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Thread: Stories of the Quadra (and/or Types)

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    Default Stories of the Quadra (and/or Types)

    In a similar vein as my previous thread (Worldbuilding), but with a little more focus on Socionics, I would like to know more about the quadra and/or types as storytellers. What kinds of things mark a movie/book/game/comic/poem/other creative piece as belonging to a specific quadra to you? If you have any examples of "a very gamma movie", "a poem dripping in delta energy", or any other sort of media you feel very strongly exemplifies some set of quadra values then I'd love to hear about them. Of course as a beta I'm very interested in beta examples especially, but anything really would be intriguing to me. I'm a fairly creative person, but I feel that I am often too worried about what I'm "supposed to create" to please the gatekeepers of whatever craft I'm attempting to create in to simply get down and actually make things that I enjoy making. My thinking is that since I struggle to break free of thinking in terms of "what I'm meant to be doing" it would be useful to just use beta examples so that I can continue with my bad habit of worrying too much about what other people think while hopefully doing so in a way that more closely matches what I actually enjoy/care about
    “Things always seem fairer when we look back at them, and it is out of that inaccessible tower of the past that Longing leans and beckons.”
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    The Morning Star EUDAEMONIUM's Avatar
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    Hmm, what would Beta stories be?

    I think stories of one group overcoming another? Overcoming dangerous odds to fight for an idea or belief?

    Nietzschean stories about finding meaning and significance? I mean these could fall into other quadras but there's a flavor beta has.

    It's world-denying, a push for something greater, different, new. There's also an existential dread of emptiness, the indifference of the world to human pain and struggle, the futility of actions and ambitions in the face of time.



    Beta stories are raw, emotional, often violent, and existential.
    The Barnum or Forer effect is the tendency for people to judge that general, universally valid statements about personality are actually specific descriptions of their own personalities. A "universally valid" statement is one that is true of everyone—or, more likely, nearly everyone. It is not known why people tend to make such misjudgments, but the effect has been experimentally reproduced.

    The psychologist Paul Meehl named this fallacy "the P.T. Barnum effect" because Barnum built his circus and dime museum on the principle of having something for everyone. It is also called "the Forer effect" after its discoverer, the psychologist Bertram R. Forer, who modestly dubbed it "the fallacy of personal validation".

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    The Creator and the Destructor The Iconoclast's Avatar
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    Greek tragedy is mainly Beta. The Illiad and Odyssey are Beta and Homer was probably an EIE. Shakespeare, Dostoyevsky, Tolstoy, Nietzsche. Evangelion, Berserk (highlighted by comrade Eudaimonia), Code Geass. Romanticism is categorically Beta. Every story that exhibits passion and struggle is Beta in essence. Gamma and Delta don't show passionarity (which is, willingness to sacrifice themselves for the sake of an idea or collective value) because both are pragmatic quadras (P (Te) valuing). Most Beta stories are mainly focused in the future. Beta is a very future-focused quadra. Betas also value leadership, altruism, heroism, asceticism, intelligence, vision, and creativity. The overall picture was poetically described above.

    Notes: The alphas also show passionarity, but in a childlike level (I and S (Ne-Si) valuing) . They are still democratic (individualists).

    Betas are future-oriented, and in contrast, Deltas are past-oriented.

    Probably some (or most) stories won't be mainly Beta. The central quadras (Beta and Gamma) do struggle for power in society, so, many stories will be about the clash between these quadras.

    -E (Fe) Passion, Dramatic Emotions +T (Ni) - Vision, Future -F (Se) Struggle for Power +L (Ti) System, Hierarchy, Theories.

    Ti + Se - Totalitarism, centralized state (most empires and dictatorships), Fe + Ni - Future, holding the vision, large groups, fanaticism
    and charismatic leadership (examples: socialism, fascism, etc.)

    (EIE is the leader and idea generator, SLE is the implementer, LSI is the stabilizer, and IEI is the peacemaker in the Beta Quadra).
    Last edited by The Iconoclast; 06-04-2022 at 05:40 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eudaimonia View Post
    I mean these could fall into other quadras but there's a flavor beta has.
    Yeah, I feel like a lot of the time the overall story will have other quadra values, but then subplots might be very beta. I struggle to think of more "purely" beta stories, and I wonder if it's because there aren't as many beta directors/writers or something.

    P.S. I really need to start reading Berserk. It looks so good lol
    “Things always seem fairer when we look back at them, and it is out of that inaccessible tower of the past that Longing leans and beckons.”
    — James Russell Lowell
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    @The Iconoclast Ooo I hadn't considered Greek tragedy at all, but you're so right. Makes sense why I loved all that stuff growing up. That also reminded me somehow of Louis L'Amour's The Walking Drum. My dad loved his Westerns as a kid so he had a box full of them he gave to me. While most of them weren't super memorable, they were a lot of fun. The Walking Drum stuck in my brain though and I reread it again because it was so good. It's like his one book that wasn't a Western. It's been awhile since I read it last, but I wonder if that would be a good example
    “Things always seem fairer when we look back at them, and it is out of that inaccessible tower of the past that Longing leans and beckons.”
    — James Russell Lowell
    猫が生き甲斐

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    The tv series the 'Gifted' was very Beta to me- maybe more IEI Beta I don't know, but it was about these misfits with super powers who were hunted by the government for being 'freaks.' Lol I cutely related to it a bit too much. The main antagonist was some kind of Gamma or Delta who hated all of the 'freaks' because they accidentally killed his daughter with their super powers during what was essentially some gay pride parade rally LMAO. He ostracized them, discrminated against them, bullied and scapegoated them- but he didn't care, because for him it was all for a good cause (Protecting children from evil Beta scum) It truthfully might be more a Gamma vs Alpha conflict maybe- or at the last it was Fe vs Te definitely lol.

    I mean it wasn't as simple as the people with powers just being misunderstood softies - some of them really were just completely amoral, sadistically vindicative and venomous- like this girl who gleefully killed a bunch of people with her reality warping powers. So it was complex- but did a good job at portraying what government and 'authority' is really like- and how it's not really some purely benevolent thing like Normies often think it is etc. It was also refreshing for the protagonists to be against the government instead of working with them like you see so much nowadays. That's why people like 'The Flash' really aren't my hero even though I liked the Killer Frost character. Goddamn Te-valuing Barry Allen would sell your soul out to the Te pigs and do it with a gleeful smug smile on his face, that little white asshole. The only reason he doesn't do that to Killer Frost is because he grew to knew Caitlyin in a Fi way and I think in a way he's scared of her as her 'ice powers' are naturally in contast to his fast speed powers to me- at least that's how I understand it in my own head lol.

    Pity to me it only lasted two seasons- but any more than that the show might have been ruined so short and sweet might be better. Yeah I liked the show a lot and wanted it to last for at least 5-7 seasons maybe but it is what it is.

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    IEI stories focus on dreamworlds & daydreams (Marcel Proust, Anais Nin), the relationship between world forces and the inner life (James Baldwin), self discovery (Herman Hesse), victim-aggressor romanticism (Anne Rice), travel fantasy/fantasy travel (Antoine de Saint-Exupery), Se seeking (Sylvia Plath), relationships (DH Lawrence). And IEI-ifying religion and mythology (John Milton, William Blake).

    SLE stories are the other side of the coin. Realism (Ernest Hemingway), overcoming world forces through the strenuous life (Teddy Roosevelt), alienation & rootlessness (VS Naipaul), aggressor libertinism (Marquis de Sade, Sasha Grey), field journalism (Norman Mailer), Ni seeking (Jack Kerouac?), action (Richard Marcincko).

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    Quote Originally Posted by AWellArmedCat View Post
    ...I am often too worried about what I'm "supposed to create" to please the gatekeepers of whatever craft I'm attempting to create in to simply get down and actually make things that I enjoy making...I struggle to break free of thinking in terms of "what I'm meant to be doing" .... bad habit of worrying too much about what other people think ... doing so in a way that more closely matches what I actually enjoy/care about
    A couple of the IEI have written non-fiction books or essays about how to tackle this if you wanna go down that road.

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    I would think games like Stardew Valley or Animal Crossing are super delta/Si in general.

    Management games where optimizing systems at a high level is a major factor are very IxTx.

    An anarchic, hostile, winner takes all game like rust is dominated by betas.

    Most games I can think of have Alpha, Beta, and Gamma elements, less have Delta, but they are there.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ouronis View Post
    I would think games like Stardew Valley or Animal Crossing are super delta/Si in general.
    That makes sense why my Delta sisters (EII and LSE) and aunt (SLI) love those games, while I can't get into them at all and don't really see the appeal lol

    My favourite games are all games that are centered around fighting, leveling up combat abilities, and have a great story. I enjoy combat-oriented RPGs if single player, and for multiplayer I like competitive FPS games
    “Things always seem fairer when we look back at them, and it is out of that inaccessible tower of the past that Longing leans and beckons.”
    — James Russell Lowell
    猫が生き甲斐

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    I like RPG game that have brutal fighting mix with resource management, like, how to manage your resource in different ways to get stronger and stronger. Also like sanbox games that have dynamic random event and npc (Crusader King 2 is the best for now).

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    My favorite stories are those who involve mental games from different characters trying to overcome each other, or stories that have real meaning and significance.

    Anyways I think these sort of things might be mildly influenced by type but usually are related to other factors, cognition is probably not the only influence in personality.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AWellArmedCat View Post
    In a similar vein as my previous thread (Worldbuilding), but with a little more focus on Socionics, I would like to know more about the quadra and/or types as storytellers. What kinds of things mark a movie/book/game/comic/poem/other creative piece as belonging to a specific quadra to you? If you have any examples of "a very gamma movie", "a poem dripping in delta energy", or any other sort of media you feel very strongly exemplifies some set of quadra values then I'd love to hear about them. Of course as a beta I'm very interested in beta examples especially, but anything really would be intriguing to me. I'm a fairly creative person, but I feel that I am often too worried about what I'm "supposed to create" to please the gatekeepers of whatever craft I'm attempting to create in to simply get down and actually make things that I enjoy making. My thinking is that since I struggle to break free of thinking in terms of "what I'm meant to be doing" it would be useful to just use beta examples so that I can continue with my bad habit of worrying too much about what other people think while hopefully doing so in a way that more closely matches what I actually enjoy/care about
    I personally don't care about quadras in relation to media, so I won't say much in regards to that. I am only posting here to comment that I appreciate your honesty and transparency in this post. Hopefully that doesn't come off as phony or awkward, it just stood out to me and I wanted to say that.


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    I typically gravitate towards works with a certain atmosphere that permeates the entire work and is largely consistent in spite of possible mood clashes. I enjoy atmospheres that are tangible. For instance, I enjoy gritty films like The Dollars Trilogy aka Man With No Name trilogy.
    Yes, there is violence but it's not done in a way that is overly gory or makes my skin crawl. It doesn't take away from the atmosphere.
    In contrast is Hellraiser which has very uncomfortable imagery.
    I also enjoy Apocalypse Now for its similar gritty aesthetics. It's dark but still immersive and the plot and dialogue takes some unusual twists and turns but remains satisfyingly subtle.

    I similarly enjoy games like Bioshock Infinite which has a similar gritty atmosphere occasionally juxtaposed with faux cheerful locations which is not entirely unusual for Delta works (think Cowboy Bebop and its ability to combine the dark and rugged with more lighthearted music and imagery, creating an appealing dissonance).

    And then one of my favorite games of all time is Super Metroid whose atmosphere is consistently dark but it's very appealing in that the errieness is counteracted with a sense of stability that comes from delicate game mechanics and very fluid gameplay that minimizes any real sense of frustration.

    I also enjoy quirky but serious stories. A case study would be Majora's Mask. It has a lot of strange elements and some very quriky dialogue, but with the looming crisis ever present, it evokes a sense of urgency and intrigue coupled with genuine concern over the fate of Termina, especially as the player grows connected to the seemingly inconsequential characters who grow in depth and importance the more the player sees them in their routines cycle after cycle, especially as the player goes deeper into their characters through various side quests.

    So elements that appeal most are atmosphere with a sense of stability and some aesthetic grit, quirkiness, slow building connections, and a sense of crisis/cataclysm.

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    Dunkirk is a great Gamma movie. Themes of personal sacrifice, race against time, every man for himself.

    Dune is a brilliant Beta movie. Themes of learning your rightful place in the grand scheme of things, group conflict, romantic destiny.
    Last edited by VagrantFarce; 12-20-2021 at 09:26 PM.

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