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Thread: Weak vs strong si?

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    DiOwOgenes's Avatar
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    Default Weak vs strong si?

    Hello.

    How do I know whether my si is strong or weak? I am aware of my body, my bodily sensations are intertwined with my feelings/emotions and I understand my own comfort pretty well but I hate routine household tasks and maintenance, with the exception of cooking. I also like food.
    My aesthetic sense isn't that bad, but I only utilise it when necessary, and I don't care about how my surroundings looks unless it's outright unhygienic. If anything, I only make sure my art looks good, and it still is sort of chaotic and blurry when I'm done.
    In fact, it annoys me when people prefer aesthetic over functionality. At school, it alway pissed me off when teachers marked notebooks based on appearance as that's not the point of a notebook - it's supposed to contain my fucking notes, not look good.

    Despite this, I definitely appreciate beauty and aesthetic, and I like to travel to scenic places or enjoy nature.

    I usually eat the same food at restaurants. I also like food and I'm trying to combat my sweet tooth every day.

    I have this thing where I can instantly recall associated past situations by tasting/smelling something. I can generally remember sensations well.

    I sometimes forget to eat despite feeling hungry or do routine things like shower, but it's not a major problem.

    One final thing - I'm restless and neurotic and it's not very easy for me to relax. However, I sometimes get into the opposite situation, where I'm too lazy to do anything.

    Aren't all humans at least somewhat aware of their flesh prison? What exactly distinguishes strong si from weak si?
    Last edited by DiOwOgenes; 10-10-2021 at 09:54 PM.

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    twiggewed, dewusional, entitwed, snowfwake VewyScawwyNawcissist's Avatar
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    Si is sedantism. Sedantism in mind is stability. Se users in contrast need to move to get their mind working. Si users are strongly biased in their immediate experiences. They don't learn things broadly in a short amount of time. Oscilation between restlessness and laziness, that's ur intuition. Focusing on aesthetic about notebooks is Si bias. The Si people had the highest grades and neatest notebooks. Hating chores is another case of instability/intuition.
    muscle function, cranial plates posture, personality, cognition and mental illness


    i'm afraid it will hurt like hell, i am afraid of screaming and i am afraid of crying, i am afraid of forgetting but i'm not afraid of dying.



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    DiOwOgenes's Avatar
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    But aren't bodily sensations tied directly into si? Wouldn't being able to remember tastes and smells signify better si?

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    idiot sandwich aixelsyd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cambrian explosion View Post
    But aren't bodily sensations tied directly into si? Wouldn't being able to remember tastes and smells signify better si?
    Sounds like MBTI Si. That said, I can easily recall sensations so there might be something to it. I think Si has more to do with going with the flow and enjoying the moment or trying to make the most of the moment. However, what this looks like is highly subjective. Some people like to surround themselves with luxury and their sense of aesthetics may be more high brow. Then there are people like myself who have simpler tastes or find beauty in things people take for granted or might see as ugly. Like I can find a run down looking shack aesthetically appealing whereas others would say it is ugly because it is dilapidated. Some people like shiny new shoes but I prefer something worn but sturdy. So, again, Si is sort of in the eye of the beholder.

    I think Si definitely has to do with comfort, convenience, and tends towards preferring a sense of stability. When my comfort and sense of stability is disturbed, I tend to react poorly. I am a bit more tolerant towards inconvenience, though, unless it is a constant thing.

    Bodily sensations are a factor. Like, I usually know why I am experiencing a certain sensation and can figure out how to change it. For instance, if I feel nauseous, I can usually determine if it is because I am very hungry and need food or if it is from an upset stomach where ginger and leafy greens would help settle my stomach or if I need to lay off certain consumables. I also find it difficult to ignore bodily sensations unless they are chronic and mild. For instance, I deal with chronic pain in my back and shoulders and I can usually ignore it because I am used to the pain.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cambrian explosion View Post
    Hello.

    How do I know whether my si is strong or weak? I am aware of my body, my bodily sensations are intertwined with my feelings/emotions and I understand my own comfort pretty well but I hate routine household tasks and maintenance, with the exception of cooking. I also like food.
    My aesthetic sense isn't that bad, but I only utilise it when necessary, and I don't care about how my surroundings looks unless it's outright unhygienic. If anything, I only make sure my art looks good, and it still is sort of chaotic and blurry when I'm done.
    In fact, it annoys me when people prefer aesthetic over functionality. At school, it alway pissed me off when teachers marked notebooks based on appearance as that's not the point of a notebook - it's supposed to contain my fucking notes, not look good.

    Despite this, I definitely appreciate beauty and aesthetic, and I like to travel to scenic places or enjoy nature.

    I usually eat the same food at restaurants. I also like food and I'm trying to combat my sweet tooth every day.

    I have this thing where I can instantly recall associated past situations by tasting/smelling something. I can generally remember sensations well.

    I sometimes forget to eat despite feeling hungry or do routine things like shower, but it's not a major problem.

    One final thing - I'm restless and neurotic and it's not very easy for me to relax. However, I sometimes get into the opposite situation, where I'm too lazy to do anything.

    Aren't all humans at least somewhat aware of their flesh prison? What exactly distinguishes strong si from weak si?
    Weak Si people are so not connected to their own body, that they can be overly paranoid regarding getting sick. (ive seen this with beta NFs where the Si is still ''conscious'' in the superego) Or they can only eat candy just because it tastes good, but not realize how shit they actually feel because they dont feel that theyre not getting in the minerals and vitamins from actual meals. (ive seen this with alpha NTs)
    ~ ESTP ~ SLE ~ 7w8 ~ Sp/Sx ~ Fire ~ Aries ~ Beta ~ Gryffindor ~ Summer ~ SLUEN ~

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    Quote Originally Posted by cambrian explosion View Post
    But aren't bodily sensations tied directly into si? Wouldn't being able to remember tastes and smells signify better si?
    yes it has connections to having at least decent Sensing. its a sensation after all.
    ~ ESTP ~ SLE ~ 7w8 ~ Sp/Sx ~ Fire ~ Aries ~ Beta ~ Gryffindor ~ Summer ~ SLUEN ~

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    Quote Originally Posted by pomeden View Post
    @cambrian explosion you seem to be in a toss up with sei and iee primarily
    I somehow relate to everything written about these two types on wikisocion apart from their respective PoLRs (I don't really relate to any PoLR description apart from Se slightly but in that situation it's also not very strong)

    As for the strong/weak si distinction you described, I sort of relate to both. I'm very confident in what kinds of sensations I prefer (in fact I'm extremely picky), but I would gladly listen to what a doctor tells me, guides on how to exercise, etc.

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    Si refers to a type of input data filtering (a perspective on data) that's employed within a specific information control system; it's either employed or not with no in-between so “weak” and “strong” are misleading adjectives. Strong would have to refer to Si being part of the system and weak would have to refer to lacks of certain competencies compared to Si-types. People find ways to compensate for filter and configuration deficiencies, which may appear like weak Si but again, such associations are misleading.

    a.k.a. I/O

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    What's the purpose of SEI? Tallmo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cambrian explosion View Post

    Aren't all humans at least somewhat aware of their flesh prison? What exactly distinguishes strong si from weak si?
    It has to do with the priority of it. If your consciousness and your whole being is attuned towards it. The other thing is that the function is adapted to reality and differentiated. That's the base function.

    Si is sensations. It doesn't actually do anything, simply senses the world from the inside. You sit and feel you body, and take in the environment. It's like the environment develops on the inside. I can typically sit in a cafe and feel very distant from everything around me but the sensations are strong, but they are totally introverted and psychic in character. It's like there is a separation between the actual environment and the sensations. It's a dispassionate and disconnected attitude.

    But Si is mostly useless so SEI/SLIs learn to focus on weaker functions in order to get by in life.
    The decisive thing is not the reality of the object, but the reality of the subjective factor, i.e. the primordial images, which in their totality represent a psychic mirror-world. It is a mirror, however, with the peculiar capacity of representing the present contents of consciousness not in their known and customary form but in a certain sense sub specie aeternitatis, somewhat as a million-year old consciousness might see them.

    (Jung on Si)

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    What's the purpose of SEI? Tallmo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aixelsyd View Post

    I think Si definitely has to do with comfort, convenience, and tends towards preferring a sense of stability. When my comfort and sense of stability is disturbed, I tend to react poorly. I am a bit more tolerant towards inconvenience, though, unless it is a constant thing.
    This is definitely true of the Si types (SLI&SEI), but you shouldn't attribute convenience and stability to Si as a function, but instead to Se ignoring: Avoiding too much impact from the disturbing world of objects. Convinience might also have something to do with the Te in SLI.
    The decisive thing is not the reality of the object, but the reality of the subjective factor, i.e. the primordial images, which in their totality represent a psychic mirror-world. It is a mirror, however, with the peculiar capacity of representing the present contents of consciousness not in their known and customary form but in a certain sense sub specie aeternitatis, somewhat as a million-year old consciousness might see them.

    (Jung on Si)

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    OP, have you thought of using dichotomies such as he ones described by Jung or the Big Five personality system to determine your socionics type?

    Rather than going function per function, which is often very convoluted, why not just contrast dichotomies and see which ones fit you more. You raise an interesting point about about everyone (not just Si users) being aware of their bodies, the question is not whether intuitive types are or not aware of their bodies, it's which one you focus on more (intuition or sensing).

    This is how I would port big five to socionics.

    High openness relates to intuition, low openness to sensing.

    Extraversion is the same thing as in Jungian typology.

    Orderliness relates to rationality, low orderliness is typical behavior of irrationals.

    Agreeableness relates to high ethics, low agreeableness relates to logic.

    And I would just ignore neuroticism for the sake of this experiment since it doesn't relate to Jung's dichotomies (some would say it actually relates to thinking vs feeling but to me it seems unrelated).

    An objection to this approach might be that it focuses on behavior and that can be misleading, since in socionics, behavior does not always correlate to type (the concept of introverted extraverts for example). But I think this highlights the problem with socionics: by excluding behavior from the typological equation, what external, measurable metric is there? Sure, there can be some leeway in what behaviors point to type, but there are some behaviors which clearly indicate certain preferences and even certain types. Looking at the type profiles written by various socionists, they don't differ that much. What differs is the methods used to determine type, and which is why different schools have such vastly clashing results when it comes to specific people's types. But the type "profiles" are very similar from one school to another. Why? Think about it.
    What good is a book that does not even transport us beyond all books?

    ~Nietzsche

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    twiggewed, dewusional, entitwed, snowfwake VewyScawwyNawcissist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cambrian explosion View Post
    But aren't bodily sensations tied directly into si? Wouldn't being able to remember tastes and smells signify better si?
    intuitives are more sensitive. they also tend to be more neurotic in the weak sense. sensors tend to be more neurotic in the strong/forceful sense. people with strong Si are repressing intuition this means they repress the negative sensations they dont like in favor of the ones that they do like.
    ur remembering sensations could be 4D Fi with 2D valued Si. if u remember the negatives and cant shut it off easily u would use Ne be restless to escape it. Good Si users can numb the unpleasant with what's pleasant so they are not neurotic like that. They are in control of how sensations affect them.
    ime Si egos can overreact to things but it;s due to Ne. they dont feel so helpless uncomfortable sensation wise. they feel helpless when they project wild assumptions about waht they dont understand or shut all of those off to pretend everything's going fine or that it doesnt matter how bad it is. my mother is very disgust reactive not sensitive. what makes them good at chores is also the fact that they can shut off the unpleasantness as they wish. they feel more rewarded by making things clean and tidy then they feel bad about working towards that.
    ur instant recall also sounds like Fi memories. thats also why ILIs tend to have good memories even with valued 2D Fi.
    Si is not even about sensations. its about internal irrational impulses that guide each other to manipulating something outside (Te/Fe). the differnce between this and Ni is that Ni releases the irrational impulses, to look beyond them into what's guiding them. intuitives have reduced barrier between their conscious and unconscious minds. this makes them more unstable bc contents keep oscillating from one thing to another. thats also why they need more general variety of stimulation.
    Si would be better at being able to consistently reproduce the same result. U eating the same food could be one way to stabilize urself that makes u unstable in other areas hence u hate chores. if u had more variety in ur life maybe there would be a point of being overwhelmed so chores would be relaxing instead.

    Se would be seeking external stimulation to feed Ti/Fi. This is concrete things like properties of sound or visuals but not only.
    Sensation is a metaphor about a way of cognition. it doesnt mean literally sensations. it may mean more literal perception in general though.
    muscle function, cranial plates posture, personality, cognition and mental illness


    i'm afraid it will hurt like hell, i am afraid of screaming and i am afraid of crying, i am afraid of forgetting but i'm not afraid of dying.



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    @VewyScawwyNawcissist

    Thanks for the explanation! Perhaps I managed to misunderstand the Si descriptions because they all mention physical sensations and stability so maybe I took it too literally.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cambrian explosion View Post
    @VewyScawwyNawcissist

    Thanks for the explanation! Perhaps I managed to misunderstand the Si descriptions because they all mention physical sensations and stability so maybe I took it too literally.
    Jung mentions that it removes physical sensation for the sake of the subjective experience it brings. they also do mention physical sensation bc its the most concrete example. the difficult part is understanding how its not about just that.
    muscle function, cranial plates posture, personality, cognition and mental illness


    i'm afraid it will hurt like hell, i am afraid of screaming and i am afraid of crying, i am afraid of forgetting but i'm not afraid of dying.



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    What's the purpose of SEI? Tallmo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cambrian explosion View Post
    I am aware of my body, my bodily sensations are intertwined with my feelings/emotions and I understand my own comfort pretty well
    There is a wide variety of inner phenomena, things happening in the body, head ache, muscle tension and weakness, comfort and discomfort etc. One SEI once told me that when lying in bed she felt like her body was turning into stone. These things can be hard to put into words.

    but I hate routine household tasks and maintenance,
    And many Si (base) types dislike this, because Si is only concerned with impressions in a passive way. I don't even know why anybody would link household work to Si (base). However, these people like to give their sensory impressions time to develop on the inside, so focusing on some slow task or detail might be stimulating. But things become very slow and inefficient.

    Of course, if the person has developed some weaker functions he can be more active and productive.

    My aesthetic sense isn't that bad, but I only utilise it when necessary, and I don't care about how my surroundings looks unless it's outright unhygienic.

    Despite this, I definitely appreciate beauty and aesthetic, and I like to travel to scenic places or enjoy nature.
    I think you can say that Si has something to do with aesthetics, but it's a very specific kind of aesthetics. Keeping it natural, soft, genuine, sometimes a worn look, is in my opinion typical Si aesthetics.
    The decisive thing is not the reality of the object, but the reality of the subjective factor, i.e. the primordial images, which in their totality represent a psychic mirror-world. It is a mirror, however, with the peculiar capacity of representing the present contents of consciousness not in their known and customary form but in a certain sense sub specie aeternitatis, somewhat as a million-year old consciousness might see them.

    (Jung on Si)

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    if you're fat, you have Si ego


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    I hate housework too. Inb4 everyone hates housework.

    Only people to like housework are Se types, and Te types. Oh wait. There are no SeTe types.

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    DiOwOgenes's Avatar
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    @Uncle Ave My Big 5 type is somewhere between RLUEI and SLUAI, xLUxI being constant. (I took multiple tests)

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    Quote Originally Posted by cambrian explosion View Post
    @Uncle Ave My Big 5 type is somewhere between RLUEI and SLUAI, xLUxI being constant. (I took multiple tests)
    Limbic/calm is not really relevant to socionics IMO. Unstructured and Inquisitive might point to irrationality and intuition, respectively - the ones that are constants are more telling, of course.

    Maybe my method is wrong, though, so take it with a grain of salt.
    What good is a book that does not even transport us beyond all books?

    ~Nietzsche

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    I view strong Si as the epitome of temperance/barometer of homeostasis. Weak Si... Not so much. It tries but struggles to maintain an internal balance.

    All my Si family and friends will give long rambling texts or speeches about how they aren't feeling well as the ultimate reason to cancel plans. Me, on the hand, just says "I don't feel good, can we reschedule?"

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    Humanist Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    Well I panic if something goes wrong and I don’t let it get far along and I usually seek help ASAP
    My EIE cousin ended up in emergency probably because she was ignoring it for so long that she needed resuscitation when she got there
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 2w1sw(1w9) helps others to live up to their own standards of what a good person is and is very behind the scenes in the process.
    Tritype 1-2-6 stacking sp/sx


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

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    Humanist Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MissTrix View Post
    if you're fat, you have Si ego
    Nah
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 2w1sw(1w9) helps others to live up to their own standards of what a good person is and is very behind the scenes in the process.
    Tritype 1-2-6 stacking sp/sx


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beautiful sky View Post
    Nah
    You're the exception to the rule


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    Maybe it will help you if I share my own experience? I'm Si Role.

    For me, I am very aware that I should pay attention to Si things, but am just very bad about doing so. It is very easy for me to forget to eat and starve, or to forget that I ate and eat again like an hour later, and I don't really notice my body's own signaling half the time. I might understand that I feel uncomfortable but not really know why, and then after awhile be like "Oh yeah, food!" Or I might thoughtlessly drink five coffees and then wonder why I'm so anxious and jittery. I don't naturally think of physical things as having anything at all to do with my mental state even though I logically know that they do. I'm just not that in tune with my body and tend to not really feel that present in space or time. I'm a bit clumsy when not specifically focusing on my physicality (I feel I'm actually pretty good at sports for example when that's all I'm focusing on), and tend to run into my own desk or back up into the blackboard getting chalk all over me when I'm excitedly teaching something. The most embarrassing thing is when I run into the same desk like three times in a row because I just lack that awareness of where I am in relation to other objects around me.

    Every so often I'll try really hard to fix my useless Si. I'll try to set reminders to eat and plan meals and I'll do the deepest of deep cleans to my house. I can go really quite crazy with this mode when I get into it. After everything's clean and organized and I follow my meal and exercise schedule for about a week I get completely exhausted by focusing on these things and just go back to my usual self. I know I should be taking better care of my body and the sight of my desk and closet gradually becoming disorganized again bothers me a little, but it takes quite awhile before I come back around to the brief but extreme Si-focused mode. I don't tend to do Si related things in small amounts. It's much more all or nothing for me, so I find it very difficult to maintain any semblance of consistency in this area despite multiple attempts. I can be rather prideful at times though, so if I anticipate guests then that'll trigger one of these Si modes so that I can sort of "show off" I guess. I try to invite people over with some regularity just because it is the only reliable way I can motivate myself to stay on top of things. God forbid anyone see my weakness in this area lol
    猫が生き甲斐

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    The cutest type Luna Lovegood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EIE View Post
    I view strong Si as the epitome of temperance/barometer of homeostasis. Weak Si... Not so much. It tries but struggles to maintain an internal balance.

    All my Si family and friends will give long rambling texts or speeches about how they aren't feeling well as the ultimate reason to cancel plans. Me, on the hand, just says "I don't feel good, can we reschedule?"
    Eh I think it depends. If it's something I really want to do I won't cancel even if I feel unwell. If it's something I wasn't that interested in you bet I'm gonna cancel for not feeling well
    Chronic "grass is always greener" syndrome




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    Yeah, I'll say that it's comparable to what AWellArmedCat says. I'll have moments where I get a burst of energy and then clean everything up, but otherwise, things stay to a certain standard.
    Last edited by Alomoes; 10-19-2021 at 04:40 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Luna Lovegood View Post
    Eh I think it depends. If it's something I really want to do I won't cancel even if I feel unwell. If it's something I wasn't that interested in you bet I'm gonna cancel for not feeling well
    To be fair, these people also seemed to have a strong self preservation aspect. And if I hang out with them despite their ailments, they will tend to whine about it the whole time so no fun. Lol

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