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Thread: DEAD, I'm going to punch your fat head in...

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    Exclamation DEAD, I'm going to punch your fat head in...

    Okay, I have pretty much pinned down and accepted the fact that I am a Beta ST, according to Aushra's model and I do struggle with Ne and Fi infinitely.

    But am I LSI or SLE?

    [Discuss, ask questions, build arguments and I will dissect] Vibes are NOT a valid argument, need evidence.

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    Are you or are you not extroverted?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Great View Post
    Are you or are you not extroverted?

    1. Socially, I'm pretty introverted but cognitively, I would say I am pretty ambiverted, which is where my issue lies.

    2. I use a great deal of Se, as is evidenced by wanting control of the environment around me, and organising it effectively.

    2a. I am also inclined to use a great deal of Ti alongside the Se to:
    i) make sense of the world
    ii) systematically order/organise it
    iii) restore order in terms of "logical rules"

    I'm not sure if this makes me SLE-Ti or LSI-Se.

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    You are SLE-Ti. No LSI has ever really asked me to spend time alone with them before, I think that would weird them out too badly lol. I know my reasonings for thinking u are SLE-Ti are almost completely 4D Fi and probably hurt ur Fi polr though... when I try to explain them, they aren't logical based- more vibe/emotional energy patterns.

    I'll try to be more logical about it later maybe. but yeah dual > activity.

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    I um see DEAD as SEE /hides/

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    Quote Originally Posted by BandD View Post
    You are SLE-Ti. No LSI has ever really asked me to spend time alone with them before, I think that would weird them out too badly lol. I know my reasonings for thinking u are SLE-Ti are almost completely 4D Fi and probably hurt ur Fi polr though... when I try to explain them, they aren't logical based- more vibe/emotional energy patterns.

    I'll try to be more logical about it later maybe. but yeah dual > activity.
    Yes, you can do that. You are one of the reasons why I am convinced I am Beta ST > SF. It's logically natural. I don't get the same stability and linear connection from any other type, except the two Beta NFs. Gamma NT are connected differently to me in the system of ITR. It's not dualised.

    Quote Originally Posted by inumbra View Post
    I um see DEAD as SEE /hides/
    No one has ever given me a proper, fully fleshed out logical reason for SEE with good examples. Not just you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DEAD View Post
    No one has ever given me a proper, fully fleshed out logical reason for SEE with good examples. Not just you.
    i'm sorry I can't. I don't have creative Te.

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    Quote Originally Posted by inumbra View Post
    i'm sorry I can't. I don't have creative Te.

    Very sarcastic and not a good excuse

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    When writing me you seemed pretty analytical, but not introverted.
    Everything that irritates us about others can lead us to an understanding of ourselves."

    -Carl Jung



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    Quote Originally Posted by chriscorey View Post
    When writing me you seemed pretty analytical, but not introverted.
    Yeah, I am a pretty analytical person and expand on the not introverted point, please? In what way?

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    Quote Originally Posted by DEAD View Post
    Very sarcastic and not a good excuse
    but it's not an excuse I don't know if any explanation would satisfy you? I do believe I could be wrong about this, if that helps. What I know most clearly is you are EP temperament and definitely not ILE. IEE is also unlikely. I think you are probably Se ego and you agree with that? I just can't explain easily. And even if I tried it would fail.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DEAD View Post
    Yeah, I am a pretty analytical person and expand on the not introverted point, please? In what way?
    Usually when I'm writing an introvert I control the conversation. Or I understand that I can control the conversation if I want to. With you, you were more in control of the conversation.

    Well, maybe I just think I'm in control of the conversation with introverts.
    If I look at all my conversations with introverts and compare it to all my conversations with extroverts, you seem more extroverted to me.
    Everything that irritates us about others can lead us to an understanding of ourselves."

    -Carl Jung



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    No, you are a delta NF with a brain tumor.
    MOTTO: NEVER TRUST IN REALITY
    Winning is for losers

     

    Sincerely yours,
    idiosyncratic type
    Life is a joke but do you have a life?

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    Quote Originally Posted by inumbra View Post
    but it's not an excuse I don't know if any explanation would satisfy you? I do believe I could be wrong about this, if that helps. What I know most clearly is you are EP temperament and definitely not ILE. IEE is also unlikely. I think you are probably Se ego and you agree with that? I just can't explain easily. And even if I tried it would fail.
    You could even give something simple, like Chriscorey did below:

    Quote Originally Posted by chriscorey View Post
    Usually when I'm writing an introvert I control the conversation. Or I understand that I can control the conversation if I want to. With you, you were more in control of the conversation.

    Well, maybe I just think I'm in control of the conversation with introverts.
    If I look at all my conversations with introverts and compare it to all my conversations with extroverts, you seem more extroverted to me.
    I see, that makes sense. In control in a logical, or Se sense?

    Quote Originally Posted by PseudoRandomBSGenerator View Post
    No, you are a delta NF with a brain tumor.
    Impossible, Delta NF don't have brains to begin with

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    Quote Originally Posted by DEAD View Post
    You could even give something simple, like Chriscorey did below:



    I see, that makes sense. In control in a logical, or Se sense?



    Impossible, Delta NF don't have brains to begin with
    Se sense.
    Everything that irritates us about others can lead us to an understanding of ourselves."

    -Carl Jung



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    Quote Originally Posted by DEAD View Post
    You could even give something simple, like Chriscorey did below:



    I see, that makes sense. In control in a logical, or Se sense?



    Impossible, Delta NF don't have brains to begin with
    In all fairness us ILE are known to simplify...
    Everything that irritates us about others can lead us to an understanding of ourselves."

    -Carl Jung



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    idiot sandwich aixelsyd's Avatar
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    SLE>LSI

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    Quote Originally Posted by inumbra View Post
    i'm sorry I can't. I don't have creative Te.
    Even if you do you won’t be listened to lol the game is rigged inumbra.



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    Quote Originally Posted by chriscorey View Post
    In all fairness us ILE are known to simplify...
    Yeah, and people don't see that underneath the dumb stereotypes which are prepetuated by more extreme examples of ILE in pop culture, such as Rick Sanchez. Are there ILE like him? Yes. But do I think he should be held as the baseline, like the SLE who happen to enjoy fixing cars are? No. Are those activities that people with Se+Ti can gravitate towards? Of course. Like I have said many times before, it's about the IME. About how the person functions and makes sense of the world which is the most important thing. Not the stereotypes, nor the ITR. It's about programming on humans, not archetypes and there are many vairables that need to be organised and made sense of within the context of socionics. Like many subjects/topics with raw data analysis, there are going to be some anomalies within the graphs, aside from the average and the low end of the types. Subtypes can help explain the differences to a degree, as can other established elements.

    Quote Originally Posted by aixelsyd View Post
    SLE>LSI
    Why?

    Quote Originally Posted by one View Post
    Even if you do you won’t be listened to lol the game is rigged inumbra.
    The game has been rigged from the start, since everyone started putting biases into the equation.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DEAD View Post
    The game has been rigged from the start, since everyone started putting biases into the equation.
    Hm hm hm I wonder who actually put the bias in the equation



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    Quote Originally Posted by one View Post
    Hm hm hm I wonder who actually put the bias in the equation

    Well, both sides. One side is biased toward the SEE typing, the other the SLE. If we want to be precise.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DEAD View Post
    Well, both sides. One side is biased toward the SEE typing, the other the SLE. If we want to be precise.
    Aren't you tired of those sides? Just claim LSI, that's what I did for ESI. Or trade your type with me, I'm open for ESI takers!



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    Quote Originally Posted by one View Post
    Aren't you tired of those sides? Just claim LSI, that's what I did for ESI. Or trade your type with me, I'm open for ESI takers!
    If I'm being honest, I know I value Se, have weak Ne and Fi, which rules out any Alpha and Delta Type, and strong SF Gamma type, due to the Fi.

    Out of that, that leaves: SLE, LSI, IEI and EIE as well as ILI and LIE. My Fe isn't strong (either 1D/2D), which takes Beta NF out of the running.

    Although I have strong Si, I don't value it like Se, so that means that it's either Demonstrative (4D, strong, unvalued) Ignoring (3d, unvalued), Role (2D, unvalued) or PoLR (1D, unvalued and weak).

    On top of that, I think that my Ni is weak, but valued, which leaves it between Beta ST as my most likely type. Out of the functional order and functions being valued, that leaves SLE > LSI > LIE > ILI as my most probable types. You can see that despite having Strong Si and Te being the most probable of the 4D/3D functions, they are "unvalued, thus Delta ST is left out of the running. But if we were going by function strength, regardless of value, then it would be (most likely): SLE> LSI > LSE> SLI.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DEAD View Post
    If I'm being honest, I know I value Se, have weak Ne and Fi, which rules out any Alpha and Delta Type, and strong SF Gamma type, due to the Fi.

    Out of that, that leaves: SLE, LSI, IEI and EIE as well as ILI and LIE. My Fe isn't strong (either 1D/2D), which takes Beta NF out of the running.

    Although I have strong Si, I don't value it like Se, so that means that it's either Demonstrative (4D, strong, unvalued) Ignoring (3d, unvalued), Role (2D, unvalued) or PoLR (1D, unvalued and weak).

    On top of that, I think that my Ni is weak, but valued, which leaves it between Beta ST as my most likely type. Out of the functional order and functions being valued, that leaves SLE > LSI > LIE > ILI as my most probable types. You can see that despite having Strong Si and Te being the most probable of the 4D/3D functions, they are "unvalued, thus Delta ST is left out of the running. But if we were going by function strength, regardless of value, then it would be (most likely): SLE> LSI > LSE> SLI.
    There you go, SLE. Have you thought why you keep on doubting your type?



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    Quote Originally Posted by one View Post
    There you go, SLE. Have you thought why you keep on doubting your type?
    It's more to do with the fact that I am more:

    • Calculated
    • Analytical
    • Less impulsive, irl
    • I don't really "seek" Ni, I'm more into seeking Fe.


    The points that contradict this are:

    • I can be more unhinged online (I think this is more me winding down than focusing, and having a bad week irl, and having genuine difficulty with processing/forming relationships and emotions)
    • IEI seem to mesh better with me than EIE in terms of "completion", which I think is a better word than duality *


    * I know that ITR aren't the end all and be all, but from observation, it seems that way.

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    I agree with @BandD, I think you are SLE-Ti

    I thought you were SLE-Se but, thinking about it more, I am pretty sure you are SLE-Ti. Most likely Dominate or Creative.

    I can't see you as Gamma as you really dislike Fi. ALways going after that EII meat

    You seem to have 4D Te and 3D Si in my opnion. Why? First, you get pissy at my grammar and spelling lol (im not offended I have accepted my shit weakness). Like ILE with Te, you're not afraid to instruct nor help in that area. You want to help but not take charge nor do you seem overly offend by it if I were to turn my nose up on it lol. If you were an LSI, you would rather take control of your ignoring when pushed to it. I get like that with Se.

    You don't seem to get very controlling in a Te way or get on the offensive when pushed to it. I can see that with Si. I also view ignoring as the "fantasy function" in terms, I 'fantasize" about Se stuff, like being a badass assassin or pushing to the limits when I cant, but I will always choose Si instead. In daily life, I will always choose Si. You have always seemed the opposite to me in that regard. You don't seem to play around with Si that much and enjoy it in a minimal way. If you were LSI, I think you would be more...understanding and appreciative of Si if that makes sense? Especially when you mentioned on that chat one time about engaging in some Si stuff for a day.

    You don't come across as a Ti dom to me. After watching @myresearch and @FreelancePoliceman interact on here and seeing their thought patterns, I cant see you as a Ti dom. You are obviously rational without a doubt. Just, the underlying thinking patterns and orientation towards Fe is different.

    You are also more sensitive to Fi then an LSI and you wouldn't care about it as much if you were an LSI. In the sense, I think we are more vulnerable and aware of our POLR then we would like to admit. We lookout for that information more then we realize. I get that way with Te and can get overly rigid with it. You also seem to have a stronger distaste for Fi then Ne. Plus, you are very much Fe seeking. More so then SLE-Se. While you often Ni seek, even this post I would categorize this as Ni-seeking, you also need strong Fe approval of the group overall. Though, I think you are dual Ni seeking at the end of the day. I mean, you worship the wonderful @BandD lol

    You hate Ne but you seem to be able to be a little more flexible in it then you realize. Therefore, not a POLR. You are able to recognize a lot more "possibility" then most SLE I know. You don't like it but you are at least aware. Plus, I think you would be living in a bunker right now with Ne POLR

    We also get along pretty well. I know I tease but it is out of Fe care As an SEI-Fe, I tend to get along best with Ti doms and subtypes. I don't really see the benefit relation between the two. It feels more like a mirage at times. I kinda want to automatically help you with Si, Fe, and Fi. I think you kinda do the same for me sometimes with you're Se, Ti, and Te. But we are not duals so we are both looking for that Ni/Ne guidance but are not getting that from one another I can try and Ni but its wonky at best

    That is my general perspective.



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    The Evening and the Morning Star Eudaimonia's Avatar
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    SLE



    /thread
    With mind distracted, never thinking, "Death is coming,"
    To slave away on the pointless business of mundane life,
    And then to come out empty--it is a tragic error.
    ENFJ | EIE | WEPL | 3w4 sx/so

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    Quote Originally Posted by MissDucki View Post
    I agree with @BandD, I think you are SLE-Ti

    I thought you were SLE-Se but, thinking about it more, I am pretty sure you are SLE-Ti. Most likely Dominate or Creative.

    I can't see you as Gamma as you really dislike Fi. ALways going after that EII meat

    You seem to have 4D Te and 3D Si in my opnion. Why? First, you get pissy at my grammar and spelling lol (im not offended I have accepted my shit weakness). Like ILE with Te, you're not afraid to instruct nor help in that area. You want to help but not take charge nor do you seem overly offend by it if I were to turn my nose up on it lol. If you were an LSI, you would rather take control of your ignoring when pushed to it. I get like that with Se.

    You don't seem to get very controlling in a Te way or get on the offensive when pushed to it. I can see that with Si. I also view ignoring as the "fantasy function" in terms, I 'fantasize" about Se stuff, like being a badass assassin or pushing to the limits when I cant, but I will always choose Si instead. In daily life, I will always choose Si. You have always seemed the opposite to me in that regard. You don't seem to play around with Si that much and enjoy it in a minimal way. If you were LSI, I think you would be more...understanding and appreciative of Si if that makes sense? Especially when you mentioned on that chat one time about engaging in some Si stuff for a day.

    You don't come across as a Ti dom to me. After watching @myresearch and @FreelancePoliceman interact on here and seeing their thought patterns, I cant see you as a Ti dom. You are obviously rational without a doubt. Just, the underlying thinking patterns and orientation towards Fe is different.

    You are also more sensitive to Fi then an LSI and you wouldn't care about it as much if you were an LSI. In the sense, I think we are more vulnerable and aware of our POLR then we would like to admit. We lookout for that information more then we realize. I get that way with Te and can get overly rigid with it. You also seem to have a stronger distaste for Fi then Ne. Plus, you are very much Fe seeking. More so then SLE-Se. While you often Ni seek, even this post I would categorize this as Ni-seeking, you also need strong Fe approval of the group overall. Though, I think you are dual Ni seeking at the end of the day. I mean, you worship the wonderful @BandD lol

    You hate Ne but you seem to be able to be a little more flexible in it then you realize. Therefore, not a POLR. You are able to recognize a lot more "possibility" then most SLE I know. You don't like it but you are at least aware. Plus, I think you would be living in a bunker right now with Ne POLR

    We also get along pretty well. I know I tease but it is out of Fe care As an SEI-Fe, I tend to get along best with Ti doms and subtypes. I don't really see the benefit relation between the two. It feels more like a mirage at times. I kinda want to automatically help you with Si, Fe, and Fi. I think you kinda do the same for me sometimes with you're Se, Ti, and Te. But we are not duals so we are both looking for that Ni/Ne guidance but are not getting that from one another I can try and Ni but its wonky at best

    That is my general perspective.
    You make some great points, Ducki. Thanks for your valued response. I'd like to add a few things though:

    1. I used to think I was Se sub, but I realised how I still yearn for organisation, rather than just flat out ploughing into things with attack. It's like the Se has a heavy tint of Ti, if that makes sense. It seems like Se is the main outer ring, focus and the interior is the Ti under the Se.

    indexxx.png
    If you look at the stucture of the Valued (blue) sections and the unvalued (orange) sections of the psyche, and 4D Se/4D Te being the ones with the most coverage, you can see how the average psyche in the SLE is -supposed- to manifest itself, based on value, coverage area and strength/usage. The Se sub would have even more and Te space used up and less Ti space, more than likely. It would have some of the Ti and Si sucked away. It would be more of an expansive type, imo. Also, imagine that Se has more area taken yup, too lazy to redraw that, but you get the idea.

    2. Yeah, lol. My Dad's LIE and even his Fi annoys me. ESI-Fi are so annoying to me, tbh.

    3. Yeah that's a general pet peeve of mine lol. I want to instruct you, yes. I'm not afraid to get my hands dirty in that aspect. I am a bit of a control freak, yeah, but I'm not gonna snap your neck if you don't accept my help. Mostly

    4. Yeah, my LIE Dad can be a SUPER control freak at times lol. I think he is also Te subtype, but he has a healthy dose of Ni. His plans are a lot more long-term and detailed than mine will ever be. He's all about timing and I'm not lol. I think my love of food/creating recipes with a combination of similar ingredients i.e. pineapple yogurt porridge, strawberry bagels etc. is my Si coming out, and wanting to watch TV series/videos after my daily grind as well. I like to relax and be a lazy bastard, but I'd rather get things done first you know? xD

    5. That is a reasonable point, but don't forget that they are both most likely LII. You have been observing your activity partners more than LSI (but tbf, we don't have many active LSi here do we?).

    6. Yeah, I used to be called and think I was Ti PoLR because I wasn't being overly rational here about the theory, but I realised that it was me not understanding the theory enough due to being a lazy bastard and not studying it indepth enough, and not critically examining what I knew. But once i understood what Fi and Ti actuall were, I figured out the Fi i tried to force when I was "SEE" was stressing me out. And having watched some of the Vampire Diaries and this show Gang Related I'm watching now with BAndD, I've realised that ESI-Fi are blergh to me (not as bad as EII, though), especially when they have strong morals and senses of justice. I want to punch some logic into them, especially when they go on their won moral crusades. No. As for Fe group approval, I'm pretty much a lone wolf. I do enjoy the group's company at times, but I'm not really seeking their approval most of the time (this could be seen as a rare example I guess). And BAndD is pretty cool, ok? Honestly? I can sniff out EIE and IEI very well to activate/dualise with. Maybe EIE would be the more overbearing of the two to dualise with.

    7. That's interesting you say that. I've always thought of myself as a pretty rigid person, and joking aside about the Ne PoLR living in the bunker but I think that Ne is more hopeless in xSI, if that makes sense. It confuses and annoys them, with all the potential shooting out. As Ji is the antithesis to Pe, and vice versa, the differing energy sources and flows can cause a sort of meltdown in the circuitry after a while, if the currents are fighting against each other. They need a linear, direct current in order to survive.

    8. Of course we get on well xD We would have to, after all the meat exchanges lol. Joking aside, interesting that you say that. Yeah, you can't get Ne from me, and I can't get Ni from you lol.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eudaimonia View Post
    SLE

    /thread
    Do I activate you, bb?

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