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Thread: Therapy

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    Default Therapy

    If people are comfortable, I would like to start this thread. The good, the bad, and the ugly because I think itís important.

    Ive been to 3 therapists and right now Iím just trying to figure shit out on my own. I even went to a hypnotist when I was younger to try and help.

    I love therapy and I really recommend it. Though, it can be really hard to find someone you are compatible with and understand you. The most compatible therapist I had so far was an Italian man and he was an NF I think. Really liked him.

    I think a lot of people can benefit from it. I think it is important though please be careful when choosing a therapist. There are some crappy ones out there and look for someone that is specialized in your field.

    I can go I to more details if people want to later but, just want to kick things off with this.

    Therapy is also never something you should be ashamed of. You should never feel ashamed on working on yourself and healing. It takes a very strong person to do that.



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    Quote Originally Posted by MissDucki View Post
    Ive been to 3 therapists and right now I’m just trying to figure shit out on my own. I even went to a hypnotist when I was younger to try and help.
    Lol, that's some Ni sh*t. Gulenko writes: ILI talks like a hypnotist.
    EIE's are into seance sh*t.

    Anyway, my SEE sister could totally fall for it after some time.



    Therapy for me? It could be cool to wrench their (therapists) minds.
    Dear therapist, today I almost married my left shoe. It was touching but the approach made the right one jealous. She tried to kill me. That is probably what you get when you date Siamese dominatrix twins with high heels while you have a shoe fetish.
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    I've never been to therapy before...but I know I have to at some point since it has become significantly harder for me to live with myself the way I am now.

    I used to think the first therapist people saw would automatically be good for them. I didn't know it was such a process. It's almost like choosing a friend or partner in that way, not just anybody can be a good therapist for anyone. I'm curious to hear about other people's experiences with therapy.
    Chronic "grass is always greener" syndrome




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    oh I feel like I've already talked about this to death- but yeah I haven't had a good experience with most therapy. Besides the LSI therapist I gush about, most therapists have been Delta and really clash-y. Many of them blamed me for things that weren't even my fault, were jerk-ish and asshole ish. Didn't have any true empathy and compassion. One particulary evil one would even totally make up sexual abuses that didn't happen just so she could report the person to the police and have them arrested. None of it was true she was just being a cunt.

    I felt better and healed only by being therapied by Betas I think. The best therapist advice I think I got was 'you don't need to be here. Just go out and explore- do what you want to do etc.' The best therapist gave me confidence- but 90% of it took it away. I was already vulnerable and 'low' and they just made it even worse. Or even if they were nice and not harmful and well-intentioned I still didn't respond to it that well usually. I'm not trying to say that all therapy is evil or bad for everybody ((but I still think many/most of it kinda is...))

    oh maybe it also has something to do with my type 5 to 8 integration. Therapy is sorta like the opposite of type 8-ish and ironically I've felt healed more by 8 crap. Like the LSI gave me a lot of official responsibilities and I made it to the highest level of the group home lol (sorta like me becoming a moderator here I guess...) It's like I grow by getting power, not by talking about my feelings. I guess that's fucked up but it works for me.

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    What's the purpose of SEI? Tallmo's Avatar
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    If I found a Jungian therapist. Otherwise no.

    It's really important that the therapist himself has been through a lot in life and has gone through therapy and integrated the shadow. Otherwise he might project it on his patient.

    It's irritating how health care persons project on their patients. Not just in a therapy situation, but generally.
    A true sense-perception certainly exists, but it always looks as though objects were not so much forcing their way into the subject in their own right as that the subject were seeing things quite differently, or saw quite other things than the rest of mankind. As a matter of fact, the subject perceives the same things as everybody else, only, he never stops at the purely objective effect, but concerns himself with the subjective perception released by the objective stimulus.
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    Quote Originally Posted by PseudoRandomBSGenerator View Post
    EIE's are into seance sh*t.
    Yes
    With mind distracted, never thinking, "Death is coming,"
    To slave away on the pointless business of mundane life,
    And then to come out empty--it is a tragic error.
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    I feel like I keep saying this lol. I had an IEE therapist, they were idiotic and incompetent. They would tell me what to think, how I should feel, and throw nonsense diagnoses seemingly just for their own enjoyment.

    I avoid going to therapy after that.
    With mind distracted, never thinking, "Death is coming,"
    To slave away on the pointless business of mundane life,
    And then to come out empty--it is a tragic error.
    ENFJ | EIE | WEPL | 3w4 sx/so

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    I had an IEE therapist, they were idiotic and incompetent. They would tell me what to think, how I should feel, and throw nonsense diagnoses seemingly just for their own enjoyment.
    an IEE therapist once told me to do something and then next week asked me if I did what he asked. I told him no I didn't do it and he got super pissed. I think cuz if I was a SLI I would have easily done what he said. But IEEs can't really boss IEIs around like they can SLIs and it annoys them. It also annoyed me that he got genuinely mad just because I didn't do something he said to do. I tried to give him one last chance after that- but then next week all he did was read passages out of the Bible to me. I was like 'Seriously?' and I never saw him after that lol.

    I don't mean to pick on IEEs - I mean he was a bad therapist regardless but I don't think that helped much either lol.

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    It's really important that the therapist himself has been through a lot in life and has gone through therapy and integrated the shadow. Otherwise he might project it on his patient.
    yeah I think a lot of that Shadow crap is often used as an excuse to do fucked up shitty vulnerable things to people under the guise of 'I'm exploring my shadow so it's okay.' The opposite of virtue signaling is Shadow vice signaling... which has it's own problems. I think this isn't always some bad thing if you have a strong Fi enough connection with the person though. but if you don't- then it's going to cause a lot of problems.

    also there's that thing where its like 'toughen up you soft shy little fag- therapy is supposed to be challenging and hard I'm not going to baby or coddle you, you pathetic weakling' and I get that but its not really how to talk to me when I'm already feeling vulnerable and helpess in ways. I still want to be challenged- but if a person is a jerk about it- Bye, Felicia. lol

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    I went to one for the first time last summer, every few weeks for 3 or 4 months maybe. The first and second sessions, to me, seemed the most valuable, but after that it started seeming redundant. I felt like I just dumped everything on her at first and wanted to get her opinion lol. She referred me to a psychiatrist. Then I quit going to the therapist. She didnít tell me anything I didnít already know. I have OCD, ADHD, GAD, and MDD. I was worried about bipolar, and still kind of am. But it was an interesting experience. Iím sure it def helps some people. I personally didnít find it helpful long term, maybe at some other point in my life again, when going through a transition, and want someone to talk, but it prob could have been more with a different one idk. I think I personally got what I needed out of it so far (and had a nice one, no horror story!). Iím glad it helps you, and you are getting such a benefit out of it!!! Itís still really stigmatized. It can be hard to tell people about. I tried getting my mom to go to one, but she didnít think she was Ďbad enoughí to need one . Or I was, for that matter. Iím really good at convincing people Iím fine, even to my own detriment.ugh. And I donít even realize Iím doing it lol. I told her she didnít have to be at the lowest of the low. If I tell people I have seen a therapist, I kinda worry they think Iím really disturbed, because a lot of people assume that when anyone says ĎtherapyíÖSeems a word that many feel the need to whisper, more than say, but itís getting better
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    Quote Originally Posted by PseudoRandomBSGenerator View Post
    Lol, that's some Ni sh*t. Gulenko writes: ILI talks like a hypnotist.
    EIE's are into seance sh*t.

    Anyway, my SEE sister could totally fall for it after some time.



    Therapy for me? It could be cool to wrench their (therapists) minds.
    Dear therapist, today I almost married my left shoe. It was touching but the approach made the right one jealous. She tried to kill me. That is probably what you get when you date Siamese dominatrix twins with high heels while you have a shoe fetish.
    if you go to one and talk that way, they might not let you leave
    ∑:*®༺༻®*:∑.𝓽𝓾𝓶𝓫𝓵𝓻∑:*®༺ ༻®*:∑.
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    Quote Originally Posted by BandD View Post
    oh I feel like I've already talked about this to death- but yeah I haven't had a good experience with most therapy. Besides the LSI therapist I gush about, most therapists have been Delta and really clash-y. Many of them blamed me for things that weren't even my fault, were jerk-ish and asshole ish. Didn't have any true empathy and compassion. One particulary evil one would even totally make up sexual abuses that didn't happen just so she could report the person to the police and have them arrested. None of it was true she was just being a cunt.

    I felt better and healed only by being therapied by Betas I think. The best therapist advice I think I got was 'you don't need to be here. Just go out and explore- do what you want to do etc.' The best therapist gave me confidence- but 90% of it took it away. I was already vulnerable and 'low' and they just made it even worse. Or even if they were nice and not harmful and well-intentioned I still didn't respond to it that well usually. I'm not trying to say that all therapy is evil or bad for everybody ((but I still think many/most of it kinda is...))

    oh maybe it also has something to do with my type 5 to 8 integration. Therapy is sorta like the opposite of type 8-ish and ironically I've felt healed more by 8 crap. Like the LSI gave me a lot of official responsibilities and I made it to the highest level of the group home lol (sorta like me becoming a moderator here I guess...) It's like I grow by getting power, not by talking about my feelings. I guess that's fucked up but it works for me.
    yeah, going off what you said about therapist reporting things, I feel like that’s one reason I couldn’t entirely benefit from it. I would want to feel like I could tell one anything and not have to worry about that, but the fact of the matter is, you do, especially nowadays, people just report anything. I even googled things not to say or tell a therapist before I went, and what they were legally required to report, to be on the safe side. So yeah, I feel like I filter probably, and it takes away from the experience. Because I mean I wouldn’t even want to go down a road where they would even think I would be sexually abused, so I might word things or direct the convo away from them wanting to even think that.
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    It's good to know when you're approaching the point of needing help and going before it gets acute. That way you have an established relationship before the crisis since the process of finding the right person and getting to know them can be such a slog.

    I've gone before when I needed more of a mentor, another time when I was struggling to understand the past, and now I started going more for emotional support and "de-programming." Previously I stopped going when it seemed like it was getting redundant or I felt like the problem was mostly behind me. I honestly didn't think I needed or wanted to go back to therapy after working through family stuff years ago, but the pandemic and some losses from the past two years left me extremely sad and anxious. Finally I was just like "I have to talk to somebody, good grief."

    I like seeing someone who recognizes the ultimate responsibility and authority inside of you over your own experience while still being a guide. If you see someone who puts themselves in a superior position where they're imparting Great Wisdom and you're the lucky recipient I don't think it produces much lasting healing or change, it just makes you dependent on them and even less trusting of yourself.

    Therapy is also a rapidly developing field and certain methods are outdated. IFS (Internal Family Systems) is something my current counselor uses and it's been really helpful.

    Oh and I agree it's important to find the right person. A daunting process in itself. I saw an EII briefly many years ago and that was a terrible fit, then an EIE who I loved but was more of a motivational speaker/advice giver, and now I see an IEI and it's been incredible.

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    Bad experience with therapists. I just allotted more time for my reflection and went to a psychiatrist. I know how to "fix" myself now I just need more time.

    My last therapist and I couldn't understand each other, and at one point it seemed like it was a drag for her because instead of giving feedback or literally any information/method that I could try she just wanted to list down stuff. She just keeps on listing down what I say and ask me questions. I realized I could do the same thing with better questions so that's what I did. I hated the fact that she didn't make the whole thing an experiment to do some tests on.



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    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XmLd...HealthyGamerGG

    There's this one guy on twitch/youtube, dr. k, specializes in video game addiction and has a stream where he interviews (mostly) streamers. They're really fascinating to watch, and the surprising diversity between the people he interviews, so it's not too hard to find one with someone similar enough to you to be able to relate.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Baqer View Post
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XmLd...HealthyGamerGG

    There's this one guy on twitch/youtube, dr. k, specializes in video game addiction and has a stream where he interviews (mostly) streamers. They're really fascinating to watch, and the surprising diversity between the people he interviews, so it's not too hard to find one with someone similar enough to you to be able to relate.
    I really like the dude, he always asks great questions. (I think he's ILE)

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    The Evening and the Morning Star Eudaimonia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BandD View Post
    I tried to give him one last chance after that- but then next week all he did was read passages out of the Bible to me. I was like 'Seriously?' and I never saw him after that lol.
    This sounds like a very bizarre thing for a therapist to do. Why do you think he was doing this?


    I don't mean to pick on IEEs - I mean he was a bad therapist regardless but I don't think that helped much either lol.
    I don't think IEEs are actually fantastic candidates for being a therapist. I think you need at least 2D Ti.

    I think the best therapists are rational introverts.

    Therapy requires very rigid and unchanging boundaries between patient and therapist. I don't see IEEs really giving a shit about this.
    With mind distracted, never thinking, "Death is coming,"
    To slave away on the pointless business of mundane life,
    And then to come out empty--it is a tragic error.
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    Quote Originally Posted by PseudoRandomBSGenerator View Post
    Lol, that's some Ni sh*t. Gulenko writes: ILI talks like a hypnotist.
    EIE's are into seance sh*t.
    I was young and I was undiagnosed social anxiety/depression and my mom didn’t know what to do. So she brought me to a hypnotist first to try and help me. I ended up leaving feeling worse cause she told me to kept picturing all these good things in my head and then I would lead me to spiral into negativity lol. I went to see a therapist a couple months later and got officially diagnosed.



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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallmo View Post
    If I found a Jungian therapist. Otherwise no.

    It's really important that the therapist himself has been through a lot in life and has gone through therapy and integrated the shadow. Otherwise he might project it on his patient.

    It's irritating how health care persons project on their patients. Not just in a therapy situation, but generally.
    I suspect that therapists ó do Jungian therapists even exist? ó arenít likely to do much for anyone introspective enough to have some sense of where their problems come from.

    Projection aside, it seems that the approach of therapists seems to be to focus on external behaviors rather than someoneís inner thoughts. I get the sense sometimes thereís almost a denial that the inner life determines the outer, or thereís a very shallow approach to addressing these sorts of deeper experiences.

    My personal experience was that I was forced into therapy when I was younger. I remember trying to explain everything I felt and thought, and the therapist sitting distant, confused, not knowing what to say. He then suggested to my parents that I was autistic and suggested they put me into a mental hospital for a while, which they did. I still bear a lot of anger from that.

    I donít personally believe mainstream therapy is very useful. For the people it ďhelpsĒ itís essentially a mental fraud, like going to confession; you believe youíve achieved some insight or progress when all youíve done is give some academic a large sum of money to recite banalities at you and tell you what you should obviously know if you have a speck of self-awareness. Despite ever-rising numbers of therapists and psychiatrists, are rates of depression falling? Are people becoming more introspective? No, but pharmaceutical companies are making a killing, often literally.

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    Well I thought I would give more of my experiences. I started seeing a therapist at 16 after dealing with shit for ages and then I saw a psychiatrist and got some anti depressants. I really liked my first therapist and it was like an opening door to some stuff. Especially cause it was during a very critical and emotional time in my life. It felt nice to explain my feelings and not be judged for my struggles for once. A lot of people really don’t understand my reactions and feelings. I would often get criticized when I expressed them. She was very kind and I remember her fondly. She retired when I graduated so I stopped going to therapy for a little while after that. I got off my anti-depressants after my second year in University. I tried the student counselling at my University when I was struggling but, it just a bad taste in my mouth afterward. I didn’t feel….”seen”. Just, you’re dealing with stress and that must be really hard. It wasn’t what I needed. Did my own thing for the time being.

    I went back to therapy my third year of Uni as it was getting bad again and I wanted to make sure I would be okay when I went to therapy. My Italian psychologist was great. I loved talking with him. He helped spell somethings out for me too with boundaries and understanding other things as well. The only thing I wish we talked about more was romance in dating but that’s okay. He really encouraged me to go abroad and see things a little differently. The only thing I kinda disagree with him about is that I have “mild-moderate” anxiety. I mean, it’s not false. Just, I hide a lot of stuff and I hate when my anxiety is downplayed. No, I can leave the house, hold down a job, and travel. But I shouldn’t be loosing my shit over leaving my house and peoples “unspoken” views of me that I believe. I know he didn’t mean it like that, just trying to give me a different perspective.

    When I came back from Germany. I had a really fucking rough time adjusting. Throw on being back with my family, an environment I didn’t want to be in, baggage from my time abroad, and my own depression ramping up to 100 and extreme self criticisms. I was a wreck. I saw a cheap therapist over the phone and while she was really great in providing me help in a theory way. I really didn’t feel understood for my feelings. It’s like she didn’t trust my perspective and that fucking hurt cause That triggered a really big wound of feeling…ignored and unheard in my childhood. But she did help me realize a lot of childhood wounds in that regard. I saw her for 2 months but it was at least nice to have someone to talk to. I still struggled after that and I looked for other psychologists but I haven’t found the right one yet. I decided to get on anti-depressants/anti-anxiety to give me some emotional stability which has helped me a lot. I will get off them in the new year but I just need some time to get in a right mind and not have an emotional breakdown everyday lol. It’s really hard for me to be back home. I just feel…very lonely and misunderstood a lot. I’m just going to build my self esteem up and it has been helping. I just need to fix some other things and I should be okay to get off them in January.

    I also realized a lot during this time that it wasn’t me. I always blamed myself for everything and it took me a while to realize that I’m in therapy for people not wanting to deal with their own shit lol. Jk…partly You would be surprised about how much people project or do shit based on their own unresolved trauma and I shouldn’t be blaming myself for not being able to fix it, resolve it, or not feeling enough because I couldn’t.

    I still love therapy and I think it’s important. Sadly there are a lot of shit therapists out there and it can be difficult to find the right one. Mental health is something very close to my heart and I really hope to help people one day or help research to help people with it one day. There is still so much stigma and I want people to feel okay if they really need mental health. I understand the struggles immensely and more importantly, I really don’t want to pass on my traumas for the next generation. I think the more we normalize it, the more we will all begin to heal as a society.



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    I only have limited experience with Dianetic therapy with volunteering to help students as a preclear in book 1 auditing and another student with a quad, also the book Self Analysis, and a self oriented CBT workbook I did back in 2014.

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    Worked with an ILE guy who at the time had recently started a practice and had 3 patients. I felt pity for his patients is all I could say.

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    I have a therapist and a psychiatrist. My therapist annoys me because she likes to dig where I have anxiety. She asks me what induces my anxiety, and then picks at the scab. I started calling her Scabbers. I guess it's supposed to help to talk about it. She's a nice lady, I just don't like therapy. She emails me YouTube videos about muscle relaxation techniques to help with my tactile dysfunction.

    My psychiatrist is all about the medication of course. He irritates me because he keeps saying "Well people with tactile dysfunction are usually on drugs." I keep telling him I don't do drugs, and never have. But he still brings it up. I really have zero reason to lie to him and it makes me feel like I can't talk to him because he just thinks I'm lying and do drugs. The medication he prescribes me only takes away my anxiety and I don't even ask him for anything else.

    Therapy is helpful, but uncomfortable, ime.
    Everything that irritates us about others can lead us to an understanding of ourselves."

    -Carl Jung



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    Dragoon/Genie/Dancer Shazaam's Avatar
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    This sounds like a very bizarre thing for a therapist to do. Why do you think he was doing this?
    I really don't know. Our first visit he seemed rather too worldly & knowledgeable to do something like that - but I think all his 'worldiness' was really more book related and it felt a lot like he felt I was too far gone because I didn't listen to him once lol and that I needed "spiritual" help or something. But yeah it was off-putting and offensive. I don't even think he asked for my permission first before he read it. He just kind of assertively started doing it or maybe he sort of half-way did.

    I don't think IEEs are actually fantastic candidates for being a therapist. I think you need at least 2D Ti.

    I think the best therapists are rational introverts.

    Therapy requires very rigid and unchanging boundaries between patient and therapist. I don't see IEEs really giving a shit about this.


    Very good point I agree 100%. The 1D Ti and Ti polr was a problem because its like nothing could be solidly defined. and Ne valuing was like 'anybody could be anything if they just believed' it did not resonate with me. Oh he wasn't homophobic or anything & I even got this suspicious he might even be gay himself - I mean the thing he asked me to do that I didn't was visit a gay bar lol. But its like Ti polr I think a person can easily have contradictions like that where they can be gay activists + religious fundies all at once. also with the Ne valuing and 2D Te HA it's like he wanted the topic of conversation to always be changing and I felt like I couldn't really process anything because he would try to change the topic too much for my tastes.

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    Ree Seether MrInternet's Avatar
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    I guess it depends on who you are and what problems you have, but therapy always proved to be a complete waste of time for me, as did medicine. What's helped me the most has been Se, taking action, going against what's comfortable, cutting out the bullshit.

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    I wanna be nice and diplomatic. In theory I do, but I'm not going to Enneagram 9 out with this topic. I want to say therapy can be helpful depending on the right therapist blah blah but I just can't- Sorry. I remember too many past abuses. I see how the system has fucked too many people over to be any different. I guess that's typical of IEI victim huh- but whatever. I don't care. I fucking hate them. I want to dress in drag and beat them up. Society would say I need therapy for that- but it makes me feel alive. =D

    I remember when Ms. Umbirdge therapist at the awful Delta group home made me not eat my dinner with the rest of the group- I had to face away and eat while staring at the wall lol. It was abusive. I should have thrown the food right in her face or just punched her- she was such an evil cunt- but if I did that she would have easily sent me to a higher security facility. also one time she tried to goad me to assault her so she could do just that. She wanted me to hit her cuz if I did then she could easily send me away. Your plans failed, CUNT.

    oh sorry I'm 'playing the victim' - even though she basically made me do that for no good reason and instigated crap herself. Yeah I realize I put myself in that situation to a large extent and I take full responsibility for my own choices that led me there but I fucking hate THE RAPE ISTS. If you think it was okay that she did that you're just a sadistic asshole I'm sorry I want nothing to do with you and you're not my friend. Don't respond to me if you think what she did was right or 'you can see her point too.' I have tried to forgive her but I can't - SHE WAS JUST A NARCISSISTIC CUNT and I don't have to like everybody or 'see their side too.'

    The good therapists I've had weren't able to out-do the bad. It was too much. and I've had a lot of therapists over the years. Too much. As you can see, it clearly never worked. <3
    Last edited by Shazaam; 09-07-2021 at 12:46 AM.

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    Dragoon/Genie/Dancer Shazaam's Avatar
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    You are also more vulnerable to authority and probably not as able to see through BS (or if you do see BS, maybe you can't leave).
    I was naive when I was that age and thought that if you were honest to the therapist they would be able to help you with your problems and make you feel better- but all they did was try to hurt me and try to destroy my family & falsely accuse me of things that didn't happen so they could feel morally superior. ((they had to pretend I was evil so they could feel like they were 'good')) "Tell me about your feelings so I can use them against you" type of thing.

    They would often twist my words and not listen to what I was really saying etc. I admit I wasn't the best communicator then because I was a nerdy kid and a bit of a spaz- but still.

    They couldn't really handle any truth- it seemed, even benign truth. Anything real they would just try to manipulate or destroy. I had to lie to them always at all times - to get away from there.

    oh I wasn't really 'born that naive' I mean my parents were too naive and taught me to be that way but it was fucked up. I always knew better than them and wish I trusted my own voice more but ... I mean I am learning. I'm sure ur a good teacher Emily u seem so genuinely caring and understanding. <3


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    twiggewed, dewusional, entitwed, snowfwake VewyScawwyNawcissist's Avatar
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    If i went to therapy i wouldnt get out cured but the loser would need therapy if they persisted trying to fix me. If they were good and capable they wouldnt do it as a job. Hell they would be incapable of getting a degree. and would have the self awareness that anyone Who goes to therapy lacks awareness and capacity for introspection so they are hopeless. The previous sentencea is very wrong. About this though, most ones actually became good after growth after they took their degree. Who they are now would be in conflict with everything befofe.

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    Therapy requires very rigid and unchanging boundaries between patient and therapist.
    .
    Strong disagree. If there's no connection, its spiritual offense. U cant Just take that away. Instead of connection u have transactions.

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    Everything is corrupt and even other IEIs dont believe me. Im Just entitled and should suck it up.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FreelancePoliceman View Post
    I suspect that therapists — do Jungian therapists even exist? — aren’t likely to do much for anyone introspective enough to have some sense of where their problems come from.

    Projection aside, it seems that the approach of therapists seems to be to focus on external behaviors rather than someone’s inner thoughts. I get the sense sometimes there’s almost a denial that the inner life determines the outer, or there’s a very shallow approach to addressing these sorts of deeper experiences.
    It is as if there is a need to recognize Oldham types/styles and their existence beginning from the early childhood (like let's say solitary/schizoid is not autistic unless they are... well autistic). You just do not become something over night when you cross over some age.
    MOTTO: NEVER TRUST IN REALITY
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    Dragoon/Genie/Dancer Shazaam's Avatar
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    I think it goes a bit far to say they'd want to hurt you. Most of them want to help right?
    No offense but I think this is naive. I think a lot of them are people who want to hear about somebody's problems ((ie being victimized or molested)) because they want to get off on it and it's a legal way to do that. Like the primary reason they went to therapy and all that schooling was so they could fap to somebody else's pain. Think about it, it would be a good faux-'socially appropriate' way to do that lol as you're talking to a lot of vulnerable people all day lol.

    But yeah you're also right- some of it was just they didn't mean harm and they were just not compatible. There was a therapist once that was as sweet and innocent as apple pie and I still didn't respond well to it.

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    okay I'll try to be a bit more open minded about that I guess because it's nice to have ESEs on the forum as there usually isn't any at all. <3

    I did eventually find a great LSI therapist like I said before but I can't say it was worth it personally all the bad ones I had to go through to get to her- I mean I liked her and everything but it didn't warrant all that, to me.

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    Currently, I think therapy is a set of tools in a garage of other health tools, and it might be the right ones for the job at hand or it might make things worse. It can also be used skillfully or not. Or maliciously.

    I agree that finding a good fit of a therapist is important, though sometimes "OK" is better than none. But, also, much like with anything else self-improvement related, you have to want to get better and take some responsibility for your own progress. So the therapist is a helper (potentially a key one), but not the main fixer.

    I first saw a therapist after my brother died a few years ago. I hunted around and found one that seemed to fit me on paper, and she turned out to be fairly good. I feel like there's still a disconnect, where it isn't "perfect" between us - partly in that I sometimes feel I can't be completely raw with her. It's nothing she's said or done as far as I can tell; I think it's more there's a part of me that wants to impress her and wants to hide more of the ugly things in me. I think that's more my issue than hers, ironically. But even so she helped me get much more functional again and, beyond just the grief, helped me get into a place internally where I could find and get into a long term relationship with someone who's good for me.

    I stopped seeing her a couple of years ago (she gently "kicked me out of the nest"), but this last year has been really rough for me and a few weeks ago I decided to see her again. I talked with her twice, but decided it's not quite what I need right now. There's a ton I could (and probably should) process from the last year, but doing so takes more energy than I have available right now. I still have a lot of the tools she gave me from our initial times together. And I already have a pretty good grasp on what I need to focus on currently - which has a lot to do with physical health. Once I'm in a better physical space, I think it might once again be helpful to do some talk therapy. And/or I might look for someone who does more nervous system therapies.


    Over the years, I've learned there's a LOT that can gum up the works in our brains. Childhood traumas and patterns are big ones, but so is our physical environment and states. For example, environmental toxins (pollution, mold, pesticides, etc.) and infections (bacterial, parasites, etc.) can have HUGE impacts on mental health. Your gut makes the majority of serotonin, for example. And usually it's not just one insult, but several, that lead to problems.

    So good on everyone who's wrestling with this. It's not easy and I applaud you for trying and taking even the littlest of steps.
    Oh, to find you in dreams - mixing prior, analog, and never-beens... facts slip and turn and change with little lucidity. except the strong, permeating reality of emotion.

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    Dragoon/Genie/Dancer Shazaam's Avatar
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    Are you still seeing her?
    No we both felt that it wasn't necessary any more. Which I also respected- as too many therapists try to milk you for money even when they don't need anymore. It becomes a scam thing.

    Again I'm also enneagram 5 so I don't seem to grow much talking about my feelings or inner worlds to a the rape ist. Usually talking about something makes me feel worse not better. It 'beats the drum of it' instead of letting it go.... besides I usually think it's pointless to open up to somebody because it is too rare they ever truly listen to me, they just naturally warp what I say to their own perceptions. But I can't blame people for this because everybody just has their own worlds and own personal shit.

    It's nice though, when you finally find the one you click with?
    It's nice but it's not that nice. A therapist is not your friend- it is still a master/slave relationship even when it's good and working well. Relying too much on their input and not your own voice is too weak to me.

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    Dragoon/Genie/Dancer Shazaam's Avatar
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    Also mutual, like yourself. Have you tried something like vipassana, body scanning, things like that? Not trying to solve your problem or anything, just interested in what you think about it


    I don't have any problems. I'm always perfect. It's the world that has to change not me.

    j/k- a bit of Te polr over exaggeration there. Yeah okay so I tried that 'tapping technique' and it sounds lame but it actually helped me quite a bit sometimes. Where u tap certain points on your body for emotional release etc. Although I'm not sure how much of that is the placebo effect or anything but it has helped at times. "Therapy" can mean so much- you know,t here's so many aspects- can't put a pretty ribbon on anything, like LSI told me before.

    Therapy can be eating a healthy diet- which I sometimes forget to do. I forgot to eat fruits/vegetables for a couple weeks and now I got a cold. =(

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    Dragoon/Genie/Dancer Shazaam's Avatar
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    also like somebody mentoined earlier, I think it was that policeman guy - therapy doesn't seem to have a lot of inner feeling emo work anyway- it's all about superficial behaviors and external crap. 'do this and that and be a normal person and pretend feelings don't exist and everything is just str8 male logic' etc. and that basically is what it has come down to it. So the therapist helps the patient 'fit in' and be normal, and not have feelings- and just be a robot of society- while feeding off their feelings and 'eating them' sadistically. So they can know what its like to have a soul themselves- as a lot of them are just heartless and empty inside. And the patient is really helping the therapist more than the other way around, I think - at least in a spiritual way. It's kind of this clever trick.

    so I did those external things and superifical things and they thought I was 'cured' - even with the LSI, although it was good- I never meant one I could talk about really deep internal shit too. They were all so Normie and Karen-like. That was part of how I was naive in the beginning - I thought therapy *was* a place you could safely talk about that crap. I didn't realize how superfical and catty it really was...

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    Dragoon/Genie/Dancer Shazaam's Avatar
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    Yeah I think the tapping thing was great for my 1D valued Se- I think talk therapy is probably better for people with low-ish Ni or people that aren't Te polrs- as too much therapy they tried to throw Te at me and it didn't work lol.

    Yeah the person has to find the thing that works for them. Although whatever you do, I still agree it's important to be properly challenged. No healing/or 'therapy' should be used as a tool to fuel a person's narcissism or anything. It's not that I didn't want to be challenged- I just refused to be abused. Although there are definitely people who would benefit from a "healthy" sense of narcissism... and people can sometimes become addicted to therapy I think - wanting to psychoanalyze their life all day instead of live it.

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    I don't need therapy; as Tony Soprano said "No cure for life."
    With mind distracted, never thinking, "Death is coming,"
    To slave away on the pointless business of mundane life,
    And then to come out empty--it is a tragic error.
    ENFJ | EIE | WEPL | 3w4 sx/so

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