Types you hate dealing with that aren't your conflictor.
Types You Hate That Aren't Your Conflictor.
Types you hate dealing with that aren't your conflictor.
The Barnum or Forer effect is the tendency for people to judge that general, universally valid statements about personality are actually specific descriptions of their own personalities. A "universally valid" statement is one that is true of everyone—or, more likely, nearly everyone. It is not known why people tend to make such misjudgments, but the effect has been experimentally reproduced.
The psychologist Paul Meehl named this fallacy "the P.T. Barnum effect" because Barnum built his circus and dime museum on the principle of having something for everyone. It is also called "the Forer effect" after its discoverer, the psychologist Bertram R. Forer, who modestly dubbed it "the fallacy of personal validation".
IEE
I've worked with them, it doesn't go well. Lots of misunderstandings.
The Barnum or Forer effect is the tendency for people to judge that general, universally valid statements about personality are actually specific descriptions of their own personalities. A "universally valid" statement is one that is true of everyone—or, more likely, nearly everyone. It is not known why people tend to make such misjudgments, but the effect has been experimentally reproduced.
The psychologist Paul Meehl named this fallacy "the P.T. Barnum effect" because Barnum built his circus and dime museum on the principle of having something for everyone. It is also called "the Forer effect" after its discoverer, the psychologist Bertram R. Forer, who modestly dubbed it "the fallacy of personal validation".
Originally Posted by Eudaimonia
It's funny you mentioned this because I was gonna say EIE's
Makes sense
The Barnum or Forer effect is the tendency for people to judge that general, universally valid statements about personality are actually specific descriptions of their own personalities. A "universally valid" statement is one that is true of everyone—or, more likely, nearly everyone. It is not known why people tend to make such misjudgments, but the effect has been experimentally reproduced.
The psychologist Paul Meehl named this fallacy "the P.T. Barnum effect" because Barnum built his circus and dime museum on the principle of having something for everyone. It is also called "the Forer effect" after its discoverer, the psychologist Bertram R. Forer, who modestly dubbed it "the fallacy of personal validation".
EIE ironically
We get it, you want attention, well I want attention too, so where do we go from here?
The Barnum or Forer effect is the tendency for people to judge that general, universally valid statements about personality are actually specific descriptions of their own personalities. A "universally valid" statement is one that is true of everyone—or, more likely, nearly everyone. It is not known why people tend to make such misjudgments, but the effect has been experimentally reproduced.
The psychologist Paul Meehl named this fallacy "the P.T. Barnum effect" because Barnum built his circus and dime museum on the principle of having something for everyone. It is also called "the Forer effect" after its discoverer, the psychologist Bertram R. Forer, who modestly dubbed it "the fallacy of personal validation".
Group up and give each other attention.
I think 95% of my complaints towards people were fueled by Ejs, my conflictor happens to be one of them, oop.
I just can't seem to find compassion towards the unhealthy ones acting up and they are the ones I end up enraged about.
Or maybe it's just mommy(LSE) issues.
Hate is too strong a word. I have had extreme difficulty working or seeing eye-to-eye with ILE. It's been a challenge working with IEI, ILI and SLE in that order - but not impossible. SEEs seemed to bob and weave a lot but we could usually come to an agreement.
a.k.a. I/O
Yeah maybe hate was too strong, but I had to make a title that popped lol. I actually don't have too much of a conflict with most types and I don't really even come into many conflicts with SLI and ILIs.
The Barnum or Forer effect is the tendency for people to judge that general, universally valid statements about personality are actually specific descriptions of their own personalities. A "universally valid" statement is one that is true of everyone—or, more likely, nearly everyone. It is not known why people tend to make such misjudgments, but the effect has been experimentally reproduced.
The psychologist Paul Meehl named this fallacy "the P.T. Barnum effect" because Barnum built his circus and dime museum on the principle of having something for everyone. It is also called "the Forer effect" after its discoverer, the psychologist Bertram R. Forer, who modestly dubbed it "the fallacy of personal validation".
It's my ESI sister's LSI husband that I can't get along with at all. If they're both in the same room, I hardly speak. Shenanigans.
I don't think this is all LSIs though, just him.
The mind is restless and difficult to restrain, but it is subdued by practice
-Krishna
Lol I can see how an LSI can be annoying. You're sister is ESI? How has having a sibling who is your conflictor affected how you interact with Fi types?
The Barnum or Forer effect is the tendency for people to judge that general, universally valid statements about personality are actually specific descriptions of their own personalities. A "universally valid" statement is one that is true of everyone—or, more likely, nearly everyone. It is not known why people tend to make such misjudgments, but the effect has been experimentally reproduced.
The psychologist Paul Meehl named this fallacy "the P.T. Barnum effect" because Barnum built his circus and dime museum on the principle of having something for everyone. It is also called "the Forer effect" after its discoverer, the psychologist Bertram R. Forer, who modestly dubbed it "the fallacy of personal validation".
I do okay with most Fi types or I know how to get along with them anyway. I avoid certain topics or I start changing the subject. When I was younger, I was pretty argumentative, but as I matured, I mellowed out.
I've become somewhat hand-shy around my ESI sister and her LSI husband. If I talk, I can irritate them. They're like a small Ne hating gang. They get loud when they don't agree with me, and I don't debate with people if they yell at me. I haven't experienced this with other LSI or ESI. Maybe I'm not around them enough to become irritating? I had one ESI boss I couldn't get along with, but I think she was deranged.
I guess you could say because of my ESI sister I remain more neutral around Fi types. Seems to work.
The mind is restless and difficult to restrain, but it is subdued by practice
-Krishna
This guy yells at you? What does your sister do when this is happening?
The Barnum or Forer effect is the tendency for people to judge that general, universally valid statements about personality are actually specific descriptions of their own personalities. A "universally valid" statement is one that is true of everyone—or, more likely, nearly everyone. It is not known why people tend to make such misjudgments, but the effect has been experimentally reproduced.
The psychologist Paul Meehl named this fallacy "the P.T. Barnum effect" because Barnum built his circus and dime museum on the principle of having something for everyone. It is also called "the Forer effect" after its discoverer, the psychologist Bertram R. Forer, who modestly dubbed it "the fallacy of personal validation".
They both get loud with me. It's hard to get any kind of shift in perspective from them. They don't agree, and apparently the volume in their voice wins the topic at hand.
The mind is restless and difficult to restrain, but it is subdued by practice
-Krishna
I WANT TO PREFACE THIS: DELTAS ARE WONDERFUL PEOPLE AND THE ONES ON HERE ARE SPLENDID!
I can seriously struggle with Delta NF’s and Delta ST women in life. Like it’s either the best thing ever or it all goes to shit in a fiery hell. It’s not that we don’t get along. Heck no. It’s just I tend to get the most whiplash from them. Delta NF women I cant rely on and that Fi whiplash is hard. It’s not consistent for me enough and I feel like I have to always be on their schedule. Delta NF men (the ones that are attracted to me) tend to really rub me the wrong way. I often feel patronized by them cause they always try to help me out with Si stuff and then mix is that Fi whiplash…yeah you get an annoyed duck real quick.
I get along with Delta men fine, I have the least issues with them. Delta women it just doesn’t work when we get to close. I feel trapped by their Te and Fi and I really don’t prescribe to their world view. Plus, it makes me upset when they get mad at my Fe expression.
I have had some great relations with Delta’s. I also have had the worst and most frequent struggles with delta. I get along with them better the gammas usually, but working with them and sometimes closeness is not a good idea for me. Makes me question if I am Beta but, it just comes down to me not valuing Fi/Te like they do.
Edit: I don’t hate any type. I’ve just noticed I tend have more issues with certain ones more then others.
LMFAOO the I burst out laughing right when I read the disclaimer.
What is Fi whiplash? Because I think we might be annoyed by the same thing.
The Barnum or Forer effect is the tendency for people to judge that general, universally valid statements about personality are actually specific descriptions of their own personalities. A "universally valid" statement is one that is true of everyone—or, more likely, nearly everyone. It is not known why people tend to make such misjudgments, but the effect has been experimentally reproduced.
The psychologist Paul Meehl named this fallacy "the P.T. Barnum effect" because Barnum built his circus and dime museum on the principle of having something for everyone. It is also called "the Forer effect" after its discoverer, the psychologist Bertram R. Forer, who modestly dubbed it "the fallacy of personal validation".
Fi whiplash: They can be really mean to you over something that personally offends them. Then the other minute expect you to be the best of friends. Your not allowed to leave them but they can leave you and come back when they want. Oh and sometimes they can remember the sweetest things but you don’t know when or why. Then other times you realize it was of manipulation to why they remember it to keep that bond there.LMFAOO the I burst out laughing right when I read the disclaimer
What is Fi whiplash? Because I think we might be annoyed by the same thing.
Disclaimer: Fi types are great most of the time. Most of my friends have been Fi users. Just it is hard as a Fe users sometimes and I really don’t understand it.
Ok YES, this is what I'm talking about. We will all be joking, everything will be fine, then all of the sudden they are going off on me for something I said. I treat it as a joke, thinking they couldn't be actually serious, and they get even more livid.
And the Si thing you said earlier with IEEs. Male IEEs hit my Si polr way more often than SEIs and SLIs. There was a guy that thought he was some style guru and would criticize almost every outfit I had. He dressed like a he shopped at the thrift store btw.
Some of the manipulation and coming in and out of peoples lives stuff I will stay silent on because I do that lol.
But if there is a big group of people and some Fi types are there, the flow will inevitably come to a screeching halt because we have to clarify something that was said because someone took it way too personally and the whole vibe gets weird and has to recover.
I love delta NFs they are usually really nice, cool, chill people. But there have been issues lol.
The Barnum or Forer effect is the tendency for people to judge that general, universally valid statements about personality are actually specific descriptions of their own personalities. A "universally valid" statement is one that is true of everyone—or, more likely, nearly everyone. It is not known why people tend to make such misjudgments, but the effect has been experimentally reproduced.
The psychologist Paul Meehl named this fallacy "the P.T. Barnum effect" because Barnum built his circus and dime museum on the principle of having something for everyone. It is also called "the Forer effect" after its discoverer, the psychologist Bertram R. Forer, who modestly dubbed it "the fallacy of personal validation".
I've been guilty of this haha. Thing is, Fi an introverted and thus individual function, so that what offends one Fi valuer might not offend another. There is no way to know.
Same way there are some Ti valuers that think quantum physics explains reality and others that Elon Musk is at the heart of a deep state conspiration that aims to use rockets to turn the Moon into a death star like weapon to turn all humans into slaves(real example, a IEI told me this, and he wasn't joking). It's like if you just say what you think in a Te way, there's always a chance of a Ti valuer wanting to lecture you about their weird worldview disconnected from facts.
Maybe the best thing is just to hang out with people who have the same convictions as you, whether about Fi or Ti? If they get too offended or disagree all the time, maybe it's best to just take some distance?
You must be very afraid of hurting some Fi types in here. It makes sense that your duals are like the complete opposite "I don't care if you're offended, that's your problem"
I have a lot of Fi friends that I do adore and the Fi valuers/friends here are very sweet. I have my own opions about it but, just because I don't understand or value it doesn't mean I should be a dick about it lol. The SEI mediator values her good relations despite being an Alpha TyrantYou must be very afraid of hurting some Fi types in here. It makes sense that your duals are like the complete opposite "I don't care if you're offended, that's your problem"I am a bit sensitive in that regard.
ILE men tend to be more like that then the ILE women. Someone has to smooth over relations so we can live somewhat comfortably lol
The whole dis-integrative <-> integrative nature of the quantum world that depends on the observer sounds very Ni. From an object relation perspective it is interesting and might encourage some sort of inclination to personalize one's own experience in an aesthetic Se suggestive way.
MOTTO: NEVER TRUST IN REALITY
Winning is for losers
Sincerely yours,
idiosyncratic type
Life is a joke but do you have a life?
Joinif you dare https://matrix.to/#/#The16Types:matrix.org
Tbh, Fe types can do a similar thing. Fe and Fi are as nasty when they get this way. I guess we are less affected by one or the other depending which one we value. Don't mean to depreciate your experience, it's just that I can relate by switching Fi to Fe.
I think it's impotant to mention it, tho it probably seems as coming out of nowhere in the middle of Fe types agreeing about Fi whiplash.
And I'm honestly terrified of Fe backlash writting this. Probably over nothing, people are chill here, but I got hit badly in the past, like you described.
Naw I get it. Don’t worry, I won’t go all Fe on youI often forget how Fe can feel to Fi feelers. I hope you have some good Fi feelers around you more now and that you don’t have to deal with a lot of Fe whiplash going forward.
ILE's are the scum of the Earth.
MOTTO: NEVER TRUST IN REALITY
Winning is for losers
Sincerely yours,
idiosyncratic type
Life is a joke but do you have a life?
Joinif you dare https://matrix.to/#/#The16Types:matrix.org
I truly disagree with this.
In my experience, ILEs can be noble, generous, kind, respectful of others, considerate in an oblique way, and smart and inventive.
The fact that ILEs and I often irritate each other does not make them scum. It does make them irritating. And me evil, maybe.
ive had an LSE manager that was notorious for being difficult and super anal about rules/cleaning and pretty much everything. Sometimes just to annoy you aswel.
Lol we all know THAT LSE manager. I had one telling me that forgetting to turn off the lights when leaving the office is a personal offense to them. It meant I lacked respect for them.
With respect to the entire type, I don't *hate* any.
I have felt strong antipathies toward ESIs more frequently than any other type (including my conflictors, SLEs).
IEEs drive me crazy and some people have thought I hated the IEEs in my life, but in actuality it's not a personal grudge; I just find many of them mentally draining.
I don't know if I've ever really hated an LSI, but my feelings toward them are usually on a pendulum that ranges from awe/warmth to bitter resentment. I can also say the same of some duals...
I notice Holographic-Panoramic cognition (of the ESI-SLE-LII-IEE supervision ring) and I don't get along in general.
Last edited by PinKDiGiT18; 08-31-2021 at 12:02 AM.
What kind of conflicts do you have with ESIs?
The Barnum or Forer effect is the tendency for people to judge that general, universally valid statements about personality are actually specific descriptions of their own personalities. A "universally valid" statement is one that is true of everyone—or, more likely, nearly everyone. It is not known why people tend to make such misjudgments, but the effect has been experimentally reproduced.
The psychologist Paul Meehl named this fallacy "the P.T. Barnum effect" because Barnum built his circus and dime museum on the principle of having something for everyone. It is also called "the Forer effect" after its discoverer, the psychologist Bertram R. Forer, who modestly dubbed it "the fallacy of personal validation".
they often appear self-serving to me in how restrictive their brand of Fi is. Likely because of Fe ignoring + Ne PoLR they can have grand oversights or simple disregard for how their actions have the potential to negatively impact others.
I'm going to pour some salt, so cover up your wounds...
I funny enough do not hate LIEs that much. Can they be arrogant and cause the world's problems yet act like it's the "mindlesssheeples'" fault instead of their PoLR block? Yes. They do, but when I hang out with them and we have a subject we both like, they're actually fun, insightful. The other Gammas though... I just can't.
ESIs are like a bootleg version of an LSI. What happens is that you basically have a close-minded insufferable moralist... but with zero sense. All their reasoning can basically be just summarized as "my vagina". I once had a- I dunno what she was called, but a teacher's assistant in high school who I am sure is ESI. One could argue she was LSI, but I didn't see much structure orreceptivity. But anyways, to exemplify their insanity once during high school I was looking for music on a computer and was able to re-earth a song I have been dying to listen to again. I shouted with excitement "I FINALLY FOUND IT! AHAH alright, time to pirate it." The teacher with a stone face, not even looking at me, just goes on a tirade saying that's illegal and she would call the authorities on me. Like, I get being principled, but are you really willing to lock up some kid or put him in eternal financial debt just because he wanted to pirate some obscure out-of-print Japanese remix of a song? So cool. ESIs are basically just aggressive NPCs to me.
ILIs... The most pointless type ever. There's being an "umm actually" and then there's... them. They'll often get pissy when people are having fun and or being boisterous, wanting everyone to confirm to their rigid non-expression. And when they do hog the limelight that's only being amassed because because they want to "correct" you, they don't even provide a solution or constructive response. It's like, if you're gonna get pissy about me being boisterous or being incorrect at least ACTUALLY try to correct me. But no, they literally expect you to be silent, wade through their paragraphs of text DEBOOONKING YOU just to get "idk lmao ur just dumb". At least LIEs actually do something with their relativism. Seriously, they just say a bunch of depressing shit that ruins my mood. "oh so you're against truth? that must mean you're stupid!" no, you're just annoying. Simple as.
SEEs.... I dunno. They can just be snakes.
What you said about ILIs and moral relativism reminds me — I’ve known a number of ILIs who become occasionally angry about something called “postmodernism,” by which they seem to mean an idea that truth is relative. Yet these ILIs invariably have the most relativistic outlook you’ll ever hear. It’s amazing.I'm going to pour some salt, so cover up your wounds...
I funny enough do not hate LIEs that much. Can they be arrogant and cause the world's problems yet act like it's the "mindless
ESIs are like a bootleg version of an LSI. What happens is that you basically have a close-minded insufferable moralist... but with zero sense. All their reasoning can basically be just summarized as "my vagina". I once had a- I dunno what she was called, but a teacher's assistant in high school who I am sure is ESI. One could argue she was LSI, but I didn't see much structure or
ILIs... The most pointless type ever. There's being an "umm actually" and then there's... them. They'll often get pissy when people are having fun and or being boisterous, wanting everyone to confirm to their rigid non-expression. And when they do hog the limelight that's only being amassed because because they want to "correct" you, they don't even provide a solution or constructive response. It's like, if you're gonna get pissy about me being boisterous or being incorrect at least ACTUALLY try to correct me. But no, they literally expect you to be silent, wade through their paragraphs of text DEBOOONKING YOU just to get "idk lmao ur just dumb". At least LIEs actually do something with their relativism. Seriously, they just say a bunch of depressing shit that ruins my mood. "oh so you're against truth? that must mean you're stupid!" no, you're just annoying. Simple as.
SEEs.... I dunno. They can just be snakes.
I think a number of “postmodern” writers were/are ILI, and if not were another Ni ego. Something about playing with established forms and narratives seems to appeal to that kind of person. I have an idea that ILIs’ struggle against “postmodernism” is really just an expression of their self-hatred.
I have noticed this, I think it could be the whole Dialectical-Algorithmic group.
The Barnum or Forer effect is the tendency for people to judge that general, universally valid statements about personality are actually specific descriptions of their own personalities. A "universally valid" statement is one that is true of everyone—or, more likely, nearly everyone. It is not known why people tend to make such misjudgments, but the effect has been experimentally reproduced.
The psychologist Paul Meehl named this fallacy "the P.T. Barnum effect" because Barnum built his circus and dime museum on the principle of having something for everyone. It is also called "the Forer effect" after its discoverer, the psychologist Bertram R. Forer, who modestly dubbed it "the fallacy of personal validation".
How so?
I mean postmodernism is a really vague definition. But, I think its because of the dynamic nature of their thinking, it has a particular ambiguous subjectivity to it.
Gulenko talks about it in the descriptions.
There is an emphasis on an individuals perception of events rather than events themselves. Someone's perception of events is more important to consider over what "actually happened" like a Casual-determinist may worry about. Instead of a static description of water, Heraclitus opts for a dynamic description of the river's flow as it exists in time.Historically, the first representative of a Dialectical worldview would be Heraclitus. Epitomizing the Dynamic dichotomy, he was of the opinion that "you cannot enter the same river twice" because whenever you enter again, the flow is already of different water.
One more graphical illustration of Dialectical perception. What do you see in the picture: a vase against a black background, or two facial profiles on a white background? It depends on which one for you is the background, and which is the figure. Some see a vase and the profiles turn into a dark background, others see two black profiles and the white vase goes into the background. But once a person sees both images, fluctuations of attention begin. The picture seems to pulsate: you see a vase, then the profiles. There is a dialectical exchange of background/foreground. Triggering negative reverse perspective, where distant or darkened objects are perceived more significantly than those located closer to the observer.
This emphasis on an individuals perception of experience can be considered too subjective and relativist for some. These are similar criticisms for what is considered "postmodern" thought.
The Barnum or Forer effect is the tendency for people to judge that general, universally valid statements about personality are actually specific descriptions of their own personalities. A "universally valid" statement is one that is true of everyone—or, more likely, nearly everyone. It is not known why people tend to make such misjudgments, but the effect has been experimentally reproduced.
The psychologist Paul Meehl named this fallacy "the P.T. Barnum effect" because Barnum built his circus and dime museum on the principle of having something for everyone. It is also called "the Forer effect" after its discoverer, the psychologist Bertram R. Forer, who modestly dubbed it "the fallacy of personal validation".
I too have noticed this, that the vocal anti-post-modernists are ILI, or some kind of Decisive type. I find the Betas approach somewhat forgiveable. Because even if they are wrong, they have some actual foundation where they reason from. ILIs just spit nonsense for sake of it. They actually seem to pollute the ideational pool. I have not read his stuff nor do I plan to, but possibly is Max Stirner ILI? if so.... yeah.
What you said about playing with the rules is perhaps an Irrational thing and even more likely, Decisive Irrational. It seems they are the ones who reject all structures, say life is meaningless, then say the truth is some "will to power" or "might is right", then get smoked by an ideology that disagrees with them.
seems so adept at forecasting everything besides its own demise. It's stuff like this that reminds me being Judicious ain't all that bad.
''life is meaningless'' sounds Ni devaluing since Ni sees meaning everywhere and even creates meaning for others. Max Stirner reminds me of LIII too have noticed this, that the vocal anti-post-modernists are ILI, or some kind of Decisive type. I find the Betas approach somewhat forgiveable. Because even if they are wrong, they have some actual foundation where they reason from. ILIs just spit nonsense for sake of it. They actually seem to pollute the ideational pool. I have not read his stuff nor do I plan to, but possibly is Max Stirner ILI? if so.... yeah.
What you said about playing with the rules is perhaps an Irrational thing and even more likely, Decisive Irrational. It seems they are the ones who reject all structures, say life is meaningless, then say the truth is some "will to power" or "might is right", then get smoked by an ideology that disagrees with them.
I should have clarified because bothtypes can be meaning seeking or nihilistic. But how they go about it is much different. From what I have observed and can deduct
To relate this back to Decisive Irrationals and the expression "life is meaningless", they might blatantly say this, but since nihilism is still a philosophy (thus suggesting meaning), at the heart of it, they are just talking about a detected unescapable trend or inability to appropriately apply force, which can lead to a very bleak outlook on life where ethics and logic are expendable. They start to epitomize the vices of Darwinism. Which I believe captures the animalistic essence of
So in short, anyone can say life is meaningless and fall prey to depression, but everyone is automatically meaning seeking and bound, it's people's methods and attitudes that matter.
ESIs are like a bootleg version of an LSI. What happens is that you basically have a close-minded insufferable moralist... but with zero sense. All their reasoning can basically be just summarized as "my vagina". I once had a- I dunno what she was called, but a teacher's assistant in high school who I am sure is ESI. One could argue she was LSI, but I didn't see much structure or
ILIs... The most pointless type ever. There's being an "umm actually" and then there's... them. They'll often get pissy when people are having fun and or being boisterous, wanting everyone to confirm to their rigid non-expression. And when they do hog the limelight that's only being amassed because because they want to "correct" you, they don't even provide a solution or constructive response. It's like, if you're gonna get pissy about me being boisterous or being incorrect at least ACTUALLY try to correct me. But no, they literally expect you to be silent, wade through their paragraphs of text DEBOOONKING YOU just to get "idk lmao ur just dumb". At least LIEs actually do something with their relativism. Seriously, they just say a bunch of depressing shit that ruins my mood. "oh so you're against truth? that must mean you're stupid!" no, you're just annoying. Simple as.
The Barnum or Forer effect is the tendency for people to judge that general, universally valid statements about personality are actually specific descriptions of their own personalities. A "universally valid" statement is one that is true of everyone—or, more likely, nearly everyone. It is not known why people tend to make such misjudgments, but the effect has been experimentally reproduced.
The psychologist Paul Meehl named this fallacy "the P.T. Barnum effect" because Barnum built his circus and dime museum on the principle of having something for everyone. It is also called "the Forer effect" after its discoverer, the psychologist Bertram R. Forer, who modestly dubbed it "the fallacy of personal validation".
Let me see which types I like by process of elimination
LII - No
ESE - No
SEI - Depends on the day and the SEI
ILE - No
EIE - Yes, but also no
SLE - No
LSI - No
IEI - begrudgingly sometimes, but no
ESI - No
LIE - Depends on the LIE
SEE - hell no
ILI - eh, no
IEE - No
EII - No
LSE - No
SLI - eh, no
Conclusion: I only like harmless people
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