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Thread: PoLR pain

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    Default PoLR pain

    In what way is your PoLR painful for you?

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    Bc SEEs misunderstand me and think I’m “disrespecting them” when that’s not my intention, in many cases that’s not even what’s objectively happening is my guess. But I didn’t know this and I don’t know whether or not I “deserve” some se type lashing out at me for some perceived slight or whatever, even my intentions are completely innocent. So it messes with my head. Some SEEs can also be really insensitive and unempathic so their feedback made me think I was being too dramatic or should try harder when really they were unintentionally mistreating me? Other Se valued and/or strong types in my life told me there was miscommunication

    so yeah in sum, pain, because you can’t defend yourself against unfair attacks

    no experience with SLEs

    edit you can imagine that a pattern like this, over time, basically becomes unintentional abuse and destroys you from within.

    Also before I knew socionics I had an ILE I wanted to get close to, of course I couldn’t and supervisees can also hurt their supervisor due to devaluing their lead but I’m extremely careful with ILEs since now I feel like I just couldn’t have expected him to understand me ane shouldn’t have tried to close the distance, probably harmed him. So yeah - I mean I keep the concept of supervision in mind even as a supervisor. I feel pretty bad but he wasn’t nice to me either, again claiming that I was “trying to get attention” which messes with my head again. That how come I am in so much pain I need help, should try harder to not be or something.

    anyways not interested in ILEs or SEEs at all at this point
    never really felt interest in an SLE

    this might sound strange but SLEs almost make more “sense” to me than SEEs. I cannot stand the latter type (well there are exceptions - there have been kind SEEs who basically just left me alone; those types I can find somewhat attractive). It was difficult for me to “see the Fi” if you will in SEEs at first but relative to SLEs..they clearly have it haha
    Last edited by necrosebud; 05-25-2021 at 12:30 AM.

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    Ok, I think this relates to Te PoLR.

    I have trouble absorbing large bodies of information and being factually detailed, I prefer condensed logical structures because it is easier for me to absorb them. I also do not really have Te practicality and business sense so I wouldn't really do well in a Te environment and it would just drain me. I have issues with being objective and I tend to look at things as being more subjective. Getting overloaded with too many facts that I find useless to the overall lesson is very unpleasant also.

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    I am not sure what my PoLR is. It could be Si, Fi, Ti, or Ne.

    For me, I tend to have a lot of anxiety. Especially around things that I am not good at, the future, and my health. I like the freedom of making decisions. An assumption that many of anxious people is that they are indecisive. For me, I need the closure that a decision brings.

    Fi is maybe not painful; it is more fickle and confusing. I have pretty strong morals, but not a good grasp on relationships and social rules. Social rules can be very vague.
    unsure socionics type - intj-t - 5w4 sx/sp - 538 - SLOEI
    virgo sun - aquarius rising - scorpio moon




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    I'm Se PoLR.

    My theories are somewhat related to the reality. I don't like the ones which are totally impractical and are just for fun. This seems to be how my PoLR is supervising my EGO block as a Super-EGO evaluatory function. But I don't do the Se well and my Se remains in a low level.

    Some of my Se-related problems:


    • I am somewhat clumsy such that I am usually not sure of how much force to use on an object. For example I often destroy my keyboards.
    • I find that I am almost unable to mobilize myself. Even a few days before an exam such that ILEs are mobilized, I am still in the same working pace to review the materials and I will not be mobilized by an exam. Even if this exam is very important, I mostly keep the same pace and I will not be highly mobilized by it.
    • I don't like to be pushed and I also find myself hard to push others.

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    Quote Originally Posted by asd View Post
    Also before I knew socionics I had an ILE I wanted to get close to, of course I couldn’t and supervisees can also hurt their supervisor due to devaluing their lead but I’m extremely careful with ILEs since now I feel like I just couldn’t have expected him to understand me ane shouldn’t have tried to close the distance, probably harmed him. So yeah - I mean I keep the concept of supervision in mind even as a supervisor. I feel pretty bad but he wasn’t nice to me either, again claiming that I was “trying to get attention” which messes with my head again. That how come I am in so much pain I need help, should try harder to not be or something.
    I know personally that I've figured out how to just ignore all Fi stuff that I don't wanna hear. If someone scolds me for doing/saying something wrong, I'll sit there in the sand trying to calmly debate explain to them on why I don't care. Usually it makes people angry, but I don't care, I've just accepted that the best end is if I just don't care. I personally know a couple EII's, and I'd just like to ask where the problem with opening up is? What makes it so that they don't want to open up to you? Personally I'm fine with people opening up to me of any type, it's more the problem of getting other people to do it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Baqer View Post

    I know personally that I've figured out how to just ignore all Fi stuff that I don't wanna hear. If someone scolds me for doing/saying something wrong, I'll sit there in the sand trying to calmly debate explain to them on why I don't care. Usually it makes people angry, but I don't care, I've just accepted that the best end is if I just don't care. I personally know a couple EII's, and I'd just like to ask where the problem with opening up is? What makes it so that they don't want to open up to you? Personally I'm fine with people opening up to me of any type, it's more the problem of getting other people to do it.
    idk, I have no problem opening up
    but if they're not going to get close to me...it is kind of pointless.

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    Ti vs Fi

    Ti checks the logical validity
    Fi checks the feeling alignment

    Many times Fi valuers can not see that I'm deriving from detached perspective. "More of this is the truth vs I'd like it like this - I'm experiencing to the truth". Fe muddles up this by making things too grand - the truth gets a poetic spin and is no longer factual which might make Fi valuers confused.
    Many times Ti valuers can not see that Fi valuers deriving from personal feelings. "More of I'd like things to be like this vs this is the way things are - I'm stating the personal aspect". Te muddles up this by stating it as a fact in too hasty manner- the aspect becomes stubborn factual state which divorces from logic and confuses Ti valuers.

    The personal feelings tend to make me question sanity of many things.
    MOTTO: NEVER TRUST IN REALITY
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    Quote Originally Posted by BrightDemonSheep96 View Post
    Ti vs Fi

    Ti checks the logical validity
    Fi checks the feeling alignment
    That's what the theory says. In my case, I 'supervise' Fi. Take ethicist Peter Singer as an example. I am sometimes swayed by his arguments, but I often find errors in logical consistency or coherence in his reasoning, and I'm therefore not always swayed. His type would take it personally, but I'm basically playing devil's advocate with this type (IEE), but they don't like it. OTOH, I read certain Fi-PoLR types posts, and the message is almost that they don't believe in ethical ideas period. That I don't understand. As Ti, it should not be a matter of having distaste for anything with the word 'ethics', but rather they dislike these ideas ('Fi') because they are incoherent, poorly thought out, etc.. In other words, it should not simply any ethical idea that they have distaste for, but only the ones that are based on poor logic. (OTOH, what do I know? )
    Last edited by jason_m; 05-27-2021 at 10:20 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BrightDemonSheep96 View Post
    Many times Fi valuers can not see that I'm deriving from detached perspective.
    perhaps fi valuers recognize this and grow perturbed

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    It's stressful no matter how good I am at it.
    It takes so much energy, I have none left for other stuff. Makes me want to nap, forget, dissapear...
    I'm too used to it for it to be painful, it's closer to resignation by now.
    Even EIEs are closer to small annoyance when they get on my case, hope someday I'll become inwardly solid enough it won't bother me at all.

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    NF types make me want to bite their heads off. Especially EII/IEE.

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    with weak nonvalued Ni it's hard to be assured in good outcomes
    as it's weak - you underesteemate positive tendentions and stay more anxious than should
    as it's nonvalued - it's hard consciously trust to known positive opinions
    it's possibly to make yourself be assured in positive outcomes, but is harder than for most people

    also. when I dealed with IN*J types, I felt near them more calmed and optimistic. mainly by coping their state that due to what they say

    Quote Originally Posted by flowers and sugar View Post
    hope someday I'll become inwardly solid enough it won't bother me at all
    Among what is possible:
    - to make the life or its perception good enough to bother lesser about bad in it
    - to improve weak region skills to make lesser mistakes there
    Types examples: video bloggers, actors

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    Quote Originally Posted by jason_m View Post
    That's what the theory says. In my case, I 'supervise' Fi. Take ethicist Peter Singer as an example. I am sometimes swayed by his arguments, but I often find errors in logical consistency or coherence in his reasoning, and I'm therefore not always swayed. His type would take it personally, but I'm basically playing devil's advocate with these types, and they don't like it. OTOH, I read certain Fi-PoLR types posts, and the message is almost that they don't believe in ethical ideas period. That I don't understand. As Ti, it should not be a matter of having distaste for anything with the word 'ethics', but rather they dislike these ideas ('Fi') because they are incoherent, poorly thought out, etc.. In other words, it should not simply any ethical idea that they have distaste for, but only the ones that are based on poor logic. (OTOH, what do I know? )
    With Fi-PoLR types, it should also be poorly thought out logical ideas in general that bother them. And ethical types are therefore more prone to this, and therefore inflict their vulnerable function. That is what I assume anyway: my function 'supervises' such ideas, Fi-vulnerable is really bothered by them. (Not to say that everyone Fi has really poor ideas either, as it would not be Fi per se that bothers Ti, but simply someone with weak ideas period.)
    Last edited by jason_m; 05-27-2021 at 08:30 PM.

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    I don't really view Te polr as being weak against a lot of factual data- cuz raw facts and crap is Ti not Te really. IEIs have 2D valued Ti so depending on the context we probably really like knowledge for it's own sake- the thing is Te is like external active knowledge that moves around a lot, and is always changing or something. 'external objects in motion.' Te changes the rules to fit it's Fi feelings. Te polr is like, being painfully aware or not liking how you sometimes have to try a lot of different things logically to get to the right strategy in a situation. Ti is more fixed and rigid- but I just prefer that better. And it's like how multiple facts are changing- my LIE uncle will always talk to me about this external business crap that I don't want to hear. Businesses are usually based on Te rules not Ti - 'Ti institutional rules' can be Alpha or Beta like a lot of colleges have a lot of Alphas cuz they are Ti valuing and they don't change their structure much.

    And I prefer rules that always stay the same- or if they do change there is just crystal clear objective evidence for why they should change. I don't like 'okay we're going to do this now because my Fi got a hard-on for something.' I hate that shit and Deltas especially with both valued Ne & Te are always pulling that shit!

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    Quote Originally Posted by BandD View Post
    I don't really view Te polr as being weak against a lot of factual data- cuz raw facts and crap is Ti not Te really. IEIs have 2D valued Ti so depending on the context we probably really like knowledge for it's own sake- the thing is Te is like external active knowledge that moves around a lot, and is always changing or something. 'external objects in motion.' Te changes the rules to fit it's Fi feelings. Te polr is like, being painfully aware or not liking how you sometimes have to try a lot of different things logically to get to the right strategy in a situation. Ti is more fixed and rigid- but I just prefer that better. And it's like how multiple facts are changing- my LIE uncle will always talk to me about this external business crap that I don't want to hear. Businesses are usually based on Te rules not Ti - 'Ti institutional rules' can be Alpha or Beta like a lot of colleges have a lot of Alphas cuz they are Ti valuing and they don't change their structure much.

    And I prefer rules that always stay the same- or if they do change there is just crystal clear objective evidence for why they should change. I don't like 'okay we're going to do this now because my Fi got a hard-on for something.' I hate that shit and Deltas especially with both valued Ne & Te are always pulling that shit!
    Holy fuck you just described exactly how I view Te Polr but couldn’t put into words. ESPECIALLY CAUSE FREAKING TE IS ALWAYS CHANGING AND IT DRIVES ME FUCKING NUTS. I appreciate it in others that can do it but yeah, I can’t. Polr hurts.

    Thank you BandD! Your the bestest!

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    Aw @MissDucki. I like you a lot too! Te polr hug.

    Yes! If you ask IEI to do something logically and use Ti the IEI will probably reproduce/solve it beautifully despite being a feeler type! Sure we might need a bit more time or something than a 3D or 4D Ti person would - but it's very possible. If IEIs didn't have any capability for logic - we'd just be these emo spirit wisps that floated in space uselessly! We're not just Night Elf wisps- we're more than that! People tease us a lot and say we're like this, but we can make fun of them back! It was easy for me to get all As in school and compete and complete in logical crap because a lot of that is really just Ti and not Te.

    But yeah Te will often not tell you about something and not be totally clear on it- because it's trying to fullfill a Fi agenda that is not logical at all , it's all emotional. ((and it might be utilizing a lot of Ti too, but only in service to the Fi)) Like it can be especially so underhanded and shady with all the machinations of how it's trying to rule the world. (doesn't help that most of American society is Te valuing and Gamma too) I had something like that happen to me just recently when I was in a very Te heavy place. It annoyed me that they weren't very clear on the Te stuff they were changing- and I was dissapointed in the end result, but I mean it was my own fault because it's hard for me to keep up with it as it's always so much in flux and Te is my polr.

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    As for me (Ne-PoLR), I interrogated @Megatrop to death today, to my foolishness, of course lol

    For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life
    . -John 3:16



    Apologetics

    Stop wasting time

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    @BandD do you really think so? I’ve always loved Te types specifically because I find them clear and willing to make things make sense to me - I find myself having to pry clarity out of Ti types, because they often think certain details that I want to know are irrelevant.

    Interesting

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    Quote Originally Posted by pandemic candy View Post
    Se-PoLR @Stray Cat

    Almost too easy. I feel kinda bad.
    You talk, bait, post lies with no proof & feed off my reaction. You're basically an ex-wife who never goes away.

    If I had Se-Polr I'd avoid confrontation. You're boring & probably annoying the entire forum at this point by being a shameless nutbag attention whore.

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    @
    BandD do you really think so? I’ve always loved Te types specifically because I find them clear and willing to make things make sense to me - I find myself having to pry clarity out of Ti types, because they often think certain details that I want to know are irrelevant.


    Well I think they will definitely do that for you if they like you in a Fi way, and it's ur dual seeking function. And if you both value Te/Fi the communication is probably clearer between you.

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    Disrupting your illusory reality Megatrop's Avatar
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    Not being attentive to Sensory details (S), and rules and processes (T) is what is painful, not addressing any specific function

    I'm always navigating in the ocean of ideas but not able to implement them. I'm the one who gives insights that others work upon
    self-discovery
    self-development
    optimism
    relationships
    communication
    high ideals

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    Quote Originally Posted by BandD View Post

    Well I think they will definitely do that for you if they like you in a Fi way, and it's ur dual seeking function. And if you both value Te/Fi the communication is probably clearer between you.
    it’s just mind blowing how PoLRs manifest in the different types. Se PoLR for me is being conscious of the world, but having no clue how to affect it. When someone asks me to demonstrate a physical activity or discipline/instruct someone with orders, I instantly freeze - and Se valuers are subsequently like, “it’s not that big a deal? Just tell them/do what you have to” which seems like it should be that simple, but in practice for me it’s like trying to lift a weight in the gym that your body is not ready for. If I manage to get it up, I look like a spaz and probably hurt my back in the process.

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    When someone asks me to demonstrate a physical activity or discipline/instruct someone with orders, I instantly freeze - and Se valuers are subsequently like, “it’s not that big a deal? Just tell them/do what you have to” which seems like it should be that simple, but in practice for me it’s like trying to pull a weight in the gym that your body is not ready for.
    Aw yeah. Well I can kinda relate cuz I have 1D Se myself and I'm personally not very pushy if somebody else can't do something usually- but because it's suggestive with the right encourgement I usually over come this and just kinda go for it. Also I usually get power/authority in the world despite having 1D Se and so I think I'm less hesitant about giving orders and stuff. Suggestive is definitely stronger than polr I think, even though both are one dimensional.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pandemic candy View Post
    Pussy
    Quote Originally Posted by pandemic candy View Post
    ^^^^^ Se-PoLR ^^^^^^
    Quote Originally Posted by pandemic candy View Post
    Waiting on @Stray Cat's Se-PoLR be like...

    Quote Originally Posted by pandemic candy View Post
    Waiting on @Stray Cat's Se-PoLR be like...

    Typical you. Cherry picking info. Ignoring what doesn't fit your barbie ass narrative. Getting 80 alerts from an insecure internet incel like you is boring. I'd understand if you were getting paid, but instead you're probably just gay.

    I have nothing against gays just blow your noodle to someone who gives a f*ck.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pandemic candy View Post
    I know u r but what am i

    Keep recycling & proving how a submissive geek like you is desperate for attention

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    Quote Originally Posted by CR400AF View Post
    I'm Se PoLR.

    My theories are somewhat related to the reality. I don't like the ones which are totally impractical and are just for fun. This seems to be how my PoLR is supervising my EGO block as a Super-EGO evaluatory function. But I don't do the Se well and my Se remains in a low level.

    Some of my Se-related problems:


    • I am somewhat clumsy such that I am usually not sure of how much force to use on an object. For example I often destroy my keyboards.
    • I find that I am almost unable to mobilize myself. Even a few days before an exam such that ILEs are mobilized, I am still in the same working pace to review the materials and I will not be mobilized by an exam. Even if this exam is very important, I mostly keep the same pace and I will not be highly mobilized by it.
    • I don't like to be pushed and I also find myself hard to push others.
    I find myself nodding yes, same here. Though I'm unusually dogged when it comes to liberty and freedom.

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