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Thread: Why donít people like Gulenko?

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    Default Why donít people like Gulenko?

    Why donít people like Gulenko/ DCNH? Iíve only just started reading stuff on his website. It seems quite accessible/ progressive? Am I imagining it that people on here donít seem to like him much?
    Don't judge each day by the harvest you reap but by the seeds that you plant.

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    It’s not that I don’t like DCNH and Gulenko but I don’t see the point of it or see it in people
    I do think of someone or talk to them and immediately think - This guy is EP, that sounds Fe as fuck, etc etc
    And I guess that’s enough? I know who would be annoying or explain why our conversation is going haywire

    Maybe my small brain can’t understand it, but it’s not like I’m trying tbh. I’m sorry
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    People may don't like baseless heresies which are not Socionics and which Gulenko uses much. And his typing mistakes, which are expected to be high for all known typers. People do not care about Gulenko himself.

    What is more interesting. Why some people may _like_ much what he does, while there is no reasonable basis for this.
    Mb cause he says what some people like to hear. Alike to get "your pair is your dual", what @aster got before trusting to nonsense IEI. And some other ones too got those "duals" taken from nowhere as there was no appropriate typing material.
    Or to get a type by what they say to him, when they know the theory and are prejusticed to get some type, so may filter the info to mislead him (as he uses logical analysis much and so trusts to words).
    Or mb they don't want to feel themselves as fools which spend significant money for bs.
    Or mb they just like to be typed by someone relatively wide known.
    etc
    Types examples: video bloggers, actors

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    i like him even though i disagree with his typing i paid for. i think it's a combination of distaste for one or more of his supporters + jealousy about him being able to leverage his opinions for profit.

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    As far as liking or disliking the guy, I think he seems (from what I’ve seen of him) more likable than not.


    I think a lot of what’s happening is some people don’t like to be wrong or have their own perceptions questioned. As far as typing other people, they get these ideas in their head~like this person is X type and this person acts like X= all people like X are X type. Then they have this idea for a long time and build a lot off of this idea. If
    Someone comes around with progressive ideas and says, no this person is type A, well I think some of what we are encountering here is a difference in personality. Some will consider it, some will not even consider it (blind arrogance), some will see how it could be either way. A lot of people imo that seem to not like him are stuck on their own constructs that they have been building for a long time, and they are very solid in their minds.


    Some people haven’t really read into it that much. I know I hadn’t, so I never really used it and was just listening to what others had to say about it on here-that it didn’t make any sense. But tbh, the more I read, the more sense it makes to me and the more I started understanding. So also a lot of it could be people listening to others, like how people usually just parrot what they hear on the news without having any in depth understanding of issues.


    Anyway, that’s just how I see it
    Last edited by aster; 05-01-2021 at 07:46 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by one View Post
    It’s not that I don’t like DCNH and Gulenko but I don’t see the point of it or see it in people
    I do think of someone or talk to them and immediately think - This guy is EP, that sounds Fe as fuck, etc etc
    And I guess that’s enough? I know who would be annoying or explain why our conversation is going haywire

    Maybe my small brain can’t understand it, but it’s not like I’m trying tbh. I’m sorry
    ah cool. I don't think my brain works like that. I can just about type people but I don't like/find it hard to think about people in terms of functions. Could get on board with thinking about people as EP/IP etc. DCNH seems like it might suit me more.. I feel like I can spot the types and feels like it might be a more healthier/natural way for me to relate to people.
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    Quote Originally Posted by one View Post

    Maybe my small brain can’t understand it, but it’s not like I’m trying tbh. I’m sorry
    Lol, I mean it's not like I've watched/understood those mad looking Model G videos I've caught a glimpse of
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    Gulenko will mostly appeal to alpha and beta types, especially to creative subtypes. his theories are generalizations of observations that he has made over the years, it's pure Ti + Ne. of course gamma and delta types will have problems with that, just as I would have problems in a Te-centric domain. I'm fine with people not caring about his ideas, but I dislike when people criticize him even though they cleary don't understand him. I wouldn't go to an Se dom and tell him how to fix his car, too.

    I assume that beta likes his reputation, and gamma might be convinced by that, too. probably not as much, though.

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    Think it's a conversation worth having. His website seems like quite a nice place to start for people new to socionics (although I think understanding DCNH you probably need to learn how to type first) but seen as the only other resources are stuff like wikisocion and this site (which is great but overwhelming when you first join) I think it's not a bad thing for people to take a look at Gulenko's site (the language is a bit more modern and inclusive than random old articles on wikisocion I feel).

    I see what people are saying- there are a lot of people quite deep into their socionics studies so they know which theories they like or not and feel a responsibility to defend it almost.

    I suppose he is also bringing socionics to the mainstream, which might worry people a little, as maybe they'll think it get too watered down/ the parts they don't like might get too popular.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bethany View Post
    Why don’t people like Gulenko/ DCNH? I’ve only just started reading stuff on his website. It seems quite accessible/ progressive? Am I imagining it that people on here don’t seem to like him much?
    What i thought gulenko was socionist nr 1 on this forum. Theres litterally a 50 page + thread on typings by him. There isnt any for any other socionist
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    I find his type descriptions to be nonsense, but then again, I can say that about pretty much all type descriptions.
    I haven't read much of him, but so far his function descriptions, DCNH system, and how he explains certain function in certain position, like launcher, I've found rather interesting. Functions and nuances within a function is generaly what I find interesting overall. I'm more interested in having each function in every color of the rainbow than having them being only one color each.
    It's cool imo to have softer Fe and Te lead because H, it put a name to some color I didn't understand.
    I also like the way he describes Si.
    I guess he's bringing his own observations and doesn't seem big on duality, and that might bother some peeps. Even on here peeps argue about those things among each other. I remember an Fe vs Fi as being linked to empathy, it depends which one you value imo.
    Do I like him, well, I don't know him so idk.

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    Well, I will have to look into model G. Not really in a rush to but would like to read the basics. At the moment I feel comfortable basing my knowledge on my own observations/typing of people, reading people's posts on here who I've come to respect, DCNH and tritype from enneagram. Ultimately, you do have to find your own way of 'seeing people' using typology ideas but I suppose it can be helpful to have someone's ideas to follow or help guide your thinking. What I like about DNCH is that it just seemed to click right away for me. After thinking about the types of people for a long time (sociotype and enneagram for 2 years), when it came to reading the DCNH break down and subtype descriptions, it seemed like I had a lot of data in my mind about people which seemed to easily match them up with a DCNH type. Also, I've always felt like socionics could be more simply explained than it is in articles/ by people and that there must be a way to combine enneagram with socionics. Not saying Gulenko uses ennegram but I suppose you could compare DCNH to ennegram as it's kind of a role one falls into.

    DCNH seems a better way to sort people than the quadras because there seems more of a focus on how people can work together rather than a focus on people's differences.
    Last edited by Bethany; 05-02-2021 at 10:09 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Number 9 large View Post
    What i thought gulenko was socionist nr 1 on this forum. Theres litterally a 50 page + thread on typings by him. There isnt any for any other socionist
    I think I just recall people seeming a bit cynical or something. Also, I think he seems nice and his ideas progressive (practical, inclusive, harmonising) and surprised I haven't read this about him I guess.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bethany View Post
    I think I just recall people seeming a bit cynical or something. Also, I think he seems nice and his ideas progressive (practical, inclusive, harmonising) and surprised I haven't read this about him I guess.
    Yea thats probably for good reason. Also some ppl worship him like a god so that automatically puts other people into the skeptic category to balance it out
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    I like Gulenko, but he is a human and capable of making mistakes, his method is not bullet proof. Noone has to believe in someone or agree to someone in every way to like them.

    I think he is a good socionist, if I am going to get typed, it is going to be him, but I am not going to believe in the results with my eyes closed.

    About DCHN, I think it explains some differences, but to me it seems like an another system feeding a little bit of socionics. It is not linked properly to any model of socionics, there are not enough info that explains how DCHN affects one's psyche like how other IEs get affected from this etc, there are only type descriptions which are not enough.

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    He deflects criticism by retyping his critics into sociotypes that don't value progress. For that reason, his school resembles a cult and, IMO, he gives off a Charles Manson vibe. Other than that, he seems personally amiable and I like him.
    Last edited by xerx; 05-01-2021 at 09:46 PM.

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    Model G is new-ish. DCNH is pretty old but its been updated. He's gone through many others before. Cognitive styles, +\- signs, etc. The thing with Gulenko is he changes every 5-10 years, like any good researcher should. But it seems like a handful of people are taking everything he puts out as gospel set in stone, which is probably going to cause some painful reorienting for them at some point. I wonder how Gulenko will handle it when he wants to pivot again, whether he will feel bound and boxed in by his paid body of work.

    There's a difference between disagreeing with him, disliking him as a person, and disliking the people around him.

    From reading back through posts a couple months back, it appears some of the people namedropping him had become a bit insufferable from the association.

    From what I've seen, the people who dislike him either have a problem with the money, or are reactive against his rise as an "authority" and the use of his assessment as a trump card to end discussion.

    The people who are skeptical tend to have their own Ti or Te method, or just disagree with certain typings.

    He's human. Nobody is going have a 100% perfect record on anything. Doesn't mean its about disliking Gulenko. To his credit, he did cut through a couple very complicated typings who were -I won't say misrepresenting themselves to the forum - but admitted they were different in the Gulenko interview and realized later they had been living out a persona due to bad living situations or whatever.

    Its not about his rep its about what he did to earn it, and what he is doing to keep his skills. He did years with Ausra, he did years with other researchers having his work critiqued. Most importantly, he did years running group observations to confirm ITR and typings. His background isn't just pure Ti/Ne archetypes based off random life encounters and typing people on youtube from home. Look at his body of work. He has thousands of interactions, over a long enough period of time to confirm type and ITR. You are able to informally confirm his theories for yourself in your life & ITR, or you are not. That is what matters, not word of mouth. What changed is he now he is in a bit of a closed bubble. He is surrounded by people who paid for a class or paid him to type them. People don't really question gurus as critically as researchers question fellow researchers. Who will tell him if he starts slipping?

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    Hm yeah. But socionics does have flaws/gaps and does need to be modernised if it's going to be more widely accepted. There's something about socionics that has often given me a queasy feeling, like there is something oppressive about it- like it was designed to divide and dictate to people. Gulenko, not saying he's a God, but he might improve it's image a bit lol.

    sorry meant to post this earlier in the thread
    Last edited by Bethany; 05-01-2021 at 09:42 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bethany View Post
    There's something about socionics that has often given me a queasy feeling, like there is something oppressive about it- like it was designed to divide and dictate to people.
    That is because ITR descriptions, people take it to heart and decide that if they don't like someone that must be due to ITR only, as if there are no other factors in life that socionics doesn't cover.

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    Quote Originally Posted by myresearch View Post
    That is because ITR descriptions, people take it to heart and decide that if they don't like someone that must be due to ITR only, as if there are no other factors in life that socionics doesn't cover.
    yea its easy to fall into confirmation bias. the ITR are really more for actual relations, as in friendships and romantic relationships. even then there are confounding variables ofc
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    Quote Originally Posted by Number 9 large View Post
    yea its easy to fall into confirmation bias. the ITR are really more for actual relations, as in friendships and romantic relationships. even then there are confounding variables ofc
    I think socionics is a valid theory, hence partially agree to how relationships play out in socionics sense. However, anyone can like someone of X type and dislike someone with the same type. For example, I can like one spesific conflictor more than one spesific dual due to other variables that socionics didnt take into account like mental health etc.

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    Quote Originally Posted by xerxe View Post
    He deflects criticism by retyping his critics into sociotypes that don't value progress. For that reason, his school resembles a cult and, IMO, he gives off a Charles Manson vibe. Other than that, he seems personally amiable and I like him.
    classic battle typing
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    Quote Originally Posted by Number 9 large View Post
    Yea thats probably for good reason. Also some ppl worship him like a god so that automatically puts other people into the skeptic category to balance it out
    a realistic and not overwrought intellectualized answer from an SLE. my dual, according to some. bless u

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    Quote Originally Posted by xerxe View Post
    He deflects criticism by retyping his critics into sociotypes that don't value progress. For that reason, his school resembles a cult and, IMO, he gives off a Charles Manson vibe. Other than that, he seems personally amiable and I like him.
    Ni HA luvs this theory. bless u too

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    Quote Originally Posted by xerxe View Post
    his school resembles a cult and, IMO, he gives off a Charles Manson vibe. Other than that, he seems personally amiable and I like him.
    omg I just died lol

    don’t forget, it’s his wife that’s the EIE. I have my own conspiracy theory going with that
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    Meh. Gulenko's theory just relates closer to what really drives conflict. Aggression. The more energy, the more aggression, the less energy, the less aggression. I have little to no problems with it.

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    i like gulenko's theories, i just don't put a halo over them or believe in the One True Socionist. but generally dcnh is pretty central to how i think about socionics these days.

    also i wouldn't be surprised if most socionists battle type one another...

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    I think many people like him but they just not agree with his theories.

    For me I actually started with his website. I think model G is isomorphic to model A but it provides a new perspective. But the most essential literature are those written by Jung and Aushra.

    For subtypes, personally I'm not very interested in it. I think one should definitely tries to understand the 16 types at first, which is already a huge task. I agree that each type could have several subtypes. However, without understanding the 16 fundamental types, it quite possible that the use of subtypes are essentially used for a correction of mistyping. I'm not saying that Gulenko is doing so, but it might be very common among amateurs.

    For instance, a lot of ILEs are socially awkward. Due to a misunderstanding of introtim-extratim, they might be typed as LIIs. So one might argue that s/he is a certain subtype of LII without finding the truth that s/he is ILE instead.
    Last edited by CR400AF; 05-02-2021 at 05:37 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by aster View Post
    omg I just died lol

    don’t forget, it’s his wife that’s the EIE. I have my own conspiracy theory going with that
    His approach is to type most celebrities as EIE because this type seeks the spotlight (he falls back on DCNH to differentiate between them). I think he takes it too far, but what do I know — he's getting rich off this stuff and I'm not, which means that he must be doing something right.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bethany View Post
    ah cool. I don't think my brain works like that. I can just about type people but I don't like/find it hard to think about people in terms of functions. Could get on board with thinking about people as EP/IP etc. DCNH seems like it might suit me more.. I feel like I can spot the types and feels like it might be a more healthier/natural way for me to relate to people.
    I notice temperaments a lot at work. For compatibility, it's something that I've paid attention to a lot (even over knowing my own type) bec I can easily notice people who I should be okay with in terms of their personality etc but there's just a disconnect and irrational annoyance.
    To be fair I noticed some people who could be Harmonizing, but I have always seen the traits on xEIs so I'm not that open to the idea yet.
    R

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    By the way, his popularity got a boost in the West because of me. I was the one who translated his infamous Cognitive Styles article. I was also the one who popularized DCNH. I did all that, yet he gets all the credit for cooking his own meth.
    Last edited by xerx; 05-02-2021 at 06:39 PM. Reason: typo

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    Quote Originally Posted by xerxe View Post
    By the way, his popularity got a boost in the West because of me. I was the one who translated his infamous Cognitive Styles article. I was also the one who popularized DCNH. I did all that, yet he's the one who gets all the credit for cooking the better meth.
    Mirror is the cruelest meth.

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    I assume that beta likes his reputation, and gamma might be convinced by that, too. probably not as much, though.
    He doesn't have that much good reputation to me personally, I don't like his methods and the way of presenting the service mostly. I thought he could have done more promoting too and should make himself a personality. I do like the method of sharing a vid two times in separate days though. I also don't have an issue with his system with regards to this.
    R

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    Quote Originally Posted by myresearch View Post
    That is because ITR descriptions, people take it to heart and decide that if they don't like someone that must be due to ITR only, as if there are no other factors in life that socionics doesn't cover.
    yes..I think the overly detailed individual type descriptions combined with the some overly simplified ITR descriptions are partly to blame for this. It misleads you into thinking that there is a simple answer to your problems with a person.

    Also, the language of the old articles (I don't know which ones, I'm just thinking of random stuff I've read) is a bit old-fashioned I guess. The tone feels a bit patronising, maybe it is a just a product of its era. Also, the tone is not academic. Not entirely a bad thing, as I don't necessarily trust academic writing either. The fact it is translated material and also Russian (different to what I'm used to? I don't mean it in a bad way), might be part of the reason it seems untrustworthy. Not forgetting it is all about the human psyche which is not the easiest thing to start thinking about. Essentially, you have to get comfortable with it, which takes time. Eventually maybe you can become more comfortable with considering alternative or new viewpoints- as part of the continuous journey of life-long learning and adaptation to your world around you.
    Don't judge each day by the harvest you reap but by the seeds that you plant.

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    I think the opinion I hear echoed on this website in particular is that he types too many people as betas through his own typing service. There are explanations as to why this is, and while I understand the skepticism and think it's valid, it doesn't mean that his typing service is bunk or a scam (or at least that it intends to be, which is something I hear on this forum sometimes).

    I'm not gonna go out and deny that many of the people he typed as betas (Penny, Vex, North, Peteronfiree, Shotgun, Viktor...)* already were usually considered staples of that quadra on this forum. Others such as myself, Aster, Ash, TGF, Duschia who either doubt their typing or have others doubt the typing (or both) are considered less "obvious" examples of beta. And I haven't heard complaints of those who he typed as something non-beta.

    The point is that it's likely Gulenko's typings have a beta slant, though personally I always thought betas were the most common and deltas rare, with gammas and alphas being fairly common too.


    Other than the beta thing, Gulenko's ideas are fairly new and may appear strange to some people. This is typical when someone has an unconventional idea in a field with well-established prejudices (for example the idea that types are evenly represented among the general population).

    *Shotgun wasn't considered beta before
    Last edited by Uncle Ave; 05-02-2021 at 12:02 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by xerxe View Post
    His approach is to type most celebrities as EIE because this type seeks the spotlight (he falls back on DCNH to differentiate between them). I think he takes it too far, but what do I know — he's getting rich off this stuff and I'm not, which means that he must be doing something right.
    Looking through celebrity examples on his website, I wouldn't say he types most of them as EIE. EIE, LSI, SLE, IEI, LIE, ILI and SEE are the most common, and peripheral quadras are almost non existant.

    I personally agree that central quadras are more likely to be motivated to become a celebrity (or at least influencial in society) but I think he and Timur take this too far, surely alphas and deltas are motivated by other things than being an anonymous corn farmer on the outskirts of society.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uncle Ave View Post
    I think the opinion I hear echoed on this website in particular is that he types too many people as betas through his own typing service. There are explanations as to why this is, and while I understand the skepticism and think it's valid, it doesn't mean that his typing service is bunk or a scam (or at least that it intends to be, which is something I hear on this forum sometimes).

    I'm not gonna go out and deny that many of the people he typed as betas (Penny, Vex, North, Peteronfiree, Shotgun, Viktor...) already were usually considered staples of that quadra on this forum. Others such as myself, Aster, Ash, TGF, Duschia who either doubt their typing or have others doubt the typing (or both) are considered less "obvious" examples of beta. And I haven't heard complaints of those who he typed as something non-beta.

    The point is that it's likely Gulenko's typings have a beta slant, though personally I always thought betas were the most common and deltas rare, with gammas and alphas being fairly common too.

    Other than the beta thing, Gulenko's ideas are fairly new and may appear strange to some people. This is typical when someone has an unconventional idea in a field with well-established prejudices (for example the idea that types are evenly represented among the general population).
    Pretty much this. To be honest, I am pretty neutral towards G and his work. I just don't like the whole "if G says so, it has to be. He's the expert so he knows better than you" mentality. When one takes someone as the ultimate authority figure on anything, not just personality theory, it can lead to unintentionally harmful consequences. I wouldn't be surprised if the most vocal opponents have had histories of being fucked over and gaslighted by trusted authority figures (parents, doctors, psychologists, teachers, religious leaders)...just because they "know better" or "know more". Those people know firsthand what the potential downfalls can be and are resistant to psychological pressure to conform and become skeptics.

    Also, talking in generalities here, most people just don't like to be told in absolute, definitive terms that they are "this" or "that" more so than chalking it up to self-delusion or jealousy. It's all just basic human nature shit. How people react to G gives insight into people's relationship with authority figures in general, I would speculate. Some are very anti-authority, others are desperate for answers from someone or something, but most are in between.
    Last edited by EIE; 05-02-2021 at 03:08 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by myresearch View Post
    I like Gulenko, but he is a human and capable of making mistakes, his method is not bullet proof.
    He is actually a space lizard with impenetrable skin brought to you by genius malignant EIE who knows all the truths in the universe.
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    I kinda just like the idea of a simple DNCH typing because it means I can use my own non-type part of my personality to relate to the other person’s non type part of their personality. My knowledge of sociotypes and model A helps me to know there are limits to relationship dynamics and communication but my knowledge of DCNH helps me to not see the type and see this more individual DCNH energy about the person. A mix of trusting my own self-hood (my instincts and desires) but with acceptance of limits. (This could be applied to relationship dynamics or thinking about my own self.)

    I also like the idea of noticing similarities across the types, this seems like a natural way to develop wisdom about human nature.
    Don't judge each day by the harvest you reap but by the seeds that you plant.

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