Results 1 to 10 of 10

Thread: The Reason for Almost All Mental Illnesses - Prof. Jordan Peterson

  1. #1
    Serious Left-Static Negativist Eliza Thomason's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    eastern U.S.
    TIM
    ENFp, IEE
    Posts
    3,193
    Mentioned
    315 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default The Reason for Almost All Mental Illnesses - Prof. Jordan Peterson

    In 2 min., 34 sec.!

    "A man with a definite belief always appears bizarre, because he does not change with the world; he has climbed into a fixed star, and the earth whizzes below him like a zoetrope."
    ........ G. ........... K. ............... C ........ H ........ E ...... S ........ T ...... E ........ R ........ T ........ O ........ N ........


    "Having a clear faith, based on the creed of the Church, is often labeled today as fundamentalism... Whereas relativism, which is letting oneself be tossed and swept along
    by every wind of teaching, looks like the only
    attitude acceptable to today's standards."
    - Pope Benedict the XVI, "The Dictatorship of Relativism"

    .
    .
    .


  2. #2
    Serious Left-Static Negativist Eliza Thomason's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    eastern U.S.
    TIM
    ENFp, IEE
    Posts
    3,193
    Mentioned
    315 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Jordan Peterson on Depression

    Here is a longer discussion, on that common issue of our time [49 min., 45 sec.]

    "A man with a definite belief always appears bizarre, because he does not change with the world; he has climbed into a fixed star, and the earth whizzes below him like a zoetrope."
    ........ G. ........... K. ............... C ........ H ........ E ...... S ........ T ...... E ........ R ........ T ........ O ........ N ........


    "Having a clear faith, based on the creed of the Church, is often labeled today as fundamentalism... Whereas relativism, which is letting oneself be tossed and swept along
    by every wind of teaching, looks like the only
    attitude acceptable to today's standards."
    - Pope Benedict the XVI, "The Dictatorship of Relativism"

    .
    .
    .


  3. #3
    Serious Left-Static Negativist Eliza Thomason's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    eastern U.S.
    TIM
    ENFp, IEE
    Posts
    3,193
    Mentioned
    315 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Peterson on Borderline personality Disorder

    Wow. This is so informative. For me it's necessary information at this time for a current career turn. But also, someone we love deals with this. What understanding here, in 7 min. And it is sobering. So sobering.

    After viewing this I believe now our only hope for this loved one is a miracle. I now realize it needs to be a huge supernatural miracle. (I have harbored hope she would "wake up" and do the right thing, as her strong intelligence and excellent sensitivity should kick in and dictate. But that statistical "ZERO correlation' which Peterson speaks of here informs me otherwise. And that is confirmed with the age 2-4 lack of socialization correlated with the development of this disorder. This loved one's mom was a wandering dysfunctional addict in her 2nd to 4th years, and I see her beautiful self and have always believed something BAD happened to her in those years - though Mom denies it, though how could she know?

    I am grateful for this dose of reality here though. If anyone knows or has lived with a borderline, I would be interested in knowing of your experience. Peterson says it is very frustrating to know, love, deal with one closely. I have seen the frustration in this loved one's guardian, and for me the jury has always been out whether the guardian had issues that caused the issues the BPD has, but after this explanation by Peterson, I am ready to judge that it is most likely that the frustration I kept seeing in the guardian was simply the natural expected frustration that Peterson mentions here.

    "A man with a definite belief always appears bizarre, because he does not change with the world; he has climbed into a fixed star, and the earth whizzes below him like a zoetrope."
    ........ G. ........... K. ............... C ........ H ........ E ...... S ........ T ...... E ........ R ........ T ........ O ........ N ........


    "Having a clear faith, based on the creed of the Church, is often labeled today as fundamentalism... Whereas relativism, which is letting oneself be tossed and swept along
    by every wind of teaching, looks like the only
    attitude acceptable to today's standards."
    - Pope Benedict the XVI, "The Dictatorship of Relativism"

    .
    .
    .


  4. #4
    asd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2020
    TIM
    EII-C 4w5 sx/so
    Posts
    606
    Mentioned
    32 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Eliza Thomason View Post
    Wow. This is so informative. For me it's necessary information at this time for a current career turn. But also, someone we love deals with this. What understanding here, in 7 min. And it is sobering. So sobering.

    After viewing this I believe now our only hope for this loved one is a miracle. I now realize it needs to be a huge supernatural miracle. (I have harbored hope she would "wake up" and do the right thing, as her strong intelligence and excellent sensitivity should kick in and dictate. But that statistical "ZERO correlation' which Peterson speaks of here informs me otherwise. And that is confirmed with the age 2-4 lack of socialization correlated with the development of this disorder. This loved one's mom was a wandering dysfunctional addict in her 2nd to 4th years, and I see her beautiful self and have always believed something BAD happened to her in those years - though Mom denies it, though how could she know?

    I am grateful for this dose of reality here though. If anyone knows or has lived with a borderline, I would be interested in knowing of your experience. Peterson says it is very frustrating to know, love, deal with one closely. I have seen the frustration in this loved one's guardian, and for me the jury has always been out whether the guardian had issues that caused the issues the BPD has, but after this explanation by Peterson, I am ready to judge that it is most likely that the frustration I kept seeing in the guardian was simply the natural expected frustration that Peterson mentions here.

    they don’t truly have zero degree of empathy, at least not as a group. On an individual level it may vary.

    for bpd, the sources I would suggest most are Marsha Linehan and Peter Fonagy. Shari Manning has a book on skills that can help you with a loved one with BPD.

    from experts (decades of research/clinical work/ literally came up with the diagnosis of BPD - some of them) - on stigma and BPD.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Atbc...AR93XU0emmdL11

    I misread at first - he is talking about them not being able to implement actions. Marsha Linehan has already created a therapeutic modality to target precisely this and it's Dialectical Behavioral Therapy.

    Also I do not believe it is the "female variant of anti-social personality disorder."
    Last edited by asd; 03-12-2021 at 05:49 PM.


  5. #5
    Serious Left-Static Negativist Eliza Thomason's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    eastern U.S.
    TIM
    ENFp, IEE
    Posts
    3,193
    Mentioned
    315 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Peterson on Agoraphobia

    I edited the title of this because I watched the video and it's about agoraphobia, not PTSD.

    [14 min., 13 sec.] I have get outside and do something in this weather, so I will listen to this 15 min. video later. But I can't wait to see what Peterson has to say about this. It is a topic I have done MUCH study into, and it is a topic dear to my heart, although i do not have any close family members who suffered this. But I had a close friend suffering the deepest form of this (she was highly intelligent and highly functional so it was possible to hide this), and I learned so much, and I have experience with a ministry with a while different take on this, from the spiritual angle, that through prayer heals this disorder completely, at a very high rate of success in CURING it for good, by the power of God, in contrast to the typical psychological treatments, which are expensive and extensive, and DON'T cure it, but have a rate of helping one cope with it at about 10-15% max. Which si not much with such a deep issue!

    But I believe in miracles. I also have a heart for those who grew up in these anti-God times, which influences them to be unable or unwilling to believe in God. But God will act, and help those. The prophets are all saying that we are coming into a time of great miracles, like NO OTHER time in human history, and they say in this soon coming time in our generation there will be many, many healings - physical and mental - of impossible cases. I believe it!

    Here's Peterson's expertise:

    Last edited by Eliza Thomason; 03-13-2021 at 04:06 AM.
    "A man with a definite belief always appears bizarre, because he does not change with the world; he has climbed into a fixed star, and the earth whizzes below him like a zoetrope."
    ........ G. ........... K. ............... C ........ H ........ E ...... S ........ T ...... E ........ R ........ T ........ O ........ N ........


    "Having a clear faith, based on the creed of the Church, is often labeled today as fundamentalism... Whereas relativism, which is letting oneself be tossed and swept along
    by every wind of teaching, looks like the only
    attitude acceptable to today's standards."
    - Pope Benedict the XVI, "The Dictatorship of Relativism"

    .
    .
    .


  6. #6
    Serious Left-Static Negativist Eliza Thomason's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    eastern U.S.
    TIM
    ENFp, IEE
    Posts
    3,193
    Mentioned
    315 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by asd View Post
    they don’t truly have zero degree of empathy, at least not as a group. On an individual level it may vary.

    for bpd, the sources I would suggest most are Marsha Linehan and Peter Fonagy. Shari Manning has a book on skills that can help you with a loved one with BPD.

    from experts (decades of research/clinical work/ literally came up with the diagnosis of BPD - some of them) - on stigma and BPD.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Atbc...AR93XU0emmdL11
    Thank you, I will look into this.

    He did not say zero degree on empathy though. Not at all. He did not discuss empathy. He says they are quite capable of thinking though solutions, but incapable of implementing any solutions. Perfect description of what I have seen with our loved one.

    What Peterson says is "zero" is the correlation between IQ and conscientiousness. Conscientiousness he defines here as planning, strategizing and implementation.* With BPD is there is a complete disconnect, or zero correlation, between their intelligence and that type of conscientiousness. Wow, that summarizes what we have seen with this very intelligent love one. This wound, this divide, this zero correlation which marks BPD, comes abut because of incomplete socialization between the ages of 2 and 4.

    Our loved one, a SEI, has a particularly sensitive empathy that I admire. It is the thing about her that had made me question the BPD diagnosis. But while she has excellent intelligence and empathy, she makes the stupidest life decisions. Like she has been homeless for months now, by choice, completely believing in this latest guy who is now the center of her entire life, in the long lineup of guys who were her entire world from the moment she met them. A drug dealer no one likes. But until she flips from idolizing to denigrating him, she is going to be all about him.

    She doesn't have experience growing up with abusers, and I am always praying that the latest guy isn't one of those. So far, it seems she has been spared.

    What got you interested in the topic of BPD?

    (I previously ignored study of this topic specifically because of her. I did not like the "label" she received and wanted to believe in her potentiality due to her good qualities. But I think Peterson has me seeing the reality here).

    _____________
    *"And so is the correlation between working memory and contentiousness. ZERO!"
    "A man with a definite belief always appears bizarre, because he does not change with the world; he has climbed into a fixed star, and the earth whizzes below him like a zoetrope."
    ........ G. ........... K. ............... C ........ H ........ E ...... S ........ T ...... E ........ R ........ T ........ O ........ N ........


    "Having a clear faith, based on the creed of the Church, is often labeled today as fundamentalism... Whereas relativism, which is letting oneself be tossed and swept along
    by every wind of teaching, looks like the only
    attitude acceptable to today's standards."
    - Pope Benedict the XVI, "The Dictatorship of Relativism"

    .
    .
    .


  7. #7
    asd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2020
    TIM
    EII-C 4w5 sx/so
    Posts
    606
    Mentioned
    32 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Eliza Thomason View Post
    Thank you, I will look into this.

    He did not say zero degree on empathy though. Not at all. He did not discuss empathy. He says they are quite capable of thinking though solutions, but incapable of implementing any solutions. Perfect description of what I have seen with our loved one.

    What Peterson says is "zero" is the correlation between IQ and conscientiousness. Conscientiousness he defines here as planning, strategizing and implementation.* With BPD is there is a complete disconnect, or zero correlation, between their intelligence and that type of conscientiousness. Wow, that summarizes what we have seen with this very intelligent love one. This wound, this divide, this zero correlation which marks BPD, comes abut because of incomplete socialization between the ages of 2 and 4.

    Our loved one, a SEI, has a particularly sensitive empathy that I admire. It is the thing about her that had made me question the BPD diagnosis. But while she has excellent intelligence and empathy, she makes the stupidest life decisions. Like she has been homeless for months now, by choice, completely believing in this latest guy who is now the center of her entire life, in the long lineup of guys who were her entire world from the moment she met them. A drug dealer no one likes. But until she flips from idolizing to denigrating him, she is going to be all about him.

    She doesn't have experience growing up with abusers, and I am always praying that the latest guy isn't one of those. So far, it seems she has been spared.

    What got you interested in the topic of BPD?

    (I previously ignored study of this topic specifically because of her. I did not like the "label" she received and wanted to believe in her potentiality due to her good qualities. But I think Peterson has me seeing the reality here).

    _____________
    *"And so is the correlation between working memory and contentiousness. ZERO!"
    right I mixed up some other video/source with this one, i had edited my post

    you might be interested in CBT for BPD - first 3 chapters. It's highly theoretical but it will give you imho an accurate glimpse into the mind of someone with the disorder.

    as for my interest, i have been looking into it and want to do research and clinical work with the population
    Last edited by asd; 03-12-2021 at 06:20 PM.


  8. #8
    Serious Left-Static Negativist Eliza Thomason's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    eastern U.S.
    TIM
    ENFp, IEE
    Posts
    3,193
    Mentioned
    315 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by asd View Post
    right I mixed up some other video/source with this one, i had edited my post

    you might be interested in CBT for BPD - first 3 chapters. It's highly theoretical but it will give you imho an accurate glimpse into the mind of someone with the disorder.

    as for my interest, i have been looking into it and want to do research and clinical work with the population
    Interesting. CBT seems a good therapy in general, I have noticed before when looking into it. I will be working with a team of highly experienced experts in BPD but I am not professionally trained in this. But I will be voraciously learning a lot on my own so I can be more conversant.

    (My close EII friend was doing her training for nursing and was told she would be excellent in the field of working with mental health. And she liked it, but was a bit wary that her small stature could be an issue in the mental health wing with anti-socials, i.e.)
    "A man with a definite belief always appears bizarre, because he does not change with the world; he has climbed into a fixed star, and the earth whizzes below him like a zoetrope."
    ........ G. ........... K. ............... C ........ H ........ E ...... S ........ T ...... E ........ R ........ T ........ O ........ N ........


    "Having a clear faith, based on the creed of the Church, is often labeled today as fundamentalism... Whereas relativism, which is letting oneself be tossed and swept along
    by every wind of teaching, looks like the only
    attitude acceptable to today's standards."
    - Pope Benedict the XVI, "The Dictatorship of Relativism"

    .
    .
    .


  9. #9
    asd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2020
    TIM
    EII-C 4w5 sx/so
    Posts
    606
    Mentioned
    32 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Eliza Thomason View Post
    Interesting. CBT seems a good therapy in general, I have noticed before when looking into it. I will be working with a team of highly experienced experts in BPD but I am not professionally trained in this. But I will be voraciously learning a lot on my own so I can be more conversant.

    (My close EII friend was doing her training for nursing and was told she would be excellent in the field of working with mental health. And she liked it, but was a bit wary that her small stature could be an issue in the mental health wing with anti-socials, i.e.)
    working on...?


  10. #10
    Serious Left-Static Negativist Eliza Thomason's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    eastern U.S.
    TIM
    ENFp, IEE
    Posts
    3,193
    Mentioned
    315 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by asd View Post
    working on...?
    As an educator (not a therapist) in a very special setting. I'll tell you more in a PM.
    "A man with a definite belief always appears bizarre, because he does not change with the world; he has climbed into a fixed star, and the earth whizzes below him like a zoetrope."
    ........ G. ........... K. ............... C ........ H ........ E ...... S ........ T ...... E ........ R ........ T ........ O ........ N ........


    "Having a clear faith, based on the creed of the Church, is often labeled today as fundamentalism... Whereas relativism, which is letting oneself be tossed and swept along
    by every wind of teaching, looks like the only
    attitude acceptable to today's standards."
    - Pope Benedict the XVI, "The Dictatorship of Relativism"

    .
    .
    .


Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •