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Thread: Do ESFps have ANY redeeming qualities?!

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    Default Do ESFps have ANY redeeming qualities?!

    I am fed up with the duals in my life. I'm beginning to wonder whether duality is all it's cracked up to be because my ESFps seem to cause more headaches than they are worth. I have a dual parent, a dual friend, and a dual love interest and they are all looking like lost causes to me. I have had to deploy a ridiculous amount of forgiveness to tolerate them. No matter how much true love I display, it is never returned.

    My ESFp parent:
    -Abused me physically for the smallest things growing up
    -Could not tell when being manipulated by others and allowed those manipulations to lead to the abuse of others, especially me
    -I never truly felt loved by this parent unless something was up. I was supported financially, but it is routinely thrown in my face
    -Married to a mirage, miserable, perpetual cheater, and appears selfless to others but those closer to the circle witness the truth selfishness of their actions
    -Cares a lot about appearances, but underneath it all is an awful rolemodel
    -Never reaches out to me first but complains to others that I don't try hard enough to mend our relationship (because as the child that's obviously my job)

    My ESFp friend:
    -Great for partying or adventures, but has mood swings and becomes very emotionally manipulative
    ex: If I'm dating a guy and I'm happy but she isn't, she will try to manipulate my thoughts about the guy
    -Doesn't listen to sound advice, but when shit hits the fan, expects me to suffer with her
    -Nowhere to be found when I'm depressed or have mood swings of my own
    -Allows other friends of questionable morale to come between us
    -Uses everyone, has 0 interest in someone who doesn't apparently have something she can use (money or fame)
    -Won't tell anyone how she feels but expects them to "know", (My Fe polr won't tolerate this at all)
    -Randomly chooses to ignore me, abandon me, and give me the cold shoulder and is appalled when I don't run back to her
    -Will reject people's help if she didn't lie, swindle, or seduce them to get her way
    -Will be jealous of people who work for what they have, unlike her
    -Admittedly hates seeing people happy if she is not
    -The entire friendship gives me the feeling that she wishes I were a lesbian and in love with her, that way she could seduce me and take advantage of me
    -Will pretend she has no money so I'll pay for her
    -When I buy her food or something she needs, she never shows appreciation. She might say thank you once, but quickly makes a habit of becoming entitled to the good treatment. Continues to complain that no one cares about her.
    -I never know where I stand with her and am constantly walking on eggshells to keep her happy
    -Gives the impression that she could care less about our friendship even though it's obvious I am quite literally the only genuine friend she has.
    -Will run off when I try to stand up against her mistreatment then shit-talk me and tell a twisted version of what happened to whoever is willing to listen, one time she painted me as an awful person on social media.

    We are currently on an OFF stage and I've decided to let her go. She is in bad financial shape and deeply in need of someone and I've decided to leave her to the wolves. Why should I, the better friend (not to mention, the Victim), have to chase her?

    My ESFp love (interest?): I'll start this off by saying it has been extremely hard to find a straight, male ESFp. I'm starting to wonder if they even exist...
    -No solid career, no stable income and no concrete plan to have either
    -Easily spends what money he does have on useless things
    -Easily swindled into get rich quick schemes
    -No desire to "be a man" and work or take care of a woman
    -I once told him I was in a bad situation, he showed no concern ("Gotta go, you're being too negative")
    -Is taken care of by and living with his mother
    -Hypersexual Tinder addict whose admittedly slept with close to 200 girls
    -Keeps mentioning transwomen and gay men, being "mistaken" for gay, to the point of suspicion
    -Hard for me to tell when his compliments or anything he says is sincere, because...
    -He is constantly lying about even the smallest things, just for me to catch him in his lies because he never remembers them once they leave his mouth
    -Is also attracted to people with money and fame, leading me to wonder if I will be used for these things or left for someone with more of it
    -Tells me he likes me, has fun with me, but never texts me first or makes plans with me

    With duals, it's like I'm constantly trying to force them to see the value in me and in our pairing, no matter how much they are benefitting from it.
    The things they value are things I have but refuse to be used for like money. I instead would like to help them make money using their talents and dissuade them from making bad decisions or hanging around the wrong crowd. I do all this expecting nothing in return. And yet, they tend to hurt me more than any other type I have relationships with. And though we have good times together, I end up feeling like I get nothing out of the pairing. They have proven themselves to be selfish, self-serving, and willing to do anything with anyone to meet their needs.
    They don't seem to stand on any moral principles, can't tell which friends or love interests are worth their time and effort, and are constantly using me as an emotional punching bag if not just stringing me along. It has caused more damage to my trust and self esteem than growth in my opinion. I almost wish I was a different type so I wouldn't have such an awful dual type. No matter how much help you give them, they are a bottomless pit and will have you feeling like you put time and effort in for nothing. Then they happily move on to someone who treats them worse but is more loved and appreciated by them than you were.

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    Wait, you say you’re dating Donald Trump?

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    Do massive textwall posts have any redeeming qualities?

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    In my experience ESFp are the best type at giving love. That's basically a main attribute.

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    this all sounds really bad, I have cut people out of my life for much less. Set boundaries and get rid of these ppl, if they won't leave, you leave...if they follow.. get a restraining order.



    ...wtf is wrong with this quadra holy fuck!?
    LSI-H - - Melancholy|Sanguine - 6w5-4-8 Sp/Sx - MBTI IST
    Oldham's Vigilant Type

    “The meeting of two personalities is like the contact of two chemical substances: if there is any reaction, both are transformed.”
    ― Carl Gustav Jung ―


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    They really know how to party and have sex..... like, a lot of sex.

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    Yes!! I have manipulated everyone into liking me so I can have sex with them and steal their money! My white knights, defend me now!

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    Quote Originally Posted by voider View Post
    Yes!! I have manipulated everyone into liking me so I can have sex with them and steal their money! My white knights, defend me now!
    I actually don’t need a lot of manipulation for that. What are you doing Friday night?


    .................................................. .................................................. ........................... I’m joking, in case there is any doubt.

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    SEEs are the best at enjoying their lives and not making useless complaining textwalls

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    To answer the OP’s question, I think that ESFp’s can be extremely good salespeople.

    Three of the four ESFp’s that I personally know IRL are salespeople. The fourth was also in sales when I met her, but I don’t know what she’s doing now.

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    Quote Originally Posted by shotgunfingers View Post

    ...wtf is wrong with this quadra holy fuck!?
    OP doesn't seem to be of this quadra tho

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    Yes they have a few when some are not trying to cheat on your so lol
    They can have a lot of energy and get things done
    Be a good friend
    Help cheer you up
    Keep memories
    Help you dress nice
    Smart and thoughtful
    Help you do homework
    Help you walk it off
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 2w1sw(1w9) helps others to live up to their own standards of what a good person is and is very behind the scenes in the process.
    Tritype 1-2-6 stacking sp/sx


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

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    Humanist Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    It’s easy to feel bitter when you feel let down
    I hope my own story of love and patience proves that it’s out there for you if you too remain hopeful
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 2w1sw(1w9) helps others to live up to their own standards of what a good person is and is very behind the scenes in the process.
    Tritype 1-2-6 stacking sp/sx


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    I actually don’t need a lot of manipulation for that. What are you doing Friday night?


    .................................................. .................................................. ........................... I’m joking, in case there is any doubt.




    (I know you are joking, but the 'second number' seems to be staying at zero anyways)

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    Quote Originally Posted by voider View Post
    OP doesn't seem to be of this quadra tho
    That's actually likely. OP, few things:
    a) have you considered another type for yourself?
    b) have you considered another type (or types) for them?
    c) most importantly, have you considered cutting them off (or even limiting contact with them) for being really problematic to you? Why you didn't? Boundaries, pal!

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    Humanist Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Duschia View Post
    That's actually likely. OP, few things:
    a) have you considered another type for yourself?
    b) have you considered another type (or types) for them?
    c) most importantly, have you considered cutting them off (or even limiting contact with them) for being really problematic to you? Why you didn't? Boundaries, pal!
    OP seems ILI to me because he(?) seems very organized and methodical and Ni
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 2w1sw(1w9) helps others to live up to their own standards of what a good person is and is very behind the scenes in the process.
    Tritype 1-2-6 stacking sp/sx


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

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    Humanist Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    My ESFP dad never said “I love you “ or showed love either. He was very cold while I was very warm. It’s an attribute of some ESFP to be physically distant but they show love in cooking for you and maybe providing financially lol
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 2w1sw(1w9) helps others to live up to their own standards of what a good person is and is very behind the scenes in the process.
    Tritype 1-2-6 stacking sp/sx


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

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    When life is shit, they help to bring back the fun and positivity. This may seem shallow at first, but being reminded of the lighter side of life decreases overall stress and increases health and longevity.

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    If I associated abuse with a certain schema (personality type in this case - "typism" or not, it doesn't matter, the brain forms connections) and my first experience of x type was an abusive caregiver I would be similarly hesitant to trust this type (if I've never had any positive experiences with them); it can also be notoriously difficult for 1D functions, both suggestive and polr to respond to norms. They can get "stuck." It's not as if you can help how you feel on a visceral level (unsafe) (besides through therapy perhaps) anyways so the best you can do is just rationally keep yourself open to genuinely liking another ESFP but more importantly, you should surround yourself with people that you like and that makes you feel better I think. Even if they are not your duals, they might still be very rewarding relationships.

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    Sleeping with someone who's slept with 200 ppl is risky. condoms
    ENTj-Ni sx/so

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    To answer the OP’s question, I think that ESFp’s can be extremely good salespeople.

    Three of the four ESFp’s that I personally know IRL are salespeople. The fourth was also in sales when I met her, but I don’t know what she’s doing now.
    One of my ESFp friends used to be a car salesman. He's a supervisor at a warehouse now. He also used to be a bartender.
    If you got a problem with me call 1800-who-cares

    If it ain't money in your pocket, don't worry about it

    Aiiiiight, who tryna argue on the forum today?

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    Your experience with your friend is not due to her being ESFp, but due to her being a women.
    Jokes aside, I have heard similar things about obvious SEE's, and I have seen similar but milder things personally with SEE's. They are sometimes the scum on earth and if one day we discover gene editing and the genetic base of personality types, they should be eliminated from society just to avoid the risk of having that version of SEE's. Whatever thing they might be decent at other types do better, if we talk about doing fucked up things SLE's are better, if it's about selling you something EIE's or even IEE's are better, and if it's about lifting spirits then most ethical types are superior to them, etc.
    We might have to avoid behavioral socionics and focus more on education, upbringing, genetics, culture, and the psychological composition of the person at hand (A.K.A Big 5, Psychosophy, psychoanalysis etc) as well as mental disorders (the things you mention seem common for people with malignant narcissistic personality disorder). Socionics is about how you process the information the outside world feeds you and how you organize it, create it yourself and use it to impact your inner world or your outside enviroment. There are workaholic SEI's and lazy LIE's, all kinds of people might share the same psychological skeleton (sociotype).
    Last edited by Frddy; 09-16-2020 at 02:25 AM.

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    I have 2 ESFp guy friends. Both are amazing people imo.

    One was a friend I met Freshman year of college. He was fun, outgoing, & easygoing. He was very non judgemental & one of the easiest people for me to talk to about things I don't usually talk about. Into his appearance, & would make comments on my clothes/makeup too. Always trying to get me to look better because "you never know who you'll meet." Flirts naturally without trying, which causes relationship trouble. Up for trying new things on campus. We used to hit the gym everyday after classes, so he kept me focused on fitness too (workout buddy!). One of the genuinely nicest people I've ever met. Anytime I wasn't in class, we were usually hanging out. Even would cancel dates to spend time with me instead.

    Another is a friend I met at my last job. Always looking well put together (matching sporty clothes, hair looking good, all that), was a former semi pro hockey player (& still gives hockey lessons), patient & friendly with people, can be gossipy & lacks a filter, can be moody, notices everything about people, kindhearted (been really sweet & caring to me about my depression & anxiety), likes to be silly & entertain others (but can be quiet & serious often too), & flirts with lots of girls (but at least doesn't lead girls on or ghost them, so he's not purposely mean about it).

    I honestly really enjoy ESFp people myself. The people you described seem just especially toxic in general, regardless of type.
    If you got a problem with me call 1800-who-cares

    If it ain't money in your pocket, don't worry about it

    Aiiiiight, who tryna argue on the forum today?

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    Quote Originally Posted by voider View Post
    OP doesn't seem to be of this quadra tho
    q_q Voider, you are the only sane Gamma I know..

    Quote Originally Posted by voider View Post
    Yes!! I have manipulated everyone into liking me so I can have sex with them and steal their money! My white knights, defend me now!
    M'lady I have arriveth to defendeth thy honor!

    LSI-H - - Melancholy|Sanguine - 6w5-4-8 Sp/Sx - MBTI IST
    Oldham's Vigilant Type

    “The meeting of two personalities is like the contact of two chemical substances: if there is any reaction, both are transformed.”
    ― Carl Gustav Jung ―


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    Quote Originally Posted by Frddy View Post
    Your experience with your friend is not due to her being ESFp, but due to her being a women.
    Jokes aside, I have heard similar things about obvious SEE's, and I have seen similar but milder things personally with SEE's. They are sometimes the scum on earth and if one day we discover gene editing and the genetic base of personality types, they should be eliminated from society just to avoid the risk of having that version of SEE's. Whatever thing they might be decent at other types do better, if we talk about doing fucked up things SLE's are better, if it's about selling you something EIE's or even IEE's are better, and if it's about lifting spirits then most ethical types are superior to them, etc.
    We might have to avoid behavioral socionics and focus more on education, upbringing, genetics, culture, and the psychological composition of the person at hand (A.K.A Big 5, Psychosophy, psychoanalysis etc) as well as mental disorders (the things you mention seem common for people with malignant narcissistic personality disorder). Socionics is about how you process the information the outside world feeds you and how you organize it, create it yourself and use it to impact your inner world or your outside enviroment. There are workaholic SEI's and lazy LIE's, all kinds of people might share the same psychological skeleton (sociotype).
    sexism.
    ENTj-Ni sx/so

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    Quote Originally Posted by xerxe View Post
    They really know how to party and have sex..... like, a lot of sex.
    Idk, thats stereotypical. e_e I know when ppl talk about LSI as this some kind of callous monster.. I don't relate either. OP just has some shitty ppl in lyf and thinks they are SEEs.

    although the salesman type of ppl are annoying af, I have to deal with their kind on a daily basis. After the first meeting they kinda figure out they can't Se-Fi me and deflate lol.
    LSI-H - - Melancholy|Sanguine - 6w5-4-8 Sp/Sx - MBTI IST
    Oldham's Vigilant Type

    “The meeting of two personalities is like the contact of two chemical substances: if there is any reaction, both are transformed.”
    ― Carl Gustav Jung ―


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    there are genuinely great SEE ppl.

    Don't waste time getting treated poorly provided you can get out. Set firm boundaries when it's safe to do so, and seek out the healthy people.
    ENTj-Ni sx/so

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    @calm duality is not the garantee for perfect relationships. Why do you associate with wrecking balls in the first place? It sounds like you choose the most fucked up SEEs, the ones that make you suffer; and then you whine(from your post you sound like an inert "ultra victim" ILI-Ni to me). Why do you want to live at 100mph if you're afraid of speed?

    I also felt like SLIs were bottomless Fi pits until I started associating with the ones that have a compatible subtype(inert subtype instead of contact subtype)/instinct stacking and were just nice people in general.

    Edit: the story with your father sucks tho
    Edit 2: "I once told him I was in a bad situation, he showed no concern ("Gotta go, you're being too negative")" I also ghosted several SLIs that did that to me. You having problems should not be used as justification to force me to 'care' or 'show concern' in a way you decide. That's what Nietzsche would call slave morality :

    In master morality, individuals define what is good based on whether it benefits that person and their pursuit of self-defined personal excellence; the strong-willed man values such things as good because they aid him in a life-long process of self-actualization through the will to power.
    According to Nietzsche, masters are creators of morality; slaves respond to master morality with their slave morality. Unlike master morality, which is sentiment, slave morality is based on re-sentiment—devaluing that which the master values and the slave does not have. As master morality originates in the strong, slave morality originates in the weak. Because slave morality is a reaction to oppression, it vilifies its oppressors. Slave morality is the inverse of master morality. As such, it is characterized by pessimism and cynicism. Slave morality is created in opposition to what master morality values as "good".
    Slave morality does not aim at exerting one's will by strength, but by careful subversion. It does not seek to transcend the masters, but to make them slaves as well.
    If they are not nice with you, it means they don't want to be nice. Just get yourself what you want out of life. If you want someone who cares in the way you want, quit hanging out with people like that; quit bitchin' whithout changin'
    Last edited by lkdhf qkb; 09-16-2020 at 09:31 AM.
    Jg djwjmjabujpo jt up tvswjwf, xf nvtu dvmujwbuf uif tdjfodf pg ivnbo sfmbujpotijqt - uif bcjmjuz pg bmm qfpqmft, pg bmm ljoet, up mjwf uphfuifs, jo uif tbnf xpsme bu qfbdf.
    Gsbolmjo E. Spptfwfmu

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    Quote Originally Posted by shotgunfingers View Post
    q_q Voider, you are the only sane Gamma I know..



    M'lady I have arriveth to defendeth thy honor!

    I carry this whole quadra on my back like Atlas

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    Hot Message FDG's Avatar
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    I have a SEE male friend who is a bit like your love interest. But he has a job. That probably makes a difference, the rest of your list...I'd take them more as positive qualities in a friend? If i don't have to live with them daily.

    Try to insult them openly when they do something you don't like, they generally learn after a while.
    Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit

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    Cat Lady
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    They can be very hard workers and can attain a lot if they put their mind to it and exercise discipline. They can engender a spirit of competition. I find their lack of intuition prevents them from "rigging the competition" unless they have some cunning allies.

    They're decent enough so long as they don't get too close or try to take advantage of my time and intellect. However, I try to keep a distance because I can get easily exhausted. Generally, they are likable when they have their dual nearby to help even things out, but isn't that generally true of duals?

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    Quote Originally Posted by nanashi View Post
    sexism.
    Is that easy to make you fall for a bait?

    Read the entire comment and you will realize everything is in a sarcastic tone. I imagine you fell for the bait because you are a woman.
    Last edited by Frddy; 09-16-2020 at 11:50 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Smilex View Post
    In my experience ESFp are the best type at giving love. That's basically a main attribute.
    In my experience, they only give love to themselves and have no loyalty whatsoever. They are the best type at backstabbing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by xerxe View Post
    They really know how to party and have sex..... like, a lot of sex.
    With anything that moves, and probably things that don’t move. I find it repulsive.

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    Quote Originally Posted by voider View Post
    Yes!! I have manipulated everyone into liking me so I can have sex with them and steal their money! My white knights, defend me now!
    Only deep down we feel sorry for you airheads. Men toss esfp women around and never take them seriously.

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    Quote Originally Posted by calm View Post
    Only deep down we feel sorry for you airheads. Men toss esfp women around and never take them seriously.
    Jeez chica. I guess you took my joke seriously.

    I do realize men will toss 'easy' women around if they lack the self respect/awareness to set proper boundaries and get too emotionally involved with who they call hookups. But you'd do well with thinking about how not every person with a type is a carbon copy of the one that damaged you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beautiful sky View Post
    Yes they have a few when some are not trying to cheat on your so lol
    They can have a lot of energy and get things done
    Be a good friend
    Help cheer you up
    Keep memories
    Help you dress nice
    Smart and thoughtful
    Help you do homework
    Help you walk it off
    I underlined the correct statement and bolded the most incorrect statement. They couldn’t help a kindergartner with their homework. They’re also great friends until they can’t fight their impulse to stab you in the back for their own personal gain. They will never resist doing that. And the “great friend” thing is all an act they play until they realize you aren’t coughing up any money or falling for it in the slightest.

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    Quote Originally Posted by voider View Post
    Jeez chica. I guess you took my joke seriously.
    Everything is a joke with you guys

  39. #39
    Humanist Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by calm View Post
    I underlined the correct statement and bolded the most incorrect statement. They couldn’t help a kindergartner with their homework. They’re also great friends until they can’t fight their impulse to stab you in the back for their own personal gain. They will never resist doing that. And the “great friend” thing is all an act they play until they realize you aren’t coughing up any money or falling for it in the slightest.
    It’s understandable to be upset but let me assure you I know an ESFP who works for NASA as a physicist
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 2w1sw(1w9) helps others to live up to their own standards of what a good person is and is very behind the scenes in the process.
    Tritype 1-2-6 stacking sp/sx


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beautiful sky View Post
    It’s easy to feel bitter when you feel let down
    I hope my own story of love and patience proves that it’s out there for you if you too remain hopeful
    I appreciate the effort but I’m quickly learning that they are all the same.

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