In what way does a certain type enjoy or participate in drama?
Was thinking each type can be seen as dramatic or as enjoying drama or starting it, depending on viewpoint
Fi valued types more prefer emotional comfort, than emotional agitation
if you'd had LIE as you think, but not some Fe ego type - you'd understand the different and did not asked that
On the contrary, Lie are stated to be dramatists. Look at the information elements we have,Sol. All day I spin tales and dramatize in a corporate setting to get innovations I can tell need to go through, through. I base them on science, but I'm still telling a story about the future and, as the socionics author wrote about XIE types, making a mountain out of a mole hill. If I don't ghost of Christmas future them, they don't innovate to protect the company, and life will bite them in the ass
Originally Posted by Sol
"Ni as creative function of EIE (ENFj; Hamlet) and LIE (ENTj; Jack London)
These types like to find internally contradictory people, "dig" in them and create in them internal harmony and mood. They make for great artists, because they know how to and love to "become" one with an image of a man and play a role from his worldview. They are able to understand the essence of complex internal situations and make for potentially good analysts. Often it is difficult to find employment for them, as their "product" is the internal conflicts of man and essence, and to penetrate so far, into "the soul" of man, you just need to have permission. Often become unstable, vulnerable, fragile, just so that they can harmonize themselves, and sometimes can start to torment and tear into themselves and dig into their own issues. They have a difficulty finding adequate application to their creative function in the world, since it is not in high demand - not everyone wants someone else to dig into their internal states. Their product - bold ideas, principles, systems of belief and knowledge that they bring into the world and promote. But they do this beautifully, creatively, elegantly, not forcibly imposing them but promoting them in interesting ways. Search for internally contradictory situations, like to grasp their essence. Often realize themselves in art and writing, as this is also a good way to use the function. They are able to enter into various internal psychological states. A good speaker, as he is able to influence positively on the internal state of others. Their product is the "wholeness" of the internal state, and therefore they can find success in field of psychology, because it means that they are the healers of souls. In life they loved to dramatize everything. Everyone around becomes informed about the slightest change in their mood or internal state. Usually they are very fond of "making mountains out of molehills", for them this is a way to find work for their second function. The more they become exposed - the greater the realization of their personality in the world."
Your emotional manipulative behavior as a prime method was seen in that situation. It's much more common for F types.
You claim that people of all types enjoy "dramas", just in different ways. What is against the theory. The reason you ignore the theory is your own experience of F type by which you think T types should be similar, while F types should be not lesser predisposed.
Te/Fi types enjoy quiet emotional comfort. Loud emotional expressions which can be described by a term as "drama" is alike dogs barking for them. For Te is hard to tolerate when loud base Fe types express even positive emotions, not even negative emotions of dramas. This supresses and distorts Te psyche - there is nothing to enjoy. Mb funny sometimes as to get _a little_ of spice, but not a normal meal to like it.
The most emotional types among Fi/Te are base Fi. They express dramas by "ignoring" function which is more activated in a situation when a human goes to defence. This can be useful for when they deal with "sweet" base Te duals when those annoy them. To stop them effectively and not hard for themselves (as it's strong region for them) they may hit their minds by Fe-style rude words and loud emotionality. When they reduce Fi-style warmness and politeness of talking is generally enough Te would feel not ok and understood as bad signes to not provoke for more (in case it's close human with Te type which cares about feelings of those Fi ones and hence is open to their emotional influence). To be rude and loud by Fe is not what base Fi do often, - when behave alike superego of own duals. You need to annoy them seriously so they wanted to push you away or mb to break the relations. Fe is alike their nuclear weapon of base Fi - the existence of which (and rare usage as a demo) helps to support a peace and harmony with their duals.
It needs to be Fe valued type to perceive dramas as something to enjoy. The type which you seem to have. EIE is close to LIE.
See, I'd disagree. I would have characterized your calling certain types stupid as drama.you were talking about types you were thinking you might not be. And it occurred to me it was a shorthand for you. And I got curious about how you felt about those types. My point in writing this OP is that drama seems to be defined differently by different types.....and...it seems a cool self reflective and other-reflective exercise to explore ...and could tell us cool things about the types
Originally Posted by Duschia
See, I've never called a whole /type/ 'stupid' and I'm pretty sure of that. I can recall talking about problems with people of particular type (I had particular problems with beta NFs), but that is not the same, and I always do accentuate to not look at people /just/ by their type (note /just/, I also think some things are determined by those type differences). I suspect you are trying to skew my words/views so it fits your narrative (?, and I don't even remember having a passionate discussion about /types/ with you), but okay, whatever - I don't want to fight, and maybe it's just creative or whatever.
Originally Posted by nanashi
I definitely don't enjoy at the very least most kinds of drama, and I try to not instigate it (with some people - apparently any behavior can be a reason to drama about, so... in these cases I tend to go away nowadays and not bother, as I'm naturally rather ground-holding). Drama lives for drama. If a thing is done out of some useful purpose then, in my eyes, things can be 'dramatic' and some people may try to instigate drama, but this is not drama, rather just a purposeful involvement (by the way something that XIEs are good at doing apparently, if you read sources).
And some people definitely don't enjoy drama.
I'm a peach and you're a plum
Sometimes others drama can be interesting and entertaining, though when really thinking about it and realizing that one, both/all parties now feel quite bad/and like shit...well, that sucks. In some cases maybe people don't feel like shit and they thrive on it, but I think a majority of the time people come out of it feeling somehow wounded, at least temporarily, however that manifests for said person. Being personally involved in drama, even if I'm one of the initiators, makes me feel truly sick. It is extraordinarily unpleasant and and hate being in the center of it, but sometimes my need for justice, to speak my mind, to stand up for others or myself etc.(and not always saying my thinking is right here) can override knowing what's going to come which is feeling really, really bad :/ In person, with most people, I mostly avoid it. I am not very confrontational. I can probably be a little melodramatic though pertaining to just myself and my state/feelings.
a two horned unicorn renegade
No. Haha. I'm not trying to lie nor to get you to fit my narrative. I genuinely had that reaction of surprise when you said blank type is stupid. You might have been thinking about some behavior pattern or weakness. I'm referring to the last week in the chatbox.
Originally Posted by Duschia
Something called archive exists, so, here are my posts from last week and I'm going to stand my ground:
Originally Posted by nanashi
First is the case of a particular person who seems sometimes so blind in so-called 'intuitive' matters for me, that I'm going 'geezus are you stupid I can't' - and I don't do that often. This seems to be connected to their PoLR, but tbh it's rather surprising as usually no PoLR does THAT badly. It was to the point I've kinda distanced from typing the same as that particular person as this particular brand of 'stupidness' (on Nx; in fact, it was about several lacking of usage) is very alien to me - in fact, I can quite easily spot it and 'call it out'. So, by this way I don't relate much to Nx PoLR/weakness, as in descriptions. If we are somehow the same type with that person, then this person has much bigger problems with Nx than me or, additional, other problems in general (to end speculations - I don't want to discuss this further and I don't want to do a drama about this so, end here). That was always what I meant.
Second is @Adam Strange ironically-philosophically calling LIEs stupid, and me telling him that 'well, I'm either LIE then or other types can be as stupid'. So no, maybe there is a specific brand of LIEs' stupidity, but I actually think all types can be in their own... Ways (again, 'we are all stupid').
So, seems like you have confused me with Adam (who in my opinion meant nothing 'drama-like' and this was clearly a bit satirical) or you are being intentionally dishonest (spewing drama by false accusations), or, supposing no bad intentions and no aim here, you just have misremembered and hence the results.
Anyway, I'm out of this thread. No hard feelings.
Last edited by Duschia; 07-09-2020 at 02:42 PM.
Ejs are the drama types in that they always seem to be trying to elicit responses from others and many tend to get these in overt, in-your-face manners. Drama seems to stimulate their rationalization processes; it's a bit like wrestling with a pig - everyone gets a little dirty and the pig loves it.
Eps sometimes create drama to achieve an objective or when they're cornered or caught at something they shouldn't be doing. They don't seem to like it directed at themselves.
Ips prefer a low profile but become very animated when they, their ideas or the ones they're close to are threatened. Drama is usually a means of protection but it also stimulates their rationalization processes, and Ips can usually cope with drama even when it's aimed at them.
Ijs avoid drama but some will sometimes deliberately try subvert opponents and thus indirectly cause drama. Under stress, they will sometimes uncontrollably erupt because they have no pressure relief mechanisms.
Last edited by Rebelondeck; 07-09-2020 at 06:25 PM.
Many if not most of the dramatic crap started on this site has actually been from Fi valuers not Fe valuers so I don't think Fe is more dramatic. I think like if you took of reality and sucked it in a vacuum it might appear that way but things don't really work that way so it's dumb to me to think that way. Expressing yourself as dramatic but actually willfully attempting to gaslight and set other people up to behave more dramatic are two very different things.
Woofwoofl summed up drama pretty nicely though. Something about how drama is playing victim while you yourself are actually throwing out most of the punches. Some of this is human nature, and many of us have done this from time to time as a coping mechanism to deal with adverse situations. When we do bad shit to other people, we tend to justify it or rationalize it. When bad shit is done to us it's 'HOW COULD YOU HURT MY ANGELIC JESUS SOUL. YOU WILL PAY FOR THAT!' That is the narcissistic diva drama queen in a nutshell. (and don't stereotype drama queens, some of the biggest drama queens are ultra masculine straight army guys lol) A big core of 'drama' is basically that.
The playing victim thing doesn't have to necessarily be all that 'obvious' either, you can also more low key play victim by pretending you are not responsible for how you are treating others and acting above it all. (while secretly you feel like a sad victim because you live in a trailer park or whatever) Accusing others of playing victim when you yourself are the biggest victim player of it all is often another attempt to stir up drama.
Yes, the internet does introduce a different dynamic when it guarantees anonymity. However, most Fi trolls seem to drop their overt aggression when physically in front of their opponents even when they may be in a superior position; they tend to prefer covert subversion and the internet is ideal for that. I have encountered little overt Fi drama in a work environment although stubbornness, possessiveness and passive resistance are quite common. A few have blown a gasket on occasion but it was a very brief occurrence for which the individuals seemed embarrassed about letting their weakness show.
Originally Posted by BandD