Life with a dual - criticism

[Tallmo]

Seems the old thread is closed so I'll continue here:

@Northstar

The flipside could be that they lack some other type of growth instead in this case so it's not necessarily any proof that dualization would be harmful.

I think I have enough proof at this point that duality will keep you focused on your conscious side, not taking on the challenges of superid. The dual provides it for you. That's the blessing and curse of duality. It's obvious that this will prevent growth.

I think it's funny how in thread SEI talks about the need of change and LII praises a tolerant and competition-free atmosphere.

hmm, I don't understand what you mean.

Many socionics texts on relationships seem surprisingly naive with their idealization of duality over other types of intertype relationships.

Socionics idealizes duality but they have good reasons for doing so, especially within the limited framework of Socionics. Duality can be great, it is just that there are more things to consider. Socionics is not really psychology. Or very limited psychology.

[Adam Strange]

@Tallmo, could you include a link to the closed thread, so future readers can easily find it?

[Northstar]

hmm, I don't understand what you mean.

I just thought your arguments hinted at Ne seeking in your case and Se PoLR in rebelondeck's case. An observation that your definitions of what's good in duality reflected your respective types.

[Sol]

noobs doing a criticism of what they do not understand
due to the lack of knowledge and experience
and typing mistakes they are common to do
especially when it's also own types

nuff said

[Beautiful sky]

Speaking as a married woman....
Duality is great only when both people know their type and self very well
My husband comes from a very good understanding of his type as his mom is also LSE and he is and his mom is a professional mbti practitioner for 30 plus years at a corporate level.

Had he not know his type and why his Te assess information the way it does he wouldn’t stop to listen and hear that when I say something it is exactly what he is thinking

Is duality promoting growth no. Growth and development is up to you not your dual. My dual just provides protection in a physical sense, financial security, companionship, and comfort. I grow myself by taking the time to read and learn in my interests and hobbies. Don’t expect your dual to inject knowledge in your head :/

[xerx]

According to what I've read, input from your dual's strong functions helps to raise the level of creativity of your strong functions, by feeding you with data and impressions you never would have otherwise considered. Ne works better, and is more exciting, in an environment with lots of Si, and so on... It's probably good for your self-development to find a dual that doesn't try to do everything for you, though.

[sbbds]

According to what I've read, input from your dual's strong functions helps to raise the level of creativity of your strong functions, by feeding you with data and impressions you never would have otherwise considered. Ne works better, and is more exciting, in an environment with lots of Si, and so on... It's probably good for your self-development to find a dual that doesn't try to do everything for you, though.

I think that’s right according to Jung. A dual would help you strengthen your strong functions yet maybe put less pressure on your weaker functions developing more. Other types would help you feed into your strong functions less, causing you need to use your weaker functions more to generate more info, putting more stress on your entire system, yet possibly also forcing more development on weaker functions.

[Rebelondeck]

A dual only contributes to the team, and usually and most importantly, doesn't interfere with their partner's thinking processes. Non-interference implies not trying to get into the other person's head or to supplant their ideas. On average, this helps to create a conducive environment and or harmonious team but there certainly isn't melding or merger of minds or souls, or functions. I don't often pair duals for many projects because although they often get along with one another, their skill sets are so different that they don't usually pull on the same oars.

a.k.a. I/O

[consentingadult]

Socionics is not really psychology. Or very limited psychology.

Socionics is on the boundaries of personality psychology, social psychology, sociology and cultural anthropology. If you have a basic understanding of these four disciplines, Socionics suddenly makes a lot of sense.

https://mavericksocionics.blogspot.c...socionics.html

[consentingadult]

I don't often pair duals for many projects because although they often get along with one another, their skill sets are so different that they don't usually pull on the same oars.

This is an important realization. Dualization does not so much mean two people can work together effortlessly, its more like responsibilities and tasks get automatically distributed according to personal skills and strengths. This is what I see each and every time in dealings with SLI cooks: things run very smooth, not so much because we work together on the same problem, but different problems get distributed very smoothly, almost without communication.

[Tallmo]

Socionics is on the boundaries of personality psychology, social psychology, sociology and cultural anthropology. If you have a basic understanding of these four disciplines, Socionics suddenly makes a lot of sense.

https://mavericksocionics.blogspot.c...socionics.html

Right. It's definitely psychology, but limited, so I guess I exaggerated a little. The beauty is that Socionics /Jung has discovered a limited well-defined part of the mind to study. That's great as long as one remembers that this is in no way the whole picture.

[Beautiful sky]

A dual only contributes to the team, and usually and most importantly, doesn't interfere with their partner's thinking processes. Non-interference implies not trying to get into the other person's head or to supplant their ideas. On average, this helps to create a conducive environment and or harmonious team but there certainly isn't melding or merger of minds or souls, or functions. I don't often pair duals for many projects because although they often get along with one another, their skill sets are so different that they don't usually pull on the same oars.

a.k.a. I/O

Plus I’m weaker physically so I don’t work well in physical projects maybe because I’m a woman however it depends on the field. The dual LSE and EII men at work find it easy and comfortable to work together because they are doing medical work and they are all males

[Rebelondeck]

Plus I’m weaker physically so I don’t work well in physical projects maybe because I’m a woman however it depends on the field. The dual LSE and EII men at work find it easy and comfortable to work together because they are doing medical work and they are all males

Are those duals doing exactly the same job? Physical characteristics aside, I found that duals with equivalent training tend to focus on much different aspects of the same field. Perhaps with more narrowly defined jobs, there's not as much leeway.

a.k.a. I/O

[xerx]

I think that’s right according to Jung. A dual would help you strengthen your strong functions yet maybe put less pressure on your weaker functions developing more. Other types would help you feed into your strong functions less, causing you need to use your weaker functions more to generate more info, putting more stress on your entire system, yet possibly also forcing more development on weaker functions.

Yeah. I don't 'click' with all duals, but when I do, it's eerily easy to express yourself. That said, duality relations aren't always easy to start, because of initial hurdles in understanding or communication... you need to put effort into them, just like anything else.

[Beautiful sky]

Are those duals doing exactly the same job? Physical characteristics aside, I found that duals with equivalent training tend to focus on much different aspects of the same field. Perhaps with more narrowly defined jobs, there's not as much leeway.

a.k.a. I/O

Yes they are all nurses with the same duties

[Rebelondeck]

Yeah. I don't 'click' with all duals........

I've seen duals fight big time in work environments. Usually, one of them was ill-suited to the job that they were supposed to do. Incompetence trumps duality every time - unless they're doing something else on the side.

a.k.a. I/O

[Eliza Thomason]

noobs doing a criticism of what they do not understand
due to the lack of knowledge and experience
and typing mistakes they are common to do
especially when it's also own types

nuff said

But then, there are non-noobs who once they've figured their type they refuse (or take umbrage at the idea) to question it because they already decided it. Why is that? Perhaps they lack the self-knowledge, or the true understanding of Socionics types? Or is there instead some Socionics qualities that make it harder to revisit that identity they have adapted? It would be interesting to explore which Socionics qualities these are.

One I have often noticed is the Renin Constructivist/Emotivist, where the constructivist - has "emotional 'anchors' (eg, books, films, places) which they use to support their internal emotional state." I believe they are emotionally anchored in their chosen type and no matter how logical/rational they may be otherwise, they do not want to revisit or challenge that which they are anchored to. There are probably other things too, like Cognitive styles. Some are more restrictive about revisiting old decisions, probably.

Then their are noobs who seem to grasp a lot with accuracy right off. Just sayin'.