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    What's the purpose of SEI? Tallmo's Avatar
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    @shotgunfingers,

    I was wondering if you could be Si base (SLI), but after comparing with some other people, I think you lack Si, and I would vote ILE for you. At least for the moment.

    I'm pretty sure this guy is a SLI but in him I can actually sense the real Si:ness and a certain sensitivity, but I can't sense it in you.
    A true sense-perception certainly exists, but it always looks as though objects were not so much forcing their way into the subject in their own right as that the subject were seeing things quite differently, or saw quite other things than the rest of mankind. As a matter of fact, the subject perceives the same things as everybody else, only, he never stops at the purely objective effect, but concerns himself with the subjective perception released by the objective stimulus.
    (Jung on Si)


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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallmo View Post
    @shotgunfingers,

    I was wondering if you could be Si base (SLI), but after comparing with some other people, I think you lack Si, and I would vote ILE for you. At least for the moment.

    I'm pretty sure this guy is a SLI but in him I can actually sense the real Si:ness and a certain sensitivity, but I can't sense it in you.
    I'm still not sure. By description irrational intuitive for sure (positively secure in my asessment of this), but for temporal intuition at least so far according to Filatova nowhere did I find anything regarding plans for the future. According to the book planning in advance is a rational trait period irrationals are highly situation dependent and easily adapt to/deal with nebulous situations.. and I still have this gut feeling I'm introverted... likely a feeler. By recent information I think I can rule out ILI.

    I'm not sure I'm actually a Ne dom, due to how novelty seeking and active in this pursuit IEE and ILE can be. O.o however i have spent one time months alone without internet and it got really bad e_e positively suicidal lmao..

    So far I have narrowed it down to IEI, IEE or ILE. Its one of these types.
    Last edited by shotgunfingers; 06-12-2020 at 07:33 PM. Reason: typo correction OCD

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    Quote Originally Posted by shotgunfingers View Post
    but for temporal intuition at least so far according to Filatova nowhere did I find anything regarding plans for the future. According to the book planning in advance is a rational trait period
    Ni is not just time, it's more like perceiving the abstract momentum of situations, the "undercurrent". Ni people don't need to plan the future because it comes anyway, and they are fine with temporal uncertainty, something like that. It's easy to see the opposite in Ni polr people, how they react according to here-and-now, messing up the momentum that could have solved everything by itself. For example stressed Ni polr moms with their kids. They often react too early or escalate the situation.
    A true sense-perception certainly exists, but it always looks as though objects were not so much forcing their way into the subject in their own right as that the subject were seeing things quite differently, or saw quite other things than the rest of mankind. As a matter of fact, the subject perceives the same things as everybody else, only, he never stops at the purely objective effect, but concerns himself with the subjective perception released by the objective stimulus.
    (Jung on Si)


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    Quote Originally Posted by shotgunfingers View Post
    According to the book planning in advance is a rational trait period
    This is a common misunderstanding, even with the 'great' theorists of Socionics. Rational types are not into planning, they often aren't even good at it. Rational types are about trying to control things. A subtle but important difference.

    When applied to the social domain, the rational information elements can be fully understood with the sociological concept of institutions.

    Finally, I want to state that I find Filatova rather lightweight and simplistic. But then again, perhaps beginning with something simplistic is the best way to start out with Socionics, and expand and nuance your insights from there. As long as you kind in the back of your mind that it is a simplification.
    “I have never tried that before, so I think I should definitely be able to do that.” --- Pippi Longstocking

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    Quote Originally Posted by consentingadult View Post
    This is a common misunderstanding, even with the 'great' theorists of Socionics. Rational types are not into planning, they often aren't even good at it. Rational types are about trying to control things. A subtle but important difference.

    When applied to the social domain, the rational information elements can be fully understood with the sociological concept of institutions.

    Finally, I want to state that I find Filatova rather lightweight and simplistic. But then again, perhaps beginning with something simplistic is the best way to start out with Socionics, and expand and nuance your insights from there. As long as you kind in the back of your mind that it is a simplification.
    My observation was and is that @Sol does this in order to not get lost in excessive details that may or may not be true. Keeping it simple provides clarity and oversight. Like this its easier to see what type is the closest approximation to the client and consequently its probably more accurate.

    I agree with you on rationals, they expect reality to be in a certain way because unlike irrationals they are slightly disconnected from it by having a base rational function. This leads to a tendency towards establishing control. I have no such tendency, I take things as they come and adapt.

    I do however view even individual people as a long chain of causality stretching from the past into the future.I am the product of the past and have resposabilities towards my future descendants. Time is a river of causality and this is true even on a grand universal scale. Everything that was and will be is connected though a single chain-link in the present.

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    Quote Originally Posted by shotgunfingers View Post
    My observation was and is that @Sol does this in order to not get lost in excessive details that may or may not be true.
    Sol is on my ignore list, so I can't really comment on that.
    “I have never tried that before, so I think I should definitely be able to do that.” --- Pippi Longstocking

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    Quote Originally Posted by shotgunfingers View Post
    I'm still not sure. By description irrational intuitive for sure (positively secure in my asessment of this), but for temporal intuition at least so far according to Filatova nowhere did I find anything regarding plans for the future. According to the book planning in advance is a rational trait period irrationals are highly situation dependent and easily adapt to/deal with nebulous situations.. and I still have this gut feeling I'm introverted... likely a feeler. By recent information I think I can rule out ILI.

    I'm not sure I'm actually a Ne dom, due to how novelty seeking and active in this pursuit IEE and ILE can be. O.o however i have spent one time months alone without internet and it got really bad e_e positively suicidal lmao..

    So far I have narrowed it down to IEI, IEE or ILE. Its one of these types.
    I absolutely don’t think you’re an IEI. No offense.

    I mean I guess it isn’t impossible technically, but you’d be the rare oddly masculine variation.
    Last edited by sbbds; 06-13-2020 at 09:16 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by consentingadult View Post
    Sol is on my ignore list, so I can't really comment on that.
    e_e you guys don't seem to like him, but he isn't wrong. I have seen a lot of ppl here be butt-hurt. Getting pissed off and emotional isn't conducive towards finding one's actual type. What one is and what one wishes to be can be 2 completely different things.

    Quote Originally Posted by sbbds View Post
    I absolutely don’t think you’re an IEI. No offense.

    I mean I guess it isn’t impossible technically, but you’d be the rare oddly masculine variation.
    yeah, you make a good point.

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    Not all male IEI are effeminate. That is a misconception.

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    Quote Originally Posted by shotgunfingers View Post
    e_e you guys don't seem to like him, but he isn't wrong. I have seen a lot of ppl here be butt-hurt. Getting pissed off and emotional isn't conducive towards finding one's actual type. What one is and what one wishes to be can be 2 completely different things.
    That is a totally wrong assumption about my motivation for blocking Sol. He/she and I have never collided on any matter, as far as I recall. I just don want to waste my time on nonsensical posts. Several members have been added to my ignore list for that reason alone.
    “I have never tried that before, so I think I should definitely be able to do that.” --- Pippi Longstocking

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    Quote Originally Posted by Northstar View Post
    Not all male IEI are effeminate. That is a misconception.
    Just about 90% of them...

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    Quote Originally Posted by sbbds View Post
    Just about 90% of them...
    Not really, I know several beta NF men who aren’t all that effeminate. Their Fe is more related to the intensity and variability than the ”softness” of emotional expression. Especially if the subtype is D, for example.

    You aren’t all that stereotypical SLE either, right?

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    Quote Originally Posted by sbbds View Post
    Just about 90% of them...
    Lol @Duschia at one point said I was Fi PolR... :/ still unsure what was meant by that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Northstar View Post
    Not really, I know several beta NF men who aren’t all that effeminate. Their Fe is more related to the intensity and variability than the ”softness” of emotional expression. Especially if the subtype is D, for example.

    You aren’t all that stereotypical SLE either, right?
    I know one, maybe two who are neutralish, but not to the point of masculinity that @shotgunfingers seems to be. So I do think it’s basically 90% of IEIs who are effeminate or neutral, if not more. Can’t say it’s exactly the same for EIEs though, if you are thinking of those guys too.

    Again, I didn’t say it’s totally impossible. Just seems unlikely to me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sbbds View Post
    I know one, maybe two who are neutralish, but not to the point of masculinity that @shotgunfingers seems to be. So I do think it’s basically 90% of IEIs who are effeminate or neutral, if not more. Can’t say it’s exactly the same for EIEs though, if you are thinking of those guys too.

    Again, I didn’t say it’s totally impossible. Just seems unlikely to me.
    I think it’s a misconception in general that F types can’t behave masculine, not just beta NF. Feeling preference doesn’t equal soft IMO, although it typically means expressing all kind of feeling more and using it more in decision-making. Also especially in case of Fe, being aware of societal gender roles and how to come off as someone that ”belongs”. Fe creatives like to conform and belong to groups in my experience.
    E-type plays a role in behavior also, e6 is not a sweet feminine type in my book.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Northstar View Post
    I think it’s a misconception in general that F types can’t behave masculine, not just beta NF. Feeling preference doesn’t equal soft IMO, although it typically means expressing all kind of feeling more and using it more in decision-making. Also especially in case of Fe, being aware of societal gender roles and how to come off as someone that ”belongs”. Fe creatives like to conform and belong to groups in my experience.
    E-type plays a role in behavior also, e6 is not a sweet feminine type in my book.
    Sure. Idk about soft but generally in most cultures, I do think the F preference comes off as somewhat more effeminate overall though. Obviously everyone has different masculine and feminine qualities to them, and I think F types can and do behave masculine too at times, but I’d very rarely consider an F type male in particular to be more masculine overall than a T type male, except in rare cases. Except in rare cases. Emphasis on rare cases..

    I don’t think it’s an offensive or bad thing though lol.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Northstar View Post
    I think it’s a misconception in general that F types can’t behave masculine, not just beta NF. Feeling preference doesn’t equal soft IMO, although it typically means expressing all kind of feeling more and using it more in decision-making. Also especially in case of Fe, being aware of societal gender roles and how to come off as someone that ”belongs”. Fe creatives like to conform and belong to groups in my experience.
    E-type plays a role in behavior also, e6 is not a sweet feminine type in my book.
    e_e well that sux. I have an incredibly hard time conforming and belonging.. and I have a bad tendency to just run my mouth, be outspoken and say it as I see it. This has been so since I was a kid. I still remember my mother constantly scolding me and regulating how I behaved & what I said, because I'd run my mouth and call my uncle and grandmother scum of the earth that they truly are.. to their face. I understand that blending in is probably a good idea, but I can't and my mother's insistence on me behaving "normally" only ended in me developing social anxiety.

    to be part of the herd is stupid. I'm more likely to cause trouble and disagree than go along to get along. Just look at the protesters and ppl rioting nowadays, they hold odd chanting sessions e_e who the fuck in their right mind would participate in that bullshit... it doesn't really surprise me that people can;t seem to think for themselves, but its annoying to have to witness anyway.

    Quote Originally Posted by sbbds View Post
    Sure. Idk about soft but generally in most cultures, I do think the F preference comes off as somewhat more effeminate overall though. Obviously everyone has different masculine and feminine qualities to them, and I think F types can and do behave masculine too at times, but I’d very rarely consider an F type male in particular to be more masculine overall than a T type male, except in rare cases. Except in rare cases. Emphasis on rare cases..

    I don’t think it’s an offensive or bad thing though lol.
    ?_? uhm, I am only being myself. I'm positive I'm not trying to behave one way or another, What you see is what you get with me. I guess I'm... nice... but you wouldn't have guessed based on my posts culture has nothing to do with this. I act on my own thoughts and feelings, not some bullshit societal expectation of how and what I should be e_e ... this very thought is what broke my social anxiety in the end.

    I was watching this "IEI" party and my first reaction to the guy was: trey is so cringe wtf. I feel like punching him in his fake-ass face. That guy's very presence is irritating for some reason. Something bout him just spells: "this guy is bad news, avoid at all costs"

    https://youtu.be/fuIoAJ-644k

    Last edited by shotgunfingers; 06-13-2020 at 12:40 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by consentingadult View Post
    This is a common misunderstanding, even with the 'great' theorists of Socionics.
    There are only 2 theorists of Socionics: Jung and Augustinavichiute.

    > Rational types are not into planning, they often aren't even good at it. Rational types are about trying to control things.

    So you reject typology basics, oppose to common Socionics texts and practice.
    Doing this without clear and good reasons.

    To do something and to have good result doing it - is not the same. The more important is what is more comfortable and efficient approach - for J types it's planing and stable acting (as it's harder for them to switch), while for P types is higher flexibility and wave alike acting.
    Rationality is about reasonable relation - where you think and then you do, where you may explain why you do. This leads to planing, which also helps with a controlling - as you are prepeared for what should be.

    One of reasons when people have exotic theoretical views, reject or distort (your case) the basic types theory is to rationalize a misfiting of a seen behavior to theory basics due to mistakes in types they often do. While mistakes are common, taking that known real typing matches are <20% in common average. If you are a random noob which did not practice much in typing - it's baseless to suppose you type significantly better than common.

    > I want to state that I find Filatova rather lightweight and simplistic.

    This is another common part which helps to rationalize mistypings.

    Basic types theory is simple. She holds to classical theory's basics which deserve more of trust. It's enough to identify types. The more of doubtful, lesser reasonably based and worser described hypotheses you are useing - the more mistakes you'll do.

    Many noobs have irresponsible relation to types and theories. They read random texts, instead of systematic studing and normal sources as books. Never read Jung's book. Such do not undestand good what are theory basics to trust them more. They accept many of nonsense near Socionics as Reinin's traits and Gulenko's fantasies, having to this the same trust as to core theory. Also among types to the lack of reasonable objectivity predisposes F types and nonvalue Te.
    It's enough for noobs to get fun on forums - to play in types discussions where the more theories - the more of fun, and having more muddy hypotheses is easier to rationalize their incompetent opinions about someones types. So noobs have the lack of motivation to behave more reasonably. Even some of them who later get significant typing experience and wants to use types seriously - may keep the same issues due to innertia of initial inreasonable relation. To irresponsibly trust to doubful hypotheses and sometimes to have strange understanding of basics as initially studed types by a mess.

    Resume
    You have baseless exotic theory views. And you trust to baseless hypotheses.
    Among main reasons for such is that this helps you to mislead yourself and others. Especially higher need in heresies appear with incorrect understanding of own type.

    If you want to use Socionics with positive results you need to use its correct theory, be teached and trained enough for this.

    As you have high chance to be misleaded about own type I recommend you to make a typing theme with your videointerview.
    Types examples: video bloggers, actors

  19. #99

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    I don't think you're IEI because I don't see strong Ni use... You don't to seem dig deep for the nuance and meaning behind things. IEIs tend to do this towards relationships, roles, etc. They often look for succinct themes and conclusions after the idea exploration. @BandD is a good example of this.

    You seem much more expansive and exploratory on a broader scope (open-ended).
    Last edited by JustWandering; 06-13-2020 at 01:01 PM.
    “There are things known and there are things unknown, and in between are the doors of perception.”
    Aldous Huxley

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sol View Post
    If you want to use Socionics with positive results you need to use its correct theory, be teached and trained enough for this.

    As you have high chance to be misleaded about own type I recommend you to make a typing theme with your videointerview.
    A typing theme? How do I do this? What do you mean?

    e_e I found this, by the looks of it, it seems the most reasonable approach I have seen and it reflects your thoughts on the subject: http://worldsocionics.blogspot.com/2...lf-typing.html

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    -.- well, Filatova's test was of no help either. I even asked the opinions of those closest to me and tried to be as objective as I can.



    Whatever type I am, the base function is the strongest one.

    I'm socially introverted, but when it comes to information or sensory input I'm a glutton, so it splits up and evens out in the test results for I-E. If I'd ever lose internet connection e_e I'd go insane with lack of stimulation within half a day.. in 3 months I'd be suicidally bored out of my mind.

    There was this question about where I would spend my vacation: bustling city visiting places or alone at a quiet lakeside. The lakeside sounded like torture, but the bustling city sounded boring as well. I can't spend days alone just with my thoughts.. boredom = torture. O.o but I don;t really need ppl to interact with, I just need stuff to think about, new information and experiences to ponder, reflect on..

    Similar situation with T-F, it depends on the context. I'm not good at comforting people tho, prefer to try and solve their problems, if that doesn't help them I give up in frustration. <== why I never liked practicing psychology. Like any normal human being I have feelings, but mine are even most of the time and trivialities don't bother me.
    Last edited by shotgunfingers; 06-13-2020 at 04:01 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by shotgunfingers View Post
    A typing theme? How do I do this? What do you mean?
    it was for consentingadult
    an example of a typing theme/thread/topic is this one. in Russian the common term is "theme", not a thread
    Types examples: video bloggers, actors

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    For what shotgun said,

    he seems to 'need' (well, if you state it that way - this is duality) a person, who can 'soften' his edges and is more diplomatic than him (as this seems to be a running theme in his stories - he 'fails' because of his bluntness/lack of diplomacy). This is VERY far away from being IEI (often the most shrewd type when it comes to diplomacy in socion, using both Ni and their natural charm), this is more like NEEDING one (someone more 'diplomatic').

    That means, in my eyes shotgun is no way SEI, IEI or even IEE. (And heck, probably didn't dualize/meet his dual at a closer distance. )

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    @shotgunfingers: did you already fill out tests? Have you tried this one, by any chance:

    https://www.aimtoknow.com/test_beta

    I think this is a decent test, because the questions aren't all that obvious as many other tests.
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    Quote Originally Posted by shotgunfingers View Post
    e_e well that sux. I have an incredibly hard time conforming and belonging.. and I have a bad tendency to just run my mouth, be outspoken and say it as I see it. This has been so since I was a kid. I still remember my mother constantly scolding me and regulating how I behaved & what I said, because I'd run my mouth and call my uncle and grandmother scum of the earth that they truly are.. to their face. I understand that blending in is probably a good idea, but I can't and my mother's insistence on me behaving "normally" only ended in me developing social anxiety.
    Are you of the type that excuses himself by saying: "But I'm only speaking the truth/facts here!"
    “I have never tried that before, so I think I should definitely be able to do that.” --- Pippi Longstocking

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    Quote Originally Posted by consentingadult View Post
    Are you of the type that excuses himself by saying: "But I'm only speaking the truth/facts here!"
    It depends on the context. Sometimes yeah, but how can someone's amorality warrant a response like "I'm only speaking truth!"? I thought back then and I still think that my parents swallow too much bullshit and are too nice for their own good. I'm the kind of person who despite seeming nice will call his own grandmother a sociopathic manipulative bitch, scum of the earth lower than a worm e_e make her freak out & cry and when she ten continues with the manipulative bullshit, tell her to go to hell... then proceed to avoid her, because ppl who aren't even self aware cannot be reasoned with and I'm just wasting my time and energy constantly being angered by her presence. I hate that old hag so damn much for what she does daily to my mother and father. I'd abandon her to rot tbh without a second thought. <-- that kind of stuff as well, idk, is this Fi? Its rare, but some ppl are definitely irredeemable trash regardless of their age or social standing.

    If I were my parents I would have told my grandmother long a go to shove her money up her ass and go die in a hole somewhere, where she won't bother me.

    I don't recommend getting on my bad side by being a shitty human being..

    Otherwise idk, I mean if I'm saying the truth I have evidence and can demonstrate it via logic and facts no? Do I even need to tell someone that its the truth/facts? Further, people don't really listen to the truth or facts, it just pisses them off more, so trying to convince anyone with that is pointless outside of maybe venting personal frustration.

    Sometimes I just like to piss ppl off tho for fun, in a more lighthearted way. A kind of impish amusement, to devil's advocate for fun and sport, but I don't really mean any harm by it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by shotgunfingers View Post
    It depends on the context. Sometimes yeah, but how can someone's amorality warrant a response like "I'm only speaking truth!"? I thought back then and I still think that my parents swallow too much bullshit and are too nice for their own good. I'm the kind of person who despite seeming nice will call his own grandmother a sociopathic manipulative bitch, scum of the earth lower than a worm e_e make her freak out & cry and when she ten continues with the manipulative bullshit, tell her to go to hell... then proceed to avoid her, because ppl who aren't even self aware cannot be reasoned with and I'm just wasting my time and energy constantly being angered by her presence. I hate that old hag so damn much for what she does daily to my mother and father. I'd abandon her to rot tbh without a second thought. <-- that kind of stuff as well, idk, is this Fi? Its rare, but some ppl are definitely irredeemable trash regardless of their age or social standing.

    If I were my parents I would have told my grandmother long a go to shove her money up her ass and go die in a hole somewhere, where she won't bother me.

    I don't recommend getting on my bad side by being a shitty human being..

    Otherwise idk, I mean if I'm saying the truth I have evidence and can demonstrate it via logic and facts no? Do I even need to tell someone that its the truth/facts? Further, people don't really listen to the truth or facts, it just pisses them off more, so trying to convince anyone with that is pointless outside of maybe venting personal frustration.

    Sometimes I just like to piss ppl off tho for fun, in a more lighthearted way. A kind of impish amusement, to devil's advocate for fun and sport, but I don't really mean any harm by it.
    This kindof sounds like ILE. Being "too honest", devils advocate etc.
    A true sense-perception certainly exists, but it always looks as though objects were not so much forcing their way into the subject in their own right as that the subject were seeing things quite differently, or saw quite other things than the rest of mankind. As a matter of fact, the subject perceives the same things as everybody else, only, he never stops at the purely objective effect, but concerns himself with the subjective perception released by the objective stimulus.
    (Jung on Si)


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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallmo View Post
    This kindof sounds like ILE. Being "too honest", devils advocate etc.
    Agreed. I'm leaning towards ILE for you now, @shotgunfingers. You talked about your mom trying to get you to fall in line, be quieter, nicer, not say what you were thinking, but that you simply couldn't help calling BS and saying what you thought. I think that's classic ILE. Pretty sure my sister is ILE and I remember this dynamic between her and my parents growing up pretty much constantly.

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    Here is the deal: Fi comes in different sizes, eight to be precise. All of them are about passing value judgments, but only one of them is Mobilizing Fi, which manifest as broadcasting these value judgments as loud as you can to the world, instead of keeping such judgments to yourself and work your way around the issues. As excessive use of the mobilizing function always includes violations of principles related to the PoLR function, in this case Fe, such use leads to the breakdown of a good or at least tolerable social atmosphere, and thus to a breakdown of relationships. Sometimes you have to choose: do I want to reap the benefits of relationships that are in many other respects outright shitty, or am I willing to separate myself from the group and stand alone?

    Your problem is that you, in your current state of mind, are not willing to put up with anyone's bullshit, yet still want to be part of social interaction, or otherwise you wouldn't have this social anxiety. To choice comes down to this: either you choose wholeheartedly to go through life alone as much as possible, so you do not step on anyone's toes and no one can step on yours, or your get yourself dualized by finding yourself a nice IEE woman. For this to happen, you need to leave your childhood, so obvious in your videos, behind.

    ...
    As a child, I thought I could
    live without pain without sorrow
    As a man I've found it's all caught up with me
    I'm asleep yet I'm so afraid
    ....

    Before the leaves have fallen
    Before we lock the doors
    There must be the third and last dance
    This one will last forever
    Metropolis watches and thoughtfully smiles
    She's taken you to your home

    It can only take place
    When the struggle between
    our children has ended
    Now the Miracle and the
    Sleeper know that the third is love
    Love is the dance of eternity

    From: Metropolis Part I - The Miracle and the Sleeper by Dream Theater


    ETA: I do not agree with the assesment of the behavior you described as typical for ILEs. With ILEs the typical problem is mobilizing Fe, e.g. acting as a clown or devil's advocate and thereby breaking the principles of Fi, which is their PoLR, making you look like a person without morals. It is a subtle but important difference. To the average onlooker, bad behaving xLIs lack tact, bad behaving xLEs lack decency.
    Last edited by consentingadult; 06-13-2020 at 08:14 PM.
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    I think Ti is pretty far fetched for the ego.

    It gives the viewpoint and then defends it. The theoretical debater or pusher. So it is not about the person. It acts as impersonal ruler or advisor. I see lots of personal stance in terms of putting emphasis on logical actions and it is pretty PoLRzing.
    Last edited by COVID 007; 06-13-2020 at 08:48 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by consentingadult View Post
    Here is the deal: Fi comes in different sizes, eight to be precise. All of them are about passing value judgments, but only one of them is Mobilizing Fi, which manifest as broadcasting these value judgments as loud as you can to the world, instead of keeping such judgments to yourself and work your way around the issues. As excessive use of the mobilizing function always includes violations of principles related to the PoLR function, in this case Fe, such use leads to the breakdown of a good or at least tolerable social atmosphere, and thus to a breakdown of relationships. Sometimes you have to choose: do I want to reap the benefits of relationships that are in many other respects outright shitty, or am I willing to separate myself from the group and stand alone?
    Shitty relationships aren't worth the "reward". My mother's reward for putting up with my grandmother was nearly a trip to a mental institution. I learned a lot from their ordeal tbh. There are plenty of good relationships to be had. Having boundaries is healthy. No money in the world nor misguided wish for parental approval is worth all that suffering and pain.

    Your problem is that you, in your current state of mind, are not willing to put up with anyone's bullshit, yet still want to be part of social interaction, or otherwise you wouldn't have this social anxiety. To choice comes down to this: either you choose wholeheartedly to go through life alone as much as possible, so you do not step on anyone's toes and no one can step on yours, or your get yourself dualized by finding yourself a nice IEE woman. For this to happen, you need to leave your childhood, so obvious in your videos, behind.
    I don't have social anxiety. What is this black or white bullshit? I don't get what you mean by leaving my childhood, plz explain.

    ...
    As a child, I thought I could
    live without pain without sorrow
    As a man I've found it's all caught up with me
    I'm asleep yet I'm so afraid
    ....

    Before the leaves have fallen
    Before we lock the doors
    There must be the third and last dance
    This one will last forever
    Metropolis watches and thoughtfully smiles
    She's taken you to your home

    It can only take place
    When the struggle between
    our children has ended
    Now the Miracle and the
    Sleeper know that the third is love
    Love is the dance of eternity

    From: Metropolis Part I - The Miracle and the Sleeper by Dream Theater
    e_e oh God, now poetry.. wtf does all this even mean? EDIT: oh its a band & this is a song. I prefer this:

    [Verse 1]
    When I was born, the seed was sown
    I will not obey, my life is my own
    Battle those, who wish to enslave me
    Expose the lies, that enrage me

    [Verse 2]
    I don't believe in heaven, I don't believe in hell
    Never joined the herd, could not adjust well
    Slave and master, it's not for me
    I chose my own path, set my self free

    [Chorus]
    I, I go my own way
    I swim against the stream
    Forever I will fight the powers that be

    I, I go my own way
    I swim against the stream
    Forever I will fight the powers that be
    The eagle flies alone

    [Verse 3]
    Reject the system, that dictates the norm
    This world is full of lies and deceit
    I have felt betrayal, cut so deep
    Suffered defeat, only to rise again

    [Chorus]
    I, I go my own way
    I swim against the stream
    Forever I will fight the powers that be

    I, I go my own way
    I swim against the stream
    Forever I will fight the powers that be
    The eagle flies alone

    Alone

    [Chorus]
    I, I go my own way
    I swim against the stream
    Forever I will fight the powers that be

    I, I go my own way
    I swim against the stream
    Forever I will fight the powers that be
    The eagle flies alone

    https://youtu.be/mjF1rmSV1dM

    ETA: I do not agree with the assesment of the behavior you described as typical for ILEs. With ILEs the typical problem is mobilizing Fe, e.g. acting as a clown or devil's advocate and thereby breaking the principles of Fi, which is their PoLR, making you look like a person without morals. It is a subtle but important difference. To the average onlooker, bad behaving xLIs lack tact, bad behaving xLEs lack decency.
    So I'm not an ILE. It doesn't matter what type I am as long as the match is accurate.

    Guys, what is he trying to say? Speak English damn you. Lmao I'm not even a sensor, are you daft? All this from someone who blocks ppl on a forum. Kinda hypocritical.
    Last edited by shotgunfingers; 06-13-2020 at 10:30 PM.

  32. #112
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    Those masculine IEI men I've seen are like Johnny Depp (Ni) , Billy Corgan (Fe) or Kurt Coban(Ni) and they and shotgun are not the same type imo. I actually have an IEI friend similar to Depp and Cobain and I don't think he is the same type as Shotgun.










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    Quote Originally Posted by Tommy View Post
    Those masculine IEI men I've seen are like Johnny Depp (Ni) , Billy Corgan (Fe) or Kurt Coban(Ni) and they and shotgun are not the same type imo. I actually have an IEI friend similar to Depp and Cobain and I don't think he is the same type as Shotgun.
    >) since we are talking about music, Arch Enemy's "WILL TO POWER" (the whole album) pretty much gets to the heart of my view of life. The entire album is just pure soul food, and not rose tinted glasses junk. I'm E6, so my outlook on life is pretty grim tbh, "grim determination & will to power". Stuff like:

    [Verse 1]
    I've lived in darkness
    Stood in the light
    Crawled through the shadows
    Between wrong and right

    [Pre-Chorus]
    One thing I know for sure
    This is a fight I must win

    [Verse 2]
    With wings of tin and feet of stone
    I crash against the ground below
    It's not the first time, won't be the last time
    Got to pick myself up, get on with the show

    [Pre-Chorus]
    One thing I know for sure
    This is a fight I must win

    [Chorus]
    I can feel the coming storm
    There's a demon I have to control
    One more fight I must win
    Fight the demon dwelling within

    [Verse 3]
    I'm not like I was before
    I'm something less, I'm something more (more, more, more)
    This life has been bittersweet
    Blackened heart stays on the beat

    [Pre-Chorus]
    One thing I know for sure
    This is a fight I must win

    [Chorus]
    I can feel the coming storm
    There's a demon I have to control
    One more fight I must win
    Fight the demon dwelling within

    [Bridge]
    Alone in my cloak of lead
    Choking on words of advice
    Heard all the answers
    Most of them lies

    [Chorus]
    I can feel the coming storm
    There's a demon I have to control
    One last fight I must win
    There's a demon dwelling within

    [Outro]
    This is a fight I must win (win, win, win)
    A fight I must win (win, win)
    This is a fight I must win (win, win, win)
    A fight I must win (win, win)
    This is a fight I must win (win, win)
    A fight I must win (win, win)
    This is a fight I must win (win, win)
    A fight I must win (win, win, win)

    Starts here: https://youtu.be/Cegigc3BxIw


    Last edited by shotgunfingers; 06-13-2020 at 11:19 PM.

  34. #114
    Jesus is the cruel sausage consentingadult's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shotgunfingers View Post
    Shitty relationships aren't worth the "reward". My mother's reward for putting up with my grandmother was nearly a trip to a mental institution. I learned a lot from their ordeal tbh. There are plenty of good relationships to be had. Having boundaries is healthy. No money in the world nor misguided wish for parental approval is worth all that suffering and pain.



    I don't have social anxiety. What is this black or white bullshit? I don't get what you mean by leaving my childhood, plz explain.



    e_e oh God, now poetry.. wtf does all this even mean? EDIT: oh its a band & this is a song. I prefer this:

    [Verse 1]
    When I was born, the seed was sown
    I will not obey, my life is my own
    Battle those, who wish to enslave me
    Expose the lies, that enrage me

    [Verse 2]
    I don't believe in heaven, I don't believe in hell
    Never joined the herd, could not adjust well
    Slave and master, it's not for me
    I chose my own path, set my self free

    [Chorus]
    I, I go my own way
    I swim against the stream
    Forever I will fight the powers that be

    I, I go my own way
    I swim against the stream
    Forever I will fight the powers that be
    The eagle flies alone

    [Verse 3]
    Reject the system, that dictates the norm
    This world is full of lies and deceit
    I have felt betrayal, cut so deep
    Suffered defeat, only to rise again

    [Chorus]
    I, I go my own way
    I swim against the stream
    Forever I will fight the powers that be

    I, I go my own way
    I swim against the stream
    Forever I will fight the powers that be
    The eagle flies alone

    Alone

    [Chorus]
    I, I go my own way
    I swim against the stream
    Forever I will fight the powers that be

    I, I go my own way
    I swim against the stream
    Forever I will fight the powers that be
    The eagle flies alone

    https://youtu.be/mjF1rmSV1dM



    So I'm not an ILE. It doesn't matter what type I am as long as the match is accurate.

    Guys, what is he trying to say? Speak English damn you. Lmao I'm not even a sensor, are you daft? All this from someone who blocks ppl on a forum. Kinda hypocritical.
    It hurts, doesn't it? Now you know how it feels when someone speaks their mind without any restrictions. Now you go buy yourself a bunch of sodas and milkshakes and soothe yourself behind your game console. Sweet dreams!
    “I have never tried that before, so I think I should definitely be able to do that.” --- Pippi Longstocking

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    Just to update here too, you are ILE final for me now.

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    Quote Originally Posted by consentingadult View Post
    It hurts, doesn't it? Now you know how it feels when someone speaks their mind without any restrictions. Now you go buy yourself a bunch of sodas and milkshakes and soothe yourself behind your game console. Sweet dreams!
    ^^ I don't own a game console or a steam account for that matter. I'm a very shitty casual gamer. but I see your point, yeah. thx! I needed /deserved that. I appreciate it, this is not sarcasm.

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    This ESE looking woman explains type 6... e_e I'm a stereotypical E6 leaning towards the CP side. Probably 6w7 either sx or sp. Maaaybe it adds to the "theme" of figuring out muh type: https://youtu.be/_RP8P97ynww

    Quote Originally Posted by sbbds View Post
    Just to update here too, you are ILE final for me now.
    https://youtu.be/BYvhhMjW32k
    Last edited by shotgunfingers; 06-14-2020 at 11:40 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by consentingadult View Post
    @shotgunfingers: did you already fill out tests? Have you tried this one, by any chance:

    https://www.aimtoknow.com/test_beta

    I think this is a decent test, because the questions aren't all that obvious as many other tests.
    Results were ILE, but its interesting e_e because I scored more ethical than logical, yet it interpreted it as ILE anyway. IF I consider that I'm REASONABLE and not at all DECICIVE... that quadra related dichotomy narrows it down to either ILE or IEE. <== its probably one of these. the distinction between these 2 can be resolved via PolR. I'd like to add that Role Se is very much how Se manifests in me, so I think it makes sense to be a Ne dom.

    This is the only way I manage to manifest Se:

    The individual tends to criticize himself for being less disciplined and organized than he should be, and typically tries to improve himself in this area, with very limited success. He is almost unable to make himself (or anyone else, for that matter) do things that they do not want to do, and is more likely to abandon a situation where people don't want to do anything rather than figure out how to mobilize or organize them properly. Discipline, organization, and mobilization can occur on their own, though, when there is a situation that demands it (as opposed to trying to generate it by oneself). However, he grows increasingly tired and emotionally worn out from having to put up a fight, and begins to look for a different, easier route rather than continue to confront the challenge directly.

    He resents any attempts to "push" him to do things and rejects the idea of people pressuring each other to do things. He himself avoids the use of pressure, preferring instead to entice and inspire. Only severe irritation can make him become forceful and demanding for brief periods of time until he calms down.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by shotgunfingers; 06-14-2020 at 11:11 PM.

  39. #119
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    In response to some of the above posts, sometimes Sol is right. When I first came here I also thought it wasn’t a big deal that he had contrary opinions and thought he may actually be very insightful on all of this. It didn’t take me long to realize I was incredibly wrong and not just due to my own typing at all. I could go on with the reasons why, but I am sure you will figure it out in time.

    And once again, I thought Ne valuing was very obvious in your video, which I think could indicate strong Ne dimensionality/Ne base. “People” say both intuitive irrationals and Ne base types often have a pretty hard time determining their type so good luck on your journey

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    Quote Originally Posted by thegreenfaerie View Post
    In response to some of the above posts, sometimes Sol is right. When I first came here I also thought it wasn’t a big deal that he had contrary opinions and thought he may actually be very insightful on all of this. It didn’t take me long to realize I was incredibly wrong and not just due to my own typing at all. I could go on with the reasons why, but I am sure you will figure it out in time.

    And once again, I thought Ne valuing was very obvious in your video, which I think could indicate strong Ne dimensionality/Ne base. “People” say both intuitive irrationals and Ne base types often have a pretty hard time determining their type so good luck on your journey
    Yeah. Its like this "but what IF" ping-pong jumping between ever expanding list of possibilities... and the next thing you know its 2 AM and you have to go to work at 7 AM.. but you absolutely want to get to the bottom of this / having too much fun.. so you don't feel like going to sleep.. but you know its gonna suck come morning.

    *drinks coffee like its water because he is tired af* .. e_e this coffee ain't working!
    Last edited by shotgunfingers; 06-15-2020 at 05:23 AM.

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