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Thread: Identifying ESIs???

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    ひきこもり Eli's Avatar
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    Default Identifying ESIs???

    I think this is the most difficult type for me to identify in real life for some reason. Could be because they're known for being quiet so they don't really stand out a lot most of the time, or because they're apparently more soft than the other se egos. All the video examples come off as very "completely normal person", there's not really any distinctive mannerisms or pattern I can detect from those. And Ne Polr is also really hard to put my finger on, it seems to manifest in anxiety and a blindness to possibilities?? but anxiety is a very typical trait for many different people of the socion. Good S also usually translates to good style, but there are also many ESIs that don't dress up a lot, especially males, so style is also kind of unhelpful too. Basically, their mental image in my head is very fuzzy.

    What trait/mannerism is completely distinct to ESI? Especially compared to EII and LSI, which I get stuck choosing between a lot. Anything that helps capture their essence or vibe would be helpful, thanks! kudos

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    scientist donkey BrightDemonSheep96's Avatar
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    One could say that while they are physically bit softer at first glance they are capable of imposing psychological terror. Tbh I don't really see LSI's that physical either [they just have a very clear leader quality which sometimes looks very stiff more than a threat] and maybe even softer than ESI's from my stand point because they are much more flexible in atmosphere.

    So I say they go by the guardian attitude regarding procedures and facts. If someone questions things having alternative validity they won't listen.
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    Iíd say ESI dress up more than any other type. ESEs are more put together but ESIs are more flashy. They have their bad days but their style is usually unique and very pleasant. I canít identify Ne PoLR so I mostly look out for lack of Ne when Iím down to EIIs and ESIs.

    Even ESI men dress up really well and in their best lines. For example of one of them has long legs they would wear long flared pants.

    ESIs are the normal people of the world not in a bad way. I havenít met the weird artist type but usually those are EIIs so. Yeah. I identify them by lack of bad traits present in other types except for the fact that they are really bad with appointments. Oh and their competitiveness comes up if you play board games with them but not all the time.

    If EIIs are Persian cats ESIs are Prussian blue lol.
    ترفرف كالأجنحة غير المنظورة حول رأسي

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    Quote Originally Posted by lilith View Post
    All the video examples come off as very "completely normal person"
    try bloggers types examples in my signature to notice the difference between types. to evaluate the difference between examples people (as those are not well known to you) use intuitive impressions from their nonverbal behavior mainly

    if you'll make a typing thread with your videointerview it will be a chance to help you with own type, as it can be not EII. with the correct type you'll can understand IR effects to use them in a typing too

    > What trait/mannerism is completely distinct to ESI?

    there is a pack if traits the match of which describes types: dichotomies, ego functions, strong/weak functions, values, model A some functions specifics, your IR effects, etc. the more of traits for some type and the lesser of traits for other types - the more you may be sure in that type. nothing else
    Types examples: video bloggers, actors

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    ひきこもり Eli's Avatar
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    @COVID 007
    I completely agree that LSIs are more easygoing than first meets the eyes. But I think they are still very "hard" in their own way, they are IJ after all. Although I think in a superficial, social sense stiffest would be is fe ignoring -> "softest" are fe creatives

    @Ibreen
    Thanks for your insight! Typing people by process of elimination or "lack of" is probably more helpful than I initially gave credit for heheh. Completing your train of thought, fe creative is scottish munchkin, se leading is some exotic illegal feral type, fe is a flamboyant maine coon, and fe polr is a disgruntled ragdoll.

    @Sol
    I would love that! But I'm a bit camera shy....... maybe if you can help me with getting a gud questionaire I'll give it my best shot. ^^

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    Quote Originally Posted by lilith View Post
    But I'm a bit camera shy....... maybe if you can help me with getting a gud questionaire I'll give it my best shot. ^^
    Video is important as gives your nonverbal behavior. Types have difference in this and people can be typed so. To type people which are not known good - by behavioral VI is the best way (I do not use physiognomical VI).
    Questionnaires texts are not enough, especially for those who knows types theory and so has more possiblities to filter the info.
    Without video there is a lack of important typing info. Video rises chances of correct typing to acceptable level. A typing by any methods may give assured or not assured opinion about a whole type or about some traits of it. Though, it's not so hard to record a 10 min video clip.

    You may correctly identify your type without external help too. If you type people IRL near you and get irrational IR impressions which fit good to IR theory (and behavior of people to common for types) - you may trust to your own type and typing skills. External help may point you on types which have more chances to be correct. Then you check the possible versions of your type by IR theory with people IRL - it's obligate step to be sure in own type and the initial level of skills to type other people.
    To study the types theory I recommend Filatova's and Jung's English books. Having this, then mb read other texts. Socionics is Jung and Augustinavichiute's ideas only, where some parts as Reinin's traits, accepting/productive functions, etc are too doubtful and are better not be used. The lesser core theory, the lesser reason is seen as basis for it - the lesser trust to it. Additional ideas of other authors I'd recommend do not use too - there is no good basis for them, as for Gulenko's subtypes.
    Types examples: video bloggers, actors

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    Serious Left-Static Negativist Eliza Thomason's Avatar
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    Both ESI women I know dress more classically, not necessarily interesting, but well-presented.
    Last edited by Eliza Thomason; 04-21-2020 at 12:54 AM. Reason: sp.
    "A man with a definite belief always appears bizarre, because he does not change with the world; he has climbed into a fixed star, and the earth whizzes below him like a zoetrope."
    ........ G. ........... K. ............... C ........ H ........ E ...... S ........ T ...... E ........ R ........ T ........ O ........ N ........


    "Having a clear faith, based on the creed of the Church, is often labeled today as fundamentalism... Whereas relativism, which is letting oneself be tossed and swept along
    by every wind of teaching, looks like the only
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    - Pope Benedict the XVI, "The Dictatorship of Relativism"

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    @lilith
    "holy shit this guys got more plot subversions than a modern day disney star wars movie on crack"

    to note, that talking style is closer to IEI than EII
    Types examples: video bloggers, actors

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    ひきこもり Eli's Avatar
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    @Sol

    haha! besides many people acting like actual animals online, a phenomenon which can be observed in any anonymous interweb chatroom, my real-life personality being more "subdued monotone overly-polite girly girl", AND me being a completely immature (redacted) child, does swearing and mentioning drugs casually invalidate the EII-ness? Is it like a paradox to the EII stereotype?
    Last edited by Eli; 04-21-2020 at 12:10 AM. Reason: edit out age

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    Quote Originally Posted by lilith View Post
    a phenomenon which can be observed in any anonymous interweb chatroom
    It's not a chat with running text. It's a forum with the possibilities to write by rules of "good behavior" not worser than talking or any normal texts.
    "Stereotypes" are common traits of something. The more your traits are closer to that common - the more chance you have it. It's how the typing is done - it identifies by stereotypes according to the theory - to which type you are closer the most and in what degree.
    Based on your different messages, your talking and thinking styles are closer to IEI than EII. The chance you have base Fi is not high. INFP is among most possible. I'd need your video to be more sure in your types traits and the concrete type.

    The examples of base Fi are @aster, @Memento Mori, mb @FreelancePoliceman. You may compare yourself with how they talked on the forum. By my bloggers examples you may check men of which types you find as more psychically comfortable. Those may appear more beta T than delta T.

    wbr
    I'd recommend to make a typing theme with the video as the chances of you have EII as you think are not large.
    Types examples: video bloggers, actors

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    Rebelondeck's Avatar
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    The queen in the UK seems to exhibit typical ESI behaviour. Now, public personas are often much different from the private ones so I'm uncertain of her actual type.......

    a.k.a. I/O

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rebelondeck View Post
    The queen in the UK seems to exhibit typical ESI behaviour. Now, public personas are often much different from the private ones so I'm uncertain of her actual type.......

    a.k.a. I/O
    A pity. Her husband seems to be a casual racist and a complete jackass, but I don't think he's LIE.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    A pity. Her husband seems to be a casual racist and a complete jackass, but I don't think he's LIE.
    His behaviour seems somewhat ESTp-like or perhaps he wants to portray himself as a devil-may-care adventurer, and the relationship with his wife makes him seem supervised. However, appearances can be deceiving because I'm sure that most of what everyone sees of them is scripted in some way.....

    a.k.a. I/O

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    Some miscellaneous observations which may or may not be useful towards understanding their overall vibe. One of their defining characteristics (as an Se ego) is a strong presence; ESI speaks somewhat gently but with a quiet resolve. Unlike their mirrors, they tend to be even-tempered and modest, also aren't as socially initiating or willing to promote themselves. Often they'll have a reputation for being hard workers while also devoting a lot of attention to their attachments (i.e. family, relationships, whatever). Tend to be very private and have a limited range of interests and social contacts, but what they do have, they really invest their time into. Ergo, they sacrifice breadth for depth. They share this specific trait in common with LSI, although LSI isn't interpersonally focused.

    I would argue a bubbly ESI is an oxymoron and a functionally inconsistent variable, as is one that tries to be playful and/or flippant regarding how they interface with others. I've also noticed that others tend to view them as having a stick up their ass (not me--those people were almost always Fe/Ti, especially Alpha). ESI is precisely the type to be called "too serious". And externally they can be stoic, although they don't struggle whatsoever with sincerely and openly communicating their feelings or forming attachments.

    Regarding Ne PoLR, ESI has an absolute aversion to, and rejection of, entertaining possibilities or arguments which lie outside their own point of view. ESI's ethical values are axiomatic and held in reverence. Same deal with LSI, but regarding whatever logical principles they've attached themselves to e.g. an ideology. Thus, don't try to introduce foreign PoVs (of an ethical nature). ESI will interpret it as an attack, as if you were siding against them or attempting to subvert goodness itself. For example, if an ESI believed it was a cardinal sin to betray a family member, then it'd be nigh unto impossible to persuade them otherwise (and they would certainly judge you for attempting to do so). EIIs are far more flexible, but nowhere near as single-minded.

    Speaking in terms of VI, I would ignore paying too much attention to their appearance and focus more on behavioral analysis. But I would also say they're among the least likely to do anything crazy with their appearance.

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    Allegra's Avatar
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    ^ I think that is spot on.

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    • Because of a sense of duty to loved ones (and devalued Si?) theyíll (unlike INFjs?) do things like one-sidedly decide theyíll be the ones in the family to sleep on the most uncomfortable bed, travel in the most unfavorable conditions, etc. They seem to be more willing to undergo physical discomfort for the sake of others.
    • Stoic people that need nothing from nobody/donít want to trouble anyone is the vibe I get from one when we spend time together. So after a hard dayís work you can offer food and drinks and there is a high chance they will refuse. If youíre not used to it you might think they donít want to come across as freeloaders. So (again, unlike INFjs?) they donít react well if caretaking behaviour is pushed on them. This can lead to hilarious situations.
    • They seem to always be on the go/get ready relatively faster than me, a Si ego. They will give the impression that they move faster, groom themselves less and still look as presentable.
    • They take their obligations seriously. If an ISFj woman is the oldest sister, she is likely to take on that role forever, for example. The ones who are always calling their families, who never forget a birthday, likely to be in touch with distant relatives the family has only met twice. More likely than the general population to have a religious belief (if older), maybe??
    • LSIs are more likely to bitch about the abilities of other people or deride others and ISFjs are more likely to comment on the moral of other people.
    • Really long stretch now but undereating/food can be a theme with them. One ISFj I know refused to eat when she was a child and suffered from iron deficiency, does not eat much at present and has developed gastrointestinal problems now that sheís older.

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    ひきこもり Eli's Avatar
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    Thanks for the answers. Ya'll have been super in responding. <3 After the bat plague is mostly over will attempt to put new knowledge to the test.

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    The quickest way for me as an IEI to identify them is the clear Fe ignoring, obvious to me as a Fe creative, and the little soft spot for Ni =)
    e.g. occasionally has philosophical revelations that they regard very dearly, even if the revelation is relatively surface-level, and they seem endearingly vulnerable with a metaphorical childish wide-eyed wonder as they explore the insight or meaning.
    (maybe this is just my perspective from the Ni base benefactee/activator standpoint)

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    In my personal experience (which can be wrong), characteristic traits are distate of strangers who might interfere in daily life, tendency towards isolation, violent reactions to the breaking of their emotional barriers or principles, fast to categorize anyone of "ethically undesirable" without much knowledge of cause or origin of the events, or for the slightest offences, contradictory opinions based around their own likings and dislikings and not proper reasoning, etc.

    If I'm wrong in the typing of this person, there's some things I'm completely sure about it; Ethical, introverted feeling type most probably, with strong extraverted sensing.
    Last edited by RBRS; 06-17-2021 at 08:45 AM.

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    Identifying types is always weird to me, because any description I could come up with would always be fairly subjective in how someone else interprets it. I often hear ESIs described as "harsh" in their expression, but what does that mean? What is "harsh" to one person might not seem so to another.

    There are always going to be people who fit behavioral descriptions of a type, others who do not...so behaviors are a pretty poor way to type imo.

    Sometimes people will come across as an "obvious" example of a type to me, but I cannot really explain it, it's a holistic impression.
    What good is a book that does not even transport us beyond all books?

    ~Nietzsche

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    Quote Originally Posted by Uncle Ave View Post
    I often hear ESIs described as "harsh" in their expression
    Read normal theory (Filatova, Jung) and then use it, but not baseless claims of random people.
    Base Fi types which value emotional comfort the most are "harsh" in what, for who and when? Not in emotional expressions compared to average level, at least. They are the least expected to talk rude.
    Types examples: video bloggers, actors

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    Humanist Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    Like I have said my mom is ILI and I'm surrounded by her activity relations ESI and they all try to meet up and support one another since they are all disabled. My mom's ESI friend is the sweetest woman ever, at least to me and my daughter. Externally they all like to keep a clean and neat home. lol and they all like natural remedies and treatments for like arthritis and nerve issues. They are constantly asking their kids to order such and such a cream that they "heard" works. The one ESI thinks I'm too skinny and frail and suggested that I try such and such a diet (details escape me sorry) to try to gain weight. I told her that I've tried many and they don't work. I have also told her that it's genetic but she tried pushing the idea anyway. I get so nervous going over to her home because she's so clean and neat. She puts out food on the table and I get nervous that I may drop something on those pristine couches and I maybe reprimanded for being such a slob even though I'm not. I just have a different attitude about clean. I think just about anything can be effectively cleaned and I don't worry about physical space or possessions. I have a tendency to rid myself of physical stuff like every so often I feel like I want to give everything away lol and I don't think ESI are that way. I think they just look put together, natural, and somewhat firm. It's so much the physical attitude around us that separates our two type. I couldn't care less what anyone does in my space as long as it's not against my ethics like doing drugs or being overly sexual (keep it in your own space please) otherwise messiness is ignored for the most part or escapes me.

    This part of this article is so true of my experience with ESI:

    "the resoluteness, firmness, and dedication with which she implement her directives into real life, because this trait is often masked by external conformity and ability to pick up on the mood of another person and his attitude towards what is occurring around him (Fi)."

    "https://www.the16types.info/vbulletin/content.php/36-ISFj-description-(Filatova)
    Last edited by Beautiful sky; 06-20-2021 at 02:35 PM.
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 2w1sw(1w9) helps others to live up to their own standards of what a good person is and is very behind the scenes in the process.
    Tritype 1-2-6 stacking sp/sx


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

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    scientist donkey BrightDemonSheep96's Avatar
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    MOTTO: NEVER TRUST IN REALITY
    Winning is for losers

     

    Sincerely yours,
    idiosyncratic type
    Life is a joke but do you have a life?

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    Quote Originally Posted by BrightDemonSheep96 View Post
    lmao. the hypocrisy is palpable.

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