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Thread: Do you want to have a family or a traditional life?

  1. #41
    Alonzo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baboooshka View Post
    Irlol.

    I think the same about children-- Having no family at all is better than having a broken one. Children are so easy to mess up yet so hard to fix afterwards.
    In the world I ran (Gattaca-lite), parents would have to undergo extensive training (that began in early education), pass a personality/IQ/EQ/aptitude test, and be pre-approved/pre-authorized in order to have children. If permits and licences attained via empirical and observational evaluations must be held in order to wield a vehicle and operate dangerous machinery, why less for handling the often asserted (though neglected) "precious" life of a child? The same disastrous result is possible when both unwieldy vehicles and humans are managed irresponsibly > innocents get hurt. In most parts of the developed world, those who babysit or even teach children must be extensively tested or vetted in order to procure the ability to intimately interact with them. And yet, ironically, the same standards aren't as thoroughly applied to those primarily responsible for rearing a child from infancy to adulthood. Doesn't make sense to me.

  2. #42
    Socionics is a spook ashlesha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alonzo View Post
    In the world I ran (Gattaca-lite), parents would have to undergo extensive training (that began in early education), pass a personality/IQ/EQ/aptitude test, and be pre-approved/pre-authorized in order to have children. If permits and licences attained via empirical and observational evaluations must be held in order to wield a vehicle and operate dangerous machinery, why less for handling the often asserted (though neglected) "precious" life of a child? The same disastrous result is possible when both unwieldy vehicles and humans are managed irresponsibly > innocents get hurt. In most parts of the developed world, those who babysit or even teach children must be extensively tested or vetted in order to procure the ability to intimately interact with them. And yet, ironically, the same standards aren't as thoroughly applied to those primarily responsible for rearing a child from infancy to adulthood. Doesn't make sense to me.
    How to pass would be common knowledge and people would cheat all the time. Also the follow-up of sterilizing people or forcing them to maintain birth control would be a big complicated issue.

    Maybe I have a knee jerk reaction to throw bolts in this because at 17 years old I was not exactly on the approved list lol but I love my son and he's a great kid.

    Some people definitely shouldn't be parents, true, but I wonder if they'd be adequately weeded out with testing (and if potentially good parents would be cut out). I feel like a libertarian, wtf.

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by ashlesha View Post
    How to pass would be common knowledge and people would cheat all the time. Also the follow-up of sterilizing people or forcing them to maintain birth control would be a big complicated issue.
    1.) Well few systems are perfect (read: optimal), even though that should be the ideal. There will likely always be chinks in the armor that the particularly nimble and crafty can exploit; it just must be effective enough to make a difference. There are plenty of people who don't deserve a driver's licence that still manage to get their hands on one. But imagine the potential damage if licences weren't required at all. At the end of the day, it's all about risk mitigation.

    2.) And sterilizations are perhaps a step farther than I'd go--which is why I said "Gattica-lite." lol Even though there could be a case made for those who continually push out children without the resources (physically, mentally, financially) to adequately provide for them. But then could potentially put a target on the back of certain (high risk) demographics and then it all becomes far more ethically problematic, even if icily practical and logical if maintaining balance for the "whole" is the aim.

    In this hypothetical scenario, I'd also think that before (if we possess the adequate technology) or after a child was born, there would be "how to" guidelines or some rubric tailored to the child's own cognitive/psychological needs. And as long as the parent has all of the required means to sufficiently support a child's development (in the best way for that particular child), then perhaps more people wouldn't be kept from rearing children. Sometimes it's not that the parents are inherently bad in so much as they don't know how to deal with their child as an individual (with different needs, makeup, etc...).

    Quote Originally Posted by ashlesha View Post
    Maybe I have a knee jerk reaction to throw bolts in this because at 17 years old I was not exactly on the approved list lol but I love my son and he's a great kid.
    I'd wager you're a great mom. I don't worry as much about people like you, so much as people like me. lol If a child doesn't come with an instruction manual, than count me out. I like (some) kids but prefer cats, fish, and Siri. lol However, not everyone has my degree of self awareness concerning my limitations. Some don't know what they are capable of and can do irreparable damage.

    Having said that, I don't think parents are supposed to be perfect because their parents weren't perfect and their parents before them; I honestly believe that most try the best they can but sometimes the best is not good enough. And so there must be check and balances put into place to ensure a certain standard is maintained > don't create people who become societal drains (murderers, con artists, do-nothings, leeches, etc...).

    Quote Originally Posted by ashlesha View Post
    Some people definitely shouldn't be parents, true, but I wonder if they'd be adequately weeded out with testing (and if potentially good parents would be cut out). I feel like a libertarian, wtf.
    If for every 1 "good" parent weeded out, 1,000 "bad" ones were, wouldn't that still be preferable?

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    I should add that I think the main reason to not have children nowadays is because IMO western society is slowly collapsing over time due to incompetence and shilling from politicians as well as greedy and power hungry wealthy business interests. As a result of this, each succeeding generation of the vast majority of the population no matter who you are or where you're from and unless you're a part of the ~1% will have increasingly worsening lives with lower financial independence and lower personal freedom. I also consider bad parenting to be merely a symptom of a poor society.

    A turbulent and weak society creates bad parents, which creates ill-equipped children who then go on to father and mother their own mal-adjusted children and the vicious cycle continues. The solution to ending this cycle is to fix society, but that will not happen any time in the near future. So the next best solution is to work on yourself if you want to be a parent; become more financially independent and more self aware of your own foibles as a human being that you developed because of your parents and your school environment so you can tamper or end the cycle at least for your own bloodline.
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    It's not something I ever envisioned doing, and I'm aware of many of the disadvantages, but, ultimately, I don't mind raising kids and having a family. I wouldn't want to lead a "traditional" life, though, and I'd much prefer that we had mind-expanding adventures rather than some dull suburban existence.

    That said, no wife of mine would ever have to work unless she wanted to — it's easy for me to do the 70 hour work week and whatever else it takes to be a good provider.

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    Wanting offspring to come of age in this ecosystem is psychotic. As long as the technology that maintains a baseline standard of living for humans has a deleterious effect on the environment they live in, expanding this population at any replacement rate at all for a long enough time will eventually make it inhospitable, and tech-optimism on this issue is foolish naivete. We cannot thrive at a middle-ages style standard of living without also inheriting the plagues of their age like disease and extreme scarcity, and even if we tried, we are far above the carrying capacity of the land for that to be viable anyway. Doing it by accident is forgivable though, it's how it happens most of the time. Still, the sentiment itself of intentionally wanting to make a life against its own will - it just rubs me with this weird megalomania of not being satisfied enough with controlling your own sphere, and preserving your own "mark" into the future even after you're long dead and can't experience it, ugh.
    Also I don't want my genes to survive. Not after they made me how I am.
    Quote Originally Posted by Singu View Post
    Shut the fuck up, dumbass.


  7. #47
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    But of course. I'm just not confident it's going to happen to me.
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    No, I don’t want to have a traditional life at all. I want to be a wanderer. I don’t need a two story house with a white picket fence - I want a decent little apartment and a kick ass roommate. My family will be a good group of friends. I’ll save a lot of money and stress living this way. Kids are great but I don’t have the patience or capability to raise any. Marriage is possible but I don’t know how likely that is. I want a watch the stars on the hood of a car on a cliff over the city at 2 am with a joint life.
    And I'm what you desire, like a siren in the night



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    Quote Originally Posted by fresh meat View Post
    No, I don’t want to have a traditional life at all. I want to be a wanderer. I don’t need a two story house with a white picket fence - I want a decent little apartment and a kick ass roommate. My family will be a good group of friends. I’ll save a lot of money and stress living this way. Kids are great but I don’t have the patience or capability to raise any. Marriage is possible but I don’t know how likely that is. I want a watch the stars on the hood of a car on a cliff over the city at 2 am with a joint life.

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    If you're not mating, then you're a loser at life in the only natural end that ultimately matters.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mfckrz View Post
    If you're not mating, then you're a loser at life in the only natural end that ultimately matters.
    WTF, you made babies? I am out of the loop.

    “My typology is . . . not in any sense to stick labels on people at first sight. It is not a physiognomy and not an anthropological system, but a critical psychology dealing with the organization and delimitation of psychic processes that can be shown to be typical.”​ —C.G. Jung

     



  12. #52
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    Love too breed like insects without bounds until we have the atmosphere of Venus.



    If life only reproduces because living things want to and might makes right, I'll not, because I don't want to, and might makes right. :^)
    Last edited by Grendel; 10-15-2019 at 06:47 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Singu View Post
    Shut the fuck up, dumbass.


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    Whether I want to or not, it’s less likely than not. Anything is still possible, but also, the choices that led me to this point probably reflect a preference for a different kind of life anyway.

    It’s important, though, that I find one way or another to perpetuate what I’ve learned and empower other lives rather than live my life only for myself.

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    Not type related.


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    It's not foreseeable until it happens.

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    I couldnt see myself ever getting married or having kids. Just doesnt align with my lifestyle, and I think marriage only serves as some kind of shackle on love that makes it less authentic. I dont see the point. Also having kids with so many global crisises and fucked up potential realities in the future just seems irresponsible to me. Final point, its boring and conventional

  17. #57

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    Quote Originally Posted by mfckrz View Post
    If you're not mating, then you're a loser at life in the only natural end that ultimately matters.
    I hope youre trolling cause that's the most braindead thing ive heard all day

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    Quote Originally Posted by NASS CODA View Post
    I hope youre trolling cause that's the most braindead thing ive heard all day
    By the looks of you, it's better that you didn't take my advice.

  19. #59
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    Yes I do want to have a family but as I get older I can appreciate the near impossiblity for me personally.

    As far as traditional life, I've kind of always had that, with pockets of untraditional throughout my life time.

    I always feel a lil sad about not having my own kids. Sometimes it feels more then a heart ache.

  20. #60

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    Quote Originally Posted by mfckrz View Post
    By the looks of you, it's better that you didn't take my advice.
    post your face edgelord, let's see it

  21. #61
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    No I don’t. I don’t want children and although I can see myself with a long-term mate, I am not sure if it would be forever. I don’t know, relationships haven’t tended to work out for me in the long-run.. I just... lose the feelings that got me there to begin with. You could say “haven’t found the right one” and all of that, but I don’t know... I kind of have a new vision of being by myself, in a house and having family I already have coming to visit. Maybe a pet or two or 3 Of different kinds (too many is gross to me living situation wise) a garden, doing arts and crafts (lol), reading, drinking tea, venturing into nature etc. I would also love to travel if I could ever afford it I was fortunate to have kid influence in my life already, a sister and nephew who I was around and even helped out with a lot... enough for me to know I love kids, but I don’t want any of my own, lol. If for some reason this changed, plenty of kids that need homes and I’m not obsessed with having a mini-me, spreading my seed or any of that shit
    "The seed of suffering in you may be strong, but don't wait until you have no more suffering before allowing yourself to be happy."

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    I could also see myself ending up getting involved in some bigger cause, through my travels, people I meet etc., I’m in my 30’s and just starting to get glimpses of the life I really want, though I’ve never really seen kids on the picture. I’ve dreamed of great romance, but not of having a great family. I already have one and I don’t need to birth more humans to make it
    "The seed of suffering in you may be strong, but don't wait until you have no more suffering before allowing yourself to be happy."

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  23. #63
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    I’ve been thinking about what I want more deep down and I do want to have kids (probably just one or two), and a successful career or at least just a stable career. I suppose that second part may not be traditional for a woman, but it represents a societally-friendly version of success still I guess. And I think any man would get tired of having me sitting on my ass at home all day long if I’m not that pretty. I would get tired of myself doing that all day long too.

  24. #64
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    Fuck tradition. You do you , as long as the kids have a nice loving family with both parties contributing. Maybe you could have a pretty man sitting at home with the kids ;p
    "The seed of suffering in you may be strong, but don't wait until you have no more suffering before allowing yourself to be happy."

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  25. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by bouncingoffclouds View Post
    Fuck tradition. You do you , as long as the kids have a nice loving family with both parties contributing. Maybe you could have a pretty man sitting at home with the kids ;p
    I would be okay with that except my cupcake would 1000% be being a slut on the side if he did. Only a menial job with little free time for him.

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