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Thread: Tips on Alpha-Gamma friendships?

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    zelonyr's Avatar
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    Default Tips on Alpha-Gamma friendships?

    I'm Alpha (LII) and true to the theory it's really hard for me to mesh well with Gamma types. Most of them are great initially but after a while the friendship would just be very hard to maintain. Any Gamma or Alpha here who wants to share how do you deal with it?

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    Uncle Ave's Avatar
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    I have the same problem in reverse.

    The question is though, why do you need to get along with them? Why not find more compatible people?


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    Adam Strange's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zelonyr View Post
    I'm Alpha (LII) and true to the theory it's really hard for me to mesh well with Gamma types. Most of them are great initially but after a while the friendship would just be very hard to maintain. Any Gamma or Alpha here who wants to share how do you deal with it?
    Sure, @zelonyr. (Ze loner? Lol.)

    I am LIE and my favorite sister is LII. I also work with a couple LII's and have a few of them as friends. We get along great as long as we confine our discussions to work-related matters and avoid talking about personal stuff and avoid trying to understand each other. As soon as a discussion goes into "reasons for doing things", then the gulf between us is readily apparent.

    Having said that, the LII-LIE pairing can be quite productive, because we approach everything from opposite perspectives and therefore any problem that we tackle tends to be solved.

    This practice of sticking to the facts and avoiding the motivations is helpful when dealing with anyone who doesn't share all of your functions. You should go into any interaction with the understanding that you might not be understood, but you might be able to cooperate.

    Incidentally, when things are going great between me and an Alpha, that's the time when I am most likely to share personal details or to joke around with them. Big, big mistake. People in the opposite quadra look like you and me, but inside, they are space aliens full of bugs and creepy stuff, and getting too close to them will have serious consequences for the both of you.
    -just joking. I love my sister. She's not a space alien. She can be pretty weird, though, sometimes.

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    cerise confite lilac tenebris's Avatar
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    Respect and a certain distance. Agreeing to disagree. Not get worked up over how the other does stuff and focus on how you do things. Listen but shut up if they tell you about their problems, your advices are unlikely to be received well.
    Don't hope for a meaningful intimate relationship with them.

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    What's the purpose of SEI? Tallmo's Avatar
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    Dont get too close. Dont meet too often. Lower your expectations. Take things as they are. Seek fellow Alphas instead.

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    Dalek Caan's Avatar
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    Unfortunately, it's not going to work out how you want. Alpha and Gamma have completely different values; what's important to one isn't important to the other. It leads to feelings of frustration and being misunderstood. The most you can hope for is a superficial relationship where you each don't take yourself very seriously; but that's not going to be very meaningful or fun either.

    It sucks, but it's pretty much the truth.
    Androgynous Robot Dreamer - Not really human, but good at pretending.

    Quote Originally Posted by Number 9 large View Post
    blame the merry quadras

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    a two horned unicorn renegade Nihilist 007's Avatar
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    Super-Ego: perfect for comfortable roasting. Well, you know what it means. Quite OK for short term.
    Contrary: hmmm... quite OK if you do not overstep to each other's private area and respect interests.

    Conflict: eh. Interest until you open your mouth for bit more lengthy stuff. After that: WTF is going on. Let's keep it distant.
    Quasi-identical: what is his/her problem because everything seems to be potentially OK and still stressed out.
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    What's the purpose of SEI? Tallmo's Avatar
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    Subtype can also make things easier. It's the Harmonizing sub who can smooth over incompatibilities. I know a H-LIE and I'd say he's a friend. We meet about every second year to catch up on what's happening in life.

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    Being LII, I've had many close relationships with ESIs and find these relationships very strong - and the easiest to start. I've been reasonably close friends with many ILI and LIE, but no SEE (most of whom have come across as shallow, flippant and or insincere although these are probably misperceptions); I could never imagine sharing accommodations with any ILI or SEE, and most LIE have underestimated me.....

    a.k.a. I/O

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    I get along very well with ILI, but the other three relationship pairs are sadly very uncomfortable.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tallmo View Post
    Dont get too close. Dont meet too often. Lower your expectations. Take things as they are. Seek fellow Alphas instead.
    this is a very good advice.

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    My experience is that I actually prefer relations with superego and conflicts to extinguishment/quasi-id. SEEs and ESIs are perfectly fine unless you start talking about anything seriously and inevitably disagree on something, at which point you feel like banging your head on a wall. My impression is that they don’t have much capability for nuance and so it’s difficult to make them understand anything or even really — care, I guess, since they just tune out and continue to state whatever they like if they don’t care to change their opinion . As for ILIs and LIEs though — they can make for interesting conversation, but their personalities tend to become off-putting. They seem as if they have a childish, selfish hedonist trapped inside them they struggle to restrain, and who will make itself known at certain times: when they look at a member of the opposite sex they’ll show this kind of repressed lust, for instance, and watching them actually interact with them is like watching a dog trying to steal his master’s steak. There’s a similar feeling watching them around any other sensory pleasure.
    But, after all, who knows, and who can say
    whence it all came, and how creation happened? The gods themselves are later than creation, so who knows truly whence it has arisen?


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    Adam Strange's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FreelancePoliceman View Post
    My experience is that I actually prefer relations with superego and conflicts to extinguishment/quasi-id. SEEs and ESIs are perfectly fine unless you start talking about anything seriously and inevitably disagree on something, at which point you feel like banging your head on a wall. My impression is that they don’t have much capability for nuance and so it’s difficult to make them understand anything or even really — care, I guess, since they just tune out and continue to state whatever they like if they don’t care to change their opinion . As for ILIs and LIEs though — they can make for interesting conversation, but their personalities tend to become off-putting. They seem as if they have a childish, selfish hedonist trapped inside them they struggle to restrain, and who will make itself known at certain times: when they look at a member of the opposite sex they’ll show this kind of repressed lust, for instance, and watching them actually interact with them is like watching a dog trying to steal his master’s steak. There’s a similar feeling watching them around any other sensory pleasure.
    Lol. “A dog around a steak.” That’s me around an ESI if she’s hot. Pretty accurate.

    *EDIT*
    This illustrates one of the beautiful things about LII's, from my perspective. They say things which are perfectly true and perfectly unexpected. Things which I would never have thought of.

    I wonder if all Extinguishment relations are like this?
    Last edited by Adam Strange; 07-11-2019 at 01:03 AM.

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    Quasi-identical can easily find and create shared interests, and are drawn to the same things. Contrary can have invigorating 1-on-1 interactions, do not tire of each other over long periods of time. Conflict partners will readily admire each other's capability in areas where they themselves are helpless. Superego will understand each other seamlessly, although their values and preferred elements are forever opposed, mutual fascination can result.

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    So, no details, eh?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Uncle Ave View Post
    I have the same problem in reverse.

    The question is though, why do you need to get along with them? Why not find more compatible people?
    @Uncle Ave because they are okay people. I enjoy their company. We have mutual interests, and for some who are very different from me they at least have helped me in some way. I tend to just leave people in the past but I just figured I would never learn to deal with relationships if I continue to leave them behind the moment I get disappointed at them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    I wonder if all Extinguishment relations are like this?
    Depends. When you encounter jealous ILI [Let's say there is an ILI who has difficulties with math and wants upmanship with rest of the world in gambling but is also very cautious and meets someone who likes to do stuff where he has weakness]. That is a pretty potent trigger to put their Fe into a test. Their internal balance flies out of handle.
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    What's the purpose of SEI? Tallmo's Avatar
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    Odd combinations happen. The question is can they last.

    I knew a LII & SEE friends. The LII is a guy I've known since childhood. He became best friends with the SEE when he was around 20 and very unbalanced and searching for his identity. (And I mean VERY unbalanced) They lived in the same student home for awhile. The LII was a student of medicine and the SEE a musician both classical and pop/rock. The LII was also very into music but not at the same high level as the SEE. I think they definitely complemented each other on a shallow level.

    Since then the LII has become more stable and grown up. They dont see each other anymore at all. The LII has told me that he doesnt want to meet the SEE although SEE sometimes suggests going for a beer. Instead the LII became friends with his ESE cousin. They have travelled together and they also have some investment business thing going on.

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    What's the purpose of SEI? Tallmo's Avatar
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    Odd combinations happen. The question is can they last.

    I knew a LII & SEE friends. The LII is a guy I've known since childhood. He became best friends with the SEE when he was around 20 and very unbalanced and searching for his identity. (And I mean VERY unbalanced) They lived in the same student home for awhile. The LII was a student of medicine and the SEE a musician both classical and pop/rock. The LII was also very into music but not at the same high level as the SEE. I think they definitely complemented each other on a shallow level.

    Since then the LII has become more stable and grown up. They dont see each other anymore at all. The LII has told me that he doesnt want to meet the SEE although SEE sometimes suggests going for a beer. Instead the LII became friends with his ESE cousin. They have travelled together and they also have some investment business thing going on.

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    Uncle Ave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zelonyr View Post
    @Uncle Ave because they are okay people. I enjoy their company. We have mutual interests, and for some who are very different from me they at least have helped me in some way. I tend to just leave people in the past but I just figured I would never learn to deal with relationships if I continue to leave them behind the moment I get disappointed at them.
    Then I would say it depends on the nature of the problem.

    What is an example of you getting disappointed in them?


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    zelonyr's Avatar
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    It's not exactly a bad thing, only if I know that they are like that the moment I get to know them. One person who I suspect is an SEE was quite fun to be around, seems very "all over the place" to me and is clearly driven by different things from me but it wasn't the problem. The problem is after a while I noticed that she keeps on disrupting the flow of conversations in a negative way just for her to be noticed by other people. This happens specially when she is in a bad mood and she proudly admits to it. I don't care if she does that, but it is very baffling to me that she never does that when we hang out one-on-one. When I talk to her personally everything is pleasant. I guess I am just not used to that attitude because I seem to be the same (but not necessarily a good) person to anyone I talk to.

    To most gamma types though conversations tend to be nice initially. (I would most likely notice the PoLR Fe on ILI but it would just see it as interesting thing about them.) There would just come a time wherein we wouldn't understand each other at all. At that point it's really hard to go back to what it was before because specially for ILI it gets awkward real fast and everything I say could be considered offensive. I cannot pinpoint what triggers it though.

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    Adam Strange's Avatar
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    @zelonyr, The SEE doesn't interrupt you when you two are one-on-one because she has your undivided attention.

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    zelonyr's Avatar
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    @Adam Strange Fuck, that wasn't obvious to me at all. Thanks for the enlightenment.

    She lets me lead the conversations most of the time though. I wonder why she doesn't want to do that when it comes to groups?

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