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Thread: The Rise of Far Left Extremism

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    Quote Originally Posted by Carolus View Post
    Sounds like a lot of compensation to me, creampuff. Remember when you accused K4m of trying to act tough online?
    And again, stop projecting on to me.
    Clearly you've taken one too many stumpy pale dicks to the skull--you are the one that first tried to puff up that padded bird chest to me, as if you haven't endured a lifetime of wedgies, stolen lunch money and a pervasive sense of inadequacy. lol The only thing I wish I could project is piss down your throat, you guttersnipe tramp.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alonzo View Post
    Clearly you've taken one too many stumpy pale dicks to the skull--you are the one that first tried to puff up that padded bird chest to me, as if you haven't endured a lifetime of wedgies, stolen lunch money and a pervasive sense of inadequacy. lol The only thing I wish I could project is piss down your throat, you guttersnipe tramp.
    lol, these posts tho. best content in awhile

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    Quote Originally Posted by Raver View Post
    Or you can't understand basic English when I already mentioned several times that ANTIFA are not the same as Neo-Nazis, but can be dangerous at the same time, both are possible. This isn't rocket science dude, your brain shouldn't be short circuiting like this.
    You've done nothing but pussy pop and back peddle all over this thread, and especially after it got too hot for you.

    Quote Originally Posted by Raver View Post
    It's clear that these people are the other side of the coin in extremism compared to far right extremists. They are basically the left-wing version of neo-nazis,
    That’s literally what the fuck you said and now you act as if you were misquoted once it became glaringly obvious to anyone reasonable enough to see beyond your clusterfuck of right wing trigger words that you were wading neck deep in logical fallacies (as you are wont to do).

    The problem is that you do this often–you’ll make the most rudimentary, blatantly obvious, uncritical, hyper reductionist observations and string them together with a fuck ton of low brow conjecture, buttressed by incomplete and/or inaccurate information. Your comments often read like Dave Rubin and Jordan Peterson had a chromosome depleted love child.

    Honestly, it seems to me that you enjoy presenting false equivalencies for the sake of appearing "fair and balanced" or neutral, a tactic which flies in the face of critical thinking and historical nuance, which you often lack.

    Here’s the thing > ANTIFA is not completely blameless--and no one here has argued that. Some of its members clearly have gone overboard with some of their tactics. But hyping and over-inflating the threat they pose paints a decentralized, relatively impotent (in the grand, hegemonic scheme of things) group with a broad and overly simple brush, and contributes to a disproportionate right-wing panic and hypocritical pearl clutching in the process. The fact of the matter is that the worst of ANTIFA's sins don't compare to that of the far right. There is no ANTIFA equivalent to the murder of Heather Hyer, the Charleston church shooting, or the attack on a Pittsburgh synagogue. ANTIFA has no relationship with the Democratic Party nor do its members really support the party; on the other hand, many far right activists are ardent Trump supporters, and at times seem to get tacit support from the White House (e.g., Charlottsville and the 'both sides' comment) and propagandist machines like Fox News. Placing a focus on ANTIFA unnecessarily distracts from the much greater problem of far-right extremism. By creating threads like this, you are part of the problem, not the solution. You want to stop ANTIFA? Then stop the right wing extremists that give them cause to exist.

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    Unbridled authoritarianism leads to nasty outcomes.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alonzo View Post
    Clearly you've taken one too many stumpy pale dicks to the skull--you are the one that first tried to puff up that padded bird chest to me, as if you haven't endured a lifetime of wedgies, stolen lunch money and a pervasive sense of inadequacy. lol The only thing I wish I could project is piss down your throat, you guttersnipe tramp.
    You consistently type like an apoplectic idiot and want to say that I'm the one with the sense of inadequacy. You think of yourself and want to be some schoolyard bully, so resort to vulgar low-hanging fruit.
    Yeah, I fired the first shot, because you were acting like a dumbass first and I'm not scared of meaningless online fights with insignificant nobodies who pretend to be macho thugs online. I've never been bullied or abused in my life but clearly you have, since you've developed the mindset and IQ of a state-of-nature primitive. You get that reference?

    Quote Originally Posted by mfckrz View Post
    lol, these posts tho. best content in awhile
    Don't choke on his chode, sycophantic faggot.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Carolus View Post
    Don't choke on his chode, sycophantic faggot.
    Don't get mad online, or I'm gonna be laughing at your posts too

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    Quote Originally Posted by Carolus View Post
    You consistently type like an apoplectic idiot and want to say that I'm the one with the sense of inadequacy. You think of yourself and want to be some schoolyard bully, so resort to vulgar low-hanging fruit.
    Yeah, I fired the first shot, because you were acting like a dumbass first and I'm not scared of meaningless online fights with insignificant nobodies who pretend to be macho thugs online. I've never been bullied or abused in my life but clearly you have, since you've developed the mindset and IQ of a state-of-nature primitive. You get that reference?
    lol You may have been considered "bright" in whatever backwater, pollutant adjacent Appalachian village that spawned you but among those whose blood isn't 45% red Mountain Dew, you reek of unabated identity disturbance, the soft bigotry of low expectations, and first-degree incest.

    You could watch 10 minute youtube videos on Rousseau until you're blue in the face but you'd still be nothing but a hand-me-down communal cum dump for the dimwitted, toothless, politically abandoned and socially aggrieved. And that's the rub > Bubba, Uncle Rufus and kin don't give a fuck about your "sissy" "references"; all they care about is that corroded, maxed out, compacted garbage disposal unit you call a "boypussy." lol

    Drink wet cement and gargle, bitch.
    Last edited by Alonzo; 07-11-2019 at 03:04 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mfckrz View Post
    All freedom extends from property.
    Depends on how you define freedom.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alonzo View Post
    lol You may have been considered "bright" in whatever backwater, pollutant adjacent Appalachian village that spawned you but among those blood isn't 45% red Mountain Dew, you reek of unabated identity disturbance, the soft bigotry of low expectations, and first-degree incest.

    You could watch 10 minute youtube videos on Rousseau until you're blue in the face but you'd still be nothing but a hand-me-down communal cum dump for the dimwitted, toothless, politically abandoned and socially aggrieved. And that's the rub > Bubba, Uncle Rufus and kin don't give a fuck about your "sissy" "references"; all they care about is that corroded, maxed out, compacted garbage disposal unit you call a "boypussy." lol

    Drink wet cement and gargle, bitch.
    There's someone who did it better.

    Hannibal Lecter: You're so ambitious, aren't you? You know what you look like to me, with your good bag and your cheap shoes? You look like a rube. A well-scrubbed, hustling rube, with a little taste. Good nutrition has given you some length of bone, but you're not more than one generation from poor white trash, are you, Agent Starling?

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    from someone concerned about online hate, that's a lot of delusional hypocrisy

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    Why are the vast majority of IEEs around here so remedial in their understanding of...everything?

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    I'm as much an inbred Appalachian bigot as William Faulkner or Robert Penn Warren, I suppose (nice way to stick up for the poor and downtrodden btw). All of your posts confuse me more than anything, nothing but nonsense pulled out of your pathological imaginings.
    This is the last post I'll make in this thread. This is stupid.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Carolus View Post
    I'm as much an inbred Appalachian bigot as William Faulkner or Robert Penn Warren, I suppose (nice way to stick up for the poor and downtrodden btw). All of your posts confuse me more than anything, nothing but nonsense pulled out of your pathological imaginings.
    This is the last post I'll make in this thread. This is stupid.
    lol Talk about deluded...

    1.) Ho, you are not Faulkner. He was a prolific, widely acclaimed talent; you are not. Or, at the very least, any talent you may possess is not readily discernible, save for your ability to graze dick with your teeth.

    2.) As a EIE enneagram 4 (which is highly unlikely and if actually so, would certainly speak to your evident sub par "health"), "pathological imaginings" are what define you. More blatant projection. Tsk.

    3.) The "poor and downtrodden," especially anywhere containing the likes of you, already receive an unearned, undeserved and disproportionate amount of my largesse and good will, even as they foolishly empower people that seek their disenfranchisement and show disdain towards those that pose no actual threat. That being the case, I'm sure they wouldn't mind "taking one for the team" in my disembowelment of one of their trifling, equally problematic and hypocritical "native sons."

    "In the pursuit of wrongdoing, one steps away from God." lol

    4.) Farewell, bitch.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Singu View Post
    Yeah because you've basically backpedaled after me and some other people have pointed out that they're not the same lol.

    Your entire OP was based around the premise that "left-wing extremists are the left wing version of Neo-Nazis".

    Then you complain that "antifa are given a free pass because of left-wing brainwashing and media conspiracy!". But the real reason is that no one gives a shit when they have some fisticuffs with some random right-wingers.
    The idea that someone can change their mind during a thread is revolutionary, I know. But that is all you have so you keep beating the same point home like a broken record.

    Quote Originally Posted by Alonzo View Post
    You've done nothing but pussy pop and back peddle all over this thread, and especially after it got too hot for you.


    That’s literally what the fuck you said and now you act as if you were misquoted once it became glaringly obvious to anyone reasonable enough to see beyond your clusterfuck of right wing trigger words that you were wading neck deep in logical fallacies (as you are wont to do).

    The problem is that you do this often–you’ll make the most rudimentary, blatantly obvious, uncritical, hyper reductionist observations and string them together with a fuck ton of low brow conjecture, buttressed by incomplete and/or inaccurate information. Your comments often read like Dave Rubin and Jordan Peterson had a chromosome depleted love child.

    Honestly, it seems to me that you enjoy presenting false equivalencies for the sake of appearing "fair and balanced" or neutral, a tactic which flies in the face of critical thinking and historical nuance, which you often lack.

    Here’s the thing > ANTIFA is not completely blameless--and no one here has argued that. Some of its members clearly have gone overboard with some of their tactics. But hyping and over-inflating the threat they pose paints a decentralized, relatively impotent (in the grand, hegemonic scheme of things) group with a broad and overly simple brush, and contributes to a disproportionate right-wing panic and hypocritical pearl clutching in the process. The fact of the matter is that the worst of ANTIFA's sins don't compare to that of the far right. There is no ANTIFA equivalent to the murder of Heather Hyer, the Charleston church shooting, or the attack on a Pittsburgh synagogue. ANTIFA has no relationship with the Democratic Party nor do its members really support the party; on the other hand, many far right activists are ardent Trump supporters, and at times seem to get tacit support from the White House (e.g., Charlottsville and the 'both sides' comment) and propagandist machines like Fox News. Placing a focus on ANTIFA unnecessarily distracts from the much greater problem of far-right extremism. By creating threads like this, you are part of the problem, not the solution. You want to stop ANTIFA? Then stop the right wing extremists that give them cause to exist.
    Like I told Singu, you two keep hammering the same point because that is all you have. Besides being less harmful and not being Neo-Nazis, ANTIFA are basically indefensible. Like Singu, you two are just mad that I specifically singled out far leftists like you guys and separated you two from the rest of the sane leftists to the entire forum. I don't regret it at all, now everyone can know who the problem is and who isn't.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raver View Post
    The idea that someone can change their mind during a thread is revolutionary, I know. But that is all you have so you keep beating the same point home like a broken record.

    Like I told Singu, you two keep hammering the same point because that is all you have. Besides being less harmful and not being Neo-Nazis, ANTIFA are basically indefensible. Like Singu, you two are just mad that I specifically singled out far leftists like you guys and separated you two from the rest of the sane leftists to the entire forum. I don't regret it at all, now everyone can know who the problem is and who isn't.
    Too bad most people share my views and most people don't give a shit about whatever antifa does and don't think that they're a huge threat to society.

    Look, what you've been saying is mostly typical imagined right-wing hysteria, such as:

    1) Sweden is being swamped by Muslims, and pretty soon they will become a Muslim country if immigration is uncontrolled.

    2) Antifa are the biggest threat to society since... well, whatever.

    3) There is left-wing and media conspiracy to brainwash the entire nation, and things like multi-culturism are destroying Western culture. The fact that I can't say mean things on YouTube or Twitter is an obvious left-wing suppression and authoritarianism, those bastards!

    We know where you're getting your sources from, because they're all typical right-wing hysteria that doesn't actually exist or is a huge problem in reality.

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    Yes, far leftists are everywhere, making America and the rest of the developed world into a shithole with their idiotic opinions. That's the ground on which Antifa can be considered just as bad as neo-Nazis without being exactly equivalent in every minor detail. The only way to find anyone who doesn't act autistic and retarded in America is to hang out with poor or uneducated people, and that has another set of problems. I am organizing to help the freshmen at the local university avoid becoming indoctrinated by communazi bureaucrats since I remember very well that freshmen don't typically come in like that unless they're weirdos who have been reading too much Tumblr and Reddit. I remember times of relative innocence before college and I'm glad I have the skills and knowledge to survive intact. It's actually incredibly easy to take down the bright state but no one who hasn't heard my observations even knows the depth and breadth of the problem since all the actually-intellectual students without exception (except for me) are too busy having the "four best years of their life" whining about how they're being metaphorically raped by Beethoven (you do you, I guess,) and the non-intellectual ones have no idealistic expectations like youth is supposed to. This communist country can kiss my ass.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alonzo View Post
    Why are the vast majority of IEEs around here so remedial in their understanding of...everything?
    Is there anything wrong with that though? The alternative is just to argue and preach and never change mind, which seems like a complete waste of time.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Number 9 large View Post
    blame the merry quadras

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    Quote Originally Posted by coeruleum View Post
    Yes, far leftists are everywhere, making America and the rest of the developed world into a shithole with their idiotic opinions. That's the ground on which Antifa can be considered just as bad as neo-Nazis without being exactly equivalent in every minor detail.
    Antifa don't really have any ideologies, doctrines or opinions, they just attack far-right and racial supremacists, etc. They're a kind of anarchists.

    If you want to know what's really making America and the rest of the world into a shithole, then it's neoliberalism and neoconservatism. Neoliberalism has turned into an economic doctrine of "blaming the victim", where it turns around and say that the economic theory is sound, but the problem is you, because you didn't work hard enough or you're just playing the victim. Well, look where that has gotten us other than making everybody equally poor.

    As for neoconservatism, well we know America's insane militarism and their militaristic doctrine of "Full-spectrum dominance" has actually turned many countries into an actual shithole, and they're the entire reason why there are so many refugees and immigrants that the rights complain about.

    But of course, blaming the left is much easier and much safer...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Singu View Post
    Antifa don't really have any ideologies, doctrines or opinions, they just attack far-right and racial supremacists, etc. They're a kind of anarchists.

    If you want to know what's really making America and the rest of the world into a shithole, then it's neoliberalism and neoconservatism. Neoliberalism has turned into an economic doctrine of "blaming the victim", where it turns around and say that the economic theory is sound, but the problem is you, because you didn't work hard enough or you're just playing the victim. Well, look where that has gotten us other than making everybody equally poor.

    As for neoconservatism, well we know America's insane militarism and their militaristic doctrine of "Full-spectrum dominance" has actually turned many countries into an actual shithole, and they're the entire reason why there are so many refugees and immigrants that the rights complain about.
    I agree that neoconservatism is bad but neoconservatism is the flipside to American's covert socialism in universities. Do you think all the neocons are backwards hicks? They're Ivy League educated Presidents who raid countries with major cultural achievements not for their resources but for their money itself. If we wanted oil, it'd be easier to raid South America or peacefully annex Canada than it'd be to wage a war on Middle Eastern countries where the economic value of the oil is significantly less than the value lost waging the war. Middle Eastern countries can make a lot of money with the same amount of oil as significantly less wealthy countries because they're older countries with gold-embellished mosques and long poetry traditions and, until recently, wine production (in Persia) as well as mathematics and sciences (al-gebra, al-chemie, etc.) They're not rich just from having resources. The cost of living in the desert would kind of offset that.

    Neoliberalism is a half-truth. I still believe that there is order in the world and that it isn't a bunch of chaos and randomness so yes, I am going to tell people to not play the victim card, but at the same time I don't expect everyone to do everything for themselves. If your house is on fire, the fire department will put it out, not you yourself. If you're drowning, the lifeguard will get you out. Those measures are put in place exactly because those are expected risks. The world being absolute chaos with there being nothing anyone can do to influence their destiny or their lives is not an expected risk of any sort, just an excuse for paternalistic tyranny.

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    And yes, I'm saying that the US government gets most of its money directly from making other countries poor by tearing them up with wars without producing anything of value. The US is in trillions of dollars of debt primarily due to funding its military. How is that a good investment at all? Making other countries poor and war-torn destroys almost all the cultural capital they had so people will buy products from the US instead. Almost all the US's products are cultural even if statistics try to minimize that. Yes, Coca-Cola is fizzy sugar water, but the value of Coca-Cola is what it stands for, the image, etc. and not the mere fact that it's fizzy sugar water. You don't need fizzy sugar water to survive and there are other brands if you just want it. The US is losing more money than it makes this way since culture isn't a zero-sum game but you can't expect the idiots who get Ivy League educations to know this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Singu View Post
    Too bad most people share my views and most people don't give a shit about whatever antifa does and don't think that they're a huge threat to society.

    Look, what you've been saying is mostly typical imagined right-wing hysteria, such as:

    1) Sweden is being swamped by Muslims, and pretty soon they will become a Muslim country if immigration is uncontrolled.

    2) Antifa are the biggest threat to society since... well, whatever.

    3) There is left-wing and media conspiracy to brainwash the entire nation, and things like multi-culturism are destroying Western culture. The fact that I can't say mean things on YouTube or Twitter is an obvious left-wing suppression and authoritarianism, those bastards!

    We know where you're getting your sources from, because they're all typical right-wing hysteria that doesn't actually exist or is a huge problem in reality.
    My sources are a hybrid of left wing and right wing sources. Don't let my stance on immigration fool you, I have several leftist beliefs. The problem isn't the left wing in general, most left wingers are fine. Even a far left economic liberal like Bernie Sanders is fine as he is anti-establishment to the core and poses a threat to corporate interests. The issue is specifically far left identity politics that both far left idenitarians like ANTIFA and center left neoliberal corporatists use as well.

    Quote Originally Posted by Singu View Post
    Antifa don't really have any ideologies, doctrines or opinions, they just attack far-right and racial supremacists, etc. They're a kind of anarchists.

    If you want to know what's really making America and the rest of the world into a shithole, then it's neoliberalism and neoconservatism. Neoliberalism has turned into an economic doctrine of "blaming the victim", where it turns around and say that the economic theory is sound, but the problem is you, because you didn't work hard enough or you're just playing the victim. Well, look where that has gotten us other than making everybody equally poor.

    As for neoconservatism, well we know America's insane militarism and their militaristic doctrine of "Full-spectrum dominance" has actually turned many countries into an actual shithole, and they're the entire reason why there are so many refugees and immigrants that the rights complain about.

    But of course, blaming the left is much easier and much safer...
    Finally, we can reach common ground on something. Neoliberalism and neoconservatism are major issues because they both support bad status quo policies. Neoliberalism with their inability to want to enact economic social policies and neoconservatism for economic policies that favor corporations and the rich and being warhawks. Neoliberalism and ANTIFA can both be issues in the same time by the way, you don't have to pick one or the other.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Singu View Post

    But of course, blaming the left is much easier and much safer...
    Is it? I guess it depends upon who's in power, and your entourage (where ostracism is concerned).


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    Quote Originally Posted by Carolus View Post
    I'm as much an inbred Appalachian bigot as William Faulkner or Robert Penn Warren, I suppose (nice way to stick up for the poor and downtrodden btw). All of your posts confuse me more than anything, nothing but nonsense pulled out of your pathological imaginings.
    This is the last post I'll make in this thread. This is stupid.
    Quote Originally Posted by Alonzo View Post
    lol Talk about deluded...

    1.) Ho, you are not Faulkner. He was a prolific, widely acclaimed talent; you are not. Or, at the very least, any talent you may possess is not readily discernible, save for your ability to graze dick with your teeth.

    2.) As a EIE enneagram 4 (which is highly unlikely and if actually so, would certainly speak to your evident sub par "health"), "pathological imaginings" are what define you. More blatant projection. Tsk.

    3.) The "poor and downtrodden," especially anywhere containing the likes of you, already receive an unearned, undeserved and disproportionate amount of my largesse and good will, even as they foolishly empower people that seek their disenfranchisement and show disdain towards those that pose no actual threat. That being the case, I'm sure they wouldn't mind "taking one for the team" in my disembowelment of one of their trifling, equally problematic and hypocritical "native sons."

    "In the pursuit of wrongdoing, one steps away from God." lol

    4.) Farewell, bitch.
    Tbh I can't see why both of you had to step down into ad hominem arguments while talking about this kind of stuff. Are both of you really so uninformed that you can't come up with anything to say about the topic by itself?

  24. #104
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    The Far Right is more extreme.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Raver View Post
    My sources are a hybrid of left wing and right wing sources. Don't let my stance on immigration fool you, I have several leftist beliefs. The problem isn't the left wing in general, most left wingers are fine. Even a far left economic liberal like Bernie Sanders is fine as he is anti-establishment to the core and poses a threat to corporate interests. The issue is specifically far left identity politics that both far left idenitarians like ANTIFA and center left neoliberal corporatists use as well.
    More evidence that you don't possess as much as in-depth knowledge and nuanced understanding of these topics as you claim (in so much as you frequently speak on them, often invoking some buzzword that you relentlessly beat over the head); everything you say sounds like it's been regurgitated from the most partisan, right wing hacks. First off, when conservative and moderate commentators talk about "identity politics," they usually mean espousing ideas and policies that appeal specifically to women, minorities, and LGBTQ people, in other words, a "multi-tribalism" or multi-tribal coalition of sorts; but in contrast, the right has long peddled in a form of mono-tribalism (centered on white, straight, Christian men), and as of recent (with the rise of Trump), a particularly ethnonationalist brand of mono-tribalism rooted in white identified grievance politics and culture wars. Anyone who has watched Fox News for a few minutes can cop to this.

    Trump's "us against them” brand of demagoguery (and his focus on white ethnocentrism, anti-immigrant attitudes, racial resentment, fear of Muslims, and racial and ethnic intolerance) resonates in an American political environment that has long been centered on social groups and has grown even more since the Obama era. Appeals to racial and ethnic anxieties have often succeeded in activating support for racially conservative politicians. There has been research conducted that shows that white identity more strongly affects opinions when whites perceive themselves as under threat. This foreshadows a rising white identity politics as the United States becomes a majority-minority nation. The white supremacists marching on Charlottesville were only a small segment of a much larger population for whom the politics of white identity has deep resonance and meaning. The vast majority of white Americans who feel threatened by the country’s growing racial and ethnic diversity are not members of the KKK or neo-Nazis. They are much greater in number, and far more mainstream, which is why a fair amount of them were ripe for the picking when Trump came along, propped up and backed up by Fox News, the alt-right, intellectual dark web, etc... that have crafted a decidedly right wing, white oriented identity politic centered around resistance and opposition to actual and/or perceived left wing identity politics. Stop disingenuously focusing on the left wing as if they are the sole perpetrators of centering one's identity.

    One of my chief issues with your "takes" and opinions is that they lack what I deem to be an intellectual honesty/rigor because they conveniently leave out deeper contexts, connections, perspectives, and data points that matter in these types of discussions. It just makes you look like an uninformed, lopsided hack. I'm not trying to be mean, but in a debate, that's some frustrating shit. And as a matter of public dialogue, I see your brand of cherry picking as dangerous.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aramas View Post
    Tbh I can't see why both of you had to step down into ad hominem arguments while talking about this kind of stuff. Are both of you really so uninformed that you can't come up with anything to say about the topic by itself?
    For one, he took a shot at me and being someone I don't particularly care for, I retaliated--it's as simple as that. Furthermore, I don't necessarily see the usage of ad hominem arguments as a "step down"--I can both insult and make whatever argument I choose to at the same time. I don't know why people act as if that's such a difficult thing to do. In an e-brawl, I'm liable to say all kinds of untoward shit for the sake of the battle > 1D Fi and 2D Fe. I understand that others might find it difficult to say the types of things I do, but that's what makes us different. For those who deal with me in a respectful manner, I usually return that, easily. For those who don't, they get what they get.

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    lies : )

    hypocritical delusional shit confirmed

    (and congratulations for the fine art of insulting strangers online!)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alonzo View Post
    More evidence that you don't possess as much as in-depth knowledge and nuanced understanding of these topics as you claim (in so much as you frequently speak on them, often invoking some buzzword that you relentlessly beat over the head); everything you say sounds like it's been regurgitated from the most partisan, right wing hacks. First off, when conservative and moderate commentators talk about "identity politics," they usually mean espousing ideas and policies that appeal specifically to women, minorities, and LGBTQ people, in other words, a "multi-tribalism" or multi-tribal coalition of sorts; but in contrast, the right has long peddled in a form of mono-tribalism (centered on white, straight, Christian men), and as of recent (with the rise of Trump), a particularly ethnonationalist brand of mono-tribalism rooted in white identified grievance politics and culture wars. Anyone who has watched Fox News for a few minutes can cop to this.

    Trump's "us against them” brand of demagoguery (and his focus on white ethnocentrism, anti-immigrant attitudes, racial resentment, fear of Muslims, and racial and ethnic intolerance) resonates in an American political environment that has long been centered on social groups and has grown even more since the Obama era. Appeals to racial and ethnic anxieties have often succeeded in activating support for racially conservative politicians. There has been research conducted that shows that white identity more strongly affects opinions when whites perceive themselves as under threat. This foreshadows a rising white identity politics as the United States becomes a majority-minority nation. The white supremacists marching on Charlottesville were only a small segment of a much larger population for whom the politics of white identity has deep resonance and meaning. The vast majority of white Americans who feel threatened by the country’s growing racial and ethnic diversity are not members of the KKK or neo-Nazis. They are much greater in number, and far more mainstream, which is why a fair amount of them were ripe for the picking when Trump came along, propped up and backed up by Fox News, the alt-right, intellectual dark web, etc... that have crafted a decidedly right wing, white oriented identity politic centered around resistance and opposition to actual and/or perceived left wing identity politics. Stop disingenuously focusing on the left wing as if they are the sole perpetrators of centering one's identity.

    One of my chief issues with your "takes" and opinions is that they lack what I deem to be an intellectual honesty/rigor because they conveniently leave out deeper contexts, connections, perspectives, and data points that matter in these types of discussions. It just makes you look like an uninformed, lopsided hack. I'm not trying to be mean, but in a debate, that's some frustrating shit. And as a matter of public dialogue, I see your brand of cherry picking as dangerous.
    I don't really consider myself super knowledgeable about politics or an expert on it, but I can still make conclusions based on my observations and what I do know. I am well aware that the far right are not innocent and a part of the problem like the far left. The reason why I bring up the far left is because they are often ignored and downplayed by the media and many leftists. I know the far right extremists are worse in damage and involved in identity politics too, but why should that excuse the far left extremism? Just seems like a weird double standard. I brought up the far left extremism specifically because I wanted to bring it up as an issue.

    I am not expecting you or anyone else on the left to say that the far left are equivalent to neo-nazis (a point I retracted several times in this thread), but rather that the far left are a part of the problem. My views tend to vary politically for each issue, which is why I may appear dishonest when it is the exact opposite. If we can't admit that far left extremists, far right extremists, neoliberal corporatists and neoconservative corporatists are all a part of the problem then we will never make any progress in solving the real issue because we are too busy fighting each other.

    IMO, the real problem in the US is the corporate oligarchy, the MIC and the mass media as their weapon of propaganda that dominates the country while neoliberal and neoconservative corporate politicians seek to protect it. Far left extremists and far right extremists fighting each other over identity politics is a waste of time and energy and those on the top are counting on it. Once you zoom out and look at the big picture rather than obsessing over the fine details, it just looks like a sideshow or a game comprised of smoke and mirrors. George Carlin put it best here:

    “We cannot change the cards we are dealt, just how we play the hand.” Randy Pausch

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    I feel like this whole debate over Antifa is sort of emotionally overcharged. They are symptom, not a cause. The cause is corporations and government shoving their soulless neoliberal agenda down everyone's throats which is where most of the attention and outrage should be targeted, not on some deranged foot soldiers burning trash cans or hitting old people.

    The truth is that throughout history, the vast majority of people have been lemmings who will conform to whatever the society's leaders decide to get by. Antifa happen to be a bunch of lemmings who are scared that the System is being threatened/overtaken (by the likes of, well, me) and constantly feel dread that all their Marvel movies and sex toys and all the goody goody corporation-approved ideas they were taught at school will be taken away by a big blonde guy who yells loud and has a scary gun like in movies. So this deranged, emotionally overcharged sense of instability (also contributed to by corporations on a daily basis) clouds their minds and sends them to a fantasy world where they have to be like the superheroes they subconsciously program themselves with at IMAX and defend corporate interests or else Cheeto Hitler will send them to the Shadow Realm and do things that violate corporate standards.

    That's really all there is to it.

    And you may be thinking "Nuh-uh, girl, you're projecting. Neo-Nazis like you are the same way you dumb hoe [laughing/crying emoji x4]". Well, if you look at my posts in the Political Pictures or Political Videos thread you can see that you're wrong. And this struggle is for the good and me and my family and my tribe. I don't have some nonsensical ideal that takes priority over that like the corporate foot soldiers do.
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    OK, I love that post, except for the fact that I don't think companies like Cheetos are responsible for the problem. It is true that if they all got together, they could overthrow the military-industrial complex, but is that what they're supposed to to do begin with, even when the stakes are this high? Here's some virtue ethics for you: The virtue of a knife is to cut, but my knife won't cut anything. If my knife doesn't cut anything, and then I try to use my spoon to cut things but it doesn't work either, am I warranted in cursing my spoon and throwing it against the wall and destroying it? No, I don't think that's reasonable. So, I don't think corporations in general are to blame for the state of things. I would blame the military-industrial complex, and I absolutely would blame Hollywood for promoting the military-industrial complex when they're more than able to make good films that speak about the issues of today instead of awful superhero films that program people to punch people who have scary ideas and glorify the military, but I wouldn't blame the people selling snacks at the movies. Technically anyone could do anything to solve any problem if they pushed themselves enough, but that just gets us to some sort of "original sin" concept where everyone can be blamed for everything because they're not literally God and I don't think that's a useful explanation if we're going to try to actually solve problems.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Raver View Post
    I don't really consider myself super knowledgeable about politics or an expert on it, but I can still make conclusions based on my observations and what I do know. I am well aware that the far right are not innocent and a part of the problem like the far left. The reason why I bring up the far left is because they are often ignored and downplayed by the media and many leftists. I know the far right extremists are worse in damage and involved in identity politics too, but why should that excuse the far left extremism? Just seems like a weird double standard. I brought up the far left extremism specifically because I wanted to bring it up as an issue.

    I am not expecting you or anyone else on the left to say that the far left are equivalent to neo-nazis (a point I retracted several times in this thread), but rather that the far left are a part of the problem. My views tend to vary politically for each issue, which is why I may appear dishonest when it is the exact opposite. If we can't admit that far left extremists, far right extremists, neoliberal corporatists and neoconservative corporatists are all a part of the problem then we will never make any progress in solving the real issue because we are too busy fighting each other.

    IMO, the real problem in the US is the corporate oligarchy, the MIC and the mass media as their weapon of propaganda that dominates the country while neoliberal and neoconservative corporate politicians seek to protect it. Far left extremists and far right extremists fighting each other over identity politics is a waste of time and energy and those on the top are counting on it. Once you zoom out and look at the big picture rather than obsessing over the fine details, it just looks like a sideshow or a game comprised of smoke and mirrors. George Carlin put it best here:

    re: bolded: i don't personally agree with the notion of criticizing both sides for the sake of 'balance' or some such. Imo
    "Inasmuch as it is nothing but pure communicability, every face, even the most noble and beautiful, is always suspended on the edge of an abyss"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Delilah View Post
    re: bolded: i don't personally agree with the notion of criticizing both sides for the sake of 'balance' or some such. Imo
    I wouldn't say it is about achieving balance or being impartial for the sake of it, but rather calling out poor behavior in general regardless of the severity of it. It should not be a competition of who is worse or better and the lesser of two evils is accepted, while the greater of two evils is scorned. It is about acknowledging both while simultaneously seeing the differences in severity and in general between them.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raver View Post
    I wouldn't say it is about achieving balance or being impartial for the sake of it, but rather calling out poor behavior in general regardless of the severity of it. It should not be a competition of who is worse or better and the lesser of two evils is accepted, while the greater of two evils is scorned. It is about acknowledging both while simultaneously seeing the differences in severity and in general between them.
    Yes! The far left shouldn't be allowed to try to ruin the college years of all the more intellectually-inclined students by filling everything up with ridiculous evil philosophies so that you have to agree if you're a normal human being and bite your tongue to the point you can't actually interact with anyone if you're not, and it shouldn't be allowed to ruin Hollywood by filling it with awful superhero films to the exclusion of good films, or fuel the military-industrial complex and run around destroying any wealthy countries it can get away with destroying (which results in way more deaths than right-wing terrorists have on their hands even if antifa aren't the ones killing people.) The damage the far left is doing is much more widespread, though I don't think there's any point in comparing them because I don't want to downplay the damage of the far right by comparing it to the far left any more than I want to downplay the damage of serial killers by comparing them to 20th century genocides. That just doesn't make any sense to do to begin with. "OK, Ted Bundy, you can go scott-free because there once was a man named Adolf Hitler." "Oh, Hitler was completely innocent! He didn't stab a single person to death!" How about no.

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    Quote Originally Posted by coeruleum View Post
    Yes! The far left shouldn't be allowed to try to ruin the college years of all the more intellectually-inclined students by filling everything up with ridiculous evil philosophies so that you have to agree if you're a normal human being and bite your tongue to the point you can't actually interact with anyone if you're not, and it shouldn't be allowed to ruin Hollywood by filling it with awful superhero films to the exclusion of good films, or fuel the military-industrial complex and run around destroying any wealthy countries it can get away with destroying (which results in way more deaths than right-wing terrorists have on their hands even if antifa aren't the ones killing people.) The damage the far left is doing is much more widespread, though I don't think there's any point in comparing them because I don't want to downplay the damage of the far right by comparing it to the far left any more than I want to downplay the damage of serial killers by comparing them to 20th century genocides. That just doesn't make any sense to do to begin with. "OK, Ted Bundy, you can go scott-free because there once was a man named Adolf Hitler." "Oh, Hitler was completely innocent! He didn't stab a single person to death!" How about no.
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    Quote Originally Posted by FreelancePoliceman View Post
    Periods are free; we won't charge you extra for using them.
    How about you go first instead of using that semicolon?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aramas View Post
    Tbh I can't see why both of you had to step down into ad hominem arguments while talking about this kind of stuff. Are both of you really so uninformed that you can't come up with anything to say about the topic by itself?
    Mea culpa. I'm arrogant by nature.

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    Ugh @Raver isn't this just like an overly privileged straight white male. How dare you. As your punishment you will write 'I am an overly privileged str8 male cistard that will learn to listen to others before I speak' on the chalkboard 500 times.

    But lol yeah, I mostly agree. Taken too far, a far left person becomes just as obnoxious and bullying as some republican asshole with a gun pistol whipping an innocent faggot in the face, who is doing nothing but minding his own business. His only crime being born a little more effeminate and less aggressive than his peers, he isn't even talking or announcing his homosexuality but he's being cruelly bullied by a bunch of assholes. It's like that, in reverse.

    It becomes problematic as like some well meaning but aloof liberal professor will start talking about how privileged and easy str8 male whites have it, but the average str8 male white who works a minimum wage job at the taco stand or gas station obviously doesn't feel that way, and doesn't live some overly privileged glamours life in the least and why are people picking on him anyway, and they wonder why colleges lost so many males really. It is true though that I think, the white str8 males on the very top that are also wealthy- hold a lot of the power and cruelly hoard it for themselves but then people will kinda start talking about it in a way that doesn't really bring any good results or solution.


    I always really liked the quote "Conservatives who want to conserve are as rare as liberals who actually want to liberate."

    Its also about dividing the population as a whole, as the media will of course focus on some SJW or other type they know is really extreme and far out there/and so distant from the average Joe that they know they will be despised, as a way to troll the masses I think. So even being offended by it you play into their game.

    Good thing you realize that in moderation things like feminism and gay rights/opportunities won't cause society or civilization to implode. How power is distributed is also really complex, but the way the blue pill matrix sends the message basically that women are good and holy and men are bad and ugly and well, it is really bad and ugly what they are doing and sending that message to little boys. Power corrupts because it's power, it doesn't care if you are a str8 male asshole or a faggy effeminate wisp.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Raver View Post
    Finally, we can reach common ground on something. Neoliberalism and neoconservatism are major issues because they both support bad status quo policies. Neoliberalism with their inability to want to enact economic social policies and neoconservatism for economic policies that favor corporations and the rich and being warhawks. Neoliberalism and ANTIFA can both be issues in the same time by the way, you don't have to pick one or the other.
    Well great, you've successfully distracted away the real dangers of the far-right by making a false equivalence, and then moved onto a completely different target. The far-right has successfully dodged and evaded any condemnation and criticisms, and now they can freely go on their merry ways unscathed.

    I don't think you do it deliberately, but it's clear that this is what the far-right wants. You're simply being used like a fodder and a propagandist tool for their cause.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Singu View Post
    Well great, you've successfully distracted away the real dangers of the far-right by making a false equivalence, and then moved onto a completely different target. The far-right has successfully dodged and evaded from any condemnation and criticisms, and now they can freely go on their merry ways unscathed.

    I don't think you do it deliberately, but it's clear that this is what the far-right wants. You're simply being used like a fodder and a propagandist tool for their cause.
    I can say the same thing about you, that you're being used like a fodder and a propagandist tool for the cause of the far left. Instead of incorrectly thinking that I'm supporting the far right directly or indirectly, maybe we should reach common ground in our disdain for neoliberal/neoconservative politicians and corporations. Both the far-right and the far-left have emerged as symptoms of neoliberal/neoconservative politicians and corporations via their social policies that serve to further business interests to line their pockets. What they want is each political side to have their own personal boogeyman, the left with the far right and the right with the far left so attention is drawn away from them and directed towards pawns instead so they can continue to profit and continue with their plans without too much criticism directed towards them.
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    None of you are my duals. My duals dont even follow politics.

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