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Thread: Fi + Ne vs. Fe + Ni

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    user title The Perpetual Now's Avatar
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    Default Fi + Ne vs. Fe + Ni

    How do you tell them apart?

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    What's the purpose of SEI? Tallmo's Avatar
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    How? One is EII and other is EIE. Just like one tells apart any other types

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    Humanist Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    Im calm and I dont have a wide spectrum of emotions and Im not very emotive. When I speak it can seem random because Im taking so much in and mulling things over in my mind
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 2w1sw(1w9) helps others to live up to their own standards of what a good person is and is very behind the scenes in the process.
    Tritype 1-2-6 stacking sp/sx


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

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    First impression might be the same. The longer you observe it should become clear. They kind of share similar configuration but you'll see that ignoring should become visible when pressed ie. shutting it down from environment.
    Quote Originally Posted by Groucho Marx
    I dont care to belong to any club that will have me as a member.

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    lol sorry but Talmo's first post is why it is best to read theory yourself. I don't mean that to insult him. Each person is like the center of their own socionics universe here so they type the other heavenly bodies orbiting them accordingly. IOW, it's mostly subjective. I gave my own take on EIE and EII in another thread recently but I believe it was more about similarities than differences so probably not helpful.

    I chose Filatova since some find her a credible source and even use her VI gallery.

    EIE (Hamlet)

    Ethical Intuitive Extrovert
    EIE – ENFj – Hamlet (Artist)


    To the EIE life is filled with meaning when it contains emotional heat and dramatic experiences. He guesses which idea will take the imaginations if people and shape their feelings in the correct manner.


    Descriptions of the activity of the strong functions:

    Fe – Program function. Life for EIE is the sphere of emotions, which he, as a conductor, skillfully orchestrates. He is capable to act on his surroundings by a wide range of his own feelings – from powerful explosions saturated by his dramatic nature, by tragedy or by enthusiasm, by the ability to keep silent for several days and go about with a stone face; his entire form despising and “punishing”, in an unmistakable way, the person whom insulted him. People admire his bright emotionalism, the dramatic nature of his experiences, and his ability to respond to the most trivial changes in the moods of those around him. His rich world of feelings contains different hues of emotions, which in observing this psycho-type are immediately demonstrated by those surrounding.

    If others act indignantly towards him they qualify themselves as loathsome, malicious, and envious, and action is taken. His source of enthusiasm and delight, without fail, is anything directed to the highest spiritual ideals… In the emotional sphere EIE has a certain standard of expression he uses to discover how the public reacts, to him, emotionally.

    In connection with this the EIE places an important role on morality, taken aback by society he himself strives into those spheres, where, in his opinion, this criteria is best matched. Being a very emotional man he easily may be made victim of strange misfortunes. Towards others he is capable of exemplifying warmth and sincere sympathy, he is very courteous and inclined to prove to be of service, at least when prolonged participation is not required. Wonderfully knows how to manipulate others by their feelings. At the same time feels greatly wounded himself, sometimes seeming like “a man without skin”. He strongly depends on the opinion of those that surround him, they, without fail, take the role of student or spectator.

    In reacting to something he always feels himself to be an actor, located on set. Because of this his behavior frequently contains a noticeable theatricality about it, an increasing excitability, enthusiasm, exaggerated gestures, poses. His behavior contains a demonstrative nature, which seemingly signals to those surrounding him whether he is unhappy, sick, insulted, sincere, flattered, ingenious, needy of nourishment…
    He knows how to magnificently appear before an audience, to ignite and fascinate the crowd through his ideas, which he preaches. He requires interaction with someone at least everyday in order to satisfy his everyday emotional manifestations.

    Ni – Creative function. To take the attention of those that surround him, to hold it in himself; leading others aids him in experiencing an indefatigable fantasy. He is able to dedicate himself to serving a high ideal, especially if such activity aids him in recognizing his own sense of nobility and uniqueness. The demonstration of his uniqueness serves to stimulate and inspire him.

    As a rule he reads a lot. Not alien to having a literary gift, loves poetry, music, painting, and cinematography. Holds close to himself the ideas of humanism and general human values. He’s drawn towards the image of a noble person; sometimes he’ll be tempted by the desire to enter into a “secular society” where his talents would be properly noticed and his value properly evaluated.

    The fact that his own imagination is what makes him appealing to the world leads to his attention being primarily directed towards global problems. Thus flashes of mutual anxiety and sympathy to those close by can just as easily “come to naught”. He may suddenly involuntarily insult another without understanding this. His heightened sense of vulnerability forces him into adopting a self-defensive stance; in which case through his sharpness and intolerance he can easily deliver (with words) a calculated “strike” against his target.

    His strong intuition of time permits him to foresee the course of events, and in time to feel as well as conduct himself as one man or another. He thus has the ability to operate in the political arena. He eagerly alerts those, whom he respects, of threatening situations and other dangers. He straightforwardly states possible troubles to others for it is always deemed preferable to act in an already established situation.

    EIE is magnificently capable of detecting the psychological characteristics in others, to comprehend their strengths and weaknesses. Makes an excellent psychologist, however, he does not always use this talent for good. Frequently there appears a desire, in EIE, to manipulate close ones, and the nature of this manipulation depends on his concrete relations he has with the individual.

    EIE finds it boring to live the measured, routine life, he is motivated and inspired by extreme situations. If such situations fail to present themselves, for long enough, he will create tension around himself, forcing something to happen.

    Descriptions of the activity of the weak functions:

    Si – Vulnerable function. If he does not doubt in his own abilities and uniqueness then he is utterly capable of taking care of his health and household – spheres where the EIE often feels the need for the help and council of other people. As a rule he is clean and squeamish. But he poorly recognizes his body’s needs, thus he may either constantly run to the physician or react in the exact opposite manner and not visit medical institutions until he literally collapses.

    He often lacks the ability to discern the appropriateness of his observations before communicating them. Thus he appears to lack etiquette and this is reinforced by rough or vulgar manifestations in his behaviour. He often yields to his immediate mood, when this is positive, often because he’s been incited by public attention, he can present a commendable sense of generousity and charity. Such traits are dependent on his mood and, likewise, when effected negatively he may treat others meagerly, as if pitying them.
    EIE often experiences difficulty in selecting clothing for himself, which adequately fits his frame. Some are able to overcome this shortcoming, however, and develop a good taste in selecting an appropriate outfit. Conscious of his ability to make an educated guess, in regards to the essence of what is happening around him, and confident in his correctness because of this, he is capable of acting with volitional pressure. Specifically if before him is someone, whom EIE considers “below himself”, whether in regards to age, level of culture etc… he sometimes desires to humble this person, to “put them in their place.”

    Te – Role function. Emotional enthusiasm plays an integral role in the EIE’s fitness for work. Without such influence he can wonder about, deeply drowning in his troubles, and thereby justifying his own inertia. But if his work fascinates him he burns with a bright flame. In such a situation it is difficult to sway him from his course; it’s even difficult for him to stop, in such a situation, and acknowledge other vitally necessary tasks (i.e. preparation of food). He relates, as a rule, to creative work, and conversely disdains any sort of manual labour. When he finds himself forced into a “course cloth” type of labour he prefers to work on people instead of the task at hand, he utilizes his ability to convince, to inspire, to operate the emotional levers present in the situation (he thus compensates by acting with his strong function).

    EIE enjoys realizing himself in the intellectual arena. He takes pleasure in demonstrating the implications that philosophical problems present. He loves discussions with abstract themes.

    Summary of Functions:

    1. – Life for EIE is focused within the sphere of emotions, which he skillfully controls like the conductor of an orchestra. Without the surge of a periodic dramatic experience he finds himself unable to work. He attempts maintain a certain standard, in regards to his emotions, which serves to inform those around him his current condition.
    2. – He foresees the possible course of events and possesses a sense of fantasy and artistic taste. Wonderfully reveals the possibilities of what may have been and what never was, knows how to inspire people with fantasy and to manipulate them.
    3. – Not confident in determining physical needs and not always capable of organizing a routine manner of living; spends money reasonably. His volitional efforts are of an unpredictable nature and their essence is directed towards the people in close proximity. He may push too hard without any definite reason.

    4. – Finds it difficult to work on large tasks; prefers delicate, thorough, and scrupulous work. Finds it difficult to strictly follow a definite system, in such cases it is necessary to find help.

    EII (Dostoevsky)

    Ethical-Intuitive Introvert

    EII – INFj – Dostoevsky

    The orientation of main functional block of EII: the conditions of normal life, harmony in human relations, the observance of ethical norms and morals, conservation of traditions. For purposes of this, EII devotes herself to improving and perfecting ethical values, strives to teach and cultivate moral refinement and spirituality in others, seeks veritable qualities in people.

    Descriptions of the Strong Functions:

    Fi – Program function. Introverted ethics in first function designate a person for whom the main orientation in life is making judgments about good and evil, morals and depravity, decency and dihonorableness. EII very acutely feels the general trends and standards of behavior which prevail in a society or a social group. She is usually mindful of these norms in order to not be insulting to other people. When she first joins a new group, she holds herself back and behaves tactfully conforming to established norms, meanwhile observing and assessing the psychological atmosphere. Once she has absorbed the existing atmosphere, only then she considers becoming a full-fledged member of the community and establishes her influence in regards to its psychological atmosphere.

    When encountering people who are disadvantaged, outcast, unhappy, or weak she experiences a desire to emotionally support them and console them. Thus others will frequently refer to her with their troubles, and she will listen to their grievances and confessions sometimes for hours. She tries to sympathize, to enter their personal position, to feel their emotional pain as if it is her own, to accept the person and give them moral support.

    EII is very sensitive and emotional, however, her introversion turns all her experiences inward, and thus these qualities are not always observable from the outside. Sometimes she appears as calm and impassive, but this impression is illusory, for every event, even those popularly deemed insignificant, leaves a trace in her soul that survives for a long time. As a rule, she represses her anger and irritation, and the desire to criticize others in herself.

    One of the characteristic qualities of EII when she has taken offense is the creation of a psychological barrier between herself and the offender. In such cases, she take the position of emphatically cold politeness and answer all questions monosyllabically. For some people such behavior of this sociotype is difficult to endure; they'd prefer that the EII shouts or somehow expressed her anger and indignation. It is not an easy state for her either. However, if the offender asks for forgiveness and shows his desire to change the situation, then this state of offense may rapidly pass.

    High emotionalism in combination with rationality frequently make the EII to focus on some past traumatic situation; she thinks it over and over again. In her consciousness, a center of excitation is created that overshadows all other aspects of life when this occurs. In these cases, she finds it difficult to focus on anything else. Mentally, again and again, she returns to the same point; she may speak repeatedly about it, and annoy others around her with these recollections.

    Ne – Implementation of the program. To create harmony in life, EII searches for people' veritable, core values. These values she often finds in realm of ethical virtues and spirituality. Even in youth, through her imagination, EII forms a certain ideal that she attempts to reach. A feeling of obligation often lies at the foundation of her program function. Thus, the smallest divergence in behavior away from this ideal causes the EII to chastise and restrain herself. In this journey towards self-perfection, EII can become her own worst tyrant. This tyranny of this sense of obligation in its extreme manifestations can even lead the EII to develop contempt for herself. It can also lead her to feel contemptuous and critical of others, when their behavior fails to correspond with her ideal of decency and ethical values. This sort of maximalism, characteristic of EII in her youth, can lead to confrontations and conflicts with her peers, which weigh heavily upon her and are very trying for her.

    Since her ethical ideal and norms, that she feels are compulsory to strive for, tend to be extremely high and difficult to live up to, she may gradually develop an increasing and continuous feeling of shame before everyone for her failings. Due to this feeling, with great difficulty does she assert herself and protect her rights. She considers that if she has failed in something – it is punishment for her mistakes. This sense of guilt can accompany the EII throughout her entire life.

    She has little interest in career advancement and material values as main goals for her existence. The main thing for her is to find her purpose, to make something of her life before it passes by, to realize her innate abilities and talents. For the ideas that EII advocates, she is willing to go to the "executioner’s bloc". In psychologically extreme situations, she does not care how others evaluate and judge her, because her own inner trials are the most severe ones. However, in ordinary situations EII prefers to avoid conflicts, assuming that kindness and decency are the best ways of resolving any misunderstandings.

    Descriptions of the Weak Functions:

    Se – Painful function. Witnessing instances of physical violence and application of force is usually unpleasant for the EII. She develops a negative gut reaction in response to physical punishments, abuse, and conflict, especially if these lead to someone's death, sometimes even if these are merely representations on television. Such spectacles incite in EII the desire to put an end to violence. Her protest becomes more vivid and sharp when she sees this happening in real life, especially if the abuse and punishment is directed at children.
    EII considers that each person should aim for betterment, self-improvement and self-erudition, and harshness with which she applies this to herself is often unrealistic and inadequate for ordinary, real life. In this, the vulnerability of her weak sensing functions manifests itself. It should be noted that on vulnerable function, the person's reactions do not correspond to the circumstances – she can be both unjustifiably strong and too weak.
    The EII is very sensitive to authoritative and overbearing notes in her address. Frequently she works haplessly at tasks due to her underdeveloped business logic. If, in addition to this, she is forced to do more, she interprets this as the underestimation of her diligence and may simply discontinue working, while an appeal to her feeling of responsibility can for long time keep her in the state of work activity.

    The orientation towards the ideal, constant work on herself from one side, and the difficulty of emotional recharge from another, make the EII eventually feel tired of herself. This often lends to disorders of her nervous system. Contact with nature greatly assists her in her struggle to relax; instinctively she strives for a healthy mode of life.

    In resolving problems that have to do with housekeeping, EII tends to be inefficient. To purchase quality food, to adequately suture a piece of clothing, to do laundry – on all of these she resolves expanding too much effort than is necessary. If it was up to her to dictate her life, she would wish to not have to deal with the chores. Yet the EII never ceases in spending too much time and energy on each task. She feels that she must maintain cleanliness and order, because she cannot live in disorder and she also considers it shameful to allow others to witness disorder in her living space. The absence of money greatly alarms and suppresses her, if this occurs, because she does not feel confident in her ability to obtain resources when they are exhausted. Thus she saves and strives to always have money around, just in case "for the rainy day". Weakness in sensing also manifests in her difficulty understanding whether some thing will be needed in future or not. Thus, she is prone to hoarding and keeping things for years, which most other people would have thrown out long time ago.

    Ti – Role function. EII thinks over all her actions beforehand, defining concrete goals or imperatives that are of primary importance to reach. This approach does not always succeed due to her emotionalism which frequently pushes or pulls her away the original direction she planned to follow. Nevertheless she tries to organize her activity into a specific system, bring about order, which requires vast efforts from her.

    The normative nature of this function in EII is especially clearly seen in how ardently this sociotype abides by the laws and regulations. She follows exactly the official norms and regulations that are endorsed in her society.
    Trying to work as conscientiously as possible, EII doesn't always do so effectively. Thus she wastes much of her time in an unproductive fashion. She sometimes compensates for this by working from dawn to dawn. She finds it difficult to bind her workday within a reasonable framework: there always seems to be something that is unfinished. Frequently, she wants to realize herself in that which doesn't work out for her. As a consequence of her efforts at self-improvement, she sometimes wholly devotes herself to work, which contradicts her nature, but the feeling of responsibility exceeds her other needs.

    Summary of Functions:

    1. – The main interest of EII is focused on the moral norms of behavior, considers it necessary to listen to all whom require their sympathy and help. Very emotional but believes that one ought not to concentrate just on the bad things, but to seek the positive sides of life.
    2. – Possesses an excellent eye for promising long-range opportunities; knows how to manipulate variants and select the most promising one. Prefers methodical activities, is frequently disturbed by the future.
    3. – Relates poorly to anything involving violence. While on one hand they resist external pressures, on the other they’re prone to tyrannize themselves internally. Find it difficult to efficiently complete household tasks, organize their budget, and purchase necessary things.

    4. – Subordinate themselves to a system of order so long as not they’re not forced. Does not develop interest in theories of an abstract nature. Not always capable of organizing work efficiently, spends much time ineffectively spending resources, capable of overworking in order to make up for this.

    My typology is . . . not in any sense to stick labels on people at first sight. It is not a physiognomy and not an anthropological system, but a critical psychology dealing with the organization and delimitation of psychic processes that can be shown to be typical.​ C.G. Jung

     



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    Quote Originally Posted by The Perpetual Now View Post
    How do you tell them apart?
    It's the difference between Jesus and Hitler lol

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    user title The Perpetual Now's Avatar
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    @aylen

    That's why I asked. I just saw a heated exchange in another thread between two individuals arguing Fi+Ne vs Fe+Ni. It all seems very subjective. A lot of lay people's explanations of Fi and Fe, for instance, seem to overlap like a venn diagram or something. Everyone wants to be an expert and gets really touchy over disagreements on the nature of IMs.

    I also started the thread for selfish reasons because I occasionally go back and forth in trying to determine which ones I value.

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    Queen of the Damned Aylen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Megatrop View Post
    It's the difference between Jesus and Hitler lol
    You are probably joking but those are extremes. Jesus gets typed beta NF too.

    My typology is . . . not in any sense to stick labels on people at first sight. It is not a physiognomy and not an anthropological system, but a critical psychology dealing with the organization and delimitation of psychic processes that can be shown to be typical.​ C.G. Jung

     



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    Quote Originally Posted by The Perpetual Now View Post
    @aylen

    That's why I asked. I just saw a heated exchange in another thread between two individuals arguing Fi+Ne vs Fe+Ni. It all seems very subjective. A lot of lay people's explanations of Fi and Fe, for instance, seem to overlap like a venn diagram or something. Everyone wants to be an expert and gets really touchy over disagreements on the nature of IMs.

    I also started the thread for selfish reasons because I occasionally go back and forth in trying to determe which ones I value.
    Don't get me wrong, I don't mind you posting it since it is a chance to post a "socionist of the day" () take on theory from articles that some people might not have read otherwise.

    My typology is . . . not in any sense to stick labels on people at first sight. It is not a physiognomy and not an anthropological system, but a critical psychology dealing with the organization and delimitation of psychic processes that can be shown to be typical.​ C.G. Jung

     



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    Fi types tend to think to themselves and not like interjections while Fe-types prefer to engage others when rationalizing and seem to like the back-and-forth. Ne-types don't seem nearly as sure of their information or beliefs as Ni-types seem to be; they tend to be more tentative and unsure while Ni-types seem to be rather offended if they're told that they might be wrong.

    a.k.a. I/O

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    Humanist Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    EIE have more friends and parties than I do. My social circle is extremely small
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 2w1sw(1w9) helps others to live up to their own standards of what a good person is and is very behind the scenes in the process.
    Tritype 1-2-6 stacking sp/sx


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

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    yeah, one is extroverted and the other is introverted. since their IDs coincide, they're what each other wished to be if they weren't who they are, or... they are what the other would be if they stepped "beyond the looking glass".

    IDK if you're aware of astrology, but to make it very simple... your contrary is the equivalent of your opposite sign: Aries-Libra, Taurus-Scorpio, etc etc

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    BTW, following Aushra, a telling sign would be found in the Super-ego, which is what we do to ingratiate ourselves to the needs of society. If you can "easily" use Ti + Se, you're likely an EII, if you can use Te + Si around people, you're probably an EIE.

    easy beans

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    Let me break it down for you all

    EIE is not very discerning when it comes to their relationships. I am. Because of this my LSE husband and I don’t have a lot of people around us.
    EIE need help from someone “just because.” I don’t
    EIE take on other people’s problems as their own and the drama that goes along with it. I do listen to people speak to me on a one on one basis but the majority of my psychological services in the form of moral support goes to my husband not other people
    EIE with Ni jump to the worst case scenario while EII tend to view the bright aspects of life
    EIE needs someone to do things for them; EII has very little needs for themselves so have few requests
    Se energy preferences are different; I like Si “not now and when I feel like it” works great for me but would likely irritate EIE

    I take care of my health I expect others to do their own work in this area
    I hardly joke around, my husband is the cheery one walks in the door with a big smile on his face while I’m emotionalless or even
    Last edited by Beautiful sky; 05-03-2019 at 05:46 PM.
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 2w1sw(1w9) helps others to live up to their own standards of what a good person is and is very behind the scenes in the process.
    Tritype 1-2-6 stacking sp/sx


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

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    2nd annoy me
    Types examples: video bloggers, actors

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    EII


    EIE

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    Fe lead obvious emotional range continually expressed, emotional reactions everywhere, different pitches of voice.

    With Fi lead usuallu negative outlook, feel very intensely and also have an emotional reaction to almost anything, but its subdued, here they try more to be as sincere as possible instead of improving the vibe and atmosphere in a positive way

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    Fe has often been referred to a director of emotions, States and moods however I find that it is only a very skillful tool to get other to do what they want that is in line with society

    Around each person the EIE creates a certain emotional field which he "charges" either positively or negatively at his own discretion by constantly expressing his attitudes regarding this person's ethical and personal qualities; moreover, the EIE formulates these statements not as his personal point of view, but as general and already prevailing opinions, which he personally would only be happy to doubt. Since all of this is presented in the form of subtle hints, accompanied by the most expressive mimicry, EIE's conversation partners immediately feel themselves intrigued, and, imperceptibly to themselves, they fall under EIE's social and emotional guidance and influence, becoming "obedient marionettes" moved by the strings of such, as it seems to them, well-wishing and personable conversation partner.
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 2w1sw(1w9) helps others to live up to their own standards of what a good person is and is very behind the scenes in the process.
    Tritype 1-2-6 stacking sp/sx


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

  19. #19
    Humanist Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    EIE with perfection wields his entire arsenal of methods and tools needed to forge a necessary to him public opinion, with the aid of which he then intends to direct the actions of people around him into a specific predetermined course. The creation of a formal or informal groups within an already existing system, the emergence of a new formal or informal leader and the displacement of the existing leadership, the changes within hierarchical layers of the system, the exclusion from the group of those who have interfered with his "rearrangement of forces" all of this is a sphere of EIE's never ceasing activity, independent of his age, occupation, location, and his current social position.

    If everything is too calm EIE starts looking for a quarrel.

    Like what? I love calmness and peace
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 2w1sw(1w9) helps others to live up to their own standards of what a good person is and is very behind the scenes in the process.
    Tritype 1-2-6 stacking sp/sx


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

  20. #20
    Humanist Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    For example, the EIE sometimes looks for a quarrel simply because everything is "too calm and quiet", and this for him is alarming, and frightening, and irritating. By and large, the EIE does not believe in peace and quiet. If the "pool of water has gone too quiet" then there are bound to be "water gremlins" in it, and they have to be identified. It is exactly in such orientation and attitude that the EIE sees the highest manifestation of civic duty and loyalty to the existing regime. (It should be noted that EIE's type of mind has been "programmed" for viability and effectiveness in extreme situations for periods of totalitarian systems, in the era of violent upheavals in history. To survive in such troubled times and to get through them this is the most important social and biological challenge for this type of personality. This is why the EIE is characterized by such traits as ethical maneuverability, foresight, prudence, loyalty, and political "farsightedness", as well as the desire to get into the higher levels of the hierarchy, in order to obtain certain advantages in critical situations.)

    The EIE is always politically active, always attentive towards his rights and stances as a citizen. He is irritated by an attitude of indifference towards matters of social and public importance. He is annoyed by the type of person who simply lives and exists, who wants to simply keep his peace of soul and mind. The EIE hates "philistinism" and commonality. He can for some time "play" a game of family comfort and idyllic atmosphere, but to "get caught up in mundane life" this he won't allow for himself. Moreover, he will consider this to be a kind of personal degradation. (Some female representatives of this type are very annoyed by society's requirements for women to "lock" themselves into their family circle. Such requirements adversely influence their character, and lead them to turn family relationships into "arenas of military-political struggles".)


    Yes EIE would hate me because I can become mentally detached from the world around me and immerse myself in my hobbies also an LSE May look alike EIE in reading up on society news, in questioning the rules of the system they are in.
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 2w1sw(1w9) helps others to live up to their own standards of what a good person is and is very behind the scenes in the process.
    Tritype 1-2-6 stacking sp/sx


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

  21. #21
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    http://sociotoday.narod.ru/EII.html

    Tab. 4. Properties that maximally distinguish EII from EIE

    Emotional stability without any tendency to poorly controlled aggressively irritable outbursts, to a lack of restraint and poise.

    Lack of demonstrativeness and theatricality in behavior.

    The underdevelopment of the auditory function of the subject and its individual low bandwidth as a channel for the receipt of information.

    Says a little.

    He has no inclination and ability to manipulate people.

    In society, invisible and non-initiative.

    The tempo of thought and perception is patient and slow.

    Control your emotional behavior.

    Sincerity, honesty, inability to deceit, intrigue and manipulation.

    The weakness of motivations (Abulia), when nothing attracts, does not please and does not want anything.

    Vision is more important than hearing and better developed than hearing (the formal difference between typical cluster profiles of "good vision" and "good hearing")

    The lack of lust for power, the desire for independence and withdrawal from their involvement in the vertical of governance.

    Lack of leadership skills; does not know how and avoids seizing the initiative.

    Conformity in the field of action - as the desire not to violate the prohibitions and restrictions, the avoidance of exciting situations of risk.

    There is no dexterity of social interaction at all.

    Low energy potential.

    Absence or lack of gambling.

    He is not a donor of negatively vicious, painful emotions - so that one often experiences dissatisfaction (frustration) and anger, and sometimes even subconsciously strives to experience evil feelings.

    Susceptibility to danger, uncertainty, avoidance of adrenaline emissions and situations of high nervous tension and risk.

    Lack of short-term vindictiveness.

    He avoids disputes, discomfort and anxiety, is afraid of overworking, searches for conflict-free situations, therefore he starts his business with the simplest tasks and trifles, and generally avoids unnecessary and complex.

    He is not predisposed to an impulsive response without prior evaluation and control.

    phonetic difficulties in pronouncing, changing sounds, difficulty in selecting synonyms, poverty of verbs, difficulty and lack of speech, its telegraphic style, difficulties with the language to do the exercises in the mouth

  22. #22
    aka Feathers, Penny Dreadful Chrysalis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ooo View Post
    That link is a treasure trove.
    It's what the Faberge eggs wish they were, but with more socionics.
    Thanks for sharing, ooo
    I will spend the following days/years/millenia sorting through the differences between EII, IEI and IEE.
    4w3 7w6 9w1 so/sx

    "You see, there are still faint glimmers of civilization left in this barbaric slaughterhouse that was once known as humanity. Indeed that's what we provide in our own modest, humble, insignificant... oh, fuck it."

  23. #23

  24. #24
    ooo's Avatar
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    lol, I guess my sum for EII vs EIE is a bit off.. you should actually look for the last column results.. the striking difference between EII and EIE is that EIIs love bread and carbohydrates more... no words

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beautiful sky View Post
    For example, the EIE sometimes looks for a quarrel simply because everything is "too calm and quiet", and this for him is alarming, and frightening, and irritating. By and large, the EIE does not believe in peace and quiet. If the "pool of water has gone too quiet" then there are bound to be "water gremlins" in it, and they have to be identified. It is exactly in such orientation and attitude that the EIE sees the highest manifestation of civic duty and loyalty to the existing regime. (It should be noted that EIE's type of mind has been "programmed" for viability and effectiveness in extreme situations – for periods of totalitarian systems, in the era of violent upheavals in history. To survive in such troubled times and to get through them – this is the most important social and biological challenge for this type of personality. This is why the EIE is characterized by such traits as ethical maneuverability, foresight, prudence, loyalty, and political "farsightedness", as well as the desire to get into the higher levels of the hierarchy, in order to obtain certain advantages in critical situations.)

    The EIE is always politically active, always attentive towards his rights and stances as a citizen. He is irritated by an attitude of indifference towards matters of social and public importance. He is annoyed by the type of person who simply lives and exists, who wants to simply keep his peace of soul and mind. The EIE hates "philistinism" and commonality. He can for some time "play" a game of family comfort and idyllic atmosphere, but to "get caught up in mundane life" this he won't allow for himself. Moreover, he will consider this to be a kind of personal degradation. (Some female representatives of this type are very annoyed by society's requirements for women to "lock" themselves into their family circle. Such requirements adversely influence their character, and lead them to turn family relationships into "arenas of military-political struggles".)


    Yes EIE would hate me because I can become mentally detached from the world around me and immerse myself in my hobbies also an LSE May look alike EIE in reading up on society news, in questioning the rules of the system they are in.
    wow, very interesting. I see why SLI and EIE are conflictors, we are exactly the opposite in this terms. And this is the reason why I think most of social movements such as feminism or lgtb are predominately Fe. I dislike militancy, like political, social, etc I want to be calm and quiet all the day and night. I dislike ppl who seek fights and make emotional discharge (especially negative emotions). But Fe types, especially Fe leads seem to "need" to express emotions (so they use opportunities or seek scenarios and plots to express them) and I think for them (especially beta) is "unethical" to not let them express them.

    What do you think are the differences between EIE and IEE over their use of Fe?

  26. #26
    Humanist Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackberry View Post
    wow, very interesting. I see why SLI and EIE are conflictors, we are exactly the opposite in this terms. And this is the reason why I think most of social movements such as feminism or lgtb are predominately Fe. I dislike militancy, like political, social, etc I want to be calm and quiet all the day and night. I dislike ppl who seek fights and make emotional discharge (especially negative emotions). But Fe types, especially Fe leads seem to "need" to express emotions (so they use opportunities or seek scenarios and plots to express them) and I think for them (especially beta) is "unethical" to not let them express them.

    What do you think are the differences between EIE and IEE over their use of Fe?
    When I was with my SLI ex our exchange was peaceful and loving about 98% of the time. The 2% was when he would get lazy and I’d get frustrated at asking him to help me clear boxes from the middle of the living room and when he wouldn’t I’d scream about it (after asking 10 times ) lol. We were together 7 years

    Also my IEE friend is even more peaceful. She uses affection and teasing more than I do but overall she would rather pray about it than stir up water with her SLI husband.

    I went to a party once at an EIE’s home. All her loyal musician friends were there and I was the only one who wasn’t a musician. I took a liking to an sei who was there and wanted to speak with her. The EIE circulated around us and kept eyeing me in an intense and almost disapproving way. I didn’t know why. I didn’t want to upset her any further so I stopped speaking with the SEI but the EIE glances are extreme
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 2w1sw(1w9) helps others to live up to their own standards of what a good person is and is very behind the scenes in the process.
    Tritype 1-2-6 stacking sp/sx


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

  27. #27
    Shytan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beautiful sky View Post
    When I was with my SLI ex our exchange was peaceful and loving about 98% of the time. The 2% was when he would get lazy and I’d get frustrated at asking him to help me clear boxes from the middle of the living room and when he wouldn’t I’d scream about it (after asking 10 times ) lol. We were together 7 years

    Also my IEE friend is even more peaceful. She uses affection and teasing more than I do but overall she would rather pray about it than stir up water with her SLI husband.

    I went to a party once at an EIE’s home. All her loyal musician friends were there and I was the only one who wasn’t a musician. I took a liking to an sei who was there and wanted to speak with her. The EIE circulated around us and kept eyeing me in an intense and almost disapproving way. I didn’t know why. I didn’t want to upset her any further so I stopped speaking with the SEI but the EIE glances are extreme
    7 years?! What was the cause of the break-up?

    C-EII-INFj 4w3 Sx/sp 479

  28. #28
    Humanist Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shytan View Post
    7 years?! What was the cause of the break-up?
    When I discovered that we were activity relations rather than duality some of my frustrations about the relationship made sense and I became very sad about them and wanted a dual. Those were that we would do things together but our cooperation in completing tasks together were not the best, he would randomly lake off on motorcycle rides and leave me guessing and hanging as to when he would come back so when he did return I was like "why didn't you tell me you'd be back so late I could have done something with my time." The interpersonal distance really bothered me. You see LSE plan actions and want closeness. My LSE husband now will always tell me his plans ahead of time. I know when he'll be back home and we even plan meals together. With my SLI ex I would tell him "I'm making tacos tonight" and he wouldn't show up until late at night and I would just be left dumbfounded and not knowing what was going on or what to do. Te problems. There were other problems. But not having cooperation for basic life things was the heart of my issue.
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 2w1sw(1w9) helps others to live up to their own standards of what a good person is and is very behind the scenes in the process.
    Tritype 1-2-6 stacking sp/sx


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

  29. #29
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    A visual: people who metaphorically dwell on islands (Ijs) have a hard time maintaining connections with people who live in castles (Ips); what often saves these two temperaments from themselves is that Ejs usually carry their own bridges while Eps have ladders.

    a.k.a. I/O

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rebelondeck View Post
    A visual: people who metaphorically dwell on islands (Ijs) have a hard time maintaining connections with people who live in castles (Ips); what often saves these two temperaments from themselves is that Ejs usually carry their own bridges while Eps have ladders.

    a.k.a. I/O
    I have always preferred teleportation.
    Quote Originally Posted by Groucho Marx
    I dont care to belong to any club that will have me as a member.

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