Page 2 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast
Results 41 to 80 of 136

Thread: Stackings and Misconceptions

  1. #41
    Neokortex's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2016
    Location
    Post-Colonial Wasteland
    TIM
    Extrovert and Happy.
    Posts
    203
    Mentioned
    11 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Aylen View Post
    Still a voyeur of the ever elusive (to you) sx instinct I see.

    I have given up enough of my secrets on this forum. I am passing the baton. Mine are in various threads and in various pm. We already had this conversation before.
    There's no way you're an Sx-dom for the very reason that you're mocking my Sx hunger. As if you've never had this feeling, of being anxious, waiting for the crowd to dissipate, walls of insincere people to yield way to that other person waiting for you. Ain't it easy to poke fun of that despair when you've never had it? So if we've already had this convo before, did you answer it the last time with opening up more? Or was it just the same playful, impish, elusive (so/sx) butterfly, ever so light, ghosting one before leaping to the next?

    That gets personal and I prefer to keep that to the chatbox where it eventually fades into the mist. But I tried.
    Well, if you were an Sx dom you would have succeeded, to a degree. As I wrote before, what I see in your style of writing, as well as others is this lack of heaviness, sinisterness (in case of Sx/So, something else but still more focused). You guys aren't really here to discuss details, to be intimate about how you feel, this is just like a females' mag's letter column to you. It's all so dispersed, there's no exclusive, dead-on focus on either one topic or one individual, it's plain social chatter, batting the breeze. So you don't see yourself a leader type? But do you still end up *somehow* in leading positions, coordinating a group, be its head? I bet you're also here to lead (and develop a social position here, starting by being friendly, mostly accepting, picking up a bit of the local lingo, theory along the way), it's just that it wouldn't work if people knew it ahead, would it?
    Last edited by Neokortex; 01-16-2019 at 10:57 PM.
    Except for impaired empathy, an ordinary guy who's looking for down-to-earth, loving, loyal friends and a geeky, warm, voluptuous girlfriend!

  2. #42
    Darn Socks Abbie the Child's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Southwest USA
    TIM
    LSE
    Posts
    7,084
    Mentioned
    352 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)

    Default

    I found a site that listed stackings by enneagram type and looked through the 1 descriptions. I didn't really fit any of them, but I tried to order them from fits-most to fits-least.
    so/sx
    sp/so
    sp/sx
    sx/sp
    so/sp
    sx/so
    Also, those descriptions relate sx to close people, not to anything sexual, and I reaffirm that seeing sx as necessarily sexual is a misconception.
    And the 1 descriptions made it clear that sx and 1 don't blend well, and implied that an sx 1 would be unstable. But I'm not unstable. I'm just weird.

    Quote Originally Posted by VenusRose View Post
    What has usually happened is that I get hung up on whether someone "wants to be close to me" or not, and get frightened that maybe I am too much, and that I am repelling them.
    I can relate to that. Not in such thoughts, but a similar impression.

    Quote Originally Posted by VenusRose View Post
    I think I have avoidant attachments to my friends.
    The attachment styles don't work for me. It seems there's too much fluctuation.

    Quote Originally Posted by VenusRose View Post
    IMO, Fi types will speak of their relationships in terms of closeness, bonding, etc. and when SX is there, it's more subtle, implied, due to the dislike of blatant SX behavior/descriptions/anything for infant/caregivers.

    And so I brought in that description on purpose, where it states that LSEs and SLIs may live "outside sexuality" and may have to intellectualize it in order to be comfortable. Can probably apply to I/Cs in general.

    Anyways, so yeah, I don't think SX has to be blatantly sexual, nor restricted just to romantic relationships.


    So do you have a guess as to my stacking? At this point I've tried on each one and am starting to get the impression that stackings aren't real.

    LSE
    1-6-2 so/sx
    Johari Nohari

    Quote Originally Posted by Ritella View Post
    Over here, we'll put up with (almost) all of your crap. You just have to use the secret phrase: "I don't value it. It's related to <insert random element here>, which is not in my quadra."
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquagraph View Post
    Abbie is so boring and rigid it's awesome instead of boring and rigid. She seems so practical and down-to-the-ground.

  3. #43
    Queen of the Damned Aylen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Spiritus Mundi
    TIM
    psyche 4w5 sx/sp
    Posts
    11,276
    Mentioned
    948 Post(s)
    Tagged
    42 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Neokortex View Post
    There's no way you're an Sx-dom for the very reason that you're mocking my Sx hunger. As if you've never had this feeling, of being anxious, waiting for the crowd to dissipate, walls of insincere people to yield way to that other person waiting for you. Ain't it easy to poke fun of that despair when you've never had it? So if we've already had this convo before, did you answer it the last time with opening up more? Or was it just the same playful, impish, elusive (so/sx) butterfly, ever so light that ghosts one to leap to the next?
    I find you to be needy for the social approval of your opinions and you want attention from women who have told you no. You are a voyeur of other people's sx because you are clueless. You asked me for details on my sex life and I declined. I didn't want your energy invading mine so I blocked your energy, not your posts.

    You are not someone I would want to merge with and still you cry about social instinct like sx is going to just immerse themselves with anyone. You instantly creeped me out. Is it coming back to you? You are like a dime a dozen on social media platforms trying to make some kind of connection to me when I don't want it. People can tell when I am interested because I do immerse myself in the experience. I don't do it with just some rando on the forums who wants to draw things out of me I am not interested in sharing with them.

    Maybe consider you have social anxiety and it is not about sx energy. I don't know you stacking and don't care to.

    I think you told me I was so/sp but not sure.

    Edit: You probably wouldn't remember me since you did it to several women in the sx/sp thread. The exchange went on for days.

    “My typology is . . . not in any sense to stick labels on people at first sight. It is not a physiognomy and not an anthropological system, but a critical psychology dealing with the organization and delimitation of psychic processes that can be shown to be typical.”​ —C.G. Jung

     



  4. #44
    Adam Strange's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Location
    Midwest, USA
    TIM
    ENTJ-1Te 8w7 sx/so
    Posts
    6,643
    Mentioned
    767 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Director Abbie View Post
    I found a site that listed stackings by enneagram type and looked through the 1 descriptions. I didn't really fit any of them, but I tried to order them from fits-most to fits-least.
    so/sx
    sp/so
    sp/sx
    sx/sp
    so/sp
    sx/so
    Also, those descriptions relate sx to close people, not to anything sexual, and I reaffirm that seeing sx as necessarily sexual is a misconception.
    And the 1 descriptions made it clear that sx and 1 don't blend well, and implied that an sx 1 would be unstable. But I'm not unstable. I'm just weird.


    I can relate to that. Not in such thoughts, but a similar impression.


    The attachment styles don't work for me. It seems there's too much fluctuation.




    So do you have a guess as to my stacking? At this point I've tried on each one and am starting to get the impression that stackings aren't real.
    I'm pretty sure that stackings are real. I looked up the most likely instinct stacks for ESTj's, and got this: https://thoughtcatalog.com/heidi-pri...enneagram-2/5/

    It seems the most common for ESTj's are sp/sx, sx/so, and so/sx.

  5. #45
    Neokortex's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2016
    Location
    Post-Colonial Wasteland
    TIM
    Extrovert and Happy.
    Posts
    203
    Mentioned
    11 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Aylen View Post
    Not only that but you have people writing subjective descriptions of types based on themselves who never even read the basics of the enneagram system and definitely didn't study it. These get passed around as if they are some kind of fact about an enneagram type or instinct stacking just by people copy/pasting from one place to another. I have passed them on too without checking it out.

    Is sx really the death instinct as some writers say, sx/sp the phoenix rising from the ashes? In this world we are going to have to rise from the ashes of our lives eventually. Probably more than once. Time will catch up with us all (hear that 7s you can't avoid yourself forever?) and events that cannot be foreseen will happen. How you deal with these things will give an idea of what enneagram, instincts and socionics type is best fit.

    The quote is not to be read too literal and neither are the sx descriptions. So many things can factor into the expression of an instinct and E type. Reading all these brief descriptions and trying to apply a paragraph or two to a complex person is why people get confused. If you want to use enneagram as a tool, read the books and everything you can find on the type(s) you think you are and go from there. Find what really resonates on all levels. Your personal feelings really cannot be trusted so get feedback from different people you know well. Ask family and friends how you were as a child. They know things about you that people here do not and things you probably wouldn't even share here no matter how open you are. I noticed Russ is giving the same advice and he is a teacher who will NOT tell someone their type which makes total sense to me.

    Too many people use E type and instincts as a filler for their online profile and don't use it for self awareness. That is why you will see people with enneagram types that are contradictory to socionics types. This is no easy task.

    If you type sx first just because you are a romantic or want to be loved then consider other types too. Maybe the above will serve as a good example for the life of some sx 4 or even some sp 4s with strong sx. Sp/sx 4s are made out in some descriptions to be dauntless but I find them to be more self controlled and not as dependent on the spark an sx needs from something outside themselves. It can look like Se seeking but there are differences that emerge when you take in the whole instead of focusing on one statement here and there then basing your self or other people's typing around it. I have seen some of you around for years and still don't get a clear idea of what type you are or instincts you best fit.

    Sx 4s have an energy they do not contain as well as some of the other instincts. If you are a very healthy type then congrats maybe your instincts are more balanced and you might not see much of yourself in any of the descriptions. If you are very unhealthy you may not either.

    This stuff is so deeply personal so, if you can, find someone who knows the system well and will work with you to help you figure it out. Most people here are not going to put the energy or effort into it. A test probably won't help as much without the prerequisite understanding of the system but it is better than nothing and they are fun. You might have better luck in an enneagram group than on here since those who know the system well here come and go. Many have no desire to talk about it anymore but if someone helps type you have them explain why so that you know you are on the same page and they are not misunderstanding you.

    Even though others can help you find your type, if they understand the system, in the end it is up to you to apply it in the real world to see if it helps you grow in some way. Advice for other types can often be useful too but it doesn't usually have the same impact on me as the advice for sx 4s. It is ok to look at other types and not be sure. Years ago I wanted to be a 9 and didn't want to look at anything else. I thought 4s were lame, crybabies. They are so much more.

    People who make long enneagram lists of people they don't even know and throw out types without asking you questions then add the authoritative tone by saying "obvious" or "definite" are to be taken with a grain of salt since many of them will mistype for years and not bother to find out how it applies to them. Take what I say with a grain of salt too since I see the world through the veil of my base function and the instincts that drive me.
    This should be the opening thread to every other Enneagram thread. People should be "forced" to or be unable to go around reading this before venturing into the Enneagram forum. Well done, I agree with your views.
    Except for impaired empathy, an ordinary guy who's looking for down-to-earth, loving, loyal friends and a geeky, warm, voluptuous girlfriend!

  6. #46
    Queen of the Damned Aylen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Spiritus Mundi
    TIM
    psyche 4w5 sx/sp
    Posts
    11,276
    Mentioned
    948 Post(s)
    Tagged
    42 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Neokortex View Post
    This should be the opening thread to every other Enneagram thread. People should be "forced" to or be unable to go around reading this before venturing into the Enneagram forum. Well done, I agree with your views.
    At least we agree on something.

    “My typology is . . . not in any sense to stick labels on people at first sight. It is not a physiognomy and not an anthropological system, but a critical psychology dealing with the organization and delimitation of psychic processes that can be shown to be typical.”​ —C.G. Jung

     



  7. #47
    Haikus VenusRose's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2018
    TIM
    EII 4w5 Sx/So
    Posts
    311
    Mentioned
    28 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Unfortunately @Director Abbie , I need to know the person and/or have observed them over a long period of time in order to really provide a more solid guess as to type. Otherwise it's just based on vague impressions...not that they are necessarily incorrect all the time.

    So really, it's up to you, what you think fits you best. I found this from Katherine Fauvre:

    The social instinct will seek a mate that could potentially insure the desired security that rank and social status can provide… or a mate with a shared social vision. Or, the social could be anti-social and avoid having a mate and others. Once the mate chosen and in place, the social will return to their outside interests, groups and/or activities. An area of pain and disappointment for the social type is when they have a mate that is unwilling to pay attention to their need for people, activities, causes and/or is unwilling to share their interest in others.


    The sexual instinct will seek the greater world and become more social to find "the" desired mate. It is about chemistry and intensity. One must be social to find "the one" among the many. But, only "the one" will do. Some sexual types will try over an over again to find "the one" while other sexual instinctual types will abstain from dating or pairing until they magically encounter their twin flame or special mate. Once the mate is selected they will focus on twinship and become a pair even in groups. They want to fuse totally and completely with their desired other dissolving boundaries and creating their own private world. An area of pain and disappointment for the sexual is when they have a mate that is unwilling to pay attention to their need for intimate contact, intensity and union on all levels.
    Of course, she talks about mating and romantic relationships, but you can replace that with "friendships" if you would like to.

    Which one do you see yourself more in? I know you have talked about how you may or may not relate to SX descriptions, but what about Social? How do you - or not - relate to it?

    I do agree with Fauvres that SX is about the 'one on one' connection and intimacy and it's "not about sex." At least, not as blatantly sexual as many like to make it. It might be for them, but not necessarily the only manifestation of SX.

    This is also from Katherine Fauvre:

    Sexual/Intimate
    Both positively and negatively identified sexual instinctual types long for their favorite, their beloved and the object of their desire whether a life partner or a lifelong friend.

  8. #48
    Darn Socks Abbie the Child's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Southwest USA
    TIM
    LSE
    Posts
    7,084
    Mentioned
    352 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Neokortex View Post
    You guys aren't really here to discuss details, to be intimate about how you feel, this is just like a females' mag's letter column to you.
    Well, I ain't gonna be sharing how I intimately feel with you. It ain't your business. I barely know you!
    Sheesh. What kind of would want people to publicly barf up their feelings?

    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    I'm pretty sure that stackings are real. I looked up the most likely instinct stacks for ESTj's, and got this: https://thoughtcatalog.com/heidi-pri...enneagram-2/5/

    It seems the most common for ESTj's are sp/sx, sx/so, and so/sx.
    I noticed that the ones I relate to better are all synflow.

    LSE
    1-6-2 so/sx
    Johari Nohari

    Quote Originally Posted by Ritella View Post
    Over here, we'll put up with (almost) all of your crap. You just have to use the secret phrase: "I don't value it. It's related to <insert random element here>, which is not in my quadra."
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquagraph View Post
    Abbie is so boring and rigid it's awesome instead of boring and rigid. She seems so practical and down-to-the-ground.

  9. #49
    Neokortex's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2016
    Location
    Post-Colonial Wasteland
    TIM
    Extrovert and Happy.
    Posts
    203
    Mentioned
    11 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Aylen View Post
    I find you to be needy for the social approval of your opinions and you want attention from women who have told you no. You are a voyeur of other people's sx because you are clueless. You asked me for details on my sex life and I declined. I didn't want your energy invading mine so I blocked your energy, not your posts.

    You are not someone I would want to merge with and still you cry about social instinct like sx is going to just immerse themselves with anyone. You instantly creeped me out. Is it coming back to you? You are like a dime a dozen on social media platforms trying to make some kind of connection to me when I don't want it.[...]

    Maybe consider you have social anxiety and it is not about sx energy. I don't know you stacking and don't care to.[...]
    Okay, what I remember is not that I was pressing harder when women had clearly told me "no," rather that I may have been more vehement when women were ghosting me. This is a communication problem, not a "voyeur" problem, IMO. Your choice of word adds a moral weight, as well as a rhetorical spin to it, whereas the purpose of the forum is to make connections, so one should be allowed to approach others (in the proper subforums). What may appear insidious is my intellectual "tackling" of people's attitudes, beliefs. Why do I do that? Well, I'm an Sx head type and I'm going to state this here loud and clear: people are very nebulous, elusive here about their purposes, motivation, agenda. This also ties into your previous comment on Ennegram being exploited. And when I say "opening up more," I don't mean it in the prying sense, I don't expect your deepest secrets. It's just that according to my baseline of intellectual/political honesty, which can be also culture related, people are very closed off here. Very scattered, unreliable, hard to grasp, in a sense that they come off as conniving, duplicitous in my perception. It's as if they expected me to take all their type indications for granted and not call them out on their behavioral discrepancies. And when I do, people go silent and you jump on rhetoric to call me a voyeur. Well, all Sxs need the juice and Sx/Sp are the "hungry ghosts/wanderers" because of being blind to the social network that could match them up with similar zombies. So we cold approach. This is why you perceive us as "voyeurs."
    You got a problem with that? Then, drop your pride and consider that you may not be an Sx/Sp. Because what we need is help from the socials, like the Socials who don't portray themselves as such but still have this cool thing going on on Discord, their extra channel because why one forum if we can social network further out?
    People can tell when I am interested because I do immerse myself in the experience. I don't do it with just some rando on the forums who wants to draw things out of me I am not interested in sharing with them.
    Well, maybe a woman who was actually an Sx/Sp wouldn't mind the random approach, perhaps because they would have been as much as lost in this crowd of fake individuals as I am. People (that is, a certain range of types) can tell when you are interested but that doesn't give you the right to complain when they didn't read your thoughts.
    Edit: You probably wouldn't remember me since you did it to several women in the sx/sp thread. The exchange went on for days.
    I mean yeah, subtypes react differently but I've encountered your current antagonism before on PerC and it was the same problem, people indicating Sx-dom, yet being unable to properly define it, complete with examples from their life to give some (semblance of) proof that they got their type right. This is what I mean by intellectual murkiness. They fancy this or that type but are unwilling to back it up and then get upset when an Sx/Sp weirds them out. It was the Sx/Sp forum and Sx/Sps are (more or less) asocial animals, FYI; we're supposed to be weirdos. And wherever we go, we get harassed for that. If that doesn't resonate with you, then your antagonistic attitude/sensitivity to our cold approach suggests that it was you and the rest of you who were/are out of place, not me. (and no, I don't remember going on for more than a couple of days and no, I wasn't as prying and lecherous as your smear rhetoric suggests)
    Last edited by Neokortex; 01-16-2019 at 11:37 PM.
    Except for impaired empathy, an ordinary guy who's looking for down-to-earth, loving, loyal friends and a geeky, warm, voluptuous girlfriend!

  10. #50
    Neokortex's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2016
    Location
    Post-Colonial Wasteland
    TIM
    Extrovert and Happy.
    Posts
    203
    Mentioned
    11 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Director Abbie View Post
    Well, I ain't gonna be sharing how I intimately feel with you. It ain't your business. I barely know you!
    Sheesh. What kind of would want people to publicly barf up their feelings?
    What?! No! Intimacy can also mean you write stories of your life where you don't give the names of people but you're more particular about the succession of events and how those impacted you. What I see is that you guys aren't giving in-depth examples, jump around topics (banter) and argue with sparse descriptions.

    I don't give much thought to my social standing, though it is nice to be generally well-liked. But I do get obsessive about my closest friendships. (Like being pleased at the thought of my closest male friend marrying someone who's not me, but scheming how to overthrow his best man if he picks someone other than me.) (Like spending time when I should be working plotting fun gifts to send my friends.) (Like crying when a close friend is too busy to spend time with me because I think that means our friendship is over.) (Like abandoning a casual friend I was chatting with when someone who outranks them messages me.)
    To my understanding of the social type, you blatantly reveal yourself here to be So/Sp. Not the stereotypical anxious-about-fitting-in but the secure attachment, level headed one. You value tradition (Si), as well as this social-cultural rituals (wedding) to find them important enough not to miss the "best man" role. You are aware that it is expected from you to keep in touch with your friends, and you accept that one way to do that is through this other ritual "plotting fun gifts" (which are indirect expressions, mediators, so to speak, instead of direct intimacy). You don't strive to reach a certain intimacy with a casual friend and feel no guilt about it as you easily abandon them for someone who "outranks" them. This coming from an ESTJ may also connote social status (e.g. someone with whom you have more future with; same social class) beyond emotional closeness.
    Last edited by Neokortex; 01-16-2019 at 11:27 PM.
    Except for impaired empathy, an ordinary guy who's looking for down-to-earth, loving, loyal friends and a geeky, warm, voluptuous girlfriend!

  11. #51
    Queen of the Damned Aylen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Spiritus Mundi
    TIM
    psyche 4w5 sx/sp
    Posts
    11,276
    Mentioned
    948 Post(s)
    Tagged
    42 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Neokortex View Post
    Okay, what I remember is not that I was pressing harder when women had clearly told me "no," rather that I may have been more vehement when women were ghosting me. This is a communication problem, not a "voyeur" problem in my opinion. Your choice of word adds a moral weight, as well as a rhetorical spin to it, whereas the purpose of the forum is to make connections, so one should be allowed to approach others (in the proper subforums). What may appear insidious is my intellectual "tackling" of people's attitudes, beliefs. Why do I do that? Well, I'm an Sx head type and I'm going to state this here loud and clear: people are very nebulous, elusive here about their purposes, motivation, agenda. This also ties into the your previous comment of Ennegram being exploited. And when I say "opening up more," I don't mean it in the prying sense, I don't expect your deepest secrets. It's just that according to my baseline of intellectual/political honesty, which can be also culture related, people are very closed off here. Very scattered, unreliable, hard to grasp, in a sense that they come off as conniving, duplicitous in my perception. It's as if they expected me to take all their type indications for granted and not call them out on their behavioral discrepancies. And when I do, people go silent and you jump on rhetoric to call me a voyeur. Well, all Sxs need the juice and Sx/Sp are the "hungry ghosts" because of being blind to the social network that could mediate them to other zombies like them. This is why you perceive us as "voyeurs."
    You got a problem with that? Then, drop your pride and consider that you may not be an Sx/Sp. Because what we need is help from the socials, like the socials who don't consider themselves as such but they still have this cool thing going on on Discord, their extra channel because social networking has its ways of self-organization..., I guess.

    Well, maybe a woman who was actually an Sx/Sp wouldn't mind the random approach, perhaps because they would have been as much as lost in this crowd of fake individuals as I am. People (that is, a certain range of types) can tell when you are interested but that doesn't give you the right to complain when they didn't read your thoughts.

    I mean yeah, subtypes react differently but I've encountered your current antagonism before on PerC and it was the same problem, people indicating the Sx-dom instinct, yet being unable to give a proper definition of it, complete with examples from their life to give some (semblance of) proof that they got their type right. This is what I mean by intellectual murkiness. They fancy this or that type but are unwilling to back it up and then get upset when an Sx/Sp weirds them out. It was the Sx/Sp forum and Sx/Sps are asocial animals (more or less) FYI; we're supposed to be weirdos. Yet, we can't allow that to show. If that doesn't resonate with you, than your antagonistic attitude to our cold approach suggests that it was you and the rest of you who were/are out of place, not me. (and no, I don't remember going on for more than a couple of days and no, I wasn't as prying and lecherous as you make it sound like)
    I was a bit harsh but only because you are pulling the same frustrating nonsense you did in that thread and typing anyone who would not give you the details on their sex life or how they get "intimate" with others social firsts. Sorry you felt you had to defend yourself. You are free to read any post of mine in any thread. I don't tend to analyze my sx instinct in public threads when I don't want to. I don't want to. I am secure in my self typings and don't really need to. If I share anything it is because I want to. I didn't want to have the "intimate" conversation you were seeking then and neither did anyone else from what I remember. It only went on for days with me. It went on weeks with you and others.

    “My typology is . . . not in any sense to stick labels on people at first sight. It is not a physiognomy and not an anthropological system, but a critical psychology dealing with the organization and delimitation of psychic processes that can be shown to be typical.”​ —C.G. Jung

     



  12. #52
    Darn Socks Abbie the Child's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Southwest USA
    TIM
    LSE
    Posts
    7,084
    Mentioned
    352 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)

    Default

    @VenusRose
    Well, I do like the idea of getting my friends to meet each other and would like to show them off and would be disappointed if they didn't want to meet anybody. It's not a status thing, though, more like sharing. "I love this game/book/person! You should try it too. (Then you'll understand what I'm into.)"

    There is something elusive in finding someone I can be close to. It's not about "the one" though. The nice thing about it being best-friendship and not romance is that I can get away with having two or three if I can find them.
    I do want the lifelong friend. Always have. But who wouldn't?

    The thing about social standing is that when I accidentally end up with it I'm not sure what to do with it. 'Cause I feel I'm supposed to do something with my new social power. But then I'm like, "Okay, everyone should throw their shoelaces on a pile and grab a new set." and nobody listens to me and my social standing drops again and I realize if I try to have a social affect, I won't. So I just try to ignore that and it fluxuates on its own as it is meant to do. Fame is fickle or something like that.

    LSE
    1-6-2 so/sx
    Johari Nohari

    Quote Originally Posted by Ritella View Post
    Over here, we'll put up with (almost) all of your crap. You just have to use the secret phrase: "I don't value it. It's related to <insert random element here>, which is not in my quadra."
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquagraph View Post
    Abbie is so boring and rigid it's awesome instead of boring and rigid. She seems so practical and down-to-the-ground.

  13. #53
    Haikus VenusRose's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2018
    TIM
    EII 4w5 Sx/So
    Posts
    311
    Mentioned
    28 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Director Abbie View Post
    There is something elusive in finding someone I can be close to. It's not about "the one" though. The nice thing about it being best-friendship and not romance is that I can get away with having two or three if I can find them.
    I do want the lifelong friend. Always have. But who wouldn't?
    The thing with SX I think, even with friendships, is that there is this intense desire to find (well at least one ) individual you can be completely and totally close to. There might be feelings of jealousy and such, related to that. In that sense it comes across as more of a "one-on-one" or "the one" focus.

    The thing about social standing is that when I accidentally end up with it I'm not sure what to do with it. 'Cause I feel I'm supposed to do something with my new social power. But then I'm like, "Okay, everyone should throw their shoelaces on a pile and grab a new set." and nobody listens to me and my social standing drops again and I realize if I try to have a social affect, I won't. So I just try to ignore that and it fluxuates on its own as it is meant to do. Fame is fickle or something like that.
    Ah, ok. Do you relate at all to "Afraid of losing your place in the community" or wanting to contribute and "belong" so to speak, whether it be with a group or communities, etc. ?
    Last edited by VenusRose; 01-17-2019 at 12:45 AM.

  14. #54
    Darn Socks Abbie the Child's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Southwest USA
    TIM
    LSE
    Posts
    7,084
    Mentioned
    352 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Neokortex View Post
    What?! No! Intimacy can also mean you write stories of your life where you don't give the names of people but you're more particular about the succession of events and how those impacted you. What I see is that you guys aren't giving in-depth examples, jump around topics (banter) and argue with sparse descriptions.
    Names left out, obviously. But saying how I was impacted is personal too, so you'd have to either be someone I know and trust or have a really good excuse for needing the data for statistical/scientific purposes.

    Quote Originally Posted by Neokortex View Post
    To my understanding of the social type, you blatantly reveal yourself here to be So/Sp. Not the stereotypical anxious-about-fitting-in but the secure attachment, level headed one. You value tradition (Si), as well as this social-cultural rituals (wedding) to find them important enough not to miss the "best man" role. You are aware that it is expected from you to keep in touch with your friends, and you accept that one way to do that is through this other ritual "plotting fun gifts" (which are indirect expressions, mediators, so to speak, instead of direct intimacy). You don't strive to reach a certain intimacy with a casual friend and feel no guilt about it as you easily abandon them for someone who "outranks" them. This coming from an ESTJ may also connote social status (e.g. someone with whom you have more future with; same social class) beyond emotional closeness.
    "Best man" role usually goes to the groom's best friend (not counting his bride). So being chosen for that would be showing me that he sees me as his closest friend he would have no intention of kissing.
    You misunderstood my "should" comment. I should have been working rather than plotting gift ideas. As in I do that while at work and that's not in my job description.
    I feel a little guilt about abandoning a casual friend. I wouldn't normally do that for something trivial like eating.
    Social status beyond emotional closeness? What nonsense is this? Their rank is based on emotional closeness, obviously!

    Quote Originally Posted by VenusRose View Post
    The thing with SX I think, even with friendships, is that there is this intense desire to find (well at least one ) individual you can be completely and totally close to. There might be feelings of jealousy and such, related to that. In that sense it comes across as more of a "one-on-one" or "the one" focus.
    I suppose I can relate to that.
    I once made a list of traits I hope for in a friend. And usually I've had to have a few friends to cover all the points for completion. So when one person seemed to qualify for all of them, I was overwhelmed.
    Someone who likes me as much as I like them? Who I can have fun with. Who cares enough that they would even go out of their way to be there for me if I need help. Someone who can understand my humor (and whose humor I understand) even during an intellectual conversation. (Someone I can have intellectual conversation with.) Someone who makes me feel understood in general. Even someone who I might "hang out" with for no good reason?
    Quote Originally Posted by VenusRose View Post
    Ah, ok. Do you relate at all to "Afraid of losing your place in the community" or wanting to contribute and "belong" so to speak, whether it be with a group of or communities, etc. ?
    Losing my place in the community? I never considered it. Don't know how that would happen. I suppose if I moved to a different community. But that wouldn't bother me.
    I definitely want a sense of belonging. But it seems that the smaller the group of belonging, the more meaningful it is. (To a point. 3-5 seems to be a sweet spot.) And I would want my contribution to be of specialization. So each person in the group has something they're good at and there's not competition to take someone else's specialty.

    LSE
    1-6-2 so/sx
    Johari Nohari

    Quote Originally Posted by Ritella View Post
    Over here, we'll put up with (almost) all of your crap. You just have to use the secret phrase: "I don't value it. It's related to <insert random element here>, which is not in my quadra."
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquagraph View Post
    Abbie is so boring and rigid it's awesome instead of boring and rigid. She seems so practical and down-to-the-ground.

  15. #55
    Heaven and Hell Samson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    TIM
    LSI
    Posts
    325
    Mentioned
    39 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Director Abbie View Post
    Well, based on the first part of your post I must be either sx/sp or sx/so.
    But what you described as so is what I had in mind for sx. Just that regular social interactions I can do. They can get tiresome, but I kinda like them, and they're not a problem. But they don't fix loneliness - they pause it.
    And being understood requires a deeper connection.
    The way I see it, being attractive is more an so thing than an sx thing. It helps one to fit in socially. (And I've always disregarded and even insulted popular styles.) The more closely people know you, the more forgiving they are of physical appearance.

    I have low neuroticism overall. I don't worry about my physical well-being, I'm not concerned about losing romantic interests, and I don't give much thought to my social standing, though it is nice to be generally well-liked. But I do get obsessive about my closest friendships. (Like being pleased at the thought of my closest male friend marrying someone who's not me, but scheming how to overthrow his best man if he picks someone other than me.) (Like spending time when I should be working plotting fun gifts to send my friends.) (Like crying when a close friend is too busy to spend time with me because I think that means our friendship is over.) (Like abandoning a casual friend I was chatting with when someone who outranks them messages me.)
    Being up-to-date-with-the-trends may be Social, but needing to be attractive is directly related to sexuality and partnership. It is about seducing and being seduced, and looking hot and sexy is a must.

    There is a reason it is called 'sexual' after all. And yes, it is a very basic need for our species, it is an instinct. I don't understand this notion that it shouldn't be about sex. Sex is vital to our existence, just as much as preserving ourselves and the group is - if not moreso depending how you look at it.

    Denying the importance of sex in our base make-up as human beings is exactly what 'blindspot' means. VenusRose's idea that somehow the Delta quadra downplays sex even when they are Sx dominant is nonsense. Have you ever met an IEE Sx/So 6? I have. The sex is dripping out of their eyes. Of course I can say what I want, you don't have to believe me on this one.
    Another example would be Helena Bonham Carter. Not-Sx-blindspot Delta person. Looking at her, yeah.. she cares about sex.

    Anyway, I didn't realize this was a typing thread, so I do apologize for my tone in this post. I assure you I have nothing against you or your typing or w/e. My frustration lies with the denial of something so potentially beautiful, by so many people across forums and IRL, including teachers and writers, and it pains me that sex, desire, eros,... is looked at as dirty or fake and that it needs to be cleansed from its 'sin' as it were. And similarly the beauty of the social arena gets erased for much of the same 'sin:' that of superficiality. It pains me to see that the depths of these mechanisms are denied.

    In a post not directed at me you say this:
    Well, I do like the idea of getting my friends to meet each other and would like to show them off and would be disappointed if they didn't want to meet anybody. It's not a status thing, though, more like sharing. "I love this game/book/person! You should try it too. (Then you'll understand what I'm into.)"

    There is something elusive in finding someone I can be close to. It's not about "the one" though. The nice thing about it being best-friendship and not romance is that I can get away with having two or three if I can find them.
    I do want the lifelong friend. Always have. But who wouldn't?

    See, this is what is so beautiful about the Social instinct: being able to share interests and people and connections and the warmth that comes from feeling safe and not-lonely and at home with one another.

    To answer the question of "who wouldn't?" - though I realize it was mostly rhetorical in nature - I don't. My wife is my soulmate, I share everything with her and we have bonded on the deepest level. Eros to the max, but not to the exclusion of the other forms of love. 'Friend' isn't good enough for me. But that is because I undervalue friendship. My social instinct is my blindspot and it comes very hard for me to see what other people see in having friends. I feel like I just don't benefit much from them. Now, that is my personal bias, inspired by my natural tendencies which I have typed as social last, and I can acknowledge that I am indeed missing out. But I do struggle to understand what I am missing out on. But I try, like what I wrote in the paragraph above, about what is so beautiful about the social instinct. I think that you innately understand its beauty better than I do, just as I understand the beauty in the sex(ual) instinct better than you. And neither of these are more or less important than the other per se, except on the individual level of preferences and life journeys and lessons.

  16. #56
    Haikus VenusRose's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2018
    TIM
    EII 4w5 Sx/So
    Posts
    311
    Mentioned
    28 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Samson View Post
    Denying the importance of sex in our base make-up as human beings is exactly what 'blindspot' means. VenusRose's idea that somehow the Delta quadra downplays sex even when they are Sx dominant is nonsense. Have you ever met an IEE Sx/So 6? I have. The sex is dripping out of their eyes. Of course I can say what I want, you don't have to believe me on this one.
    Another example would be Helena Bonham Carter. Not-Sx-blindspot Delta person. Looking at her, yeah.. she cares about sex.
    That's not what I said. "They downplay sex." I said they prefer subtle ways of communicating that, instead of the more blatant and in your face descriptions.

  17. #57
    Volcana's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    At the crux.
    TIM
    SeF 4w3-8w7-5w6 SpSx
    Posts
    126
    Mentioned
    22 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    I've never met anyone that cares more about losing their place in the big, wide community than about their close friendships and having a partner. It would require serious illness to be that far removed from deep connection.
    Soc instinct is not a mental illness or a 'problem with depth.' Being Soc dominant doesnt mean you care more about communities than people you're close to.
    Soc is actually the instinct that cares most about deep connection between two humans.

    I'm Sx/So, the love of my life is @Samson, blatantly Soc last. He really is not that taken with "connecting." The eros is high between us, and he does trust me and open up to me 100% - we have no lack of trust. But sometimes I have to remind him to get out of his personal corner to 'Share' - to remind him that we also need to bond.

    He loves this about me, as it is a basic human need; but he's just not as good at recognizing it. But he's very high Sx, so he does merge with the fascinating and alluring qualities about me, like getting deep into my fantasy novel, both dressing up to impress and allure the other, etc.
    This forum is a haven for art, archetypes, typology and more! Join the tribe.
    ----> ARCHETRIBE.COM <----

  18. #58
    Heaven and Hell Samson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    TIM
    LSI
    Posts
    325
    Mentioned
    39 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by VenusRose View Post
    That's not what I said. "They downplay sex." I said they prefer subtle ways of communicating that, instead of the more blatant and in your face descriptions.
    But communicate they do - and putting the emphasis on friendships instead is taking away the vital aspect of this instinct

  19. #59
    Haikus VenusRose's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2018
    TIM
    EII 4w5 Sx/So
    Posts
    311
    Mentioned
    28 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Samson View Post
    But communicate they do - and putting the emphasis on friendships instead is taking away the vital aspect of this instinct
    Ok I was just clearing up what looked like a misunderstanding.

    DA's instinct stacking is upto her, I don't know her well enough yet to comment.

    And I don't think "friendships" are necessarily "not SX first either" as I provided the example with my friend.

    But communicate they do
    Indeed, that is exactly what I think is missed by people online at least, when they suppose that anybody who isn't talking about SX perhaps in this way, as an example...must not be talking about SX. It's a language thing, it's in the body language, the eyes, I don't know how to describe it. It's sexual, but it's not going to be in your face sexual.

    So to reiterate, I never said:
    1) They downplay sex.
    nor
    2) Sex is dirty thing and things should be cleansed of it, lol.

    I would appreciate you not twisting things and making it look like something it is not, that is all.
    Last edited by VenusRose; 01-17-2019 at 03:33 AM.

  20. #60
    Luminous Lynx Memento Mori's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2018
    TIM
    D-ESI-Se 1w2
    Posts
    307
    Mentioned
    66 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Volcana View Post
    the love of my life is @Samson,
    Oh, wow!

    I already thought the two of You were lovely individually, but to hear You're together is incredible! This honestly made my day. Congratulations to the both of You!
    "We live in an age in which there is no heroic death."


    Model A: ESI-Se -
    DCNH: Dominant

    Enneagram: 1w2, 2w1, 6w7
    Instinctual Variant: Sx/So


  21. #61
    squark's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    TIM
    1sx
    Posts
    3,030
    Mentioned
    257 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Director Abbie View Post
    Really, so is sx really that moronic and shallow?

    What do the Fi people say?
    It's not moronic or shallow imo, nor does it only have to do with relationships. It's Van Gogh painting, it's Archimedes yelling "Eureka" it's power, energy, a bright light bursting forth, a powerful magnet pulling some in, forcing others away. It's strong and rich, and unpalatable to many, something so saturated and bitter that many will spew it right out of their mouths, but an intoxicating elixir to others, it's a divine mission, a calling, a drive and a lust, it's electricity coursing through your veins, lightning escaping, and you have to manage it, pull it in, direct it, keep its laser from burning right through everything, it's destructive and creative, it's everything but lukewarm.

    You and I share an enneagram type. We're both 1s. I don't think I can name anyone who finds you objectionable. Not really, not even when you say things they value are moronic and shallow lol. I've never seen you to have any enemies. On the other hand, I create them without even trying. People like you, or they're at least neutral towards you, they either feel warmly towards you, or whatever other feelings they might have are mild, I've never seen anyone express any kind of strong dislike towards you. (And obviously I don't know every instance, and maybe it's happened, but as a normal, general trend, it doesn't really happen, at least not that I've seen on this forum.) Some people like me, many more hate me, talk about me lol, seethe with anger. I've inspired through just being me such bitter hatred that I've even left and returned disguised, only to have different people hate me lol.

    And I'm not trying to say that sx is about hate, not at all, but it's polarizing, and especially when it's in an enneagram 1, because we have other traits that people can find hard to tolerate, very unpleasant, probably one of the most hated enneagram types there are heh. Because we can't help but say what we think if we think something is wrong. We can control ourselves in the minor details, learn to let things go, but not the things that matter to us. You know it, I know it, Sol knows it - it really bothers people and each of us does it anyway. But you're the only one who gets away with it without creating enemies. And it's not because you're a better person lol (though I'm sure there's plenty of people who would like to jump in to say so). It's because you're inoffensive, mild, toned down. You're the Sunday school teacher people come to talk to, while I'm the hellfire and brimstone fanatic screaming from the pulpit. I've managed to reign this in a lot, although sometimes my attempts to hold it back end up making me look even more like an asshole heh. Learning enneagram has taught me a lot that has helped me, and I'm figuring things out. I know how to relax, to not be so critical of myself and others, I can see the humor in most things and purposely turn insults into something benign, but the polarity remains. Have you ever had to contend with that kind of polarity, ever?

    In an enneagram 1, sx energy is righteous anger, it's power of conviction, it's Joan of Arc leading an army, it's Samson armed with only a jawbone standing in the middle of his enemies covered in their blood until every one of them is dead, it's anger and power and energy to do what you know is right. And nothing will stand in your way because every fiber of your being tells you that you're doing the right thing. It's beautiful and terrible and when unhealthy can cause a person to destroy everything and everyone even innocents, even people they shouldn't have, because the belief in one's own rightness can make a villain more easily than it makes a hero. That to me is what it's like to be an sx 1, and the sx description of the 1 is the only one I can fully relate to. It's a picture of me. I think your portrait is a different one. Someone more stable, dependable, rock-solid and a comfort. Not someone who might go scorched earth in pursuit of an ideal. Never the villain.

  22. #62
    Haikus VenusRose's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2018
    TIM
    EII 4w5 Sx/So
    Posts
    311
    Mentioned
    28 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    To reiterate,

    What I find "moronic" is the idea that your language of sexuality is the only one. And anyone who speaks in a different one...well they are not talking about SX, or that it's not sexual. That's not true. You don't know that. I have run into the difficulty again and again where people impose their definition (perhaps it's the "Beta flair" or whatever) on others and it makes me roll my eyes because it is absolutely arrogant.

    Going back to the LSE/SLI description, for instance, to metabolize sex intellectually, does not mean that they are less sexual. Lol. It means the way they make sense of this experience is intellectually. Not that they are less affected by sexuality. And definitely not that SX-ness is not obvious in them as it might be with others.

  23. #63
    Volcana's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    At the crux.
    TIM
    SeF 4w3-8w7-5w6 SpSx
    Posts
    126
    Mentioned
    22 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default










    TeSi - Helena Bonham Carter, Sx dominant
    NeFi - Florence Welch, Sx/So
    FiNe - Marilyn Manson, So/Sx, with Sx amped up by 4 core & 7 fix.
    SiTe - Frida Kahlo , high Sx


    *Note: All cognitive types are verified by Cognitivetype.com based on vultology/ facial signals.
    This forum is a haven for art, archetypes, typology and more! Join the tribe.
    ----> ARCHETRIBE.COM <----

  24. #64
    Haikus VenusRose's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2018
    TIM
    EII 4w5 Sx/So
    Posts
    311
    Mentioned
    28 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default



    Not that they are less affected by sexuality. And definitely not that SX-ness is not obvious in them as it might be with others.
    And I don't personally have comments on types of those individuals regardless of what they are "verified" by, lol. So no comment on that, at least.

    I was commenting on the language used, specially online, when talking about SX...not pictures of people. Or what they look like. Also should put another disclaimer here I suppose, the erotic attitudes may not map directly onto the types as much as they are stated to be. Though that should be obvious, but still, just to be clear. As such, not all Deltas or Alphas will identify with infantile/caregiver and several people may identify with several descriptions...it really depends.
    Last edited by VenusRose; 01-17-2019 at 04:11 AM.

  25. #65
    Darn Socks Abbie the Child's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Southwest USA
    TIM
    LSE
    Posts
    7,084
    Mentioned
    352 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)

    Default

    Volcana, I don't know who those people are, but their pictures are irrelevant.

    Samson, your post is all "blah-blah-sexy-sexy-sex" and basically a wad of the main misconception I was addressing in my initial post.

    Quote Originally Posted by Volcana View Post
    I've never met anyone that cares more about losing their place in the big, wide community than about their close friendships and having a partner. It would require serious illness to be that far removed from deep connection.
    Soc instinct is not a mental illness or a 'problem with depth.' Being Soc dominant doesn't mean you care more about communities than people you're close to.
    Oh, I wouldn't think of it as any more mentally ill than any other stacking. Just from what I understand in my recent readings and conversations, so people focus more on group interactions. That's okay. It's expected in some cultures and there can be group bonds as well as bonds between individuals.

    Quote Originally Posted by Volcana View Post
    Soc is actually the instinct that cares most about deep connection between two humans.
    You're the only source I've seen make such a claim. And it is no more true than saying soc cares nothing about connection.

    Quote Originally Posted by Volcana View Post
    'm Sx/So, the love of my life is @Samson, blatantly Soc last. He really is not that taken with "connecting." The eros is high between us, and he does trust me and open up to me 100% - we have no lack of trust. But sometimes I have to remind him to get out of his personal corner to 'Share' - to remind him that we also need to bond.

    He loves this about me, as it is a basic human need; but he's just not as good at recognizing it. But he's very high Sx, so he does merge with the fascinating and alluring qualities about me, like getting deep into my fantasy novel, both dressing up to impress and allure the other, etc.
    It's nice that you and your husband have an intimate connection. But I don't see that as an argument for stacking. You're saying "because we are this, this is like us." And that's not good logic. It's goofy logic, for when one wants to make fun of a system.
    I don't even know your sociotypes, which are certainly more applicable to anything positive than stackings are.
    Since stackings are enneagram and enneagram is about weaknesses.

    Quote Originally Posted by squark View Post
    It's not moronic or shallow imo, nor does it only have to do with relationships. It's Van Gogh painting, it's Archimedes yelling "Eureka" it's power, energy, a bright light bursting forth, a powerful magnet pulling some in, forcing others away. It's strong and rich, and unpalatable to many, something so saturated and bitter that many will spew it right out of their mouths, but an intoxicating elixir to others, it's a divine mission, a calling, a drive and a lust, it's electricity coursing through your veins, lightning escaping, and you have to manage it, pull it in, direct it, keep its laser from burning right through everything, it's destructive and creative, it's everything but lukewarm.

    And I'm not trying to say that sx is about hate, not at all, but it's polarizing, and especially when it's in an enneagram 1, because we have other traits that people can find hard to tolerate, very unpleasant, probably one of the most hated enneagram types there are heh. Because we can't help but say what we think if we think something is wrong. We can control ourselves in the minor details, learn to let things go, but not the things that matter to us. You know it, I know it, Sol knows it - it really bothers people and each of us does it anyway. But you're the only one who gets away with it without creating enemies. And it's not because you're a better person lol (though I'm sure there's plenty of people who would like to jump in to say so). It's because you're inoffensive, mild, toned down. You're the Sunday school teacher people come to talk to, while I'm the hellfire and brimstone fanatic screaming from the pulpit. I've managed to reign this in a lot, although sometimes my attempts to hold it back end up making me look even more like an asshole heh. Learning enneagram has taught me a lot that has helped me, and I'm figuring things out. I know how to relax, to not be so critical of myself and others, I can see the humor in most things and purposely turn insults into something benign, but the polarity remains. Have you ever had to contend with that kind of polarity, ever?

    In an enneagram 1, sx energy is righteous anger, it's power of conviction, it's Joan of Arc leading an army, it's Samson armed with only a jawbone standing in the middle of his enemies covered in their blood until every one of them is dead, it's anger and power and energy to do what you know is right. And nothing will stand in your way because every fiber of your being tells you that you're doing the right thing. It's beautiful and terrible and when unhealthy can cause a person to destroy everything and everyone even innocents, even people they shouldn't have, because the belief in one's own rightness can make a villain more easily than it makes a hero. That to me is what it's like to be an sx 1, and the sx description of the 1 is the only one I can fully relate to. It's a picture of me. I think your portrait is a different one. Someone more stable, dependable, rock-solid and a comfort. Not someone who might go scorched earth in pursuit of an ideal. Never the villain.
    Ah, now this is a good argument.
    (And on the subject of moronic and shallow, I read the story of Samson the other day, and those words describe him well. )

    I have had righteous anger once or twice, but I kept it in check.
    When I have that kind of drive, it's more like a plow that must continue even if there's a dog in the way. I'm earth, not fire.

    So do all sx types have that sort of flaming energy, or just the unhealthy ones?
    I read through the stacking descriptions and couldn't find one that fit me. I don't know - should I try reading through the descriptions of 6 and 2 since they're in my tritype? Can I be a 1 with a 6-type stacking?
    And if you are sure I don't have the demeanor of an sx/sp, what would you expect my stacking to be as a 1?
    Are you an sx/so or sx/sp?

    LSE
    1-6-2 so/sx
    Johari Nohari

    Quote Originally Posted by Ritella View Post
    Over here, we'll put up with (almost) all of your crap. You just have to use the secret phrase: "I don't value it. It's related to <insert random element here>, which is not in my quadra."
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquagraph View Post
    Abbie is so boring and rigid it's awesome instead of boring and rigid. She seems so practical and down-to-the-ground.

  26. #66
    squark's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    TIM
    1sx
    Posts
    3,030
    Mentioned
    257 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Aylen View Post
    I thought social too but only going on what I know of Abbie. Her self presentation I suppose. She may not reveal the sx side of herself on the forum. She is a different E type and socionics type so I have to remind myself this is based on how I view other sx firsts and myself.
    That's true, she might not. I also was comparing her to myself and other E1s, but she is still different from me in socionics type and other ways as well. And those differences might be changing things more than I think.

    It's like I can feel the magnetism with them even if I never speak to them. Even if they never speak a word to me either. It is not a physical thing. It is energy. They can look physicallI only really offer some of my own experiences one on one these days since I still believe that if I share to much I will alienate others. I basically spoon feed myself to people I think can't handle it. I was not always like that. It just comes with experience and I am pretty sure a lot of people have not lived a life similar enough to mine to relate. I feel I am more balanced with my instincts now which is a plus.
    Yes, I like seeing it in terms of energy as well. And I see so in terms of warmth. I expressed in the other thread how I also feel that I alienate people, or just look kind of insane or dramatic or something when I express myself, but after I wrote what I did regarding the lack of resonance I wondered if it wasn't tinged with self pity. And that's something I don't want to indulge in. I have no idea if anyone will relate to all the stuff I wrote about how it feels internally to me being a 1 and sx. But some people will understand what I mean, even without having my exact experience, and maybe it'll be useful even for those who don't. Maybe. Idk.

    But I don't want to go into specific personal details either. And I don't think anyone should have to. Nor should they need to prove anything because like you said enneagram is personal, and it is about personal growth. So everyone needs to be able to sort out what is right for them.

  27. #67
    idontgiveaf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Posts
    2,873
    Mentioned
    165 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)

    Default

    ***So an sp would close themselves off and focus on physical survival, an sx would push away acquaintances and cling to only the closest relationships, and an so would try to be around a lot of people to get through the situation.***


    Then I must be an Sp

  28. #68
    Darn Socks Abbie the Child's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Southwest USA
    TIM
    LSE
    Posts
    7,084
    Mentioned
    352 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by idontgiveaf View Post
    ***So an sp would close themselves off and focus on physical survival, an sx would push away acquaintances and cling to only the closest relationships, and an so would try to be around a lot of people to get through the situation.***

    Then I must be an Sp
    Oh, you think there's some merit to this theory?
    Last edited by Abbie the Child; 01-17-2019 at 06:36 AM.

    LSE
    1-6-2 so/sx
    Johari Nohari

    Quote Originally Posted by Ritella View Post
    Over here, we'll put up with (almost) all of your crap. You just have to use the secret phrase: "I don't value it. It's related to <insert random element here>, which is not in my quadra."
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquagraph View Post
    Abbie is so boring and rigid it's awesome instead of boring and rigid. She seems so practical and down-to-the-ground.

  29. #69
    squark's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    TIM
    1sx
    Posts
    3,030
    Mentioned
    257 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Ah, saw your post just now @Director Abbie. Will get back to you after I get some sleep.

  30. #70
    Adam Strange's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Location
    Midwest, USA
    TIM
    ENTJ-1Te 8w7 sx/so
    Posts
    6,643
    Mentioned
    767 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by idontgiveaf View Post
    ***So an sp would close themselves off and focus on physical survival, an sx would push away acquaintances and cling to only the closest relationships, and an so would try to be around a lot of people to get through the situation.***


    Then I must be an Sp
    It's hard to argue with that logic.

    So I won't.

    I wonder how the Chicago Bears are doing?

  31. #71
    Volcana's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    At the crux.
    TIM
    SeF 4w3-8w7-5w6 SpSx
    Posts
    126
    Mentioned
    22 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Director Abbie View Post
    Volcana, I don't know who those people are, but their pictures are irrelevant.

    Samson, your post is all "blah-blah-sexy-sexy-sex" and basically a wad of the main misconception I was addressing in my initial post.
    Ah, now this is a good argument.
    (And on the subject of moronic and shallow, I read the story of Samson the other day, and those words describe him well. )
    Wow. I've never had anyone respond so rudely when they didn't even know me. You don't have to agree with my opinion, or Samson's, but I feel for you if this is how you react to a disagreement with strangers.

    I wish you the best on your typing journey and your other endeavors.
    This forum is a haven for art, archetypes, typology and more! Join the tribe.
    ----> ARCHETRIBE.COM <----

  32. #72
    Volcana's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    At the crux.
    TIM
    SeF 4w3-8w7-5w6 SpSx
    Posts
    126
    Mentioned
    22 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Luminous Lynx View Post
    Oh, wow!

    I already thought the two of You were lovely individually, but to hear You're together is incredible! This honestly made my day. Congratulations to the both of You!
    This was so sweet... made my day too.
    This forum is a haven for art, archetypes, typology and more! Join the tribe.
    ----> ARCHETRIBE.COM <----

  33. #73
    Heaven and Hell Samson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    TIM
    LSI
    Posts
    325
    Mentioned
    39 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Director Abbie View Post
    Samson, your post is all "blah-blah-sexy-sexy-sex" and basically a wad of the main misconception I was addressing in my initial post.
    You split the threads, so I want my answer to be known.

    If you cared to actually read my post - which you admitted you had not - then you would know that your OP did not address my post at all. The misconception that is the greatest in this thread, however, is your idea that the Enneagram and instincts type your weakness.
    This is incorrect.
    Following your logic, you would type yourself as your blindspot, so you type as Sx.

    You even admit to being Sx last in all but those very words:

    Quote Originally Posted by Director Abbie View Post
    But for myself, I've never been afraid of losing a romantic relationship. I think to me, those were more practical than intimate.
    Quote Originally Posted by Director Abbie View Post
    I honestly don't fathom how people approach romantic relationships, so that's like asking whether you squeeze waffles like other people squeeze plasmaloids.
    Quote Originally Posted by Director Abbie View Post
    I've never had a romantic relationship based off emotional closeness. Just, "I like this person. They'd be acceptable to live with for the rest of my life, and we could have a mutually beneficial life together."
    Quote Originally Posted by Director Abbie View Post
    Really, so is sx really that moronic and shallow?
    Quote Originally Posted by Director Abbie View Post
    Attraction and eros and mushy stuff like romance and merging with lovers.
    There are like four or five kinds of love and eros is the stupid one.
    Quote Originally Posted by Director Abbie View Post
    There is something elusive in finding someone I can be close to. It's not about "the one" though. The nice thing about it being best-friendship and not romance is that I can get away with having two or three if I can find them.
    Quote Originally Posted by Director Abbie View Post
    I'm saying that not thinking in terms of sexuality doesn't exempt one from being sx. That part of sx just wouldn't be part of their sx.
    Sexuality isn't part of someone's Sexual instinct? You know, words have meaning, and the terms weren't chosen at random.

    Quote Originally Posted by Director Abbie View Post
    Well, without the sexual aspect an sx would just hone in on their close relationships and give their attention to their best friends.
    For someone without close friends, they may focus on close family members.
    For someone with nobody, well, there's always a volleyball.
    Without the sexual aspect there is no Sexual instinct.

    Is there a Social instinct without the social aspect, is there a Self Preservation instinct without the self preservation aspect? If your answer to this is no, then the same goes for the Sexual instinct. If your answer is yes, then I am very delighted to read how you would rationalize that!

    Quote Originally Posted by Director Abbie View Post
    Well, if enneagram is about weaknesses, then I'm sx-first, 'cause I'm weak in that.
    But if sx is about attraction then I'm sx-last, 'cause I don't care about that.
    Enneagram isn't about weaknesses. I don't know where you get that from.


    You're welcome.

  34. #74
    Neokortex's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2016
    Location
    Post-Colonial Wasteland
    TIM
    Extrovert and Happy.
    Posts
    203
    Mentioned
    11 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Aylen View Post
    I was a bit harsh but only because you are pulling the same frustrating nonsense you did in that thread and typing anyone who would not give you the details on their sex life or how they get "intimate" with others social firsts. Sorry you felt you had to defend yourself. You are free to read any post of mine in any thread. I don't tend to analyze my sx instinct in public threads when I don't want to. I don't want to. I am secure in my self typings and don't really need to. If I share anything it is because I want to. I didn't want to have the "intimate" conversation you were seeking then and neither did anyone else from what I remember. It only went on for days with me. It went on weeks with you and others.
    I would have to read back to know for sure that what here you're stating is true. In general, I have bursts of activities on these forums that with the exception of one case (on PerC) have never been drawn out for weeks. Or at least not in a quarrelsome way as you put it. The reason is that people quickly ghost me after I ask for "too much information." I'm not sure if this is a cultural thing (called as "proximity" in non-interpersonal relations, such as the distance between strangers in the States vs. in Italy, the level of closeness allowed) but to my standard, this "too much" is not intimate, as well as (and I'm repeating myself for emphasis) I don't remember anyone clearly expressing denial of such information and rejection of conversation. What I can say, instead, as a general experience, is that people don't tell me not to bother them but still want to end the conversation with the image that "they know their type." That they'd be able to discuss that further, it's just that they don't feel like it. Such as you do know --- but: following the Latin saying ("Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?"), what differentiates you from the ones you point out as the abusers of the Enneagram? True, people cannot be forced to reveal anything on these forums but can you deny that it is for the civility and maturity of these "communities" that they "got their type right" and were more forthcoming about it? If it is, then intimacy (sx/sp) is more closely linked to social causes, than you're willing to acknowledge. Hence, your rejection of engagement (responding to the call to "open up"), in light of how similar is to others', can be interpreted as the Social types' diffusion of responsibility. After all, someone has to start to be more open about themselves (so as to provide a reference point for others to bounce off from) to straighten out the problem (of the "community") that you acknowledge.

    This is the contradiction in you that you tried to deflect and distract from by waving the currently popular (social) #metoo flag in response to me taunting your for being a social butterfly. Frankly, that Discord server you mention sounds like an insiders' circle, a clique. Is it, then, that you show general friendliness, engagement with people around the forum, when in actuality you're more invested socially in a clique?

    (And these were all rhetorical questions, so that you won't be able to call my criticism a harassment.)
    Except for impaired empathy, an ordinary guy who's looking for down-to-earth, loving, loyal friends and a geeky, warm, voluptuous girlfriend!

  35. #75
    Queen of the Damned Aylen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Spiritus Mundi
    TIM
    psyche 4w5 sx/sp
    Posts
    11,276
    Mentioned
    948 Post(s)
    Tagged
    42 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Neokortex View Post
    I would have to read back to know for sure that what here you're stating is true. In general, I have bursts of activities on these forums that with the exception of one case (on PerC) have never been drawn out for weeks. Or at least not in a quarrelsome way as you put it. The reason is that people quickly ghost me after I ask for "too much information." I'm not sure if this is a cultural thing (called as "proximity" in non-interpersonal relations, such as the distance between strangers in the States vs. in Italy, the level of closeness allowed) but to my standard, this "too much" is not intimate, as well as (and I'm repeating myself for emphasis) I don't remember anyone clearly expressing denial of such information and rejection of conversation. What I can say, instead, as a general experience, is that people don't tell me not to bother them but still want to end the conversation with the image that "they know their type." That they'd be able to discuss that further, it's just that they don't feel like it. Such as you do know --- but: following the Latin saying ("Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?"), what differentiates you from the ones you point out as the abusers of the Enneagram? True, people cannot be forced to reveal anything on these forums but can you deny that it is for the civility and maturity of these "communities" that they "got their type right" and were more forthcoming about it? If it is, then intimacy (sx/sp) is more closely linked to social causes, than you're willing to acknowledge. Hence, your rejection of engagement (responding to the call to "open up"), in light of how similar is to others', can be interpreted as the Social types' diffusion of responsibility. After all, someone has to start to be more open about themselves (so as to provide a reference point for others to bounce off from) to straighten out the problem (of the "community") that you acknowledge.

    This is the contradiction in you that you tried to deflect and distract from by waving the currently popular (social) #metoo flag in response to me taunting your for being a social butterfly. Frankly, that Discord server you mention sounds like an insiders' circle, a clique. Is it, then, that you show general friendliness, engagement with people around the forum, when in actuality you're more invested socially in a clique?

    (And these were all rhetorical questions, so that you won't be able to call my criticism a harassment.)
    I would respond to this if I knew what you were going on about. Anyone is free to check out your posts in the sx/sp thread.

    “My typology is . . . not in any sense to stick labels on people at first sight. It is not a physiognomy and not an anthropological system, but a critical psychology dealing with the organization and delimitation of psychic processes that can be shown to be typical.”​ —C.G. Jung

     



  36. #76
    Queen of the Damned Aylen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Spiritus Mundi
    TIM
    psyche 4w5 sx/sp
    Posts
    11,276
    Mentioned
    948 Post(s)
    Tagged
    42 Thread(s)

    Default

    I had these saved but don't remember the source. I thought they were decent (brief so not complex) descriptions of instincts so I saved them. Feel free to critique them. If you don't know what critique means, look it up first. TBH I don't want to feel like I am walking on eggshells talking sexual instincts in a thread started by DA but I do. I don't feel that way with most people. Maybe my mom.

    I assume these are Delta friendly.

    An Overview of Sx

    The Sexual Instinct, above all, seeks stimulation, whether it be physical, mental emotional, etc. This, most of the time, manifests as a want; a need for someone, to be intimate with and to fulfill their inner desires, or "make them whole".

    When Sx finds someone, it knows it wants them, without hesitating to consider the consequences or background of the person. It wants unlimited connection and intimacy with that person, usually, but not necessarily in a sexual or romantic sense, and caters all their actions toward this person, e.g. making the first move in a relationship.

    Some authors have sought to tame this Instinct with new names, such as Intimate or One-to-One, but any attempt at reworking the Instinct into something wholesome/spiritual/romantic misses the mark: the Sexual Instinct is an unbridled narcotic of wanting, untethered by ethics/morality.

    The most common metaphor for Sx is a burning flame; a raging fire that keeps itself alive by seeking fuel to feed it. On the other hand, Sx can also be represented as rushing water; a river that seeks nothing more than to find its ocean, someone to lose itself into.

    Health Levels

    (impacts Sx dominants the most)

    Healthy Sx

    Advancing Relationships

    When healthy, Sx can deepen and strengthen relationships and interpersonal bonds, and steadily ringing intimacy levels to greater and greater heights until satisfaction; like a tight-knit family. The Sx user is adequately stimulated, and confident and caring towards their loved ones and intimates. They have a natural magnetism which draws people in, and can control themselves well.

    Average Sx

    Fixation and Stimulation

    The Sx Instinct starts to become (what it deems as) understimulated and dependent on others, whether it be their close friends or acquaintences, to supply it with energy and life, much like a vampire. Instead of deepening their bonds, the Sx user starts to form "fixations", in which they not only want their person-of-choice's love and attention, but their "soul" as well. This can be overwhelming for some, and can ironically drive people away with the intensity.

    Unhealthy Sx

    Obsession and Desperation

    The Sx instinct becomes drastically understimulated and desperate for love and/or stimulation, and would go to extreme lengths to attain it. This could lead the Sx user down dangerous paths, such as drug abuse or promiscuity. They become an "adrenaline junkie", and this attitude often puts off others and drives them away, and if the Sx user cannot find adequate stimulation to sate their desires, they will eventually sink into despair.

    Sx in sx/sp

    The sx/sp will only *truly* care about those they are close to, and try to push for more and more intimate relationships between people they already know. The energy from this type is given a laser-focused control by the sp, and seeks stimulation, but in a relatively safe way. This stacking is more willing to be friendly or "fake" soc, in order to attract potential friends or intimates. They build upon the (often few) close relationships they already have; many sx/sps have fantasies of whisking away their loved ones to a secluded place where they can do whatever they want, undisturbed by the world.

    Sx in sx/so

    The sx/so will often seem like they are driven by pure, uninhibited sx, luring people in and trapping them, much like a Venus Flytrap. This stacking is more prone to dependency, bringing awkward intensity into a group, and dragging "fixations" into it. It waits to see whatever looks nice to grab onto, and will fixate until either the target or the sx/so is drained. Sx/so might look desperate to others. Their energy is akin to battering-rams, charging into relationships and breaking walls until they fall, only to get back up again and continue bashing.

    Sx in so/sx

    The so/sx will have a similar charm and magnetism to the sx/so, but is generally softer and friendlier, ready to take things more steadily instead of rushing headfirst into things. The so/sx will enter a group, and scatter interpersonal energy (Sx) to a more focused area, and form close bonds with their people of choice. However, it would take a while for them to put their sx relations as a priority, and even longer for them to admit it (more commonly in Fe users).

    Sx in sp/sx

    Sx in sp/sx seems to be weak and almost non-existent at first, since they themselves always come first. They will never put somebody else before their own needs, even if they're their closest friend. Instead of bulding a castle with their close ones inside like the sx/sp, they build walls around themselves first, secretly hoping for someone to come in. However, this often puts people off becoming closer to them, leaving them alone.

    Sx-Blindness

    Sx-blinds have a far gentler approach to interpersonal relationships, and are sometimes unsure and cautious in approaching someone they are attracted to. When in a close relationship, they may have trouble or insecurity in showing enough intimacy, and tend to compensate for this through acts of service(so) or advice and stability (sp) for their loved ones and/or partners. Sx blinds also have the tendency to "compartmentalize" their relationships, separating them and putting them into "boxes" (e.g. work acquaintances, online friends, real life friends, etc. are separated).
    An Overview of Sp

    The Self-Preservation Instinct, above all, craves stability. Both on a physical level (lifestyle, comfort, resources, etc.), and to a lesser extent, on a mental and emotional level as well. Striving for independence and autonomy, it aims to be resourceful in order to deal with life's challenges.

    Unlike the other two instincts, which both deal with other people, Sp focuses on the self: how comfortable it is, how safe and secure it is. Sp gears its actions towards this ideal, for example, getting a job to provide steady income, and staying away from potentially harmful situations.

    A common defense tactic of Sp to keep away from draining situations/people is to build up "walls", remaining distant and impersonal until it can fully trust the other person. The self can be rigid or fragile, but it must not be harmed at all costs.

    A common metaphor for Sp is earth; quite literally grounded, providing fresh fruit for all those who seek to reap it. All things come from Gaia, and all things will return to her.

    Health Levels

    Healthy Sp

    Satisfied Sturdiness

    When healthy, Sp brings a grounded quality to the table; it gathers practical skills and tools to use to improve their own life, and to an extent, the lives of others as well. Self-sufficient yet unselfish, it obtains an unmatched balance and stability in their life.

    Average Sp

    Detached and Hardworking

    The Sp Instinct loses some of its much-desired stability, and begins to work harder to keep themselves afloat. Survival becomes their main concern, using common sense and emotional detachment/compartmentalization to deal with situations. Wanting nothing more than to deal with life by themselves, they may actively avoid people, taking away time spent with others to focus on themselves.


    Unhealthy Sp

    Neurotic Self-Absorption

    The Sp instinct descends into delusion and obsessiveness, hoarding and (over)working whenever it can in an attempt to keep their life together. They become selfish and miserly, shoving or cutting off people who get in their way. They sacrifice one aspect of their life to keep another standing, and continue to do this until it all comes crumbling down.

    Sp in sp/so

    Understanding the need for both solidarity and solitude, sp/so strikes a balance between self-sufficiency and social connection. Their level-headed quality attracts people to them; they're wanted for their stability and ability to pull people back to earth. Equipped with a "if you want something done, do it yourself" attitiude, they prefer to take care of their own issues, but may appease others in order to get ahead. Approachable yet self-assertive, sp/so can be relied on to be a rock in the storm.

    Sp in sp/sx

    The sp/sx believes and knows it can survive completely on their own, and seems to be driven by pure Sp. They see other people as a hassle to deal with; they get in the way of their autonomy. Secretly coveting a deep connection with another, they more often than not end up making no attempts at sacrificing anything for a significant other, which may result in alienating the few people they hold close to them.

    Sp in sx/sp

    Sp in sx/sp acts as both a restraint and a safety net for the stacking. As Sx seeks out intense experiences and people, Sp serves to keep it in check, making sure the sx/sp doesn't exert themself, and if they do, they are aware of the consequences. If the sx/sp goes understimulated or crashes and burns, Sp is there to make sure that they can support themselves by themselves, at least until they can recover.

    Sp in so/sp

    Sp seems feeble and muted in so/sp, and like in sx/sp, also acts as a restraint for so/sp, though it goes to more extreme measures. When the so/sp feels too pressured to please people or fit a Soc standard, sp shuts them down, causing the so/sp to isolate and/or push others away. However, this also gets in the way of the so/sp's need to be with people, resulting in a tension between Soc fears and Sp needs.

    Sp-blinds have a lighter, more flighty approach to life. Other-directed instead of self-directed, they tend to be more dependent on others, whether they would like to admit it or not. Though they can be private people, they tend to be more reckless and heedless of consequences than other types. Lacking roots to plant into the ground, they can break up the monotony of mundane everyday life, but are lazy/avoidant of their own domestic needs.
    An Overview of Soc

    The Social Instinct, above all, is the desire to belong to a greater whole. This often manifests as a desire for fame, recognition, attention, connections and the valdiation/esteem gained from them, or to make an impact on the world.

    Soc fears rejection and shunning, varying its approach and actions to blend in with the group, whether it be climbing the social ladder or helping others and doing good. Soc feels a strong sense of loyalty to the group or community it's in, especially if it feels appreciated and loved.

    Soc connects with others through mutual bonding activities, and getting to know one another at a chosen pace. It seeks stable connections with others, whether for the sake of connecting with others or for their own sake. The interpersonal dance between people from all walks of life.

    A common metaphor for Soc is fresh air; it is expansive, and travels far and wide, searching for others of its kind. It also brings forth sunlight; it shines on the Earth, bringing a gleam to all it touches.


    Health Levels


    (impacts Soc dominants the most)


    Healthy Soc

    Actively Contributing to Society

    When healthy, Soc is selfless, though not self-destructive, and the Soc user is regularly seen doing social work, like participating in community movements or doing missionary work overseas. The Soc user is good-natured and affectionate, with an array of friends and acquaintances, traversing the social realm with grace and ease.

    Average Soc

    Friendly and Networking

    The Soc Instinct becomes less confident in itself in the social realm, and may start to develop social anxiety, worrying what others think of them. At the same time, it becomes generous and amicable, but only if it serves to improve their status and reputation. If the Soc user is without a group or network to support them, they become listless and wandering, searching for something to be a part of.


    Unhealthy Soc

    Antisocial Attitudes

    The Soc Instinct is lost, shunned and/or rejected by others, and starts to develop antisocial tendencies, withdrawing and resenting others or society at large for putting them in such a situation. This attitude further drives others away, burning the bridges between them and human contact altogether.

    Soc in so/sx

    So/sx has the ability to see everyone simultaneously in relation to a greater whole, but also as individuals. Without any Sp to inhibit its Soc agenda, it can be as free as it wants to be when navigating the social realm. Like a bird in the sky, the so/sx seeks out flocks of people to be a part of, and picks out one or a few people to be best friends with. The cycle repeats, and the so/sx slowly but surely gains a circle of quality friendships.

    Soc in so/sp

    The so/sp seems to be driven by pure Soc, but unlike so/sx, it comes off as more awkward and bumbling when trying to interact with people. They're often self-conscious, and do anything they feel that might get them accepted in the group, even if it's questionable. They can socialize fine, but it is often on their own terms, e.g. if they feel as if their line has been crossed or are being taken for granted, they will back off or outright halt social activity with the person.

    Soc in sp/so

    The sp/so will use their Soc connection to a greater whole to provide a stable resource to support their Sp lifestyle. Though preferring to mind their own business, they will readily take on social responsibilities or situations if it doesn't intrude on their inner boundaries. Although Soc-second, this stacking tends to handle people better than so/sp, since their sp needs are established clearly, while so/sp is usually oblivious that they have sp inhibitions at all.

    Soc in sx/so

    Soc in sx/so seems to be lacking, and there is usually a certain elitism about them; either you're in their (often rigid) circle or not, no in-between. It filters interpersonal energy from the outside; instead of broadening their scope with Soc, they close off, and disengage into a world of Sx on their own.

    Soc-blinds have difficulty seeing the need to make new connections (not necessarily the same as friendships) and network. Seen as aloof and stand-offish, they often come with a lack of engagement with people, or an attitude in doing so. They are generally unafraid of going "against the grain" and of social rejection, ignoring social conventions, usually leading to a rocky relationship with authorities. They have no need to be a part of a society or community, presenting an outsider-looking-in perspective.
    Edit: Noticed I missed the other health levels for sx so I added them.
    Last edited by Aylen; 01-17-2019 at 01:31 PM. Reason: formatting

    “My typology is . . . not in any sense to stick labels on people at first sight. It is not a physiognomy and not an anthropological system, but a critical psychology dealing with the organization and delimitation of psychic processes that can be shown to be typical.”​ —C.G. Jung

     



  37. #77
    Queen of the Damned Aylen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Spiritus Mundi
    TIM
    psyche 4w5 sx/sp
    Posts
    11,276
    Mentioned
    948 Post(s)
    Tagged
    42 Thread(s)

    Default

    I added health levels for sx for those who missed it.

    “My typology is . . . not in any sense to stick labels on people at first sight. It is not a physiognomy and not an anthropological system, but a critical psychology dealing with the organization and delimitation of psychic processes that can be shown to be typical.”​ —C.G. Jung

     



  38. #78
    squark's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    TIM
    1sx
    Posts
    3,030
    Mentioned
    257 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Director Abbie View Post
    Ah, now this is a good argument.
    (And on the subject of moronic and shallow, I read the story of Samson the other day, and those words describe him well. )

    I have had righteous anger once or twice, but I kept it in check.
    When I have that kind of drive, it's more like a plow that must continue even if there's a dog in the way. I'm earth, not fire.

    So do all sx types have that sort of flaming energy, or just the unhealthy ones?
    I read through the stacking descriptions and couldn't find one that fit me. I don't know - should I try reading through the descriptions of 6 and 2 since they're in my tritype? Can I be a 1 with a 6-type stacking?
    And if you are sure I don't have the demeanor of an sx/sp, what would you expect my stacking to be as a 1?
    Are you an sx/so or sx/sp?
    I'll start from the bottom questions and go up. I think I'm probably sx/sp because I do feel that sp is the easiest, and the thing I just do without having to be overly concerned about it. I relate to some of the same things you said about it in your OP, that it's stuff I'll take care of when necessary but can be put aside easily for other priorities. In the one descriptions a close friend has suggested that I could fit sx/so also, as he said that in person I am charming and friendly, open to people, and another friend even said I can come across as socially extroverted because of my approachability. I find it hard to see myself like that, but people are seeing something there, so I don't dismiss it. These are the things in the 1 sx/so description from your link that my friend says fit me, and I agree with everything except the charismatic part:
    They can be very charismatic and engaging. If they have an opinion you are going to hear about it. It’s very important for them to be understood. They are outwardly competitive. The anger that is under the surface with the other instinctual variants of type One is much more likely to be apparent with this subtype. You always know where you stand with them. On the high side, this type is warm and engaging, but on the down side this same energy can bring with it the full brunt of the One’s anger and the need to be right.
    but everything in the sx/sp description fits me, so I still think that's the better choice. Every once in awhile, especially when I get annoyed at people overfocusing on creature comforts and practical concerns, or I realize that I'm less concerned with my physical safety than others may be about theirs I think about being maybe sp blindspot and revisit the idea of sx/so but always come back to sx/sp in the end.

    I think that either we both share sp as that balancing point and second instinct, or our shared brand of practicality is an ST strength. I think it's most likely that sp is second instinct for both of us. Either way I think that your social instinct is primary. This is from enneagram institute:

    Sexual (aka “Attraction”) Instinct

    Many people originally identify themselves as this type because they have learned that the Sexual types are interested in “one-on-one relationships.” But all three instinctual types are interested in one-on-one relationships for different reasons, so this does not distinguish them. The key element in Sexual types is an intense drive for stimulation and a constant awareness of the “chemistry” between themselves and others. Sexual types are immediately aware of the attraction, or lack thereof, between themselves and other people. Further, while the basis of this instinct is related to sexuality, it is not necessarily about people engaging in the sexual act. There are many people that we are excited to be around for reasons of personal chemistry that we have no intention of “getting involved with.” Nonetheless, we might be aware that we feel stimulated in certain people’s company and less so in others. The sexual type is constantly moving toward that sense of intense stimulation and juicy energy in their relationships and in their activities. They are the most “energized” of the three instinctual types, and tend to be more aggressive, competitive, charged, and emotionally intense than the Self-Pres or Social types. Sexual types need to have intense energetic charge in their primary relationships or else they remain unsatisfied. They enjoy being intensely involved—even merged—with others, and can become disenchanted with partners who are unable to meet their need for intense energetic union. Losing yourself in a “fusion” of being is the ideal here, and Sexual types are always looking for this state with others and with stimulating objects in their world.

    Social (aka “Adaptive”) Instinct

    Just as many people tend to misidentify themselves as Sexual types because they want one-on-one relationships, many people fail to recognize themselves as Social types because they get the (false) idea that this means always being involved in groups, meetings, and parties. If Self-Preservation types are interested in adjusting the environment to make themselves more secure and comfortable, Social types adapt themselves to serve the needs of the social situation they find themselves in. Thus, Social types are highly aware of other people, whether they are in intimate situations or in groups. They are also aware of how their actions and attitudes are affecting those around them. Moreover, Sexual types seek intimacy, Social types seek personal connection: they want to stay in long-term contact with people and to be involved in their world. Social types are the most concerned with doing things that will have some impact on their community, or even broader domains. They tend to be warmer, more open, engaging, and socially responsible than the other two types. In their primary relationships, they seek partners with whom they can share social activities, wanting their intimates to get involved in projects and events with them. Paradoxically, they actually tend to avoid long periods of exclusive intimacy and quiet solitude, seeing both as potentially limiting. Social types lose their sense of identity and meaning when they are not involved with others in activities that transcend their individual interests.
    As the above quotes show, yes sx is about that fire, a chemistry, so yes I think all the sx share that kind of energy, and soc is about personal connection and being involved in another's world. This could be one other person or a small group of close friends too, and not just the world at large or society. I think for instance that beta Fe can be about finding your place or your role, where you fit or can make the most difference, and a lot of concepts get mixed, so when you mix that with social instinct then the focus shifts to groups and for certain types, like for 3s I believe the social instinct is related to status regardless of quadra. In alpha and delta the caregiving quality I think comes out more, so for delta social types, especially the caregivers it can be more about showing care, planning gifts like you mentioned. Sharing or maybe involving I think would be a good theme word for social, but I guess that can be used in other contexts also.

    I think the unhealthy aspects of sx are the competition, the intense jealousy etc, but the energy itself I find can be very positive as well. Each drive is in all of us, and while enneagram itself is used for growth I don't think any of the drives are of themselves negative. That sx energy can be a driving force for a lot of good things, creative works, progress etc too. The world needs a few fanatics in it too =D


    Edit: Just read Aylen's post, and from those descriptions sp/so could fit you, yes? The earth quality you described in yourself, etc. So, maybe I wrong as to which of your instincts is primary. Idk, whichever you think best fits.
    Last edited by squark; 01-17-2019 at 03:58 PM.

  39. #79
    Haikus VenusRose's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2018
    TIM
    EII 4w5 Sx/So
    Posts
    311
    Mentioned
    28 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    The sx/so will often seem like they are driven by pure, uninhibited sx, luring people in and trapping them, much like a Venus Flytrap.
    Oh wow
    It does not often happen that something is a really...interesting coincidence (referring to my name). This is pretty...impressive haha.

    This stacking is more prone to dependency, bringing awkward intensity into a group, and dragging "fixations" into it. It waits to see whatever looks nice to grab onto, and will fixate until either the target or the sx/so is drained. Sx/so might look desperate to others. Their energy is akin to battering-rams, charging into relationships and breaking walls until they fall, only to get back up again and continue bashing.
    Ah I see. I am not as focused on how the group sees me so that tends to go into the background
    i don't think it looks "desperate" even when i see someone else who is sx/so so
    perhaps they meant more so unhealthy
    as for battering rams, I think that's a little too strong for me, as I am not that strong and may come across stronger online than I am and people may read into my tone.

    But um still...that initial coincidence...wow haha.

    Also as to unhealthy sx descriptions, for the ones I have come across - it seems interesting to me that they say "drastically understimulated" wouldn't they still be over-stimulated/adequately stimulated since they are sx and they seek that out, always? Though I guess if they were badly traumatized or something, they can become "deadened" or "understimulated"...
    Last edited by VenusRose; 01-17-2019 at 05:46 PM.

  40. #80
    Haikus VenusRose's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2018
    TIM
    EII 4w5 Sx/So
    Posts
    311
    Mentioned
    28 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    By the way, @Director Abbie,

    I still wonder about so/sx for you:

    Soc in so/sx

    So/sx has the ability to see everyone simultaneously in relation to a greater whole, but also as individuals. Without any Sp to inhibit its Soc agenda, it can be as free as it wants to be when navigating the social realm. Like a bird in the sky, the so/sx seeks out flocks of people to be a part of, and picks out one or a few people to be best friends with. The cycle repeats, and the so/sx slowly but surely gains a circle of quality friendships.
    ...which seems to fit in with what you have been saying. I feel like I sensed the rootlessness and turbulence of the SP last...though I could be wrong.

    What do you think of the so/sx description vs. these:

    Soc in so/sp


    The so/sp seems to be driven by pure Soc, but unlike so/sx, it comes off as more awkward and bumbling when trying to interact with people. They're often self-conscious, and do anything they feel that might get them accepted in the group, even if it's questionable. They can socialize fine, but it is often on their own terms, e.g. if they feel as if their line has been crossed or are being taken for granted, they will back off or outright halt social activity with the person.


    Soc in sp/so


    The sp/so will use their Soc connection to a greater whole to provide a stable resource to support their Sp lifestyle. Though preferring to mind their own business, they will readily take on social responsibilities or situations if it doesn't intrude on their inner boundaries. Although Soc-second, this stacking tends to handle people better than so/sp, since their sp needs are established clearly, while so/sp is usually oblivious that they have sp inhibitions at all.
    compared to so/sp imo you are more so/sx. I dunno about sp/so though. What do you think?

Page 2 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •