Fictional ESTp & INFp Dualities in Movies and Books

[Hot Scalding Gayser]

Actually you may be right. A guy I clicked with years ago liked playing this for me. We were really different tho, maybe we were duals.

Him: I love the opera
Me: I don't really like the opera lol
Him: I drive fast
Me: I don't drive fast....
Him: I like lots of sex partners
Me: I like just one at a time
Him: (told me what to do)
Me: (allowed that, but argued and challenged his reasonings a lot)

It probably was pretty complementary but Idk, I think we both wanted something a tad more similar. We didn't even really meet irl though, it was just over the phone.

[discojoe]

I fixed the link. It had been linking to the wrong version of the song. Now it's the actual clip from the movie.

[discojoe]

By the way, the Phantom is played by the same guy who played King Leonidas in 300, Gerard Butler.

[Marie84]

yeah probably, always thought this was Beta-ish

[Hot Scalding Gayser]

After watching much more of the show (almost done with all the episodes!), I think Xena and Gabrielle are ESTp and INFp duals. With Xena being the ESTp, and Gabrielle being the INFp, of course.

Why? Well, for one- Xena helped Gabrielle become a Warrior, and Gabrielle helped Xena tap into her loving heart. Xena was a dark warrior who needed redemption, as she used her powers without thinking about what she was doing to others. Gabrielle had a loving heart, but no role model to look up to, nobody she could inspire strength from. She also felt ‘different’ from the other people in her small village, a very common complaint that IEIs make. Her heart longed for more journeys, more excitement.

Xena loved protecting Gabrielle. INFps love to be protected, and ESTps love to do the protecting.

Gabrielle since the beginning of the adventures was the writer, the bard, somebody who recorded all their adventures by writing them down on parchment. A very IEI thing to do.

Their relationship wasn’t always solid, it went through some rocky grounds, just like duality. Many times Gabrielle had questioned if she was really in the right place. Was being a Warrior really right for her? She learned to fight slowly over time, her fighting skills really didn’t kick in until the fourth season or so.

Xena also questioned herself. So they balance and play each other out nicely, and offer each other both subjective and objective reassurance. Xena, a very strong warrior who is as tough as at least 10-15 men, wants to find some Ni-valuing purpose for her powers. She just doesn’t want to be an uncaring machine, and the very human, innocent Gabrielle is her key to that.

Gabrielle is loving and kind, and more connected to the human race. However, she always felt different from the villagers, like they couldn’t really ever understand her.

Xena played the role of Manus (Hand), a pure powerful physical force that can do anything it wants because it’s so strong. But her soul and conscience deep down wants to the right thing despite of how much raw power she has. Xena wants to do good. Gabrielle played the role of Animus (Heart), somebody who inspires others to take the most ethical course of action in life. Xena needs this the most, out of all the others in the show – or she would become the villain. Although other people are too inspired by Gabrielle, nobody needs Gabrielle like Xena needs her.

Gabrielle needs somebody that understands the inner ‘Yang’ part of her aspect, the part that wants to fight and do battle, otherwise people would just keep taking advantage of her. Xena encourages Gabrielle to stand up for herself. And when Gabrielle gets kidnapped, it’s Xena’s own strength and Gabrielle’s own inner strength deep down inside that Xena encourages, that helps her get through it both physically and emotionally.

When Xena was fighting somebody once, the bad guy said something like “You are soft and weak!” and Xena said, “You shouldn’t confuse softness with weakness.” This, in a nutshell, is what Xena learned from Gabrielle.

But this is where they are two sides of the same coin. Gabrielle is just as much of a Warrior as Xena is, and Xena is in truth just as much of the loving writer and humanitarian Gabrielle is. So really it’s not opposites attracting, it’s two different sides of the same whole coming together to form a holy and romantic union.

[krieger]

i sanction these claims.

[Hot Scalding Gayser]

Callisto is a clear delta ESTj imo. Xena ruined the peaceful civilized life that Callisto had, Callisto just wanted to be a normal, boring village girl (Deltas lol) and when Xena was evil she terrorized Callisto's town and killed her parents.

Gabrielle, her conflictor, in contrast, never really wanted to be a dull villager.

Callisto killed Gabrielle's lover. To a beta INFp nothing is more important than romantic love. To a delta ESTj, nothing is more important than fitting in society and having a normal life. Both had what they loved the most taken away from them. Of course we all know Xena is Gabrielle's true partner, but at the time she really loved Pegasus. or whatever his name was.

Redeemed Callisto wants to help society objectively and to rebuild civilization. I think though in a way, Betas will always want to keep fighting. No matter what. Sadly, they may even create an enemy just to have somebody to fight, because the fight makes Betas stronger.

[somavision]

Callisto is a clear delta ESTj imo. Xena ruined the peaceful civilized life that Callisto had, Callisto just wanted to be a normal, boring village girl (Deltas lol) and when Xena was evil she terrorized Callisto's town and killed her parents.

Gabrielle, her conflictor, in contrast, never really wanted to be a dull villager.

Callisto killed Gabrielle's lover. To a beta INFp nothing is more important than romantic love. To a delta ESTj, nothing is more important than fitting in society and having a normal life. Both had what they loved the most taken away from them. Of course we all know Xena is Gabrielle's true partner, but at the time she really loved Pegasus. or whatever his name was.

Redeemed Callisto wants to help society objectively and to rebuild civilization. I think though in a way, Betas will always want to keep fighting. No matter what. Sadly, they may even create an enemy just to have somebody to fight, because the fight makes Betas stronger.

These are good posts.

[Krig the Viking]

It's been forever since I've seen the show, but Xena as SLE makes perfect sense to me.

[Trevor]

As the series progressed there were more and more ESFp elements introduced into Xena's character. I generally agree with ESTp typing.

It's been forever since I've seen the show, but Xena as SLE makes perfect sense to me.

This is not the "Type Xena, please" thread, man.

[Krig the Viking]

This is not the "Type Xena, please" thread, man.

Er... wha? BnD said he thinks Xena and Gabrielle and SLE and IEI, then gave a bunch of examples of how that played out in the show. I then posted to agree with his typing of Xena. I don't understand your comment.

[UDP]

Callisto is a clear delta ESTj imo. Xena ruined the peaceful civilized life that Callisto had, Callisto just wanted to be a normal, boring village girl (Deltas lol) and when Xena was evil she terrorized Callisto's town and killed her parents.

Gabrielle, her conflictor, in contrast, never really wanted to be a dull villager.

Callisto killed Gabrielle's lover. To a beta INFp nothing is more important than romantic love. To a delta ESTj, nothing is more important than fitting in society and having a normal life. Both had what they loved the most taken away from them. Of course we all know Xena is Gabrielle's true partner, but at the time she really loved Pegasus. or whatever his name was.

Redeemed Callisto wants to help society objectively and to rebuild civilization. I think though in a way, Betas will always want to keep fighting. No matter what. Sadly, they may even create an enemy just to have somebody to fight, because the fight makes Betas stronger.

That's crap.

... but mostly true in my experience?

I must be special.

[Sol]

Lucy Lawless playing Xena is ESTP, she's natural there and hence Xena should to be the same type. But have no idea about Gabrielle character (actress is ESFJ), - some feeler.

[marooned]

yes... I almost tried to mention something like this in that other thread where you had Gabrielle as SEE... as I thought especially in S1 and 2 she was quite INFp-like and very Se-DS. But then when I thought about her in the later seasons I could see the SEE idea which made me wonder about how consistent her character is in general and it would just be a matter of the "new" Gabrielle vs. the "old" one. But for S1-2 at least I rather agree with a lot of this. I'm inclined to generally want to see Gabrielle as IEI throughout. Also I like SLE for Xena.

Gabrielle also throughout the show sees Xena as having saved her from her boring village life. Xena brings an element of action and adventure into Gabrielle's life that she wouldn't have been able to get on her own (it's what drew her to Xena in the first place, aside from her feeling that she could help Xena along her new path because she saw the good in Xena).

I was going to say that I could see a lot of Fi in Gabrielle's character, but actually I can see a lot of Fi in the show in general although I don't know how to explain it. So I think I've decided to sort of filter it out because it seems ambient and not so much a central part of any of the characters, but I could still see arguments for Gabrielle as an Fi type. Although my other alternate type for Xena would be a Gamma extrovert.

[Hot Scalding Gayser]

Well there is a lot of Fi in the show but remember IEIs are great at Fi. The demonstrative function is strong. Without Gabrielle, Xena's Fi polr would really hurt her. I mean, Xena chose Caesar to try and be her lover and other narcissistic, evil/unavailable men.

A function doesn't have to be valued or in the ego to be strong. IEIs are excellent at Fi, it covers up the polr of the SLE very nicely. Just like SLEs are great at Te.

Yeah I was being too subjective in my ESFp typing of Gabrielle before, because she reminded me of Dolphin a lot. After watching the show more (I was only into like the 1st season when I wrote that post I think) IEI/SLE makes more sense. The duality becomes really solid/strong in later seasons, after they have known each other for awhile.

Although INTp/ESFp for the pair could make some sense, I just think their overall thought processes and worldview is aristocratic, not democratic. Gabrielle doesn't really write about society the way Daria does or some other gamma. And I don't think either of them really have that rigid/stern gamma-ish-ness. (ESFps don't really have the same 'sternness' that the other three gamma types do because SEE is my semi-dual, but still, Xena seems more lusty and bloodthristy and estpish than to be assertive in the gamma way.)

[marooned]

I wouldn't consider ILI for Gabrielle... if I were to consider an Fi type it would have to be something like SEE or Delta NF (which sounds silly to me at this moment).

With Xena I don't know that I could see her as SEE so easily. I'd probably have to consider LIE more and it just doesn't work is the problem with it. I guess that maybe part of this feeling was I felt that Xena is prone to hold constant grudges against people and seeks vengeance against those who have wronged others who were important to her, or who make a habit of beating down the weak and defenseless (although of course she used to do that herself ahem). Also after someone has crossed her, they're on her shit list for good unless they do something to seriously redeem themselves in her eyes. Anyway part of me suspected that she became "evil" to begin with over something like this (someone wronged her and she had a flip out). However, the mythical accounts of Xena's retarded history do seem more like she just couldn't control her power-seeking impulsive behavior and didn't care who got in her way, killing indiscriminately like some psychopathic mad woman. And so I guess I wondered if she was too inflexible in this way for Fe HA or something, but I still like SLE the best. I think that the picture I was starting to paint of Xena above is just off and it's a miss... also in general holding grudges is part of the show and most people would hold permanent grudges against a lot of the stuff that happens since these aren't little things but usually involve life or death of people important to them.

Also I guess to me Xena seems clearly logical and Gabrielle clearly ethical as I think that this sort of defines their relationship early on. Gabrielle is very emotionally revealing and very comfortable with her feelings where as Xena's heart is some sort of shrouded unexplored territory that Gabrielle helps her get more in touch with. Gabrielle helps Xena find her "good self" becoming her guiding light because Xena can't see it so clearly on her own.

So my problem with SEE is that Xena just seems too logical and my problem with LIE is that she's far too impulsive and crazy and action-oriented (but I'd be willing to go with it I suppose but SLE is still my first choice). I guess though that I feel the whole show has an Fi tint to it and that it comes out in both main characters although then I'm just repeating myself (which is great because I've now repeated myself a lot since I don't seem to feel like editing this down to be more concise). Your point is noted that Gabrielle would obviously have strong Fi if she were IEI.

And I think you have a point here:

Xena seems more lusty and bloodthristy and estpish than to be assertive in the gamma way

[Hot Scalding Gayser]

I meant Xena as an INTp and Gabrielle as the ESFp one...

But it just doesn't make sense because of how hands on and Se-ish physical Xena is.

[WVBRY]

I think Xena(and Lucy lawless) is ISFj, I dunno about Gabrielle I guess INFp could work but they seem more like a benefit pair than a dual one to me.

[Trevor]

Er... wha? ... I don't understand your comment.

It was a joke. Notice how I did exactly the same thing I criticized you for.

[Krig the Viking]

It was a joke. Notice how I did exactly the same thing I criticized you for.

Ohhhhh. See, I did notice that, but it just made things more confusing, rather than funny.

[Timmy]

Anybody seen this movie? I think you betas would like it. It depcits SLE/IEI duality brilliantly and is a great movie too.

[Sir Knight]

See, now IEI is going to use this for his, "I hate SLEs!" thread. He's going to point to this and say, "See! I TOLD you SLEs are blood-sucking vampires! I didn't mean it quite this literally, but still! Bam! Proof positive, motherfuckers!"

Also, how does the

*ominous chord*

American remake stand up to the original?

[Timmy]

The SLE girl in the movie is freaking awesome. Were it not for the fact that she is 12, a vampire, and arguably a transvestite, i might have to retype myself as IEI to make myself her dual.

[IEI]

See, now IEI is going to use this for his, "I hate SLEs!" thread. He's going to point to this and say, "See! I TOLD you SLEs are blood-sucking vampires! I didn't mean it quite this literally, but still! Bam! Proof positive, motherfuckers!"

Also, how does the

*ominous chord*

American remake stand up to the original?

Ahhhh IM A GIRL

[jessica129]

Sorry but this was the dumbest movie I've ever seen in my life.

[discojoe]

Sorry but this was the dumbest movie I've ever seen in my life.

Then the best movie you've ever seen must be the most profound piece of art ever created by a human.

It is a very good movie. A-

[jessica129]

I guess I shouldn't have said that because I stopped halfway thru. I'm entirely too lazy to read subtitles.

[jessica129]

How did this movie end?

[Absurd]

How did this movie end?

Happy ending on train.

[Sir Knight]

Ahhhh IM A GIRL

Oh. Well. Excuse my male-dominantly minded wording of my previous response.

[discojoe]

The best part of the movie is the pool scene near the end.

[Ezra]

Then the best movie you've ever seen must be the most profound piece of art ever created by a human.

It is a very good movie. A-

Hahahah. It is awesome.

How did this movie end?

 

She kills everyone when they try to drown the blonde kid in a swimming pool.

[Ezra]

Anybody seen this movie? I think you betas would like it. It depcits SLE/IEI duality brilliantly and is a great movie too.

YouTube - Let the Right One In Official HD Trailer

Yeah, interesting though, I didn't consider them as duals. Guess I could see it although they're little kids.

[stray]

lol i've just "discovered" Xena (and Hercules). I'm only at the end of season 1, and just getting to Callisto. I agree that Xena is SLE (and I suppose Gabrielle is IEI, clouded by the actress' type). Hercules seems more like the Fi hero (SEE?) to Xena's SLE.

[stray]

I think Callisto is more ESE than LSE. The actress seems EIE though, so maybe that's getting in the way.

This show is like 10 times better with her in it..

[Korpsy Knievel]

Ohhhhh. See, I did notice that, but it just made things more confusing, rather than funny.

confusion = funny

[marooned]

I think Hercules is LSE (I mean on the show, not the legendary character from myth who I wouldn't be surprised if he were an Se type). I agree with you Stray that he's an Fi hero. And I feel that he just is an embodiment of Delta values, though I just don't know how to explain this. I don't really think Hercules cares for and that any behavior is "bad" on the show... although the only example I can think of is Ares (SLE imo) at the moment.

Edit: I thought Callisto was an quadra type. I never could decide which one. Especially after she becomes "angel Callisto"... trying to square that with psychopath Callisto under one type is just kind of a challenge. I had considered SEE and EIE the most, I suppose.

[Clumsy]

Liam (SLE) and Annie (IEI) from 90210.

[Clumsy]

What DCNH subtypes would they be?

[rafaeli]

i think annie is more IEE.