Such a shame he always contorts them into idiotic typings for people.
Such a shame he always contorts them into idiotic typings for people.
Each essence is a separate glass,
Through which Sun of Being’s Light is passed,
Each tinted fragment sparkles with the Sun,
A thousand colors, but the Light is One.
Jami, 15th c. Persian Poet
If numerous people are having a problem with you then isn't it safe to say that you are the problem and not them? If that's the case then perhaps it's time for some self-reflection so you can grow. Or you can choose to ignore or be offended by this and continue on with your bad habits, but that's at your detriment in the end. I only say this to you now because it's a recurring pattern instead of just a one off.
“We cannot change the cards we are dealt, just how we play the hand.” Randy Pausch
Tfw Raver masterfully weaves an argument for Sol’s typing and gently chiding his behaviour into one post.
Type me you fools, you cruel bitches.
There’s a difference between tendencies towards natural strengths, and having an interest in something. Thinking sensing types are typically uninterested in intuitive activities and intuitives are typically uninterested in sensing activities is an ancient song bellowed out by the great whales from the lost sea of MBTI-land.
This is a discussion forum, not a pro psychologist training centre.
In socionics types tend to automatically generate their own ego stuff, I think. It tends to be so that Ne egos for example tend to just talk about stuff without tangible basis. When it continues too long they notice that the meta information goes nowhere while they can keep track of the information comfortably which leads to frustration.
Measuring you right now
Winning is for losers
My LSI mother often goes for series where she sees something that has roots in real life, but with some sort of conspiracy-esque backdrop to it (Ie. Person of Interest is one of her favourite TV series that I've seen her watch countless times and recently she was reading a book on history of religions, saying that it is something she prefers to digest properly than try going for in one sitting) as well as tends to have dreams where she sees dead people she was close to giving her warnings/saying something to celebrate is coming soon with some major thing often happening afterwards.
That is not to say they aren't interested in/good at and naturally follow their ego function habits and talents, but simply that it is really downplayed even in Socionics in favour of going "You just need a Dual!" than actually acknowledging that many people, do try to provide their own HA and DS functions, or to find a supply of them from somewhere else, so that just because it is not a natural strength doesn't equate to a complete natural disinterest so much as how much energy you have to devote to such things and ways you can do it being limited.
Which also bring me to whole "such theories are dominated by intuitives (and thinkers)" thing, which actually has some truth in it because the area they suck at has to do with sensing (and feelings/ethics/relationships) so that's actually the intuitives (and thinkers) trying to reach to their weakspot/trying to learn cover it/how to get better into touch by it via what they are already adept at, just like it is for other types, which again brings us to interest does not always equate strength, and in fact, can be just as often reverse too, sensors (and feelers, to not have them left out as well) are looking for the abstract/philosophical/wide-picture (thinking/categorization/systematization/profit) such theories/abstract things can provide that is lacking in their life as well. So while probably still isn't perfect 50/50, it probably isn't as extremely skewed towards one side.
That's what I got, at least.
As a side note, my crack theory on whole "subtype" matter is that it simply tells if someone simply focused more honing on their natural ego talents or if at some point pushed themselves to try to develop in their weaker areas/had been pushed by life to have to figure out how to operate that basically other realm they suck at to some passing level of competence, by trial and error as at the end of the day those are 2D and 1D functions, learning from experience (and social norms on the matter, for 2D)
I do think you raise many good points here. Personally, I spent perhaps the first 20+ years of my life being rather impractical, living more in fantasy than reality through play, video games, art, movies, etc. Then I took this interest in being more practical and started denying myself the only things I were ever naturally good at. I tried to get my head out of the clouds and books and live more for the moment, and all that crap. Then it dawned on me that the very people I was trying to be more like couldn't do the things I could do. Why was I trying to do the things they are naturally good at? I shouldn't really be focusing my time with such things, unless I was actually interested.
I do see where the line is blurred for many people. I actually advocate that most people don't really have a type because they are kind of in the middle of the dichotomies. It is the ones that are solidly within each dichotomous camp that form the basis for our overgeneralizations. I think my own thinking and feeling are close to one another, while my N and S aren't very close. I still S when I S, but the overall tendency is to not S. Many people use both relatively equally, but I wouldn't say they are sensors or intuitives. Maybe they are sentuitives? Or Intuensors?
So here you have Socionics. The theory says people both can and can't master weaker functions, depending on the opinion. You need a dual to do certain things for you, but heaven forbid be told you can't do something!
My logic definitely has its bounds, I have noted. I get very nice ideas how to think about things but then I also end up noticing that I might need someone with bit more precision if it gets purely formalized. That is to say that my logic is foremost approximate and selective with good precision.
Measuring you right now
Winning is for losers
I would agree that real people are rarely as type profile level neurotic for most typologies than just Socionics, as well as the culture where the typologist(?) lives in inevitably leads to bias on certain mannerisms they might not realize that is more related to socially learned/adopted behaviour than something as intrinsic for the person, or it is intrinsic but in one case is fully allowed and encouraged to develop while in another devalued by the culture and makes one question worth of their own talents as you mentioned above.
So basically, to me, typology is a tool to see and share patterns in human behaviour and thinking, that is discussed, showed personal anecdotes for from others or refuted by others of supposedly same category that is talked about, trying to connect how and why some things fit and why some doesn't, for the sake of understanding my way of thinking and being better as well as get a better picture of other side too, to get the discussion going on about different points of views so I can both personally grow further and become a more tolerant person.
If one suggestion is wrong or it doesn't apply for that specific case, that's fine. Things can be always refined and at some point I realized that there really is no "completely objective" level of "The Collective Truth TM" a human can reach, and being an organic being myself, as much as I would like to think myself as someone acting rationally and "according to what makes sense", at the end of the day, I am still just as swayed by my emotions and experiences as any other, so no need for a piss race over who is "better" at being "objectively logical" as it is in our current time, something that seems to be socially valued in most countries, a trait of "superiority" though in all honesty most people are just fed up with ones boasting that while being hypocritically unaware of their own subjectivity.
So I would say your point on your thinking and feeling being closer, might be just self awareness over how subjective at the end of the day really is- Introtim/Introverted Thinking, Subjective Thinking, by definition. And yeah, most people who achieve some level of self awareness probably are more well rounded in general, but I see type as something they are used to picking as their way of dealing with the world as their main method, using that mainframe of narrative they stick with throughout their lives, which can change/get altered by experiences, but usually as they get older, with their neuroplasticity settling in to being set/less flexible, it is probably things that actually physically affect their brain or some rather extreme experience that would shake their entire world view based on all their past experiences and thinking patterns they developed until then, so at the end, typology is useful for general purposes if you use it to pick up certain patterns in people rather than expecting them to act like extreme/caricaturized examples that are in most type profiles, is my view of typology stuff in general, if that makes sense?
And I would say that people can get better at things, but again, as they get older it often gets harder to change their thinking patterns/to develop new connections so compared to someone who was honing on that pathway longer, also for some things added with perhaps genetic tendencies, they are unlikely to get as good as such people/get better than them in general, which applies for type weakspots as well. So they can develop, but it is not something they are as likely to marvel at/do as naturally unless they pull themselves through some extreme change in personality/perception/even perhaps personal history they have- everything would need to be reframed and retrained, and that's some massive load with often little to no map even telling you how to do them, so I find type changing sort of things unlikely, but do believe that people can learn circumvent around their weak points/to get at least some competence at them via trial and error to the point of where they can survive, if they need to.
Last edited by ApeironStella; 12-21-2018 at 12:32 PM.
The truth is life asks all functions out of everyone depending on circumstances. One cannot just "ego function" their whole life, dual or not, and even with a dual, the duo is not stitched together, there will be time where both will have to use their weak functions while stranded out in the world. Having a dual around is a way to learn by witnessing, imo, and there is no need to fuck them to learn from them.
Anyhoo, I think that a person has function preferences at least, and that by being very often in situation that calls for their weak functions can make them pretty decent at emulating said weak functions, though they will not grow from it, more likely fall into despair.
I have found that there is a sense of "right" in learning to put oneself in more situation that require one's prefered functions, doesn't mean one suddenly cannot "weak function" anymore, though it seem preferable to leave that to other people who actually are better at it than one, and focus on what one is better at.
Everyone has feelings, has a logic, a need for imagination and possibilities, can enjoy endulging in the senses... it's human.