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    Quote Originally Posted by Braingel View Post
    Therefore, those people are also “yours” on a way( they are giving to you, to raise what is you, and you give to them. You both give one another energy and time, time is ultimate energy form.. You both are each other’s energy and interact to bring more energy.
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    Once you marry yourself to what fully is yours— your own self, what is around you, and that which governs movement for the governing well, of what is yours; other people’s energy given to you (money is really measuring the time and amount of energy one put in), you will be an evolved human being.
    I am in my head; not society.

    Yes, that is who I am, hence the bold am.​ Also, a brain angel. (But Zelda's incarnate too).


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    Marrying acceptance of all that is yours, shortcoming, what is in and out of self that is self and that is not self, but still affects self.
    I am in my head; not society.

    Yes, that is who I am, hence the bold am.​ Also, a brain angel. (But Zelda's incarnate too).


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    Quote Originally Posted by Braingel View Post
    Once you marry yourself to what fully is yours— your own self, what is around you, and that which governs movement for the governing well, of what is yours; other people’s energy given to you (money is really measuring the time and amount of energy one put in), you will be an evolved human being.
    Evolution in the highest divine mind seeks the annihilation of all things physical, to evaporate and erode what is so corrupt and damaging, and replace it with a shining utopia!!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Braingel View Post
    Once you marry yourself to what fully is yours— your own self, what is around you, and that which governs movement for the governing well, of what is yours; other people’s energy given to you (money is really measuring the time and amount of energy one put in), you will be an evolved human being.
    Maybe you should try to communicate this to your dad so you guys can have more meaningful conversations rather that screaming matches.
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    The more evolved humans there are, by the way, the less abuse there will be in the world, also meaning lesser chance your daughter will by others be abused, and that she will marry abuser who can abuser her children; your grandchildren.
    I am in my head; not society.

    Yes, that is who I am, hence the bold am.​ Also, a brain angel. (But Zelda's incarnate too).


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    Quote Originally Posted by Beautiful sky View Post
    Maybe you should try to communicate this to your dad so you guys can have more meaningful conversations rather that screaming matches.
    I’ve tried... He stalks my Quora regularly as well and he has not gleaned single thing. His poor PolR Ni.
    I am in my head; not society.

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    The age types come first in Quadra.. By ensuring the whole is secure, you can ensure that individuals grow healthfully, thus attain peace, as delta Quadra yearns.
    I am in my head; not society.

    Yes, that is who I am, hence the bold am.​ Also, a brain angel. (But Zelda's incarnate too).


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    And alpha tries unite you so you can work force and change with beta, gamma does what needs for peace to ensure and delta keeps peace
    I am in my head; not society.

    Yes, that is who I am, hence the bold am.​ Also, a brain angel. (But Zelda's incarnate too).


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    Quote Originally Posted by BandD View Post
    @Tim

    So I agree with all your typings except I would put DEAD as a SLE & Joy as a LSE.
    Quote Originally Posted by BandD View Post

    Anyway I don't understand what this compulsive need for the community to place DEAD as SEE, I don't see enough good logic or evidence of it personally. He often complains about not getting along too well with his LIE dad. Activity partners aren't really like that- they are a much more positive relationship than most people give them credit for.
    Yeah, I think that my Dad and I would be much more energized if we were actual activity partners. I think that I would agree with him more, and we would be on the same wavelength as each other. I wouldn't be wanting to argue with him so much, and show him where he's gone wrong and couteract his logic with a much better argument. And after a while, when he goes into "fi ethical mode" his Fi just gets boring and too preachy and like it doesn't give a crap about actual facts and logic. He doesn't think about grey areas when it comes things, it's all very black and white. And I don't care much for ethics myself. I want to know the actual, clear reasoning behind things not just "I'm not supporting Pepsi because they use aborted babies in their drinks." Where does it say that in the ingredients? What are the ingredients? How are the aborted babies put in the Pepsi? Does this flavoruring have different names? How many countries are they doing this in?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tim View Post
    I typed DEAD as an SEE because he doesn't care about emotions, emotional expression, and not disturbing the emotional atmosphere. SLE are Fe mobilizing. Also, DEAD valued pragmatism and productivity. Meanwhile, SLE could be pragmatic but they often downplay it due to being Te demonstrative. Similarly, I've seen a lot of SEE mistyping themselves as SLE because most self-identified MBTI ESTP are in fact SEE. Something ain't consistent in the Socionics model. If an SLE is not concerned about the emotional atmosphere but valued being competent and practical, then they are most likely mistyped. For example, Kiana once typed herself as SLE before realizing that she is SEE.

    Anyways, I'm gonna see what type DEAD is in voice chat in the Transcendence Discord server.
    I think that my Dad drilled a lot of Gamma values and Te into me and my brother at a young age. It doesn't mean that I'm comfortable with Fi/Te, or really adept at using it. I got a lot of lectures about being practical, and using my brain despite actually doing things and getting them done. I have noticed considerable differences between how my Dad and myself act and think, and how we process information. I think I come across as a bit of a "bitch" and hide my Fe a bit because of how I was brought up. I was taught to value productivity, and not waste time.

    Kiana went crazy though after being typed SEE. Do you think that maybe (not saying this is the case of course) that she was stressed going from Ti creative to Ti PoLR in the system and that she was actually Fi PoLR, and when she tried to be Fi, she flew off the reals? I guess that could happen in some circumstances when people have such a massive type jump. Or again, she could just be a bitch and was good at hiding it.

    Fair enough, I'm going to do some things before I login to Discord, then we can talk later if we're both around.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DEAD View Post
    Kiana went crazy though after being typed SEE. Do you think that maybe (not saying this is the case of course) that she was stressed going from Ti creative to Ti PoLR in the system and that she was actually Fi PoLR, and when she tried to be Fi, she flew off the reals? I guess that could happen in some circumstances when people have such a massive type jump. Or again, she could just be a bitch and was good at hiding it.
    To be fair Kiana was always like that. She just changed what it was she was gatekeeping and defending. Prior to switching to SEE she would gatekeep the fuck out of Beta quadra and then when she switched types she kept that attitude but directed it towards being a "loyal follower" to Gulenko and seemingly hating EIEs lol. Same attitude just directed at something else.

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    Quote Originally Posted by QueenTiger666 View Post
    To be fair Kiana was always like that. She just changed what it was she was gatekeeping and defending. Prior to switching to SEE she would gatekeep the fuck out of Beta quadra and then when she switched types she kept that attitude but directed it towards being a "loyal follower" to Gulenko and seemingly hating EIEs lol. Same attitude just directed at something else.

    Okay, fair enough. I hadn't really observed her that much but from a quick glance that's what it seemed like. I don't understand stuff like that, the whole loyalty thing, then switching loyalties and changing mindsets. It seems really inconsistent in general. Loyalty seems extreme as well, to a point in a lot of cases.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DEAD View Post
    Okay, fair enough. I hadn't really observed her that much but from a quick glance that's what it seemed like. I don't understand stuff like that, the whole loyalty thing, then switching loyalties and changing mindsets. It seems really inconsistent in general. Loyalty seems extreme as well, to a point in a lot of cases.
    She did have an extreme kind of devoted cult follower attitude towards "G" yeah. Being loyal to someone like that with no benefit to me is something I really don't get. (Well, I can understand why people do it but it seems pointless if you really don't get anything from it). She seemed the type to need an authority figure to follow lol.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pandemic candy View Post
    yea she typed @sbbds as an EIE masquerading as SLE
    Didn't she just type everyone she didn't like as EIE?

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    I’ve read some of his Facebook posts and I can certainly buy @Tim as having weak and devalued Fi/Ne.

    I don’t have any new typings rn.
    —-

    tbh I skim most posts and there may be many who don’t quite make it into my sx filter even if they post a lot - they may not catch my attention and/or I have put them on ignore. Just wanted to say this I guess. Over time I should notice more people/have more typings.

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    I was away all day today, and was researching things for major endeavor of my embarking, but also, imagine if your child or daughter/son were the one to become the abuser.. Would you want them undergo a penalty of death? Will pressure that Fi.
    I am in my head; not society.

    Yes, that is who I am, hence the bold am.​ Also, a brain angel. (But Zelda's incarnate too).


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    All those abusers are daughters and sons of people, most of who abused them their own selves (whether consciously or unconsciously), but say your daughter/son marries an abuser and enables the abuse and is a complicit... They have as much culpability, especially if they are aware, even despite manipulation. Or say your daughter/son develops a serious mental illness that skipped generations, and environmental triggers activate it in them, and it results in behavior that are harmful for the child, and violence results unto them, the children... Do they deserve the death penalty over treatment? (I already know answer, but it is for you to think about.
    I am in my head; not society.

    Yes, that is who I am, hence the bold am.​ Also, a brain angel. (But Zelda's incarnate too).


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    And would you like be faced with death penalty if an illness ever bestow you upon, such as psychosis or Alzheimer's, or traumatic brain injury that violently alters your personality to polar opposite, and you did something vile amidst that.. Would you want be dead? And do not think from the current you, think of how you would be in that scenario, and how morals put aside, and guilt.
    I am in my head; not society.

    Yes, that is who I am, hence the bold am.​ Also, a brain angel. (But Zelda's incarnate too).


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    It is situations as these where Fi will fail, and act from its own, and this is where Fe is belonging in society. The Fe will look out, and there Fi looks in. But combined with Ni, it looks in and then out, and so the view is more fair in terms of situation as these.
    I am in my head; not society.

    Yes, that is who I am, hence the bold am.​ Also, a brain angel. (But Zelda's incarnate too).


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    Quote Originally Posted by BandD View Post


    I'm against it because many times a person who was molested/abused/whatever are acting out that way because they were also molested/abused/whatever themselves and if you kill them you also kill the innocent person in them that was hurt. And abusers can be very good at 'grooming' others and making the victim feel like it's normal and okay when it obviously is just hurtful and sick and fucked up etc.
    Yeah same. There's also the issue of who even has the right to decide when someone "deserves" death. I'm fine with lethal force in the heat of the moment if it's in self-defense/protection of someone else, but once the situation is over/diffused I feel there's no longer any real need to kill someone. Not to mention I'd rather the state not have the authority to execute people
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    I think the death penalty being present, is indicative of a Fi society. (Ones who are not having such, more likely have Fe consensus).
    I am in my head; not society.

    Yes, that is who I am, hence the bold am.​ Also, a brain angel. (But Zelda's incarnate too).


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    Quote Originally Posted by QueenTiger666 View Post
    To be fair Kiana was always like that. She just changed what it was she was gatekeeping and defending. Prior to switching to SEE she would gatekeep the fuck out of Beta quadra and then when she switched types she kept that attitude but directed it towards being a "loyal follower" to Gulenko and seemingly hating EIEs lol. Same attitude just directed at something else.
    I wonder where the EIE hate comes from. Every EIE I've known has been really sweet
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    the hate comes from EIE being the most expressive type there is, because of the Fe and Se, and such matter is in society, disparaged. Especially in that of male.
    I am in my head; not society.

    Yes, that is who I am, hence the bold am.​ Also, a brain angel. (But Zelda's incarnate too).


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    Quote Originally Posted by Braingel View Post
    I think the death penalty being present, is indicative of a Fi society. (Ones who are not having such, more likely have Fe consensus).
    Could you expand on this a little? I'm not sure why that's necessarily indicative of society being Fi. I agree that American society is generally Fi, but I'm just not sure why the death penalty would be indicative of that
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    Because of our feelings and thoughts, the flower scent will be more beautiful or will wilt. The truth that we can heal, we must learn again. Medicine is in our hearts and also in the heart of animal that we call the universe. - tesla
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    Yeah @AWellArmedCat I think more often than not it's a way to be smugly sadistic with others but in a faux-righteous way where the sadism of it gets hidden behind the notion of justice.

    I've experienced those type of people try to totally make up crap that didn't happen just so they then would have the authority to punish people. They would say people exposed their penises in public when they never did. I think it would be really gross and creepy if it happened and deserving of some type of punishment - but it just did not. It was just really a way to be sadistic and get away with it. And sexuality stuff can be a good scapegoat for that kind of thing. They would often target really shy and sensitive people who might totally make up something just so to appeal to authority or tell them what they wanted to hear to punish them. Or the gay community in general, since there's already the stigma that we're just sick perverts deserving of every cruelty that happens.

    Wasn't so much about "justice" or "Morals" like they claimed, that was a huge veneer.

    But I mean that doesn't mean I'm against a family person shooting a pedophile if they caught him in the act. Even though rationally he was probably abused himself and gaslighted to think it was okay - you of course aren't going to think rationally in that movement and will just care about protecting your child. That is to be expected and I understand the outrage of that. I just loathe unhealthy Te authority people or something lol.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AWellArmedCat View Post
    Could you expand on this a little? I'm not sure why that's necessarily indicative of society being Fi. I agree that American society is generally Fi, but I'm just not sure why the death penalty would be indicative of that
    It would be basing on how the person feels and how the situation measures in a distance to their own self in contrast to their own emotional state and values. Fe is about uniting and paying attention to the atmosphere and what is outside of self.
    I am in my head; not society.

    Yes, that is who I am, hence the bold am.​ Also, a brain angel. (But Zelda's incarnate too).


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    Quote Originally Posted by BandD View Post
    Yeah @AWellArmedCat I think more often than not it's a way to be smugly sadistic with others but in a faux-righteous way where the sadism of it gets hidden behind the notion of justice.

    I've experienced those type of people try to totally make up crap that didn't happen just so they then would have the authority to punish people. They would say people exposed their penises in public when they never did. I think it would be really gross and creepy if it happened and deserving of some type of punishment - but it just did not. It was just really a way to be sadistic and get away with it. And sexuality stuff can be a good scapegoat for that kind of thing. They would often target really shy and sensitive people who might totally make up something just so to appeal to authority or tell them what they wanted to hear to punish them. Or the gay community in general, since there's already the stigma that we're just sick perverts deserving of every cruelty that happens.

    Wasn't so much about "justice" or "Morals" like they claimed, that was a huge veneer.

    But I mean that doesn't mean I'm against a family person shooting a pedophile if they caught him in the act. Even though rationally he was probably abused themselves- you of course aren't going to think rationally in that movement and will just care about protecting your child. That is to be expected and I understand the outrage of that. I just loathe unhealthy Te authority people or something lol.
    That would be an act out of the moment and emotional overwhelm, so it is more understandable. Fight or flight.
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    Yes, that is who I am, hence the bold am.​ Also, a brain angel. (But Zelda's incarnate too).


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    Well... that thing is not very forgivable to people so even if they do hear about it later down the road- they might not be calm about it and it's probably not fair to expect them to. Especially if it was more of a stranger/less well-known person and a not a family member they would be more likely to do it. Probably even a family member maybe depending on how close they were. Most abuse happens with people close to you, though. Or a person that is supposed to be trustworthy and moral but abuses their authority like a priest or counselor/teacher.

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    Correct... It is less forgivable, because it is deliberate, but of course, in a vast majority of cases, the sexual perpetrator does have their own history, which makes them a victim... And 9/10 times they probably never would have not been given what they needed to process their sexual abuse (bit most of us victims who have been sexually abused still do not go around abusing others sexually, so they probably also have genetic predisposition and impulse control issue or something). But it still is not excusable, of course. Especially when they know to sneak it, and it is more calculated.. It's just best we try heal society to lessen such prevalence..
    I am in my head; not society.

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    You never really hear of a healthy person hurting someone else.. So.. Trying to make healthy of society to promote health in others is the answer to this all. Others just look around to point fingers, when most times it is a cycle of generation, and if not, an illness. The real solution needs to be resolving these matters, more than does the blaming. People are so caught in wanting punish, they cannot even avert on preventing this happening. And all the political and media bullshit ties people further up, when they can out forth their energy into making closer to heaven on Earth.
    I am in my head; not society.

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    @BandD and @Braingel I agreed that most of Western society valued Te, and they are the most Te in this time and age. Globalized homogenized (Globohomo) society seem to be more Gamma or Delta, and they look down on the Beta elements (i.e. Russia, the Deep South, Boer Afrikaners in South Africa, Old India) and want to convert them into other quadra besides Beta.


    This guy (Rudyard Lynch / Whatifalthist) seem to be an ILI-Ni to me but he could be LSi-Ti. He valued Ni but he also seem to be good at providing facts and datas, which indicate Te creative. Apparently, Kiana likes insight from this guy back when I linked her Whatifalthist's sources so there might be a duality here. While I reckon that he is Te valuing, he does criticized Te society.


    Starting in 22:17, Rudyard mentioned something about why people would rather live in the zombie apocalypse than in our society. He mentioned that humans today are less free than a peasant in medieval times. According to him, society have been more Te valuing because of industrialization and then World War II was won by experts which give credence to a Te system. Industrialization is very Te friendly. Our society was ran by experts and thus it only sees as just efficient cogs in the machine. That is perhaps why society love Te so much to answer y'all questions.





    However, he also mentioned in his other videos and livestream that automation might end the Te dominance in society, and because he is Gamma, he would hate it since according to him, without working, people would start drama and thus Fe would be valued again. Perhaps, Fe would start dominating society again once we reach an era of automation. Another videos, I remember he said that we are in the era of good times that create Si valuers (that are beginning to decline) but that wouldn't last long and once war is started and chaos ensues (i.e. due to climate change), people would suddenly start valuing Se to survive. Maybe, in later generations, we would heading toward a society similar to the pre-industrialized past where Beta are once valued again as honorable protectors of nations and tribes. Maybe not. I don't know what the future would ensues.
    Last edited by Tim; 07-20-2021 at 02:17 AM.

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    Thanks @Tim that gives a good thinking type perspective.

    God I hate Te so much lolololol.

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    I would like to say that there are Gammas with a bad reputation. I did benchmarked Amber Heard as SEE and Martin Shkreli as LIE but they typically get caught later after all the damage have been done. I also think Donald Trump is an SEE but many would argued that he's SLE, and he seem to be hated by many.

    I don't think Delta and Alpha are stigmatized in the real world though. However, both judicious quadra would be sometimes stigmatized in the Facebook Socionics community as being a useless joke who either play video games all day or carve wood all day and be boring (Spongebob, Fred Rogers, and Hank Hill). Sometimes, being a Beta in the Socionics community are overtyped similar to the "INTJ Mastermind" in the MBTI community. Being a Delta and Alpha is similar to what people think of sensors in MBTI and enneagram 6 in the enneagram community.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DEAD View Post
    I think that my Dad drilled a lot of Gamma values and Te into me and my brother at a young age. It doesn't mean that I'm comfortable with Fi/Te, or really adept at using it. I got a lot of lectures about being practical, and using my brain despite actually doing things and getting them done. I have noticed considerable differences between how my Dad and myself act and think, and how we process information. I think I come across as a bit of a "bitch" and hide my Fe a bit because of how I was brought up. I was taught to value productivity, and not waste time.

    Kiana went crazy though after being typed SEE. Do you think that maybe (not saying this is the case of course) that she was stressed going from Ti creative to Ti PoLR in the system and that she was actually Fi PoLR, and when she tried to be Fi, she flew off the reals? I guess that could happen in some circumstances when people have such a massive type jump. Or again, she could just be a bitch and was good at hiding it.
    That would have some influence. However, I'm also from a family of Te and Fi valuers (LSE dad, ESI mom, and EII sister). I'm still concerned about emotional expression and impact the atmosphere often giving a troll vibe as Kat said in the Transcendence Discord.

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    If I get away with an older IEI, I may be moving to the Deep South. @Tim
    I am in my head; not society.

    Yes, that is who I am, hence the bold am.​ Also, a brain angel. (But Zelda's incarnate too).


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    If it's more beta, I will probably have much easier time
    I am in my head; not society.

    Yes, that is who I am, hence the bold am.​ Also, a brain angel. (But Zelda's incarnate too).


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    I was raised by an ESE, and my father is probably LSE sp8. I I the IEI2Fe, which is ESE pseudo type, and so I sort of value Si a bit more than would typical IEI.. By Is and Se being "boosted". It can affect your subtype. @DEAD
    I am in my head; not society.

    Yes, that is who I am, hence the bold am.​ Also, a brain angel. (But Zelda's incarnate too).


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    This shit is probably written by Te/Fi eh:

    The image in it: http://stateofthesouth.org/2015/10/2...ith-the-south/
    I am in my head; not society.

    Yes, that is who I am, hence the bold am.​ Also, a brain angel. (But Zelda's incarnate too).


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    Quote Originally Posted by AWellArmedCat View Post
    I wonder where the EIE hate comes from. Every EIE I've known has been really sweet
    For her it seemed she was almost stuck in a loop where she'd ascribed certain traits to EIEs (eg. rallying a "hate mob" and being overdramatic - both of which can be exhibited by more unhealthy EIEs sure but aren't in themselves defining traits of the type) so that when she perceived someone to be doing that she'd type them as EIE and thus reinforcing her opinion of the type.

    It does seem a lot of people are quick to slap an EIE or Beta typing on people they don't like. Likely because there seems to be a lot of Si valuers and Deltas on the forum who see someone they don't like and assume they must be of the opposing quadra. That and taking surface level traits that can be influenced by non-type related factors and assigning them to a type based on personal bias and experience.

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