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Thread: Are you a leftist or a rightist?

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    Default Are you a leftist or a rightist?

    Tell me your type and what do you believe about politics? And why?

    https://www.diffen.com/difference/Le..._vs_Right_Wing

    Last edited by idontgiveaf; 12-22-2017 at 01:36 PM.

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    Neither. Pretty moderate/libertarian.

    I 'lean left' I guess you can say but.... the extreme stereotypes of both left and right people annoy me. ie the liberal faggot professor who uses the word 're-iterate' too much and lives too much in sjw academia and is so sheltered in his liberal bubble vs. the asshole conservative republican str8 man who spends his entire life hating everybody else while stroking himself to the dude from duck dynasty.

    Not that you can ever be perfectly in the middle of a position either but its the type of people I find most refreshing.

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    I have none too. Like both parties have it's foul odor. But i more lean on the rightist though because of these cringey sources

    Real cringey for real

    https://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/5937230

    https://youtu.be/2rZ_sR3KS34

    https://youtu.be/-O9msTyRiDg

    https://youtu.be/Gg8xhKI1sMw

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    These types of dichotomies are distractions. The real dichotomy is Democracy vs Aristocracy, framed by Pro vs Con government, originating with a misunderstanding of the relationships between government and its people. Democracies give permission to meritocratic aristocracies. It is their duty to rule of the common good of the democracy, not themselves or their buddies, like Trump.

    Do you believe everyone has a say in their own lives and who has power over them? Or, do you prefer to just let the self-annointed?

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    Eh, I'm somewhere in the middle.

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    I am a left leaning libertarian. My political mindset leans towards a smaller government overall. Both political parties generally want to expand the government in different ways, which is why I usually oppose the left and right, but not always.

    I have more left wing beliefs than right wing beliefs, but there are still several issues I agree with the right. I think the important thing is to keep an open mind politically. Whether you are in the left, right or neither doesn't matter.

    What matters is if you keep yourself from falling into group think and demonizing the opposing political side and/or anyone who doesn't coincide with your political beliefs and party.

    Political infighting solves nothing, while looking at the crux of each issue and how to remedy it effectively is what will solve problems. Also, being aware of the big picture and how both political parties can be used to fulfill a hidden agenda is also very important.
    "Nothing happens until the pain of staying the same outweighs the pain of change."

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    Quote Originally Posted by Raver View Post
    I am a left leaning libertarian. My political mindset leans towards a smaller government overall. Both political parties generally want to expand the government in different ways, which is why I usually oppose the left and right, but not always.

    I have more left wing beliefs than right wing beliefs, but there are still several issues I agree with the right. I think the important thing is to keep an open mind politically. Whether you are in the left, right or neither doesn't matter.

    What matters is if you keep yourself from falling into group think and demonizing the opposing political side or anyone who doesn't coincide with your political beliefs and party.

    Political infighting solves nothing, while looking at the crux of each issue and how to remedy it effectively is what will solve problems. Also, being aware of the big picture and how both political parties can be used to fulfill a hidden agenda is also very important.
    ^pretty much this.
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    Economically I'm naturally a bleeding heart and I've reaped a lot of benefit from social assistance but I'm also aware I know dick about economics so I'm kind of ambivalent. Socially I tend towards liberalism with a few exceptions.

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    Left.

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    I'm kinda the opposite of libertarian. Fiscally left, socially somewhat right.

    But, our politicians are laughably bad. The right side is hard to side with right now just based on how transparently self serving they're actions are.
    Projection is ordinary. Person A projects at person B, hoping tovalidate something about person A by the response of person B. However, person B, not wanting to be an obejct of someone elses ego and guarding against existential terror constructs a personality which protects his ego and maintain a certain sense of a robust and real self that is different and separate from person A. Sadly, this robust and real self, cut off by defenses of character from the rest of the world, is quite vulnerable and fragile given that it is imaginary and propped up through external feed back. Person B is dimly aware of this and defends against it all the more, even desperately projecting his anxieties back onto person A, with the hope of shoring up his ego with salubrious validation. All of this happens without A or B acknowledging it, of course. Because to face up to it consciously is shocking, in that this is all anybody is doing or can do and it seems absurd when you realize how pathetic it is.

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    Tribe Name: Progressive
    "Open, internationalist and inclusive view of Britain, comfortable with immigration. Belief in the welfare state, balanced view towards tax and the economy."

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    I'm an LIE, and politically I'd say I'm a non-Authoritarian realist.

    I think governments are one solution to how individuals can better get along with each other with a minimum of killing, so they are both useful and generally beneficial to the groups of individuals, if not always to the individuals themselves.

    My personal preference is for liberal democracies.
    Last edited by Adam Strange; 12-23-2017 at 01:46 AM.

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    I'm on the left, but my political views don't fit in with what would be considered a democrat, socialist or communist (etc.). I'm more of a syndicalist, believing in the replacement of capitalism with non-competitively categorized industrial sectors that are used to manage and calibrate the economy.

    An ideal society, in my mind, is one that could more effectively deal with the measures of bureaucracy without the crushing fiscal measures of conservative and liberal policies. A state that has a decentralized government that is ruled by directly elected regional councils under the jurisdiction of a national congress. Whereas other nations in the past that have realized this goal have gone through nationalization and collectivization seemed necessary, for the reason of it being that’s what the people wanted, it has systemically backfired in that the socioeconomic hierarchy inverted and the consequences of people barely able to make enough money to survive in that hierarchy.

    Another reform that I had in mind would be to allow economic freedom at the local level. In turn, this would be backed up by strong workers' rights, welfare support and a democratization of the workplace in the form of co-operatives. Representatives would be elected to represent the people by direct elections standing as nominally independent candidates, though in practice a solid majority would coalesce in groups around certain ideals (thus cutting out the need for political parties to have to be excessively funded by corporations or the candidates themselves. An extreme, but possibly necessary measure would be to ban them as formal organizations).

    Here are the issues in US politics that I feel the most strongly about (not in any particular order):

    1.) The government should raise the minimum wage to make it a livable wage so that people old enough to enter workforce can make ends meet to support themselves financially. Not everyone is privileged enough to have wealthy relatives to send them money or to even make enough money as is to repay what had been lent to them in the first place. This is the most common form of wage slavery by which working class people have no other choice but to rent themselves out the upper class to get out of the debt that they've been put in.

    2.) A mandatory single-payer healthcare system that would make Obamacare obsolete, so that everyone can actually get the medical treatment that they need.

    3.) Remove Common Core education standards and instead test for the student's natural talents and abilities at the state level.

    4.) Decrease military spending to help reduce the dangerously increasing national debt.

    5.) Invest in alternative energy sources such as wind, geothermal, hydroelectric, fuel cell production, cold fusion and nuclear energy to reduce the dependency on coal and oil.

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    SLI I think, and, I think, I don't care for politics.

    To me politics are for people who like to argue, which isn't necessarily type related.

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    Overall, if I want to be honest with myself, I'm probably left-wingish. I don't like big showoffs of money, I don't like uniform thinking in people and inside companies, and I think technological innovation and artistic progress are among the most important things in life.
    But I am more into the original kind of left wing, not the hipster 2017 variant. Otherwise I'd rather go alt-right.
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    I think there's an apathy in politics, people know it won't change anything. What's the answer? Get really stressed and have strong opinions, to counteract the fear and knowing no one listens, or, just not care about it, and focus on other things. To me number 2 is reasonable.

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    Oh, there's one thing were I am strongly right-wing. I am actually in favor of territioral expansion of Italy towards other countries in Europe. I know it sounds completely nonsensical, but I believe some of our territories have been stolen after ww2 and we should get them back (especially the western part of Croatia). Ofc the people who live there should be allowed to stay there...
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    It really depends on the circumstances which direction is ideal, but currently there is nothing sane about the left in this country. The alt right is the most sane group right now.

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    When I analyzed my various positions on policy issues, I discovered that I was a libertarian with some nationalistic sympathies. However I don't like to label myself as I am pretty pragmatic about politics; I'll support whatever benefits me personally (which may and has changed over time). I don't hew to any ideology for moral reasons as that would make me dogmatic and hence unable to get the best deal, compete and continue to advance in life.

    That being said, there are a few issues which I have strong views on.

    The trifecta of high immigration, expensive rents and foreign land ownership (all of which are directly related to each other) are screwing my generation royally right now. My desire to do something about them led me to get involved in politics as a lobbyist, support Trump and other politicians/parties closer to home who have similar views. I raised a reasonable amount of money down here and we have a new government now, so I will be interested to see what my efforts earlier in the year result in.

    As you guys know, I also talk a lot about feminism and gender issues. This is mainly because I'm a young man who is single and trying to find love in an atmosphere full of anxious, distrustful and prudish women - women who've been insidiously taught by feminists that all (straight, white) men are potential rapists and oppressors. I also work in the entertainment industry, and feel depressed by how corrupt and hypocritical it is. Many artists send divisive, malicious messages to young people about the nature of sex and relationships, and what's worse, they abuse their celebrity status to pontificate and lecture their fans on how to live.

    The personal should not become political. We all have a right to privacy, and shouldn't be shamed by the outrage brigade for being different.
    Last edited by Spermatozoa; 12-22-2017 at 09:26 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cuivienen View Post
    However I don't like to label myself as I am pretty pragmatic about politics; I'll support whatever benefits me personally
    Egocentric individualism is the core of liberalism. This is your label.

    > I don't hew to any ideology for moral reasons as that would make me dogmatic

    you are dogmatic in egocentrism
    it's one of reasons you are not satisfied by relations as this needs to love, while to love needs not to be egocentric. while your dogmatic individualism prevents you from better own pleasure. paradox of the life
    Types examples: video bloggers, actors

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    Eh the group is absolutely batshit these days, there's no reason to conform to it.
    Every political stance has pros and cons, ... with collectivism you benefit from the accommodations of others but you've abandoned the attempt at establishing your own identity.
    Maybe he isn't willing to compromise his convictions to appease the random whims of the group... that could be integrity.
    Can't really love someone else if you have no self to give the love, either.
    Love occurs between individuals...
    The love of random masses of people isn't really equal to the love between two individuals.
    Last edited by rat200Turbo; 12-23-2017 at 01:40 AM.

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    I'm a rightist cuz I'm always right.
    "The society that separates its scholars from its warriors will have its thinking done by cowards and its fighting by fools." ―Thucydides



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    honestly, i see myself as a moderate, somewhere in the middle-- i believe in egalitarianism and helping out the poor, but also in glorious wars of genocidal purification.

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    you have a really simple understanding of politics...
    people are poorer now than they have ever been thanks to slow stagflation from those 'helpful policies'.

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    Taxation is theft.
    "The society that separates its scholars from its warriors will have its thinking done by cowards and its fighting by fools." ―Thucydides



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    Quote Originally Posted by Remiel View Post
    Taxation is theft.
    No doubt. This country should fund itself with bake sales.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    No doubt. This country should fund itself with bake sales.

    Nah, you already got that down with warfare.

    Edit: Also the prison industrial complex, just to throw out a couple of cheap shots..
    "The society that separates its scholars from its warriors will have its thinking done by cowards and its fighting by fools." ―Thucydides



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    Quote Originally Posted by Remiel View Post

    Nah, you already got that down with warfare.

    Edit: Also the prison industrial complex, just to throw out a couple of cheap shots..
    If not taxes, and not bake sales, how do you propose to fund services that you use? Rubbish on my street is picked up, I have street lights that work, I have a police service to keep law, I have environmental health to control pestilence, I have a town planning department to maintain the roads, make sure traffic signals work.

    Stealing is using these things without paying for it is it not? Like it or not you don't live in the woods yourself but in a society where everyone draws collective benefits, and everyone has to collectively contribute.

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    I don't understand how there can be multiple variations(right or left) of libertarian. You are either a proponent of self-governance or you aren't. Liberalism and socialism require government to work, there's no real way around that fact. It's like the Noam Chomsky's of the world decided "Hey I like that word, I'm going to hijack it and start using it too". The term left-libertarianism or libertarian socialism are literally oxymorons.

    I have the same issues with the term left libertarian as I have with anarcho communism. If there is no state, who is going to stop me from printing my own currency? If there is no state who is going to make me give up my earnings to be redistributed to equally? Who is going to regulate the means of production? Socialism will always require a strong central authority to regulate the means of production. There is nothing remotely libertarian about socialism.

    Though, perhaps what people on here are trying to say is that people should have the freedom to do whatever they want as long as it both doesn't affect other people and also doesn't involve anything of value.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Remiel View Post

    Nah, you already got that down with warfare.

    Edit: Also the prison industrial complex, just to throw out a couple of cheap shots..
    Well, I agree that prisons are bad for democracy. Nothing like denying the vote to 6 million poor people and 25 industrialists and 3 hedge fund managers. The prison population should be reduced, starting with people on the low end of monetary and social damages.

    But seriously, taxes in a sovereign nation are not used to fund the government. They shovel that money into furnaces on April 15th and just print more.
    Why would a country that can print as much money as it needs, tax its citizens? It is to
    1. Give the money value. If you didn't need green pieces of paper to pay your taxes, then the "dollar" would just be worth the paper it is printed on. Like in Somalia.
    2. Regulate prices in relation to dollars by regulating the supply of dollars. If you print too many dollars in relation to the supply of goods and services, then the prices of goods and services tend to get bid up. Taxes slow this inflationary process to a crawl.

    Inflation, incidentally, is generally a good thing if you are in debt (and you probably are) and it is only a bad thing if you are a lender (banker, investor) or are on a fixed income. Debts tend to grow exponentially, by an interest rate. Your productive capacity does not.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Scarper View Post
    If not taxes, and not bake sales, how do you propose to fund services that you use? Rubbish on my street is picked up, I have street lights that work, I have a police service to keep law, I have environmental health to control pestilence, I have a town planning department to maintain the roads, make sure traffic lights work.

    Stealing is using these things without paying for it is it not? Like it or not you don't live in the woods yourself but in a society where everyone draws collective benefits, and everyone has to collectively contribute.

    Dont compare my statement to the taxation that is occuring in your different nations, my statement is myopic and a critiquing of the society in which I live.
    "The society that separates its scholars from its warriors will have its thinking done by cowards and its fighting by fools." ―Thucydides



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    Quote Originally Posted by Remiel View Post

    Dont compare my statement to the taxation that is occuring in your different nations, my statement is myopic and a critiquing of the society in which I live.
    In other words: you're just saying stuff that doesn't make sense. This is fine but it can be taken literally and mislead people. I don't mean you in particular but such ill thought out yet inflammatory views.

    Anyway, politics has become largely ineffectual, it's mostly for people who like to argue but are within constraints of a system and world where real changes cannot really happen. The real changes happen in a persons life, regardless who's in charge of bureaucracy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Scarper View Post
    In other words: you're just saying stuff that doesn't make sense. This is fine but it can be taken literally and mislead people. I don't mean you in particular but such ill thought out yet inflammatory views.

    Anyway, politics has become largely ineffectual, it's mostly for people who like to argue but are within constraints of a system and world where real changes cannot really happen. The real changes happen in a persons life, regardless who's in charge of bureaucracy.
    Yes, I tend to think that inequality has grown past the critical point, to where we can no longer pretend that our input to the government matters.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Scarper View Post
    In other words: you're just saying stuff that doesn't make sense. This is fine but it can be taken literally and mislead people. I don't mean you in particular but such ill thought out yet inflammatory views.

    Anyway, politics has become largely ineffectual, it's mostly for people who like to argue but are within constraints of a system and world where real changes cannot really happen. The real changes happen in a persons life, regardless who's in charge of bureaucracy.
    Well, with all due respect I will say what ever the fuck I want you little used up tampon. Also, expressing views in high contrast is what I am all about. Now throw yourself in the trash.
    "The society that separates its scholars from its warriors will have its thinking done by cowards and its fighting by fools." ―Thucydides



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    Quote Originally Posted by Remiel View Post
    Well, with all due respect I will say what ever the fuck I want you little used up tampon. Also, expressing views in high contrast is what I am all about. Now throw yourself in the trash.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    Yes, I tend to think that inequality has grown past the critical point, to where we can no longer pretend that our input to the government matters.
    My solution is not to bother with it and leave them to it, and instead focus on the things I can change, ie my life and all that crap, find a girl settle down etc etc



    Anyway weirdly today it was noted I don't argue much. It's not that i'm anti-arguing, it's just that for most things in life people get worked up about, I just don't really care, instead I have my own priorities in order.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hitta View Post
    I don't understand how there can be multiple variations(right or left) of libertarian. You are either a proponent of self-governance or you aren't. Liberalism and socialism require government to work, there's no real way around that fact. It's like the Noam Chomsky's of the world decided "Hey I like that word, I'm going to hijack it and start using it too". The term left-libertarianism or libertarian socialism are literally oxymorons.

    I have the same issues with the term left libertarian as I have with anarcho communism. If there is no state, who is going to stop me from printing my own currency? If there is no state who is going to make me give up my earnings to be redistributed to equally? Who is going to regulate the means of production? Socialism will always require a strong central authority to regulate the means of production. There is nothing remotely libertarian about socialism.

    Though, perhaps what people on here are trying to say is that people should have the freedom to do whatever they want as long as it both doesn't affect other people and also doesn't involve anything of value.
    You can be a left leaning or right leaning libertarian. It is pretty simple, a left leaning libertarian wants a small government, but with slightly more control over economics rather than social issues. A right leaning libertarian is vice versa. Contrast that to a left leaning authoritarian aka Democrat wanting a big government, but with slightly less control over social issues.

    A right leaning authoritarian is vice versa. In the end, this is just slight differences. If you want to say that libertarians are mostly the same and just vary slightly on economic and social issues then that works too. It could apply to authoritarians aka the traditional two party system in a sense as well. In the end, Democrats and Republicans don't have dramatic differences IMO.
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    Hacking your soul since the beginning of time Hitta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raver View Post
    You can be a left leaning or right leaning libertarian. It is pretty simple, a left leaning libertarian wants a small government, but with slightly more control over economics rather than social issues. A right leaning libertarian is vice versa. Contrast that to a left leaning authoritarian aka Democrat wanting a big government, but with slightly less control over social issues.

    A right leaning authoritarian is vice versa. In the end, this is just slight differences. If you want to say that libertarians are mostly the same and just vary slightly on economic and social issues then that works too. It could apply to authoritarians aka the traditional two party system in a sense as well. In the end, Democrats and Republicans don't have dramatic differences IMO.
    What you're saying with right and left leaning libertarian is far different though than the way people like Noam Chomsky use it. They think that you can have a form of socialism that fits under the umbrella of libertarianism and to me that just makes no sense.
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    Wow politics is really a big hit

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    Default boo @ dialectics

    answer: no/yes

    the best of "right" is foundational to the best of "left", both are important and incomplete

    many shitholes in USA/world are pre-"right" and pre-"left"; pre-humanism, pre-ideals

    I go with whatever's necessary atm -- Se-SEE 8/9 + 5/4
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