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Thread: Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies

  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by consentingadult View Post
    The euro is backed up by something even better than an army: Germans!
    Germans without an army.

    How history has changed, lol.

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    Bump.

    What are the best apps for bit coin and mining and laundering?

    Ease of use and reliability are what I'm after.

    Edit: need to make some purchases. Not interested in history or world events, just product specifics and user experiences.

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    Quote Originally Posted by raTG13 View Post
    Bump.

    What are the best apps for bit coin and mining and laundering?

    Ease of use and reliability are what I'm after.

    Edit: need to make some purchases. Not interested in history or world events, just product specifics and user experiences.
    I like Monero, recommend it if you use it for illicit activities. Dash does something similar ig. It’s a bit obscure but it’s the only one that offers you functionality that Bitcoin can’t. Absolutely unbeatable in terms of privacy, it’s philosophy is also great and everything I stand for when it comes to internet privacy, decentralization, and open source software.

    Monero is an open-source cryptocurrency created in April 2014 that focuses on fungibility, privacy and decentralization. Monero uses an obfuscated public ledger, meaning anybody can broadcast or send transactions, but no outside observer can tell the source, amount or destination.

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    Ahh yea. Made some decent cash day trading this shit back before the first bubble pop. Put in some bucks after the pop until it blew up again and sure enough the time came! Just cashed out last weekend. Basically completely agree with Adam and covids posts. You can make some money flipping it and investing at the right time. However it's extremely volatile. Very high risk. Just cuz its a bubble doesn't mean we can't help inflate it to make some cash in the mean time though.

    Right now is a good time to keep buying stock market stocks too. I would stay away from bitcoin. It's already at 16k.. how much higher is it going to go before the new bubble pops ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cybel View Post
    I like Monero, recommend it if you use it for illicit activities. Dash does something similar ig. It’s a bit obscure but it’s the only one that offers you functionality that Bitcoin can’t. Absolutely unbeatable in terms of privacy, it’s philosophy is also great and everything I stand for when it comes to internet privacy, decentralization, and open source software.
    Very interesting these crypto currencies.

    I am most interested in bit coins however as this is the currency of choice for my needs.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kingslayer View Post
    Ahh yea. Made some decent cash day trading this shit back before the first bubble pop. Put in some bucks after the pop until it blew up again and sure enough the time came! Just cashed out last weekend. Basically completely agree with Adam and covids posts. You can make some money flipping it and investing at the right time. However it's extremely volatile. Very high risk. Just cuz its a bubble doesn't mean we can't help inflate it to make some cash in the mean time though.

    Right now is a good time to keep buying stock market stocks too. I would stay away from bitcoin. It's already at 16k.. how much higher is it going to go before the new bubble pops ?
    Do you need to a large exchange rate for the coins and if so what is it? What is the actual process of purchasing coins and what programs do you use?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    I, personally, think bitcoin is a poor store of value and is presently in a bubble. But that's just my own opinion.

    My reason for thinking that it is a poor store of value is that bitcoin doesn't have an army that forces people to give it value relative to their lives.

    My reason for thinking that it is in a bubble is the recent run up in its "value". Incidentally, note that bitcoin's "value" is measured relative to the dollar (and not vice-versa), which DOES have an army backing up its value.
    Which army has gold?

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    Quote Originally Posted by raTG13 View Post
    Do you need to a large exchange rate for the coins and if so what is it? What is the actual process of purchasing coins and what programs do you use?
    You can buy bitcoin and etherium alongside a few others through the coin base app and website . Then transfer that to a trading platform like binance for example. There you can make all sorts of crypto trades

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    Quote Originally Posted by kingslayer View Post
    You can buy bitcoin and etherium alongside a few others through the coin base app and website . Then transfer that to a trading platform like binance for example. There you can make all sorts of crypto trades
    Okay I have heard about coin base app. I have also heard about cash app, which transfers funds to different currencies and can also handle transactions. I wonder how anonymous this app really is and in what country it bases its servers.

    I want total anonymity and also ease of use. I guess I could research for days, but I really have little ambition to learn this entire process.

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    My rich financial friend who got an alt-crypto for basically pennies says bitcoin is not worth for people who don't understand how to make money off bitcoin. I am SCREAMING at this one dude to sell before it goes down again. He's like no it's gonna go up. I'm like, 1. you don't know that. 2. You missed out on a lot of money you could've made by selling at 1950 and rebuying at 1500. 3. He never said what value he it's gonna go up to, so I'm assuming he's never gonna sell. Bitcoin to 3 million. Bitcoin to hyperinflate the economy, it's so good. I threw in 25 bucks for his sake, and left with 26. The rich financial dude I mentioned does not like this guy.

    But yeah I do stocks instead. Robinhood also does bitcoin and other alts. I made a bit off dodge coin, like 50 bucks. I'm making a pretty penny off stocks, like 20% of my networth is gained from stocks.
    Fixing myself one block at a time.

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    Bitcoin: menace to the planet.




    After recent price spike, the energy to produce bitcoin could power a country of more than 200 million people



    At 92.8 terawatt hours annualized, bitcoin’s power consumption is slightly ahead of Pakistan’s consumption in 2016, and not wildly away from the Netherlands’ consumption that year. ...

    Two-thirds of bitcoin production is done out of China. More than half of China’s energy output comes from coal, so the bitcoin production is likely to be particularly dirty.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alomoes View Post
    My rich financial friend who got an alt-crypto for basically pennies says bitcoin is not worth for people who don't understand how to make money off bitcoin. I am SCREAMING at this one dude to sell before it goes down again. He's like no it's gonna go up. I'm like, 1. you don't know that. 2. You missed out on a lot of money you could've made by selling at 1950 and rebuying at 1500. 3. He never said what value he it's gonna go up to, so I'm assuming he's never gonna sell. Bitcoin to 3 million. Bitcoin to hyperinflate the economy, it's so good. I threw in 25 bucks for his sake, and left with 26. The rich financial dude I mentioned does not like this guy.

    But yeah I do stocks instead. Robinhood also does bitcoin and other alts. I made a bit off dodge coin, like 50 bucks. I'm making a pretty penny off stocks, like 20% of my networth is gained from stocks.

    people who trade altcoins are just likely to lose money because the market is too volatile. the best bet is to look for promising projects and just forget about them for a few years, but even then it's a very risky investment. look at ripple, three years ago the ATH was at nearly 3 dollars, now it's at 0,22. if you invest money into crypto, be prepared to potentially lose it all. the reason why it's such an attractive market for many is that the potential profit is so huge compared to your investment, but very very few people actually hold a coin like bitcoin for several years without taking profit. I think INxx types make the most money, because they are extremly patient bc of high Ni.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    Bitcoin: menace to the planet.




    After recent price spike, the energy to produce bitcoin could power a country of more than 200 million people



    At 92.8 terawatt hours annualized, bitcoin’s power consumption is slightly ahead of Pakistan’s consumption in 2016, and not wildly away from the Netherlands’ consumption that year. ...

    Two-thirds of bitcoin production is done out of China. More than half of China’s energy output comes from coal, so the bitcoin production is likely to be particularly dirty.
    again the entj Si polr caring about sustainance of the planet. i thought Si polr Te leads were all about profit over peoples dead bodies hm?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    Bitcoin: menace to the planet.




    After recent price spike, the energy to produce bitcoin could power a country of more than 200 million people



    At 92.8 terawatt hours annualized, bitcoin’s power consumption is slightly ahead of Pakistan’s consumption in 2016, and not wildly away from the Netherlands’ consumption that year. ...

    Two-thirds of bitcoin production is done out of China. More than half of China’s energy output comes from coal, so the bitcoin production is likely to be particularly dirty.
    Afaik Bitcoin farms are usually located near dams for hydroelectric power (cheap power source).
    What good is a book that does not even transport us beyond all books?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Number 9 large View Post
    again the entj Si polr caring about sustainance of the planet. i thought Si polr Te leads were all about profit over peoples dead bodies hm?
    No
    What good is a book that does not even transport us beyond all books?

    ~Nietzsche

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    met a bunch of LIE in berlin who are vegan, care about the enviroment and look for efficient ways to improve it. it's all about that subjective value system

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    Quote Originally Posted by Uncle Ave View Post
    No
    No
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    Quote Originally Posted by dead account View Post
    met a bunch of LIE in berlin who are vegan, care about the enviroment and look for efficient ways to improve it. it's all about that subjective value system
    This is an anecdote that doesnt hold any weight whatsoever in any argument
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uncle Ave View Post
    Afaik Bitcoin farms are usually located near dams for hydroelectric power (cheap power source).
    OK, if that's the case, then no harm done. Sort of.

    All energy use creates waste heat, but if that energy came from falling water, then that waste heat would have been created in any case when the water hit the rocks. Making bitcoins out of it on its way down merely diverts the energy from its entropic path for a while.

    My concern about wasting energy on stupid projects stems from having read these two posts:

    https://dothemath.ucsd.edu/2011/07/g...-scale-energy/

    https://dothemath.ucsd.edu/2012/04/e...ets-physicist/

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    OK, if that's the case, then no harm done. Sort of.

    All energy use creates waste heat, but if that energy came from falling water, then that waste heat would have been created in any case when the water hit the rocks. Making bitcoins out of it on its way down merely diverts the energy from its entropic path for a while.

    My concern about wasting energy on stupid projects stems from having read these two posts:

    https://dothemath.ucsd.edu/2011/07/g...-scale-energy/

    https://dothemath.ucsd.edu/2012/04/e...ets-physicist/
    I actually do not if that's the case for all Bitcoin farms.

    I was just basing myself on what I saw in this video:

    https://youtu.be/-z4qbkQ3cK8?t=210

    I put it at the timestamp where you can see where he talks about the power source of the server farm.

    Now, it makes sense to me that others would do the same. I do not have the information, however, as to whether or not they did. You mentioned China and coal, but I know China also has alot of dams.

    I skimmed through those posts and I agree with the author (physicist) that we (as a society) can't just continue to spend energy. But I guess that's a topic for another part of the forum.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    OK, if that's the case, then no harm done. Sort of.

    All energy use creates waste heat, but if that energy came from falling water, then that waste heat would have been created in any case when the water hit the rocks. Making bitcoins out of it on its way down merely diverts the energy from its entropic path for a while.

    My concern about wasting energy on stupid projects stems from having read these two posts:

    https://dothemath.ucsd.edu/2011/07/g...-scale-energy/

    https://dothemath.ucsd.edu/2012/04/e...ets-physicist/
    within a few years all the bitcoin will have been mined so u can calm ur tits
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    damn, straight to 31k without blinking. the "safest" investment right now is probably Ethereum. I'm pretty sure Vitalik Buterin is an ILI.

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    Quote Originally Posted by peteronfireee View Post

    With that being said, I think you can *reasonably* expect it to climb to at least $50,000
    Quoting myself from 2017

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    I don't really get Bitcoin. Do the people that buy Bitcoin actually expect to use it in some capacity or are they just thinking they will buy it now and sell it later at a higher price? I mean at this point it's clearly not going to replace currency or do anything spectacular for the free market, if it hasn't already. What's different about it now, other than people still trying to get rich quick? Or is this a hedge for whales that think the US economy is about to tank? I could see that I guess.
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    Quote Originally Posted by peteronfireee View Post
    Quoting myself from 2017
    ...umm...it also tanked from around $14,000 at the time of you posting that to ~$4,000 less than 6 months later. Judging from the recent spike, it looks like it's due for another huge crash. I don't think anyone buying Bitcoin truly sees it as an investment and as soon as it starts crashing everyone will pull their money.

    edit: all it takes is a sizeable whale or group of whales to sell and start the domino effect
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    Quote Originally Posted by Number 9 large View Post
    within a few years all the bitcoin will have been mined so u can calm ur tits
    ...that's not really how it works though. without miners, you have no official ledger and no bitcoin network...
    Praise Anubis, our lord and savior.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nobody View Post
    ...umm...it also tanked from around $14,000 at the time of you posting that to ~$4,000 less than 6 months later. Judging from the recent spike, it looks like it's due for another huge crash. I don't think anyone buying Bitcoin truly sees it as an investment and as soon as it starts crashing everyone will pull their money.

    edit: all it takes is a sizeable whale or group of whales to sell and start the domino effect
    Yeah, I'm sure it will crash, I agree. But the way I see it, I think cryptocurrency *in general* is here to stay looking at where the world is trending. Cryptocurrency is in its early stages much like the early stages of the internet - nobody (the mainstream) knows what it is and how it works but there is tremendous potential with blockchain technology. But yeah I do think some other altcoin will overtake bitcoin eventually.

    My thoughts on bitcoin: It's the first cryptocurrency. It will most likely survive because of brand recognition. Proof of work doesn't always work and it's very expensive to maintain. Contrary to popular belief, it is centralized out of China because they control all the mining power. Bitcoin futures and other financial institutions are buying bitcoin. And again, because it's the first in its class, it will outlive and survive in the coming ages. It is the first of its kind in terms of a digital asset. There is also a limited amount of bitcoin, making it scarce as a resource.

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    I'll leave this here <.<...>.>... the rig pays for itself. Cards have 2 years warranty :>, cost to run about 100$ a month. Profit after it pays for itself (5 months) 900$ a month.



    Last edited by shotgunfingers; 01-05-2021 at 12:20 PM.

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    I really don’t understand cryptocurrency. What is it that’s tangible that backs its value? It makes sense to invest in gold and silver. Even regular stocks and blue chip would be far better. I bought a lot of Facebook stocks when it first went public at under $20 a share. I’m really glad I did that because I cashed it out last year when it was over $300 a share so I can survive the “pandemic.”

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiana View Post
    I really don’t understand cryptocurrency. What is it that’s tangible that backs its value? It makes sense to invest in gold and silver. Even regular stocks and blue chip would be far better. I bought a lot of Facebook stocks when it first went public at under $20 a share. I’m really glad I did that because I cashed it out last year when it was over $300 a share so I can survive the “pandemic.”
    Nothing. It's basically like the USD> in that it only has value because people say so. That's pretty much it. They found an alternate currency through crypto mining and attributed USD value to it (which is hilarious that their "alternate currency to the USD" is valued by the USD ). So a bunch of people figured we could collectively bring value to this shit by trading it through USD and creating more and increasing the market cap. Alongside trying to hard sell everyone around them to keep buying and the market flowing, a crash is always inevitable. It lost 80% of it's value once already. I could always be wrong about this, yet it's highly unlikely. Most big time Financers agree Crypto is a pile of bullshit, but you can hop on for the ride and make money trading, which is the smart thing to do. That's why you're seeing institutions dropping big time money into this right now. Them cashing out, probably triggered by the vaccine or any other event will cause a MAJOR dip in price, causing the sheep to sell, causing more sells and severe dips. Perhaps the next 80% dip.

    These people staking their life savings and shit are crazy. If I'm wrong and they get rich Kudos to them, I personally don't think it's a smart risk at all to invest that much into something that can lose 80% of it's value so drastically. I'd rather trade stocks than speculative bullshit.

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    even gold only has value because people think it does.

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    Potential use cases:

    Bitcoin (Payments & Storer of Value)
    Ethereum (Smart Contracts & DApps)
    Monero (Anonymous, Private & Fungible Digital Money)
    Factom (Decentralized Notary)
    Dash (Digital Cash)
    Golem (Decentralized Supercomputers)
    Siacoin (Decentralized Cloud Storage)
    IOTA (Internet Of Things)
    XRP (Bank’s Cryptocurrency)
    Civic (Universal Digital Identity)

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    Value is subjective. Many times a hobby is like a funny work without anyone wanting to give you money.

    Well people are similar (and different) enough hence we can exchange based on subjective value that is negotiated between two parties.

    Bitcoin's value is in its agreement between people. Like coins made out of metal people burn electricity for exchange as a middleman.

    This subjectivity is clear because there are people who can survive with very little and others want stuff that costs more and have financial problems.

    Every investment is a subjective decision.


    Anyway, enjoy your roller coaster ride.
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    More and more I'm starting to think this will be here to stay. In what form it stays (whether there is one dominant currency, a handful of different ones, etc.) is still anyone's best guess. Each coin offers advantages that could cause major players to adopt it.

    Also, although ultimately the value of money is arbitrarily set (as is the value of everything), different forms of money have advantages that make them more valuable AS currencies, so it's not completely random.
    Last edited by ouronis; 01-08-2021 at 03:44 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by shotgunfingers View Post
    even gold only has value because people think it does.
    No shit, hence why gold holders are also always hard selling everyone on the idea
    Last edited by kingslayer; 01-08-2021 at 04:28 PM.

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    Gold has some intrinsically good qualities as a metal. It is incredibly malleable and so can be worked into almost any shape. It is one of only two colored metals (the other being copper), and hence it looks warm and attractive rather than cold. It is relatively rare on the surface of the Earth (but not in the Earth's core), and it has a piecewise distribution across the earth which has made mining more of it increasingly costly. Coincidentally and fortuitously for making it a store of "value", the cost of mining increasingly thinner veins of gold has increased at the same rate as the global money supply, since at least the time of the Pharaohs, when gold and silver were of equal value. This means that gold's value has remained constant. For example, in Shakespeare's day, a good suit cost one ounce of gold. That is still true today. No other metal has done that. Finally (for my purposes here), it doesn't tarnish and so continues to look good without needing constant upkeep. It doesn't rust while just sitting there.

    If you ask yourself what the highest potential value a metal like this might have, I'd say it is in making pretty jewelry to give to women to increase your odds of reproductive success. As long as women are vain and men are willing to work, gold will retain its *truly useful* value.

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    Bitcoin just passed $40,000, up from $30,000 less than a month ago.

    Not a bubble. Nope. Not at all.

    Now, if you could make women's shoes only out of bitcoins, then the currency would have some intrinsic value. Hell, I'd be the first to invest in it then.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    Bitcoin just passed $40,000, up from $30,000 less than a month ago.

    Not a bubble. Nope. Not at all.

    Now, if you could make women's shoes only out of bitcoins, then the currency would have some intrinsic value. Hell, I'd be the first to invest in it then.
    Invest in pseudomoney to get more money!



    The absence of use value of crytocurrency is indeed a problem. They tried to replace it with "effort value", basically the idea is that the money invested in mining(hardware, electricity) gives cryptocurrency it's value. That's kinda shitty though because effort != value. Cryptocurrency mining is like someone saying "Look! I chopped this wood with my bare teeth instead of an axe! Since so it's so much harder to do, my wood is much more valuable than other people's, right??!".

    Another problem is that it does not offer a substantial advantage over other types of money so that the majority of people would use it. If people did find it more convenient, it would have, if not intrinsic value, at least instrumental value. As you pointed out in previous posts, cryptocurrencies based on blockchain have no one to enforce their use on other people. As a result, the only users of Bitcoin are miners and people who want anonymity and untraceability. A miner works both like a cryptographic bank and a printing press: he allows the maintenance of the ledger and creates "value" by mining. For him, of course it's profitable to use Bitcoin, since he can print his own money! It's even better if he can convince you to accept Bitcoin as a payment instead of dollars next time he asks for a service! But for a normal person? No, switching accounts/currencies is just another pain in the ass. It's like any pyramid scheme, the one inside must convince the outsiders to follow.
    It could work though, once enough actors are 'converted', the cryptocurrency could become "too big to fail" and states would have to bail out the currency in case of devaluation because of all the pension funds and stuff.

    I still think that most people betting on cryptocurrencies backed by no authority(like a country or a criminal organization) will loose their money long term because those currencies are basically useless. The high volatility of bitcoin price indicates that there isn't any substantial part of the Bitcoin investors that are interested in stable prices; furthermore, there isn't a "stabilizing actor" on the market, but what did people expect, since the whole point of Bitcoin is to get rid of Central Banks?

    I also think it's a bubble; but it's exactly the cryptocurrency's weaknesses that allow it. The fact that bitcoins are actually "pointless" make people consider them a safe-haven value, like art for example, so when the market of real things is shit, it's always better to have your money in bitcoin, right? Probably not I'd say.
    I rarely feel alone. I rarely talk to anyone, yet in my head i have the most amazing, the most fantastic discussions with the people in my life. In real life, what most people talk about is several orders of magnitude lesser than their inner experiences. Most people never reveal the singularity of their subjective experience.
    Maybe I should learn to explore other people's consciousness. Maybe I should aim for a real space between me and others. Instead of cultivating monologues and fantasies. It's hard, but the alternative to this seems to be madness. ~ lkdhf qkb

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    Quote Originally Posted by lkdhf qkb View Post
    Invest in pseudomoney to get more money!



    The absence of use value of crytocurrency is indeed a problem. They tried to replace it with "effort value", basically the idea is that the money invested in mining(hardware, electricity) gives cryptocurrency it's value. That's kinda shitty though because effort != value. Cryptocurrency mining is like someone saying "Look! I chopped this wood with my bare teeth instead of an axe! Since so it's so much harder to do, my wood is much more valuable than other people's, right??!".

    Another problem is that it does not offer a substantial advantage over other types of money so that the majority of people would use it. If people did find it more convenient, it would have, if not intrinsic value, at least instrumental value. As you pointed out in previous posts, cryptocurrencies based on blockchain have no one to enforce their use on other people. As a result, the only users of Bitcoin are miners and people who want anonymity and untraceability. A miner works both like a cryptographic bank and a printing press: he allows the maintenance of the ledger and creates "value" by mining. For him, of course it's profitable to use Bitcoin, since he can print his own money! It's even better if he can convince you to accept Bitcoin as a payment instead of dollars next time he asks for a service! But for a normal person? No, switching accounts/currencies is just another pain in the ass. It's like any pyramid scheme, the one inside must convince the outsiders to follow.
    It could work though, once enough actors are 'converted', the cryptocurrency could become "too big to fail" and states would have to bail out the currency in case of devaluation because of all the pension funds and stuff.

    I still think that most people betting on cryptocurrencies backed by no authority(like a country or a criminal organization) will loose their money long term because those currencies are basically useless. The high volatility of bitcoin price indicates that there isn't any substantial part of the Bitcoin investors that are interested in stable prices; furthermore, there isn't a "stabilizing actor" on the market, but what did people expect, since the whole point of Bitcoin is to get rid of Central Banks?

    I also think it's a bubble; but it's exactly the cryptocurrency's weaknesses that allow it. The fact that bitcoins are actually "pointless" make people consider them a safe-haven value, like art for example, so when the market of real things is shit, it's always better to have your money in bitcoin, right? Probably not I'd say.
    @lkdhf qkb, your point about the way currencies are valued is a really good one. But even though I've said that a currency has to be backed by an army to have value, there is a bit more to it.

    Anyone can print their own money. The makers of the game Monopoly do it. But making that money valuable is another thing.

    A sovereign state, which prints its own money, uses the money it prints to buy things from its citizens, like roads, public libraries, and battleships. What gives value to the paper that the state prints is the fact that the government demands some of those notes back on April 15, based on the amount of work you've done during the year. And not all of that work has to have been done for the state. The state will only accept payment in the denomination of the paper that it prints. You can't pay your taxes with gold or with bitcoin. So you'd better have some of those notes at tax time. This fact, and this fact alone, gives money value.

    The amount of value that the citizens assign to the notes depends weakly on the number of notes in circulation. Taxation also controls that, and so not only gives the notes value in an absolute sense, but also sets the relative value of the notes. The total capital value of all assets in the United States, minus debt, is about 125 trillion dollars. So the government can print a trillion dollars and give that money to the unemployed to keep them from losing their homes, and that would theoretically increase the inflation rate by about 0.8%, assuming that the government didn't tax any of that money and that this money, invested in its citizens' skill levels, didn't cause the total capitalized value of the US to rise significantly.

    The government doesn't need your tax dollars in order to spend money. It prints money. It taxes you to make that money worth something.

    Two other things are necessary for the functioning (the ability of the state to command labor) of money. One is to have an army which can be used to adversely affect people's lives if they don't pay taxes, and the second is to have a court system (backed up by an army, etc.) which enforces the statement printed on the notes, which says that "This note is legal tender for all debts, public and private."

    Sorry, but bitcoin doesn't have any of that stuff. Bitcoin is Beanie Babies.
    Last edited by Adam Strange; 01-08-2021 at 07:49 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    Bitcoin just passed $40,000, up from $30,000 less than a month ago.

    Not a bubble. Nope. Not at all.

    Now, if you could make women's shoes only out of bitcoins, then the currency would have some intrinsic value. Hell, I'd be the first to invest in it then.
    My view of currency is that it's value is a product of the social construct, so bitcoin and other crypto currency and gold are the same, there's a difference between crypto vs something like legal tender is that legal tender is directly backed by state constructs. When state constructs are more unstable, crypto currency and the stability of those social constructs as well as the effectiveness of exchange and use of that currency may very well give it more value. The Chinese will almost certainly have their own crypto currency and in fact they already developed it and are testing it. Crypto is largely a technical/transactional thing, and really any decentralized currency(gems/tulips) can be similar to bitcoin.

    As a tool a stable currency is far more important than unstable currency, as it allows for exchange without creating huge incentives to hold and speculate. Something like bitcoin is more like a stock backing tulips, there is almost no incentive to use it for exchange of goods and services and people just hoard it for speculative purposes or exchange it to cash out.

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