View Poll Results: What's my type?

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  • ESTj

    0 0%
  • ESTp

    0 0%
  • ESFj

    0 0%
  • ESFp

    0 0%
  • ISTj

    1 16.67%
  • ISTp

    0 0%
  • ISFj

    0 0%
  • ISFp

    1 16.67%
  • INFj

    1 16.67%
  • INFp

    1 16.67%
  • ENFj

    1 16.67%
  • ENFp

    1 16.67%
  • ENTj

    0 0%
  • ENTp

    0 0%
  • INTj

    0 0%
  • INTp

    0 0%
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Thread: EXTENDED HOTELAMBUSH QUESTIONNAIRE - Desperate to know my type - hopeless case - every kind of help is welcome

  1. #81

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    Quote Originally Posted by Myst View Post
    Fake NT variant of EIE? Hmm.

    What in Socionics made you go for NF>NT clearly as opposed to MBTI?

    OK, that was one more question, sorry. : p
    Fi and Fe abilities! Learned a bit more about 8 functions model. Both of which I saw in High School, when my "feels" talents began to grow exponentially, not at all in line, too quickly to be faked, as I tried to meet new people, make friends, payed closer attention to other people's feelings and motives. I had a Fe complex in my middle school, that was something I thought I lacked, but what I think about now was due to lack of proper training With said proper training, I developed both very quickly, so I think I'm an NF after all

  2. #82

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    I will answer these questions in parts, hahah, they are quite a lot of them and must think closely about each one... I'll start maybe with Ti, because the case isn't very muddled there (yet to be). But I think that if you can't grasp any Ti from the text, then probably it isn't there. Especially with two Ti-leading types looking for it with geiger counter. When I encounter LIIs, it's always rather clear. They have this "academic professor debating" vibe about them because of Ti. Didn't look for it in my questionnaire tho, because I'm biased for sure

  3. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by hullothere View Post
    When I encounter LIIs, it's always rather clear. They have this "academic professor debating" vibe about them because of Ti.
    Well, I... I just don't know what to say.
    Are you getting "academic professor debating" vibes from me? Really?
    KEEP IT LIGHT AND KEEP IT MOVING

  4. #84

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    Quote Originally Posted by Myst View Post


    Yeah, LII is not to be excluded. She can say more on how she relates to Ti, I guess.

    I won't be asking more questions for now though, lol.
    One important thing, I forgot; tho I use Ti quite often, I can't imagine being a Ti lead. My reasoning is nearly always subjective first. That's quite natural for me. Having a "Ti" brain sounds really cold. And I rather don't see an ILE in myself, the same way I don't see an IEE.
    How I relate to Ti
    That's funny because I have a problem with writing about that, though I write about feeling functions rather instantly and effortlessly. Maybe I've got little understanding about Ti.
    I love/ like systems. That's how I treat learning about functioning of human body; I like to map all the important "stages" or "places" of a process (for example: immune system - very Ti system; the system topics are my fav ones - among with functioning of human brains and hormone system). And I try to apply this sort of reasoning to other theories - understanding them like that is rather easy. I also try to categorise things, make sense of them giving them order and interconnections, logical implications, correlations and stuff. I try to understand general, occuring rule behing things. I am gramatically inclined - I often make for a grammar nazi. Like rules and principles of things. Getting deep into them and trying to get logical order inside them.
    OK, I've always thought I'm rather good at Ti, but now I see that it's not possible in any way

  5. #85

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    Quote Originally Posted by User Name View Post
    Well, I... I just don't know what to say.
    Are you getting "academic professor debating" vibes from me? Really?
    Oh, maybe... Theoretic physicist with a beard, that one well-liked in the university, because likes to Fe-indulge his students with good grades But seriously tho. You're clearly a Ti reasoning itself, backing it up with some soft Fe to make the message pleasant.

  6. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by hullothere View Post
    One important thing, I forgot; tho I use Ti quite often, I can't imagine being a Ti lead. My reasoning is nearly always subjective first. That's quite natural for me. Having a "Ti" brain sounds really cold. And I rather don't see an ILE in myself, the same way I don't see an IEE.
    How I relate to Ti
    That's funny because I have a problem with writing about that, though I write about feeling functions rather instantly and effortlessly. Maybe I've got little understanding about Ti.
    I love/ like systems. That's how I treat learning about functioning of human body; I like to map all the important "stages" or "places" of a process (for example: immune system - very Ti system; the system topics are my fav ones - among with functioning of human brains and hormone system). And I try to apply this sort of reasoning to other theories - understanding them like that is rather easy. I also try to categorise things, make sense of them giving them order and interconnections, logical implications, correlations and stuff. I try to understand general, occuring rule behing things. I am gramatically inclined - I often make for a grammar nazi. Like rules and principles of things. Getting deep into them and trying to get logical order inside them.
    OK, I've always thought I'm rather good at Ti, but now I see that it's not possible in any way
    This doesn't sound Ti Role (EII). You almost seem Ti Creative (ILE), because your Ti is developed quite well. Or it may just be a stronger Ti Seeking, like the one in EIE-Ni. Yeah, possibly the last option.
    KEEP IT LIGHT AND KEEP IT MOVING

  7. #87

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    Quote Originally Posted by hullothere View Post
    I will answer these questions in parts, hahah, they are quite a lot of them and must think closely about each one...
    No worries, no rush


    I'll start maybe with Ti, because the case isn't very muddled there (yet to be). But I think that if you can't grasp any Ti from the text, then probably it isn't there. Especially with two Ti-leading types looking for it with geiger counter.


    I didn't try to look too hard but no, I didn't see too much Ti, you were giving a rather verbose expression of things that I think Ti would be more concise about.


    Quote Originally Posted by hullothere View Post
    One important thing, I forgot; tho I use Ti quite often, I can't imagine being a Ti lead. My reasoning is nearly always subjective first. That's quite natural for me. Having a "Ti" brain sounds really cold. And I rather don't see an ILE in myself, the same way I don't see an IEE.
    How I relate to Ti
    That's funny because I have a problem with writing about that, though I write about feeling functions rather instantly and effortlessly. Maybe I've got little understanding about Ti.
    I love/ like systems. That's how I treat learning about functioning of human body; I like to map all the important "stages" or "places" of a process (for example: immune system - very Ti system; the system topics are my fav ones - among with functioning of human brains and hormone system). And I try to apply this sort of reasoning to other theories - understanding them like that is rather easy. I also try to categorise things, make sense of them giving them order and interconnections, logical implications, correlations and stuff. I try to understand general, occuring rule behing things. I am gramatically inclined - I often make for a grammar nazi. Like rules and principles of things. Getting deep into them and trying to get logical order inside them.
    OK, I've always thought I'm rather good at Ti, but now I see that it's not possible in any way
    That's the impression I got, yeah, your being subjective first in some subtle way (subtle from my pov), yet valuing Ti. I'm not sure what you mean by stages of a process, that sounded quite dynamic Intuition, going just by the wording tho'. Interconnections and correlations are also an Intuitive outlook. So I would say your N comes way before your Ti.


    That about your subjectivity reminds me, if you don't mind, I'm just simply curious, what does this look like when you get to feel emotions due to listening deeply (going by this bit "answer automatically with some great dose of emotions I cant even feel (because I wasn't able to listen deeply").

    @User Name - one day you'll be that academic professor, I'm sure lol

  8. #88

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    Quote Originally Posted by User Name View Post
    This doesn't sound Ti Role (EII). You almost seem Ti Creative (ILE), because your Ti is developed quite well. Or it may just be a stronger Ti Seeking, like the one in EIE-Ni. Yeah, possibly the last option.
    Wouldn't Ti role be actually stronger as EII-Ne's role than EIE-Ni suggestive?

  9. #89

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    (I am at least not a Ti-leading)

  10. #90

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    Quote Originally Posted by Myst View Post
    I didn't try to look too hard but no, I didn't see too much Ti, you were giving a rather verbose expression of things that I think Ti would be more concise about.
    That's what happens in chats - I try to give a concise, one-sentence opinion covering all the necessary points, and then it begins to serve as a novel.

  11. #91

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    Quote Originally Posted by Myst View Post

    That's the impression I got, yeah, your being subjective first in some subtle way (subtle from my pov), yet valuing Ti. I'm not sure what you mean by stages of a process, that sounded quite dynamic Intuition, going just by the wording tho'. Interconnections and correlations are also an Intuitive outlook. So I would say your N comes way before your Ti.


    That about your subjectivity reminds me, if you don't mind, I'm just simply curious, what does this look like when you get to feel emotions due to listening deeply (going by this bit "answer automatically with some great dose of emotions I cant even feel (because I wasn't able to listen deeply").
    Just wording; I think. Imagine buildings being centered in far places of the city, with some square in the middle. Now you're an architect and you have to connect them with street, so as the people would be able to drive from home to home in most economic and easiest, shortest way. I think of intuition more of a way to connect ideas, not facts. Would describe what I mean in biological terms, but I'm a weak academic professor debating. When you have blood, it has its paths, it has to be pumped to heart, it must take part in gas change in cells, and all of these are facts, your givens - now for you to understand, you must connect those "stages" into "process" - the given stages have to be interconnected.
    Oh, wow, that's again a process screaming for some imaginery. I''l answer that in depth and with reasoning with some other question (because you've already asked about that), but when I talk deeply with some person, I blend with that person into one, "conversational" experience - I am flooded with the other person's perspective on life and points of view. Imagine a channel, a tunnel, which connects two people conversing, and everything they say is in between, completely understood and absorbed. It is rather about informations that evokes emotions - rather than emotions themselves. Emotions rather calm and deep in a way, warm, slow, quiet - of understanding and trust. In that moment, I can feel bonding with that person. But first, I must understand. I get my understanding mainly from words, informations (less from the voice, mimics nearly never matter, I even rarely look at anybody when I try to detect one's mood/feeling, because it gets me nowhere; I'm quite good at deciphering vocal communication -long digression here, sorry, but I had to precise), and that understanding is very easy for me: I absorb that person's personality as a whole and forget about my own mood, because I'm in the experience. The feeling I get is of course the feeling I produce because of reacting for correlating (or not) of informations of others with overall picture of myself.

  12. #92

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    Quote Originally Posted by hullothere View Post
    Just wording; I think. Imagine buildings being centered in far places of the city, with some square in the middle. Now you're an architect and you have to connect them with street, so as the people would be able to drive from home to home in most economic and easiest, shortest way. I think of intuition more of a way to connect ideas, not facts. Would describe what I mean in biological terms, but I'm a weak academic professor debating. When you have blood, it has its paths, it has to be pumped to heart, it must take part in gas change in cells, and all of these are facts, your givens - now for you to understand, you must connect those "stages" into "process" - the given stages have to be interconnected.
    Yah this isn't Ti to me. Ne or Ni. You are connecting ideas that were originally facts, yeah, but I'm not seeing any distinct reasoning for connecting the facts here, just vague abstract connections.


    Oh, wow, that's again a process screaming for some imaginery. I''l answer that in depth and with reasoning with some other question (because you've already asked about that), but when I talk deeply with some person, I blend with that person into one, "conversational" experience - I am flooded with the other person's perspective on life and points of view. Imagine a channel, a tunnel, which connects two people conversing, and everything they say is in between, completely understood and absorbed. It is rather about informations that evokes emotions - rather than emotions themselves. Emotions rather calm and deep in a way, warm, slow, quiet - of understanding and trust. In that moment, I can feel bonding with that person. But first, I must understand. I get my understanding mainly from words, informations (less from the voice, mimics nearly never matter, I even rarely look at anybody when I try to detect one's mood/feeling, because it gets me nowhere; I'm quite good at deciphering vocal communication -long digression here, sorry, but I had to precise), and that understanding is very easy for me: I absorb that person's personality as a whole and forget about my own mood, because I'm in the experience. The feeling I get is of course the feeling I produce because of reacting for correlating (or not) of informations of others with overall picture of myself.
    Have you got an example of the last sentence?

  13. #93

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    Quote Originally Posted by Myst View Post
    "For sure"? That's a bit strong...

    Why not remain objective and consider the other test results too?

    Tbh, I kinda find going by these tests pointless anyway Too many different results. But if considering them, why pick only one and call that meaningful?




    This bit is closest to IEI if we have to stick with NF types.

    If we go back to (Fe valuer) NT types, how do you see Fe seeking for yourself?

    I still think there is no way that you don't value Fe but where I said you devalue Si, it's possible it's just simply rejecting focus on it. You seemed critical of the Si approach of that friend, which is why I originally went for devalued Si instead of just weak Si with strong Ni "overpowering" it. I'd be final in my typing for you only if seeing both Ego functions clearly, though.
    Probably mentioned seeking of Fe-partner (but, then, that's people I have "crushes" on; I imagine for a long-term partner someone with calmer Fe or Fi even; that's also what I described). I sometimes enjoy group conversations where people crack jokes and have quite a pleasant, unserious, time (quite a socionics test fe description I probably quoted). Hm. Other than that... Can't remember. I like acting and theatre improvisation. In the second one you have to change roles frequently and be in the moment - that's where I get most expressive lol I like saying things in realms of controversy, shocking or amusing, sometimes very black humour, often to get reactions out of people. For example, I would come to some people conversing, and tell them out of nowhere that my life purpose was to become a rabbi. Or everybody is talking about some car crash with casualties (now I'm making it up), and I'll say that that at least they didn't have expensive cars. Or if I know that some person is reserved sexually, I will make a lot of unapropriate jokes just to tease and provoke a blush. I sometimes like standing out with look (once went nearly bald, partly because of my curiosity of how I would like, partly, I must admit, for shock).

  14. #94

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    Quote Originally Posted by Myst View Post
    Yah this isn't Ti to me. Ne or Ni. You are connecting ideas that were originally facts, yeah, but I'm not seeing any distinct reasoning for connecting the facts here, just vague abstract connections.
    OH SHIT, so you're saying that I'm using Ti by using my Ne to get ideas from Ti to connect them with Ni and fake with them Ti connecting, making intuition out of logic? You know what you are? YOU ARE RIGHT blind for years

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    Quote Originally Posted by Myst View Post
    Have you got an example of the last sentence?
    You mean, real-life metaphor? Sure! When you eat to many burgers, your stomach will hurt, not necessarily because burgers give toxic vibes, but you stomach reacts badly for their existence.
    I tangled it up a bit. What I mean is I try to match someone's life-long experience and personality traits with mine, and thus I feel closer to them, because naturally we aren't able to have this occasion very often.

  16. #96

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    Quote Originally Posted by Myst View Post
    Yah this isn't Ti to me. Ne or Ni. You are connecting ideas that were originally facts, yeah, but I'm not seeing any distinct reasoning for connecting the facts here, just vague abstract connections.
    Now, question on my part: what is your understanding of Ti? Because mine seems... vague...

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    Quote Originally Posted by hullothere View Post
    OH SHIT, so you're saying that I'm using Ti by using my Ne to get ideas from Ti to connect them with Ni and fake with them Ti connecting, making intuition out of logic? You know what you are? YOU ARE RIGHT blind for years
    Well yeah, the idea is, you use your strong and/or ego Intuitive functions to deal with the logical facts. A Logical type would process those facts as Ti or Te information, you instead process as Ne or Ni information.

  18. #98

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    Quote Originally Posted by hullothere View Post
    You mean, real-life metaphor? Sure! When you eat to many burgers, your stomach will hurt, not necessarily because burgers give toxic vibes, but you stomach reacts badly for their existence.
    I tangled it up a bit. What I mean is I try to match someone's life-long experience and personality traits with mine, and thus I feel closer to them, because naturally we aren't able to have this occasion very often.
    I was interested in an actual example but I guess this will do. So now it's interesting because that bit there does have Fi in it. I mean, you were talking about feelings, so this is about Fe vs Fi, not Ne vs Ni, and your analogy was fundamentally about an introverted IE - if the burger gave a toxic vibe then Fe, if your stomach's attitude to it is the focus then Fi.


    Quote Originally Posted by hullothere View Post
    Now, question on my part: what is your understanding of Ti? Because mine seems... vague...
    It's about judging logical correctness, requiring strict analysis of explicit (not subjective) details. Let me know if you want a more detailed explanation.

  19. #99

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    Quote Originally Posted by Myst View Post
    That's actually way more typical of Fi creative types, to "creatively" change their personal evaluations towards a thing/person. Fe base doesn't really start with saying "I love you" on the first date because I guess, emotionally it's not right to first say "love you" and then change that very quickly to the opposite judgment without any significant Ethical reason for it. Also it would require revealing their own personal feelings quite too fast. I don't know how I can explain this better because I'm not very good at understanding Fe, I just have observations on it. Any Fe base type (summoned people or other people) on this forum is welcome to refine this. But let me know if this made any sense at all.

    By dynamic emotionality I meant the emotional flow that Fe pays attention to. Fi is more like "I feel like this just because", from my Ti pov anyway.




    What if you feel differently about the situation than what you are expected to show?




    I'm not sure I followed the idea on Fi being comfortable like that. If you can say more on what that feels like or more on the impression you had, feel free to.
    I'll try to number the questions
    1. (which I saw somewhere earlier) a) I do some social acting when I'm with colleagues. With closest people I'm never like that, and with strangers I'm not comfortable enough to do any acting. I think it's fun when you don't need to consider it seriously. When I'm like that, it's for the sake of interaction, or building myself an image. It would be devastating if strangers had wrong first impression about me so I don't use this tactique often. It feels fun for short periods of time, but then I must come back to the "real me"; I wouldn't like getting lost in my roles; like to have a stable sense of self. That's what I would attach to Fi with my poor understanding of it. I like having consistent anchors in life; some goals, for example, or circle of close friends, one of these anchors is my personality; must keep an eye on it not to lose it. With friends, I don't do it nearly at all. I am rarely gregarious or "fun", in a sense, I prefer discussing and sharing, and there one have to be fully sincere. Like to be able not to fake anything, because mentioned thing is very energy emptying.
    b) I'm scattered because of some reasons: - thoughts chaotic and racing too fast - disinterest in the physical world - lots of ideas -being immersed in my internal world - very often: imagining alternative scenarios and convos
    c)best/truest: best is my social image which I must admit I manage as I want it to be. truest is what I try to manage to get that image and at the same time not to lost it. Emphasise some parts of personality, and hide others. Going with my analogies: pimp my ride the same car, new look.
    2. I think I can feel the emotional flow/sense it, but I am not too affected by that, only if I want/allow myself to. I've got some (not moral, at least I think so) compass or guide in me, set of personal traits and beliefs, loved and hated things; the constant core, to which I turn when I get lost in my daily wavering and wandering.
    3. I prefer to hide my emotions overall then; show nothing. Or express my emotions with not emotional words, if it is important. Or show veeery low-key expressions for people to feel consent and me not acting. People usually don't even try to assess the sincerity of emotions if they get socially acceptable reactions in the terms of social etiquette, I think. So I can say something even partly ironic and no-one have a clue. But I try to convey my disagreement by saying something for them to understand that I don't agree, but still not making an emotional drama/not expressing any emotions. For example: a person is crying. after investigation, the person is very sad because she/he did something bad and doesn't recognize that that was bad, feels like a victim. I would tell that person that I disapprove of person's behaviour and point out why, but won't shout, or ridicule; plain, rational explanation. Tho I might boil internally. I won't cheer up that person (even in mine understanding of cheering up).
    3. That would be something about mentioned anchors. Like some old photo that you keep near your bed when you're far away from your family or homeland. I like having a consistent idea of myself; acting is a past-time activity, I don't like being like that. It feels very calm and safe; without any rush and speed. Hope it is enough otherwise I would try to squeeze a little more

  20. #100

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    Quote Originally Posted by Myst View Post
    I was interested in an actual example but I guess this will do. So now it's interesting because that bit there does have Fi in it. I mean, you were talking about feelings, so this is about Fe vs Fi, not Ne vs Ni, and your analogy was fundamentally about an introverted IE - if the burger gave a toxic vibe then Fe, if your stomach's attitude to it is the focus then Fi.



    It's about judging logical correctness, requiring strict analysis of explicit (not subjective) details. Let me know if you want a more detailed explanation.
    Yeah, what I noticed (and it was while being a MBTI learner I think), that I don't feel easily moved when somebody is JUST emotional - I won't feel a thing when a person is crying (a bit uncomfortable tho), I won't feel overjoyed when I see a coach telling me everyone is born to succeed - but I will be moved by anyone's story and trying to relate to it. That's why, I think, I get so immersed during watching movies.
    I think that I go into Ti-mode when I discuss: I focus on whether what someone is saying is correct or not and find weak points in logic; it seems more of a fun exercise than trying to get to the truth. I check all the points mentioned and try to get the idea of is it consistent or not and point out not matching things. People often say I'm very critical, taking care for details in what they say and if they match one another, always ask for precising.

  21. #101

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    Quote Originally Posted by Myst View Post
    OK, I was jk anyway




    Yeah, this seems like pretty "standard" stuff for conflicts/arguments. You don't sound too afraid of all of it.




    Sounds like at least somewhat conscious Fe (bolded those parts). I don't know what's with the deemphasizing of frequency for it - almost like "mimicking" with it how IEI is, but still with some very low Si (that really seemed like PoLR to me as I said) and quite high Ne that fits EIE more. Or an ILE with "NF flavour" if there's such a thing I don't really see other options, you don't have much focus on Fi to be Fi ego or I did not see it at all so far.

    ("Mimicking": I don't mean that you are trying to come off as IEI.)


    One bit that took my interest: "I much more prefer listening closely to the tone of the speaker and WHAT he says" - what is this "WHAT", what sort of stuff?


    Other than that, I don't think I can give much more input unless you have specific questions on stuff.
    Some arguments for veeery weak Si valuing - I appreciate and like cultures and traditions (from scientific point of view; not engaging in them at all; hate masses etc), hate reading about dietetics, but when someone asks me about something about it, I know surprisingly much, I take close care of my body and health and watch for any symptoms of illness, frequent doctors often, and I generally pay attention to my internal states, BUT my abilities are weak, I can ignore pain to further see that my nail was in a too small shoe and it is actually violet/black, not feel any hunger, and then eat like a bulimic when I actually start to feel it. Like the topic of medicine and generally often start discussions about that. I like comfy environments. Like the idea of yoga and keeping in shape. Liked running, tho I fail at sports. Like looking at beautiful people. Someone typed me ISFp in the poll, so I had to elaborate on that.
    Somewhere there there was darya's quote: "That is always more important from being sincere, sincerity is a very flexible thing ; ) If you put a lot of emotion into something, it becomes true in a way - even in your own mind." That is NOT AT ALL me, sincerity is NEVER flexible. It is not fluent - it is stable. Putting emotion into something never makes it true because your motives were not true in the beginning.
    "WHAT" - is a person's story, dreams, hopes, opinions, impressions, worldview, feelings, tastes, values, and the overall portrait of that person's personality that I get. I find these informations the only important informations about the person.


  22. #102

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    Quote Originally Posted by hullothere View Post
    Probably mentioned seeking of Fe-partner (but, then, that's people I have "crushes" on; I imagine for a long-term partner someone with calmer Fe or Fi even; that's also what I described). I sometimes enjoy group conversations where people crack jokes and have quite a pleasant, unserious, time (quite a socionics test fe description I probably quoted). Hm. Other than that... Can't remember. I like acting and theatre improvisation. In the second one you have to change roles frequently and be in the moment - that's where I get most expressive lol I like saying things in realms of controversy, shocking or amusing, sometimes very black humour, often to get reactions out of people. For example, I would come to some people conversing, and tell them out of nowhere that my life purpose was to become a rabbi. Or everybody is talking about some car crash with casualties (now I'm making it up), and I'll say that that at least they didn't have expensive cars. Or if I know that some person is reserved sexually, I will make a lot of unapropriate jokes just to tease and provoke a blush. I sometimes like standing out with look (once went nearly bald, partly because of my curiosity of how I would like, partly, I must admit, for shock).
    Lol whatever type you are, this is your EIE side. : p


    Quote Originally Posted by hullothere View Post
    I'll try to number the questions
    1. (which I saw somewhere earlier) a) I do some social acting when I'm with colleagues. With closest people I'm never like that, and with strangers I'm not comfortable enough to do any acting. I think it's fun when you don't need to consider it seriously. When I'm like that, it's for the sake of interaction, or building myself an image. It would be devastating if strangers had wrong first impression about me so I don't use this tactique often. It feels fun for short periods of time, but then I must come back to the "real me"; I wouldn't like getting lost in my roles; like to have a stable sense of self. That's what I would attach to Fi with my poor understanding of it. I like having consistent anchors in life; some goals, for example, or circle of close friends, one of these anchors is my personality; must keep an eye on it not to lose it. With friends, I don't do it nearly at all. I am rarely gregarious or "fun", in a sense, I prefer discussing and sharing, and there one have to be fully sincere. Like to be able not to fake anything, because mentioned thing is very energy emptying.
    b) I'm scattered because of some reasons: - thoughts chaotic and racing too fast - disinterest in the physical world - lots of ideas -being immersed in my internal world - very often: imagining alternative scenarios and convos
    c)best/truest: best is my social image which I must admit I manage as I want it to be. truest is what I try to manage to get that image and at the same time not to lost it. Emphasise some parts of personality, and hide others. Going with my analogies: pimp my ride the same car, new look.
    Hmm, ok, same impressions as before. Reminiscent of how Ni approaches parts of oneself. I do recommend reading the Ni bits by Golihov btw, here. Is it anything like that? (I was interpreting it that way but that's my impression only.)


    2. I think I can feel the emotional flow/sense it, but I am not too affected by that, only if I want/allow myself to. I've got some (not moral, at least I think so) compass or guide in me, set of personal traits and beliefs, loved and hated things; the constant core, to which I turn when I get lost in my daily wavering and wandering.
    Why do you say this is not a moral compass? I'm really interested in this.


    3. I prefer to hide my emotions overall then; show nothing. Or express my emotions with not emotional words, if it is important. Or show veeery low-key expressions for people to feel consent and me not acting. People usually don't even try to assess the sincerity of emotions if they get socially acceptable reactions in the terms of social etiquette, I think. So I can say something even partly ironic and no-one have a clue. But I try to convey my disagreement by saying something for them to understand that I don't agree, but still not making an emotional drama/not expressing any emotions. For example: a person is crying. after investigation, the person is very sad because she/he did something bad and doesn't recognize that that was bad, feels like a victim. I would tell that person that I disapprove of person's behaviour and point out why, but won't shout, or ridicule; plain, rational explanation. Tho I might boil internally. I won't cheer up that person (even in mine understanding of cheering up).
    What sort of bad action would one do that then makes them feel like a victim?


    3. That would be something about mentioned anchors. Like some old photo that you keep near your bed when you're far away from your family or homeland. I like having a consistent idea of myself; acting is a past-time activity, I don't like being like that. It feels very calm and safe; without any rush and speed. Hope it is enough otherwise I would try to squeeze a little more
    Is this a response to my wondering with my not following your earlier lines on Fi being comfortable like "like going home from a party or vacations"?


    Quote Originally Posted by hullothere View Post
    Yeah, what I noticed (and it was while being a MBTI learner I think), that I don't feel easily moved when somebody is JUST emotional - I won't feel a thing when a person is crying (a bit uncomfortable tho), I won't feel overjoyed when I see a coach telling me everyone is born to succeed - but I will be moved by anyone's story and trying to relate to it. That's why, I think, I get so immersed during watching movies.
    I think that I go into Ti-mode when I discuss: I focus on whether what someone is saying is correct or not and find weak points in logic; it seems more of a fun exercise than trying to get to the truth. I check all the points mentioned and try to get the idea of is it consistent or not and point out not matching things. People often say I'm very critical, taking care for details in what they say and if they match one another, always ask for precising.
    Not sure what to think about this one except that Ti being just a fun exercise isn't what a Ti lead would see it as It's by default taken a bit more seriously than that.

    Ti creative, or Ti superid would see it as more of a fun exercise, though for me what seems more relevant to type is just that overall you seem to be interested in/into analyzing in the Ti way.


    Quote Originally Posted by hullothere View Post
    Some arguments for veeery weak Si valuing - I appreciate and like cultures and traditions (from scientific point of view; not engaging in them at all; hate masses etc), hate reading about dietetics, but when someone asks me about something about it, I know surprisingly much, I take close care of my body and health and watch for any symptoms of illness, frequent doctors often, and I generally pay attention to my internal states, BUT my abilities are weak, I can ignore pain to further see that my nail was in a too small shoe and it is actually violet/black, not feel any hunger, and then eat like a bulimic when I actually start to feel it. Like the topic of medicine and generally often start discussions about that. I like comfy environments. Like the idea of yoga and keeping in shape. Liked running, tho I fail at sports. Like looking at beautiful people. Someone typed me ISFp in the poll, so I had to elaborate on that.
    Somewhere there there was darya's quote: "That is always more important from being sincere, sincerity is a very flexible thing ; ) If you put a lot of emotion into something, it becomes true in a way - even in your own mind." That is NOT AT ALL me, sincerity is NEVER flexible. It is not fluent - it is stable. Putting emotion into something never makes it true because your motives were not true in the beginning.


    Appreciating traditions only from a scientific point of view... not very Si valuing


    Your last line I would actually agree with, lol, maybe this is some enneagram thing too, darya is an E3.


    "WHAT" - is a person's story, dreams, hopes, opinions, impressions, worldview, feelings, tastes, values, and the overall portrait of that person's personality that I get. I find these informations the only important informations about the person.


    Ah ok, I was just wondering if it's the objective/impersonal content but apparently nope


    OK, I still wonder about this bit: what if you feel differently about the situation than what you are expected to show? Or were you answering this with, you will show what you're expected to show with everyone except friends?
    EDIT: nvm I think I located your answer to it lol. "I prefer to hide my emotions overall then; show nothing. Or express my emotions with not emotional words, if it is important. Or show veeery low-key expressions for people to feel consent and me not acting. People usually don't even try to assess the sincerity of emotions if they get socially acceptable reactions in the terms of social etiquette, I think. So I can say something even partly ironic and no-one have a clue."

    That again sounds like Fe>Fi to me, Fi types will show their personal attitude.


    One interesting thing: "one of these anchors is my personality; must keep an eye on it not to lose it". That's a typical EIE problem, they usually easily lose the anchor for it. Fi lead on the other hand always easily has a focus on the anchor due to the introverted focus of Ji (Ti/Fi are both anchors in that sense).
    Last edited by Myst; 09-06-2017 at 02:49 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hullothere View Post
    It is rather about informations that evokes emotions - rather than emotions themselves. Emotions rather calm and deep in a way, warm, slow, quiet - of understanding and trust. In that moment, I can feel bonding with that person. But first, I must understand. I get my understanding mainly from words, informations (less from the voice, mimics nearly never matter, I even rarely look at anybody when I try to detect one's mood/feeling, because it gets me nowhere; I'm quite good at deciphering vocal communication -long digression here, sorry, but I had to precise), and that understanding is very easy for me: I absorb that person's personality as a whole and forget about my own mood, because I'm in the experience. The feeling I get is of course the feeling I produce because of reacting for correlating (or not) of informations of others with overall picture of myself.
    Just want to note, not sure what the bolded means. Do you mean it's too often faked by people or that you have a hard time reading it or something else?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Myst View Post
    Just want to note, not sure what the bolded means. Do you mean it's too often faked by people or that you have a hard time reading it or something else?
    I think people can't fake facial expressions; there are so many subtle hues of emotional expressions that the faked one are the ones that I easily define as fake. I had a problem trying to read facial expressions some time ago, tried desperately to observe every movement in the face and it didn't work, now only a glance is sufficient, because I'm not so stressed about failing at reading emotions and focus on overall reception rather that concrete signs, but still, I find detecting emotions in the voice tone much more accurate, and then I can take a look at someone's face to assure my judgment, sometimes I don't even attempt that. If it weren't for the voice, I would be lost. I sometimes, when can't hear properly, when somebody asked me a question and now waits for me to answer it, I get the message (anticipating look) with some delay.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Myst View Post
    Lol whatever type you are, this is your EIE side. : p




    Hmm, ok, same impressions as before. Reminiscent of how Ni approaches parts of oneself. I do recommend reading the Ni bits by Golihov btw, here. Is it anything like that? (I was interpreting it that way but that's my impression only.)




    Why do you say this is not a moral compass? I'm really interested in this.




    What sort of bad action would one do that then makes them feel like a victim?




    Is this a response to my wondering with my not following your earlier lines on Fi being comfortable like "like going home from a party or vacations"?




    Not sure what to think about this one except that Ti being just a fun exercise isn't what a Ti lead would see it as It's by default taken a bit more seriously than that.

    Ti creative, or Ti superid would see it as more of a fun exercise, though for me what seems more relevant to type is just that overall you seem to be interested in/into analyzing in the Ti way.




    Appreciating traditions only from a scientific point of view... not very Si valuing


    Your last line I would actually agree with, lol, maybe this is some enneagram thing too, darya is an E3.




    Ah ok, I was just wondering if it's the objective/impersonal content but apparently nope


    OK, I still wonder about this bit: what if you feel differently about the situation than what you are expected to show? Or were you answering this with, you will show what you're expected to show with everyone except friends?
    EDIT: nvm I think I located your answer to it lol. "I prefer to hide my emotions overall then; show nothing. Or express my emotions with not emotional words, if it is important. Or show veeery low-key expressions for people to feel consent and me not acting. People usually don't even try to assess the sincerity of emotions if they get socially acceptable reactions in the terms of social etiquette, I think. So I can say something even partly ironic and no-one have a clue."

    That again sounds like Fe>Fi to me, Fi types will show their personal attitude.


    One interesting thing: "one of these anchors is my personality; must keep an eye on it not to lose it". That's a typical EIE problem, they usually easily lose the anchor for it. Fi lead on the other hand always easily has a focus on the anchor due to the introverted focus of Ji (Ti/Fi are both anchors in that sense).
    Analysing parts of it:
    "Strives to be inwardly calm in all situations and internally consistent. "Fluid like a river": involuntarily adjusts himself to the interlocutor in conversation by taking form of consciousness that is best fitted for the situation. By this he isn't playing a role, his consciousness is simply multifaceted and he is directed by his inner "wholeness". That is, he simply presents a version of himself." YES. Though there is some consistent person in me, consisting all of those facets.
    "Communicating with you, he always feels your moods as if he is living through them together with you, adjusts himself to this." Nope. I can feel the emotions if you want to, I may cut off from them also. Being "myself" in conversations (I mean the one on one ones) is most important. This isn't a mentioned "situation" and I don't try to impress anyone there.
    "Does not like restless, internally discordant individuals, as their state can get transmitted to him, will try to escape from their company at any price." - very typical. Can't stand stressed or whining people, because I easily get stressed to the point of not being able to do anything and paralised. I get stressed out very easily, mostly because of thinking about external circumstances or probability of future's misfortunes and it is not easy for me to snap out of this state, do I try not to get stressful vibes from others, otherwise I will suffer much longer than them... I get stiff then and panic.
    That was from Ni-leading description.
    "like to find internally contradictory people, "dig" in them and create in them internal harmony and mood. " psychiatrist solving problems

    "e able to understand the essence of complex internal situations and make for potentially good analysts. Often it is difficult to find employment for them, as their "product" is the internal conflicts of man and essence, and to penetrate so far, into "the soul" of man, you just need to have permission. Often become unstable, vulnerable, fragile, just so that they can harmonize themselves, and sometimes can start to torment and tear into themselves and dig into their own issues. They have a difficulty finding adequate application to their creative function in the world, since it is not in high demand - not everyone wants someone else to dig into their internal states. Their product - bold ideas, principles, systems of belief and knowledge that they bring into the world and promote." " Search for internally contradictory situations, like to grasp their essence." Didn't understand the part about becoming fragile - I do tend to get unstable and dig into my issues. I search for contradictory things to make sens out of them - yes. Penetrating people - yes. I often serve as "idea generator" and give people my interpretations of things.
    "
    Usually they are very fond of "making mountains out of molehills", for them this is a way to find work for their second function. The more they become exposed - the greater the realization of their personality in the world." sometimes I'm overwhelmed by problems and can't even think about them, so I'm not fond at all, but tend to do that.
    "
    A good speaker, as he is able to influence positively on the internal state of others. Their product is the "wholeness" of the internal state, and therefore they can find success in field of psychology, because it means that they are the healers of souls. In life they loved to dramatize everything. Everyone around becomes informed about the slightest change in their mood or internal state." Not at all good speaker, very stressed and hesitant speaker. I don't like dramatizing - I rather hide my internal turmoil. Everyone becomes infomred if I can't keep it to myself any longer because it's unhealthy (I learned not to be too quiet about problems because it causes psychical disintegration). But I rather keep it all to myself.
    (that was EIE)
    Now, for Ne creative:
    "killful maneuvering in a stream of opportunities is their ace card - they approach this activity very creatively. They see the possibilities of how anything can be improved, changed or rearranged, anywhere. They are able to take the situation apart and then re-assemble it into a more harmonious, upgraded version. They are often the generators of bold ideas on how to make humanity happier. They look for places where chaos reigns, so that they can mend it. They know how to help people understand complex external issues in an original way" I always have a talent to choose the most promising opportunity and then people perceive me as a successful person. Next two sentences: that's how I imagined my Ti, lol. I have a gift for upgrading things and can't stand this when something can easily be improved and isn't - it gets me sick. When I was a child, I had bold ideas about how to improve humanity (for example: Chinese overpopulation: why don't we transport some Chinese people to underpopulated people? Don't judge me, I was, like, four y.o.) I've also got a talent for helping people understanding phenomena: I wrote pop-science articles, I often teach and explain lessons to colleagues, etc. I NEVER look for places where chaos reigns - I fear chaos, or even being completely subdued by chaos.
    "Only the real people don't always fit into this. The solution to this problem they often see in taking "drastic measures" with respect to others. They love to teach and better people, say, if someone tossed a bottle but not into the trash bin, this can provoke them to reprimand such a person even if it is not safe to do so in such a situation, since this is their "creative product"." - perfect description of where I can get arrogant and provocative. I can get harsh in this kind of situation. I had to learn to keep some judgments for myself - a few years ago, I would tell people what they should or shouldn't do impolitely all the time. I am demanding in the regard of bettering people - the more I love someone, the more demanding I get.
    That bit with MBTI -that was about what Fi I imagine would look like (gettind any emotions after understanding other person's pov)
    Why not moral compass - I don't have "set of values" which I consciously adhere to, I only feel when I am close to crossing the safe line of moral comfort
    In sum, I've got some unconscious moral compass, but I can't say that: "this action is wrong because I believe that all someone should something", but rather get a feeling first and dig deeper into myself (often get instant negative reactions about things). Or: my moral compass have some rather not concrete thingsand deeds in it, but rather models of behaviours and motivations.



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    Quote Originally Posted by hullothere View Post
    I think people can't fake facial expressions; there are so many subtle hues of emotional expressions that the faked one are the ones that I easily define as fake. I had a problem trying to read facial expressions some time ago, tried desperately to observe every movement in the face and it didn't work, now only a glance is sufficient, because I'm not so stressed about failing at reading emotions and focus on overall reception rather that concrete signs, but still, I find detecting emotions in the voice tone much more accurate, and then I can take a look at someone's face to assure my judgment, sometimes I don't even attempt that. If it weren't for the voice, I would be lost. I sometimes, when can't hear properly, when somebody asked me a question and now waits for me to answer it, I get the message (anticipating look) with some delay.
    OK interesting


    Quote Originally Posted by hullothere View Post
    Next two sentences: that's how I imagined my Ti, lol.





    I NEVER look for places where chaos reigns - I fear chaos, or even being completely subdued by chaos.
    Out of curiosity, what kind of chaos?


    "Only the real people don't always fit into this. The solution to this problem they often see in taking "drastic measures" with respect to others. They love to teach and better people, say, if someone tossed a bottle but not into the trash bin, this can provoke them to reprimand such a person even if it is not safe to do so in such a situation, since this is their "creative product"." - perfect description of where I can get arrogant and provocative. I can get harsh in this kind of situation. I had to learn to keep some judgments for myself - a few years ago, I would tell people what they should or shouldn't do impolitely all the time. I am demanding in the regard of bettering people - the more I love someone, the more demanding I get.


    Is it just whatever actions or is it specifically Ethics related like the judgments by Fe base as described on the same page (Golihov descriptions)?


    That bit with MBTI -that was about what Fi I imagine would look like (gettind any emotions after understanding other person's pov)
    Why not moral compass - I don't have "set of values" which I consciously adhere to, I only feel when I am close to crossing the safe line of moral comfort
    In sum, I've got some unconscious moral compass, but I can't say that: "this action is wrong because I believe that all someone should something", but rather get a feeling first and dig deeper into myself (often get instant negative reactions about things). Or: my moral compass have some rather not concrete thingsand deeds in it, but rather models of behaviours and motivations.
    OK, yeah, not Fi in ego. As for the MBTI stuff, that's a very different interpretation of cognition, yeah.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Myst View Post
    OK interesting









    Out of curiosity, what kind of chaos?


    [COLOR=#3E3E3E]

    Is it just whatever actions or is it specifically Ethics related like the judgments by Fe base as described on the same page (Golihov descriptions)?




    OK, yeah, not Fi in ego. As for the MBTI stuff, that's a very different interpretation of cognition, yeah.
    Ethics actions, I think. Behaving illogicaly also brings in me ethical repulsion But these descriptions are supposed to paint the picture of both types using Ne in creative position, LII and EII.
    That's a broad definition of chaos you demand, I think. Everything which I can't bear mentally or make order of; coincidences and too many interconnections in the moment; I get overwhelmed.For example, badly coordinated event, or big party with many new people interacting with you and with one another. Also, the literal, physical definition of chaos: bustling crowds, disorder in a room, too many demands, etc.

    I didn't answer some of your earlier questions;

    1. "Is this a response to my wondering with my not following your earlier lines on Fi being comfortable like "like going home from a party or vacations"?" - the analogy with a photo, yes, it was, anchors being rather indicators of Ij temperament.

    2. "
    What sort of bad action would one do that then makes them feel like a victim?" Oh, there are lots of minor things... People will always try to rationalise their petty crimes with some explanation... Al Capone, as I recon, felt like a victim because he was thought of as a criminal but only brought joy to people in the form of alcohol (and this is where it begins to be morally slick, so I'll move to some other example), a man will feel like a victim if he stalks a girl a lot and creeps her out, then she rejects him and then, magically "all the girls are sluts", or something like that. Here is the grand scale and the small scale. I would tell Al Capone, that he didn't obey the law, and I would tell the guy that it was psychologically understandable for her to reject him; I wouldn't keep it to myself, if they were my friends, I would silently jugding them if they were strangers, I would tell them my opinion sincerely if they were strangers who asked for my opinion.

    1.For the Fe>Fi part, I'm apparently Fi-verbal, Fe-behaviour, it seems. "
    One interesting thing: "one of these anchors is my personality; must keep an eye on it not to lose it". That's a typical EIE problem, they usually easily lose the anchor for it. Fi lead on the other hand always easily has a focus on the anchor due to the introverted focus of Ji (Ti/Fi are both anchors in that sense)."
    Abstract questions time! I keep an eye on my anchor nearly always (and never lose it). I only sometimes make circles in the water around it for fun... Observing the anchor
    I easily regret not having enough focus on my anchor because I'm afraid I will drift off and never find myself again in the enormous and unknown sea (or find that anchor).
    Would probably never forgive myself losing an anchor. Whatever we call an anchor.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hullothere View Post
    Ethics actions, I think. Behaving illogicaly also brings in me ethical repulsion But these descriptions are supposed to paint the picture of both types using Ne in creative position, LII and EII.
    Yeah, hmm.


    That's a broad definition of chaos you demand, I think. Everything which I can't bear mentally or make order of; coincidences and too many interconnections in the moment; I get overwhelmed.For example, badly coordinated event, or big party with many new people interacting with you and with one another. Also, the literal, physical definition of chaos: bustling crowds, disorder in a room, too many demands, etc.
    Broad definition - oh, anything that you yourself see as chaos, you answered that alright. More hmm lol.


    I didn't answer some of your earlier questions;

    1. "Is this a response to my wondering with my not following your earlier lines on Fi being comfortable like "like going home from a party or vacations"?" - the analogy with a photo, yes, it was, anchors being rather indicators of Ij temperament.

    2. "
    What sort of bad action would one do that then makes them feel like a victim?" Oh, there are lots of minor things... People will always try to rationalise their petty crimes with some explanation... Al Capone, as I recon, felt like a victim because he was thought of as a criminal but only brought joy to people in the form of alcohol (and this is where it begins to be morally slick, so I'll move to some other example), a man will feel like a victim if he stalks a girl a lot and creeps her out, then she rejects him and then, magically "all the girls are sluts", or something like that. Here is the grand scale and the small scale. I would tell Al Capone, that he didn't obey the law, and I would tell the guy that it was psychologically understandable for her to reject him; I wouldn't keep it to myself, if they were my friends, I would silently jugding them if they were strangers, I would tell them my opinion sincerely if they were strangers who asked for my opinion.

    1.For the Fe>Fi part, I'm apparently Fi-verbal, Fe-behaviour, it seems. "
    One interesting thing: "one of these anchors is my personality; must keep an eye on it not to lose it". That's a typical EIE problem, they usually easily lose the anchor for it. Fi lead on the other hand always easily has a focus on the anchor due to the introverted focus of Ji (Ti/Fi are both anchors in that sense)."
    Abstract questions time! I keep an eye on my anchor nearly always (and never lose it). I only sometimes make circles in the water around it for fun... Observing the anchor
    I easily regret not having enough focus on my anchor because I'm afraid I will drift off and never find myself again in the enormous and unknown sea (or find that anchor).
    Would probably never forgive myself losing an anchor. Whatever we call an anchor.
    OK, it's a good idea to make generic statements more concrete, because this now sounds different than before. These concrete bits sounded more Fi than Fe. Interesting way to sum it up with "Fi-verbal, Fe-behaviour". You do seem to show Fe in that way and you did express some Fi judgments here.


    What do you yourself think atm?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Myst View Post
    Yeah, hmm.




    Broad definition - oh, anything that you yourself see as chaos, you answered that alright. More hmm lol.



    OK, it's a good idea to make generic statements more concrete, because this now sounds different than before. These concrete bits sounded more Fi than Fe. Interesting way to sum it up with "Fi-verbal, Fe-behaviour". You do seem to show Fe in that way and you did express some Fi judgments here.


    What do you yourself think atm?
    Maybe it's some enneagram thing? 4w3 serving as fe or 4w5 serving as fi. But I don't believe in enneagram really... I think that we excluded IEI and EII because of intuition and now I'm either well developed or have a sick fe/fi. Probably behaving like this or that a bit unexpectedly for fe/fi because of its underlying motives. Probably some fe/fi leading should take a look to get a vibe. Though I can see this fe smoothness.. or is it ni... also, definisions of fe and fi motives seem similar and fi and ni cross themselves in the "anchor self" part.
    I also remembered (and this might be helpful in detecting IM development) that as a child I didnt ask any questions, didnt need any instructions or information, about functioning of things or anything. I rather made up my own theories without any validatiom (that part about china, that if I will heat the egg long enough then a chicken will go out, that as a pope I would have world domination lol, made my own mixtures out of cosmetics), and read a lot info. Now I ask a lot of questios (but rather for clarifications or proof) and rather not have that grandiose plans

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    Quote Originally Posted by hullothere View Post
    Maybe it's some enneagram thing? 4w3 serving as fe or 4w5 serving as fi. But I don't believe in enneagram really... I think that we excluded IEI and EII because of intuition and now I'm either well developed or have a sick fe/fi. Probably behaving like this or that a bit unexpectedly for fe/fi because of its underlying motives. Probably some fe/fi leading should take a look to get a vibe. Though I can see this fe smoothness.. or is it ni... also, definisions of fe and fi motives seem similar and fi and ni cross themselves in the "anchor self" part.
    I also remembered (and this might be helpful in detecting IM development) that as a child I didnt ask any questions, didnt need any instructions or information, about functioning of things or anything. I rather made up my own theories without any validatiom (that part about china, that if I will heat the egg long enough then a chicken will go out, that as a pope I would have world domination lol, made my own mixtures out of cosmetics), and read a lot info. Now I ask a lot of questios (but rather for clarifications or proof) and rather not have that grandiose plans
    Dunno about IM development but the anchor thing is definitely Ji. You said you have a conscious focus on this, so Ego. It's very fundamental to you so should be Lead function. So I'd see that as a strong argument for type - xII in this case.

    (I liked the way you put it btw, I definitely recognize myself in how you described it "I only sometimes make circles in the water around it for fun". I just do it with Se, while you might be doing it with Ne.)

    Sum up more: the thing is you did say you have some interest in some fun Ti analysis. Not sure how to interpret the interest on the whole but at least it's clear it's not that strong for you. You also have some focus on Fe stuff but it's not consistent... So if you are very sure on NF>NT then EII.

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    After reading your long conversation, Ij Temperament and NF Club seem pretty clear to me. I think it's better not to overcomplicate things, so my last say is EII. This is because I still get Fi/Ne and not Fe/Ni valuing. For the xII thing, EII > LII seems to be right. Your Ti is strong (2.5D, Contact subtype) but not valued.

    Maybe you can check your type with ITR, at this point. I highly recommend it.
    KEEP IT LIGHT AND KEEP IT MOVING

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    Thank you both for your time! Let's assume that I am most probably an EII-Ne with a chance of being an EIE (unless ITR proves otherwise/some fx ego type digs out this thread and corrects me, hahah)

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    Quote Originally Posted by hullothere View Post
    Thank you both for your time! Let's assume that I am most probably an EII-Ne with a chance of being an EIE (unless ITR proves otherwise/some fx ego type digs out this thread and corrects me, hahah)
    I had an idea, do you relate to the social instinct in enneagram? Because I did notice some soc themes in your OP before and I wonder if that's the Fe-ish behaviour for you. That is, you do more Fe-ish things (and even utilizing some Fe information processing for it) because of soc instinct purposes but otherwise you don't focus on Fe information in the way you'd focus on a valued Ego function. Let me know if this makes sense.
    Last edited by Myst; 09-07-2017 at 12:27 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Myst View Post
    I had an idea, do you relate to the social instinct in enneagram? Because I did notice some soc themes in your OP before and I wonder if that's the Fe-ish behaviour for you. That is, you do more Fe-ish things (and even utilizing some Fe information processing for it) because of soc instinct purposes but otherwise you don't focus on Fe information in the way you'd focus on a valued Ego function. Let me know if this makes sense.
    No, this is the least likely instinct. I've got some other revolutionary idea... Will write more in a few days, on vacations, deprived of internet

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    Quote Originally Posted by hullothere View Post
    No, this is the least likely instinct. I've got some other revolutionary idea... Will write more in a few days, on vacations, deprived of internet
    Any luck?

    Btw, if you can describe that anchor thing of yours more, it could be more clear as to what it exactly is.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Myst View Post
    Any luck?

    Btw, if you can describe that anchor thing of yours more, it could be more clear as to what it exactly is.
    Oh, sorry, had to think a bit about it. It still sounds too "revolutionary" for me.
    My idea was that when Ne is my social disguise, something with which I would serve others, it demands certain behaviours then. In the quest of entertaining others (which is some of Ne skills), I sometimes may need some back up of Fe to implement that. This back up might be superficial, like adding unserious atmosphere to what I say or trying to manipulate a bit to convince others to some ideas. This is not a developed, mature Fe which would be more about making groups oneness and communicating, emotional empathy etc. I got the idea because of the descriptions of Fi-subtype and Ne-subtype. Ne seems more extraverted in a Fe way: making jokes, having fun, Fi subtype is more serious, focused, seems to have more developed Ni because of being less scattered and more mystical. They are more interested in reading quietly, attending any kind of masses etc., or at least I think so - superficial aspects of Ni. It serves their deep values of Fi. EII-Ne still would have more imaginative skills, and EII-Fi would be more skilled socially, mature aspects of both IMs. This seems like some kind of heresy to me and I'm hesitant to share that, I should think about it more time than a week

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    Update: I recently asked a random person skilled and seizing up people about my personality, and what I got was a definition of Fi (that I was emotionally cold, analysing everything rationally when facing a problem, hating shallow relationships, but deeply valuing true connections, very loyal, devoted to my friends' problems and helping them rather with a solution rather than accomodating emotionally), so I thought that if it is so obvious first impression, then there's something about that, it was bizarre to hear this description. Well... I'm not emotionally cold, but probably that's my vibe and that's what he meant. My point is, I'm more probably a Fi leading on a Fi/Fe scale, but the case is still open because I'm not an obvious example

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    Anchor thing is very abstract and difficult to explain, and I might have to come back here to explain it further if anything more comes to my mind. I have some essence of who I am, what I believe in, in what I trust, who I like/love and so on. This isn't what I feel in any moment; more like a planner kept in a backpack or a cross necklace on neck for catholic, or family's photographies in the wallet. This is what I can look at at any moment when I feel lost or sad or anything. I feel it when I know when I do something that is not exactly my style. This is when this "anchor thing" is very conscious and aching. Other times, it is rather subconscious and I feel it rather briefly. When I consciopusly do something in line with those things, resembling them, I feel very warm and comfortable.

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    Oh, sorry, had to think a bit about it. It still sounds too "revolutionary" for me.
    My idea was that when Ne is my social disguise, something with which I would serve others, it demands certain behaviours then. In the quest of entertaining others (which is some of Ne skills), I sometimes may need some back up of Fe to implement that. This back up might be superficial, like adding unserious atmosphere to what I say or trying to manipulate a bit to convince others to some ideas. This is not a developed, mature Fe which would be more about making groups oneness and communicating, emotional empathy etc. I got the idea because of the descriptions of Fi-subtype and Ne-subtype. Ne seems more extraverted in a Fe way: making jokes, having fun, Fi subtype is more serious, focused, seems to have more developed Ni because of being less scattered and more mystical. They are more interested in reading quietly, attending any kind of masses etc., or at least I think so - superficial aspects of Ni. It serves their deep values of Fi. EII-Ne still would have more imaginative skills, and EII-Fi would be more skilled socially, mature aspects of both IMs. This seems like some kind of heresy to me and I'm hesitant to share that, I should think about it more time than a week
    No worries .

    Hmm, well, Ne isn't about controlled behaviours, that's more Feeling (Fi/Fe). Then Fe isn't necessarily about group oneness, that requires the social instinct too.

    As for the entertainment part. Your way of entertaining here on the forum reminds me more of @GuavaDrunk for example than any EII, tbh. Like you say jokes in a certain way for effect or something like that. Just my impression.


    Quote Originally Posted by hullothere View Post
    Anchor thing is very abstract and difficult to explain, and I might have to come back here to explain it further if anything more comes to my mind. I have some essence of who I am, what I believe in, in what I trust, who I like/love and so on. This isn't what I feel in any moment; more like a planner kept in a backpack or a cross necklace on neck for catholic, or family's photographies in the wallet. This is what I can look at at any moment when I feel lost or sad or anything. I feel it when I know when I do something that is not exactly my style. This is when this "anchor thing" is very conscious and aching. Other times, it is rather subconscious and I feel it rather briefly. When I consciopusly do something in line with those things, resembling them, I feel very warm and comfortable.
    I might've misunderstood your earlier mention of the anchor thing as a Ji lead orientation then. This doesn't sound like that. Mind giving an example of doing something that's not exactly your style and say why it's not your "style", whatever that means.


    Update: I recently asked a random person skilled and seizing up people about my personality, and what I got was a definition of Fi (that I was emotionally cold, analysing everything rationally when facing a problem, hating shallow relationships, but deeply valuing true connections, very loyal, devoted to my friends' problems and helping them rather with a solution rather than accomodating emotionally), so I thought that if it is so obvious first impression, then there's something about that, it was bizarre to hear this description. Well... I'm not emotionally cold, but probably that's my vibe and that's what he meant. My point is, I'm more probably a Fi leading on a Fi/Fe scale, but the case is still open because I'm not an obvious example
    Analysing rationally isn't really making me think of Fi. : p Fi just feels what they like/dislike (this applies to all Feeling, Fi is the introverted side of that).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Myst View Post
    No worries .

    Hmm, well, Ne isn't about controlled behaviours, that's more Feeling (Fi/Fe). Then Fe isn't necessarily about group oneness, that requires the social instinct too.

    As for the entertainment part. Your way of entertaining here on the forum reminds me more of @GuavaDrunk for example than any EII, tbh. Like you say jokes in a certain way for effect or something like that. Just my impression.




    I might've misunderstood your earlier mention of the anchor thing as a Ji lead orientation then. This doesn't sound like that. Mind giving an example of doing something that's not exactly your style and say why it's not your "style", whatever that means.




    Analysing rationally isn't really making me think of Fi. : p Fi just feels what they like/dislike (this applies to all Feeling, Fi is the introverted side of that).
    What I mean, was Ne creation of a role/absurdity/humour context/perceiving what needs to be done to achieve conceptual wholeness, and then using just the Fe functions (superficial ones) to make it happen(because Fi is useless there), eg trying to make statement convincing or adding some acting to a joke. I lurked through some of his/her posts lol, and it looks like something I would write/my type of humour. He/she is an E9 though as I could read or at least GuavaDrink thinks about his/herself this way, so it's definitely atypical example of an EIE type, introverted one. (Sorry here if he/she ever happens to read that just had to spy a bit )And yes, here with humour/ in social situation I mostly try to loose the atmosphere, jokes are rather soft, pleasant, and for an effect. My own inside jokes are rather morbid, and people are rather surprised when they hear any examples of what makes me laugh
    in "anaysing rationally"I meant what I came off to others (to this person gifted at catching human behaviours). Rather not emotive nor expressive. Fun fact: close friends confirm that, but strangers/newly met people generally think that I'm super positive, cheerful and nice.
    Why this doesn't sound like ji lead?

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