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    Default Unable to self-type

    Hey guys, new here. This is my first post and I have registered here in order to settle a confusion that has lasted for nearly three years. I seem to be unable to settle on a type for long. One thing that I am almost certain of is the fact that I am on the Ni/Se axis. I am going to keep this short, as there are quite a few questions to answer and by doing so I think that I'll hold your attention on the most important aspects.

    Tell me about yourself.

    Well, how do I start this. I think it is relevant to say that I find it hard to talk about myself in general terms. Specific questions I have no problem to answer. I am an intuitive person, quite empathetic, intelligent and goal-oriented. One problem that I have is with procrastination, but I always finish the task. For this reason I am able to maintain in the 10% of my class in college. I think a relevant addition here would be an occurence from my childhood. A teacher was telling a mithical story and I was running the story through my mind, seeing the events from the perspective of the characters. This led to me starting to cry because I was seeing the drama of the characters in front of my eyes, so to speak. I feel kinda embarassed to talk about things like this, but I do for the purpose of this thread.

    What do you study or do for a living? How did you come to do that? What do you like or dislike about it?


    I study law. I came to do this because I thought the law field matched my personality, and for the posibilities that can arise from being a lawyer afterwards. I like to study certain fields, like Civil law and International law, along with the competitive aspect that arises from different contests in college. I dislike the dogmatism that some teachers manifest.

    What are your values, and why?

    This is a problematic question for me. I feel like I am not sufficiently aware of myself to answer these kind of questions with certainty. I value strength, self-discipline, emotional control, kindness, rationality. Because I think these fit with the ideal that I set for myself to achieve.

    What else do you do on a daily basis? What are your interests and hobbies? Why do you do them?

    Besides being occupied with law school, I got involved in a year-long contest. So that occupies most of my free time. Aside from that, I study psychology and religions. I like to drive very much. I love the rush that comes with driving at a high speed. Also driving at night with music playing. I feel like I get in a meditative state in these moments. Ni/Se, maybe. Also reading books, watching either pure action movies like Mad Max, or intellectual movies like Cloud Atlas. I would like to try sky-diving. I like both to the same degree, as both provide something of equal value to me. One stimulates my need for rush, the other my intellectual needs.

    Describe your relations with family and friends. What do you like and dislike about them?

    My relations with my family and friends are a bit distant. I like that fact that I can always rely on their support. I kinda dislike that we are somewhat distant, to be frank.

    What do you look for in friends? In romantic relationships?

    In friends I look for loyalty, intelligence, a bit of a wild side, the ability to have fun when the situation arises. I find that regarding my intellectual needs I can satisfy myself for the most part, so in friends I am mostly looking for someone that is able to have a good time with me. In romantic relations there can't be a compromise between the intellectual and the physical. I need a balance, so my partner needs to be both someone with who I can have an intellectual conversation, and someone with who I can have fun. Physical attraction is a must.

    What conflicts have you encountered recently with other people? Why did they happen? Which kinds seem to happen on a regular basis?

    Recently with a friend. I didn't think of him when I smoked somewhere in the house. These kind of conflicts, about not thinking about others needs, seem to arise on a regular basis. Not calling my family enough, not complimenting my girl enough.

    How would your friends describe you?

    Calm, reliable, logical, strong. My friends don't know my empathetic side. For better or worse, I hide that for fear of looking weak. I hate losing emotional control. Sometimes though my emotions get so high that I can't hold back.

    What do people generally see as your strengths? What do you like about yourself?

    The qualities that I described abouve. The fact that I am able to strive for self-actualization, for the image that I hold of myself in my mind.

    What are your weaknesses? What criticism do you often face from others? What do you dislike about yourself?

    I can be extremely stubborn. Indecisive if I don't have objective facts on which to make a decision. The tendency to get annoyed when people work on a task too slow. Kinda shy, but people don't see that as I hide it. Criticism related to the fact that I don't think about them, even though that is not necessarly true. I dislike about myself my shyness and occasional indecisiveness.

    In what areas of life can you manage well on your own? In what areas of your life would you like help?

    Studying, intellectual pursuits. Help in taking initiative more often in relations and building those in the long term. Also in household tasks. I procrastinate on cleaning.

    What things do you find to be a chore? What things do you enjoy more than others?

    Household tasks, paying bills. I enjoy more than others the feeling of adrenaline rushing through my body in risky situations. Also I enjoy intellectual pursuits more that most people. Though most people don't always see this side of myself because I keep relations with them on a mostly superficial level.

    What goals, aspirations, or plans do you have for the future? How did you come to have them?

    Finish law school in the top 5%. Find a high level job at a law firm. Take more initiative in relations. I came to have them based on the future that I envision for myself as a person.

    If you had enough money to live comfortably for the rest of your life without working, what would you do with your time?

    Try to experience as many things as possible that life has to offer. Hardships and bliss.

    What traits do you find endearing that others might dislike? What traits are considered positive/neutral by others but tend to annoy you?

    Well, in the opposite sex, the capacity to seduce. Same sex, being frank. Excessive and superficial smiling.

    What kinds of things do you do to manage and/or beautify your environment (your room, your house, etc.)? What do you think of daily chores?

    Avoid clutter, harmonize colours. Hate them for the most part.

    How do you behave around strangers?

    Some would see me as kind of hostile, distant. Until someone enters my circle, I don't show much affection.

    How do you react to conflict? What do you do if somebody insults or attacks you?

    Rationally. I try to find if there is a valid reason for the conflict. If there is, resolve that. If there isn't, make it clear. If necessary, react the same.

    What is one common misconception that people have? Explain why it is wrong.

    About me? That I lack feelings. The level of sentiment that I can reach is deeper than most people could ever imagine me reaching. But I hide it to not appear weak.

    What did you do last Friday?

    Went to the mall with a friend.

    What is your biggest accomplishment?

    Finishing first in my class last semester.

    What is something you regret?

    Hesitating in owning some of my decisions.

    Who do you admire, and why?

    Real example, or qualities in a person? David Lynch. He's a genius, seems very deep.

    What's been on your mind? Has anything been worrying or concerning you? What problems have you encountered lately?

    Lack of motivation. Always needing a purpose to do something. Procrastination.

    What are your religious or spiritual beliefs and why do you hold them?

    My beliefs are in flux. I find it hard to believe in something without a bulletproof reasoning. Which is why I am not really religious or spiritual. Despite this, I try to bipass my intellect and just do things that would be considered spiritual to lead me to that path, even though my mind might find it absurd.

    What are your political beliefs, and why? To what extent do you care about politics?

    I hold mostly conservative beliefs. I used to have more liberal beliefs, but I think that some limits to certain freedoms must exist. More involved in politics than the average person.

    Would you ever be interested in starting a business? Why or why not? What role would you play in it? What kind of business would it be?

    Yes. In order to develop myself and for the financiary gain. CEO. Law related.

    What kind of work environment do you prefer? What do you look for in a job?

    Clear delimitation of tasks. Friendly colleagues. I look for the prospect of advancement.

    What is or was your favorite school subject and why?

    Civil law. It is not black and white.

    How do you approach responsibility? What do you tend to expect of others?

    I hold it in high regard. I keep my promises. I expect the same.

    Where did you go on your most recent vacation? What did you do there? How did you like it and why?

    Italy. Visiting and partying. Loved the atmosphere, especially at night. It felt...mysterious, passionate, meditative.

    What were you like as a kid? How have you changed since you were a child?

    Very active in sports. Talented at all kinds of sports. Intellectual, less control of my emotional response. Very deep emotions. More shy, more introverted, less confident. Changed by becoming substantially more confident. Still talented at all kinds of sports, but less involved in them.

    What was your high school experience like?

    Boring for the most part. Much better in college. I was too reclusive and shy in high school.

    Talk about a significant event from your life.

    Recent break-up. Had to face my naked self and answer some unpleasant questions regarding myself.

    Do you like kids? Why or why not?

    Yes. Because they naive and sincere. Kinda like small animals. For the most part.

    If you were to raise a child, what would be your main concerns, what measures would you take, and why?

    Assure the respect of my kid. That he got involved in intelligent hobbies, like chess. Also that he got involved in sports, team sports especially. Guide him to those. In order for him to become a well-rounded individual.

    Ever feel stuck in a rut? If yes, describe the causes and your reaction to it.

    Yes, regarding socionics actually. Going back and forth between INxp, ENxj, considering ESTp, even ENFp. The causes revolve around the fact that I can entertain in my mind every posibility, to some extent. My reaction to it is to research the crap out of it and to become frustrated.

    How do you see other people as a whole? What do you consider a prevalent social problem? Name one.

    I see people as a whole as interesting. Well...I think that uniformity in people, the need to conform to superficial common interests, would be a problem.

    What do you do if you're not getting what you want? What approach do you use?

    Try to get what I want. Insist.

    Are you comfortable taking leadership roles? In what areas? Why or why not?

    Yes. In competitions regarding law school, for example. I love getting the whole team around a common purpose, organizing the weak spots and maximizing the strong spots of the team.

    How often do you get angry? What kinds of things make you angry?

    Funny. I get angry at the fact that I get anxious. Probably enneagram 6 related. Besides my anxiety: a condescending tone. I hate this. Also people that convey themselves as pitiful, as victims. Hate them also.

    What is the best thing that happened to you during the past week?

    Got accepted for an internship that I wanted badly.

    What is the worst thing that happened to you during the past week?

    Can't think of anything significant.

    What is the purpose of life? What do you find personally meaningful in life?

    I believe there are numerous paths on which one can walk in life. However, what I find to be meaningful, and what I think every individual wants, is to find self-actualisation. To become the best version of you that you can become.

    What is the most interesting place you have been, and why?

    A hotel in France. Had the opportunity to meet some very interesting people. The atmosphere was almost spiritual.

    How do you dress or manage your appearance?

    I dress very well. I have an innate ability to sort out aesthetics. This includes clothes and general looks.

    Do you like surprises?

    I would tend towards saying no.

    Is there anything else important about you that we should know?

    I believe this covers it.

    Well, those were a lot of questions. I would be very grateful for your help. Seeing as I seem unable to find a type and settle on it for long, I would appreciate a discussion as it would help me clarify my thoughts. I find that by speaking some things become more clear to me.

    Cheers!
    Last edited by frankwithyou; 06-04-2017 at 02:47 AM.

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    ESI

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    Ahhhhh so much to read. I saw ni valuing and unable to self type, so im going ILI from a standpoint of knowing little about you.
    Projection is ordinary. Person A projects at person B, hoping tovalidate something about person A by the response of person B. However, person B, not wanting to be an obejct of someone elses ego and guarding against existential terror constructs a personality which protects his ego and maintain a certain sense of a robust and real self that is different and separate from person A. Sadly, this robust and real self, cut off by defenses of character from the rest of the world, is quite vulnerable and fragile given that it is imaginary and propped up through external feed back. Person B is dimly aware of this and defends against it all the more, even desperately projecting his anxieties back onto person A, with the hope of shoring up his ego with salubrious validation. All of this happens without A or B acknowledging it, of course. Because to face up to it consciously is shocking, in that this is all anybody is doing or can do and it seems absurd when you realize how pathetic it is.

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    Sorry about that, man. Many questions, tried to keep it as short as possible while also providing the neccesary information. Another thing: I care a bit too much about what people think about me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by frankwithyou
    Going back and forth between INxp, ENxj, considering ESTp, even ENFp
    Add LSI to your list to consider.

    It's funny, I was just re-reading Reinin's description to send to someone as it's one I relate to, and reading your description of yourself just now, I saw you in it too. I don't know if that's because I was just reading it, and so started drawing connections that I wouldn't have otherwise, but here take a look and see what you think:

    http://www.wikisocion.net/en/index.p...Maxim_Gorky.29


    (Unfortunately as is the case with all descriptions, I hesitate to recommend them as a first-line in typing as they're not meant to be taken as absolute fact that must match 100% nor as some sort of hunt and find kind of thing, but if you've been looking for 3 years, you've probably already researched the elements and functions to their breaking point)

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    Gonna have a long list.

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    Quote Originally Posted by frankwithyou View Post
    Gonna have a long list.
    yeah, I know, sorry about that. I edited in a link though that might speed things up (or not)

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    C-ESI-Se 6w7 sx/sp ashlesha's Avatar
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    I like LSI for you also. My impression is: clear, no bullshit, logical, competent, IJ temperament.

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    Yeah, problem is that while I may be percieved as such, in my mind there can be many uncertainties. Going back and forth on questions, ideas, doing the right thing, fear of being incompetent. Find it hard to create and maintain routines(XXXp?). I also care for people more than they would imagine, and that is because I hide it in order not to seen as sentimental. This is my problem. Between the image that I have grown accustomed to emulate and that which I really am.

    An addition would be that I percieve realtionship dynamics better than most people. What people think of each other, different attitudes, repulsions, insecurities. However, that does not seem to apply as much to the relationships that other people have with me. In that I have some difficulties.
    Last edited by frankwithyou; 06-04-2017 at 12:32 AM.

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    Woooow people, we have another enneagram 3 among us. All the signs are there. Finally, my call was heard.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chae View Post
    #success #success #success
    Gotta peel off all the image layers first before typing.

    Quote Originally Posted by frankwithyou View Post
    Yeah, problem is that while I may be perceived as such, in my mind there can be many uncertainties. Going back and forth on questions, ideas, doing the right thing, fear of being incompetent. Find it hard to create and maintain routines(XXXp?). I also care for people more than they would imagine, and that is because I hide it in order not to seen as sentimental. This is my problem. Between the image that I have grown accustomed to emulate and that which I really am.

    An addition would be that I perceive relationship dynamics better than most people. What people think of each other, different attitudes, repulsions, insecurities. However, that does not seem to apply as much to the relationships that other people have with me. In that I have some difficulties.
    Will go through the questionnaire in detail later *praise praise* You are very interesting. I'll stick around here. So far, first impression-wise, I think you're a Gamma type. If we can rely on Se/Ni being your values already, I got right away at the start and above is some .

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    Quote Originally Posted by frankwithyou View Post
    An addition would be that I percieve realtionship dynamics better than most people. What people think of each other, different attitudes, repulsions, insecurities. However, that does not seem to apply as much to the relationships that other people have with me. In that I have some difficulties.
    While this superficially could sound like Fi, I don't think it is. Fi is more internal, about what a person themself feels and their judgements on that, as in: I like, I dislike, I feel repulsed/drawn/resonate with, this is good, this is evil. Fi lead makes decisions and judgements based on these things, Fi creative uses their feelings in support of their base. Everything tends to relate back to oneself with Fi, as in the judgements are based on how they would or do feel in a given situation. Just picking up on external cues through observation and drawing conclusions can be through a combination of different elements, though Fe polr would be naturally the worst at this as would other Fe devaluing logical types. (Because they wouldn't be picking up on the emotional cues (Fe) as well)

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    I will punch you all in the face.

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    Quote Originally Posted by frankwithyou View Post
    Yeah, problem is that while I may be percieved as such, in my mind there can be many uncertainties. Going back and forth on questions, ideas, doing the right thing, fear of being incompetent. Find it hard to create and maintain routines(XXXp?). I also care for people more than they would imagine, and that is because I hide it in order not to seen as sentimental. This is my problem. Between the image that I have grown accustomed to emulate and that which I really am.

    An addition would be that I percieve realtionship dynamics better than most people. What people think of each other, different attitudes, repulsions, insecurities. However, that does not seem to apply as much to the relationships that other people have with me. In that I have some difficulties.
    Well don't take EIE off the table. It is not uncommon for males to want to appear less emotional but everything you say, at least superficially, looks ethical>logical to me. Self awareness is something cultivated over time so that isn't something that I would be concerned about. Just pay more attention to your choices and you will reveal yourself to yourself. It is easy to be more objective about people you don't have close relationships with. I have also read somewhere that EIE might have more difficulty deciding on a type but I don't know how reliable that source of information is.

    Here is a bit of a different perspective on temperaments that I find useful. I was just reading them again so posting to you on a whim.


    Now that we have established the concept of opposing rhythms for statics, it would be in our best interest to observe it in dynamics. As our example, I'll be using the EIE and the IEI, Mirror types.

    Dynamic types see effects of things, they perceive what is affecting an object or situation (Ip), and they take action to affect something in their own best interest (Ej). Whereas with the Static Rhythms (Ij and Ep), where we saw order versus chaos in a simplified form, the antithesis here is taking action (participating) versus observing (spectating). You can not participate in something and spectate something at the same time; thus, Ej's naturally take the playing field while Ip's prefer to view the situation from an outside perspective.

    Now, as before with statics in establishing order by identifying chaos, to enact change and to affect something, you need to observe how a situation is progressing currently if you wish to actually do so correctly. Thus, Ej's naturally rely on a creative Pi element to allow them to create change and affect a system. Let's take a look at the EIE.

    EIE:

    Fe Ni
    Te Si

    The EIE's lead element is an Ej element, extraverted ethics. Thus, the EIE is concerned with affecting people and causing change in the social landscape, being able to influence people emotionally. To do this, however, the EIE, being an intuitive, locks into the internal rhythm of a person (Ni), their psychological state, how they emotionally operate, so that they can perceive the system and know precisely what is already happening in front of them. Then, they can take action and influence the person correctly and with great expertise. In locking into the internal rhythm of a person, however, the EIE unfortunately fails to notice tangible changes in a person that signify emotional states, and may not, for instance, notice how the clothes a person is wearing signify their internal state, nor do they actively notice how physically comfortable the person is, nor any physical cues of discomfort (though they are able to sense it psychologically through the analysis of their words, most of the time, they just don't recognize the physical signals), displeasure, or any other physical expression of emotions. Thus, due to the fact that they observe the internal rhythm and the underlying meanings produced by a person, they subsequently fail to notice physical, tangible changes in a person constantly, and thus build a sort of phobia around information related to it (Si), due to the fact that their use of Introverted Perception is fully directed at Introverted Intuition.

    Now, to understand the other perspective of Ip sociotypes, we turn to the IEI.

    IEI:

    Ni Fe
    Si Te

    The IEI, belonging to the Ip sociotypes, is concerned foremost with the passive observation of situations. Geared to Intuition, this passive observation is the cognizance of fluctuating, hidden meanings, and the internal rhythms of situations or things. Being an Ethical sociotype, Introverted Intuition is applied to the sphere of Extraverted Ethics (Ni-, Fe+) and is thus oriented towards perceiving the internal rhythms of people, the dynamics of the social realm (and even spiritual), and how people are affecting each other. Unlike the EIE, however, the IEI is unconcerned with actually affecting people so much as understanding people on a deeper, subjective level, how they operate. The EIE simply wants to know how people operate for the sole purpose of being able to affect them somehow (Creative Ni), the IEI wants to know how people operate just because, and so that the IEI can fully understand human nature, and/or the situation that is unfolding presently in the social sphere (rather than trying to affect it, Lead Ni). To help them understand how a person is operating, however, they must either do one of two things. The first way is by simply not acting and only observing a person, but this way is troublesome considering that the sole information supply is from introverted intuition. The other way it to step in and affect people and then to step back out and observe the person's reaction, so that the IEI will better be able to hone in on the internal rhythm and deeper psychological state of the person. Thus, while the Introverted Irrational IEI doesn't prefer to take action, when he or she does, it will be in affecting the social sphere and people, which subsequently means that they will entirely avoid situations where they must affect impersonal, logical systems by actions, as taking action in that sphere truly represents the opposing rhythm of Ej to the IEI.

    EIE:

    Fe - Affecting People Emotionally and Socially
    Ni - By [Passively] Observing the Internal Rhythms of People to Understand the Conceptual Situation
    Te - By Ignoring How Information Impersonally affects Logical Systems
    Si - And By Avoiding the Immediate Changes in the Observable World to Understand the Physical Situation

    IEI:

    Ni - Observing the Human Condition, Internal Rhythms, and the Conceptual Situation
    Fe - By Affecting People Emotionally and Socially
    Si - By Ignoring the Physical Situation, and the Immediately Observable Changes in Reality
    Te - And By Avoiding How Information Impersonally affects Logical Systems

    Do note that, in this format, the failure in the Role function is the reason for the success in the Lead function, and the failure in the Vulnerable function is the reason for the success in the Creative function. It should then be looked at in this way:

    "The LSI is good at Establishing Logical Order in the Chaos of the Physical Environment because the LSI Doesn't Notice, Concern Itself With, and Ignores Ethical Qualms and the Conceptual Chaos in the World of Speculation."

    Success in personality, then, is determined by a sociotype's inattention to the problems of the Super-Ego block. If the LSI had to face Ethical Qualms, then the LSI would be unable to Establish Logical Order, as he must now not only organize things logically but ethically at the same time (which would get absolutely nothing done efficiently). LSI, while despising situations where they must categorize things as right or wrong, or realize the ethics of their own establishment of order, are concerned with how this establishment of order is and will be affecting people (Fe+ Seeking).

    http://personalitycafe.com/socionics...mperament.html

    Edit: I guess I should say it is easier to be more objective about others when you you have nothing invested in seeing them a certain way or having them see you a certain way. If you can detach and view it from a distance. That is much harder when you have anything invested in an interaction. Even if the investment is preserving your own ego.


    “My typology is . . . not in any sense to stick labels on people at first sight. It is not a physiognomy and not an anthropological system, but a critical psychology dealing with the organization and delimitation of psychic processes that can be shown to be typical.”​ —C.G. Jung
     
    YWIMW

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    My first impression tells me LIE.
    Possibly 1Te subtype, or no subtype.

    Chae is right about the 3 fix, but I don't think it's necessarily the core type.

    How often do you get angry? What kinds of things make you angry?
    "Funny. I get angry at the fact that I get anxious. Probably enneagram 6 related. Besides my anxiety: (...)"
    This does sound more like 6(w7?) core.

    The tritype could be 631.
    So/Sp is a good possibility.

    Everyone, I think we've got an Elon Musk doppelgänger here.
    Last edited by Olimpia; 06-04-2017 at 01:08 AM.
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    For those of you who think he could be Ne PoLR, consider the following.

    "The causes revolve around the fact that I can entertain in my mind every posibility, to some extent. My reaction to it is to research the crap out of it and to become frustrated."
    This is pretty much a strong (4D) Ne "problem", especially characteristic of LIE.
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    Wouldn't a LIE be more decisive about this sort of thing, though? After all, I've spent 3 years trying to figure out my place in this system.

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    Quote Originally Posted by frankwithyou View Post
    Wouldn't a LIE be more decisive about this sort of thing, though? After all, I've spent 3 years trying to figure my place in this system.
    Could be a matter of weak Fi. At least that is what it looks like to me, in the context of all your answers and background information.

    I've found that some people with weak Fi really have a weak(er) "sense of self" also.

    And then it could also be a matter of Ti Ignoring/Te valuing.

    Would you get different test results over the years?

    (And... a lot of 6s have troubles with settling on one type, because of constant doubts.)
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    Yes. The only thing that truly remained constant was high Ni. Besides that, it would be a toss-up between Te/Fe, with Te mostly being higher than Fe(enneagram 3?). Always scored low on Fi and Ti. Regarding high Ni, I don't really know where to place my need for an adrenaline rush and the fact that I am naturally talented at sports, since high Ni would imply lower sensing functions(that I relate to this). Though the high Ni is sustained by the fact that I get insights, on a regular basis, that come out of nowhere about people, ideas, problems, and then I work backwards from there towards the answer.

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    Quote Originally Posted by frankwithyou View Post
    Yes. The only thing that truly remained constant was high Ni. Besides that, it would be a toss-up between Te/Fe, with Te mostly being higher than Fe(enneagram 3?). Always scored low on Fi and Ti. Regarding high Ni, I don't really know where to place my need for an adrenaline rush and the fact that I am naturally talented at sports, since high Ni would imply lower sensing functions(that I relate to this). Though the high Ni is sustained by the fact that I get insights, on a regular basis, that come out of nowhere about people, ideas, problems, and then I work backwards from there towards the answer.
    What I put in bold is the interplay or back and forth between Se HA and Ni Creative/Ne Demonstrative.

    Your results pattern and what you described there just reinforces my impression of you being actually LIE.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cassandra View Post
    For those of you who think he could be Ne PoLR, consider the following.



    This is pretty much a strong (4D) Ne "problem", especially characteristic of LIE.
    In regards to looking at a typology system and trying to find where one might fit, and being able to see various aspects that could fit or not within a type in relation to yourself, then no, it doesn't have really anything to do with Ne. What it has to do with, is realizing that yes, there are aspects of almost all the types that could fit in some way. The issue is to find the best fit of course.

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    I would like to point out something else, which kept me from asserting with certainty that I was a Logical type. I can get into a very strong emotional state when watching artistic performances. The beauty, the emotion, the meaning evoke strong feelings in me. For example, I was at a ballet performance and I had to hold back tears because of the emotional response that the scene evoked in me. I am like this in regards to certain movies, also. Scenes that combine beauty with deep significance evoke that response in me, to the point of tears. Then again, I hold that back and try to suppress it, for the aforementioned fear of looking too sensitive. Also, when someone laughs, if it is authentic, even if I don't know the reason very well, I can't help but begin to smile myself. I feel it as contagious. Wouldn't this be considered Fe?

    Damn, feels awkward talking about these things.
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    Don Quixote
    ENTp
    ILE

    Ego
    Sees the world as a world of meaning, ideas, puzzles and the solutions finding for the answers to his questions. In each situation he penetrate well into the essence of an object or phenomenon, its positive possibilities, proves and describes them in terms of global, abstract logical laws.
    To present his vision he builds an abstract system, a scheme, a generalized concept, which broadly justifies concrete idea, a guess or an opportunity.

    Super-ego
    is perceptions of willful resistance, pressure and protection are based on the generally accepted patterns and stereotypes. Understanding of human relationships and the ways to avoid tension in them are based only on his personal understanding. Not able to assess the adequacy of liking / disliking, to agree with the common rules. It’s difficult for him to consider to the situation in relations. Therefore, hint of unethical behavior, of inability to act properly or of the disrespect for other people perceived painfully by him.

    He stereotypically seeks to establish and maintain relationships in order to protect self and his relatives from the volitional pressure, but with limited personal understanding of these relations.

    Super-id
    Aesthetics and comfort (in a wide sense) attracts him much. He feels the lack of knowledge and skills to eliminate discomfort and inability to diversify his aesthetic perception. He would like to believe that he can create and maintain a pleasant emotional atmosphere around, in a small circle, in an informal atmosphere. Positive assessment of this skill pleases him. He gets “activated” in situation of good, warm emotional atmosphere.

    Id
    During the life he has worked out an individual convenient ways of activities distribution over the time. Inadvertently he selects the best technologies and practices for the current operation. Subconsciously, without thinking, he makes flexible use of available goals achieving ways, allowing them to fit the overall time plan, which he mapped out for himself.

    Dumas
    ISFp
    SEI

    Ego
    "Dumas" perceives the world in terms of comfort and convenience, especially emotional comfort. He understands and appreciates comfort, depending on the time, place and situation.
    He aims to reduce the negative glow in the general emotional atmosphere to raise the mood of others, consciously change the state of another person's emotional condition, creating a specific comfortable environment around them.

    Super-ego
    His abilities to assess the future, to predict, anticipate are based on-established stereotypes, he uses borrowed techniques for solving such problems. Time limits he appoints stereotypically, he cannot always manage time according to the situation.
    Understanding of the technological properties of the materials, the construction workflow sequence, different ways of working and performance is based only on his personal experience. He is not able to evaluate and compare his way to solve such problems with the way the others do. He is sensitive about criticism of his ways to set up business and organization processes.

    Super-id
    Unusual features, ideas and opportunities in a broad sense and outstanding personalities attract him much. Sometimes he has difficulties in situations with rich potential.
    He would like to act justly, reasonably, logically in concrete situations, but in the same time he needs assessment of those skills. Unconsciously activated by the need to build a logical justification that helps in realizing a significant potential.

    Id
    In everyday life he has its own level of claims, wealth and influence in every situation. Flexible and without hesitation he applies his natural ability to establish good relations, to negotiate. Unconsciously use this ability to strengthen its position, advance their interests.

    Hugo
    ESFj
    ESE

    Ego
    In his perception emotions are the fundamental of the world. He has a good sense of the emotional atmosphere in any situation. He knows the appropriate way of expression, location, and weight (importance) of the internal state in each situation. He has a flexible approach to solving problems with emotions control and expression. He feels well both in the negative and in the positive emotional conditions.
    He creates comfort and warmth around himself, comfortably equips surrounding space with beautiful things so he is changing the overall condition and mood.

    Super-ego
    Practical and technological thoughts are firmly based on the knowledge acquired and on the sample decisions about similar problems. Methods of business in general or in a particular are selected according to the others authority opinion, or are adjusted to the one of the mastered patterns.

    Predictions of the specific changes are performed by ES only on the basis of his personal experience. He is not able to resolve his way to predict with other prediction patterns. He is sensitive about criticism of the failure of the timing, he does not like situations of delays, and he gets lost due to the negative events.

    Super-id
    Information about order, specific logical relationships in activities or interests attracts him much. Needs hint about specific methods of linking phenomena, laws and regulations.

    He would like to believe that he can choose good potentials, with even a small possibility. Needs an assessment of this skill. He is activated by the need to create an order, a clear consistency and clarity in the matter, especially if it will receive the recognition of those abilities.

    Id
    Involuntarily he tracks relationships in his social circle. Do not hesitate to use a variety of ways to establish and maintain relationships. Good relationships are important for him, for personal self-confidence in the situation.
    To avoid the deterioration in relations, often without realizing, he starts to operate with the pressure to force the showdown, forcing this way a partner to change the relationships for the better side.

    Robespierre
    INTj
    LII

    Ego
    We can say that LI has analytical mind. He understands in which relationships are between objects or between phenomena. He knows which laws can be applied in a case and which cannot be applied.
    Basing on a comprehensive analysis LI highlights specific guesses about the positive core content of the specific objects and phenomena, their concrete positive opportunities, also he expresses some constructive ideas.

    Super-ego
    He uses stereotypes about the relationship between people and the ways to avoid the unpleasant ethical situations.
    Protecting living space strong-willed manifestations he carries only on the basis of personal experience. Because of the limited capacity to resist he overreacts on any interference in their lives.

    Super-id
    Information about good mood, a specific positive state, and feeling attracts him. He would like to think that he can eliminate severe discomfort, reduce discomfort in the world. He needs assessment of this skill.
    He is activated when there is a need to make the environment more comfortable so it should lead to a better emotional state or at least to cheer up people in the immediate circle.

    Id
    Over his life he has developed a settings and methods related to specific practical activity, technology, resource use. Spontaneously feels the proper way to of the resources distribution in time in order to solve current challenges effectively.

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    Hamlet
    ENFj
    EIE

    Ego
    Fine and elaborated emotions are the corner stone of his life. This type has good understanding of positive and finely detailed emotional states (emotions, feelings) either his own or other person's at close psychological range. He can see shades and fine details of positive emotional states and can model emotions in different situations or moments. Creates emotionally uplifted and often wound-up atmosphere for himself and his close environment.

    It is typical of him to draw attention of other people to imminent troubles, hardships or inauspicious events. He perceives and interprets events as phenomena of global meaning and scale. Can assume tragic and warning tones in assesment of events. Has a tendency to see deep links and interdependency of events, far-reaching concequences, which have importance in the emotional context. Tries to avoid mistakes which might have negative consequences and warns others against commiting such mistakes.

    Super-Ego
    This type has common notions about professional or technical side of activities of his interest. In his work prefers to firmly stick to the knowledge and techniques he has learned from competent sources and suspects the same attitude in other people.

    His understanding of comfort and discomfort as well as aesthetics, sensory bodily perceptions is based only on his personal notion. He has difficulties in correlating his understanding in this matter with the generally accepted notions. That causes his irritated and painful reactions when people make remarks regarding his lack of skills in questions of general comfort or aesthetics. Tries to implement his own, deeply individual, often inadequate understanding of aesthetisc for practical purposes. Can have an inculcated notion that one must overcome pain of work and efforts to have decent looks.

    Super-Id
    He is attracted by different theories and conceptual constructs of various kinds. Examples of clear logical thinking win his attention and inspire him although his own analytical capabilities are limited to the level of individual understanding. Judges information which requires analytical competence based on subjective and deeply individual opinions and preferences. Cannot correlate his understanding with the commonly accepted one. Can have exaggereted reactions to critisism of his analytical skills.

    A representative of this type believes himself to be capable to protect himself, his opinions and resist agression defending his life space. He typically needs and seeks a positive feedback, positive assessment of his protective capabilities. Unconsciously gets inspired by an idea or possibility to show his best when defendig some cause. He is flattered by being presented as a champion, standard-bearer or defender of a just cause, protector of dear persons or values.

    Id
    Has generally satisfactory relationships with people. Has no problems handling his likes or dislikes based on aqcuired experience and personal needs. The process of forming of the interpersonal relationships for him is mainly a coincidence of individual factors and preferences.

    Usually he has a well developed capability to unconsciously sense positive potential of things, people and events and he uses this ability in his life.

    Maxim Gorky
    ISTj
    LSI

    Ego
    The vision of the world as a system of rules, laws, knowledge hierarchies. Perceived by others within the system he crafted a detailed outlook. Each concept or phenomenon fits into this system. Tends to take effect, promotion, coercion and forceful action to preserve meaningfully installed order for him. Varying degrees of pressure and the tool of influence to achieve their goals in the right situation.

    Super-Ego
    Good relationships are shown on the basis of standards studied. Understanding the relationships and sympathy based on the visual standards.

    Search capabilities, potentials and possible meanings of phenomena wih limited personal experience and personal understanding. Evaluates the inclination and the ability of others based on their own ideas, have difficulties in assessing the adequacy of the assessment and comparison of these estimates with others.

    Super-Id
    Experience difficulties in creating the necessary emotional atmosphere. Attracted by the opportunity to get away from the negative state, to get the enthusiasm and excitement.

    Activated by the positive outlook, sense of belonging to the significant events.

    Id
    Drawing on the experience of life is the right tool for the activity in which he is involved. The technological aspect of the process is done automatically and efficiently.

    Flexible use of individual ability to organize work space, convenience, comfort.

    Zhukov
    ESTp
    SLE

    Ego
    The perception of the world in terms of will, strength qualities, conflict of interests and ways of influence and control. Sees well the strength and power of various strong-willed objects, people, and social structures. In any situation, he knows how to control, subdue, suppress, overcome to succeed. Builds specific logic circuits to achieve their goals. Creates rules and procedures to allow him to achieve maximum impact.

    Super-ego
    Understanding the potential and opportunities is based on stereotyping, often with borrowed methods of evaluation. The horizon of opportunities is based on the generally accepted views. Stereotypically evaluates the ability of other people.

    Good relations with specific people established and maintained only on the basis of their understanding of personal relationships. Not able to select the best way to express the relationships, or even to assess the method of establishing relations used by others. Therefore, sensitive about remarks about impropriety and indiscretion.

    Super-Id
    Attracted to positive information about specific events and the forthcoming pleasant surprises of fate. Often feels a lack of ability to predict and to see positive incentives in the future.

    Would like to believe that he can manage the general emotional atmosphere, to maintain the desired state, the fuse. Needs assessment of this skill.

    Unconsciously activated in case of need to prove himself initiator of desired emotional atmosphere, to present an emotional surprise.

    Id
    In everyday life he enjoyed individually worked out ways of creating, comfort, convenience. Spontaneously, flexibly, and confidently uses the necessary tools, technologies, and processes for the implementation of the current practice.

    Yesenin
    INFp
    IEI

    Ego
    It feels like forever the world of the ongoing process of constant developments and changes, which are often filled with deep meaning. Especially inclined to celebrate the event, bearing the universal, or break character. Can accurately assess the prospects and development, taking into account both the general trends and particular situation.

    In situations that may lead to a deterioration in the emotional atmosphere of the oppressed in every way trying to prevent this deterioration. For this, as an antidote, it creates a good mood and friends.

    The main motto - do not lose heart, even in the most difficult situations.

    Super-Ego
    Remedy discomfort, creating a comfortable understanding aesthetic forms and proportions based on learned knowledge. This knowledge acquired or in the process of formation, or borrowed from authority figures. It is difficult to create an aesthetic product that would meet the requirements of the situation.

    Approaches to the specific practices are unique and do not always correspond with the conventional techniques. This inadequacy itself is not able to see, as it is difficult to confidently compare their ways of working with while others do it. Unpleasant criticism of practicality, business skills, the choice of method and tools work.

    Super-Id
    Attracts information on the power side of life, and especially the specific methods to protect their living space, their interests. Feeling of lack of skills and information on how to protect and display the influence.

    It claims to be a proper assessment of its ability to analyze, the ability to think collectively. Needs assessment of this skill.

    Unconsciously activated when necessary to use analytical, logical abilities, especially if it leads to a strengthening of its influence.

    Id
    Recognition is of vital developments specific essence of things and phenomena. In different situations, cope with tasks that require a choice between several possibilities, seeing the positive qualities of people or events. A broad and flexible enjoys an innate ability to build and maintain relationships. Relationship problems solve in passing, not particularly paying attention. Applies understanding of beauty to improve the properties of concrete objects.

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    Quote Originally Posted by frankwithyou View Post
    I would like to point out something else, which kept me from asserting with certainty that I was a Logical type. I can get into a very strong emotional state when watching artistic performances. The beauty, the emotion, the meaning evoke strong feelings in me. For example, I was at a ballet performance and I had to hold back tears because of the emotional response that the scene evoked in me. I am like this in regards to certain movies, also. Scenes that combine beauty with deep significance evoke that response in me, to the point of tears. Then again, I hold that back and try to suppress it, for the aforementioned fear of looking too sensitive. Also, when someone laughs, if it is authentic, even if I don't know the reason very well, I can't help but begin to smile myself. I feel it as contagious. Wouldn't this be considered Fe?

    Damn, feels awkward talking about these things.
    So do I. It can be embarrassing because I can't help it. But that also still fits LSI. Fe can affect them quite a lot.

    Quote Originally Posted by Beskova
    MAXIM is not only responsive to merriment, but he can even be touchingly sentimental, although this is hard to see within this strict, dry person. He is capable of being imbued by much compassion and pity for the hero of a melodrama, that tears will come to his eyes. At work, MAXIMs sometimes experience assaults of unexpected, unmotivated sympathy for their colleagues, even if they behave in a way warranting their dismissal. Especially so if their colleague's relatives are ill, or a dog suddenly died, or a wife being unfaithful.

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    That's Fe in Vital Block.

    Talks like a constructivist. Vibe of obstinate.

    Basically described Fi base at one point in discussions.

    Be mindful of confusing Ti base for constructivist and vice versa.

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    Btw, how did you come across typology? Because of your psychology studies? That's how I discovered it.
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    Same way, yes. I find its potential to be pretty big. It could be a good system to figure out some relations. But for that to be accurate I have to find out what I am first. This is why I haven't abandoned my search for my type for three years. That coupled with the fact that I won't rest until I have something figured out. It is 4:43 AM here

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    I find it odd how people arrive at LSI.
    Compare him to @Number 9 large and his questionnaire.
    Entirely different.

    Disliking "excessive smiling" speaks rather against Fe valuing, btw.

    And this is classic -Fi (valuing):

    Some would see me as kind of hostile, distant. Until someone enters my circle, I don't show much affection.
    ^ That is basically how many ESIs act, being -Fi lead. LIEs are kind of like ESIs flipped over. LSIs are not like that.

    And this sounds like Fi seeking + 8 fix:

    What is one common misconception that people have? Explain why it is wrong.

    "About me? That I lack feelings. The level of sentiment that I can reach is deeper than most people could ever imagine me reaching. But I hide it to not appear weak."
    All in all, the questionnaire gives me no signs of "Beta values", it is pretty much Te+Se+Ni+Fi.

    Both LSI and LIE are "Feeling seeking" so to speak, so there will be some overlaps in that regard. But the nature of those "feelings" they are after is different. Fi vs Fe.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cassandra View Post
    Disliking "excessive smiling" speaks rather against Fe valuing, btw.

    And this is classic -Fi (valuing):



    ^ That is basically how many ESIs act, being -Fi lead. LIEs are kind of like ESIs flipped over. LSIs are not like that.

    And this sounds like Fi seeking + 8 fix:

    Both LSI and LIE are "Feeling seeking" so to speak, so there will be some overlaps in that regard. But the nature of those "feelings" they are after is different. Fi vs Fe.
    Disliking excessive, insincere smiling certainly is true for Fe valuers as well. You think they like insincerity? As for looking cold and standoffish - yeah, all the IxTx types can come across that way, though yes, LSIs tend to try to be polite and smile and try to look friendly. But you don't see yourself from the outside, so a person's assessment of how they come across to others isn't the strongest argument.

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    Went through, YES: ENTj.

    Uses way too many extroverted elements to be an introverted type: what's rational and factual (Te), what's strong (Se), what's emotional (Fe), what's interesting and promising (Ne, very prominent and used all the time but unvalued, see surprise question).

    Essential weaknesses are all in the daily life - dressing excluded - or sentiment control realm. I mean, getting in a fight over cigarette smoke!

    Note the hallmark of ego: goals and future are set, but there's hesitation, procrastination, lack of forceful initiation. ego dual is needed. That has to be ESI to back up for the values part as well, and closing the distance in the relationship. Appreciated were: Friendly colleagues, dogmatic beliefs, conservativism, tact, and self-respect: all ESI.



    Won't change my Enneagram assessment, E3 all the way. Achievement focus, aspirations, wants to portray a certain image, can be hostile, monitors the way of coming across, wanting to be the best or first. Problems with getting in touch with one's true feeling, coldness. Can-do, almost robotic "get what I want", efficiency... it goes on and on. Phobic 6 anxiety is only mentioned shortly, the rest is all "ultimate 3 competitor".

    That even transfers to parenting:

    Assure the respect of my kid. That he got involved in intelligent hobbies, like chess. Also that he got involved in sports, team sports especially. Guide him to those. In order for him to become a well-rounded individual.
    A 6 would primarily want their kid to be safe and protected, not to be self-realized, busy, and successful right and left like oneself. Respect is also a 3 topic due to their self-worth premises. Also, note the kid's gender. You can't make a top dog out of a girl in this society, he knows that.

    Tritype 361

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chae View Post
    Went through, YES: ENTj.

    Uses way too many extroverted elements to be an introverted type: what's rational and factual (Te), what's strong (Se), what's emotional (Fe), what's interesting and promising (Ne, very prominent and used all the time but unvalued, see surprise question).

    Essential weaknesses are all in the daily life - dressing excluded - or sentiment control realm. I mean, getting in a fight over cigarette smoke!

    Note the hallmark of ego: goals and future are set, but there's hesitation, procrastination, lack of forceful initiation. ego dual is needed. That has to be ESI to back up for the values part as well, and closing the distance in the relationship. Appreciated were: Friendly colleagues, dogmatic beliefs, conservativism, tact, and self-respect: all ESI.



    Won't change my Enneagram assessment, E3 all the way. Achievement focus, aspirations, wants to portray a certain image, can be hostile, monitors the way of coming across, wanting to be the best or first. Problems with getting in touch with one's true feeling, coldness. Can-do, almost robotic "get what I want", efficiency... it goes on and on. Phobic 6 anxiety is only mentioned shortly, the rest is all "ultimate 3 competitor".

    That even transfers to parenting:



    A 6 would primarily want their kid to be safe and protected, not to be self-realized, busy, and successful right and left like oneself. Respect is also a 3 topic due to their self-worth premises. Also, note the kid's gender. You can't make a top dog out of a girl in this society, he knows that.

    Tritype 361

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    I do try to be polite and smile, but I still seem to come across as distant. I know this perception may be biased, which is why I say this based on what my ex used to say to me. That nobody knows how warm and affectionate I am, that I should be warmer to people. Again, I can be warmer to people in general, but it does not come naturally. Basically with her I was almost the opposite of the cold shell that I emulate in public, acting silly and loving and such(here it came naturally). Read somewhere that results oriented types tend to do this.

    Also, people seem to trust me. Despite me being a bit cold, when 1 on 1, they open up to me(as in telling me some secrets, attitudes towards other members of the group). Guess they feel like they can trust me, and for this they are right. I don't ever make something that was meant to be private, public. I reciprocate by opening up a little, but I still mistrust them to some degree.

    I am quiet for the most part. But I am always checking where the group is going, how they are thinking, feeling and behaving. I intervene if something important comes up, but I am not good so with small talk. Again, 1 on 1, this changes. I know how to keep a conversation going and how to charm a person.

    Regarding the phobic 6 part, I think that I have become this way because some time ago I decided that whatever scares me, I plunge into it in order to overcome the fear. This led to my confidence growing over time. Still does, I have the same mentality(CP 6?).

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    So.... Does this just continue until someone guesses the right personality type that you want to be?

    Wait, are you a girl or a boy? Cuz you talk about being warm and open with a girl.

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    I'm male. Talking about ex-gf. I'm providing information in order to make the picture as clear as possible.

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    Quote Originally Posted by frankwithyou View Post
    I do try to be polite and smile, but I still seem to come across as distant. I know this perception may be biased, which is why I say this based on what my ex used to say to me. That nobody knows how warm and affectionate I am, that I should be warmer to people. Again, I can be warmer to people in general, but it does not come naturally. Basically with her I was almost the opposite of the cold shell that I emulate in public, acting silly and loving and such(here it came naturally). Read somewhere that results oriented types tend to do this.

    Also, people seem to trust me. Despite me being a bit cold, when 1 on 1, they open up to me(as in telling me some secrets, attitudes towards other members of the group). Guess they feel like they can trust me, and for this they are right. I don't ever make something that was meant to be private, public. I reciprocate by opening up a little, but I still mistrust them to some degree.

    I am quiet for the most part. But I am always checking where the group is going, how they are thinking, feeling and behaving. I intervene if something important comes up, but I am not good so with small talk. Again, 1 on 1, this changes. I know how to keep a conversation going and how to charm a person.
    I hate typing this way, so I'll try not to be influenced by it, but you're the only person I've seen yet on this forum that I've read things of and actually really identified with, and could say "yeah me too" to almost all of it. Though, I don't think I'm all that charming 1 on 1 or in a group either one. Some people have told me otherwise but I'm unconvinced.

    Ok, so I'll put that aside and try to look at just the type factors that stand out.

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    Quote Originally Posted by squark View Post
    I hate typing this way, so I'll try not to be influenced by it, but you're the only person I've seen yet on this forum that I've read things of and actually really identified with, and could say "yeah me too" to almost all of it. Though, I don't think I'm all that charming 1 on 1 or in a group either one. Some people have told me otherwise but I'm unconvinced.

    Ok, so I'll put that aside and try to look at just the type factors that stand out.
    Just because you like him and relate to his cognition, doesn't mean you're the same type. That would be too easy. If anything, that means shared or overlapping values. Maybe you're duals instead, ESI and LIE?

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    Adam Strange's Avatar
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    Lol. I just read your questionnaire. Not only does it read easily to me, but your answers to most of the questions are very, very similar to what I would have answered. My own typing is LIE-Te, 8w7, 3w2, 6w7, FWIW.

    Why law school? The prestige, or do you really have an interest in law, including the nuts and bolts of daily legal service?

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    Adam, regarding law school, for the possibilities that open up for me. Also, since starting I have discovered that I am very interested in certain fields of law(as in like studying about in depth). As for the daily legal service, I have had the opportunity to get into an internship a few months ago for month and I still feel that this is right for me.

    Well, this is interesting. both LIE and LSI seem to relate to me.

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    meme hotline Chae's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by frankwithyou View Post
    Adam, regarding law school, for the possibilities that open up for me. Also, since starting I have discovered that I am very interested in certain fields of law(as in like studying about in depth). As for the daily legal service, I have had the opportunity to get into an internship a few months ago for month and I still feel that this is right for me.

    Well, this is interesting. both LIE and LSI seem to relate to me.
    LSI is out of the game. Look how you use literally ALL OVER EVERYTHING (red above, the irony). Never heard of an LSI who talks about taking chances and possibilities and whatnot in their career.

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    Quote Originally Posted by frankwithyou View Post
    Adam, regarding law school, for the possibilities that open up for me. Also, since starting I have discovered that I am very interested in certain fields of law(as in like studying about in depth). As for the daily legal service, I have had the opportunity to get into an internship a few months ago for month and I still feel that this is right for me.
    OK, good luck.

    Personally, I have a degree in Astrophysics, mainly because it was intellectually interesting and gave me a goal about which I could organize my activities for a few years. When I actually started doing it, I found the people were too conservative and intellectually punitive towards new ideas, and it didn't yield real world rewards of the kind I had come to want (money, influence, etc.).

    Most smart LIE's go into finance (or become CEO's). Finance is one of the two fields that have the best returns, the other being real estate, which is the realm of the LSE's. However, you may find ways to make money as a lawyer.

    The field of law is saturating in the US. Law school enrollment is off (my ex works for the UM Law School), but there are some sub-fields that are prospering, like patents. Mainly because the economy is moving away from competition towards monopolies. Still, a law degree can help you in business and in finance.

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