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Thread: Belief and Type 6

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    Olimpia's Avatar
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    Lightbulb Belief and Type 6

    Typing individuals who are either very religious or spiritual, I discovered that almost all of them were 6 fix.
    (Whereas the type least likely to be religious in modern society is Type 5.)

    The Type 6 personality structure is inherently on the look-out for security; and religious people find security in their faith.

    People of enneatype Six are essentially insecure...as though life has never quite provided them with a proper footing, as though there existed nothing, either internally or externally, which could serve as a solid foundation. The type Six fixation is therefore deeply and fundamentally existential, and there exists at the core of enneatype Six a tight knot of anxiety, an essential disquietude, and a deep seated desire to find something or someone stable enough in which to place some trust. Given this essential dynamic, it is not surprising therefore to find that Sixes have core issues centering around the contrast between faith and scepticism, trust and distrust, and the legitimate exercise of authority versus the abuse and misuse of power.
    Today I came across this article that confirms my theory as to why certain people are very religious or spiritual; a big reason why is to mitigate potential dangers and fear, to reach a greater feeling of internal security:

    You see a bush on fire. It could have been caused by an impersonal, inanimate, and unintentional force (lightning striking the bush and setting it on fire), or it could have been caused by a personal, animate, and intentional force (God trying to communicate with you). The “animistic bias” or “agency-detector mechanism” predisposes you to opt for the latter explanation rather than the former. It predisposes you to see the hands of God at work behind natural, physical phenomena whose exact causes are unknown.

    In this view, religiosity (the human capacity for belief in supernatural beings) is not an evolved tendency per se; after all, religion in itself is not adaptive. It is instead a byproduct of animistic bias or the agency-detector mechanism, the tendency to be paranoid, which is adaptive because it can save your life. Humans did not evolve to be religious; they evolved to be paranoid. And humans are religious because they are paranoid.
    Or in other words, paranoid Sixes are religious.
    (It also explains why the Six fix is the most common Head fix.)

    You may say "But not all Sixes are paranoid!"
    No, not all of them are – at healthy levels. Once they become unhealthy, they become paranoid and anxious.

    Unhealthy Levels

    Level 7: Fearing that they have ruined their security, they become panicky, volatile, and self-disparaging with acute inferiority feelings. Seeing themselves as defenseless, they seek out a stronger authority or belief to resolve all problems. Highly divisive, disparaging and berating others.

    Level 8: Feeling persecuted, that others are "out to get them," they lash-out and act irrationally, bringing about what they fear. Fanaticism, violence.
    You may say "But not all paranoid people are Sixes!"
    Type their tritype. They'll have a Six fix, or a Six wing (or are perhaps a 9 disintegrating to 6). Paranoia is (unhealthy) Six, just like Narcissism is (unhealthy) 3.

    You may say "I know Sixes that aren't religious at all, they are atheists or agnostics!"
    First of, I bet they (or you) have a strong 5 wing and/or are more intelligent than the average person.
    As I said earlier, 5s tend to be the least religious. 5s do not seek out external belief systems to find security; they mostly seek out knowledge to develop their expertise for security. 7s may to an extent seek out religion when they have a strong 6 wing, but they are more likely going to draw inspiration from many different beliefs and not settle on one belief. 7s feel more secure by not relying or settling on anything.

    Also:

    For any given scientific generalization, it is always easy to recall an anecdote or example that is contrary to the general pattern, such as “I know a man who...” or “I know a woman who....” As I explain in an earlier post, science is empirical, not logical, which is why there is no such thing as a scientific proof. The existence of exceptions and counterexamples, which invalidate mathematical proofs, do not invalidate scientific conclusions and empirical generalizations. You may know a man who finds elderly, obese women sexually attractive, but that does not invalidate the conclusion that men in general find young women with low waist-to-hip ratios sexually attractive.
    Of course my findings are not truly "scientific". But my point is, just because you know a couple of counterexamples doesn't mean this conclusion in invalid: that most religious or spiritual people in the world are 6 fix. Most people believe in God or similar, (because) most people are 6 fix. There's a connection between the two, for reasons I've outlined above. Needless to say, most atheists are 5 fix or have a strong 5 wing, like Richard Dawkins.

    You may say "I know someone who is/was religious or spiritual without being 6 fix!"
    First, make sure you have typed them correctly. Besides that, there have been findings showing that attachment style has an effect on someone's attitude towards God. There needs to be more research, but essentially it looks like God is an attachment figure, and that Securely attached or Preoccupied individuals are more likely going to be religious (or spiritual for that matter), whereas Dismissive individuals are less likely religious and more likely going to "dismiss" God. I've found that many SX first individuals (especially Sx/Sp) are either religious or spiritual (and often Preoccupied as well), especially when they are single. Their faith in a God or some equivalent enables them to feel attached to someone or something, it can help them with feeling less lonely.

    In a follow-up study, Kirkpatrick, Shillito, and Kellas (1999) found that secure attachment to God was inversely associated with loneliness among women.
    At last, it may look like I have equated religiosity with spirituality and see no difference between the two. Surely the two aren't the exact same thing; but they are both connected to the 6 fix. Based on my observations, spiritual people usually are either 9 core + 6 fix and SO blindspot, or 4 core + 6 fix and SO blindspot, or SX 7w6. Yes, the stackings to be spiritual the most often are Sx/Sp and Sp/Sx in my experience. I am theorizing it is their SX desire for some kind of attachment, as well as their SO blindspot disregarding the social customs of believing in an Abrahamic faith or constitutionalized religion.

    So, if you come across someone who is very religious or spiritual, it is safe to say they are most likely either 6 fix or 6 wing and/or SO blindspot and/or SX first. (I should add that the devout usually have a 6 fix and 1 fix.)

    If you come across an atheist or agnostic, they are most likely 5 fix or 5 wing and/or have a high(er) IQ and/or are Dismissive.
    Last edited by Olimpia; 04-27-2017 at 11:34 AM.
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    C-ESI-Se 6w7 sx/sp ashlesha's Avatar
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    If most religious people are 6s, and most non religious people are 5s, I suppose the vast majority of people of other types are half-assed religious faking through the motions types? Going to church for the free wine types?

    Personally I think being a 6 makes it harder for me to force a relationship with God even when I'd like to because the concept of faith is too weird and seems gullible. 6s struggle with faith (until they don't, of course - and I can see how they would be very devoted to religion if that's their security of choice).

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    Makes sense! I also thought about the other types, how they would seek belief:

    1 is belief incarnate, this needs no explanation. They are likely the authority 6 looks up to
    2 to become altruistic, Jesus is one figure that preaches a lot of 2-ness for example
    3 to achieve something, like enlightenment, or motivating others
    4 to feel deeply, especially in spiritual dimensions
    5 to know about the world - see Buddha, a 5w4
    7 to enjoy something, gospel choirs are a good example. "Joyful joyful lord, I adore thee" etc.
    8 to be powerful, belief comes with might
    9 similar to 1, to connect maybe "with the source"

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    For the record, I think this is shallow and overly simplistic, but that's to be expected, I'm sure.

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    Sir that's my emotional support gremlin ApeironStella's Avatar
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    Huh. I always found the idea of believing some spiritual being just not the right thing for myself? It never just made sense to me to 'just believe' all the questions we can't answer is because some being created us this way and only they know the answers since this would easily, easiily lead to a sadistic overlord view than a benevolent creator view for me, so I never was really... religious? If there was such a being who knows everything I think/feel/do before I even do them, what would be the point of faking as if I was a follower?

    And I would have to agree that if 6s are defined by their lack of trust, 'Holy Faith', I would say that while this might make them look for such figures, wouldn't they also be the ones to constantly be the ones to doubt it? Talking about average ranges, at least.





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    It works in reverse too. People who must join the atheist movement or MRA movement, feminism. etc. That is 6 shit too. SJW is six shit.

    Punk music is 6. Green Day. Again, another culture to belong to. Rage Against the Machine. Same thing. Fighting for a group of people or associating with a group.

    Rally around the family with a pocket full of shells. Malcolm X said the same thing.

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    I have mentioned my ESI 6 friend here before. She was not raised to believe in any kind of spirituality let alone an organized religion. She didn't go into a church until she was in her 20s and it was for a funeral. She found it creepy. My sister tried to influence her with her spiritual beliefs but my friend just couldn't relate at all and resented being asked to believe in something she didn't want to believe in and felt no connection to.

    Beliefs like these are not type related, imo. They have a lot to do with culture and how you are raised. If you are raised in a society, or even family, where most people are atheists then there is a higher chance you too may become an atheist, without question, for example. I would not even attribute that kind of atheism to higher intelligence because it too is can be as mindless as having unquestioned faith in a god or other religion.

    Also, 5s can be one of the most paranoid types with or without a 6 wing. I am sure many religious scholars are/were 5s. There are so many variables when it comes to shaping beliefs that you can't pin it on enneagram type. Each person (type) would have different motivations for pursuing things of that nature. Such as self knowledge and meaning. I think atheism can be just as fear inspired as believing in a higher power, such as god. Imagine the implications for them if there was a god. The safest thing is not to believe. Of course there are people, religious, or not, who believe without any fear either way.

    I should say that I do not believe in a god but when I did it was because it was forced on me, as a small child, and enforced with fear tactics (you will go to hell if you don't believe). I refused to go to church when I turned 12 because something didn't feel right about it. My mom didn't press since she didn't go much either at that point. I turned into an angry atheist for a short time, later. My current beliefs, about such things, are chosen consciously making them uniquely mine and almost impossible to express verbally.

    “My typology is . . . not in any sense to stick labels on people at first sight. It is not a physiognomy and not an anthropological system, but a critical psychology dealing with the organization and delimitation of psychic processes that can be shown to be typical.”​ —C.G. Jung
     
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    Science is the same thing. It offers a similar comfort. People need something warm to cuddle next to. To answer all their questions and look over them. What sixes fear:


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    Quote Originally Posted by Cassandra View Post
    But my point is, just because you know a couple of counterexamples doesn't mean this conclusion in invalid: that most religious or spiritual people in the world are 6 fix.
    I've seen an enneagram video that said 9s and 2s are two of the most common types found among religious believers. Both of these types are looking for love, so they turn to look for it in God. They could say the same thing about any counterexamples you could bring up.

    My relationship with religion has been complicated, on-and-off, so this conclusion does sound like an oversimplification of 6s.

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    Even atoms are the result of insecurity. lol. Matter. Why do we want to know things? Like science? So we can CONTROL them.

    Matter and the need for security. - In science we try to find ultimate matter, but the more we split up matter, the more we find other matter. We find movement, and movement equals energy: movement, impact, energy, but no things. Things came about, more or less, by man's need for security. You can manipulate a thing, you can play fitting games with it. These concepts, these somethings can be put together into something else. “Something" is a thing, so even an abstract noun becomes a thing.


    Like that song says, we don't believe in anything we can't break. We are breaking atoms at their smallest level. We would collide planets together if we could. It only exists, if it breaks. Oh, and we also don't believe in things we can't waste.



    Don't believe in fear

    Don't believe in faith
    Don't believe in anything
    That you can't break

    Don't believe in love
    Don't believe in hate
    Don't believe in anything
    That you can't waste

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    I think Mike Tyson may be a six. I think Tyson is a good example of Ni HA. That guy has actually gotten wise over the years. He has truly matured intellectually. Isn't Ni HA a will to believe? Sounds like 6 too.

    “Fear is your best friend or your worst enemy. It's like fire. If you can control it, it can cook for you; it can heat your house. If you can't control it, it will burn everything around you and destroy you.

    He turned Muslim in prison like Malcolm X too. lol.

    [Tyson-getting pumped]
    I'm the best ever. I'm the most brutal and vicious, and most ruthless champion there's ever been.There's no one can stop me. Lennox is a conqueror? No, I'm Alexander, he's no Alexander.I'm the best ever. There's never been anybody as ruthless.I'm Sonny Liston,I'm Jack Dempsey. There's no one like me. I'm from their cloth. There's no one that can match me. My style is impetuous, my defense is impregnable, and I'm just ferocious. I want your heart. I want to eat his children.Praise be to Allah.
    "And in those days shall men seek death, and shall not find it, and shall desire to die, and death shall flee from them."

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