"4w3 or 7w6: The Saga Continues"

[The Snow Leopard]

Hello all,

I've been following this forum for some years, had another account for a short duration, underwent a messy internal breakup with Socionics, and relate to it now as an annoyingly perceptive, estranged cousin. The Enneagram however, provides a context for personality which allows more fluctuation across a continuum of health as well as the possibility of transcendence of type altogether, which interests me. So it's back on the personality train once more!

A nagging question continues to perpetuate despite my best efforts to flesh out differences; am I 4w3 or 7w6??

Looking at subtypes in isolation (terrible Enneagram faux pas, I know), I am a CLEAR SX type, by a wide margin. SP and SO fall somewhere well below SX, not a big deal to me which is where. Descriptions of 4 and 7 from an external perspective both depict me in different states of being, in near equal heaping. There is a restless quality and a dislike of limits, yearning for freedom, and adventurous, spontaneous dimension of my personality that points to 7. Yet I also embody a depth, sensitivity to beauty, love of introspection and constant search for identity that mirrors typical type 4 patterns. My favorite enneagram type descriptions are those by Russel Rowe. When I read his description of type 4, every word mirrors my internal understanding of myself, down to career choice. But when I arrive at subtypes, it crumbles...The reverse is true for the type 7 description; I relate piecemeal to bits of his 7 description until I arrive at the subtypes, and then the type 7 sx description hits home. Here is the link:
http://www.russellrowe.com/enneagram-system-32.php

Then, this article....http://theenneagram.blogspot.com/200...entifying.html
This article has me leaning toward 4w3. The imagery of "sitting all alone in the middle of the moonlight woods, staring off into nothing, knowing they had to confront something, but not knowing what." is an apt metaphor for my life, woods, moon, unknown confrontation and all.

But....................the subtypes don't align for type 4. The subtype descriptions for type 4 seem to paint a pretty grim depiction of life as a 4 in general, maybe it's just a lack of worthy descriptions.

Type 7 sx isn't a bad fit for me, but it doesn't align with my frequent bouts of melancholy, search for identity, and willingness to listen to friends crises. I reframe towards the positive at times similarly to a sx 7, but also have a great appreciation for pain in suffering as a necessary transformational catalyst more like a 4.

To sum up my current thoughts on my internal conundrum is that I am a 4w3 who swallowed a 7w6 whole and never managed to fully digest it, and now, a typhonic battle for control of my inner world ensues, with me as the befuddled observer. Whichever type I am (4 or 7), I must have an idealized image of the other as my guiding compass.

Thanks for any input you may have!

[GuavaDrunk]

I would look at your weaknesses, shameful behaviours and unhealthy states rather than poetic descriptions.

[Chae]

You sure have the dramatism of a 4, it seems predominant Let subtypes aside for now, they cloud the overall process. Why not incorporate both in your tritype? People are subject to multiple enneagram influences and not just one type in particular, the latter as the main type is just pronounced since we use it often and/or are in an environment that triggers this motivation.

[Chae]

I would look at your weaknesses, shameful behaviours and unhealthy states rather than poetic descriptions.

Not only that, but also strengths. If Leopard is on the healthy or more average side, weaknesses and shame might not give any significant clues.

[The Snow Leopard]

I would look at your weaknesses, shameful behaviours and unhealthy states rather than poetic descriptions.

Good advice. My unhealthy states and behaviors certainly align more towards type 4, with a tendency towards withdrawal as opposed to excess. In times of extreme stress or events that threaten my sense of self, I turn inwards to work things out, a party or social event being the last place on earth I turn to for solace.
However, my overall presence is light, not heavy or sad like a type 4 is so often described as possessing. But the archetypal energies in the description of type 4 often don't encapsulate the near manic energy that I exude at other times. In such exuberant states, I feel more closely connected to the energies of a type 7. Perhaps NTR, or more indicative of my iee sociotype.
Is it possible for a type 4 to appear 7ish from an exterior perspective?

[The Snow Leopard]

You sure have the dramatism of a 4, it seems predominant Let subtypes aside for now, they cloud the overall process. Why not incorporate both in your tritype? People are subject to multiple enneagram influences and not just one type in particular, the latter as the main type is just pronounced since we use it often and/or are in an environment that triggers this motivation.

Thanks for the reply!
My flair for dramatism emerges especially strongly in my writing. In person, I've often been likened to a cartoon character.
My tritype is between 479 and 471, with the 4 and 7 as fluid entities among the primary and secondary spots for the time being. I would just like to be able to pin down my primary type with a greater degree of certainty, to better follow specific processes along the lines of integration (something I'm not sure if tritype theory has proposed?).

As for your second reply, definitely more on the average to healthy side, with occasional bouts on the lower ends of the health spectrum. Strengths again line up fairly evenly for both type 4 and 7.

[The Snow Leopard]

In tritype theory, does one actually inhabit at a given moment one of the three types individual energy patterns independent of the other two type's influence? Or does it function as a layered effect, with the secondary and tertiary types bleeding through more subtly into the overall effect a person conveys?

[Chae]

Thanks for the reply!
My flair for dramatism emerges especially strongly in my writing. In person, I've often been likened to a cartoon character.
My tritype is between 479 and 471, with the 4 and 7 as fluid entities among the primary and secondary spots for the time being. I would just like to be able to pin down my primary type with a greater degree of certainty, to better follow specific processes along the lines of integration (something I'm not sure if tritype theory has proposed?).

As for your second reply, definitely more on the average to healthy side, with occasional bouts on the lower ends of the health spectrum. Strengths again line up fairly evenly for both type 4 and 7.

Cartoon character... yes, that's 7 and 4!

For integration, how do you behave during perceived growth? For disintegration, what happens when you are stressed? For instance, I as a 3 become completely inert during stress, isolate myself, numb everything. During progress, I socialize and consider others more, become a group person. Yes, that also applies to tritype.

Ok, gotcha. So:
If you're a 4, you'll likely become more self-sacrificial during stress, forgetting yourself (e2 disintegration).
If you're a 7, you'll become nitpicky and morally strict (e7 disintegration).

[The Snow Leopard]

Cartoon character... yes, that's 7 and 4!

For integration, how do you behave during perceived growth? For disintegration, what happens when you are stressed? For instance, I as a 3 become completely inert during stress, isolate myself, numb everything. During progress, I socialize and consider others more, become a group person. Yes, that also applies to tritype.

Ok, gotcha. So:
If you're a 4, you'll likely become more self-sacrificial during stress, forgetting yourself (e2 disintegration).
If you're a 7, you'll become nitpicky and morally strict (e7 disintegration).

Very helpful insight, gratzi!

During periods of perceived growth, I actually buckle down and take on necessary tasks without regard to my feelings or mindset. A more structured approach to life, rather than one based upon my whims, and justifications for procrastination. Also, I become more stable emotionally, better able to perceive things objectively, without an internal kaleidoscopic lens refracting outer information into distortion. More calm and centered, my energy not quite so spasmodic.

My reactions to stress usually involve isolation and procrastination. I will avoid people for long periods of time without explanation, until I can internally sort things out to once more emerge in vital form. Their is often a sort of internal guilt to my avoidance patterns though, and I will force myself to hang out with the world, faking energy I don't possess.

[The Snow Leopard]

Sounds like a rather similar pattern to your 3 integration / disintegration haha.

[GuavaDrunk]

Not only that, but also strengths. If Leopard is on the healthy or more average side, weaknesses and shame might not give any significant clues.

Ofc, but the OP has already pointed out plenty of strengths and it hasn't solved their problem.

@The Snow Leopard : sounds e4 so far

[The Snow Leopard]

@GuavaDrunk : My thoughts as well, e4 for now!

[maniac]

If you're a 4, you'll likely become more self-sacrificial during stress, forgetting yourself (e2 disintegration).
If you're a 7, you'll become nitpicky and morally strict (e7 disintegration).

4s would never forget about themselves , its more like we get very attached to certain people and put all our emotional dependence on them.
For 7, probably not more moral, that doesnt make lot of sense, but critical and judgemental


OT: nothing The snow leopard has said so far sounds 4. Withdrawn type, maybe.

[The Snow Leopard]

@Ghost Would you mind pointing out something i've written that doesn't resonate with your conception of e4?

[maniac]

@Ghost Would you mind pointing out something i've written that doesn't resonate with your conception of e4?

Its not that it doesnt, its just you havent said anything that is 4. How do you feel about 9?

[The Snow Leopard]

Its not that it doesnt, its just you havent said anything that is 4. How do you feel about 9?

I have some 9ish qualities, especially a tendency to procrastination and inertia in life, but I am much more attuned to expressing my individuality in most every facet of my life than I am in appeasing the collective or reaching mutual compromise. I don't like to create unnecessary strife, but I also won't ever give into conforming pressures. My often over-reliance on individuality to me seems very 4ish. 9 is certainly in my tri-type though, likely tertiary. Also, side by side with some of my friends that I am almost certain of as 9's, I make a very poor 9 indeed. Honestly if I'm not 4, 7 would be the only other type I can see as my primary. Exteriorally I seem 7ish, interiorally, 4.
What solidified your self-typing as 4w3?