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Thread: USA politics following Trump's election

  1. #721
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    Quote Originally Posted by FreelancePoliceman View Post
    Failed? Again, I’m asking you, why do you think immigration is encouraged by policymakers? If it’s “failed”, why does it continue?
    Corporations and business in general needs cheap labor as well as likes to drain other nations of valuable human resources (doctors, engineers, scientists and so on). If you are a big business it is beneficial to abolish tariffs, open the borders, so you can employ anyone from anywhere, outsource, move production to where labor is cheapest, transport materials and products, capture resources and so on.. or even finance & profit off both sides of a conflict/war. Essentially bourgeoisie mentality / values.

    Politicians depend on people with money to back them during elections, these things go hand in hand, essentially oligarchies. Wealth means power to leverage and influence things in one's favor, which is why this has happened.

    :> these people don't care how the nation, the culture or the local population is going to be affected if there will be conflict or not. In a way the very founders of the US were such wealthy oligarchs rebelling against the crown, because it was profitable. Myth tells of ideals, the reality however was land, money, power and slaves. Thats why most of them risked their lives, the big payoff at the end. (exceptions exist)

    Merchants have no country and soon neither will the GDP producer slaves. The environment? See Planet of the Humans. The bottom line is what matters. Profit.

    Last edited by shotgunfingers; 08-11-2020 at 10:54 AM.

  2. #722
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    @shotgunfingers that's probably the best argument - certain corporations need the cheap labor and open borders and they can Trojan horse it as a humanitarian issue, which it is, but that's not why they want it. It is a move on one front for power. On another front they continue to soften government's power (they don't want its regulations). This is the one thing both left-leaning and right-leaning corporations probably agree on (less regulation). Once government is weak enough, corporations will be the actual rulers, and that's the end of democracy because there's no voting for which corporation is most in power (I do not accept that we vote with $ as legitimate).

    All that said, it still is a humanitarian issue. Both the governments of nations like the US and their corporations create the humanitarian crises to begin with. It's all such a mess, so I'm left with only the individual. The US of the 1800s and 1900s became an immigrant nation. If any nation can handle large influxes of immigrants, it's this one. But the more authoritarian it goes, the less able it will be to do that. It was able to take in millions of people in the 1800s and 1900s, and granted it was smaller then, but it's still a huge country. I really don't know what philosophy to adopt also when I see how bad the overpopulation problem is. If our birthrate is going down, that's freeing up more space, and that's good on a planet on which the species is overpopulated.

    Maintaining stability is crucial, but it will never be maintained by a bunch of it's us against them crap. It can be maintained by holding to founding ideals which act as unifiers. But what also must be understood is that undermining the individualistic spirit too much will also bring down those ideals. Anyway, it's such a disaster. It doesn't have to fail at all, it can work just fine, if people would stop being so selfish (lol, the irony). Another irony is that often immigrants bring in a revitalization of these ideals (many people want to come here because they believe in them).

    The problem is it takes sacrifice from the wealthiest and most powerful, and they don't wanna sacrifice. They just need to stop being "gods" and start being people. If they make it less difficult for the citizens here to survive (the economy needs to be less brutal), no one will feel there isn't enough for everyone. The zero-sum game specter in our heads will dissipate and haunt us no longer.

    It's all so frustrating because what the US is currently suffering from IS the corporatocracy. Our government isn't representing us. It's become weak. Then that opens the doors for phony "strong men" like Trump to come in and be like "I signs exec orders, I makes govt stwong again!" His horrifying weakness (one of the most ego-fragile men on earth) comes off as "strength" to some.

    I still don't fully understand populism, but it seems to me thinking of it as "bad" or "good" is not useful. What it seems to be afaict is what occurs when a system is failing. The anti-establishment view recognizes power is out-of-balance, and emerging populist viewpoints in people's heads reflect that the system isn't working for them. Populism can't be "bad" or "good" when it's a symptom. Yet when those with all the power screwing up the system won't change, what other way do we have?

    This was why I really liked Andrew Yang. His ideas presented a way to ditch these models and do something else, like let's just have a neo-enlightenment period instead. It was risky (and probably all the dinosaurs in government would have made it impossible), but it felt sane. It felt like pouring vitality back into the masses.
    Last edited by inumbra; 08-11-2020 at 04:01 PM.

  3. #723
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    Dementia Joe the Creepy Molester Was Stupid Enough to pick Queen of the Bag Ladies Kamala "poop for brains" harris, and JUST LIKE I FUCKIN SAID, everybody relevant, including Trump, is already using her attacks on Biden as a racist against BIDEN and calling her a phony. As I said before, she is a "fake african-american from an affluent background who tries to use her jamaican bloodline to reinvent herself as the second coming of rosa parks." I called the candidate vulnerabilities on Poop for Brains Kamala before anybody. Dementia Joe really lost his marbles picking this bag lady. Though her attacks on biden as a racist failed to convince anybody (as I had said it wouldn't when I predicted that Biden would win the nomination; everybody discounted it after New Hampshire), it shows how bad his dementia is that he picked a political adversary as his running mate. What a fckin' dummy



    Quote Originally Posted by Kill4Me View Post
    lets see whether Dementia Joe the Creepy Molester is creepy stupid enough to select Kamala Poop for Brains Harris. Basically, Harris is a fake African-American from an affluent background who tries to use a jamaican bloodline in her ancestry to reinvent herself as the second coming of Rosa Parks...Poop for brains would be a real stupid VP selection after she threw Dementia Joe creepy molester under the bus in the early primaries for the democratic party (aka identity politic cesspool), painting a picture of dementia joe as having once upon a time been a racist...holy fuck that would make for one helluva vulnerability to exploit if they were ever running mates
    CALLED THE VULNERABILITIES ON KAMALA BEFORE ANYBODY.

    She's a real stumbling mess too if you ever see her talk. If you took a Bag Lady off the street, dressed her in some fancy chanel, gave her a makeover and day at the beauty salon, then put her in the US Senate you would get Kamala Poop for Brains Harris.

    Last edited by Kill4Me; 08-12-2020 at 12:03 PM.

  4. #724
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    Apparently, one of the reasons Trump did nothing to stem COVID-19 in the beginning was that the virus was affecting mostly blue states, and if more blue Americans die, that's a win for him.

    https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2020...y-thought.html

  5. #725
    xerxe xerxe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kill4Me View Post
    Dementia Joe
    'Sloppy Joe' is more clever. You could use it to segue into a joke about how Trump is going to eat him because he's a pussy.

  6. #726
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    The unrest and violence in the US have created a new business opportunity. People and companies are turning to private security companies. Anybody can feel secure, if they can afford it.


    Security is for the rich and for the elite, multiculturalism and diversity are for the poor where police services are defunded.











    Last edited by khcs; 08-14-2020 at 07:37 AM.

  7. #727
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    US embassies are displaying the rainbow flag of Sodom and Gomorrah all over the world.















  8. #728
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    The Sodom and Gomorrah day in New York City and Tel Aviv. The punishment came in the form of a Coronavirus.













    Last edited by khcs; 08-15-2020 at 11:03 AM.

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    Let The Flight Begin! Expect white flight to accelerate from every insecure neighborhood.





    ESCAPE FROM NEW YORK: WEALTHY RESIDENTS FLEE IN DROVES AS THE CITY DEGENERATES INTO A HELLHOLE Link

    According to the New York Times (ooops), there was a mass exodus of 420,000 New Yorkers between March 1st and May 1st… Roughly 5 percent of residents — or about 420,000 people — left the city between March 1 and May 1. In the city’s very wealthiest blocks, in neighborhoods like the Upper East Side, the West Village, SoHo and Brooklyn Heights, residential population decreased by 40 percent or more, while the rest of the city saw comparably modest changes.

    Just a few days ago, New York Governor Andrew Cuomo (INFJ Dostoevsky) lamented the fact that this mass exodus is hitting tax revenues really hard…

    Mayor de Blasio (ESFJ Hugo) couldn’t care less if wealthy people leave the city for good because of the coronavirus pandemic, telling reporters on Friday that he won’t bend over backward for the one percent to return to NYC. Mayor de Blasio can continue to deny reality if he wishes, but without a doubt the lack of revenue is starting to have a major impact.



    Comment 1 under the article: NYC from scratch is a hell hole city living there is techno idiots living like robots , crowded ,smell like shitsome areas, highly spied by sonofebitnches, expensive, just good to visit that's it.
    Comment 2 under the article: Visit why.... so you can smell the shit? Or maybe get shot. same go for the other shitholes (big cities) in USA. I think best place from my memories over there is states like Montana just about now or somewhere in the mountains in a hunting cabin. This thing is not going away and it will get much worst before is finished one way or the other.





    This photo is Londonistan




    No one knows how accurate these statistics are.
    Last edited by khcs; 08-15-2020 at 08:13 AM.

  10. #730
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    Voter Fraud

    Last edited by khcs; 08-15-2020 at 11:04 AM.

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    xerxe xerxe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    It's been a long time since we've seen anything like this in the States, so it's nice to be reminded that true leaders still exist.

    It's funny how this soldier would be lauded by the public as an undisputed champion of American values, whereas an SJW saying more or less the same thing would receive immediate scorn as a liberal cuck or commie sympathizer. It is blindingly obvious that the hatred levelled against SJWs is overwhelmingly because of their perception as oversensitive pussies, not from any principled desire to defend freedom of speech.

    The latter attitude no doubt exists, sometimes alloyed with the former, but it is the exception, and most Internet trolls can barely articulate what 'freedom' even is. These are people who shrivel up under concentrated criticism, and it is a sad irony to watch them attempt to reconcile 'freedom of speech' with freedom from criticism.
    Last edited by xerxe; 08-17-2020 at 07:36 AM.

  12. #732
    Seriously Judicious Emotivist Eliza Thomason's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by End View Post
    Indeed, true and earnest prayer never fails. However, I don't like to pray for intercession in such a direct and worldly manner. In my eyes, it elevates the political to the realm of the spiritual (A thing Fulton Sheen warned would be a final/ultimate temptation of the Church as we know it).

    The true order is that the political flows from the spiritual. Politics is downwind from culture, but culture is downwind from religion. Therefore, we must all focus upon our own spirituality first and foremost. Would that we could become as saints as Jesus did before he began his ministry, tried by Satan in the desert and not found wanting by his Heavenly Father.

    Kudos for recognizing the Rosary as a "weapon" Catholic Sister. Padre Pio wasn't wrong!
    End, I found this response so troubling when I read it that I couldn't answer it. Now it is the Feast of the Assumption, the day of the beginning of the 54 Day Novena, and even though I am hit with a distasteful bafflement at your words, making me want to avoid any more discussion with you on this, I am writing it. Because I have faith you are more than what you show here.

    God says pray for everything. So, 'not liking to be direct and worldly' - when we LIVE this world, and when you are here writing about it - is NONSENSEICAL!


    So, End, listen here to this prophet - a humble Protestant pastor, who tells us the chaos begins NEXT MONTH! Then it gets WORSE! And it's quite believable when you see the news, which you obviously do! It's 15 minutes, but GRIPPING!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SAZGxTiX6bY

    So End, while God's judgment is not inevitable, we can ask Our Blessed Mother to lighten it! There is DESPERATE NEED! The rosary is our most powerful weapon, and we need her power* now, to once again hold back God's hand of justice.

    Look at the world of unbelievers you are surrounded by! They can't pray/won't pray because they don't see the need, but you have NO EXCUSE - especially not a totally LAME one! They are like starving paupers, and you are the fat rich man standing amidst them, who cannot give the tiniest handout to even one starving person, because you wouldn't "like" to. That is you, withholding the your power of prayer.


    Here is an 11 min. discussion about this novena: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m6Ej...ature=youtu.be

    Here is a useful 20 min. video on how to pray this Novena with JOY: youtube.com/watch?v=S_lEkmWSv6M It is truly inspiring.

    This starts today, but God isn't going to discount a late start. Just don't be late without reason!

    ___________________________

    * Mary is so loved by the Holy Trinity that all she has to do is sigh and they rush to do her bidding. A Saint said that; I forgot which one. Sounds like St. Alphonse Liguori. Or maybe St. Louis de Montfort.
    Last edited by Eliza Thomason; 08-16-2020 at 02:45 AM.
    "A man with a definite belief always appears bizarre, because he does not change with the world; he has climbed into a fixed star, and the earth whizzes below him like a zoetrope."
    ........ G. ........... K. ............... C ........ H ........ E ...... S ........ T ...... E ........ R ........ T ........ O ........ N ........


    "Having a clear faith, based on the creed of the Church, is often labeled today as fundamentalism... Whereas relativism, which is letting oneself be tossed and swept along
    by every wind of teaching, looks like the only
    attitude acceptable to today's standards."
    - Pope Benedict the XVI, "The Dictatorship of Relativism"

    .
    .
    .


  13. #733
    inumbra's Avatar
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    I cannot stand American pastors. I've never met a single one who I didn't think was a liar in the deepest way possible. I do believe in prophetic dreams, but when they are aligned with dogma, it's not something true. It's the mind processing its dogma.

    Were they not liars they wouldn't have used the manipulative tactics they did. They thought people wouldn't notice? They wanted power, and those ppl despite appearing strong in the most superficial way ever are the weakest of us all. They manipulated children, and for that I'm not sure I can forgive them.

    Anyway this may mean I still have work to do. Although I'm at peace with this faith, I'm not at peace with its leaders and influencers. I see myself as weak, so naturally this problem arises for me. If I can forgive myself, then I can forgive others for similar flaws.

    I know the history is burn people at the stake. Has this history been transcended?

    Jesus died for what he believed in. He didn't hurt people. He didn't betray them as lifeforms. It was dogmatic aholes who murdered him.

    Dogma is the enemy of living beings. It feeds itself from the fertilizer of their bones and decay.

    Trying to convert others is wrong. It's sick. And I will have none of it. It's the total perversion of everything Jesus stood for.

    Know that despite the history of persecution, the pagans still exist. They were destroyed but their spirit never died. They had their own belief systems and they were true to life.
    Last edited by inumbra; 08-16-2020 at 01:12 AM.

  14. #734
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    Quote Originally Posted by inumbra View Post
    I cannot stand American pastors. I've never met a single one who I didn't think was a liar in the deepest way possible. I do believe in prophetic dreams, but when they are aligned with dogma, it's not something true. It's the mind processing its dogma.

    Were they not liars they wouldn't have used the manipulative tactics they did. They thought people wouldn't notice? They wanted power, and those ppl despite appearing strong in the most superficial way ever are the weakest of us all. They manipulated children, and for that I'm not sure I can forgive them.

    Anyway this may mean I still have work to do. Although I'm at peace with this faith, I'm not at peace with its leaders and influencers. I see myself as weak, so naturally this problem arises for me. If I can forgive myself, then I can forgive others for similar flaws.

    I know the history is burn people at the stake. Has this history been transcended?

    Jesus died for what he believed in. He didn't hurt people. He didn't betray them as lifeforms. It was dogmatic aholes who murdered him.

    Dogma is the enemy of living beings. It feeds itself from the fertilizer of their bones and decay.

    Trying to convert others is wrong. It's sick. And I will have none of it. It's the total perversion of everything Jesus stood for.

    Know that despite the history of persecution, the pagans still exist. They were destroyed but their spirit never died. They had their own belief systems and they were true to life.
    If you speak of "Televangelists" in regards to "American Pastors" than you're not wrong. They worship Mammon. Case in point, I think it was during Hurricane Katrina that people asked one if they could use their "megachurch" as a relief center. Bastard refused because he feared the joint would get looted. If I were him, I'd just issue witch tests to the biggest, burliest, ought to be a bouncer at a night club dudes I could see. The ones that passed get to guard the valuables and ensure nobody breaks shit for no good reason. There, fears of getting looted/vandalized solved.

    This solution to an actual potential problem never crossed their mind. That or they were/are consummate sinners and, fun fact, sins make you stupid. They darken the intellect along with the soul. Therefore, the more you sin, the dumber you get. Thus, I assert, they do not serve God (save perhaps for the grim prospect of their lives serving as a warning unto others). I do caution against your hatred of "dogma" however. Truth is truth no matter how much we may find it to be distasteful. If a given dogma is "true" than we ought to admit that fact and act accordingly. In this light, attempts to "convert" others isn't wrong. Like I've said may times before, you do actually have a religion. All of us do. Are you confident enough in it to espouse it even upon pain of death? I know I am.

  15. #735
    inumbra's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by End View Post
    If you speak of "Televangelists" in regards to "American Pastors" than you're not wrong. They worship Mammon. Case in point, I think it was during Hurricane Katrina that people asked one if they could use their "megachurch" as a relief center. Bastard refused because he feared the joint would get looted. If I were him, I'd just issue witch tests to the biggest, burliest, ought to be a bouncer at a night club dudes I could see. The ones that passed get to guard the valuables and ensure nobody breaks shit for no good reason. There, fears of getting looted/vandalized solved.

    This solution to an actual potential problem never crossed their mind. Thus, I assert, they do not serve God. I do caution against your hatred of "dogma" however. Truth is truth no matter how much we may find it to be distasteful. If a given dogma is "true" than we ought to admit that fact and act accordingly. In this light, attempts to "convert" others isn't wrong. Like I've said may times before, you do actually have a religion. All of us do. Are you confident enough in it to espouse it even upon pain of death? I know I am.
    I speak to the churches I encountered. I speak to their lies. They can burn in their own conceptions of hell. I will NEVER believe them. They tried to screw me over as a child, and so far I cannot forgive them.

    Every mind virus in my head, I'll consider it, but when I ultimately find it lacking, I am DONE with it. There is another mind virus in my head now. I am considering it, I am taking it unto myself, but know, if it fails my tests, it is over and done with. Assholes rule this world, they always have. And I believe you understand what I'm talking about.

  16. #736
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    Quote Originally Posted by inumbra View Post
    I speak to the churches I encountered. I speak to their lies. They can burn in their own conceptions of hell. I will NEVER believe them. They tried to screw me over as a child, and so far I cannot forgive them.

    Every mind virus in my head, I'll consider it, but when I ultimately find it lacking, I am DONE with it. There is another mind virus in my head now. I am considering it, I am taking it unto myself, but know, if it fails my tests, it is over and done with.
    It sounds like you were abused by the "clergy" of a Christian faith of some sort. If so, I am sorry. It is a sign of the Devil achieving his ends in regards to your sentiments though. Nothing pleases the prince of lies more than when he manages to corrupt the pure and spread hatred of the ultimate truths by doing so. I pray that you will find God in the silence of an earnest prayer.

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    Quote Originally Posted by End View Post
    It sounds like you were abused by the "clergy" of a Christian faith of some sort. If so, I am sorry. It is a sign of the Devil achieving his ends in regards to your sentiments though. Nothing pleases the prince of lies more than when he manages to corrupt the pure and spread hatred of the ultimate truths by doing so. I pray that you will find God in the silence of an earnest prayer.
    God is never found in dogma. Organized religion is always in question. Organized religion often = dogma. it's the force that has betrayed so many ppl, the world over.

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    @Eliza Thomason You do have a point. It is indeed too late to avert the full measure of a "judgement" from on high. We have all collectively sinned too greatly without even a hint of repentance. But, like you said, prayer can still mitigate the judgement. A good reason things have gotten this bad, after all, is because good Catholics have forgotten to keep the rosary and pray it on at least a daily basis.

  19. #739
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    Quote Originally Posted by inumbra View Post
    God is never found in dogma. Organized religion is always in question. Organized religion often = dogma. it's the force that has betrayed so many ppl, the world over.
    God is truth. Full stop. You let your negative experiences cloud your reason. I regret the pain you likely felt as a supposed exemplar/avatar of that truth violated you in a most unholy way. I cannot heal that wound by myself, but I must ask if you even believe that wound can be healed at all. For all sins, all wounds, can be healed if you believe in Christ...

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    Quote Originally Posted by End View Post
    God is truth. Full stop. You let your negative experiences cloud your reason. I regret the pain you likely felt as a supposed exemplar/avatar of that truth violated you in a most unholy way. I cannot heal that wound by myself, but I must ask if you even believe that wound can be healed at all. For all sins, all wounds, can be healed if you believe in Christ...
    you who call people demonically obsessed for not agreeing with you... you expect me to see your points as valid? guess again. i am in extreme opposition to the religiously dogmatic.

  21. #741
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    Quote Originally Posted by inumbra View Post
    you who call people demonically obsessed for not agreeing with you... you expect me to see your points as valid? guess again. i am in extreme opposition to the religiously dogmatic.
    It is a test. I do not ask that you fully agree with me, just that you can even type out the words. I can fake an agreement with any position you propose save for outright and literal blasphemy and/or an endorsement of a blatant moral evil as the good.

    For instance: "Knowledge is the ultimate gift". There, I typed out and posted a literal satanic gospel passage if we get right down to it. Now do likewise and post: "Jesus is the Christ and God has risen him from the dead."

    I'd bet my balls you can't do it. Especially in this modern era of social media. Call my bluff and I post it all over Twitter and Facebook and boy oh boy, you think I hate you? Wait until you get the responses from your supposed "friends" on those platforms. The Death Cult is always most eager to consume their own .

  22. #742
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    And Just Like That

    Everyone went from politics to a discussion of religious practices

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    Firearms sales are at record high.









    Salesman - ENFP Huxley



    Salesman - ESTP Zhukov












    Democrats want new gun control laws.


    Last edited by khcs; 08-16-2020 at 09:36 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by End View Post
    I'd bet my balls you can't do it. Especially in this modern era of social media. Call my bluff and I post it all over Twitter and Facebook and boy oh boy, you think I hate you? Wait until you get the responses from your supposed "friends" on those platforms. The Death Cult is always most eager to consume their own .
    passing your tests is obviously the highest aspiration of humankind

    There are no friends on those platforms

    PS I don't think you hate me and I don't hate you either
    Last edited by inumbra; 08-16-2020 at 11:31 AM.

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    The Statue of Everything and Anything



    Last edited by khcs; 08-16-2020 at 02:09 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by khcs View Post
    And Just Like That

    Everyone went from politics to a discussion of religious practices
    Sad fact is, for most people, politics has become their religion.

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    Religious dogmas (or dogmas in general) are usually Ti/Fe. Especially when paired with Se/Ni.

    Thanks for coming to my TED talk

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    Quote Originally Posted by Duschia View Post
    Religious dogmas (or dogmas in general) are usually Ti/Fe. Especially when paired with Se/Ni.

    Thanks for coming to my TED talk
    When activists and protesters chant in the street... its like watching religious megachurch nutters chanting lmao.

    I gotta wonder tho, do none of them feel the cringe inside?

    If I were in that situation I'd be too embarrassed, would feel like an idiot and leave before the cringe twists my face like a sour lemon.
    Last edited by shotgunfingers; 08-16-2020 at 07:35 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by inumbra View Post
    God is never found in dogma. Organized religion is always in question. Organized religion often = dogma. it's the force that has betrayed so many ppl, the world over.
    The truth of God is found in true dogma. The truth sets you free.

    So what is so great about disorganized religion?
    "A man with a definite belief always appears bizarre, because he does not change with the world; he has climbed into a fixed star, and the earth whizzes below him like a zoetrope."
    ........ G. ........... K. ............... C ........ H ........ E ...... S ........ T ...... E ........ R ........ T ........ O ........ N ........


    "Having a clear faith, based on the creed of the Church, is often labeled today as fundamentalism... Whereas relativism, which is letting oneself be tossed and swept along
    by every wind of teaching, looks like the only
    attitude acceptable to today's standards."
    - Pope Benedict the XVI, "The Dictatorship of Relativism"

    .
    .
    .


  30. #750
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    Quote Originally Posted by shotgunfingers View Post
    When activists and protesters chant in the street... its like watching religious megachurch nutters chanting lmao.

    I gotta wonder tho, do none of them feel the cringe inside?

    If I were in that situation I'd be too embarrassed, would feel like an idiot and leave before the cringe twists my face like a sour lemon.
    It's easy to compare most any idea that has a devout following to a church.

    MBTI is a church.

    Socionics is a church.

    Atheism is a church.

    People who are in Facebook groups and odd subreddits? Churches.

    Churches everywhere.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Nymphaeales View Post
    It's easy to compare most any idea that has a devout following to a church.

    MBTI is a church.

    Socionics is a church.

    Atheism is a church.

    People who are in Facebook groups and odd subreddits? Churches.

    Churches everywhere.
    People form groups all the time, based on different ideas, and for different reasons. But there is a difference between groups that are based on faith and those based on evidence.

    Unfortunately, Socionics is still mostly in the Faith-based camp. There is a lot of anecdotal evidence for its veracity, but no externally verifiable proof.

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    I've been thinking about what a second Trump term may look like. Predictions about the future are mostly useless, but I think it's fair to argue that Republicans will continue to focus on mass privatizations and tax cuts for corporations.

    A Trump presidency may in fact give a giant boost to the corporate left, with companies like Google swooping in to buy highways and entire public works.

    With liberal corporate power further consolidated, neoliberalism could become the permanent ideology of the Democratic party, and 'woke' culture could become the natural culture of the United States as a whole. Corporate elites are woke because it's so easy—they can look progressive and pat themselves on the back without actually having to change the system.



    Whatever the case turns out to be, it's not clear that a second Trump presidency will be a decisive victory for right wing populism.
    Last edited by xerxe; 08-17-2020 at 03:47 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pyre View Post
    It's easy to compare most any idea that has a devout following to a church.

    MBTI is a church.

    Socionics is a church.

    Atheism is a church.

    People who are in Facebook groups and odd subreddits? Churches.

    Churches everywhere.
    MBTI & Socionics you don't need to believe in, nor socially participate in the group. These are just abstract logical models for something that is visible IRL. Tools for personal guidance. Their ambiguity does bother me a lot tho, I don't think I'm interested in the community aspect.

    Atheism is mere non belief. Asserting that there is no God or Gods is not something real atheists do. Gathering in atheist groups is BS as well. There is no church for the skeptics. Militant atheists just don't get it imo. Atheists are not a community.

    I wouldn't know about Facebook as I deleted mine a decade ago & I don't use reddit.

    I mainly meant publicly expressing it tho, to manifest the feelings publicly or to other ppl.. To me it would be very awkward, would feel cringe and I would never do it. Its why I find that I can't act as well. To be part of a group and chant like that is not something I'd ever do, in church or otherwise even if I held beliefs or feelings related to it.. not even then. Those things are private and will stay so.

    I'm more of a lone wolf anyway and groups are not my thing.


    I mainly express feelings and values by contributing through work and effort to the cause or to the group or the person I care for or through argumentation, but when I feel something for someone, argumentation is never a good way to express it.

    Quote Originally Posted by xerxe View Post
    I've been thinking about what a second Trump term may look like. Predictions about the future are mostly useless, but I think it's fair to argue that Republicans will continue to focus on mass privatizations and tax cuts for corporations.

    A Trump presidency may in fact give a giant boost to the corporate left, with companies like Google swooping in to buy highways and entire public works.

    With liberal corporate power further consolidated, neoliberalism could become the permanent ideology of the Democratic party, and 'woke' culture could become the natural culture of the United States as a whole. Corporate elites are woke because it's so easy—they can look progressive and pat themselves on the back without actually having to change the system.



    Whatever the case turns out to be, it's not clear that a second Trump presidency will be a decisive victory for right wing populism.
    Lets hope he doesn't win, but the democrat option is really bad as well. Imo you guys are doomed..for now.
    Last edited by shotgunfingers; 08-17-2020 at 04:14 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by shotgunfingers View Post
    Lets hope he doesn't win, but the democrat option is really bad as well. Imo you guys are doomed..for now.

    The new generations coming up seem to have different ideas from the baby boomers. Someday we'll know whether that congeals into movements capable of taking over their respective political parties.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eliza Thomason View Post
    The truth of God is found in true dogma. The truth sets you free.
    How does it compare to IEEs intense dislike for 100% set judgement, (dogma not derived from actual Te) based organizations, and bits like 'their creativity sees nothing as predetermined' (see: Filatova)? IEEs also don't recognize formal subordination and 'see no piety towards authorities' (whether religious or not; see again Filatova on IEEs).

    More:
    'Opponents of formulaic approaches and discipline' (Meged and Ovcharov)

    'They like to combine multiple things and ideas, rather than follow one thing to a logical conclusion' (Wiki composite)

    'IEEs are skittish about any sort of long-term membership in relationships, groups, or organizations which would imply certain duties and limitations on their freedom. They worry about being trapped in binding relationships where there are rules and demands on them that — in their opinion — would squelch their impulsive, freedom-loving search for new and interesting things and people to experience. They can overreact even to minor rules that don't affect them — just as a matter of principle.' (Wiki composite)

    'They don't like to think about what others or "the system" might expect from them. They avoid clearly defining relationships, responsibilities, expectations, etc. and frequently feel threatened and overly rebellious when other people try to establish bounds and limitations that would affect them personally.' (Wiki composite)

    'IEEs' avoidance of commitment and general air of uncertainty and unpredictability can grate on some people — especially those who are trying to organize people for some joint task and need participants to follow certain conventions and behave predictably and obediently.' (Wiki composite)

    'IEE is unable to work effectively within a rigid system that imposes too many restrictions.' (Gulenko)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    People form groups all the time, based on different ideas, and for different reasons. But there is a difference between groups that are based on faith and those based on evidence.

    Unfortunately, Socionics is still mostly in the Faith-based camp. There is a lot of anecdotal evidence for its veracity, but no externally verifiable proof.
    Sorry, I clonked/passed out since I had an incredibly busy day.

    I agree with your post entirely, but I think we are looking at these from two largely different perspectives.

    What I was aiming at with my post, even if it admittedly wasn't well structured to get my point across, was that people get attached to systems that are based on data and theories, ideologies/theories/philosophies, sub-groups and sub-cultures whether they're located online or in the real world, really most anything. Even if these things aren't meant to be faith-based or spiritually-based, people will treat them in a similar manner to churches since certain people will begin to put their faith in them, even if this faith is not spiritually based and more based on hope and belief.

    I was really just criticizing SGF's comparison as lazy, and at the same time being a cheap insult. While I'm not religious myself, there are plenty of religious people who are lovely and who actively aid others regardless of the other's background. I've seen it happen personally and I've talked/linked about it on this forum.

    (Old news, but here it is from her perspective. Worth the read imo.)


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    Quote Originally Posted by shotgunfingers View Post
    MBTI & Socionics you don't need to believe in, nor socially participate in the group. These are just abstract logical models for something that is visible IRL. Tools for personal guidance. Their ambiguity does bother me a lot tho, I don't think I'm interested in the community aspect.

    Atheism is mere non belief. Asserting that there is no God or Gods is not something real atheists do. Gathering in atheist groups is BS as well. There is no church for the skeptics. Militant atheists just don't get it imo. Atheists are not a community.

    I wouldn't know about Facebook as I deleted mine a decade ago & I don't use reddit.

    I mainly meant publicly expressing it tho, to manifest the feelings publicly or to other ppl.. To me it would be very awkward, would feel cringe and I would never do it. Its why I find that I can't act as well. To be part of a group and chant like that is not something I'd ever do, in church or otherwise even if I held beliefs or feelings related to it.. not even then. Those things are private and will stay so.

    I'm more of a lone wolf anyway and groups are not my thing.


    I mainly express feelings and values by contributing through work and effort to the cause or to the group or the person I care for or through argumentation, but when I feel something for someone, argumentation is never a good way to express it.
    Socionics is not very ambiguous and is a pretty strict model. MBTI on the other hand has grown to be pretty vague.

    Atheism is a belief that there is no higher spiritual being, but people still defend it to their last breath. People can believe in it, treat it however they like, and that still makes them an atheist. "Atheists are not a community" there is a community for everything but not always in the way you seem to think.

    I don't use or have either sites but I'm saying that social media can host communities of sorts. An example being on this very site.

    Your final point is subjective but not very counter-cultural imo and almost sounds compliant. People not really willing to take a stand. People who go to protests are not always outwardly passionate, but they usually do need to have a lot of energy.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Pyre View Post
    Socionics is not very ambiguous and is a pretty strict model. MBTI on the other hand has grown to be pretty vague.

    Atheism is a belief that there is no higher spiritual being, but people still defend it to their last breath. People can believe in it, treat it however they like, and that still makes them an atheist. "Atheists are not a community" there is a community for everything but not always in the way you seem to think.

    I don't use or have either sites but I'm saying that social media can host communities of sorts. An example being on this very site.

    Your final point is subjective but not very counter-cultural imo and almost sounds compliant. People not really willing to take a stand. People who go to protests are not always outwardly passionate, but they usually do need to have a lot of energy.
    When 10 ppl can disagree wildly on the same individual's type without a way to form an accurate and valid assessment.. I consider that vague.

    Atheism is not a belief, its the lack of it. There is no doctrine, no gospel, no church, no belief or values only "I don't know.. Where is the evidence for your unicorn?" It is hollow & nihilistic. Source: https://www.atheists.org/activism/re...about-atheism/ To be united by skepticism is a fickle alliance at best, one not even worth entertaining.

    Yeah, this is a community of sorts.

    Idk, I can't even express my feelings to my own mother really and I don't view feelings as a weakness or some drivel like that (on the contrary). One time I almost burst into tears in front of her, so I clenched my teeth, walked to the bathroom and cried alone. Public displays of affection I'd avoid.. they are kinda cringe imo. It is subjective, yeah. Its weird imo when ppl do that, but ofc. for many others it is totally normal group behavior I guess. >.> chanting, yelling or outright emotional drama "fighting" is O.O worse.. I avoid that like the plague.

    Last edited by shotgunfingers; 08-17-2020 at 11:06 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by shotgunfingers View Post
    When 10 ppl can disagree wildly on the same individual's type without a way to form an accurate and valid assessment.. I consider that vague.

    Atheism is not a belief, its the lack of it. There is no doctrine, no gospel, no church, no belief or values only "I don't know.. Where is the evidence for your unicorn?" It is hollow & nihilistic. Source: https://www.atheists.org/activism/re...about-atheism/ To be united by skepticism is a fickle alliance at best, one not even worth entertaining.

    Yeah, this is a community of sorts.

    Idk, I can't even express my feelings to my own mother really and I don't view feelings as a weakness or some drivel like that (on the contrary). One time I almost burst into tears in front of her, so I clenched my teeth, walked to the bathroom and cried alone. Public displays of affection I'd avoid.. they are kinda cringe imo. It is subjective, yeah. Its weird imo when ppl do that, but ofc. for many others it is totally normal.
    Wow, 10 people. I've only been here for really 4 months maybe, but I've never seen 10 individuals wildly disagree that much on one single person's type. That would be insane. At most I've seen people propose 3-4 types for an individual, and the variables usually include that the individual doesn't know themselves very well, they're putting on a mask in all of their posts due to various reasons, so on. But Socionics is a very strict theory even if there are accents to it, and is certainly not nearly as scattered as MBTI.

    Atheism is certainly a belief but it's not a belief system. That is where your argument falls apart even in the link you share. That link is quite pushy and odd, and they are acting as if they're the standard for atheism.



    There's no unicorn in religion (except maybe mentioned once in some versions of the bible iirc, lycanthropy certainly happened in the bible fwiw you lone wolf) so I've no idea what you're on about.

    I don't understand the place of your final point. Yeah, emotional displays and the way people react to them are subjective. I don't think anyone likes ostentatious and obnoxious emotional displays.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Pyre View Post
    Wow, 10 people. I've only been here for really 4 months maybe, but I've never seen 10 individuals wildly disagree that much on one single person's type. That would be insane. At most I've seen people propose 3-4 types for an individual, and the variables usually include that the individual doesn't know themselves very well, they're putting on a mask in all of their posts due to various reasons, so on. But Socionics is a very strict theory even if there are accents to it, and is certainly not nearly as scattered as MBTI.
    It was a random example. We have no surefire way to establish anyone's type with certainty and accuracy.

    Atheism is certainly a belief but it's not a belief system. That is where your argument falls apart even in the link you share. That link is quite pushy and odd, and they are acting as if they're the standard for atheism.
    As I said its not a belief. That is the definition of atheism.
    Belief is a leap of faith.. atheists have no faith ^^', they take no leap of faith. Its just skepticism.
    Its why they say the burden of proof is on theists.

    Yeah, this is true. its why I always say "Tragically I am an atheist." Atheism sucks. A lot of ppl who are atheists suck imo, example Steve Shives or Dawkins himself. It all makes me depressed tbh.

    There's no unicorn in religion (except maybe mentioned once in some versions of the bible iirc, lycanthropy certainly happened in the bible fwiw you lone wolf) so I've no idea what you're on about.
    I used it as a substitute for God ie. Theists assert x God exists, therefore they have to prove it, otherwise its like saying magic leprechauns exist.

    I don't understand the place of your final point. Yeah, emotional displays and the way people react to them are subjective. I don't think anyone likes ostentatious and obnoxious emotional displays.
    So why do they keep doing them?
    Imo I'm just whining about stuff, but you responded, so.

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