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Thread: IKON and BTS

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    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    I remember him from WIN, but that's all. Also his controversy,is he good? I tried stanning GOT7 for Jackson but I just hate their songs. Actually I can't remember the last time JYP did good to his male artists.

    Nothing against youngsters at all, it's just that people are always making fun of me because of it, well guys really. He pat my head and laughed so I was like I feel that must be why people always tell me I'm "cute" when I'm mad. At least until they realize I really mean it.

    How am I hilarious? I keep hearing it but I have no clue. I always talk like that, is it really funny?
    Good in what way? Bambam is some ESE type, he'll get over it. Their songs are old-school, that's their good point. GIRLS GIRLS GIRLS THEY LUV ME

    You know what I noticed? JYP as a person is cool, but as an executive, he is mediocre. With SM and YG, it's the other way around. Props to Bang PD for being a decent person and BTS' s clever boss.

    Patting the head is like, a no go in eastern cultures. And condescending in general, no matter where. Telling an angry person they are cute sounds manipulative

    It IS funny, and I experience the same phenomenon as well? I'm not a native speaker so I blame my basic set of German grammar trying to sound English. You had a bunch of funny expressions in your writing style so far I guess that when people try to be hilarious on purpose, they fail, but their natural selves are comedic enough, it applies to you well.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    I remember he danced very well back then, what is he good at now? You said he was legendary.

    Oh really? Because it was worded wrong or?


    I got my physical copy of Wings today. I'm very tempted to buy the other versions, what did Bangtan do to me? I only ever buy my bias version when there are several.
    Ah, that's what you meant. He's good at dabbing. He practically invented it.

    Worded in a very extra way, it sounded less colloquial than your usual self so it stood out to me

    What they do to you... taking your soul and cash... and giving you good music for it No seriously, awesome! Our babies should win the Daesang at MAMA so you contributed, did you vote already? Super important.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    Ah dabbing, now I remember I saw girls asking him to do it on the streets in LA.I can't believe that the face that comes up when I read that word is Suho!

    I voted for everyone I thought deserved it, had to use all my accounts and make my friends vote for them too
    Suho? Where? How? What?

    Thumbs up for so much effort!! Which other artists did you vote for?

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    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    Here:


    BTS, EXO, Taeyeon, GFriend, Beast, Pentagon& MOBB(out of loyalty).
    Hkdngdjnskl... how could I forget that. I'm still into that Kaisoo moment at the beginning, like woah, your choreographer knows what's up. Jungkook dabbed so hard at KCon that Jin had to collect him. No doubt that Jungkook is SLI :')



    Some fans would come for your neck, EXO and BTS! That's fair. Yes, MOBB has my vote as well. And HyunA. I gave my support star to BTS, idk what for, I couldn't figure that out.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    Oh yeah, they know I'm pissing myself, was he serious?!? But what's the connection between dabbing excessively and being a SLI?

    I can't choose, both were not only great in music, dance and aesthetics, but brought the theories too. Love Hyuna but her release this year was a no no. Oh it's stupid, like the roses in 2014
    Mhhmm try the rainbow, taste the rainbow. They also ship Suho and money, I'm a fan. SLIs are not capable of properly assessing the emotional atmosphere aka Fe, and their primary way of functioning is Si = subjective bodily experience. That was a condensed version

    The theories were a highlight indeed. Jimin went all Adam on that apple(s), I'm still so shook, like--- stay in your lane, director. For real, getting that sophisticated touch made the MVs more interesting than: "Let's show their faces upclose and a room that looks like the inside of a toaster haha". Seeing EXO outside their cube was liberating I voted out of loyalty as well, Roll Deep is still my classic. Next time, there should be oreos for the voting. Also, what was that hotel prize all about? That wasn't there last year.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    Sumoney making it rain was a Lotto highlight

    So leading Si makes one lose himself in the moment. Like with Hanbin.

    You mean this?



    I love that song, but the video...not so much. This is my fave Hyuna concept:


    Fandom power, which is redundant since everyone knows that's what decides the winners of most categories anyway. Unless the label manages to piss Mnet off somehow, then we have an EXO/BIG BANG situation.

    Hnggh I love the gif. Also an awe$ome conc€pt (Suho looking expensive as usual):



    Oh god... Jimin makes me love fruits and vegetables it's incredible.

    Si is not the moment but how the body relates to it. Lost in the moment for real is Se, and SX.

    My favourite Hyuna concept (I want the un-photoshopped version so bad), that gazes makes me question my existence:



    Plot twist: SHINee's back!
    I'm still proud of G-Dragon's MAMA diss rap from last year, he basically said everything that had to be stated about Mnet.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    I love how they genuinely look like they've just been synthetically modified somehow, they look so plastic and creepy.

    Ok, please elaborate on the difference

    Speaking about functions, what is your take on visual identification? Not by pictures, but natural video evidence? Because I watched a whole lot of the videos on the celebrity examples page. Like I commented on your blog, I personally assimilate things faster and more deeply if I am seeing it, not just reading descriptions, specially when there's so much discordance in the threads about what makes Ne what it is, per example.


    Great video, pity the song was poorly written.

    Can't hate on Mnet if that's the case. It's the first time since Sherlock that I've bought a SHINee album, it's insanely good. All these years I just enjoyed their Japanese releases and live concerts for the album tracks. Glad to know SM still can do them justice.
    Yes, it's always astounding what kind of visuals you can create with makeup and filters etc, EXO have been coming up with awesome stuff recently.

    Si is a state of relaxation, inside. Se is a state of proactive seizing, on the outside. Compare Bobby (Se) with Jungkook (Si) and how they deal with situations. The energy is completely different direction and territory-wise.
    Jungkook is just in his bubble and Bobby, well you know him. Si -> internal comfort versus Se-> external force. Si people can sleep all day, Se people have to occupy themselves.
    The examples page is not authoritative, a lot of typings are wrong according to several experienced typers on here. I know, V.I can be useful when you have a proper benchmark... there are some V.I threads and the filatova portraits, that's where you could gather information.

    Hm... give an example of a well-written song?

    Lmao Sherlock is stuck in my head, and all these memes Mnet and SM are doing a fairly decent job actually, given that they have been around for so many years and influence the game so much. SHINee got me hypnotized with this:


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    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    Here's where it can get confusing: both BOBBY and Jungkook have very "harmonious" Socionics and Enneagram types/stacking (the energies of all their types match), so everything they are is intensified because SEE+7w8+sx/so will be super charged and extroverted per example. But how does one who has a non obvious/expected combo know what traits are due to what factor? I always question this because based on my tritype if I were a SEE like the examples we discussed, shouldn't I be at least as energetic and extroverted as them, or even more by having all the aggressive types?

    I've seen the Filatova portraits many times, but thing is the title is misleading since she didn't use visual identification in typings herself. I asked about the videos because I felt a strong identification to a couple people's deamour, choice of vocabulary and speech patterns, but they were not from the same type, in fact the two people I most related to were from a type I just can't be.


    Soy un Dorito!


    These are great recent examples in different styles
    That's how I like my SHINee too, making full use of their vocal potential and dressing like themselves, not Tumblr hipsters
    First things first, you have to be typed correctly. Someone whose stackings etc don't align is usually mistyped. Discerning someone's sociotype when they have a murky combination... uhh that's tough but you still have to differentiate between what information elements (information metabolism) do VS what enneagram + stacking does (motivations).

    Ohh... interesting, which types were they? Please link them, I'll take a look.

    Those are excellent examples, what I wanna add is:



    Stop bashing tumblr and do it better SHINee's funny new 90ies style has me in awe, idk what it is but this group is just perfect.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    I don't know what you mean by stackings not aligning, but the second half of that paragraph is precisely what I meant. What 've seen here again and again in every quadra subforum is people categorically saying things like "You can't possibly be an IEI and an 8, you must be a mistyped 1!" which to me is ridiculous. I didn't subscribed to this attempts at oversimplification while I still was a MBTI believer, and I don't see why I would now. But that differentiation you speak of, between motivation/interests and how you process information is murky at best in most articles I've read so far.

    That's why I say that observing actual examples of people from certain types is to me the best way to identify the core of them. When I watch these videos with interviews or other types of conversation, I can observe the thought process of let's say, an ILI. If I were just to read a description of how this type's mind work, I wouldn't have any actual idea of how this essence manifests itself.

    I need to see how this type thinks by noticing how they interpret a question, how they formulate a sentence, what kind of information they include and what they leave out, will they expand on the subject on their own accord or do they have to be propelled to etc. When I have a chance to just observe people their type usually just pops up, the thing is if I knew anyone in my circle who actually thought in a way similar to mine, I could make a comparison. But my friends and colleagues, while sharing the same passions and several values, seem to think in different way, hence how even after years we still manage to surprise each other with our thought processes.
    Sure it's murky because these theories and articles and so on lack consensus. My exact thoughts, so I recommend that you read up the type's speaking styles on Wikisocion. Passionate, business-like, sincere, cold-blooded. And speaking patterns, don't know where they are but they go like, dichotomic-algorithmic and so on. Another exercise you could do, checking out the forum member's typing questionnaires (a new one is in progress btw). And about your friends, well you could ask them for a text sample, I recently typed Joy's instinct stacking through a letter of hers. Sounds good?


    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    I shall clarify that with the exception of the Malcom X video (I'm aware I sound exactly like him whenever I'm talking about a cause I'm passionate about), it's all in what they say, not the mannerisms etc.

    "Run" is in their top 5 best songs, technically speaking, but it's not so recent, which is why I didn't include it. But to be fair I could easily make a top 5 example of good song writing just out of their very best compositions.

    Gee you're so sensitive! Who knew LIE were that way. I shall keep my mouth shut from now on, least I offend any of your favorite things/people again. And I've been on Tumblr for five years so yeah, not a hater.
    Hm... those were very different impressions. In general, they seem to point towards and intuitive type though. Did you figure it out?
    Ahh and well, 4-wing problems. Think G-Dragon (3w4), you have to deal with the sass sometimes.



    Or should I send Jonghyun for singing "미안해" to you? Another well-composed song, actually. What are your Top 5 of BTS, then? For me, it's 1. Jump 2. Let me know 3. Baepsae 4. Satoori Rap 5. Fire. Mostly the upbeat songs, let me know is only in there for Suga's composition and Jimin's high note.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    YES, I DID!!!


    But neither of you are sassy? At least not to me. Reactive, yes.

    In terms of exclusively personal taste? My iPod says: 1. Blood, Sweat & Tears 2.I Need U 3.Am I Wrong 4.Dope 5.Ma City. I only included the most played group ones though, the picture would be different if I included the solos.
    Ahh, FeNi for you. The MBTI weirdos weren't too wrong, then Let's be Si PoLR together. What was the determining element, and which description did you use?

    GD, not sassy? Explain.

    Yes, personal taste. What would be your fav solo, then?

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    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    Actually, I already knew it but was in denial for the past two years But one of my strengths is being able to admit when I'm wrong without feeling diminished. So next time that lady is in town, I'll send her tangerines

    The defining element was Ni in a prominent position. It just didn't fit at all for me to be any type that didn't put a lot of thought into their actions due to concerns about future implications of decisions. Also the constant insights that "come out of nowhere", which I now see it's the reason I've been jokingly referred as a seer or a "witch". That's why none of the Se types fit past the superficial traits, because they are all much more impulsive, and while I am very impatient, I sure don't leap before looking and seeing what's in it for me, for example. I value Ni so much that for two years and a half I was highly active on a forum as an INTJ I even was a mod for a while), and no one ever questioned my type It was the Fe I had huge problems with accepting, because I didn't understand it, so I rejected it.

    I’m also not Ni seeking, because why would I seek something I already have myself? Hence the Se+Fi fatal attraction. It’s precisely their uninhibited and enthusiastic attitude in showing affection and seeking proximity with their objects of interest that pleases me, because it feeds my emotional needs. In the end when I managed to look past the eeky title, I am a “victim” type after all. This is the history of my relationships:

    But seeking Se and Fi is something only Gamma NTs do, Se and Ti are the functions you should watch out for. Or did you mean that you were attracted to the wrong kind of people that didn't match you? I can relate to the sudden insights, but that's also the Ne demonstrative. Uhh MBTI redundancy. But okay, you had to get into MBTI first before getting here. What's not surprising, EIE is the actor archetype. You could probably pull of an LSE facade if you set your passion to it, so you as an INTJ, well it has been convincing so you played your role well. Fe is very skilled at this. Now, did you encounter an LSI of some sort yet? What types are your parents?


    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    The apparently super strong Se is due to my Enneagram. 8’s want control, 7 want stimulation, 3’s want success, sx/sp is occupied with the self, it makes for an aggressive and volatile individual, one who doesn't lack in initiative in matters that are important to them. This is all a short version of it, but there are several other reasons, so hit me if you want to know them.

    GD is a kitten. He can scratch if he really needs it, but he'll soon feel bad and show he's sorry. He is certainly cheeky, but that's hardly the same as being sassy. But I guess it's because my definition of being sassy is when a person really means what they say, not when they do it in a joke manner. Naturally sassy people aren't afraid of saying things aloud like he is, Jiyong as a person is really meek.

    These are works of art and drugs at the same time:

    (Yes I am cheating by counting the whole album as one )

    Honorable mention:

    Jin is an inexplicable case, really. Big Hit, what are you (not) doing?! Let me man SING!
    Enneagram. 8’s want control, 7 want stimulation, 3’s want success - the unhealthy ones Healthy 8 integrates 2's kind focus on others, 7 integrates 5's erudite reclusion, 3 integrates the 6's adaptation to the peer group. Nah, it makes more sense now although you are more of a 7 than an 8, 8s are hard to mess with but I'm here teasing you for 7's entertainment and it works Tell me what you think. Did you read up the enneagram childhood scenarios for confirmation?

    Hm... well you are both EIE so you understand him better than I, meek I don't see although Jiyong is SO/SX... I'll ponder that.

    I still pity Jin, he got one line in BST. That's unfair like, I can't understand the entrepreneurial logic behind that. He has so many fans why don't they give him parts.

    Favs, the less upbeat ones, more on the Fi side:

    (selected the 3D version for this one, it's 2x better)






    Groovy:


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    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    It's clear you and I mean different things when saying "seeking". You are using it within the concept of duals (which I've already said I'm not sold on in the way they are implied), I'm using it meaning what attracts me in people I find entertaining. And by the way, SEEs match EIEs very well in work and friendship, ergo Baekhyun/Chanyeol and BOBBY/Jinhwan. The problem arises when trying to turn that into romance. I've never felt even the most remote attraction towards SLEs or LSIs in any way (in fact, I can't stand for longer periods), so that's why I can't take the hole dual thing so seriously. I know it's said we tend to not notice or give our duals the time of the day because "nature played a trick on us", but to me that sounds utterly ridiculous, not to mention super convenient to fit the theory. Also, if I were to try and find my type by looking at who works really well with me, I'd have to be a LIE, since ESIs and I are like magnets. Is like no matter how unlikely we are to interact at first in a setting, they always manage to find me, and we work on an almost telepathic manner.

    My mom is an IEI-Ne who drives me insane and whom I love dearly, my dad is a PIG, enough said. .
    Now that's an interesting phenomenon. You certainly aren't Te-dominant so that's astounding, ESIs sticking to you. EIE/ESI is an illusionary intertype relationship and usually draws energy, cooperation is difficult although attraction is there. You sure those aren't LSIs? Fi and Ti are harder to distinguish than the extraverted functions, take us two for example. You are operating in an emotional and social, artistic realm (NF) while I juggle with the facts, theories, understanding (NT). NFs are drawn to how STs make sense of the concrete world and impact it, NTs are drawn to the practical SF people-people.

    On the nature played a trick thing, of course you don't notice your dual well, let me be shady, you're relatively new to socionics It's not convenient but true, except that they did not count in other factors of attraction, of which there are plenty.

    PIG is the 17th Socionics type, then, Eta Quadra of villains. PIG-Pe (Extraverted Patronizing/Patriarchy) or PIG-Di (Introverted Douchebaggery) subtype?

    And oh, Baekhyun as SEE and not SLE? Elaborate. I already have my own explanation but let me hear you out on that. (Might even change the type in the OP for accuracy)


    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    You will probably never see him as meek, because his 3w4 shines through when he is in leader mode, he is certainly artistically very bold, uses social media in a provocative and sometimes confrontational manner and puts up an unaffected and aloof mode when feels vulnerable. It's Kwon Jiyong the man behind all that, the one he only allows himself to be around the very few he trusts that is not only incredibly generous, gentle and affectionate, but also meek. Because like some other examples we've discussed before, he is weak for love. I know many people who were surprised when that message exchange between him and YG was posted but really, anyone who has followed his interactions with close people offstage saw it coming. He can tease WINNER and iKON as groups because of the seniority thing, but compare his individuals interaction with Jinwoo and Hanbin for example, and see his reaction when the later freezes him out.



    I haven’t given a though to what these are in terms of functions, but these are my “mellow” Bangtan jams so far

    And also the ballad mix of Run.
    True, the tough and cold image is a compensation when he is challenged, #toxicmasculinity. Well, EIEs are Hamlets so the melodrama runs high, Jiyong is no special case here. You have a point with him messaging YG and his mentoring of IKON, showing his good will is of utmost importance. He can also be overly polite and respectful, see 90° angle bowing, how fantastic is that.

    As for the mellow compilation, Dead Leaves is holy. House of Cards, too.
    Coffee is a good slow jam, Bangtan covering something is just superb idk why


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    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    I don't see how I could mistake an ESI for an LSI when I see them as being oil and water, but if that's the case, then every typing I did on this website, particularly the ESI ones would be wrong. In that case I'll delete my account and move on from Socionics, throwing the towel due to incompetence. There's a big difference from "It doesn't feel right" to "It doesn't make sense" to me, so I honestly don't see why it'd be so hard to tell the two types apart just because they have an introverted leading function. They both can look harsh while being yielding inside though, in this they are alike.

    Never ever have I found an ST worth knowing, and I mean no shade, I'm just stating my truth. I don't think they like me much either. I don't like their attitude toward others in particular, it pisses me off. I also believe it might be linked to me being an 8, it's like having two alphas in a pack, it just won't work. As for LSIs they are just too tightly wound and stand offish (not to mention annoyingly rigid and "old minded") , which while not offending me, doesn't attract or suit me in any way. I don't approach people, they approach me, so I don't see a friendship in the future based on their attitude.

    What about ESEs, whom I either kinda like from a great distance, or wish could move to another galaxy? We're supposed to be kindred types, but I (just to be clear that it's just based on my personal experiences)find them so extra, and not very bright.
    I jokingly wanted to leave socionics when Kanye was typed SEE, I thought he was my dual As usual, everything turned out to be different. Also, case in point for your rant. Hmm fair enough, but what I sense is that most STs are pretty much on the SP + SO enneagram 1/8 axis while what you appreciate is more submissive while open to you as a person SP/SX style? I recommend the Imago thread by SisOfNight.

    ESEs are super extra, no doubt.
    What do you mean by saying "I don't approach people, they approach me" in that context?


    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    I'm new to the forum, I've been into Socionics for four years so yeah, it's not shady but incorrect. I admittedly was never so deep into this theory compared to MBTI to the point where I can recite Jung by heart, but not a total newbie. What I see in every freaking subforum here is people questioning their types based on their relationships. Like being in the same quadra or being someone's dual were a requirement in order to love someone and get along with them, which is nuts. Humans are not ideas (in spite of what Ne types might think of them as), so real life defies theory all the time.

    PIG-Di, definitely.
    Ohh I apologize! Should've said that to me earlier, I am THE assumption lord. Anything else that I have to know because it's crucial? o.O
    And well, most deductive theories (not the inductive ones) are rooted in observations of reality so it's natural to re-apply them because humans are so set on figuring their relationships out. And you're Fi-ignoring so...


    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    Show me his high Ti usage. I beg you. Show me examples of him demonstrating logical application to his decisions, that he checks if his actions and reactions make sense, instead of showing clear discomfort every single time he does or says something he doesn't really mean, even after four years in the spotlight. Show me his self sufficiency in the personal realm and his aggression (not concealed reactive anger) off stage. Show me examples that make a case for him being steady and sustained in his approach, not to mention being able to successfully hide his feelings and power through when hurt. Prove he prefers Fe when it' precisely his incapability of reading others outwards emotions and properly correcting himself that got him into trouble again and again. I could go on and write a novel on why he isn't a logical type or a Fe valuing one, but this isn't the time for it. I actually thought of him as an IEE from debut until I joined the forum in my lurking phase, then I got into Bangtan and compared him to Taehyun.



    I used to be melodramatic as a kid, but now no one uses anything above "intense" to describe me, so I don't know. I hate Hamlet! The only Shakespeare work I dislike along with Midnight's Summer Dream. Macbeth and King Lear rock.

    This is why I love Namjoon

    By the way, this is not a confrontation, it's at most, a debate. Have to say this least it comes off as if I'm fighting you


    If you have a case for me being another type, please post it in detail, my mind is open. Since you were right about the instincts thing, I value your input.
    I prefer him rapping over singing, can't pinpoint why. Maybe I cannot get used to it since his album is stuck in my brain.

    You're still melodramatic, look at your paragraph of Baekhyun's description. So no objections about EIE so far hehe.
    As for Willy Shakes... I loved As You Like It a lot.

    So, I researched more about BBH and read this sentence in an interview, SEE indeed:

    "Was it not because of your unique sociability?
    I orginally have the kind of character that is not afraid of strangers. Even if someone gives of the vibe that they do not like me, I would still be friendly towards them. And I will like anyone who has basic manners. You seem to receive love in particular when you greet your sunbaenims well."

    Fi over Ti creative. I'll change the OP in the EXO thread! Other typings that I should correct? You have a good feel for figuring out types.

    Psst we're not Si types, debate is always very productive.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    Sp/Sx? Never. I like Sx/Sp best (because of the breaking thing), then Sx/So.

    Exactly what I've said: I never starts interactions unless it's a need, but I'm very responsive if people start a conversation with me. So i'm not going to be the one bringing a LSI out of their shell, I only do this when I perceive the wallflower person to be in need of my help.

    Yes, you assume too much. But the only way to actually see it's to reset your eyes every time you look at something new. You might wanna remember that.

    I have no idea who you're talking about with the rapping thing.

    Chen> ILE-Ne
    Tao> SEI-Fi
    Xiumin> SLI-Te
    Kris> ESI-Se
    Lu Han- EIE-Fe
    Lay- ESI-Fi
    Breaking thing?
    Ah, now I get it. well that is Ni-ego specific I think.
    Mhm I'm trying :/

    Well I talked about Namjoon!

    Xiumin as SLI is perfect, can you explain Lay's typing? I always thought EII would make more sense, Ni demonstrative over Si demo.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    People who keep up a charade, usually pretending to be cold and rational, when in reality they are the opposite. I don't feel like doing this on purpose (too much work, I'm lazy), but whenever one of these cases comes up and I realize my presence affects them...there's a lot of pleasure to be obtained from watching them "break" piece by piece by doing nothing except breathing the same air. There is a reason why Let Out the Beast is my XOXO jam

    Oh, the cover! I'm not a fan of his singing either (GD and BOBBY are the only rappers who can sing imo), but I love his choice of song. That was the first time I ever paid attention to him or anyone from BTS. I saw the may LGBT references he made by recommending songs, books and films on the subject and I thought he was so brave. That was the reason I gave BTS a chance and watched I Need U for the first time. The rest is history

    Lay's whole existence is Si demonstrative, specially his first two years as an idol. Like, his whole fandom persona (Unicorn Lay) comes from the inumerous video and photo evidence of him being the embodiment of these functions. But I don't know how much you know him either. So it's me who must ask: why Ni demonstrative? Show me where you see it and we shall discuss.
    I get the allure of "breaking", SX/SP has a lot of layers to peel off. There's a hidden beast as well so you got that right Other things you noticed about the stacking?

    My preference goes towards SO/SX because they are open, very inclusive people. Most people of that stacking I encountered were pretty socially careful characters, I can provide the opposite so it matches. In their case it's not about breaking but building up, I experience a similar unintentional effect on them. They become more straightforward and feral, more energy from their 2nd instinct is set free because they adapt to what I call my "default vibe". SO/SX always adapts so that works, they cover my social mishaps naturally, I can be as weird as I want to. They actually find it funny which is bizarre Never understood how they do the social covering up, all I know is that being so polite makes me want to be close to them.

    Agree, what Namjoon does is always thought-through and brave. I can feel you there, that's quite the appeal as a group. GD and Jiwon have interesting timbres, GD being less vocally impactful but versatile, that's his strength. Also, effortless swag.

    This Coup D'Etat track is pure joy, esp with the collaborations. The singing, rapping, talking bits, the high notes.



    My knowledge of Lay has limits since I didn't focus on him so far. All I am observing are his activities (Lose Control recently). I went by the overall vibe and projects he does, can't spot the Se creative. He's not grounded, not attuned to the moment (Lay's in some higher spaces, body language is not directive). His dancing is aggressive but it doesn't convince me, it's not an expression of his off-stage demure self. The discrepancy is too high, it's not natural. I sometimes feel his mind is "floating", above the process and less immersed. "I don't date ugly girls because they don't exist" "As long as we are together the hardship will pass". Si HA --> healing, wanting others to be all right. Don't see his competitiveness but more of an inventive skill, as compared to Kris who is much more set in his ways and had lots of volitional pressure that the others respected. What would be your take on it?

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    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    I'm curious to know if is just an outside impression from someone from a different type, or if there is really some constant inner pressure? Because when I'm standing next most Sx/Sps I feel as if they are a soda bottle, if you shake them, they'll explode. I also noticed that seems that what they say or express wants towards doesn't match what they do. You can see/feel their desire for things, but they either look from afar or even push it away. Like a conflict of interests?



    I love these:





    Best Cop D'Etat track, imo (and CL is much superior to Lydia, should have been on the album version):


    Jiwon wants to sing more too! I hope YG allows it, I love when he does R&B



    I actually think Lay is in some lower places when he disconnects, but that's another story So let me get this: you think he's personal self and his stage persona are too disparate, and that's somehow linked to him being Ni demonstrative? That's why you said "higher places", right? You think he's seeing into "the beyond". I know it sounds mystical now, but you get the gist.

    I advise you against believing in like, 80% of what comes from his mouth in interviews. His actions and specially, his reactions, contradict his discourse. Is not that he lies, is that he says what he thinks is the way he should feel/think, because that's what good people do You are right, there is an unnatural vibe to him, but it's not about stage vs off stage, ia bout EXO-Lay and just Lay. Tell me, have you ever watched his videos from pre EXO, when he was famous in Chinese tv? And his recent reaction video reacting to fan reaction to videos of him(yes, it's trippy and meta as fuck)?

    I'll wait for your answer before I dwelve deeper.

    Shaking, literally: get ready to be SP-handled
    Shaking, figuratively: well, explosion ahead - you nailed it. I've read the best description last week, SX/SP is the intensifier of synflow, give this stacking a sentence and they will write a novel trilogy (esp. in their head, SX/SP is the reclusive dreamer archetype).

    A conflict of interests is also accurate, between the other (SX) and the self (SP). I also miss the mark with my integrity, when SX takes over my want to connect it's hopeless. With SX/SO it seems easier to me, SX and SO are both focused on one's interaction with others so the energy is flowing smoothly. Insights from you on that?

    This Love was fantastic, the deliveryyy.
    Jiwon is such a treasure box!! This man needs a good marketing strategy (R&B included), but YG tries to cover up the mismanagement with 2NE1/WINNER/AKMU/Lee Hi etc and BB's long-term military departures.

    No no no. As a professional LIE I order you to disclose all available and relevant information in order to settle the accuracy of his stacking asap. We don't play in Gamma. I get a hunch that you have 90% more cool stuff up your sleeve than the 10% you expose girl.


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    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    SP-handled? That's new, but I don't know if you can handle me

    In your head, I see. So that's why you don't wanna write the article series, you are lazy indeed! But very productive in your mind.

    You are absolutely correct, I want to connect with others, to satisfy myself, so there's no conflict, it all serves its purposes.


    I'm lazy in a sense of, well I do what's necessary and nothing more. Bill Gates: "I will always choose a lazy person to do a difficult job because they will find an easy way to do it." The productivity in my mind, that's random scenarios or imaginations.

    Yes, that's what I mean. SX/SP is somewhere between sacrifice and complete seclusion. Now, I forgot to ask, can you elaborate on how your blindspot manifests in that process of connect/satisfy?


    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    And he wrote that on his own during BIG BANG's making the band documentary, he clearly was born a genius. Shame his smoking damaged his voice. Frog Face doesn't know what he's doing now more than when he used to do this:


    Imagine a whole mini of this:
    How the hell did you come up with "frog face" lmao
    Idk I think it really depends on what he smokes and his disposition, Lady Gaga does the same and she's just fine (odd comparison sorry).


    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post



    Order me? Girl, you'd have to be born again to order a Beta to do anything. You're damn right about me having a lot of ammunition, but I ain't delivering my goods before you deliver yours. You know what I'm talking about.

    We in Beta play like this: you scratch my back, I'll scratch yours. Quid pro quo.

    If you ain't know, now you know.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    I'm more of a Jobs person myself, but I get your point.

    I'm constantly in need of sleep (even more than my peers), can forget to eat until my stomach rings the alarm, have missed deadlines in school many times and can let chores pile up until I'm forced to acknowledge them, forsaking anything in favor of immediate stimulation and pleasure. Pretty vanilla because being a healthy 8w7 there's no way I'd do anything that risks my life or anyone else's.
    I see what you did there, EIE vs LIE.

    That was super helpful. If it's okay to ask, your take on finances? Just in a general sense, no details. Because I hypothesize that the higher SP ranks, the more a person minds their budget. Did you read my article on that? First instinct: overused - Second instinct: healthy Third: at the mercy of the first instinct, problem area whose scope is not acknowledged. Hence: SP first --> obsesses over their finances, SP second --> balanced approach SP last --> more disregard, is often caught by surprises. In my exemplary SX/SP case, I save a lot and spend it on useful long-term stuff, I don't worry too much about it unless a bigger investment should take place. Never had any larger problems even if the budget was small. People borrow stuff from me like I'm an economic Jesus and I was ok with it, I never managed to explain that until I figured this theory out. My relations with others (SX and SO) are 90% messed up yet I always had enough cash without issues, which confirms the theory. I could swim in money and be the happiest person while everyone hates me - so to say, money is the SX/SP safe zone. For SX/SO I would expect that they can socialize healthily all day (nuanced SO instinct ) while SX matters like energy etc and budgets are their respective trouble zones.

    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    I've been calling him this for years, it's just exactly what he looks like to me.

    He struggled really hard during Crooked promos, and I've been to enough BB/GD concerts to witness what the backing track can't muffle. But still, I hope he sees the light.

    Well, then we're not getting anywhere.
    It really fits. Did you name JYP and LSM as well?

    Oh no :/ And Crooked was already 3 years ago, did it get worse?

    Hm... we need a third party dispute settlement by Min Suga.


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    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    I've seen Jobs profiled as every type under the sun, but I seriously doubt he's Beta. He's Delta as f***.

    I never really had to worry about money, since my parents provided for me and I now have my company to rely on too. I consider myself a careful spender though. I have no qualms about spending a lot if I see the purchase as being worth it, but I won't burn money on anything that seems pointless or below my standards. Well I can only speak for myself, but your supposition doesn't apply at all. I definitely need to have space and time for myself and having people around me all day log can be grating, even if I enjoy them all as individuals. I've come to realize that it' because I'm so sensitive to human energy, I can only ignore people as entities if they aren't paying attention to me not even in an unconscious level. But once I'm on their radar, I can see every look (even if they're out of my line of sight) and feel every fluctuation in their energy. This might sound crazy because of it's "esoteric" nature, but it's nevertheless true. This awareness can be really tiring. The only exception is when my whole being is focused on something, that's when this 7th sense "turns off" and I miss things, like in the examples I sent you before. That's my problem zone: too much awareness of others "feelings" (I'm not sure if that's the correct term, it could be "energy").
    Which type exactly? I tend towards Fi and Ne.

    Ok, I see! Need to work on the theory more. And I wouldn't call it esoteric or crazy, it's just you being you within this field of awareness. I feel energy fluctuation as well, but I am the one who locks the "radar" (perfect SX description) on someone by choice. Idk if you've seen my SX/SP picture spam yet, there are lots of pictures with people STARING. That's how it's like. Your focus seems to draw lots of energy from you, you said it's tiring and you need space and time for yourself. I'm introverted like you but I rarely tire, in fact, I can't get enough of an energy source that I can draw from, my 7th sense was never there in the first place so I'll practically overdose permanently on one special activity. This might be related to syn/conflow; you as a conflow stacking figuratively dissect/tear down, my synflow direction is obsessive/intensifying.

    Or not? Forgive me if I create chaos by suddenly questioning everything again: plot twist, could you possibly be SO/SX? Your descriptions of awareness seem very collective, and SO instinct matters trouble you a lot, that means excessive use. If SO was your secondary instinct, you'd be more effortless in dealing with fluctuations because SX as a primary instinct is highly selective, it's either yes or no. SX/SO sees the special activity and then the broad energies, they might miss something. SO/SX works the other way around, too much human energy first, misses nothing, and only then comes the selective savior SX that you described:

    "The only exception is when my whole being is focused on something, that's when this 7th sense "turns off" and I miss things, like in the examples I sent you before."

    The first instinct is always a conflict area. If yours was SX you'd say that your problem zone is being completely consumed by a singular cause/person et cetera. Instead, you considered everyone's attention, your 7th sense, as the issue. You can sense their attitudes/feelings towards you even "on an unconscious level", you know when their radar is on you - holy shit. That's a very strong social instinct, too strong to be in a secondary position.

    You know what, that would explain your reaction to my "do you like SP/SX people?" earlier and the fact that you're here with moi. My interactions with SX/SO are usually very brief and intense but then it gets weird, too much. You're here like, "ah, let's interact". SX/SO would go: "We don't interact, we devour each other!! And perish in the flames!!!". You're not radical and direct like that, your approach is a lot cuter to me which I like. I can't handle SX/SO for more than a day, after that the communication shuts down instantly

    Tell me what you think

    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post

    No, neither sparks my creativity. I can't take the first seriously and the second is just too cute.

    I'd say it's the same. He just won't learn.

    Unless he is willing to sign a slave contract as my personal pet in exchange for my typing services, no can do.
    S a m e

    The good thing is, GD relies on visuals more than voice. At least he can distract everyone lmaoo

    What?

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    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    IEE-Ne. A genius jackass.

    I haven't checked out the thread since finding out that wasn't my type, I'll take a look. But this overdose thing sounds exactly how it is for me, though. I have the biggest bank of hours in our center not because I'm obsessed with being good, but because I'm obsessed with making music/singing/dancing in itself. My body gets tired, but my mind can't get enough, which is why I can burn out sometimes. But I do it to satisfy myself, never others, I'm quite "selfish" when it comes to my physical resources. Most of my peers can't relate because they thrive on competition, so they thought I was the same and that's why I practiced so much. At some point I got tired of trying to explain and let them think whatever. This consuming passion and focus only is present in this area of my life, though. I can't focus like that on people, for example. Only virtually (when I'm figuring public figures out) and for brief periods of time, otherwise I just have never felt that intensely interested in anyone in my life and when I read about it, I can't even imagine how it must feel. And I find it a little scary, though the thought of inspiring that kind of feelings in someone is enticing.

    But one thing is that a long time ago I realized why I preferred to rehearse alone. Many others do too, but either they say it's because they don't want interruptions or because they can't perform to the best of their abilities under pressure. But for me it was always because of this awareness thing, when I'm alone I can get lost in the music and in myself. But when there are others, I'm way too aware of their eyes on me, the mirrors don't help. If I were to tell anyone else this they'll probably call me ridiculously self centered, but yeah. I feel like I'm prey sometimes. Probably because I have a history of attracting people who want to posses or "tame" me. A major example of it was when I was part of a dance school as a kid, I happened to be the best in my class and was always set as an example for others to follow, would train my peers etc. But when the actual day of the performance came, as soon as I got on stage, I couldn't bear to look at the audience. For three years I'd perform while looking over the heads. This lasted for a long time, I used to do the exact same thing when I started as a trainee. Until I was forced to acknowledge my audience. It was a very difficult process.

    There's also the way I feel when I'm performing, regardless of being alone or not while doing it. I feel like me and the music are actually doing it Probably sounds funny, but that's how it feels, really. I don't even know who's devouring/consuming the other, whether is music or me, but it's the only occurance of total fusion I have ever experienced and the only one I want to have. Other forms of anything/anyone trying to do it to me are invading and even disturbing. Also the only situation were I not only allow something to take over me, but actually earn for it. I want for it to consume me until I can't think anymore, just be. The only moment when I just am is when I'm singing/dancing/rapping. It's complete bliss and lightness. The closest thing to replicate the feeling was when I came to Seoul on my own. It was the only time I traveled alone, and I loved the freedom and contentment I felt.

    I also think it manifests in my type of music. I need songs that make me feel immersed in it's story/universe. Beats, lyrics and specially, a song's atmosphere it's what has to click for me. This intensity thing might be why I've always had issues with ballads or calm songs in general. I have to be in a very specific state to enjoy them, otherwise not only do they not do it for me as they irritate me, making wanna turn it off/change the station immediately. I guess I recognize very fast that I won't get what I need from it. The lack of action/energy in songs/movies/books and maybe specially, people is frequently unbearable. "Are you even alive?" is usually what I'm thinking when I encounter this low energy entities, human or not. There's also the fact that ballads or mid tempos won't give me the opportunity to dance or at least move around the stage in a satisfying manner. You either have to sit down or slowly walk while you sing, which is already boring to watch for me, let alone perform them myself. It doesn't mean this "intense" songs are party bangers or even aggressive in any manner. Both of this couldn''t sound/look more different, but have the same other worldly (but actually feels like I'm finally experiencing the real world) effect on me, for example,:





    Probably is also at least linked to the reason why I love archery so damn much, same with shooting. My attention and energy are entirely dependent on interest, so I think the answer indeed lies in examining these interests.

    I've never considered SO/SX because the real people examples I've seen so far are either people pleasers/martyrs (Jimin comes to mind), shallow social climbers/con men or "over friendly" serial huggers (Jackson). I'm indeed very much aware of people's desires/expectations towards me, but I never cater to them. When I was younger I used to rebel against them, always going against what other people would like to get from me. I've matured enough to see how stupid that can be, but still, I can't just go with the flow, even though I might feel burdened with their wants/feelings, or burdened with my own awareness of it.

    I'm sure of this though: if I'm SO/SX then I'm not EIE, I can't be both. I'm either SX first or Fi valuing, my attraction/repulse instinct and self centeredness demsnd one of this options too betrue. Thoughts?
    I had to concentrate real hard to read all of this omg my psyche is still traumatized by the Trump election sorry if I missed some points

    So, I tried to make sense of this:

    Pro SX/SO argumentation: doesn't cater to other's desires, burning out, being EIE, attraction/repulse, attention-based hobbies, anti-ballad (same girl, I also intensely dislike tracks you can't dance to exactly because they don't stimulate me), anti low energy, indulgence when performing something (again, I do the same), self-centered instead of competition = misjudged as wanting to surpass everyone, "my mind can't get enough", wholly dedicated to a cause/niche in life, being "weightless" in the moment and breaking free, fusion.

    What made me think SX/SP was your part when you explained you're selfish with your resources, and that you are so self-aware around others that you prefer to rehearse by yourself. The way you interact on this forum is also more SO-last, you seem very careful like me when I started out. It took some time until I was "all over the place" like today, I also observed a lot in the beginning before signing up. I'm still not participating in the group chat and keep to myself a lot, that's SX/SP.
    Also, you said under my Tae blog post that you don't really understand how people react to you, or there is a certain... idk do you bother explaining it in detail? Because back then when I read it I was so surprised, Fe people really know how they come across.

    Another argument for SX/SP is your synflow behaviour, you pointed out maturing from an anti-posture. Conflow stackings hardly mature in that regard, they stay in "rebel" mode.

    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    "we devour each other!! And perish in the flames!!!" HOLY SHIT, that's some new level of intensity, I don't know whether to laugh or cower in fear
    Well that's SX for you You said it yourself, "I don't even know who's devouring/consuming the other". That's the exact feeling. The way I experience it, it's melting into nothingness every second of your being.

    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    Don't say that, it's precisely that kind of warped state of mind that brought us the mediocrity that was MADE. Jiyong needs holidays. Very long holidays. And possibly having some sense beat into him. Then make him watch everything he did right and wrong these past few years like this:

    Weren't you trying to use Yoongie to get me to spill the beans? I named my price.
    It was mediocre cause it wasn't really finished!
    And which beans, you already stated your point the question would be how to argument for it. I'll just change the typing for him :3

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    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    It’ ok I not only understand it as I think you really should have taken a day off. I’d be concerned if you weren’t upset because let’s face it, not only was that the last nail in US’s coffin but it's a poison that could spread around the world.

    I'm not even American but I'm bothered anyway... German dictatorship radar. But we'll have to wait it out now and stay positive otherwise we promote hatred just like him.


    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    I read through the threads of all my three suspected types, and it showed how we can mistake functions for instincts and vise versa. I absolutely loathed the SO/SX, couldn't really relate to the SX/SO and pulled all this from SX/SP:





    Also this quote ( I edited it so only the parts I relate to remain):



    What she says until 3:49 the gospel I go by (then she completely losts me, can’t relate to the restoo f the vídeo at all):


    This guy right here, I really clicked with him:
    Mhm, mhm, exactly me as well. Like'd Marina's approach throughout the video actually. Especially risk, always new stuff. The second guy, no connection at all, instant "nope"-factor.


    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    This:


    BINGO

    And this brilliant post right here:
    http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...=1#post1151549

    And remember when I talked about Macbeth?
    http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...=1#post1115645

    So yeah, definitely SX/SP as I've been thinking for years.

    I'd be glad to explain it in detail but I don't get what you mean by "There is a certain..". Mind finishing the sentence?

    Also, it's starting to look less and less likely that EIE is really my type.
    Yes, SX/SP was the first energy I got from you as well so we've come full circle here - Fassbender, great example and performance. I found the word, a certain uncompromising edginess, something that drives you away from others.

    On the basis of SX/SP? I have similar stuff going on these days, currently reading into ILE more and watching videos.
    If you want, I can go through your questionnaire again.
    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    It was finished, parts of it years ago. That' what makes it so depressing


    The beans would be exactly on that sauce, but hey, your calling.

    PS: I'm having a field day watching SMTM3 in full by the first time. Tablo is so cute!
    True, now that you say it... it's as if YG doesn't care at all about the artistry and only cash (see Abramovic philosophy). All we have is Blackpink lmao

    Sauce? Where.

    Ohh what do you type him as?

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    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    Uncompromising edginess, that's a great and concise description I'll be using from now on.

    Yes, it just completely conflicts with it too much and there's the whole peer identification thing again. Might be because it seems like every EIE here (an there are few) are either 4's or 6's, but I don't know...

    He's just about that paper for a few years now, doesn't give two shits about music or the people involved, iKON's lineup is a testament to that. I'm glad you believe in them!

    EII-Ne 9w8 SO/SX.

    I tried to power through Hanbin's audition But I couldn't do it. Will try again now, this is exactly why I've only watched BOBBy's cuts so far. I have a huge case of second hand embarrassment, always had, i wonder what's up with that
    Perfect, I'll keep you updated on my typing analysis of you as well.

    I looked it up last night, SisOfNight actually stated that SX/SP is a probable typing for EIE, that would be no problem. Fe is about peers but in your case, it only extends to those your SX focusses on? Fe SX has excellent at social awareness, you stated otherwise so that may be the point of doubt here. Yes, your e-type is a good starting point at least. 8w7 is mostly SEE, SLE, LSE, LIE territory. That's why I went for SLE in my first suggestion for you since I saw Beta values and extrotim.

    YG is the best case of how NOT to do it. I believe in the girls <3<3 Of course! Did you see the new MVs?

    Awesome, what about Zico's e-type and stacking?

    Second hand embarrassment is what makes these shows so interesting, it's their way of getting the viewer's attraction. PDs be like: "Let's throw in gansta antics and awkward homoromantic constellations! And Vernon! Cause he's hot." The entire show format... idk where they stole it from, or is it an original idea?

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    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    I checked the questionnaire you posted on your V.I. thread and I found fascinating how well you and I seem to communicate, when we have such disparate views on things. I also sould have done it sooner, because you're clear as a day. If you have any interest I'll post my "veredict" later.

    I think you were right about me being Aristocratic but I'm not sure about being Beta, the more I read the least EIE I feel.

    Which one is your favorite, Play With Fire or Stay? Did you watch the live stages?

    I have yet to watch his 4 Things show, I'll post my typing of him once I do, because I've never seen him outside of SMTM4 and UPRS and we all know how real those shows are

    But it kills me inside!!! Can you believe I still haven't continued the first episode? I have to stop as soon as Hanbin "raps" the first line. Vernon is fake pretty to me though. But that Mingyu kid
    This is what I've been wondering about as well. We're different/similar in many ways. Verdicts are always welcome since I can research and research and still can't get it done properly.

    Hm... merry > serious quadra for you as well. So only Beta left unless you're IEE.

    Play With Fire! You know me... I prefer the edginess just like you

    I always keep an eye on him. Self-proclaimed "king of the 3rd generation" and master producer, polarizes wherever Block B is, seizes authority. What I got so far; either e8 or e7, social instinct stacking. In the shows he's portraying SX/SO, but he might be SO first as well.

    *pat pat' Even if it does, it's so worth it. What's up with your protectiveness of Hanbin though? Mingyu over Vernon all day, I have a soft and empty spot on my bias list and he kind of belongs there. Strikes me as E_ _p.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    But I am Serious

    Ok, here goes nothing:

    It makes me wonder if its the SX/SP factor or what that makes us click. This was very interesting to me, because isn't it the exact same thing I said to you before, only with different wording?:




    And now I understand why we clased whenever I "harshly" criticized people:




    Also this blasphemy got me shook:




    This is interesting too:






    Things I could've written myself:






    This was very illustrative:




    All in all what I see is an apparently extremely highly valued Te (which is also what 3w4 highly resembles), but the way you use logic doesn't fit it. You have a peculiar definition of things. I also can't see appropriately used/applied Ni. You seen to seek it/crave it at least when it comes to understanding how people work (which could be in actuality SX first), but it eludes you. Lots of projection going on.


    You love to argue two different sides of an issue, constantly turns conclusions into their heads, that's Ne being valued, girl. "But what if...?" is your preferred approach.
    I remember reading an article about Ne which described it as a person holding an object and turning it on their hands so they could see each possible side it possesses. That's what you do.

    Weak Se and no Fe in sight.

    It's amazing how much you revealed in that questionnaire while actually being short and vague all over the place. If I hadn't read I'd still be unsure, though I couldn't ever honestly believe you were a LIE. Or an Extrovert, for that matter. Your type and subtype are fairly obvious after reading your thread. I can say I'm 100% on my certainty. I can see however how it wouldn't cross your mind because you don't fit the stereotypes about this type at all, due to your unusual Enneagram combination.


    But you confused me even more. Of course it doesn't cross my mind, I can't observe myself from the outside
    Your analysis sounds Delta type to me or what is going on??



    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    I actually had him pegged as 8w7 SO/SX as well, but I'll wait to write n stone until I watch that.

    I'm powering through it with the help of a giant banana cappuccino as I type. Am I protective of him? I thought I was being protective of myself, though as I've said before I don't know why it hits me so hard. I guess it's because I'm really prideful and public humiliation regarding my professional skills would kill me, so when I see someone going through that I feel like he/she is me? It's funny because I absolutely loathed him throughout WIn, buts as soon as watched the first episode of Mix & Match I kinda adopted him.
    I would also consider SO/SP for Zico, contraflowing all over the place.
    Humiliation is the point of performance lmao but that makes sense... self-insert models on screen.
    Adoptation <3 Well that happens often with se people... hate them first, love them later.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post

    Kitten has claws!!!

    Well isn't it obvious? Clearly a Logical type but not Te, high but somewhat (or totally?) unconscious usage of Ne, not Fe (so Fi) and inferior Se, Democratic but not Gamma...LII-Ne. Can't see anything else, you even came for me with their particular brand of b****ness

    Could very well be the case.

    "Humiliation is the point of performance"> Wtf is that supposed to mean? I feel like most of my biases are self inserts to me.
    Wish I was, but I am not even half as organized, put together, lawful, factually correct - which LII assumes as much as I do... they are well-informed in the first place, I come up with bs all day, generalize, guess and so on. I've been told that I don't make sense either, low Ti or Te valuing since I work well with contradictions. I came at you through moral judgement (Fi) and not "you are not coherent" (Ti)

    How am I Se PoLR? That seems to be a new notion.
    Also, in what way democratic?

    Humilation means drawing dignitiy from someone, popular performances are pretty much trying to sell whatever is needed to get attention, that's what I mean.
    The self-insert is an interesting phenomenon actually... I always ask myself whether it's one's ideal partner or self, or both. Or one's parent.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    I don't know where did you get the notion that LIIs are any of these things. They can be, seeing as this is their idealised self, but it depends on maturity and development, both mental and emotional. Being like you described is their goal, not a description of the type. Any other type can be all these things too.

    Well if that's how you come off in real life then you're doing a good job of acting totally different in this forum. And didn't I say you were Fi? That's how LIIs come at people in real life, I have my fair share of experiences with them, hence why I said before we usually hate each other. Honestly, it seems you have a mainly theoretical and idealised vision of the types, with little real life application. Which is yet another sign of high Ne, seeing people as ideas and concepts, and then constantly trying to fit them into your personalized system, which is Ti. I even accused you of doing that before, remember? There's no way you are an Ethical type, because that's the area you have to work on.

    You are a SX/SP 3, so that really makes up for a weak Se when it comes to assertiveness and general confidence. But I noticed very early on the GD thread and then on the BTS one, that while you have a fascination with Se, you can't easily tell it apart from other functions or from Enneagram types. You thought Jiyong was SEE , thought Kai was EIE and Taemin IEI, that Chaerin was SEI and Bom IEE. You love Se and Ni and wish you could grasp it, but they elude you. Maybe that's exactly why you like them so much: because you don't really get them.

    If you're not LII, then ILE, but I don't really see it.

    I could pull quotes from your q&a, but it'll include so much of it'd be redundant. But I think our interactions so far (and specially our clashes) are very illustrative of how differently we see things in the social area. Also, vide the quote I posted earlier: You hate rules and regulations because they remind you you are not truly free, and also because you think it should be a given how people should act.

    So there''s no dignity in pop for you. Oh here you go again with the childhood psychology thing...but you did admit it yourself in your V.I. thread. That's how you explain things to yourself.
    Wait a sec, I'll reply in my typing thread.

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    Wow this thread was something

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    (moved to here due to our lists not to have it twice)

    Quote Originally Posted by FANXY CHILD View Post
    It all became ebullient inside me after Yoongi's interview in the Wings concept book and Namjoon's log. I feel for Namjoon's but can't relate to his pain because I don't value Ethics as much as he does, or at least not in the same way. It doesn't feel vital to me, though it's still quite important. On the other hand I get Yoongi, because technical competence is something I can't ever ignore or really gamble with. The way I see it:

    They both are fixated on their own ability to do what they have to correctly, and are using the same function to gauge their progress, . Namjoon's self esteem is tied to how much he can do for others (more importantly BTS in the case of his career) and affect people collectively, that's what "competence" means to him. He talks about things that are not only tied to his music writing abilities, but more image centered issues, for example him freaking about doing that interview and feeling like he isn't what a leader should be like because he's too scared and insecure. How he conducts himself as a leader in all areas involved (music production and dealing with the media) is being judged by himself through his notion of time passage, and he obsesses about the future in relation to it, he mentions time as a concept a lot during his ventings, i.e. "I've been active for 4 years but I'm still scared and sad", "You'd think songwriting would be easy for me by now" etc.

    Yoongi tortures himself about a different thing, his issue is verifiable concretization of technical competence in itself. While Namjoon needs to feel (and be told) like he's good by doing others good through influence, Yoongi needs to have his self perceived (he exaggerates it by calling himself a genius, but he knows he's really good) technical talent be recognized in an external concrete way. Just look how (self) satisfied and comfortable Joon was during and after their last US stay and the enormous positive effect of the successful mixtape release on Yoongi's holistic health. Namjoom worries about carrying himself as a leader and making a good name for himself, and Yoongi about achieving professional and financial status for his own personal satisfaction (there are no selfless vs selfish connotations intended here btw, they just are differently oriented when it comes to areas of Ethical influence). Yoongi also makes temporal references a whole lot even on hid mixtape, he compares his progress through time to other Daegu underground rappers for example, both of them are impatient with what they perceive as a slow pace in maturing/evolving (Namjoon) and climbing the (individual) success ladder (Yoongi) and fear the unknown future in these areas. It's indeed a vs thing, with as the common measuring tool.
    Awooo, yes you got it down! Namjoon: people - Yoongi: work. Super clear. Namjoon emphasizes his creative, contact subtype with accentuated 4D (= him caring waaay too much but it's not valued, he expresses it through dramatism instead). Yoongi's demonstrative manifests in terms of his status ponderings, that got apparent in Agust D, but I just watched the reaction to the BV2 episode and his main focus is his subjective focus on how events unfold. / only come out after request, Namjoon spills all the - by default did you notice?

    Quote Originally Posted by FANXY CHILD View Post
    But what about Kookie being left behind, though? They do love giving us theory fodder, I love it.

    My typings:
    Namjoon> IEI-Ni 3w4-5w6-9w8 So/Sx
    Yoongi> ILI-Te 3w4-5w6-8w7 Sp/Sx
    Hoseok> ESE-Fe 3w2-6w7-1w9 So/Sp
    Seokjin> SEI-Fe 2w1-6w7-9w8 So/Sx
    Taehyun> IEE-Ne 3w2-7w6-9w8 Sx/So
    Jimin> SEE-Fi 2w3-6w7-1w2 So/Sx
    Jungkook> SEI-Si 3w4-7w8-9w8 Sx/Sp



    I just found the threads, will read them after this
    That was like Jin during Run era. That will play a role in the upcoming MV plots, I am sure. Keeping ARMYs guessing is the best business strategy ever, while we theorize so much time passes and then they drop something new, supply all day.

    Ahhhhh impressive list! Thank you Pretty close, mine goes like that, made up my mind:


    Joon IEI-Fe 5w6 SO/SX 539 - The Thinker
    Yoongi ILI-Ni 5w4 SP/SX 584 - The Scholar
    Hoseok ESE-Fe 7w6 SO/SP 721 - The Teacher
    Seokjin SEI-Fe 7w6 SP/SO 729 - The Peacemaker
    Taehyung IEE-Ne 4w3 SX/SO 479 - The Gentle Spirit
    Jimin SEE-Fi 2w3 SO/SX 261 - The Supporter
    Kook SLI-Si 9w8 SP/SX 937 - The Ambassador

    (come a long way from the OP lol)

    Joon and Yoongz are probably both 5s because as you said, it's competence and correctness for them. That's 5's core fear of not knowing and being inadequate to a task. Yoongi is the envious and reclusive 4-wing, Joonie the 6-loyalist wing with safety concerns/anxiety.

    Hope and Jin 7, their main motivation is to be happy, not to be loved like a 2 (Jimin).

    Taehyung 4, he strives to be different and self-expressive. Van Gogh (his latest favorite person) is also a 4w3, that's quite interesting.

    Kook is SLI since he's efficient and calculating rather than social while completely unadapted in this emotional reactions. He'll pick his nose because it makes him feel comfy and just thinks he needs to do it, meanwhile the others are laughing at something but he won't care unless it's interesting (). That's also his SP/SX contraflow attitude, SP own well-being > SX mating/bonding > SO community. Values but it's rudimentary/ weak- "I hate this... I like that" + hidden ethical outlets like his song covers. In contrast to Jin, cold and business-like, no-nonsense, chimes in awkwardly but can rather give advice how to do something properly ( creative, hence Golden Maknae capable of mastering anything step by step) and how to make sense of something ( demonstrative). Spartan in style, controlled hedonism in contrast to SEI's social expansion. Like he won't engage in BTS' chat if it's not necessary, or has a black phone background just out of pragmatism. Chemistry-wise, Taehyung gets along better with Kook than Jin.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chae View Post
    (moved to here due to our lists not to have it twice)



    Awooo, yes you got it down! Namjoon: people - Yoongi: work. Super clear. Namjoon emphasizes his creative, contact subtype with accentuated 4D (= him caring waaay too much but it's not valued, he expresses it through dramatism instead). Yoongi's demonstrative manifests in terms of his status ponderings, that got apparent in Agust D, but I just watched the reaction to the BV2 episode and his main focus is his subjective focus on how events unfold. / only come out after request, Namjoon spills all the - by default did you notice?
    Joon is indeed a drama queen that's precisely why I always find myself foundly rolling my eyes at him. The thing is he's way too much in love with his because it serves the image he's chosen for himself off stage, and in turn keeps his on a tight leash too much in non "official" work events (i.e. that ridiculous rational when in love quote). It does him no good and makes something that should be easy awkward sometimes (him repeatedly hurting Taehyun with his rudeness, his kiss moment with Jimin moment and that colorist comment >again directed at poor Tae!< on that radio show years ago come to mind) creates unnecessary tension for himself. He's super intelligent, but kinda dumb like that. He was irresistibly cute during the live comment video precisely because he let his loose.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chae View Post
    Taehyung 4, he strives to be different and self-expressive. Van Gogh (his latest favorite person) is also a 4w3, that's quite interesting.

    Kook is SLI since he's efficient and calculating rather than social while completely unadapted in this emotional reactions. He'll pick his nose because it makes him feel comfy and just thinks he needs to do it, meanwhile the others are laughing at something but he won't care unless it's interesting (). That's also his SP/SX contraflow attitude, SP own well-being > SX mating/bonding > SO community. Values but it's rudimentary/ weak- "I hate this... I like that" + hidden ethical outlets like his song covers. In contrast to Jin, cold and business-like, no-nonsense, chimes in awkwardly but can rather give advice how to do something properly ( creative, hence Golden Maknae capable of mastering anything step by step) and how to make sense of something ( demonstrative). Spartan in style, controlled hedonism in contrast to SEI's social expansion. Like he won't engage in BTS' chat if it's not necessary, or has a black phone background just out of pragmatism. Chemistry-wise, Taehyung gets along better with Kook than Jin.
    What you see as E4 is classic IEE for me, I see no trace of envy, seeing himself as defective, proneness to enjoy feeling melancholic, self victimization or inclinations to anger, so he's E3 to me, though I think he's wing could be 4 and not 2.

    The person you describe as Kookie is completely foreign to me! I actually did have quite a similar image of him when I first joined the fandom right before the I Need U era, but after years of observing him in person in events and (as briefly and professionally as it is) interacting with him at fansigns, no way I can see him as being anything else but a SEI. It's interesting because I only realized Jin was one like a year ago, I thought he was ESI lol. In person he's very friendly, but a pro, while Kookie is really transparent and genuine in his warmth. Kookie has nothing substantial (as in type specific) with other SLIs idols like Yunho, Seohyun, Irene, Xiumin or Nayong. Just like a completely different vibe really, he's very similar to other SEIs idols I've met like Yoona, Suho, Yang Hongseok and Kim Jinwoo, except he's soooo young He's really just a kid, acts and feels much younger than he actually is, not polished at all, but really wants to be taken seriously while still using his maknae status when it's convenient, a paradox. You know who is like his twin in shyness, situational awkwardness and unintentional brusqueness (not to mention misplaced cockiness), besides social etiquette issues? iKON's Hanbin. I was an avid fan until last year, saw him enough times to notice he's like a bit more detached and paranoid version of Kookie (and judgy, too). I have considered Kookie having 1w9 in his tritype before, that stiffness. They're both Sp/Sx too. In the end, is a matter of perception. If I saw him like that I'd probably type him SLI too. Another comparison is Taeyong, I also thought he was a SLI-Si until like 6 months ago, and that was after I had attended several events too. In his case it's pretty easy to see why he confuses people though, because of the whole scandal thing, when he began just letting himself be the came like an avalanche

    As for the chemistry thing, it can't be compared I think, Jin is a dear hyung while Kookie...well, let's just say there's a bit too much chemistry there It's not really about personality compatibility lol.
    Last edited by PrettySavage; 07-30-2017 at 12:23 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FANXY CHILD View Post
    Joon is indeed a drama queen that's precisely why I always find myself foundly rolling my eyes at him. The thing is he's way too much in love with his because it serves the image he's chosen for himself off stage, and in turn keeps his on a tight leash too much in non "official" work events (i.e. that ridiculous rational when in love quote). It does him no good and makes something that should be easy awkward sometimes (him repeatedly hurting Taehyun with his rudeness, his kiss moment with Jimin moment and that colorist comment >again directed at poor Tae!< on that radio show years ago come to mind) creates unnecessary tension for himself. He's super intelligent, but kinda dumb like that. He was irresistibly cute during the live comment video precisely because he let his loose.



    What you see as E4 is classic IEE for me, I see no trace of envy, seeing himself as defective, proneness to enjoy feeling melancholic, self victimization or inclinations to anger, so he's E3 to me, though I think he's wing could be 4 and not 2.

    The person you describe as Kookie is completely foreign to me! I actually did have quite a similar image of him when I first joined the fandom right before the I Need U era, but after years of observing him in person in events and (as briefly and professionally as it is) interacting with him at fansigns, no way I can see him as being anything else but a SEI. It's interesting because I only realized Jin was one like a year ago, I thought he was ESI lol. In person he's very friendly, but a pro, while Kookie is really transparent and genuine in his warmth. Kookie has nothing substantial (as in type specific) with other SLIs idols like Yunho, Seohyun, Irene, Xiumin or Nayong. Just like a completely different vibe really, he's very similar to other SEIs idols I've met like Yoona, Suho, Yang Hongseok and Kim Jinwoo, except he's soooo young He's really just a kid, acts and feels much younger than he actually is, not polished at all, but really wants to be taken seriously while still using his maknae status when it's convenient, a paradox. You know who is like his twin in shyness, situational awkwardness and unintentional brusqueness (not to mention misplaced cockiness), besides social etiquette issues? iKON's Hanbin. I was an avid fan until last year, saw him enough times to notice he's like a bit more detached and paranoid version of Kookie (and judgy, too). I have considered Kookie having 1w9 in his tritype before, that stiffness. They're both Sp/Sx too. In the end, is a matter of perception. If I saw him like that I'd probably type him SLI too. Another comparison is Taeyong, I also thought he was a SLI-Si until like 6 months ago, and that was after I had attended several events too. In his case it's pretty easy to see why he confuses people though, because of the whole scandal thing, when he began just letting himself be the came like an avalanche

    As for the chemistry thing, it can't be compared I think, Jin is a dear hyung while Kookie...well, let's just say there's a bit too much chemistry there It's not really about personality compatibility lol.
    Yes, I see that as well. Hidden agenda misguided, but at least he's trying to refocus recently, something's happening (---> see "Change"). is certainly under more request nowadays, see Billboard appearance. He's more diplomatic, those things, he knows what's wrong to do. Less on his masculinity grind. More tolerance. Some LGBT stuff, even. Well, his first social instinct adapts to trends, that's all there is to it. SX/SO and SO/SX are the SJWs, SX/SO in particular because they're all about contraflow and turning society upside down. SO/SX goes with the times instead. Social last is not an activist, see Kookie. So Namjoon's doin' the most

    Those are unhealthy traits of the type, Tae is on a better level, gladly. Right, it mixes with IEE which includes making efforts being the odd one out. He's not image-cautious, too weird and moody. Jimin got that 3-influence, he adapts himself to expectations, is terribly vain, talks about wanting to be first. 4 doesn't do that. Taehyung has to be a reclusive type or E7 core (so I'm not hell-bent on the 4 typing), I solely don't see the typical ambition slogans unless his wing is concerned. It's all about being yourself without filter for Tae, which is something 3 never eschews.

    Oh I am glad you see another version! That is the magic of 's perspectives. The transparency/lack of polishedness/reservedness/situational awkwardness/cockiness/social etiquette/stiffness you describe are exactly his PoLR and very weak ethics in general. SLI can't fake anything emotionally, that is part of their great authenticity, so you can see through them. How would you describe his warmth, is it polite or just very expressive? Maybe you're a cutie and he got charmed Jungkook uses his maknae status because he's aware of hierarchy, more points to logics. Hanbin is just the quintessential Ij, and judgy -> of course I see Jungkook's first motivation as to be peaceful, so it's gotta be the 9, and he challenges, which is the 8. Hm, Taeyong is another case! But ego and enneagram 1 are set. Hm, idols are hard to type given their many facets ikr. That's why I'm glad they give us Bon Voyage footage at least

    I bet

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chae View Post
    Yes, I see that as well. Hidden agenda misguided, but at least he's trying to refocus recently, something's happening (---> see "Change"). is certainly under more request nowadays, see Billboard appearance. He's more diplomatic, those things, he knows what's wrong to do. Less on his masculinity grind. More tolerance. Some LGBT stuff, even. Well, his first social instinct adapts to trends, that's all there is to it. SX/SO and SO/SX are the SJWs, SX/SO in particular because they're all about contraflow and turning society upside down. SO/SX goes with the times instead. Social last is not an activist, see Kookie. So Namjoon's doin' the most
    Yes, I'm most definitely on that and I'm proud and relieved for him, yay for progress Yeah Kookie demonstrates his distaste and reproval through subtle , but that's all.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chae View Post
    Those are unhealthy traits of the type, Tae is on a better level, gladly. Right, it mixes with IEE which includes making efforts being the odd one out. He's not image-cautious, too weird and moody. Jimin got that 3-influence, he adapts himself to expectations, is terribly vain, talks about wanting to be first. 4 doesn't do that. Taehyung has to be a reclusive type or E7 core (so I'm not hell-bent on the 4 typing), I solely don't see the typical ambition slogans unless his wing is concerned. It's all about being yourself without filter for Tae, which is something 3 never eschews.
    Of course they are unhealthy, but not after years of observing a person of said type you'd be bound to see them at one point. And considering the nature of the job and all the crap they go through in a very public way, no way the ugly and dark can stay hidden. Like for example with his grandma's death, I think they way he dealt with it during and what he has expressed about it after, was pretty 3ish. But I agree that he's a core 7, so in the end is not a vital difference.

    Yes, that's one of the reasons I never understood why people say Jimin is an "angel" and "innocent", like bitch, where???

    Quote Originally Posted by Chae View Post
    Oh I am glad you see another version! That is the magic of 's perspectives. The transparency/lack of polishedness/reservedness/situational awkwardness/cockiness/social etiquette/stiffness you describe are exactly his PoLR and very weak ethics in general. SLI can't fake anything emotionally, that is part of their great authenticity, so you can see through them. How would you describe his warmth, is it polite or just very expressive? Maybe you're a cutie and he got charmed Jungkook uses his maknae status because he's aware of hierarchy, more points to logics. Hanbin is just the quintessential Ij, and judgy -> of course I see Jungkook's first motivation as to be peaceful, so it's gotta be the 9, and he challenges, which is the 8. Hm, Taeyong is another case! But ego and enneagram 1 are set. Hm, idols are hard to type given their many facets ikr. That's why I'm glad they give us Bon Voyage footage at least

    I bet
    I could try and articulate it in my own words but I stumbled on a great explanation of what I think about Kookie's :

    It should be noted that while this is the strongest block of a TIM, the accuracy and correctness of its estimates is strongly influenced by a person's level of experience, knowledge, and intelligence. It is quite possible for the Ego block functions to make mistakes. Still, a person rarely feels deeply ashamed or inadequate on this block even if they've blundered and recovers with ease.

    . The creative or implementation function is another strong, conscious function. However, in contrast to the inert leading function, it is flexible and contact. Creative function does not have an "integrated and complete" picture of the world, but rather considers different options available in a given situation with the goal of finding an appropriate solution for the situation that is satisfactory and supports the person's base function. Creative function gets actively expressed in conversations and everyday situations. Its expressions are poignant, designed to leverage some effect in daily situations, and often draw the immediate attention of others. Creative function requires some effort to be put forth and thus "choosy" as to when it is expressed; it may "lie in waiting" for a while to become realized in smaller everyday situations. Being another strong function in the Ego block that is openly expressed, it is oft mistaken for the leading function, especially for people of creative function subtypes.
    You see that's why I know he's SEI and not SLI: he's really warm in palpable way, like he's it's 3D and it touches and envelops you. It's not mechanic or detached (I'm not criticizing or saying they were fake btw, but it's clearly a learned ability) like I felt with the SLI idols. There's an energy element too, SLIs have this dense, heavy gravitas thing going on, SEIs are light and have a "floating" feel to them.

    Because I think it's hilarious, this is a great SEI vs SLI contrast to me:



    Yes, he's mainly 9w8 to me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FANXY CHILD View Post
    Yes, I'm most definitely on that and I'm proud and relieved for him, yay for progress Yeah Kookie demonstrates his distaste and reproval through subtle , but that's all.

    Of course they are unhealthy, but not after years of observing a person of said type you'd be bound to see them at one point. And considering the nature of the job and all the crap they go through in a very public way, no way the ugly and dark can stay hidden. Like for example with his grandma's death, I think they way he dealt with it during and what he has expressed about it after, was pretty 3ish. But I agree that he's a core 7, so in the end is not a vital difference.

    Yes, that's one of the reasons I never understood why people say Jimin is an "angel" and "innocent", like bitch, where???
    In the end, we're both right since he unites all of these influences - and the shadow part is a good point. That made me laugh, well he knows how to play the camera, behind there is his 8-disintegration awooops A perfect Christian Chimchim would be boring though - as Jung wrote: "No tree, it is said, can grow to heaven unless its roots reach down to hell". Jimin is such a sweet bunbut his roots are equally strong in the opposite direction


    Quote Originally Posted by FANXY CHILD View Post
    I could try and articulate it in my own words but I stumbled on a great explanation of what I think about Kookie's :

    You see that's why I know he's SEI and not SLI: he's really warm in palpable way, like he's it's 3D and it touches and envelops you. It's not mechanic or detached (I'm not criticizing or saying they were fake btw, but it's clearly a learned ability) like I felt with the SLI idols. There's an energy element too, SLIs have this dense, heavy gravitas thing going on, SEIs are light and have a "floating" feel to them.

    Because I think it's hilarious, this is a great SEI vs SLI contrast to me:



    Yes, he's mainly 9w8 to me.
    This bit demonstrates how tricky the inert subtype can be when the creative is on the backburner, Kook falls into that category. Ok if he's SEI then, how does 4D play into it? Yes, that's what I was going for i.e. is it adapted or does it come out naturally. The comparison is good, SLI like a rock, SEI like a feather. That vid was just hilarious



    (He reminds me of Daesung here)

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    @Chae

    Jimin as a Slyth is very successful in the end, his cunning is great and it shows.

    To me it plays in how he not only *knows* his people well (time does that in relationships), but in how he *understands* them and tries to be conscientious of their necessities. He doesn't always succeds at it, but the conscious effort is there and so is the genuine sense os achievment when it gets the desired results. It's creative because it's never the same, and his use of it depends on the situation and environment or the company he's in. Like for example the point you made about him using the hierarchy in his favor, it really doesn't hold weight in reality:by Korean ethics he's at the bottom of the pyramid, I always see I-Armys lampshaping the "golden maknae" thinh, as if anyone in Bangtan (including Jungkook) had ever took it seriously. I think is a matter of culture really, we K-fans know that the fact that they (genuinely) express awe and admiration for Kookie's abilities doesn't mean he's a "maknae on top", 'cuz such a thing doesn't even exist outside of kpop fantasy. Yeah they let him lift and manhandle them and even be cheeky within limits, but no one in the group or in the staff lets him get away with any real transpassion, no matter how small. They don't hold back from putting him in his place in front of fans either, like during the last unaired bit of their V App concert. I went off in a tangent to illustrate why I can't attribute his strategy as being about logic at all, it's a manipulation of ethics, i.e. how they feel about him, and the fact that they have said many times he rarerly does it at home says a lot. Doing it in front of an audience that loves him and cooes at how cute he is being? That's to me

    I also see his in how he expresses his loyalties and approval/disapproval of ethical displays. I see it always flares up whenever anyone (even inside the group) oversteps with the other members. He clearly gets upset, but instead of verbalizing or directly acting on it, he immediately reaffirm the person, doesn't want it to demage their self esteem ( i.e. how him and Jin responded to Jimin's comments on his singing in Hawaii vs how the others, including Tae who's the BFF/soulmate).

    I know right? SLIs are umovable mountains until they decide to move, then they become avalanches! Fascinating folks.

    Well they are the same so it figures, though Daesung is subtype IMO. He'd just laugh it off.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FANXY CHILD View Post
    @Chae

    Jimin as a Slyth is very successful in the end, his cunning is great and it shows.

    To me it plays in how he not only *knows* his people well (time does that in relationships), but in how he *understands* them and tries to be conscientious of their necessities. He doesn't always succeds at it, but the conscious effort is there and so is the genuine sense os achievment when it gets the desired results. It's creative because it's never the same, and his use of it depends on the situation and environment or the company he's in. Like for example the point you made about him using the hierarchy in his favor, it really doesn't hold weight in reality:by Korean ethics he's at the bottom of the pyramid, I always see I-Armys lampshaping the "golden maknae" thinh, as if anyone in Bangtan (including Jungkook) had ever took it seriously. I think is a matter of culture really, we K-fans know that the fact that they (genuinely) express awe and admiration for Kookie's abilities doesn't mean he's a "maknae on top", 'cuz such a thing doesn't even exist outside of kpop fantasy. Yeah they let him lift and manhandle them and even be cheeky within limits, but no one in the group or in the staff lets him get away with any real transpassion, no matter how small. They don't hold back from putting him in his place in front of fans either, like during the last unaired bit of their V App concert. I went off in a tangent to illustrate why I can't attribute his strategy as being about logic at all, it's a manipulation of ethics, i.e. how they feel about him, and the fact that they have said many times he rarerly does it at home says a lot. Doing it in front of an audience that loves him and cooes at how cute he is being? That's to me

    I also see his in how he expresses his loyalties and approval/disapproval of ethical displays. I see it always flares up whenever anyone (even inside the group) oversteps with the other members. He clearly gets upset, but instead of verbalizing or directly acting on it, he immediately reaffirm the person, doesn't want it to demage their self esteem ( i.e. how him and Jin responded to Jimin's comments on his singing in Hawaii vs how the others, including Tae who's the BFF/soulmate).

    I know right? SLIs are umovable mountains until they decide to move, then they become avalanches! Fascinating folks.

    Well they are the same so it figures, though Daesung is subtype IMO. He'd just laugh it off.
    Yep, you know what's up. I'm glad Namjoon's IEI sense sorted him properly. Hufflepuff was a charade!

    Now I am interested in how he goes about understanding them that way, I see it with Jin already. Ok thanks for the long account either way, the essence is conveyed, it's not a high thing he's pulling there + he is as people-oriented and -conscious as someone with high ethics instead. SLI doesn't know what another person likes intricately or what cheers them up so you need to elaborate it to them, probably the opposite case here. Then SEI-Si it is!

    Oh... the "G-Dragon sunbaenim!!" thing. And the walking on eggshells, hmm. Yeah I noticed this as well, some sort of praise/appease thing going on, it's true. Also ties to valuing with pointing out talents.
    Ausra called them icebergs, I subscribe to that, time to bring the heaaatttt Introtims are just great.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Chae View Post
    Yep, you know what's up. I'm glad Namjoon's IEI sense sorted him properly. Hufflepuff was a charade!

    Now I am interested in how he goes about understanding them that way, I see it with Jin already. Ok thanks for the long account either way, the essence is conveyed, it's not a high thing he's pulling there + he is as people-oriented and -conscious as someone with high ethics instead. SLI doesn't know what another person likes intricately or what cheers them up so you need to elaborate it to them, probably the opposite case here. Then SEI-Si it is!

    Oh... the "G-Dragon sunbaenim!!" thing. And the walking on eggshells, hmm. Yeah I noticed this as well, some sort of praise/appease thing going on, it's true. Also ties to valuing with pointing out talents.
    Ausra called them icebergs, I subscribe to that, time to bring the heaaatttt Introtims are just great.

    Puffs already have two representatives on the group, they better leave our little snake alone

    It's fun to analyze and crack the code of other people types so I can forget the clausterfuck that is my own!

    Icebergs fits, I mean this is their princess:


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    Quote Originally Posted by FANXY CHILD View Post
    Puffs already have two representatives on the group, they better leave our little snake alone

    It's fun to analyze and crack the code of other people types so I can forget the clausterfuck that is my own!

    Icebergs fits, I mean this is their princess:

    Don't forget to count Yoongi in, although that's a given

    You'll manage your own code come on

    Oh right! "Conceal, don't feel"

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    Hanbin EII

    Fi smile + Se PoLR ( he left the band immediately instead of defending himself and resisting )

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