View Poll Results: Arnold Schwarzenegger's type?

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  • ILE (ENTp)

    0 0%
  • SEI (ISFp)

    0 0%
  • ESE (ESFj)

    0 0%
  • LII (INTj)

    0 0%
  • SLE (ESTp)

    0 0%
  • IEI (INFp)

    0 0%
  • EIE (ENFj)

    0 0%
  • LSI (ISTj)

    3 13.04%
  • SEE (ESFp)

    0 0%
  • ILI (INTp)

    0 0%
  • LIE (ENTj)

    5 21.74%
  • ESI (ISFj)

    1 4.35%
  • IEE (ENFp)

    0 0%
  • SLI (ISTp)

    1 4.35%
  • LSE (ESTj)

    13 56.52%
  • EII (INFj)

    0 0%
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Thread: Arnold Schwarzenegger

  1. #161
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    I would say high .

    Gives even the exact routine. I think LSE.

    It is like EII's appreciate fixed well tested proven methods developed by their dual but ESI's not so much. It is obvious that LIE's micromanaging sucks compared LSE.
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  2. #162
    both sides, now wacey's Avatar
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    I'm going to multi-quote you, so don't get your panties in a bunch.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bertrand View Post
    well strong sensing implicates the other, but its where the preference lies.
    For sure, that's socionics 101.

    Si simply does not care about the weight(Si bodybuilders, obviously Si weightlifters care)
    Depends on goals and also methods. In order to advance there needs to be awareness of weights and numbers, and I disagree they are moving forward on internal sensing intuition alone. Weightlifters vs. bodybuilders care about weight, body builders are simply more focused on reaching a state of hypertrophy via greater rep amount where as weightlifters goal is to increase max loads under the bar. It all comes down to how many reps and sets. Weight lifters lift heavier yet do less reps and bodybuilders lift lighter yet do more reps. Many people in the gym rotate between the two.

    except inasmuch
    There is the word again....

    as it provokes the proper internally perceived stimulus, so like they know when they're in "sweet spot" for gains, whereas Se is far more likely to mention the real amount of weight lifted as a signal of progress.
    Sensing is just sensing and finding that sweet spot is just as easily achieved for either (we are talking about weight trainers overall as not all Sensing people participate). Also, this statement you made shows me your understanding as far as Se goes is focused to much on what I call the "show-off factor". Many people mistake Se as being a information element whose only goal is showing off said abilities as a matter of course. The same confusion happens when people talk about Te as being only about efficiency and productivity. Sure, those are a part of it but not the whole picture. Se will signal progress by how capable they feel as objects in the world, and competence in this state is not just about adulation from others and the weight numbers game. If Te people view recording numbers as a efficient means then absolutely they are going to play that way. If Se people see recording as an over focus on the numbers then absolutely they are going to drop it in favour of "just doing it."

    Of course a lot of that is Se + Ti, in the sense of rigid progress markers by systematic measurement, i.e. progressive weight programming.
    Se is an conventionally intuitive perception and thus is not about systematic measurement. I see your combining it with Ti so that leads to something I have been circling in socionics and that is the following question about this guy and his program:
    https://stronglifts.com/about/
    This is an extremely popular app and website (number 1 on apply app store) started by this guy, Mehdi. For the longest time I couldn't decide whether or not he was SLI, or LSI and if his organized system was Te, or Ti. His 5x5 is a re-popularization of old weight training principles and although its really a numbers game, it would seem to be just as popular with SLIs because it is efficient and effective way to increase strength under bar, and is done in such a short amount of time daily. I follow a facebook 5x5 group that is chalk full of Si people and Se people so you get a cross between the two. So, it's something I had been thinking about over the past few years. Is this program Te, or is it Ti....?

    Se Te is more like "I lifted more than I did yesterday" or "my biceps grew .1 cm" or something. I agree Si valuing would be more nuanced in nutrition making enjoyable recipes, not just systematically prepping a months worth of meals in advance like I envision LSI.
    That LSI do this remains to be seen.

    lots of protein shakes seem like a Se thing, whereas Si would likely want real food, although I'm sure in a pinch they'll use whatever
    I've drank raw eggs and eaten protein powder in sludgy oatmeal for breakfast cause the taste doesn't matter for me.


    See Elliot Hulse for this. "Feel your body, get in touch with your internal central nervous system." I follow him on facebook for a number of years now and he post stuff like this daily. That people see him as LIE, and therefore 1D in object sensing is wrong imo:

    20604669_1646633945346779_8682576326787599673_n.jpg 20729636_1652322464777927_4173079939622732880_n.jpg22365402_1712962818713891_8242969411901538015_n.jpg426369_495436907133161_995505041_n.jpg

    (You could get into the Ni and Fi themes coming from these photos, but don't bother as I'd like to keep this conversation focused on bodybuilding, Arnold, Se-Si.)
    I put this up to illustrate that just pure Se is not a show-off informational element.

  3. #163
    a two horned unicorn renegade Heretic 007's Avatar
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    Hulse is probs SEE (or maybe SLE). I just listened his life story. It lacked all sorts of foresight.
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  4. #164
    Bertrand's Avatar
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    Hulse is sort of a memelord so he's all over the place with his advice but I would chalk most his shit up to Ni seeking. Si "feel your body" has sort of percolated into mainstream fitness consciousness, but the types in who such a thing is innate and doesn't need to be mentioned is Si. Its good that he derived the principle via Ni as a way to develop himself via acknowledging the value of his ignoring, and I see him as trying to pass that on

  5. #165
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bertrand View Post
    Hulse is sort of a memelord so he's all over the place with his advice but I would chalk most his shit up to Ni seeking. Si "feel your body" has sort of percolated into mainstream fitness consciousness, but the types in who such a thing is innate and doesn't need to be mentioned is Si. Its good that he derived the principle via Ni as a way to develop himself via acknowledging the value of his ignoring, and I see him as trying to pass that on
    Feel your nervous system is just a easily accomplished through Se and I wasn't meaning to say it was a Si perspective. Si is more about "what I like" in terms of sensing.

  6. #166
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    yeah I don't even know why we have introverted v extroverted categories, its really like v dislike

  7. #167
    both sides, now wacey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bertrand View Post
    yeah I don't even know why we have introverted v extroverted categories, its really like v dislike
    Unfortunately based on your past tones, I can’t tell if you are being sarcastic, or sincere. I’m assuming snarky/ sarcastic.

    Introverted sensing has an element of subjectivity, making it about what feels negative, neutral, postive. In other words what one likes and does not in the sensing realm. What feels confortable and what does not. How things make the organism react based on subjective inpressions.

    Si- will subject itself to negative sense impressions more so than Si+.

  8. #168
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    Quote Originally Posted by wacey View Post
    Unfortunately based on your past tones, I can’t tell if you are being sarcastic, or sincere. I’m assuming snarky/ sarcastic.

    Introverted sensing has an element of subjectivity, making it about what feels negative, neutral, postive. In other words what one likes and does not in the sensing realm. What feels confortable and what does not. How things make the organism react based on subjective inpressions.

    Si- will subject itself to negative sense impressions more so than Si+.
    you realize +/- is based off what its blocked with right. Si in general is just the granularity with which it perceives the stimulus

  9. #169
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scarper View Post
    For all the things he did in life, what stood out was that he could see it existing before it did, whilst no one else could see it. That sort of big picture vision is Ni and it is what makes the LIE an entrepreneur/pioneer over the LSE who will concern his business logic with details.
    Well, LIE is certainly a strong possibility for him. I still lean towards LSE because generally it fits better than LIE aside from a few outliers.
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  10. #170
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raver View Post
    Well, LIE is certainly a strong possibility for him. I still lean towards LSE because generally it fits better than LIE aside from a few outliers.
    Fair enough, i'm seeing that in a few places. I was surprised myself while I read his bio, I was expecting him to be LSE myself.

  11. #171
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    I wish I could take the LIE vote back because I can't seem to decide on this one... the more I think about it the more I'm unsure. As nebula said he very well resembles an ExTJ, whether he's a Ni or a Si remains to be seen...

    What made me pick LIE, and I'm still in favor of this option because of this, is the portrait over all of the LIE. Schwarzenegger resembles that portrait, pros and cons.
    On the other hand if I go by functions and stacks alone I have to admit he looks and behaves more as a creative Si, and all that Se.. UGH. Maybe the question of proof is... does he look Ne? And he doesn't look Ne at all to me... and demonstrative would supposedly show.

  12. #172
    Adam Strange's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ooo View Post
    I wish I could take the LIE vote back because I can't seem to decide on this one... the more I think about it the more I'm unsure. As nebula said he very well resembles an ExTJ, whether he's a Ni or a Si remains to be seen...

    What made me pick LIE, and I'm still in favor of this option because of this, is the portrait over all of the LIE. Schwarzenegger resembles that portrait, pros and cons.
    On the other hand if I go by functions and stacks alone I have to admit he looks and behaves more as a creative Si, and all that Se.. UGH. Maybe the question of proof is... does he look Ne? And he doesn't look Ne at all to me... and demonstrative would supposedly show.
    I'm LIE and I know a lot of LIE's and LSE's IRL, and my first impression of Arnold is that he's LSE through and through, but then I look at the things he has done and how he has done them, and LIE makes more sense.

    To be honest, I'm really not sure which type he is, either.

    Maybe the question could be answered if we knew more about his romantic style. Is he more of a Caregiver, or a Pseudo-aggressor Victim?

  13. #173
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    Maybe the question could be answered if we knew more about his romantic style. Is he more of a Caregiver, or a Pseudo-aggressor Victim?
    eheh I checked it and felt a bit disappointed http://edition.cnn.com/2011/US/05/18...ger/index.html... whatchu think?

    also this: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz...eing-body.html

    LIE..

  14. #174
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    Quote Originally Posted by ooo View Post
    eheh I checked it and felt a bit disappointed http://edition.cnn.com/2011/US/05/18...ger/index.html... whatchu think?
    I was aware of this, actually, and it's still a tough call.

    Screwing the housekeeper while being married seems Victimy (LIE), to me, especially if there were problems with the wife. Sort of a call for help, so to speak. But it can also seem entitled and Ni-blind, so LSE.

    Shiver was American Royalty, which LSE's would love, but I have also known LIE's who were in love with the idea of marrying into royalty, especially the e3 type.

    Arnold asked everyone not to discuss his infidelity, while admitting his infidelity. My ex-wife's LSE father simply didn't want to hear about how he had divorced her mother and abandoned his family to marry his secretary, who would work harder for him.

    Finally, Shiver came to Arnold's defense by saying he was "a good man". My last LSI GF told me I was a bad BF, but a good man.

    So, basically, I still can't decide which type Arnold is.

  15. #175
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    I was lurking at his sons' pictures and noticed he had 2 of very similar age, then went to look and they were born a week apart... and imagined how hard it must have been for the boy born last from the marriage to grow up with the idea of his dad cheating on his mum right before he was born... that's pretty tough. Kid is the fattest in the family, it might be 2 cents psychology but it looks like he's a fish out of water among them... made me sad.

    In that article it even reports of some accusations by some women against him, and whether they're true or not, it's not difficult to extend such an aggressive/victim dynamics even to the case of the maid. She was working in there, perhaps she was hoping for a better future treatment in doing what she did, but we can't be sure that Arnold himself didn't force her into some particular dynamics. Using his power and his self-entitlement as a charm, he could have made anyone do anything

  16. #176
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    Quote Originally Posted by ooo View Post
    I was lurking at his sons' pictures and noticed he had 2 of very similar age, then went to look and they were born a week apart... and imagined how hard it must have been for the boy born last from the marriage to grow up with the idea of his dad cheating on his mum right before he was born... that's pretty tough. Kid is the fattest in the family, it might be 2 cents psychology but it looks like he's a fish out of water among them... made me sad.

    In that article it even reports of some accusations by some women against him, and whether they're true or not, it's not difficult to extend such an aggressive/victim dynamics even to the case of the maid. She was working in there, perhaps she was hoping for a better future treatment in doing what she did, but we can't be sure that Arnold himself didn't force her into some particular dynamics. Using his power and his self-entitlement as a charm, he could have made anyone do anything
    Yes, we can't really know what went on, subjectively, not having been there.

    It is always fun to project, though. Lol.

  17. #177
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    He would go behind his partner all the time. He would take girls on to movie sets with him. Plain girls who weren't anything special, but Arnold liked the attention they gave him, because they were so enamoured that someone like Arnold would be into someone like them. He loved people admiring his body. The girls he went with did this very much.

    I don't know if this should be related to socionics, and I'm not convinced this is what the romance styles describe. Lot's of famous people are infamous when it comes to celibacy. Most PEOPLE would be too if they had the offers from what I can tell from the average person.

    However, this being admired for his body, this - going with someone beneath him, the plain girl, it sounds like a victim to me, he wants to be dominated - really that's what it is, it's not a relation of equals it's him submitting to someone when he could have someone so much better.

    I say caution though. So maybe I don't know enough about romance styles, but i'm pretty sure personal tastes and ..... perversions are individual related. But make of this what you will. It suggests he's being a victim here, if you want to look at it like that.

  18. #178
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    ^ Dangers of the e3 orientation....

    Although that's probably not all of it. I know an LIE-Te e3, and he's afraid to look at another woman, because his wife will take him for everything he's got. So Instincts certainly play a role.

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    ^ For sure, I remember Chae mentioning E3 in this thread. As for what I can understand with his marriage, she pretty much accepted that he'd be going behind his back, but when he went behind her back to the extent of having sex with the housekeeper in their very own house, had a child and hid the fact for years, she could not let that one slide. If not for herself, then for her role as a modern inspirational woman. There were too many factors at play. Although, all her interests seems to be very F and Fi orientated. I thought she might have been EII, but I didn't look into it further. Fi base is a definite possibility.

    Interesting to me, throughout the bio, Arnold said that he always knew he'd die alone, it looks like he's going to be right about that one too. You wonder though if it was all a self fulfilling prophecy.

  20. #180
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    So, basically, I still can't decide which type Arnold is.
    What do u think of ESI

  21. #181
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    Quote Originally Posted by Number 9 large View Post
    What do u think of ESI
    In general, I like them.

    But ESI as Arnold’s type, probably not.

    Really, it is hard for me to see any type other than LSE or LIE for Arnold. But why would you think ESI is a possibility?
    Last edited by Adam Strange; 01-03-2018 at 10:42 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    In general, I like them.

    But ESI as Arnold’s type, probably not.

    Really, it is hard for me to see any type other than LSE or LIE for Arnold. But why would you think ESI is a possibility?
    Sarcasm m8

  23. #183
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    Quote Originally Posted by Number 9 large View Post
    Sarcasm m8
    OK. Sorry, sarcasm doesn't always translate well in text. Plus, I'm really tired right now.

    As sarcasm, though, I think your comment was pretty funny.

    This could be ESI: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bgLfOrVJJMg

  24. #184
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    Arnold Schwarzenegger - ISTJ - Maxim Gorky - Inspector

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    I watched this documentary of him this morning.



    I'd argue for EIE. I never knew he was so competitive, driven, but not in the way doms are, he seems to have planned out his whole journey which indicates strong , at least stronger than suggestive. It seems he is extroverted and has beta values. I could see an argument for LIE, but since he was always part of a team in bodybuilding (I remember once he was quoted with saying they would motivate each other at the gym as a group), I can't see him as lone 'lone wolf' enough to be LIE.

    Another reason for EIE is he has a strong sense of public image, he's always worked hard in that area.

    Competitive, driven, team player/motivator, good public speaker, keen on his image, I'd say EIE.


  26. #186
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    LSE

    Watch him here. His kind of humour is very typical of LSEs (Ne mobilizing).


  27. #187
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    SLE with a dominant subtype

  28. #188
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    LIE Dominant subtype

    I can't see LSE at all

  29. #189
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    well you could argue that LSE have Se as strong demonstrative function, but it's very valued in schwarzenegger. in his fitness videos, he often mentions willpower as very important. He cares about money, status, his appearance. I think Si and Fi are very underdeveloped and unvalued functions for him, and it makes LSE and LIE very unlikely.

  30. #190
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallmo View Post
    LIE Dominant subtype

    I can't see LSE at all
    I agree.

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    ESE

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    What is this lunacy people??? He’s LSE my dual
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 2w1sw(1w9) helps others to live up to their own standards of what a good person is and is very behind the scenes in the process.
    Tritype 1-2-6 stacking sp/sx


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

  33. #193
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    SLE, he's cute

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    Quote Originally Posted by ooo View Post
    SLE, he's cute
    You already said LIE. What you cannot see Te ?
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 2w1sw(1w9) helps others to live up to their own standards of what a good person is and is very behind the scenes in the process.
    Tritype 1-2-6 stacking sp/sx


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

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    i can see his muscles and his mighty manners, quite charming, agreed

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beautiful sky View Post
    What you cannot see Te ?
    Te is a very strong 4 dimensional function for SLE. an LSE has Se as 4 dimensional function.

    makes it hard to differentiate quasi-identicals sometimes.

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    What's the purpose of SEI? Tallmo's Avatar
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    Some years back I remember people in forum talking about him as LSE. I didn't think much of it until I decided "ok, let's take a look". So I spent a few days watching documentaries online, including "Pumping iron". After that things were clear. Not LSE, but LIE. Very good confidence about development and career, Te was obvious. Very good at risk taking and making money. And then just the general impression that is more LIE than LSE

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    he's a very interesting case for sure. if you look at the functional profile of a dominant subtype, they have accentuated Se, Te and Fe, which basically fit well into LSE, SLE and LIE. that's why he's probably such a confusing case. I've watched this video just now:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M6Fg4dfw49k

    at the beginning of the video, he appears basically like an SLE with his "whatever it takes" mentality, but near the end he seems like a very strong Te type. I will analyse him more in the next few days when I have more time

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