Article: Alpha Quadra: The Complex of Closed Mouth by Stratiyevskaya

[silke]

You can view the page at http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...Stratiyevskaya

[Blaze]

This is great, covers many dimensions, and could be expanded by a few more. The power of sound, words, and ideas cannot be underestimated. Alpha quadra develops ideas and transmits them to Beta, who selects the ones with the best chances of mass appeal, and applies those. This golden thread of ideas encodes the activities of the entire quadra chain. In this way ideas can be more powerful than weapons, commerce, and institutions.

The question on the table at this place and time is what is the new golden thread that needs to be articulated and discussed? Where is our species really headed if we continue as we have been? What are the most powerful ideas that will drive the change in consciousness that's required for us to successfully adapt?

This description frames Alpha as sort of powerless and struggling for scraps of resources.....and is just a bit of a characiture of a loud mouth buffoon, as least the way it's written. Strateyevskaya does a pretty good job, especially as a gamma.....yet the Alpha description seems a bit one dimensional compared to the others. Delta for example seems to have lifted up as the pinnacle of human evolution and perhaps we could agree it is so, but age after age, delta's tragic empires rise and fall.

At the end of the day we each are sacred souls with specific spiritual destinies.....time is only change we we are transformative containers of energy, part of the cosmos personalized and looking at itself.

[Exodus]

There are a lot of astute observations in this article. Yes, Alphas need to be able to freely and openly discuss whatever they feel like. It's not clear if she realizes that this is because of valuing and rather than and though...many of the theoretical explanations are shady at best. She also projects a lot of motivations that have little to do with how Alphas actually think. LIke...

Beginning to speak, they won't stop until they draw the majority to their side.

This is often sufficient for "judicious" quadra members to insist on their own opinions: whoever yells and shouts the loudest, whoever is most proactive in an argument – that person will have the last word, that person is correct and in the right.

The "declaring" "sensing of sensations" aspect of Alpha Quadra (Si) – is crude, rough, grounding and base (in its extreme expressions), and works to their self-assertion in a dispute. They aren't shy in sensory and emotional expressions – for too much is at stake: the struggle for material resources, rights, and opportunities, that are all scarce – this is a struggle for life or death. The struggle for survival here is not a joke: Alpha "program" sensing type SEI Dumas (+Si / -Fe) won't allow himself or his children to perish, but will fight for survival until the end; if not for himself, then at least for the sake of the children – and will stop at nothing if he wants to overcome his opposition.

...Seriously?

[Blaze]

There are a lot of astute observations in this article. Yes, Alphas need to be able to freely and openly discuss whatever they feel like. It's not clear if she realizes that this is because of valuing and rather than and though...many of the theoretical explanations are shady at best. She also projects a lot of motivations that have little to do with how Alphas actually think. LIke...



...Seriously?

agree completely. only ESE might tread into that territory and not all that likely due to their ethics. I guess as a gamma she reads Se when really if Alpha is at all forceful it is Ti related not Se related. and I still think it's one dimensional. basically all she says is that alpha has a big mouth.

[Jerdle]

agree completely. only ESE might tread into that territory and not all that likely due to their ethics. I guess as a gamma she reads Se when really if Alpha is at all forceful it is Ti related not Se related. and I still think it's one dimensional. basically all she says is that alpha has a big mouth.

She's not wrong about that, though. Alpha does have a big mouth.
ESE and ILE might be aggressive, but even then it's not a major part of them. Basically, Alpha extratims are the shouters of the Socion. Loud, aggressive (bold ), controversial.

[Blaze]

She's not wrong about that, though. Alpha does have a big mouth.
ESE and ILE might be aggressive, but even then it's not a major part of them. Basically, Alpha extratims are the shouters of the Socion. Loud, aggressive (bold ), controversial.

Agree with the big mouth.....but that's basically all she says, therefore one dimensional and limited. Someone non-gamma should give it a try, then it might get more fleshed out, ideally collaborate with some Alphas.

[wasp]

They're satirical representations of the negative qualities most prominent in each quadra. It's like a caricature. In a positive social setting, this is great because it means that they're comfortable communicating with each other in any which way they please, not worrying too much about their words being taken to heart, hence the light teasing. The problem lies in them carrying this same attitude over to negative social settings. They just fly off the handle (extratims, mainly) and expect that you'll forgive them for being cunts to you for potentially no reason, even if they ruin your social standing in the process, which they assume you'll jump back from just as they naturally would. All quadras are guilty of this self-centered thinking.

I think that's where the Alpha-Gamma clash becomes most apparent. Alphas talk to talk. Gammas talk when they have something to say. If an argument breaks out between the two, Alpha types fire away until they feel better (aka "everything's out in the open") but Gamma types stay quiet, and if they do say something then they usually mean it, and where an Alpha type leaves that interaction feeling a cathartic release of sorts, Gamma types internalize the irritation they experienced during that interaction and it sticks with them for a LONG time, hence why they're prone to grudges/revenge/etc. And I don't think Alpha types are above, "public executions," (especially ILE, jaysus christ almighty). Alpha is thinking, "Just call me an idiot!!! Please!!! Let's get this over with already!!!" whereas Gamma is thinking, "You're an idiot but I'd rather you just shut up. Goodbye."

This is probably why Alphas tend to, "love by touch, not by words", because nothing they say really means anything. Rooster Teeth podcasts are a fantastic exemplar of the Alpha quadra in action. The positive manifestation, that is.

[Bertrand]

I know this is slightly off topic but can you do beta/delta in the same way you just did alpha/gamma? I really liked the way you described it

[wasp]

I know this is slightly off topic but can you do beta/delta in the same way you just did alpha/gamma? I really liked the way you described it

haha I can but I'd need to wait until I feel inspired or something. coming soon to a thread near you?

[back on topic, sorry for the temp derail guise]

[flames]

Seems like the same thing for Beta-Delta to me. Beta thinks Delta is annoyingly lame because they're more modest and focused on sober and lighthearted but serious things (work, nonsensical but dry humor, emotional maturity - not a roast on betas I prefer them over deltas haha). Delta thinks Beta is obnoxiously loud and tryhard and just wants to get away from them to do their own thing. Just picture someone quietly reading a book in the library and some idiot next to them who keeps purposely pushing their buttons and then book nerd just responds with a look of annoyment and avoidance by moving somewhere else.

[mr drapetomaniac]

Alphas can be quiet even ESEs. Introverted thinking. That's freaking quiet IE static time consuming and introverted.

Until it is time for something that sparks their interest and those topics may sound useless to gammas.



Gamma talk is the most nonsensical. Time for this. You can do that with sign language.

[Pookie]

There are a lot of astute observations in this article. Yes, Alphas need to be able to freely and openly discuss whatever they feel like. It's not clear if she realizes that this is because of valuing and rather than and though...many of the theoretical explanations are shady at best. She also projects a lot of motivations that have little to do with how Alphas actually think. LIke...



...Seriously?

Hnm is this saying judicious types argue with the objective of winning the most people to their side?

[wasp]

Seems like the same thing for Beta-Delta to me. Beta thinks Delta is annoyingly lame because they're more modest and focused on sober and lighthearted but serious things (work, nonsensical but dry humor, emotional maturity - not a roast on betas I prefer them over deltas haha). Delta thinks Beta is obnoxiously loud and tryhard and just wants to get away from them to do their own thing. Just picture someone quietly reading a book in the library and some idiot next to them who keeps purposely pushing their buttons and then book nerd just responds with a look of annoyment and avoidance by moving somewhere else.

pretty much. they judge the value of a person based on contradictory criteria. concurrently, their brand of aristocracy is contradictory.



this is obviously a simplified version of what actually happens, but apply the stick-person principle to all four quadras, specifically "rivalry" quadras (or whatever they're called). oddly enough, i think that's why duality descriptions state that people can experience a strong attraction to their conflictors in the initial stages of interaction. they're easy to spot because it's like stumbling upon a laundry machine in the jungle, whereas your duals are caught in your blindside because they fit so perfectly with the scenery that you don't even think twice about their presence, which kind of contradicts the sketch i made on paint, but i'm sure there's a logical explanation for why i think those two views are compatible? i could've sworn i was onto something

[mr drapetomaniac]

So gamma is business experience (seriously you just want something that is meaningless), delta is human experience (freaking egocentric old farts), alpha is idea experience (you need to talk those things or universe collapses), beta is yell and order experience (sit, stay, roll).

[Jerdle]

Slightly more positively:
Alpha - ideas
Beta - society
Gamma - production
Delta - creativity

[Exodus]

Hnm is this saying judicious types argue with the objective of winning the most people to their side?

If that's what she's saying, then I don't agree at all.

[rivka]

this rlly fucked me up whew

[mr drapetomaniac]

I WIN!

[SilverJogiLow]

Life is a Game, the Game where if You learn the rules of the Game, then You play the Game better than anyone else. The Game involves seeking our higher balance, above and beyond the loftiest levels of the tree of life. The world opens up when we harmonize with the Force of God, come into union with the script. There is a heaven that emerges from the mountaintop. The way of heaven is found in the security of the divine intellect, which makes impossibilities overcome.

[roshanak]

Gamma talk is the most nonsensical. Time for this. You can do that with sign language.

Well, this is rather disappointing, as I've read quite a few of your posts with considerable interest.

And now alas the shadow of this your most nonsensical post --'most' as in very; 'most' as in most out of the ones of yours I've read (and up to now the only nonsensical one, but then I'm new-ish to socionics so I really can't say for sure); and 'most' as in enshrined in the Ether in the crowded but still selective Typogallery of Most Nonsensical Posts--shall loom over all your posts I read like a drizzling cloud of dull acid rain until/unless you repent.

That said, on the bright side, you have inspired me out of sheer annoyance to post myself.

Cheers from Gamma, SlightLemonSleep.

[Baqer]

Life is a Game, the Game where if You learn the rules of the Game, then You play the Game better than anyone else. The Game involves seeking our higher balance, above and beyond the loftiest levels of the tree of life. The world opens up when we harmonize with the Force of God, come into union with the script. There is a heaven that emerges from the mountaintop. The way of heaven is found in the security of the divine intellect, which makes impossibilities overcome.

what does this have to do with this thread

[Braingel]

what does this have to do with this thread

Fi PolR (of him) moment and his NE