As it turns out...

[Joy]

I've been SEE the whole time. Merry Christmas!


Five year old Joy says, "Obvs!"



For reference, I posted this over a year ago about my tentative LSE typing:

I do think there's a significant risk for confirmation bias in typing, and that's a big part of the reason I'm not sure if I'll ever fully embrace a type again. Other reasons include not wanting to take myself or Socionics too seriously and knowing that I've changed a lot over the years and may change again.

I will say though that while the original LSE typing (that I was willing to listen to) came from him after a long private conversation on Facebook when I was at a point where I didn't care about Socionics at all and wasn't a bit invested in being any particular type. He didn't know me at all at the time and also didn't care what my type was, so it seemed a reasonable suggestion to consider. I was pregnant at the time and thought it might be making me more Delta-ish, so I decided to just put the idea on the back burner until I'd had the baby and was out of postpartum recovery for while. Now it's been over a year since I had her, and I'm still feeling Delta ST. We'll see what happens.

Vulnerable Ti much? lol

And for the hell of it, something I posted ten years ago because I just stumbled upon it again and found it humorous.

I decide what personality I'll have, not my build or facial features! I suppose not everyone is as resiliant, but still... I dunno. I'm not trying to be difficult, I guess just don't get this whole concept.

And a photo of the aforementioned baby, because d'awww:

[Kim]

You have a conflict-avoidant and somewhat complacent energy about you which I don't associate with SEEs. I have never met a conflict-avoidant SEE (or sx/so for that matter). I also think you are too insecure in Fi matters to have it in your ego-block. LSE works much better.

Piper is SO DAMN CUTE!

[Joy]

Well, LSE is still definitely an option I'm considering. I'm considering all of the extroverted and sensory types, actually. Some people have even seriously suggested IEE and LIE (I don't think my Si is weak enough for those types though.) Whatever my type is, I'm an unusual representation of it, and I've ALWAYS said this. Right now I'm finding that things fall into place best if I'm SEE though. I'm going to roll with it for a bit and see how it shakes out.

I'm not conflict seeking, but I'm most certainly not conflict avoidant! Sometimes I'm complacent in a way (more like lazy). Often I'm proactive. Sometimes I'm hyper. Sometimes I'm rowdy.

Is being insecure really type related? Keep in mind that I've only recently realized what polyamory is and how it relates to me. I've always had a lot of relationship problems and doubts, but I think it's too be expected given the situation. And yes, I'm always looking for input and insight on my interpersonal dealings... But how often do I actually take anyone's advice? Almost never. Someone who've talked to about Fi stuff said this: "You seem to ask for advice when it comes to relationships but you seen pretty okay with it on your own. You have strong opinions and seem to be able to understand the emotionality. I never did understand why you asked for input because you seemed to have a clear grasp of how you viewed the relationship and what you think you should do. It seems as though you just liked talking about it." It's a fair point...

Here are some points I posted on World Socionics Society that include things both for and against SEE:

Se: I undoubtedly have strong Se. The question is whether it's valued or subdued. Having strong Se means knowing how much force to apply with any given situation/person. I've been very oriented to EIIs due to being married to one and spending so much time in WSS around them. I'm happy to be gentle and protective with them (perhaps I'm even too protective), but I very much enjoy being around people who can handle more Se from me. I definitely enjoy when people encourage/appreciate it! But even then, I feel I'm so used to controlling/suppressing it that I'm not fully letting the beast out of the cage, so to speak. However, the “I do what I want” mentality is quite prevalent in me, I like taking charge, and romantically/sexually I've been called a “textbook aggressor”. When I'm not sure what the best course of action is, my tendency is to just DO something with the confidence that I can deal with the repercussions, whatever they may be. “Fortune favors the bold.” My confidence in my resilience allows me to push forward without too much worry that I'll fail or be rejected/embarrassed. That ties into this, which is something I actually said almost word for word when someone was telling me that I rush decisions. https://www.facebook.com/groups/worl...6243448728704/

Fi: This is tricky. I've believed myself to have either vulnerable or suggestive Fi for a decade, and I can't help but wonder if I've created unnecessary distrust in my Fi as a result. Also, I'm polyamorous, and that's created a lot of issues and hurt for me over the years because I was fighting it instead of embracing it. Lately I've been really considering if the fact that this has been an area of pain for me is actually related to my circumstances/relationships more than to weakness in this IME. A few points:
- I intrinsically know how trustworthy people are in various areas, and I'm quite confident in my evaluation of this. Sometimes I get hurt because I decide to take on a chance on someone I know I can't trust, but I'm almost never flat out wrong about how much I trusted someone. I think this is both Fi (character evaluation) and Se as part of Se is sensing a person's “willingness to mobilize”, which basically means I know how liable a person is to actually do something. This is actually a pretty complicated subject for me, which says something in and of itself. I trust most people in some area or another and few people completely.
- I do stress about how people feel about me sometimes, but in hindsight I always knew and just didn't trust my evaluation as much as I should have. I've been getting better about this in the past handful of years, especially lately.
- I can sense the need for more distance and easily create it without being all or nothing. For example, I tend to tolerate some friendships that hurt me because I care about the person and/or can see potential for a better future, but when it gets too much for me I know how to back off just enough without actually ending the relationship or even damaging it (unless it needs to be "damaged" for the best outcome). I can often even do this without hurting/upsetting the other person. Sometimes the distance is permanent; sometimes it's temporary. Once I've been hurt enough (or sense enough danger) to put up a solid wall of protection, it's very difficult if not impossible to get past it.
- Sometimes I'm just way too hurt to continue a friendship/relationship, and when that's the case, I have no trouble cutting someone out of my life. They can even cry and beg for another chance, but when I'm done, I'm done.
- I love giving relationship advice! And I'm confident in my ability to do so. Often the advice ends up being, “You need to talk to him/her and tell him/her how you feel,” or, “That's bullshit, and you shouldn't have to deal with it. Get rid of him/her! You'll both be better off that way.”
- I love talking about my relationships and friendships, too! Ask anyone.
- I'm extremely gregarious and social. I love talking to and interacting with people, and I feel comfortable approaching pretty much anyone. I initiate both the beginning and end of most of my friendships and relationships.
- I have a strong sense of right vs wrong, though I generally don't think in those terms. I respect other people's sense of this, but I do not tolerate having them impose it on me. I'm quite comfortable in my own evaluations. Sometimes I need advice about how to accomplish the right thing though.
- I quickly pick up on and easily remember other people's likes and dislikes. I feel mine are pretty flexible and not a huge area of focus though. This could be a point against strong Fi, actually.

Ne: This is where it starts to potentially fall apart. I identify with all of Jack's description of Ne role in SEEs, but at the same time, I enjoy Ne from Delta NFs. It's goofy and fun! (I definitely do find too much of it or use of it at inopportune times annoying though.) I see value in considering possibilities and other people's perspectives. I value goodwill and harmony. I mean, I'm not shy about getting into confrontations if they're necessary, but I avoid them when possible.

Ti: I don't think I'm bad with Ti. I can use it when I want/need to just fine... ish. Usually there's no need though. tongue emoticon I absolutely cannot imagine EVER putting myself into a power hierarchy like the military! Also, my use of Ti is rather inconsistent. Sometimes I'm sharp and able to use it well. Other times not so much. I've been told that I have a very structured way of thinking by a few people over the years.

Ni: Yes, I can totally buy this as something I want from others. Sometimes I ask people what will happen if I do something, why something is happening, etc.

Te: Erm... I think I'm actually pretty darn good at and focused on this for the most part. Sometimes I do stupid crap that and instantly recognize it as a Te mistake after the fact. I also suck at things you wouldn't think a Te lead would suck at. Like paying bills on time (money's not the issue), for example.

Si: I'm not so sure about this one. My EII (probably) husband takes care of Si needs more than I do and focuses more on it in general, but I'm better at it. I love to cook and am amazing at it, but I only do it once in a while. Always a hobby. Never a chore. I'm also crappy with housekeeping just in general. My house is only somewhat clean if I'm about to have company. I also don't eat when I should (which causes problems). Or I eat too much. However, I feel I'm pretty aware of my body... I just don't always prioritize it.

Fe: This is another area when I'm pretty on and off. I'm very aware of other people's emotions, but I'm often not emotionally expressive. In fact, I'm actually really dry. I prefer to keep my emotions to myself for the most part, and when I do express them, it's often by telling rather than showing how I feel, and I'm not very dramatic about how I tell it. For example, I'll flatly state, “I'm really upset about this.” However, I'm not always like this. I can recall many times I've expressed emotion strongly as well. I don't know. As for emotional atmosphere, I'm always aware of it, but I don't usually care much. Sometimes I do things to make it less awkward. Often times I'm the one who's leading the atmosphere/conversation in groups, but it's also not super uncommon for me to be content to just be quiet (you'd mistake me for an SLI!). One of my favorite ways to make things less awkward is actually by purposely being awkward myself. Yup, I'm a weirdo.

As for quadra values... I can see good arguments for both Gamma and Delta. I'm more EP-like than EJ-like. I'm least IJ-like. However, I am constantly aware of changes around me, which makes me think I'm more static. I also relate much more to yielding than obstinate, which I would think is odd for an SEE. I've been married to an ILI, ESI, and EII, and I'm definitely WAY more happy with the EII than I ever was with the Gammas! (Granted, neither of those Gammas were very healthy.) So yeah. I'm just not sure what to think.



In summary, yeah, there are some issues with SEE. There are issues with every possible typing for me though.

[Kalinoche buenanoche]

@Joy your TIM is still LSE-C ,under the avatar area

btw, the ESI you mention is Peter?

[Joy]

@Joy your TIM is still LSE-C ,under the avatar area

btw, the ESI you mention is Peter?

Thanks, and yes. I'm very certain that he's Fi > Ti and not interested in delving into the subject. If people disagree (and I can see why they might), that's okay.

[blackburry]

My vote has always been Ne/Si for you. Ni PoLR is apparent. ESE-Si > LSE-Si.

[The Exception]

@Joy I will still like you and be your friend even you end up being my conflictor. I still think LSE is more likely. Maybe I'm just biased because in my interactions with you I didn't sense a conflictor vibe. There's also a small possibility I'm not LII either.

[glam]

Joy i think the best fit for you is LSE, i thought you were even before you typed yourself that! Te focus isn't hard to see, you like Fi, Ni PoLR works (introspection issues - i believe you've typed yourself into all four quadras at one point i would think a Ti-DS like ESE would desire more consistency), and IMO you don't have valued/strong Fe. just roll with ittttt

[Sol]

without video there is not enough about your type

[Joy]

without video there is not enough about your type

I do video chats sometimes. I could post something here if I plan to be in one.