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    Default Why is Se so desired?

    Why is Se so desired in both Socionics as a subtype, and MBTI as a top cognitive function? Is it because of society? Is it the whole "living in the moment" craze? Is it the exploration aspect?

    Someone, please tell me. I am an SLe-ESTp and I don't get the whole "Se" craze. Someone explain this to me.

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    Because IEIs gravitate to personality theory so a bunch of Se suggestive are on these sites.

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    I have never known this to be the case. Who told you that?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Elina View Post
    Because IEIs gravitate to personality theory so a bunch of Se suggestive are on these sites.
    I guess. I've never actually met an IEI in real life before. They must be pretty rare in reality, compared to Se, Fe and Si, Ti subtypes.
    Quote Originally Posted by Galen View Post
    I have never known this to be the case. Who told you that?
    I dunno, that's just the impression I am getting, looking through things on both sites and listening to people's opinions. It could just be me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by luchoislurking View Post
    Why is Se so desired in both Socionics as a subtype, and MBTI as a top cognitive function? Is it because of society? Is it the whole "living in the moment" craze? Is it the exploration aspect?

    Someone, please tell me. I am an SLe-ESTp and I don't get the whole "Se" craze. Someone explain this to me.
    I wasn't aware of it being that desired, in a any significant way, among the masses so I am not sure what kind of explanation you are asking for.

    Edit: I see Galen was in before me...

    “My typology is . . . not in any sense to stick labels on people at first sight. It is not a physiognomy and not an anthropological system, but a critical psychology dealing with the organization and delimitation of psychic processes that can be shown to be typical.”​ —C.G. Jung
     
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elina View Post
    Because IEIs gravitate to personality theory so a bunch of Se suggestive are on these sites.
    That's pretty much it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by luchoislurking View Post
    I guess. I've never actually met an IEI in real life before. They must be pretty rare in reality, compared to Se, Fe and Si, Ti subtypes.
    Nah, types are pretty evenly distributed throughout the general population. Certain subcultures and hobbies may draw certain types more than others, but IME they're all about evenly spread.

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    Quote Originally Posted by luchoislurking View Post
    Why is Se so desired in both Socionics as a subtype, and MBTI as a top cognitive function? Is it because of society? Is it the whole "living in the moment" craze? Is it the exploration aspect?

    Someone, please tell me. I am an SLe-ESTp and I don't get the whole "Se" craze. Someone explain this to me.
    Is it???
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aylen View Post
    I wasn't aware of it being that desired, in a any significant way, among the masses so I am not sure what kind of explanation you are asking for.

    Edit: I see Galen was in before me...
    Yeah. Oh, well. I dunno. Our whole Western culture seems gravitated toward SLE, SEE, ESE types etc. Extroverted Feelers and Sensors.

    Quote Originally Posted by Elina View Post
    I'm not sure how rare they are. I know MBTI theory says the Ni/Fe type is the rarest, but MBTI sucks anyway lol. I have one IEI friend right now irl, other than that I can't think of any others off the top of my head. But sometimes you might miss/mistype people and think you don't know any of that type when you do.
    Also, socionics theory says that you and your dual live in opposite environments. So if you're an SLE, IEIs are likely to not be hanging out in the same environment, doing the same activities as you.
    Yeah, MBTI is too abstract. I used to think I was an xSFJ, but I looked into Socionics, and it was clear that I was an SLE-ESTp. It was down to my looping. Fe-Se loop. Now I am getting out of it, thank God.

    Yeah, so basically places I would never been seen dead in? Activism, Libraries, Star Trek Conventions, Bhuddist Temples, India

    Quote Originally Posted by SisOfNight View Post
    That's pretty much it.
    Yuuuupppp.

    Quote Originally Posted by Galen View Post
    Nah, types are pretty evenly distributed throughout the general population. Certain subcultures and hobbies may draw certain types more than others, but IME they're all about evenly spread.
    What about this whole 1% and 4% thing? Is that just garbage?
    Yeah. I doubt I'd find many ILIs in nightclubs. I doubt I'd find many SLEs in a library, and I doubt I'd find many EIEs fighting with Toro in a bullring.

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    Quote Originally Posted by luchoislurking View Post
    What about this whole 1% and 4% thing? Is that just garbage?
    I only ever see those percentages in reference to MBTI, but yeah I still think it's garbage. Largely because MBTI is garbage.

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    I don't feel like Se is very desired in my life/job/friends.

    I feel like most people appreciate Si and Ne. Not Se... And definitely not Fi.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Elina View Post
    Haha try local open mic nights. Artsy fartsy stuff. Go get your fortune read by a palm reader/tarot reader. Good chance she'll be IEI lol


    Oh yeah tools of the trade but higher chance he will get an ESE, SEE, EIE or IEE gypsy type. At least that has been my experience, irl. Maybe if he finds one online (who may or may not be available for weeks at a time) it might be a legit IEI. lol

    I think I had an ESI read my cards once. I felt scolded after.

    ^ Edit: she said I wasn't living right.

    “My typology is . . . not in any sense to stick labels on people at first sight. It is not a physiognomy and not an anthropological system, but a critical psychology dealing with the organization and delimitation of psychic processes that can be shown to be typical.”​ —C.G. Jung
     
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    Quote Originally Posted by Galen View Post
    I only ever see those percentages in reference to MBTI, but yeah I still think it's garbage. Largely because MBTI is garbage.
    Yeah. The whole I = Introversion S = Sensing etc thing is dumb.

    Some MBTIs are more hidden than others ;D

    Quote Originally Posted by blackburry View Post
    I don't feel like Se is very desired in my life/job/friends.

    I feel like most people appreciate Si and Ne. Not Se... And definitely not Fi.
    Depends on where you work? And who you hang out with, I guess.

    Quote Originally Posted by Elina View Post
    Haha try local open mic nights. Artsy fartsy stuff. Go get your fortune read by a palm reader/tarot reader. Good chance she'll be IEI lol
    Open mic is as far as I'll go, lol. Tarot reading is bull, to me xP

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    Probably because Se can immediately change your internal physical state (Si). People become conditioned like dogs to seek Se objects that feel pleasurable, especially types with strong Si. Generally, Si tends to polarise one's perception of the material world, according to how it feels inside.

    Types with weak Si but strong Ni (all intuitives) experience the material world more neutrally. This is because most of their attention is on mental symbols of the real world, on their past and future development. Ni, being something of a visual overlay, can also both enhance the effect of se, and reduce it, depending on how the symbols are changing. So it can act like an anesthetic (or an aphrodisiac).
    Last edited by ConcreteButterfly; 06-16-2015 at 06:00 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ConcreteButterfly View Post
    Probably because Se can immediately change your internal physical state (Si). People become conditioned like dogs to seek Se objects that feel pleasurable, especially types with strong Si. Generally, Si tends to polarise one's perception of the material world, according to how it feels inside.

    Types with weak Si but strong Ni (all intuitives) experience the material world more neutrally. This is because most of their attention is on mental symbols of the real world, on their past and future development. Ni, being something of a visual overlay, can also both enhance the effect of se, and reduce it, depending on how the symbols are changing. So it can like an anaesthetic.
    Ah, that makes sense. So Ni-Doms can control their Se intake?
    Quote Originally Posted by Elina View Post
    Lol. I had an astrology reading done by a Beta NF once. I think EIE. The role rly seemed to fit her.
    Dang.
    Quote Originally Posted by Aylen View Post


    Oh yeah tools of the trade but higher chance he will get an ESE, SEE, EIE or IEE gypsy type. At least that has been my experience, irl. Maybe if he finds one online (who may or may not be available for weeks at a time) it might be a legit IEI. lol

    I think I had an ESI read my cards once. I felt scolded after.

    ^ Edit: she said I wasn't living right.
    Really? ESFPs are into that? Can I trick one? Lol.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Elina View Post
    Because IEIs gravitate to personality theory so a bunch of Se suggestive are on these sites.
    Don't forget Se-POLRs who like to blame things going wrong on their lack of Se!

    And also maybe it is cos of society: it's all of the leadership/individualism/capitalism ideals but without being too cerebral like Te seems. It's also good at dealing with pressure and fighting for oneself - which people (well, I) have been able to avoid by being "coddled"/protected for my past 20 years.
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    If I really get what you're trying to say, it is because of the following: humans, until they attain some sort of spiritual awakening, or better said, until they have some sort of real spiritual experience, which may be personality-conscious or personality-unconscious, are driven by the Will to Power, this Will the author F. Nietzsche based his work on, and he was widely misunderstood as supporting it. After there is the awakening or the 'light-bringing' into the personality, this may be either through conscious or unconscious processes, then the human being is basically driven to Wisdom and Love, and Understanding which is part of Wisdom. So, Se is widely regarded as 'positive' because it implies power, but not the true Power. After the soul has began pouring its influence on the personality level, then it can be said the individual may choose between pursuing Power first or Love first. Then Power has a whole different dimension to it and is worthy calling it Power, and it has its toll also. But before the individual has gained Wisdom and Love to some measure, the most primitive instincts tell him to achieve power over others, and strength to survive, and basically this most animistic primitive part has its control over the human being until some spiritual awakening happens. The Power that may come after a spiritual development has begun is also related to Se in a sense, but in a completely different manner.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ClownsandEntropy View Post
    Don't forget Se-POLRs who like to blame things going wrong on their lack of Se!

    And also maybe it is cos of society: it's all of the leadership/individualism/capitalism ideals but without being too cerebral like Te seems. It's also good at dealing with pressure and fighting for oneself - which people (well, I) have been able to avoid by being "coddled"/protected for my past 20 years.
    These reasons you cited above are also a big motive why people tend to invest so much their time and value so much Se and Te. These can also be seen as part of the western mentality: individualism and money. Money is power, therefore in the end to have power you need money, and if you have power you have money in society, but not real power. This is the distinction I make between real Power and power in society. Real Power is an influx of Will energy, it energizes and is electrical and fiery by nature, can only be understood in terms of experience with it, while society-power is money and is also an influx of energy but material by nature.

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    honestly, depends on where you are / where you belong etc.

    when i was in uni there was a huge bias towards Ne and Fi, team-work team-building crap and being part of extra-curricular activities and competitions and everything. the SLEs were most definitely outcasts. even i was an outcast, because i refused to be a part of the IEE "groupthink" but i had an easier time fitting into the study environment than SLEs and LSIs. IEI friend almost dropped out of uni because of lack of support or direction (and i think he really needed more Se professors and motivators etc). so i really don't think it's fair to say Se is desired in every context in society. just for reference, i was an ECE grad, which is one of the more challenging and technical majors.

    likewise, separately an IEE friend who is a business grad, was very well integrated into his study environment and made loads of friends and is moving forward very quickly in his job. i don't know much about what sort of environment he was surrounded with but again, it would be unfair to say his IEE-ness wasn't valued.

    soooo it really depends. i now work for an IT thing and a good majority of people here are alpha / delta, with a few betas and gammas. the betas stick out from afar because Se is such a weird unusual thing here. you can't really make a blanket statement like this IMO.

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    i will concede that while i was in uni i was friends with mostly outcasts because i related more to that, so my friends were an SEI and LSI, and i was friendly with a lot of betas whom i got to know through these two people. and within those contexts often i felt like all of my Fi or Ne was being stiffled. when i was surrounded by 3 SLEs and two ILEs and one SEI (which often happened), i couldn't really say anything that others thought was of value. so it depends.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Radio View Post
    honestly, depends on where you are / where you belong etc.

    when i was in uni there was a huge bias towards Ne and Fi, team-work team-building crap and being part of extra-curricular activities and competitions and everything. the SLEs were most definitely outcasts. even i was an outcast, because i refused to be a part of the IEE "groupthink" but i had an easier time fitting into the study environment than SLEs and LSIs. IEI friend almost dropped out of uni because of lack of support or direction (and i think he really needed more Se professors and motivators etc). so i really don't think it's fair to say Se is desired in every context in society. just for reference, i was an ECE grad, which is one of the more challenging and technical majors.

    likewise, separately an IEE friend who is a business grad, was very well integrated into his study environment and made loads of friends and is moving forward very quickly in his job. i don't know much about what sort of environment he was surrounded with but again, it would be unfair to say his IEE-ness wasn't valued.

    soooo it really depends. i now work for an IT thing and a good majority of people here are alpha / delta, with a few betas and gammas. the betas stick out from afar because Se is such a weird unusual thing here. you can't really make a blanket statement like this IMO.
    I don't know. I'm not going to University, nor do I plan on going. A lot of the work here seems Beta driven; a lot of my groups seem Beta driven, and I am a Beta, so I must see some bias towards Se. It seems a lot of our courses are hands-on based. Maybe it's me being a teenager also, that things seem more Se-driven than they should. I'm sure as I get older, things won't. My part of society seems very Se-Based, and very desired, imo.

    If I went to University, I would probably find it shit. In school, I was relatively smart, but I hated it. It didn't seem the correct environment for a Beta. Everything was theoretical, and pushed onto us. No flexibility and freedom, couldn't wait to leave. I'm not bad at technical things, but I prefer to be flexible and work on many different things. see different things etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Airman View Post
    If I really get what you're trying to say, it is because of the following: humans, until they attain some sort of spiritual awakening, or better said, until they have some sort of real spiritual experience, which may be personality-conscious or personality-unconscious, are driven by the Will to Power, this Will the author F. Nietzsche based his work on, and he was widely misunderstood as supporting it. After there is the awakening or the 'light-bringing' into the personality, this may be either through conscious or unconscious processes, then the human being is basically driven to Wisdom and Love, and Understanding which is part of Wisdom. So, Se is widely regarded as 'positive' because it implies power, but not the true Power. After the soul has began pouring its influence on the personality level, then it can be said the individual may choose between pursuing Power first or Love first. Then Power has a whole different dimension to it and is worthy calling it Power, and it has its toll also. But before the individual has gained Wisdom and Love to some measure, the most primitive instincts tell him to achieve power over others, and strength to survive, and basically this most animistic primitive part has its control over the human being until some spiritual awakening happens. The Power that may come after a spiritual development has begun is also related to Se in a sense, but in a completely different manner.
    I haven't had a proper spiritual experience, as of yet, but I have had a few quasi ones. None of them have changed my life to the extent where I can say that I have had a 'spiritual awakening' in that context, or a heightened sense of spiritual awareness. I haven't had 'light' brought into my personality, but I can see how Se can be implied as 'powerful' in both a psychical and spiritual sense, and can see how religious leaders can even desire it in the form of spirits. I see your point, but I can't fully comment on it, due to lack of experience.

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    Quote Originally Posted by luchoislurking View Post
    Why is Se so desired in both Socionics as a subtype, and MBTI as a top cognitive function? Is it because of society? Is it the whole "living in the moment" craze? Is it the exploration aspect?

    Someone, please tell me. I am an SLe-ESTp and I don't get the whole "Se" craze. Someone explain this to me.
    might be, in usa extraversion is desired, in japan introversion is desired. It just depends.

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    Quote Originally Posted by luchoislurking View Post
    Really? ESFPs are into that? Can I trick one? Lol.
    Sure, I have met tarot readers that were obviously Se base (looking back) but they had their own way of interpreting the cards. It is a skill that can be taught like any other and interpreted with or without the aid of intuition. In NYC there was a fortune teller every few blocks and they weren't all intuitive types. A lot of them were Romani though and usually women.

    Never try to trick a gypsy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    might be, in usa extraversion is desired, in japan introversion is desired. It just depends.
    Yeah, in Britain (not just England), extroversion and sensation seems a lot more desired than in say Asia. Asians tend to value hard work, dedication, loyalty and introversion a lot more than the Western world does. I think it also depends on the average age and demographics of that given population.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aylen View Post
    Sure, I have met tarot readers that were obviously Se base (looking back) but they had their own way of interpreting the cards. It is a skill that can be taught like any other and interpreted with or without the aid of intuition. In NYC there was a fortune teller every few blocks and they weren't all intuitive types. A lot of them were Romani though and usually women.

    Never try to trick a gypsy.
    Yeah, I guess so, in the same sense that being psychic is taught, eh? ;D Never trick a gypsy? Will she go after me? Kill me?

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    Quote Originally Posted by luchoislurking View Post
    I don't know. I'm not going to University, nor do I plan on going. A lot of the work here seems Beta driven; a lot of my groups seem Beta driven, and I am a Beta, so I must see some bias towards Se. It seems a lot of our courses are hands-on based. Maybe it's me being a teenager also, that things seem more Se-driven than they should. I'm sure as I get older, things won't. My part of society seems very Se-Based, and very desired, imo.
    i understand. and i guess you see that it's only a very small portion of the world that you're in.

    i just wanted to refute the claim that there is an Se craze, or if it's desired by a majority. in my surroundings right now, the majority seems to be Ne/Si valuing. and i guess it's different for different contexts, so there's always this certain relativism involved.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Radio View Post
    i understand. and i guess you see that it's only a very small portion of the world that you're in.

    i just wanted to refute the claim that there is an Se craze, or if it's desired by a majority. in my surroundings right now, the majority seems to be Ne/Si valuing. and it's different for different contexts, so there's always this certain relativism involved.
    Where is this Ne/Si being valued? San Francisco? Silicon Valley? Not here anyway...

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    Quote Originally Posted by luchoislurking View Post
    Where is this Ne/Si being valued? San Francisco? Silicon Valley? Not here anyway...
    lol well if it helps, i live in pakistan.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Radio View Post
    lol well if it helps, i live in pakistan.
    Yeah, probably why.

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    Because se suggestive ones get hooked on it as if it was pure drugs, sometimes we have an impression that se leads can do the impossible within the physical world, similar to what we can generate in our heads but not able to implement in reality. It's totally addictive.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aylen View Post

    Never try to trick a gypsy.
    Why? what happens?
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    Quote Originally Posted by luchoislurking View Post
    Yeah, I guess so, in the same sense that being psychic is taught, eh? ;D Never trick a gypsy? Will she go after me? Kill me?
    Quote Originally Posted by Suz View Post
    Why? what happens?



    “My typology is . . . not in any sense to stick labels on people at first sight. It is not a physiognomy and not an anthropological system, but a critical psychology dealing with the organization and delimitation of psychic processes that can be shown to be typical.”​ —C.G. Jung
     
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    I agree with @blackburry, I think Si is more desired in "society"... Se creatives, however, who are proficient in Si as well as Se, do well I think, better than ESXps. I've noticed this in my LSI partner, who naturally draws to him NFs of both beta and delta. NTs take a bit longer, I think they recognize that they have to compromise on their logical function a bit around him, but they're also usually Si-starved so that wins out.

    Personally, I don't like dealing with NF males, and sometimes I don't like NT males either, so it's nice to leave that to him.
    Last edited by bolong; 06-16-2015 at 05:42 PM.

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    Because its description sucks
    Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit

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    In Brazil where I live, I'd say the most desired IEs are Fe, Se and Te, on this order. Te is valued as in work, perhaps I live in a big Te-first 'island' in Brazil which is the city of São Paulo, here business and money and work come first. And here Extroversion is also highly valued. I'd type this 12 million-people city as ENTj. Definitely Gamma with an Se-hidden agenda. Enneagram 3w4.

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    High Priestess glam's Avatar
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    haven't noticed an "Se craze" thing, but as others mentioned, maybe it can seem that way online due to the preponderance of IEIs and other intuitives & introverts on typology forums. online there's also a lot of Withdrawn enneagram types and so-last instincts.

    here in 'Merica, Se is certainly valued, but along with Te. right now i'm in a job-seeking stage, and everything is about competing against others (between individuals, companies, organizations), building up a "well-rounded" resume with a ton of activities and accomplishments, all with emphasis on making making as much money as possible. on your resume and cover letters, you're expected to emphasize all your accomplishments (i.e. brag) and "sell yourself". you gotta look like an extroverted, busy person with a positive attitude who can do anything and everything! it's stressful, really....

    my friend living in Sweden (a Delta, non-Se-valuing country) says if you ever tried bragging about yourself when applying for a job, people would think you're an ass and you'd never get hired.

    i think Western culture as a whole is pretty Te-valuing right now, but there can be a big difference between Gamma and Delta if you're looking at integral types of countries/cultures.

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    Breaking stereotypes Suz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by glam View Post

    here in 'Merica, Se is certainly valued, but along with Te. right now i'm in a job-seeking stage, and everything is about competing against others (between individuals, companies, organizations), building up a "well-rounded" resume with a ton of activities and accomplishments, all with emphasis on making making as much money as possible. on your resume and cover letters, you're expected to emphasize all your accomplishments (i.e. brag) and "sell yourself". you gotta look like an extroverted, busy person with a positive attitude who can do anything and everything! it's stressful, really....
    Yeah I totally hear you there. I hate that whole having to "brag" thing too...

    I defnitely felt the push to be involved in a ton of activities back when i was in school, but I've found over time that that it's better when you have fewer but more substantial things on your resume, it goes a longer way and not as diluted. I think employers & admissions committees value when you show a real commitment to something and follow through on things and maybe make a real difference in some way, rather than being too spread thin. I personally feel more fulfilled when i can do that too, and bringing something to completion, instead of having a million things going on, none of which i can get really good at or finish. (I had an ex-boss recently that was CRAY CRAY that way, loading me up with a million projects i couldn't really finish -- I can't stand that!! ditched him).

    that said, idk what field you're in... maybe it's different for what you're trying to do idk... i'd think it would be a fairly general sentiment though.
    Enneagram: 9w1 6w5 2w3 so/sx

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    Humanist Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by glam View Post
    haven't noticed an "Se craze" thing, but as others mentioned, maybe it can seem that way online due to the preponderance of IEIs and other intuitives & introverts on typology forums. online there's also a lot of Withdrawn enneagram types and so-last instincts.

    here in 'Merica, Se is certainly valued, but along with Te. right now i'm in a job-seeking stage, and everything is about competing against others (between individuals, companies, organizations), building up a "well-rounded" resume with a ton of activities and accomplishments, all with emphasis on making making as much money as possible. on your resume and cover letters, you're expected to emphasize all your accomplishments (i.e. brag) and "sell yourself". you gotta look like an extroverted, busy person with a positive attitude who can do anything and everything! it's stressful, really....

    my friend living in Sweden (a Delta, non-Se-valuing country) says if you ever tried bragging about yourself when applying for a job, people would think you're an ass and you'd never get hired.
    They are trying to be worthy of recognition. Stating their merits
    i think Western culture as a whole is pretty Te-valuing right now, but there can be a big difference between Gamma and Delta if you're looking at integral types of countries/cultures.

    They are trying to be worthy of recognition. Stating their merits. F om Se perspective it's facts and evidence. From Te it's"look at my actions and what I've been able to do."
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 5 (wings either 4 or 6)?


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa View Post
    They are trying to be worthy of recognition. Stating their merits. From Se perspective it's facts and evidence. From Te it's"look at my actions and what I've been able to do."
    Yeah, in a sense I agree. But is that not the other way around? Does Te not like to present facts and evidence, and Se actions and accomplishments?


    Quote Originally Posted by glam View Post
    haven't noticed an "Se craze" thing, but as others mentioned, maybe it can seem that way online due to the preponderance of IEIs and other intuitives & introverts on typology forums. online there's also a lot of Withdrawn enneagram types and so-last instincts.

    here in 'Merica, Se is certainly valued, but along with Te. right now i'm in a job-seeking stage, and everything is about competing against others (between individuals, companies, organizations), building up a "well-rounded" resume with a ton of activities and accomplishments, all with emphasis on making making as much money as possible. on your resume and cover letters, you're expected to emphasize all your accomplishments (i.e. brag) and "sell yourself". you gotta look like an extroverted, busy person with a positive attitude who can do anything and everything! it's stressful, really....

    my friend living in Sweden (a Delta, non-Se-valuing country) says if you ever tried bragging about yourself when applying for a job, people would think you're an ass and you'd never get hired.

    i think Western culture as a whole is pretty Te-valuing right now, but there can be a big difference between Gamma and Delta if you're looking at integral types of countries/cultures.
    Yeah, I guess so. Social as a last? I don't think that means much though. So is my last/second last, and I like to be social.

    Yeah, same here. They want you to have a load of achievements, sell yourself in your CV, and appear a confident, active, friendly person who'll enjoy their job.

    Really? Dang. No-one here would do well in Sweden.

    Delta and Gamma? Hm. I still seem to see a lot of Betas here. My Dad is Delta/Gamma (ExTJ, not sure).

    Quote Originally Posted by FDG View Post
    Because its description sucks
    Nope.


    Quote Originally Posted by Velvet View Post
    Because se suggestive ones get hooked on it as if it was pure drugs, sometimes we have an impression that se leads can do the impossible within the physical world, similar to what we can generate in our heads but not able to implement in reality. It's totally addictive.
    Yes, Se can be addictive. I can see how people can think it's wonderful in a psychical sense, but sometimes it's nice to give it a break and focus on other Functions.

  39. #39
    Humanist Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by luchoislurking View Post
    Yeah, in a sense I agree. But is that not the other way around? Does Te not like to present facts and evidence, and Se actions and accomplishments?




    Yeah, I guess so. Social as a last? I don't think that means much though. So is my last/second last, and I like to be social.

    Yeah, same here. They want you to have a load of achievements, sell yourself in your CV, and appear a confident, active, friendly person who'll enjoy their job.

    Really? Dang. No-one here would do well in Sweden.

    Delta and Gamma? Hm. I still seem to see a lot of Betas here. My Dad is Delta/Gamma (ExTJ, not sure).



    Nope.




    Yes, Se can be addictive. I can see how people can think it's wonderful in a psychical sense, but sometimes it's nice to give it a break and focus on other Functions.
    Example...Se ...when I was living in Pasadena I had a nice house. It was a half a million dollar home and a big pool. But, I hated the neighbors.

    Te..."I fixed it and this looks good on me. I can fly these things and one day I will."

    The Se is descriing the properties of the object...the house, big, worth, the size of the pool and the people from a relationship view Fi

    The Fe is stating the action and HOW it is or will be received as the method has already been determined.
    Last edited by Beautiful sky; 06-17-2015 at 04:23 PM.
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 5 (wings either 4 or 6)?


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa View Post
    Example...Se ...when I was living in Pasadena I had a nice house. It was a half a million dollar home and a big pool. But, I hated the neighbors.

    Te..."I fixed it and this looks good on me. I can fly these things and one day I will."

    The Se is descriing the properties of the object...the house, big, worth, the size of the pool and the people from a relationship view Fi

    The Fe is stating the action and HOW it is or will be received as the method has already been determined.
    Oh, I see. How would Ti come into account from the relationship point of view? And Ni?

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