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Thread: Enneagram Type 3

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    contra-flow E3

    4w3-5w6-8w7

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    Angelina Jolie


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    ^ she's E8 imo

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    Quote Originally Posted by lemontrees View Post
    ^ she's E8 imo
    Why? She's not intimidating at all, and no reactivity.

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    Angelina Jolie is actually a Counterphobic, SX/SO 6, I'd say.

    That is how she can give off an 8-ish vibe, but also has a disintegration point to 3.

    Thinking about her history, she is pretty reactive, actually.
    It is like she committed "crazy" acts as a way to counteract her fears.
    Also, she represents the SX 6's ideal of Beauty and Strength.

    Sexual Sixes get their sense of security primarily from their emotional bond with a significant other. But they also have many doubts, both about their own ability to have a suitable mate and about the mate's ability or willingness to really be there for them. Sexual Sixes often manifest a tension between their gender roles: they are both masculine and feminine, "macho" and coquettish. Moreover, Sexual Six women have a tough, tomboy side to them but still come across as feminine. Similarly, the men of this Variant display a sensitivity and vulnerability while being essentially masculine. Sexual Sixes also tend to be emotionally intense, like Eights and Fours. Part of this comes from anxiety about their ability to keep a strong, capable partner. Thus, Sexual Sixes try to cultivate their masculine or feminine attributes in order to find a good partner and, later, to remain appealing to this person. Often, they feel most comfortable relating to members of the opposite sex and may feel competitive with the same sex. They also tend to test their significant others to see if they are strong enough and to make sure that they are really committed to the relationship. When more stressed, Sexual Sixes can be emotionally volatile, with their feelings about people changing strongly and suddenly. They fall into suspiciousness about their partner and can be quite jealous, while at the same time feeling a strong need to "prove" their desirability.
    Sexual/Social

    The counterphobic stance of the sexual Six can be seen in competition for attracting the right mate, and in testing to see who is worthy of trust. This is true of both sexual subtypes and especially true of the sexual/social. This type is likely to be found quite commonly among actresses and actors as they tend towards a dramatic presentation. Their need to be identified with their desirability and their strong social instinct, combine to sometimes make them public figures. They are less possessive of their mates, but still feel the need to have control in the relationship. They can have a very focused intensity. They can appear Four-like in their desire to express themselves and give into their passions. They define themselves in accordance with the prevailing gender norms opting to appear masculine or feminine as the case may be. This outward energy is sometimes counterbalanced with inward doubting, which can lead to depression, anger, and acting out, at the lower levels of health.


    Anxiety isn’t as noticeable with the sexual variant of type Six, especially when the self-pres instinct is last. The typical things we associate with anxiety aren’t obvious with this subtype. Their anxiety is focused in the arena of relationships, and since their stance is mostly counterphobic, anxiety is not always obvious, and the Six too might be unaware of its presence. This can be true of all the subtypes of type Six. Their anxiety exists at a core level so that Sixes don’t always know how to gauge its existence. So, even the more visibly anxious subtypes might not be aware of their underlying anxiety. The sexual/social can appear Eight-like, in their defense of their loved ones and social standing.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SisOfNight View Post
    Angelina Jolie is actually a Counterphobic, SX/SO 6, I'd say.

    That is how she can give off an 8-ish vibe, but also has a disintegration point to 3.

    Thinking about her history, she is pretty reactive, actually.
    It is like she committed "crazy" acts as a way to counteract her fears.
    Also, she represents the SX 6's ideal of Beauty and Strength.
    I agree with 6w7 sx for Angie.

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    Tritype 387-ish:


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    David & Katherine Fauvre and Enneagram Institute type Angelina Jolie as a 4. "The Individualist".
    as does Dave's Enneagram - 167 votes



    I think she is a 4w3.

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    Quote Originally Posted by yeves View Post
    David & Katherine Fauvre and Enneagram Institute type Angelina Jolie as a 4. "The Individualist".
    as does Dave's Enneagram - 167 votes



    I think she is a 4w3.
    Some of their typings miss the mark and only type the "persona" of someone.

    They also type David Lynch and Tim Burton as 5w4, while I think those are rather clear cases of 4w5 (though I suppose certain people would argue with me on this).

    Furthermore, Katherine Fauvre types herself as Type 8, while I honestly think she is actually Type 4 SX.

    The crux of the matter is, many "experts" still mistype people once in a while (or often). You can see that the most often with Socionists, unfortunately, who mistype many famous celebrities.
    I just get the feeling those mistypes are based on surface personas/appearances, and the people don't take their time to actually study the person.

    Having said that, I can understand why someone would type her as 4w3 – I used to to do that, too.
    But it never felt right.

    P.S: Who voted on this poll? Other Enneagram "experts", or just whoever visited the site? Either way, I don't find it useful to just make a poll on someone's type and base their typing on that.
    At least some explanation or reflection would be necessary. But I suppose this is my Te PoLR speaking, I am always skeptical and dissatisfied with the poll method.
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    I also dont agree with alot of Fauvres typings. I get 0 reactivity from Angelina, she is super polished and flat, like a 3. Link me an interview where she shows any sort of temper. She is a 3 sx/sp, without knowing any of her history it would be not so obvious that shes sx, this is because she's a 3 and doesnt give out an sx "mess" vibe.

    But Kathrine is no 4, your 4 typings are so off tbh. David is though, and types himself as that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost View Post
    But Kathrine is no 4, your 4 typings are so off tbh. David is though, and types himself as that.
    Well, I am not the only one who thinks she is not 8, so...
    She's rather either SX 4 or even 6. (She could have 8 in her tritype, though – and David does not.
    They are also not the same Sociotype, so that is why she may not seem to be the same E-type.)
    But fair enough.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SisOfNight View Post
    Well, I am not the only one who thinks she is not 8, so...
    She's rather either SX 4 or even 6. (She could have 8 in her tritype, though – and David does not.
    They are also not the same Sociotype, so that is why she may not seem to be the same E-type.)
    But fair enough.
    David is 468 yes, but sp/so probably
    Katherine wrote this amazing description of 468 which is totally spot on btw. I'm sure she would be able to tell if David wasn't 468...


    Why are 468s so intense?
    All 468s, regardless of the order of the types in their Enneagram Tritype, have a strong innate sense of urgency. The 468 is the Enneagram Tritype that is comprised of the emotionally expressive type from each of the 3 centers: head (567), heart (234), and gut (891). As such, they are visceral and reactive. They respond immediately to any and all perceived threats, whether real or imagined.

    Truth Teller
    I call this Tritype the 'Truth Teller' because those with this Tritype feel an intense need to call off their view of reality and say that ‘the emperor has no clothes’ even if they will be chastised for saying it.

    Biological Imperative
    Think of the 468 viewpoints and responses as important biological imperatives. Everyone and every family and/or group needs those that will not delay and will act instantly in an emergency.

    The Enneagram 468 defense strategy is uniquely designed to handle emergencies. Many professions, such as high-risk emergency medical services, require employees that are sensitive to the needs of others but are still able to make life or death decisions straightaway and without hesitation.
    The 468s have a finely tuned sense of emotional attunement and sense what others feel (4). They feel potential threats at a sharper pitch (6) than the other Tritypes. They also have a visceral experience of their emotions with an intense need to take immediate action (8) and voice their concerns (468). They are highly intuitive and are alert to imminent threats long before others. They are fiercely loyal and protective of those they love and whomever or whatever they care about. They are willing to speak their truth regardless of the consequences. They track their instinctual intuitions and warn others in an attempt to manage their own emotional distress.
    Too Intense
    Due to their emotional sensitivity and sense of urgency, 468s tend to react immediately to whatever upsets them before they can stop and think about the best way to say or do something. There are times when their immediate reaction is essential and necessary but there are far more times when their style is perceived as far too much and expressed far too often. The reason for this is that the 468s can often react prematurely before they have all the facts. Due to their impulsivity, they also find it difficult to stop and consider how they should deliver their message in a manner that others will respect and value.

    The problem is that in a heightened emotional state 468s say things with a great deal of intensity. They can lose sight of what is called for and also what is in their own best interest. When they are emotionally upset and feel unheard they often become angry and can say things they really don’t mean. At these times, others see them as over the top and inappropriate. Ironically, the very same attributes that make them great in an emergency can make them appear emotionally out of control when there is not an emergency others can see. Having said that, the level of health of the 468 has a lot to do with how they voice their concerns, both what they say and how they say it.

    When the 468s are stressed their reactivity increases. This intensity of emotion begins to diminish the value of what they are trying to address. To others, they are seen as complaining and crying wolf… Over time, if the 468 remains in distress, they will often lose the social skills needed for others to listen to what they have to say. If this continues, the 468s often become even more anti-social and can be so intense and belligerent that others will ignore them. Sadly, their concerns will go unheard and be invalidated.
    Working with the 468
    468s can have trouble identifying what is a true emergency and what just feels like an emergency. If their internal alarm bells go off, the 468s are in fight or flight. Once their emotions are triggered their adrenaline is running in hyper-drive and needs to be discharged. So it is extremely difficult for the 468 Tritype to slow down and delay reacting.

    One of the best ways I have learned to help the 468s achieve a sense of equanimity or emotional balance is to know when to tell the truth and when not to.
    The 468s see things in black and white. It helps if they can learn to see the value of gray. They are highly emotional and intuitive. As a result, they see problems far in advance of others. If their concerns are not addressed they continue to assert the merit of their concerns. In their attempt to convince others that their views are accurate they can alienate others. Teaching the 468 how to communicate their concerns without alienating others is paramount.
    Unbeknown to the 468 is their need for others to act on their concerns in order for them to feel safe. They secretly feel disempowered and emotionally dependent on others. What they have not recognized is that they can validate their concerns even if others do not. In a sense, they can become their own trusted authority. They can acknowledge the part of themselves that is feeling panic and learn how to self-soothe regardless of what others are doing. When they can identify and acknowledge their fears and validate their concerns they will feel less of a need for others to act in accordance with their concerns. When they act as their own agent, their feelings of intensity and immediate action will begin to slow down.

    468s tend to see their fears in exaggerated ways; large, loud and looming, and in vivid color. This intensity of the senses helps the 468s react in an emergency but when there is no real imminent danger this intensity cause the 468s to feel panic and distress. 468s can learn to recognize the beginning signs of being on guard. They can learn to feel their muscles tighten, their eyes widen, their jaw lock and their hands roll into a fist. Physical alertness can warn them that they are ready and poised to act. They can then learn how to interfere with this primal response to stimuli and use strategies to minimize the intensity of the reaction by shrinking the images, fading the intensity of the colors of the images, turn down the volume that says act now and slow their pulse. Conscious attention to these innate impulses can reduce the level of their reactivity.

    Transformation through Insight
    Intellectual understanding of their process can help the 468s before their impulses are on red alert. They can learn to appreciate why they feel the way they do as well as why it is not always in their best interest to act on their impulses. Like all Tritypes with 8, they can remember that ‘their’ truth is not always ‘the’ truth. And, that knowing their truth, even if they are right, does not mean that they have to immediately tell people their truth all of the time. They can learn to recognize that they will feel far more empowered and serve the greater good when they discover when it is better not to speak their truth.

    The 468 needs to remember that not everyone sees or responds to the threats they perceive in the same manner… that the other Tritypes’ responses are also important biological imperatives. And, that the other Tritypes do not feel the same sense of urgency over the same issues because they are tracking different imperatives.
    468s benefit from remembering that it takes all types. And, that another’s lack of emotional response may be the diversity required to have a balanced and more satisfactory outcome to a problem. It is also helpful for the 468 to remember that others have their own life journey and may need to make their own mistakes to learn what is important. Most people know when they have made a mistake and/or overreacted and do not need any one to remind them.
    When the 468s learn that their view of reality while valid, does not mean it will be the reality of others, they will begin to feel more at ease with others’ lack of reactivity. When they can accept these different views of reality they will be able to accept the lessons that are frustrating to 'Truth Tellers' such as patience. Even though they see things with such intense clarity it is often not their duty to call it off. Sometimes the 259 Tritype that says wait and see might reveal additional information that may be more effective in the long run.
    Self-Inquiry
    The most important question ‘truth tellers’ can ask themselves is - "What is my emotional need?” “What is my underlying motive for 'warning' others and why do I need them to agree with my point of view in order to relax?"

    Reflection
    468s sincerely believe that they are voicing what others should know and do. Upon reflection, the 468s can identify the fears they were experiencing when they dramatically expressed their views, and/or had an emotional outburst. They can then examine the situation with fresh eyes rather than trying to convince others of their viewpoint. Reemphasizing their initial concerns is a clue that the 468s are still in fear are not letting go. With insight, they can learn to accept the outcome following an emotional situation by tending to their own unmet needs that they disowned. With acceptance and ease in relating, like the natural state of the 279, they can begin to feel comfortable regardless of whether or not others agree with them.

    Instead of continuing to press others to validate their point of view, 468s can learn to self-soothe by trusting what is. When the 468 comes from a place of essence they no longer need others to see what they see and will not feel distress when others do not see the circumstances in the same way. They will be able to experience other people's lack of action as simply a truth of a different bias. They will be able to let go even though it may seem 'counter-intuitive' to a truth teller.
    Blind Spots
    Subjective truth and over reactivity are the blind spots of the 468s. And the growing edge for ‘truth tellers’ is learning to let go by having faith in others and a power greater than their own (6), realizing that their truth may not be 'the' truth (8) and letting go emotionally rather than intensifying feelings (4). It is only by letting go of their position that 468s will feel a sense of inner peace.

    This truth is very challenging for the high-strung and emotionally intuitive 468s because they value transparency. The key is for them to see it that they do not see themselves the way others see them and that they are just as transparent as others. They can learn a great deal about themselves by and their impact on others by listening to what others have to say about them.
    Dominant type leading the 468
    648,684
    These Tritypes with type 6 leading are paradoxical. Ironically the 6s with this Tritype are the most hyper-reactive 6 but they are still tentative and apprehensive. Their mental projections can make their reactions very confusing to others. They may at times show their anxiety and look timid and in need of support and at other times they can be so intensely assertive and provocative that their needs go unseen. The high side of these Tritypes is that they are extremely devoted and dutiful to those to whom they are attached. They are very loyal and protective.


    468,486
    These Tritypes with type 4 leading are the most emotionally intense of all the Tritypes. The 4 ‘passion for protest’ with the 6 doubt and the fear of being mislead combined with the 8 fear of being powerless makes these 4s appear very 8ish. They are very sensitive and emotional but are also extremely expressive and argumentative. These 4s have powerful emotions and a great need to express themselves which is why they can appear even more 8ish that the 8s. They are fiercely loyal and lovingly protective of those to whom they are attached.

    864,846
    These Tritypes with type 8 leading are very intense and definitive. Ironically, these Tritypes with 8 leading are softer than the 4 and 6 with this Tritype. The 4’s emotional sensitivity and the 6’s need to engage cause these 8s to demonstrate fierce devotion as well as fierce opposition. These 8s are very outspoken and easily call off their truth. They are quick to anger but are just as quick to get over it. Due to the 4 in these Tritypes, these 8s are more tenderhearted and emotionally sensitive and available than say the 863 that is more driven to succeed by not expressing the emotions that can slow the 8 down.

    Working with a 468
    The 468s are meant to sound the alarm. They are the most emotionally intense Tritype. They are not trying to be too much. They are trying to protect those in their world. We need these fierce protectors. A good rule of thumb is to remember that even though they have 8 in the Tritype, they have trouble self-soothing. They need to learn how to internalize their own trusted authority to let go of their need to convince others of their viewpoint. When triggered, they are in red alert and are asking to be heard and validated so that they can calm down. Remember that no matter how much the 468s are over-reacting, there is always some truth in what they are saying. Also remember that what the 468s are saying is that they need to know that you have heard them and have validated their concerns. Most of all, they are saying that they need your help to restore a sense of inner calm. If you can help them to remember to have faith in whatever happens they will find their own sense of equanimity.

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    I thought 8 for Angie cuz both her drugs/rebellion and humanitarianism make sense on E8 continuum. There's an interview where she talks about how she was discontent and self-destructive when younger, and it was only when she was older when she realized the world becomes meaningful when she has important people to protect.

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    social 3


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    Eskil Simonsson from Covenant - 3w4 sx/so (LII?)





    Edward Davenport - 3w4 sx/so (Si-ESE?) in a VICE episode England's Lord of Fraud: Wolf of the West End
    Last edited by silke; 03-03-2017 at 07:20 PM.

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    This quote by Henri Nouwen:

    "The greatest trap in our life is not success, popularity or power, but self-rejection."

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    This is so over the top, it's already a parody:

    http://www.vevo.com/watch/william/t-...)/USUV71101922

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    Kim Kardashian: sx/sp 3w2

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    IEE 3w4




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    Quote Originally Posted by silke View Post
    IEE 3w4



    I love theeeese!

    Dark lipstick, very important. Also, playing with gender identity.

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    *Queen





























































    Last edited by Chae; 12-09-2016 at 12:09 PM.

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    Most of these are just motivational pictures, not so much things about E3. A lot of them also come across more E8 to me but that's just me. E3s want people to admire them, E8s want to have power over others ("it is better to be feared than admired"), but motivational posters tend to be pretty good for both themes, as well as anyone else who needs motivation. The androgynous goth makeup person looks more like some sort of 478 to me BTW.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Verbrannte View Post
    Most of these are just motivational pictures, not so much things about E3. A lot of them also come across more E8 to me but that's just me. E3s want people to admire them, E8s want to have power over others ("it is better to be feared than admired"), but motivational posters tend to be pretty good for both themes, as well as anyone else who needs motivation. The androgynous goth makeup person looks more like some sort of 478 to me BTW.
    Yes, there's a mix involved. E3 is literally the performer and motivator so motivational posters fit - not in their exact content, but their purpose. Now we got it right
    What about 4w3 7w8 8w7 for him/her?

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    the 3w4 owls lol


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    3w2, healthy 6/8 integration and reputation:


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    Good post, @Chae ... But maybe use "spoilers" the next time.
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    Recipe of how to handle a "difficult" 3w4 Sx/So properly: in any case, give them something to perform

    If they can't put on a show or don't have a task, they get sassy/condescending/imperious due to their propensity to compare themselves. That sort of triggers an inferiority complex. The latter aims at throwing others under the bus to feel valuable oneself, the opposite happens because they look mean, and the circle repeats.

    Here's a good example of that. You can see how Madonna is an excellent performer with great business sense who is polished, recognizable, brave and professional, this is her strength, you won't forget her and are likely very entertained. But interpersonally, she aims at superiority because her competitiveness (-->fueled by Se ego) transfers to daily life as well. She appears as contemptuous in conversation because her drive is sort of misled and not channeled into her own behavior. She could easily come across as nice if her ambition would manifest in genuine attempts to be acceptable, only focused on perfecting oneself. Being accepted is something that 3w4s really want to be if it weren't for their 4-wing that wants to stand out.

    The way to solve this dilemma works through making them display something (-->3) authentic (-->4). So once she starts performing by moving around et cetera, she utilizes her talent best and can shine without an issue, which is beneficial for everyone. James Corden is happy that he has one of the best pop artists in the world on his show and the content is really cool (the video is trending at #2 right now!), and Madonna can show her skills which is very gratifying for her, she can literally express herself.



    A second step would be to ask for advice on how to become better. The 3w4 Sx/So will stop trying to be above you. They are concerned about achieving enhancement of everything and everyone so they will likely step down from their pedestal to offer some good tips. In the video, when Madonna expressed her dislike for James Corden's outfit, James could've asked what he can improve and I bet that Madonna would've had some valuable recommendations It sounds trivial but you get the point --> misguided 3w4 Sx/So energy can be rechanneled through a) opportunities for self-presentation and b) occasions for sharing their experience to help others.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cassandra View Post
    Good post, @Chae ... But maybe use "spoilers" the next time.
    Thanks, it's edited now

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chae View Post
    Recipe of how to handle a "difficult" 3w4 Sx/So properly: in any case, give them something to perform

    If they can't put on a show or don't have a task, they get sassy/condescending/imperious due to their propensity to compare themselves. That sort of triggers an inferiority complex. The latter aims at throwing others under the bus to feel valuable oneself, the opposite happens because they look mean, and the circle repeats.

    Here's a good example of that. You can see how Madonna is an excellent performer with great business sense who is polished, recognizable, brave and professional, this is her strength, you won't forget her and are likely very entertained. But interpersonally, she aims at superiority because her competitiveness (-->fueled by Se ego) transfers to daily life as well. She appears as contemptuous in conversation because her drive is sort of misled and not channeled into her own behavior. She could easily come across as nice if her ambition would manifest in genuine attempts to be acceptable, only focused on perfecting oneself. Being accepted is something that 3w4s really want to be if it weren't for their 4-wing that wants to stand out.

    The way to solve this dilemma works through making them display something (-->3) authentic (-->4). So once she starts performing by moving around et cetera, she utilizes her talent best and can shine without an issue, which is beneficial for everyone. James Corden is happy that he has one of the best pop artists in the world on his show and the content is really cool (the video is trending at #2 right now!), and Madonna can show her skills which is very gratifying for her, she can literally express herself.



    A second step would be to ask for advice on how to become better. The 3w4 Sx/So will stop trying to be above you. They are concerned about achieving enhancement of everything and everyone so they will likely step down from their pedestal to offer some good tips. In the video, when Madonna expressed her dislike for James Corden's outfit, James could've asked what he can improve and I bet that Madonna would've had some valuable recommendations It sounds trivial but you get the point --> misguided 3w4 Sx/So energy can be rechanneled through a) opportunities for self-presentation and b) occasions for sharing their experience to help others.
    Great post. 3w4 tries to get to the best potential of everything. First and very foremost of himself, but also of other people. The first thing 3w4 thinks when it looks at someone else is: "wellll, this person has so much potential. All he has to do is change the way he dresses, it also looks like he's losing his hair (he should make a research into hair implants ....hmmm, but maybe he's to poor to afford them - in that case he should look into wigs. His dancing is ok and he loves it as a hobby, but since his singing is so much better, it doesn't matter what his true passion is, he should pursue singing - because that's what's going to sell (get him admiration) and make him famous." Another example: "This girl's face is not so great, so she should get into gym and improve her body as much as she can, so she can up to a point make up for the lack of face." That's 3w4 thought process...which is superficial af, but that's the first thing that always pops up when they look at someone/something (themselves - most importantly, they're very hard and realistic on themselves, person, pet, SO, furniture) ... how they can improve their atractiveness/performance/selling point. It's always about the audience, and not the actual person. It is only about the actual person to the point as they choose the worthy selected audience they feel they want to perform for - their niche. It's all very pragmatic and realistic - nihilistic at low points.

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    Quote Originally Posted by darya View Post
    Great post. 3w4 tries to get to the best potential of everything. First and very foremost of himself, but also of other people. The first thing 3w4 thinks when it looks at someone else is: "wellll, this person has so much potential. All he has to do is change the way he dresses, it also looks like he's losing his hair (he should make a research into hair implants ....hmmm, but maybe he's to poor to afford them - in that case he should look into wigs. His dancing is ok and he loves it as a hobby, but since his singing is so much better, it doesn't matter what his true passion is, he should pursue singing - because that's what's going to sell (get him admiration) and make him famous." Another example: "This girl's face is not so great, so she should get into gym and improve her body as much as she can, so she can up to a point make up for the lack of face." That's 3w4 thought process...which is superficial af, but that's the first thing that always pops up when they look at someone/something (themselves - most importantly, they're very hard and realistic on themselves, person, pet, SO, furniture) ... how they can improve their atractiveness/performance/selling point. It's always about the audience, and not the actual person. It is only about the actual person to the point as they choose the worthy selected audience they feel they want to perform for - their niche. It's all very pragmatic and realistic - nihilistic at low points.
    Thanks for the addendum! I also had more thoughts about it, here it goes: what you pointed out subconsciously in your text, the instinct pretty much determines the focus of it.

    - Madonna projected her SX in the video, wanting to make herself attractive, applying that to someone else.
    - The social instinct would try to look for someone's affiliations (especially aristocratic quadras do that) and give feedback on how that relates to status.
    - SP would check out the person's belongings/status symbols.

    The trap is that they focus too much on the outside requirements, e3 can be locked in a state of living their life defined by others. Esp. the 2-wing. A 4-wing is also dependent on others as in wanting to be the reverse version of them, but they are much more ideal-seeking on their own and incorporate reclusive traits. I take myself as an example, after "delivery" of my skill I need a period of renewal, usually showing up with a new unique image when I return, just like Lady Gaga crafts a new look for every album, in that manner.
    What you say about potential, they do see what can make others successful. I always thought of a 3w4 as an advisory figure who knows how to navigate their sphere of influence, gathering the "best" aspects of it - so they do very well in a role model type of position. The unhealthy version would just try to beat everyone in that sphere, having nobody to give advice to in the end The more haters the 3w4 has, the more they hate/disapprove of themselves internally, that's first-hand painful experience SX, SP, SO aspects of advising grants them the approval they need instead. The downfall is that they may not tolerate perceived imperfection as you pointed out, which is more of a reflection of their own self-love. I mean, when I go around thinking others need to change, I should look in the mirror first and start there, once I accept myself I will accept others more as a consequence, that's the hard part about it Mhm, this type is pretty much about finding one's niche in life, agreed

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    Quote Originally Posted by darya View Post
    That's 3w4 thought process...which is superficial af, but that's the first thing that always pops up when they look at someone/something (themselves - most importantly, they're very hard and realistic on themselves, person, pet, SO, furniture) ... how they can improve their atractiveness/performance/selling point. It's always about the audience, and not the actual person. It is only about the actual person to the point as they choose the worthy selected audience they feel they want to perform for - their niche. It's all very pragmatic and realistic - nihilistic at low points. It's always about the audience, and not the actual person.
    Attributing your own traits to a type is really no way to go about describing an entire type.
    Not all 3w4s are "superficial af" in how they think and dip into pragmatic nihilism.
    Not all 3w4s are "performing for an audience" rather than the person--that's an SO anxiety will how an audience will react to them that doesn't touch upon SP and SX-3s.

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    Proud enneagram 3w2 dog


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    Angelina Jolie calmed down alot as she got older. Something I see alot with SLIs with anger issues. As far as reactionary, the whole fucking her moms boyfriend when she was 13 to get back at her mom is kinda reactionary right? But who knows, ennegram type might change over 25-30+ years.
    Projection is ordinary. Person A projects at person B, hoping tovalidate something about person A by the response of person B. However, person B, not wanting to be an obejct of someone elses ego and guarding against existential terror constructs a personality which protects his ego and maintain a certain sense of a robust and real self that is different and separate from person A. Sadly, this robust and real self, cut off by defenses of character from the rest of the world, is quite vulnerable and fragile given that it is imaginary and propped up through external feed back. Person B is dimly aware of this and defends against it all the more, even desperately projecting his anxieties back onto person A, with the hope of shoring up his ego with salubrious validation. All of this happens without A or B acknowledging it, of course. Because to face up to it consciously is shocking, in that this is all anybody is doing or can do and it seems absurd when you realize how pathetic it is.

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    sx 3

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    Life as Enneagram 3: walking around hiding your true colors - then shocking everyone when you show how it looks like on the inside


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