All you ever wanted to be

[Expat]

Someone (I forget who, perhaps Sergei Ganin) once wrote that if you really understand the types, are healthy and self-aware, your true type is precisely the type you'd want to be. The "best" type is your type.

Not in the sense, "I wish I could be XXXx for a moment to be better at XXXx" -- in the sense of actually thinking, consistently, "why do I have to be this type, I wish I was that other type".

I have observed that generally, when people mistype themselves and/or are unhappy with their type, it's because they don't really understand the type.

[Creepy-pokeball]

What if the type is misunderstood and referenced wrong in the first place?

[Expat]

I'm not sure if I understood your question. What I'm saying is that people who are obviously unhappy with their assigned type probably have misunderstood that type (if it is the true one) or they are indeed another type.

Of course - for instance - an INFj (say) might be mistyped as INTj and be happy about "being" INTj, but in that case I think that the person does not understand what an INTj or INFj is.

[Creepy-pokeball]

Yeah, I got that. What Im saying is that the type described or tested for, whether correct or incorrect for any random person, may not actually be proper. I say this because all of this seems to be in an infant form.

[oyburger]

Well, I'm happy with my type negative connotations and all.

[Expat]

Well, I'm happy with my type negative connotations and all.

But, conceivably (not you) someone might be happy with a wrong typing because they don't understand the type.

[oyburger]

Well, I'm happy with my type negative connotations and all.

But, conceivably (not you) someone might be happy with a wrong typing because they don't understand the type.

Right, they pick one they like because that's what they want to be.

[Expat]

Right, they pick one they like because that's what they want to be.

Yes, but what I'm saying is that I think that the type people want to be is necessarily the right type as long as they correctly understand all types.

[oyburger]

And are relatively mentally healthy.

[Slacker]

It seems like people might take an incorrect stereotype of a type, say ENFps aren't very smart, and then say, "I *am* smart and therefore I'm not an ENFp!" But that person might seem very much like an ENFp.

Just an example, not thinking of anyone in particular.

[oyburger]

Yeah, Nicky I've done that myself. I don't sound as roboticized as niffweed (though I think he's INTp now) and I don't sound as "out there" as pedro; but they are extreme examples.

[Expat]

It seems like people might take an incorrect stereotype of a type, say ENFps aren't very smart, and then say, "I *am* smart and therefore I'm not an ENFp!" But that person might seem very much like an ENFp.
.

Yes this is the sort of thing I mean.

[Logos]

Yes this is the sort of thing I mean.

And then there are "trendy" types which people pick because it makes them sound more like how they want to be perceived and not how they necessarily are naturally.

[Phaedrus]

Yes, but what I'm saying is that I think that the type people want to be is necessarily the right type as long as they correctly understand all types.

I think that I agree. But the most important thing for me is to be correct about which type I am. Now, when I believe that I am an INTp, I also want to be an INTp, but if I, or perhaps those who still believe that I am INTj, would somehow prove that belief to be false and convince that I am really an INTj, then I want that I will be able to want to be an INTj. That scenario is not very likely at the moment, though.

[FDG]

Actually, after reading the description, I was puzzled that other people seem to live their lives in a different way.

[meatburger]

The great thing about this is that if you understand yourself and work on your strenghts more instead of your weaknesses, you will be much closer to becomming the best you can be.

[Polly]

I would actually agree that if you are really drawn to a type, that actually may be your type.

OR its at the very least an indication of your type and what you value....which in itself is an indication of your type.

Some types I do believe tend to overvault other types and then try to emulate them. Like an ESTp or ESTj talking about their traits as though they are an ENTj or ENTp. Under closer scrutiny though, you see holes.

What they say, doesn't match what you are actually seeing in their personality. So if that's the case, I find that by looking at the closest 's' type of that personality, quite often you find that is actually their personality.

An 'S' type who wants to be an Intuitive hasn't learned to value their own traits nor recognize where their limitations are. They may be critical of an intuitives faults and actually may feel uncomfortable or distrusting of intuition. Without that intuition though, these traits they claim to have would not exist.

S type - This book says so and its reputable so it must be true
N type - This book says so and is reputable so I'll take it into consideration

[FDG]

S type - This book says so and its reputable so it must be true
N type - This book says so and is reputable so I'll take it into consideration

Idiotic distinction. "This books says so, it is reputable, so I guess it's true, unless somebody/my experiences prove me otherwise".

[Nessy]

S type - This book says so and its reputable so it must be true
N type - This book says so and is reputable so I'll take it into consideration

Idiotic distinction. "This books says so, it is reputable, so I guess it's true, unless somebody/my experiences prove me otherwise".

Mine: The author says so and I agree as I've known something like that/but I don't agree as I've never seen like that/though I have no idea. Maybe it's needed more investigation, or expressed badly.

[FDG]

S type - This book says so and its reputable so it must be true
N type - This book says so and is reputable so I'll take it into consideration

Idiotic distinction. "This books says so, it is reputable, so I guess it's true, unless somebody/my experiences prove me otherwise".

Mine: The author says so and I agree as I've known something like that/but I don't agree as I've never seen like that/though I have no idea. Maybe it's needed more investigation, or expressed badly.

If I haven't seen it, I tend to trust until proven otherwise. If I've previously seen something that disproves the author, what I have seen takes precedence of course.

Example:

1)Book A says "Mars is red". I have never seen Mars. I trust the book, confirming or disproving the assertion when/if I'll se Mars.

2)I see Mars and it's black. Book A says "Mars is Red". Book A is wrong. If I look at Mars, and I see that now it's black, I'll try to make some more observation, to see if maybe some days it's black, some days red.

[Creepy-Diana]

.

[UDP]

Right, they pick one they like because that's what they want to be.

Yes, but what I'm saying is that I think that the type people want to be is necessarily the right type as long as they correctly understand all types.

Yeah, I see what you mean, and I would assume it is so.


Being uncertain, unhealthy, or otherwise mentally/emotionally unfit would likely create more room for delusion. Also, a complete lack of things to do, or likewise, having too much to do --- to little or too much "outside stress".



Actually, Expat, I wonder what you think about this (thread, and your thoughts in it), in regard to human development/progress. Even more so, in terms of a book like Stephen Covey's "The 8th Habit" (if you've read it). Basically, I think that (kind of like self actualization), once a person is safe and has their needs met, the ego block can/should be developed so that they create a way of life for themselves -- an external purpose. They find their own special way to contribute to the world, or interact with it at least, and they can be satisfied with it. ((Ultimately, I think the greatest healthy-ness would come from developing a spiritual side, so as to not get too attached to this "development of external purpose", to create balance, and not get too attached to what is fleeting (deal better with aging, etc) --- but more about all of this later sometime, perahps)).


For a sort of mutual example...

Having understood socionics more over time, I've really come to apprecaiate 'my' , and I get how that shapes my life, and I'm 'conscious of it'. If I can contribute/use those things in my existence, than I feel good about myself -- I feel like I am doing something that is necessary, or that I am needed, etc. It is rewarding. I wouldn't want to be anyone else. It is a sort of self fufilling prophecy I guess, but I think I understand the nature of it.

[UDP]

Also, I wonder about the Necessity of some things, for positive health.


I mean (this is a general example), but....

For a 'j' type to be healthy, they must create a sort of structured environement or sort of routine, etc. Or, an E must have a certain emount of interaction with others, and an I must have a certain amount of time alone. Again, really general stuff, but for someone of a certain psychological types with psych preferences, I wonder how a consistent contrast to those preferences would affect that person.


e.g. To deny an ESFjs the ability to socialize with others has been very detrimental, from what I've seen

[pesto]

It bothers when I hear about how soft or weak INFjs are - because I don't see myself like that, or don't want to see myself like that perhaps.

Oh, how I agree with this. On the other hand - people often see me as softer and weaker than I am in real life too. "lol lol You're so harmless." (I have no idea why anyone would think of saying such a thing, but it's happened.) So why wouldn't that show in the type description? I think it's the PoLR. Also, I think beta and gamma are more likely to see us as week. At least that's my experience.

[Austy]

For me, when I thought I was INFP, I always felt like I needed to be more INFP, and that if I wasn't I was just some screwed up person that didn't have a type. And when things seemed to contradict, I kind of worked and fought to not be contradicting to the type.

One day Rocky said I sound more like an S, ISFP in fact, ironically I hadn't read much about them, as I read more about all the types before I read about ISFP and INFP. Guess I just don't find myself that interesting. Anyway, as I read, I felt it really fit, the Si explained a hell of a lot of my childhood and ISFP feels like home if that makes any sense.

[Animal]

It seems like people might take an incorrect stereotype of a type, say ENFps aren't very smart, and then say, "I *am* smart and therefore I'm not an ENFp!" But that person might seem very much like an ENFp.

Just an example, not thinking of anyone in particular.

I don't understand this. If I were you, I'd say to myself: "Rejoice! I am an intelligent ENFp!"

[detail]

For me, when I thought I was INFP, I always felt like I needed to be more INFP, and that if I wasn't I was just some screwed up person that didn't have a type. And when things seemed to contradict, I kind of worked and fought to not be contradicting to the type.

One day Rocky said I sound more like an S, ISFP in fact, ironically I hadn't read much about them, as I read more about all the types before I read about ISFP and INFP. Guess I just don't find myself that interesting. Anyway, as I read, I felt it really fit, the Si explained a hell of a lot of my childhood and ISFP feels like home if that makes any sense.

ISFps seem to have a thing with wanting to be INFp. I think it's because they think INFps are deep and ISFps are shallow and they want to be deep. The truth is that representatives of both types can be deep or shallow. It's a good example of how simplistic definitions of N vs S are misleading.

[Animal]

I kind of always wanted to be an ISFp. They seem to be more comfortable in their own bodies, and more connected to the world around them. They also tend to get more accomplished.

That said, my perception/judgement of myself and other types is tinged in NiFe, and so I'm biased towards my own type.

[Austy]

Actually I wanted to be ENTJ.

I never believed that crap about Ns being deeper or smarter than S types. For those that feel that way, I doubt it is because they really feel that way but that the stupid community throws that crap in there. Obviously started from some egotistical N that decided to voice his opinion.

[Joy]

I don't know that I'm healthy and self-aware... getting better though. I am, however, confident that I have a reasonably good understanding of types and functions.

I don't really *want* to be any type. With my current understanding of types and functions (I say to contrast it to my previously held ideas), the types that sound "best" to me the way Expat describes it are ENTj, ESFp, ISTp, and INTp.

ENTj sounds best... the ENTj description sounds like a happy and well me... when I picture myself in 10 or 20 years as the "me" I would most want to be, me at my most well, balanced, and successful, it looks almost exactly like the ENTj description. It is the image I've had since I was a teenager and it has never changed.

*The ESFp description sounds alright, but there's something unattractive about it, like it would be some sort of permanent mania. Some one who knows me read it and told me I'm only like that when I'm drunk.

*INTp sounds attractive too, but INTps strike me as being too responsible for me to be without having some sort of compulsive disorder. I don't think I'd be able to enjoy myself living as an INTp.

*ISTp sounds cool, but for me to be like that, I'd have to sorta "flatten out"... for me it would be some sort of permanent mild depression. While the ISTp lack of enthusiasm sounds "cool" to me, it doesn't seem like a healthy way for me to live.


blah blah blah disclaimer to those who love to bitch: *I am not saying that ESFps are manic. I am not saying that INTps are complusive and can't have fun. I am not saying that ISTps are flat. Understand?

[Raver]

What Expat is saying is pretty much true. A lot of people type themselves on *they want to be* and not what *they really are*. Of course, it's not that simple and stereotypes and misunderstandings lead to this problem as well. This is one reason why I believed I was an ENTp for a while.

[Expat]

What Expat is saying is pretty much true. A lot of people type themselves on *they want to be* and not what *they really are*. Of course, it's not that simple and stereotypes and misunderstandings lead to this problem as well. This is one reason why I believed I was an ENTp for a while.

But what I said is that generally what you want to be is your correct type, provided that you understand the types.

[Raver]

What Expat is saying is pretty much true. A lot of people type themselves on *they want to be* and not what *they really are*. Of course, it's not that simple and stereotypes and misunderstandings lead to this problem as well. This is one reason why I believed I was an ENTp for a while.

But what I said is that generally what you want to be is your correct type, provided that you understand the types.

Of course, if you don't understand them then you'll want to be an incorrect type.

[science as magic]

i thought you were going to break into a vertical horizon song

[snegledmaca]

There is no other way I'd rather be. I rejoice and have a warm fuzzy feeling when I think I'm an INFp. Such... joy. It's like I am who I am and it makes me incredibly happy. No pretense, misunderstandings, compensations, self delusion, effort to maintain an image, I am who I am and finally feel free.

But what I said is that generally what you want to be is your correct type, provided that you understand the types.

That is incredibly correct. I felt drawn to the image of being an INFp. It was like an urge, I belonged there, I felt it.
I experimented with my type a couple of times but every time it felt wrong. It might've been exhilarating as in a new experience that overwhelmed me but over time I had to maintain the image, it became awfully stressful, difficult.
Also the very reason I abandoned MBTI.

[Creepy-Diana]

.

[Polly]

I never believed that crap about Ns being deeper or smarter than S types. For those that feel that way, I doubt it is because they really feel that way but that the stupid community throws that crap in there. Obviously started from some egotistical N that decided to voice his opinion.

I don't believe this either. I do find that N types tend to be aware of things many S types aren't. Just as S types are aware of some things N's are not.

As children I think a lot of N's envied S's. I think maybe many S types didn't always understand the behaviors of the N types. I know many NTs talk about being targeted as kids.

Then they get to this point that they are just more easily aware of things which can have major impacts. Some wrap this awareness around themselves like a shield against S types. Some develop an elitest attitude.

The reality is, whatever ideas the N types might come up with, many of them simply could not be executed with S types to help us. Its not about using them, its about a partnership.

The great majority of S types I know have a far better memory than I do and did far better at school. Most are more organized and able to execute their plans better as well.

I still may run into conflicts with S types, I may bitch about them occassionally as I'm sure they do me. But I do still value them. It just tends to be more of a love/hate relationship sometimes and I do realize this is more my issue than theirs.

[Creepy-Diana]

.

[Polly]

I kind of felt that way too. I was first coming out as an ENFp. I related somewhat though because at the time I was living a pretty carefree life and was quite bubbly. I actually can act very wacky and funny.

But I really liked and admired the ENTp personality and kind of wished that was my personality. But again, that was just wishful thinking. It was what I felt I strived for in many ways (but at the time, thought I was doing it as an ENFp)

Then I started actually spend a lot of time alone and started coming out an INTp. At the time I was dealing with massive amounts of work and prolongued focus was required.

I then had a professional MBTI instructor assess and test my personality and I came out as an ENTp but just squeeked by as an E. When I reread the profile with that in mind I was absolutely beeming with pride.

When I started to learn more about my personality through socionics and MBTI I was pretty dumbfounded by how accurate things were dating all the way back to my childhood.

It then became very important to me to seek out other NT and NF types. When I started to find them and started talking to them more, I realized just how much I needed to talk to other intuitives.

[Ms. Kensington]

i think one can come to accept a lot of things, expat. so that could play a part in happiness.

I alternate between happiness with my type and wanting to have the traits of another type, but i think its just fleeting. it's kind of not something you can change so why think about it, yeah? But I see what you're saying, that these fleeting feelings shouldn't count.

because, if i wanted to be xNTp it was to further the same goals i had when i was an INTj. these things all blur after a while though. Not sure. I am finding i dont really feel much force in what I am saying, because it seems like one of those things that can't do much work if true.