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Thread: ESI and anxiety

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    boom boom boom blackburry's Avatar
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    Default ESI and anxiety

    'llo.

    spill.

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    c esi-se 6w7 spsx ashlesha's Avatar
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    pshhhhhhhhhhhhh

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    Tell me everything...

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    I'm biting my nails already :F

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    dont get anxious

    GET EVERYTHING

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    eh I wrote out a long post for the first entry but then laptop froze and all was lost.

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    It'll pass.
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

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    Quote Originally Posted by blackburry View Post
    eh I wrote out a long post for the first entry but then laptop froze and all was lost.
    My "long" posts fit on the screen so I can take a picture when that happens.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Park View Post
    It'll pass.
    True.

    I just like to be in control of myself. and anxiety has always been one thing that seems to take that away momentarily. It does eventually pass when I've rationalized my anxieties out and/or I'm too tired to continue carrying it on or I distract myself. I eventually hope to find solutions to it rather than just cover-ups.

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    Well, a permanent solution would require a permanent change in perspective towards the things that cause your anxiety. You can achieve this by identifying and clarifying what those things are, and then gradually and consciously changing your reactions to them. What I do sometimes is anticipate my own reaction and prevent it from occurring consciously. It takes some willpower and discipline, but it keeps you in control of yourself.
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

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    My mother (ESI) has horrible anxiety that can be triggered by just about anything. Although she can drive well enough, driving a car with her in the passenger seat is rather unpleasant (she gasps occasionally as if an imminent crash is going to happen).

    As far as I can tell she controls it with meds. It doesn't help that 75% of her family (other than her) is made up of Alpha NTs.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nefnaf View Post
    My mother (ESI) has horrible anxiety that can be triggered by just about anything. Although she can drive well enough, driving a car with her in the passenger seat is rather unpleasant (she gasps occasionally as if an imminent crash is going to happen).
    This is valuable piece of info. I've been thinking whether one can buy some anxiety actually. I wouldn't have so many motorbike accidents.

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    When I was like 17 I had a pretty bad anxiety problem, so I can relate. Some days I couldn't bring myself to go outside, and I would just stay in getting angry with myself. Shit sucked. Fearless now though ofc.

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    sometimes i get an uneasy stomach and a sense of urgency like i need to be doing something, changing something, but my mind won't gather the focus for anything productive because its too agitated and i can't figure out what or why and all i can actually do is just wait for the feeling to be over. this is the reason i got into focusing on my breathing because its the one thing that seems to be useful when it happens.

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    Quote Originally Posted by lungs View Post
    sometimes i get an uneasy stomach and a sense of urgency like i need to be doing something, changing something, but my mind won't gather the focus for anything productive because its too agitated and i can't figure out what or why and all i can actually do is just wait for the feeling to be over. this is the reason i got into focusing on my breathing because its the one thing that seems to be useful when it happens.
    I still get these periods of panic from time to time. I just sit and and focus on the time, and on how in ten minutes time nothing bad will have happened, it's just my body being weird at that moment, but that's okay. I think removing yourself from the situation helps.

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    Mwahahaha, silly weaklings in Si.

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    Absurd, please me banned again. or just don't click on any thread I make. You are useless and so are your comments. STOP.

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    WHAT ESI?

    The mind is restless and difficult to restrain, but it is subdued by practice

    -Krishna

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    Quote Originally Posted by blackburry View Post
    Absurd, please me banned again. or just don't click on any thread I make. You are useless and so are your comments. STOP.
    Yes, yes. Please you banned again and lul at demanding to not browse threads on a public forum, such private ownership, such entitlement, such psychosis. Anyway, people say I got not taste but I liek you, blacksheep. Your self-depreciating anxiety related "humour" and calling one useless is priceless. Carry on.

    Thanks @chriscorey for bumping this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Absurd View Post
    Yes, yes. Please you banned again and lul at demanding to not browse threads on a public forum, such private ownership, such entitlement, such psychosis. Anyway, people say I got not taste but I liek you, blacksheep. Your self-depreciating anxiety related "humour" and calling one useless is priceless. Carry on.

    Thanks @chriscorey for bumping this.
    You're an idiot in every way possible. congrats.

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    Quote Originally Posted by blackburry View Post
    You're an idiot in every way possible. congrats.
    Thank you.

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    .
    Last edited by Skepsis; 09-05-2015 at 02:55 AM.
    Important to note! People who share "indentical" socionics TIMs won't necessarily appear to be very similar, since they have have different backgrounds, experiences, capabilities, genetics, as well as different types in other typological systems (enneagram, instinctual variants, etc.) all of which also have a sway on compatibility and identification. Thus, Socionics type "identicals" won't necessarily be identical i.e. highly similar to each other, and not all people of "dual" types will seem interesting, attractive and appealing to each other.

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    I'm not unusually anxious. I get antsy while waiting for a situation to come to a head or when there's a false sense of calm or if there's any kind of uncertainty of course ... and I don't really like waiting ... but I really hate being anxious because it makes me USELESS and totally unable to focus. So I'm glad I'm not all that anxious naturally.

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    I get overstimulated pretty easily when I'm out in public.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Suedehead View Post
    I get overstimulated pretty easily when I'm out in public.
    This. It's a bit necessary for me to take some time to myself in private to wind down on a daily basis. Unfortunately, I don't always do this. I've also had some pretty bad anxiety issues since I was a kid. I didn't find out that it wasn't normal for people to take 2-3 hours for people to fall asleep until I was an adult. Apparently the average is 7 minutes. Man, someone just give me a hammer.

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    I workout to get rid of my anxiety. Or do anything that makes me feel physically tired at the end of the day.
    Last edited by Great; 04-23-2014 at 05:03 AM.

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    I have a lot of social anxiety, I worry a lot about what other people think of me, I freak out about what people are trying to do or what they are doing... And when I'm alone, I think about all the wrongs others have done to me and it gets me anxious.

    Wow, that was some real talk, lol. Slightly graphic, but, I'm here to be honest.

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    Honorary Ballsack
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    It's a constant struggle between what I want to do, what others want me to do, accepting or rejecting obligations, being stuck with unwanted obligations, being rushed and manipulated.
    Important to note! People who share "indentical" socionics TIMs won't necessarily appear to be very similar, since they have have different backgrounds, experiences, capabilities, genetics, as well as different types in other typological systems (enneagram, instinctual variants, etc.) all of which also have a sway on compatibility and identification. Thus, Socionics type "identicals" won't necessarily be identical i.e. highly similar to each other, and not all people of "dual" types will seem interesting, attractive and appealing to each other.

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    I'm LIE and I've been seeing this woman whom I think is ESI for a few months now. I've noticed that her house is immaculate. She thinks it's a mess, but you could eat off her kitchen floor, in stark contrast to the way I keep my house. She said she thinks my house is dirty, and she's right. It's a construction zone at the moment and it's not efficient to clean something when it's just going to get trampled again in an hour.

    Anyway, she's separated from her husband who took all of her bank account savings and everything else of value that he could remove from her house while she was at work to give to his new crush, so she's left with no money in the bank and her job is part time and the divorce lawyer she got in order to divorce him is not very good but he keeps sending her very large bills. So, you could say that she has some problems to deal with.

    I told her that her house was very nice. Very neat.
    "Yes, but do you see that?" and she pointed to the ceiling. I looked, expecting to see a huge crack which means that the house's foundation is broken and is sliding down the hill. But instead, I see.....nothing. An unbroken expanse of cool white ceiling.
    "What?", I said.
    "See this cove molding? It doesn't sit right."
    I squinted and I could see a one millimeter gap in places where the molding didn't lie flat to the wall.
    "You could fix that in fifteen minutes with some three-dollar paintable caulk."
    "Really? I thought it would be really expensive."

    So here she is, separated from her husband, kicked out of her church for being separated from her husband, her husband's family is talking shit about her to everyone she knows, her girlfriends are not returning her calls, she's without savings or a steady job, and she's panicked about a gap in some crown molding.

    Anxiety's gotta anxiety.

    I think she's a combination of enneagram 4 and 6, but mostly 6. Maybe she can move towards an enneagram 9 and chill a bit.

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    Anxiety? What is anxiety?

    Anyways, I'll look. Typically, the two people who I would consider gamma SF are not anxious, and are incredibly restrained, like me. However, one actually got really angry and almost killed a guy because rage. That is hear say, I wasn't there. Don't piss off Fi/Se. Especially when they are 200+ pound men. To be fair, he also grew up in Brooklyn, if that means anything.

    As to the woman above. The story is incredibly interesting. It parallels things I deal with.

    First, that is not anxiety, that is compartmentalizing. That makes sense to me, given her situation, and the context of the meeting. Compartmentalizing is a sign of anxiety, however it is something you do to deal with anxiety. If she is actually in a panic, it's not working. It is mot clear whether she actually is panicking or just being particular. Being particular is fine, and just a trait. She already shows the trait by cleaning the house so much, so I'm assuming it's not a psychological escapism thing, but more just her being a neat freak.

    To Adam.

    My thought is semi-dual. Explanation is she doesn't do things as you'd expect. Duals do indeed do things as you expect. This woman does not do what you expect, and cares about things you don't seem to care about. Up to you as to what to do with this information. Feel free to disregard it or clarify as needed.

    For a comparison of what I'd say in your position, I'd tell her not to worry about it. It is probably not worth the effort of getting a ladder, going up there with the caulk, and caulking it, then getting paint, and painting over it. Compare and contrast the solution. Am I right? No idea. How it feels to be irrational.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phrenology

    An optimist - does not get discouraged under any circumstances. Life upheavals and stressful events only toughen him and make more confident. He likes to laugh and entertain people. Enters contact with someone by involving him with a humorous remark. His humor is often sly and contain hints and double meanings. Easily enters into arguments and bets, especially if he is challenged. When arguing his points is often ironic, ridicules the views of his opponent. His irritability and hot temper may be unpleasant to others. However, he himself is not perceptive of this and believes that he is simply exchanging opinions.

    http://www.wikisocion.net/en/index.php?title=LIE_Profile_by_Gulenko

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    I used to think that I was ESI. I realized that I do not pay enough attention to the nuances of relationships and that I am too much of an "idea generator" to be an ESI. I am an EIE and I suffer from bad anxiety.





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    Quote Originally Posted by StarPath View Post
    I used to think that I was ESI. I realized that I do not pay enough attention to the nuances of relationships and that I am too much of an "idea generator" to be an ESI. I am an EIE and I suffer from bad anxiety.
    @StarPath, where do you think the anxiety comes from?

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    I knew an ESI at a job I worked. Anytime anything would go wrong with anything she would fall apart, turn into a nervous mess, and lash out at everyone.
    The Barnum or Forer effect is the tendency for people to judge that general, universally valid statements about personality are actually specific descriptions of their own personalities. A "universally valid" statement is one that is true of everyone—or, more likely, nearly everyone. It is not known why people tend to make such misjudgments, but the effect has been experimentally reproduced.

    The psychologist Paul Meehl named this fallacy "the P.T. Barnum effect" because Barnum built his circus and dime museum on the principle of having something for everyone. It is also called "the Forer effect" after its discoverer, the psychologist Bertram R. Forer, who modestly dubbed it "the fallacy of personal validation".

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    Hmmm...anxiety issues? Nope. Can't relate well. Only in new, unfamiliar situations (travelling to a new place/country, meeting new people, things like that). I'm more comfortable with the familiar, generally speaking. I don't avoid new things to cater to some annoying feelings (which would be plain cowardly, weak, and pathetic imo), I simply push past my comfort zone until it becomes the new comfort zone. My usual confidence returns once I warm up to something new. I act normal but people could pick up on it in some subtle body language and facial expressions...maybe shakiness in my voice if it's severe enough.

    I'm not really expressive of my emotions overtly. For the most part I'm pretty emotionally contained, and even uncomfortable with outward expression. I would rather simply state verbally how I feel than actually demonstrate it. That means I'll sooner say "I am getting angry because of X, Y, and Z dynamics" (while trying to maintain a calm outward demeanor) than actually yell at someone or somehow act out my anger. Much of the reason behind this is not wanting to emotionally vomit on someone I care for and hurt them. My empathy and consideration for them causes me to be passionate about self-control over my verbal lashings (passionately protective of them, even if the risk of damage is coming from myself). Generally such demonstrations are unhelpful and not conducive toward positive solutions anyway.

    If I do act it out there is generally a specific purpose that revolves around the way others will react: asserting myself more firmly so they pay more attention and stop talking over me, applying pressure to someone more 'difficult' in order to pressure them into giving me information I want to know (because they are 'difficult' I know they won't simply outright tell me), shaking someone out of self-defeating thinking patterns as they're complaining about things...I can't think of more examples off the top of my head currently.

    EDIT: A note about "asserting myself more firmly so they pay more attention and stop talking over me" - there is usually a certain shock value when someone who is always composed, emotionally reserved, and not neurotic at all, suddenly one day is escalated. It tends to take people back a bit so they are more inclined to take things seriously without me having to overdo things.
    Last edited by Fluffy Princess Unicorn; 10-04-2021 at 09:26 PM.


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    Quote Originally Posted by eiemo View Post
    I used to think that I was ESI. I realized that I do not pay enough attention to the nuances of relationships and that I am too much of an "idea generator" to be an ESI. I am an EIE and I suffer from bad anxiety.
    Testing for quadra is easy (e.g. Gamma's fundamentally know life is a game that you must play because it's impossible not to. Do you feel this way? Yes? Than I'd be surprised if you're not one of us). But this whole subject is not. You say you suffer from extreme anxiety? I can tell you why that is and it transcends socionics and types.

    Anxiety stems from attachment issues. Aristotle said that man is a social animal and he was dead on. How than is man social? He/she forms emotional bonds/attachments with others. These attachments, beyond feeling awesome and healing any wound we may suffer in our souls, were also absolutely pivotal in regards to our physical survival. Up until the modern industrial age living here, there, or anywhere was largely the same. You were born into a clan and a community. Those who truly got you became part of your "tribe", your inner circle. You had plenty of chances to find said tribe. The extended family were all located within walking distance. No matter what, you were almost guaranteed to find at least three other people who you would open up to and they'd respond with total acceptance.

    To your primal brain you knew mom, dad, brother, sister, uncle, and on and on could see deep into your soul and tell you they loved you warts and all. How could they not? They always had enough time to fulfill your needs no matter how minor. Even a simple request for a hug from someone within the clan failed to go unanswered. Even if mom and dad had negative socionic relations to you they did their best and their extended family had excellent chances of containing those who would have a positive relation to you. And while people speak of the horror of "arranged marriages" you can bet your ass that both families would try to line up duals with duals and if they didn't they'd work their way down the list of "most positive" relationships as best they could. The didn't know what we knew now, but I bet they'd have gotten pretty close just on their gut instincts. Never forget that people possessing broken attachment styles are all alike in one factor. They really do love the objects of their misguided affections. They would love nothing more than to see them be happy. Sadly, they haven't even the slightest clue as to how to make that happen. After all, the memory of how it happened for countless millennia was lost upon the shell-shocked fields of Passchendaele, Flanders Fields, Verdun, etc...

    Good luck finding the love we have lost in the suburbs let alone the inner city proper nowadays. Only in the most remote rural communities do you even stand a ghost of a chance of experiencing what our ancestors had in the so called "dark" ages. Where that village was lucky to run up against Dunbar's number. Now? I mean, if you know about Judge Dredd you've already experienced the microcosm of a Megablock if you reside within an "affordable" apartment complex. Stacked and packed in squalor... And people wonder why you couldn't pay me a billion to live in the inner cities of the coasts.

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    While I pencilled the following in the margin of status report, it was an ESI that was inspiring it:

    Poor Me

    From words that were said
    I conjured up dread,
    Poor me.
    I hate what was done
    And think I should run,
    Poor me
    I feel discontent
    But not confident,
    Poor me
    I want one of those
    And help I suppose,
    Poor me.
    I need attention
    But not intrusion,
    Poor me.
    I’ve been such a pain
    Which drives me insane,
    Poor me.
    To express I’m blue,
    I decry to you
    Poor me.

    a.k.a. I/O

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    Well I’ve been chatting to a rather funny ESI with strong opinions in my office. She’s helped me with something that’s been giving me a lot of anxiety..

    One day after I’d been sighing a lot all day she said to me ‘what is it?’ I said I can’t sleep :/ She said ‘what time are you waking up in the night? Are you going to bed too early? I know we all want to get the ideal 8 hours.’ I said ‘no, I’m not..’. But I realised she was right. By giving myself a window of slightly more than 8 hours to sleep in I’m ending up getting less than 6 often..but by aiming for 7-8 (like any doc would say..) I’m probs more likely to get more than 6. It’s not like I really wanted 8, I was just so tired I thought I had to aim for 8. Also, sleep had become so important to me it seemed like even 6.5 hours was something bad and troubling..and it can be when the rest of the week you’ve been getting 5/6 or less. The amount of drama and stress it causes is a perfect example of getting stuck in an IEI anxiety knot. Might not be obvious drama but it’s there in you head constantly ruining your life, quietly, bringing you down, lol. As well as the actual symptoms of sleep deprivation. It all adds up.

    Anxiety, when it’s bad…screw anxiety.
    Last edited by Bethanyclaire; 10-09-2021 at 08:42 AM.

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    @Bethany Many ESIs and IEIs pull bugaboos out of the ether. ESI anxiety seems wrapped around fear of failure; they tend to make mountains out of molehills so many undertakings or problems become intimidating for no real reason. IEI anxiety seems to stem from them feeling not as accepted or successful as they should be; tunnel vision often exacerbates these negative perceptions. ESIs seem to get more stressed about what will happen while IEIs stress over what has happened, or who they or those close to them have become.

    a.k.a. I/O

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