bad dual relationships

[tejing]

I'm not sure if my own personal issue would be a "bias" actually, since it was a natural reaction, thoughts, and feelings I've had since my teens, during multiple experiences. I continue to give each one I meet a chance, some with better results, but I'm pretty convinced there's no way I would choose my dual or ever would have, or if I happen to be mistyped (which, I don't think some types or function definitions are anywhere near 'correct' by my standards anyway), any other type of real relationship with this type. I tend to choose relationships with less emotional types and have since my teens. That's comfortable for me, and it allows me more time and energy, and focus. I'm not sure if everyone should try to eliminate their biases; I suppose it just depends on how extreme they are and if the biases make them unhappy vs. safe and assured, and happy.

Looks like you misunderstood me here. I was talking about removing experiential bias when considering an intellectual question, not suppressing your natural actions.

Yes, I know. It was a hypothetical example. Any two types could be used.

I know. My point was about something like not expecting socionics to predict everything.

I agree with you that interpreting socionics intuitively is about the only way, and I'm sure it's a ball for some of the intuitive types, but from my perspective, there's not a whole lot there to work with. If I were to approach it, it would be in a manner of trying to "fix" it, and that would be a much larger undertaking than anything I am capable of alone, at this time. If I were to actually spend my time creating a relations system, it would probably be done with mbti as a basis, since it's a more solid ground with which to build on.

MBTI is certainly a more mature, well-esablished theory. Socionics is sort of like alpha software by comparison: great for the geeks who want to tinker with it, but not ready for release yet.

As a pretty much all my thoughts are in this form, as it pays to keep my ideas as malleable as possible, so I tend to actually look down on the rigidity of a well-established system, or at best see it as a limited point of view on a much more malleable concept. Still that rigidity is rather handy when doing some of those "little things" I tend to ignore like actually implementing things or achieving results...

[InvisibleJim]

It sounds like people are applying bad sarahian socionics.

[tejing]

I doubt that here in America, 1/3 of married couples are dual relationships, or I (and others I know) would have noticed it alot more often. I think it's a possibility, but not more so than any other relation.

Why not? It's not like dual relationships have a big neon sign pointing them out. The differences are subtle and may only even come into play in private.

[jet city woman]

Why not? It's not like dual relationships have a big neon sign pointing them out. The differences are subtle and may only even come into play in private.

Well, to me, the differences aren't so subtle lol.....
I'm speaking of the relationships where I actually know/have known the couples at least fairly well, not just people walking down the street.

[Beautiful sky]

Why not? It's not like dual relationships have a big neon sign pointing them out. The differences are subtle and may only even come into play in private.

Partly true; take myself

LSI and I don't have decent conversations in public, yet we are physically attracted and flirtatious, in private they are too competitive and see me as just another constant obstacle course, a "challenge" to overcome and that drives me nuts because we can't have a shared relationship if all I am is just a chess piece on the board.
SLI and I both have awesome conversations and we are very fun flirtatious, in private they are too down for not doing things in a good enough organized fashion, yet they can manage time and events quite well
LSE and I have awesome conversations yet not very flirtatious, in private their energy is steady, they are very comfortable and focused energy
SLE and I have awesome conversations, very flirtatious, in private their energy, will and drive makes me feel inadequate and incapable of keeping up, I get very exhausted

[jet city woman]

Looks like you misunderstood me here. I was talking about removing experiential bias when considering an intellectual question

Ahhh.... well, sure, I don't see why not, on a personal basis.

(In my case, I don't think I have an experiential bias; I'm just going to be who I am at that moment. Sometimes it's more experiential, and sometimes it's not.)

My point was about something like not expecting socionics to predict everything.

ha.

MBTI is certainly a more mature, well-esablished theory. [Socionics is] great for the geeks who want to tinker with it, but not ready for release yet.

Certainly.

As a pretty much all my thoughts are in this form, as it pays to keep my ideas as malleable as possible, so I tend to actually look down on the rigidity of a well-established system, or at best see it as a limited point of view on a much more malleable concept. Still that rigidity is rather handy when doing some of those "little things" I tend to ignore like actually implementing things or achieving results...

ha, well that makes sense, somewhat. I know some Ti/Nes who are more rigid than I am. Rigid to the point of.... well...... (insanity with no practicality?) But at the same time, some I know are near-genius in certain matters.

yea, I'm lazy, so what are we gonna do with ourselves?

[jet city woman]

LSI and I don't have decent conversations in public, yet we are physically attracted and flirtatious, in private they are too competitive and see me as just another constant obstacle course, a "challenge" to overcome and that drives me nuts because we can't have a shared relationship if all I am is just a chess piece on the board.

How could you say such horrible things about LSIs? I am mortified! I'm really not that competitive. In fact, I don't like true competitions with buddies; I prefer friendlier relations. But maybe to you, I would be.

[Beautiful sky]

How could you say such horrible things about LSIs? I am mortified! I'm really not that competitive. In fact, I don't like true competitions with buddies; I prefer friendlier relations. But maybe to you, I would be.

I don't think you're LSI; I'm pretty sure you're SLI

[jet city woman]

I don't think you're LSI; I'm pretty sure you're SLI

Ahhh, k, I'll take that to heart. So I'm Si/Te?

What is it about me that you believe would clue you in that I'm SLI? (like Jessica, for instance, or my mother)......

[tejing]

so what are we gonna do with ourselves?

What we've always done, I suppose: be ourselves.

[tejing]

I don't think you're LSI; I'm pretty sure you're SLI

Yea, I've been settling on the same conclusion.

[jet city woman]

Yea, I've been settling on the same conclusion.

LMFAO. I think you're LSI posing as LII.

[Beautiful sky]

Ahhh, k, I'll take that to heart. So I'm Si/Te?

What is it about me that you believe would clue you in that I'm SLI? (like Jessica, for instance, or my mother)......

You, like Jessica, are trusting, open about advice in relation to your personal lives; you don't feel like you're giving your "enemy" something, a piece of information about yourself which can give too much away about who you are; trusting and see information about who you are and how you live life as universal to humanity (hence humanitarian valuers) - hence your signature. You're confident in the scope of human relations and interactions, you're not pushy, or don't size up things in terms of power dynamics; these don't mean that you're not strong and can't be when times call for it, it just means when time calls for it as opposed to a regular guard.

[golden]

I think any two people can have a terrible relationship if they work hard enough at it.

[jet city woman]

You, like Jessica, are trusting, open about advice in relation to your personal lives; you don't feel like you're giving your "enemy" something, a piece of information about yourself which can give too much away about who you are; trusting and see information about who you are and how you live life as universal to humanity (hence humanitarian valuers) - hence your signature. You're confident in the scope of human relations and interactions, you're not pushy, or don't size up things in terms of power dynamics;

I think maybe the reason I don't size up things in terms of power dynamics is because it's nothing I'm interested in. I think it's a time-waster. If you notice my e-type, 6, it goes to 3 when unhealthy, and 9 when healthy. Maybe that's what you're seeing that I have in common with some SLIs. I don't care to compete in certain arenas; others I will, but not with friends. I consider my friends my support network.

[Beautiful sky]

LMFAO. I think you're LSI posing as LII.

Why does what he say cause you to Laugh first?

[Beautiful sky]

I think maybe the reason I don't size up things in terms of power dynamics is because it's nothing I'm interested in. I think it's a time-waster. If you notice my e-type, 6, it goes to 3 when unhealthy, and 9 when healthy. Maybe that's what you're seeing that I have in common with some SLIs. I don't care to compete in certain arenas; others I will, but not with friends. I consider my friends my support network.

that.

[tejing]

LMFAO. I think you're LSI posing as LII.

Hehe, not likely. I spend at least 50% of my waking hours staring off into space (re)inventing abstract concepts. LSIs do things. But I'm curious as to why you say that.

[jet city woman]

Why does what he say cause you to Laugh first?

Because we both thought the other was wrong. It's just funny to me. (I can't totally explain why; it's just relationship dynamics).

[jet city woman]

Hehe, not likely. I spend at least 50% of my waking hours staring off into space (re)inventing abstract concepts. LSIs do things. But I'm curious as to why you say that.

The reason I laughed here is because you said LSIs do, and at that point, what went through my mind was, "Yea, some LSIs do. They do smoke pot, they do drink beer, and they do lay around the house playing video games all day."

Actually, I spend at least 50% of my time also thinking internally. I stare off into space as well, and am kinda disassociative actually, at times (my S.O., Finale, claims that I am REALLY disassociative lol.... I'll trail off on a thought in the middle of a conversation and miss what the other person said.) I'm sometimes analyzing whatever the current issue or problem is, and coming up with solutions in my head, or I am trying to figure out how something works (coming up with my own theories or "conspiracy theories" at times). I'm action-oriented, but not as much-so as you are seeming to claim.

I can't really tell you a good reason why I question you being LII; I just do. You may be a variety I haven't seen before. Most of them seem more.... original and verbally acute. I would just need a lot more time to observe to make a real determination of your type. I don't think typing over the internet is a good idea in the first place, really. People can act totally different on the internet than who they really are irl.

[Beautiful sky]

Hehe, not likely. I spend at least 50% of my waking hours staring off into space (re)inventing abstract concepts. LSIs do things. But I'm curious as to why you say that.

that's fine but do you analyze things according to systems?

[tejing]

I think maybe the reason I don't size up things in terms of power dynamics is because it's nothing I'm interested in. I think it's a time-waster. If you notice my e-type, 6, it goes to 3 when unhealthy, and 9 when healthy. Maybe that's what you're seeing that I have in common with some SLIs. I don't care to compete in certain arenas; others I will, but not with friends. I consider my friends my support network.

Incidentally this fits perfectly with a ignoring function.

[Pookie]

So as an intelligent and attractive male does that mean im doomed to one night stands and meaningless relationships? Because ill totally settle.

[Beautiful sky]

Incidentally this fits perfectly with a ignoring function.

That just proved you do

[jet city woman]

Incidentally this fits perfectly with a ignoring function.

Because I value a support system of friends that I don't compete with, and I prefer to compete with strangers, and only in certain arenas? That doesn't make sense. How would you type an ISTP 9 in socionics then, because I know one. People have contradictions within them.
Lol, so I'm not Se? I'm Si after all.....is that what you're saying?

Actually neither of us knows the other well enough to make the call, imo.

[jet city woman]

So as an intelligent and attractive male does that mean im doomed to one night stands and meaningless relationships? Because ill totally settle.

Yea for some reason all the intelligent, attractive males want that these days. Whatz the deal, dood? Are you guys all shallow?

[tejing]

that's fine but do you analyze things according to systems?

My internal systems, yes. Never external systems. All the interesting part for me is in the invention though, not the application.

[Pookie]

Yea for some reason all the intelligent, attractive males want that these days. Whatz the deal, dood? Are you guys all shallow?

Were just a bit jaded and a bit selfish. Basically, were not selfish enough to make a relationship work and not jaded enough to keep our partners invested.

[jet city woman]

Could be illusion as well, because getting bored is a very very common feature of illusion.

Some people also aren't meant for permanent romance or monogamous relationships.

As far as duals, I've never been romantically involved with one, but I've had illusion relations and semi-dual, and I would say illusion is characterized by boredom while semi-dual was characterized by violent misunderstandings. Both of these individuals I think very highly of still.

But I've worked with a dual for like 13 years and it has been a great relationship, probably one of the few people I've ever enjoyed working with, she's married to a ILE as well.

Romantic relationships are going to be more volatile but given my professional relationship experiences, I seriously doubt anything but a dual will work out romantically for me, as I view romantic relationship at a very low priority in life(althrough still neccessary). is true, hk?

Also, so you view romantic romanticships at very priority to you, yet you call yourself sx-leading? K.... than makes fucking more than sense.



That sucks for women, I guess I'll aim for the same IQ or smarter female then... ^_^

Common ENTp. Nothing original about Si.... doing the same thing, day after day, but just in a "new" way... hahaha.
How much of this is bullshit : I seriously doubt anything but a dual will work out romantically for me,as I view romantic relationship at a very low priority in life(althrough still neccessary). or this, especially, "That sucks for women, I guess I'll aim for the same IQ or smarther female then...."

[Absurd]

Hehe, not likely. I spend at least 50% of my waking hours staring off into space (re)inventing abstract concepts. LSIs do things. But I'm curious as to why you say that.

SEE.

[Ms. Kensington]

Not sure if subtypes are accepted on this forum anymore. But I think the subtype needs to be considered, and then of course the other relationship factors

[Ms. Kensington]

I have known two duals of opposite subtype, one of them I split with for differences in interests, the other we cannot get too close because they have a guard up and I find it too-cautious and annoying, too observing of boundaries, but I don't know if that would change at a closer connection. We're coworkers.

The one I grew apart from, she was my best friend from childhood. Even though we share nothing in common in terms of interests, we can talk on and on and on about nothing in particular. a bit annoying and exhausting as you can't get off the train.

[Aramas]

Every serial killer, psychopath, narcissist, abuser is a dual to someone. How much do you want to bet that they didn't kill or torture at least one dual? Be with someone who makes you happy deep down inside. There is nothing else. Socionics be damned.

In Harry Potter, Narcissa (IEI) betrays Voldemort (SLE) because she sees how evil he is. Bellatrix (IEI) loses her life because she was a fool to follow him. A good conflictor can be better than a bad dual. Tbh I'm not really sure how important Socionics is to happiness. I've known SLEs I've liked a lot and SLEs who hated each other. It seems like there's more important shit to me, tbh.

Socionics is one of those absolute abstract ideal things in a platonic sense. In reality there's a whole lot of other shit at play. And that other shit often matters a LOT more.

You shouldn't be paying attention to Socionics in real life. The only thing you should pay attention to is how you really feel about someone. In the end, that's what is going to matter--not type.

Socionics is really just a useless curiosity--something to ponder inside the depths of your own mind and with those who are interested. People who try to use it are likely to get burned. If Socionics really "works", because it's part of reality, it doesn't need your help, and there's nothing you can do to make it work. And if it doesn't, who cares? It's better to be unaware of Socionics.