EIIs-INFjs on cursing and swearing

[Suz]

Good point - there was a study on the impact of swearing on the subjective perception of pain - people who were allowed to swear loudly registered lower pain than controls who were allowed to yell a neutral word.


That delta aristocracy thing was tongue-in-cheek

Edit to add link: http://www.time.com/time/magazine/ar...913773,00.html

I particularly like the last paragraph:



My thoughts exactly...

Despite my general attitude on swearing, i think Pinker actually brings up an EXCELLENT point in that excerpt you quoted. Again, speaks to the power of words and how important they are.

[Galen]

Actually while we're on the subject, this opens up a whole new can o' worms:

And disdain at the use of the expletives is different from disdain at the person him/herself for using them.

I find it bizarre that people can disassociate the actions that someone performs from who they are. I've always seen the things people do as an inherent part of them, or at least indicative of some larger inner psychological network.

[Slacker]

I don't have a problem with people who swear. I don't generally, but I do sometimes. It just isn't a big deal to me. I don't because I think I'm generally careful because I don't want to offend other people with my language. But sometimes I get verbal diarrhea and stuff just comes out. Hmm and maybe sometimes it just seems like the best way to say what I want to say.

I don't like the argument that it shows a lack of vocabulary. I wonder if people saying that even believe it. It sounds like some kind of manipulative way of trying to make people feel embarrassed to do what you don't want them to do. I hate underhanded manipulative attempts to control people. That bothers me more than any language.

My EII sister does really have disdain for people who use any kind of coarse language (I might have said that) but she has issues and that might not be entirely or even at all related to type.

[strangeling]

Well, the emotional breakdown response to that stimulus is presumably a relatively stable part of who they are, and reflects on their identity - the hurting person in distress is who you offer help to, and is a fleeting, ephemeral part of their identity...

*dang, didn't delete in enough time.

How is an 'emotional breakdown' in any way a 'stable' part of who they are? You lost me there.

[anndelise]

Actually while we're on the subject, this opens up a whole new can o' worms:


I find it bizarre that people can disassociate the actions that someone performs from who they are. I've always seen the things people do as an inherent part of them, or at least indicative of some larger inner psychological network.

One action itself does not accurately represent the entirety of a person.
To get a better idea of a person's larger inner psychological network, it helps to look at the wide range of actions they do. In particular when they show more than one possible action in a similar situation, discovering why they chose which action from their repertoire that they did for that given situation.

Personally, I can easily dislike some parts of a person, their actions, and/or their psyche...
But not entirely dislike them.
Heck, I can even admire parts of a person that I can't stand.

For example: I don't like drugs, but I do like some people who happen to use drugs. But that's a part of their life that I am not interested in being around. It doesn't mean that I don't like them, personally...all it means is I don't like being around drugs, drug talk, drug using, etc.

[Beautiful sky]

Just because EII are loving of people, just because we are caring of those who we love and want to take care of, and just because we can navigate relations doesn't mean we can't be human, doesn't mean that every once in a while we let our frustrations fly free; yes we feel guilty and bad about doing so, but these are human emotions evoked by hurting something we don't want and it's perfectly normal.

[Suz]

I don't have a problem with people who swear. I don't generally, but I do sometimes. It just isn't a big deal to me. I don't because I think I'm generally careful because I don't want to offend other people with my language. But sometimes I get verbal diarrhea and stuff just comes out. Hmm and maybe sometimes it just seems like the best way to say what I want to say.

I don't like the argument that it shows a lack of vocabulary. I wonder if people saying that even believe it. It sounds like some kind of manipulative way of trying to make people feel embarrassed to do what you don't want them to do. I hate underhanded manipulative attempts to control people. That bothers me more than any language.

My EII sister does really have disdain for people who use any kind of coarse language (I might have said that) but she has issues and that might not be entirely or even at all related to type.

No intention to be manipulative. It's just how i see it, and one of the reasons i personally avoid swearing. Could be related to my upbringing. Interestingly my mom does swear (in Russian) when she gets emotional, but always ridiculed and acted disgusted at other people for swearing, especially if my sister or I were present. But i dont know, i guess it had an effect on me, because i have no desire ever to swear. I dont have any desire to change that about myself though either.

I actually feel like the majority here are trying to manipulate me into changing my views.

[Suz]

One action itself does not accurately represent the entirety of a person.
To get a better idea of a person's larger inner psychological network, it helps to look at the wide range of actions they do. In particular when they show more than one possible action in a similar situation, discovering why they chose which action from their repertoire that they did for that given situation.

Personally, I can easily dislike some parts of a person, their actions, and/or their psyche...
But not entirely dislike them.
Heck, I can even admire parts of a person that I can't stand.

For example: I don't like drugs, but I do like some people who happen to use drugs. But that's a part of their life that I am not interested in being around. It doesn't mean that I don't like them, personally...all it means is I don't like being around drugs, drug talk, drug using, etc.

Ditto. I'm actually really surprised at your comment @Galen, especially since you were one of the people who was saying expletives aren't really a big deal. I agree they aren't a big deal, so why should i take them to be a reflection of a person's ENTIRE being? I do feel that using expletives does reflect oneself to an extent (a very limited one). It's just one little facet of a person, which does color an impression of them, but certainly shouldn't take over to represent the entire scope of a person, imo.

You can be an awesome great person and use expletives... in fact i know many great people and friends who do.

[Suz]

Lil' bit I like to think of it as challenging you to question your bigotry...

Bigotry?? how has my personal view on vulgar language turned into bigotry? I can say you are bigoted towards using proper language then...

I am not telling you to stop swearing. I am tolerant of people who want to swear. How is that bigotry?

[ashlesha]

Bigotry?? how has my personal view on vulgar language turned into bigotry? I can say you are bigoted towards using proper language then...

I am not telling you to stop swearing. I am tolerant of people who want to swear. How is that bigotry?

a lot of it imo is the way you go about explaining yourself. if you were to flat-out say you thought people who swear are stupid and shouldn't do it then there would be something tangible to go on but when you say things like "i am tolerant of people who want to swear" it is implicit in your words that swearing is something to be tolerated. i think you often don't realize these sorts of implicit pieces of language which is part of why when people suggest ESE for you it makes a great deal of sense to me because of possible Ni polr.

[Suz]

You "tolerate" them, but you judge them to have a poor vocabulary, be embarrassing themselves, and be using "retarded rhetoric". You've been projecting an unsavory and untrue stereotype to a group of diverse individuals... I think you should be able to see my point now.

Just like you judge me to be a "bigot" or a prude for having those views. I am allowed to have my opinion. I dont impose my views on people and as i mentioned in a separate post, i dont even take expletives to be an entire reflection of a person's being. Swearing is a vulgar thing to do... it's silly to say otherwise. Some people just want to be vulgar, some people want to express their frustation in such a way, all of these things have been mentioned by others here as well, even those who disagree with my views. I personally think there are other ways to express frustration and emotion without needing to be vulgar, and this imo reflects a lack of vocabulary... what's so bigoted about that? Maybe a little haughty, sure i admit that... not bigotry though. It's a standard i apply to myself more so than expecting it from others.

[Suz]

a lot of it imo is the way you go about explaining yourself. if you were to flat-out say you thought people who swear are stupid and shouldn't do it then there would be something tangible to go on but when you say things like "i am tolerant of people who want to swear" it is implicit in your words that swearing is something to be tolerated. i think you often don't realize these sorts of implicit pieces of language which is part of why when people suggest ESE for you it makes a great deal of sense to me because of possible Ni polr.

how does this have anything to do with Fe-dom? An Fe-dom wouldn't even be having this argument!

[anndelise]

Ditto. I'm actually really surprised at your comment @Galen, especially since you were one of the people who was saying expletives aren't really a big deal. I agree they aren't a big deal, so why should i take them to be a reflection of a person's ENTIRE being? I do feel that using expletives does reflect oneself to an extent (a very limited one). It's just one little facet of a person, which does color an impression of them, but certainly shouldn't take over to represent the entire scope of a person, imo.

You can be an awesome great person and use expletives... in fact i know many great people and friends who do.

I'm not too surprised at his comments, and they make sense to me. I'm glad he wrote them.

I think one of the primary issues people are having with what you wrote is how judgmental you've been about swearing.
You've called it a sign of the person having a small vocabulary,
that swearing is dumb and self-deprecating,
referring to a 'need' to resort to such language, (while initially unattending to the purposes such words can have),
feeling embarrassed for the person who is swearing (as if they Should be embarrassed by it).

And making broad judgments/categories such as
Linking swearing with words that make/alter history,
Linking swearing with words that can be more powerful than weapons.

In other words, you didn't limit your judgment to your own preference that you don't like hearing swear words nor using swear words yourself. You expanded that into judging a person, in part. (plus a few 'logical' errors)

Yes, you were just stating your views regarding swearing. But then so are these people.

----
And, imo, octo had a point that what's more important is the message the person is trying to get across rather than the exact words that they are using. Or, placing more value on their words than their message.

Though, on the other hand, if the words one uses blocks a listener from listening, then perhaps the communication efforts aren't being used as best as could be. But...it's not like the speaker could please all of the people listening, and perhaps it's wrong to expect the speaker to cater to one's own preferences without some kind of give and take.

Finally, like the quote further up that refers to swear words losing their power if used too often, it might help some to keep in mind that one generation's swear words becomes another generation's slang. "Bloody" as an adjective used to be considered swearing. "Bastard" used to have significant meaning. What separates calling someone a moron or an idiot from calling them a cunt or an asshole? What separates "hell" from "h, e, double hockey sticks"? Or putting "diddly" in sentences Ned Flanders style from actual swearing?

[Suz]

I'm not too surprised at his comments, and they make sense to me. I'm glad he wrote them.

I think one of the primary issues people are having with what you wrote is how judgmental you've been about swearing.
You've called it a sign of the person having a small vocabulary,
that swearing is dumb and self-deprecating,
referring to a 'need' to resort to such language, (while initially unattending to the purposes such words can have),
feeling embarrassed for the person who is swearing (as if they Should be embarrassed by it).

Well i mean, what can i say...that's how i feel about swearing... i can't really change that about myself. I do feel embarrassed for the person when they swear, and I would feel embarrased if i swore as well. I'm just saying how it makes me feel. If they dont feel embarrassed, more power to them! I wasn't trying to manipulate people here into not swearing. The thread asked about attitudes towards swearing and that happens to be my attitude.

And making broad judgments/categories such as
Linking swearing with words that make/alter history,
Linking swearing with words that can be more powerful than weapons.

OK a lot of people seem to be assuming this for some reason. I was NOT talking about swear words when i said that. I was responding to aivonua's comment about how words are meaningless and "just words". This was about words in general. The ENTITY of "words". I personally place a lot of value in words. I have made it a point in my life to choose my words carefully, because I've always had an awe for how words can affect so many things, so what she said struck a chord in me and i had to respond to that. I dont always succeed but it has been a mission of mine in life to constantly improve this quality of myself. It's unfortunately that a lot of people here assumed i was referring simply to swear words in my statement, in addition to assuming that i was only implying negative effects of words. Others here have actually proven my point, even when describing swear words being used for emphasis, etc. Words even swear words are not "just words" but a vehicle for delivering one's thoughts to the world and need to be accorded the proper respect. Nowhere in these assertions have I said "that means swearing is bad" or "that's why you shouldn't swear". So far nobody here has denied the truth of what i said, even though many seem to argue against something that i didn't even say or mean.

In other words, you didn't limit your judgment to your own preference that you don't like hearing swear words nor using swear words yourself. You expanded that into judging a person, in part. (plus a few 'logical' errors)

I never said i dont like hearing swear words. I am indifferent to them. Yes i dont like using swear words myself. But i dont care if other people swear. And yes it does give me some info about the person... to begin with, it tells me the person isn't averse to using swear words. What that means as far as their character really depends on the context. It's not a black or white issue here.

And, imo, octo had a point that what's more important is the message the person is trying to get across rather than the exact words that they are using. Or, placing more value on their words than their message.

That's exactly what i believe though as well.

Though, on the other hand, if the words one uses blocks a listener from listening, then perhaps the communication efforts aren't being used as best as could be. But...it's not like the speaker could please all of the people listening, and perhaps it's wrong to expect the speaker to cater to one's own preferences without some kind of give and take.

someone using swear words doesn't block me from listening, where did you get that from? Word choice does affect the message though, i dont think anyone here contests that.

Finally, like the quote further up that refers to swear words losing their power if used too often, it might help some to keep in mind that one generation's swear words becomes another generation's slang. "Bloody" as an adjective used to be considered swearing. "Bastard" used to have significant meaning. What separates calling someone a moron or an idiot from calling them a cunt or an asshole? What separates "hell" from "h, e, double hockey sticks"? Or putting "diddly" in sentences Ned Flanders style from actual swearing?

That's a really great point, and very interesting to see the evolution of words...

[Suz]

Well, firstly, the fact that plenty of people who swear have massive vocabularies (see e.g. James Joyce), so it's a false "opinion", just like, say, gay men are feminine, or black people are criminals, or girls who wear short skirts are asking for it, or male babysitters are closet pedophiles... all "opinions" that people are "allowed to have", and some would say it would be "silly to say otherwise".

It's kind of scary how easily what you've said could be applied to other groups of wrongly maligned individuals.

I could reverse this and say the same exact thing about your judgements of my viewpoint.

[anndelise]

Well i mean, what can i say...that's how i feel about swearing... i can't really change that about myself. I do feel embarrassed for the person when they swear, and I would feel embarrased if i swore as well. I'm just saying how it makes me feel. If they dont feel embarrassed, more power to them! I wasn't trying to manipulate people here into not swearing. The thread asked about attitudes towards swearing and that happens to be my attitude.

WA, I am embarrassed for you for how you've expressed yourself in this thread.

[ashlesha]

the Ne from anndelise seemed to be working a little. we need to get an LII in here.

[Cuddly McFluffles]

You didn't like to say "fuck you" because that would have been swearing!

Thank you, thank you, I'm here all week.

If you'd like to turn yourself into my computer, you may hear it as many times as you like.

[krieger]

i'm not bothered by swearing but i think it becomes a bad thing when taken to the point where swearwords lose their impact due to overuse. at that point you may as well leave them out for the sake of brevity since they're not communicating anything like what they were intended to anymore.

[Suz]

You can try, but I don't think you'd be very successful, since I haven't made any sweeping, demonstrably false generalisations about certain groups of people, which is the crux of the point I'm trying to make.

ok let's draw another parallel.

Let's say that instead of swearing, we're talking about unsafe sex.

So i view unsafe sex as a pretty uneducated, stupid, retarded thing to do. I would never do it myself, and while i have a somewhat laissez-faire attitude about people doing their own thing in that regard, i am embarrassed for them and feel sorry for them for engaging in unsafe sex.

Does this mean i am bigoted towards people who practice unsafe sex, then? According to you, it apparently does...

I dont have to approve of people doing things that go against my values. That would be me not being true to my values. Just because what i said makes you and some others here feel inferior, i'm sorry that you feel that way. I'm not going to start dirtying my language or "appreciating" what i see to be vulgar uneducated language just to conform to you. I am also not a bigot for it. If anything you are the bigot.

As for swear words being uneducated language... i'm sorry but it's a universally understood fact... do you see any swear words in textbooks, encyclopedias, professional communication? If you were to write a business letter to a colleague, boss, collaborator, you would be careful to not use expletives right? Why is that? I personally choose to be professional not only in my professional interactions but in my interpersonal interactions as well. It's my prerogative.

[ashlesha]

As for swear words being uneducated language... i'm sorry but it just is... do you see any swear words in textbooks, encyclopedias, professional communication? If you were to write a business letter to a colleague, boss, collaborator, you would be careful to not use expletives right? Why is that? I personally choose to be professional not only in my professional interactions but in my interpersonal interactions. It's my prerogative.

because it would have negative consequences because of societal standards.

societal standards do not determine right and wrong.



FFS

[Suz]

because it would have negative consequences because of societal standards.

societal standards do not determine right and wrong.



FFS

So you think it's fine to send along a string of cuss words to your boss or your clients? You see that as a respectful way of addressing people? The only thing that's holding you back is what you see to be society's shackle on your mouth?

[Suz]

the Ne from anndelise seemed to be working a little. we need to get an LII in here.

oh please... give it a rest already.

[Suz]

WA, I am embarrassed for you for how you've expressed yourself in this thread.

I'm sorry you feel that way.

I'm embarrassed for the majority here bullying me for my values and for my having an appreciation for decent language. You guys really care that much about your expletives???

[anndelise]

As for swear words being uneducated language... i'm sorry but it's a universally understood fact... do you see any swear words in textbooks, encyclopedias, professional communication? If you were to write a business letter to a colleague, boss, collaborator, you would be careful to not use expletives right? Why is that? I personally choose to be professional not only in my professional interactions but in my interpersonal interactions as well. It's my prerogative.

This example does not support your argument well.

Not seeing swear words in writings such as textbooks, encyclopedias, and professional communications has more to do with the intent of the communications rather than educational level. Swearing primarily serves the purpose of expressing emotions, intensity, and/or value judgments rather than passing along factual information. I would not read a textbook nor encyclopedia to access someone else's value judgments on a topic. I'd want factual information that I could use. Same with professional communications. However, if I ask a stock broker if I should buy a certain stock, and he responds with "oh hell no"...it tells me two things... That he doesn't value that stock...and the intensity level of his devaluation. Then he might pass on factual support for why he felt that way. The "hell no" would be his value statement. The factual info would be his professional communication statements.

[ashlesha]

So you think it's fine to send along a string of cuss words to your boss or your clients? You see that as a respectful way of addressing people? The only thing that's holding you back is what you see to be society's shackle on your mouth?

i don't see anything wrong with it based strictly on principle, no. am i cursing AT them? if i were to say, "the report was fucking huge" or something similar i don't see that as disrespectful whatsoever in my own mind. just a bad idea because of social rules.

[anndelise]

I'm sorry you feel that way.

why would you feel sorry that I felt that way?
What does my having said that have anything to do with your emotions/thoughts?
Did you perhaps feel judged by me when I said I was embarrassed for how you were expressing yourself?

I'm embarrassed for the majority here bullying me for my values and for my having an appreciation for decent language. You guys really care that much about your expletives???

Can you really not see that they are also just expressing their own values?
Do you really care that much about people NOT using expletives?
If you interpret their supporting their own values as bullying, then how might you EXTRAPOLATE that to how they might feel regarding your attempts to support your own values?

For that matter, how might you EXTRAPOLATE your interpretations of [my saying I was embarrassed for you for how you were expressing yourself]...to how your own expressions of [being embarrassed FOR someone else's expressions] might be interpreted?

[anndelise]

So you think it's fine to send along a string of cuss words to your boss or your clients? You see that as a respectful way of addressing people? The only thing that's holding you back is what you see to be society's shackle on your mouth?

Again, a bad support example.
In this case, what's at stake isn't someone thinking she is crude, uneducated, has poor vocabulary, etc.
In this case, it's her job at stake. If she wants to keep her income, then she has to conform to some extent of her boss' expectations regarding behavior and language.

(And secondly...one would wonder WHY she would feel so strongly in her communication to the boss/client that a string of cuss words would express for her.)

[Slacker]

I'm sorry you feel that way.

I'm embarrassed for the majority here bullying me for my values and for my having an appreciation for decent language. You guys really care that much about your expletives???

The only thing that bothers me is your false assumption that people who swear must have limited vocabularies. That just isn't true. There isn't any relationship between vocabulary in general and choice to swear or not. To say that is to say something that is false, and I question why people say things that obviously and plainly aren't true.

[Cuddly McFluffles]

I'm sorry you feel that way.

I'm embarrassed for the majority here bullying me for my values and for my having an appreciation for decent language. You guys really care that much about your expletives???

*pokes head in*

As Ann said earlier, the problem is not that you dislike swearing but that your arguments against it show that you are looking down upon those who do. This goes beyond simple like or dislike; you're making value judgments about other people based on whether or not they conform to your personal standard. In other words, you're coming across as self-righteous and judgmental, and it's pissing people off.

[Galen]

Ditto. I'm actually really surprised at your comment @Galen, especially since you were one of the people who was saying expletives aren't really a big deal. I agree they aren't a big deal, so why should i take them to be a reflection of a person's ENTIRE being? I do feel that using expletives does reflect oneself to an extent (a very limited one). It's just one little facet of a person, which does color an impression of them, but certainly shouldn't take over to represent the entire scope of a person, imo.

You can be an awesome great person and use expletives... in fact i know many great people and friends who do.

Who said that all actions reflect a person's "true self" equally?

ok let's draw another parallel.

Let's say that instead of swearing, we're talking about unsafe sex.

So i view unsafe sex as a pretty uneducated, stupid, retarded thing to do. I would never do it myself, and while i have a somewhat laissez-faire attitude about people doing their own thing in that regard, i am embarrassed for them and feel sorry for them for engaging in unsafe sex.

Does this mean i am bigoted towards people who practice unsafe sex, then? According to you, it apparently does...

This is an even more passive-aggressively bigoted stance. Even if you don't care, saying that feeling sorry for them projects the impression that you're still passing negative judgment upon them for doing the act.

I dont have to approve of people doing things that go against my values. That would be me not being true to my values. Just because what i said makes you and some others here feel inferior, i'm sorry that you feel that way. I'm not going to start dirtying my language or "appreciating" what i see to be vulgar uneducated language just to conform to you. I am also not a bigot for it. If anything you are the bigot.

Why do you value it in the first place? I find that people who talk about sticking to their morals/values/whatever are often at a loss for why.

As for swear words being uneducated language... i'm sorry but it's a universally understood fact... do you see any swear words in textbooks, encyclopedias, professional communication? If you were to write a business letter to a colleague, boss, collaborator, you would be careful to not use expletives right? Why is that? I personally choose to be professional not only in my professional interactions but in my interpersonal interactions as well. It's my prerogative.

Due to the nature of their usage and emotional/societal implications, swear words immediate introduce a sense of bias and opinion into a world that attempts to be as objective and cognitive as possible, and as such demean the hyper-scholastic professionalism of whatever it is the person is trying to say. You're confusing the result with the cause.

I'm embarrassed for the majority here bullying me for my values and for my having an appreciation for decent language. You guys really care that much about your expletives???

I think we're mostly worked up with you projecting your own personal ethical biases as negative character judgments upon others, and while you deny that this is even going on the language you're using and the ways you choose to express yourself say otherwise.

[Hays]

Workaholics after skimming through this thread I would somehow like to try and stand up for you here as you are reminding me a bit of my husband who can dig holes with his sometimes conservative like judgements, as you presently seem to be displaying here.

Just be aware that by saying things like you feel sorry for peoples behaviour can come across a bit manipulative, as others then may believe you to be engaging in guilt tripping or just being too traditional etc.

We of course are all different and have many reasons for our behaviours like swearing, sleeping with another before marriage. Mostly we are aware of any faults we hold or partake in to varying degrees and are capable of assessing ourselves for where our faults may lie without another being overly judgmental, highlighting their views on our lives or pressuring us - even if unintentional, with theirs ways, ideals, likes & dislikes. We often learn through time and experience so try and give others a bit of lee-way with their lives and maybe just stop and remember that you are sure not to have done everything perfectly yourself.
So perhaps save and adjust that feeling of sorry or pity for others for moments when they would like and need some true sympathy or empathy from you.

And no you don't deserve what seems to me to be bombardment by this many forum members for sharing your views. But how many times and in how many ways though, can you attempt to explain your views without someone else attacking and you in return maybe making that hole even deeper.

Hope I haven't offend you, just want to see you desert that hole before you get buried there by the mob!

Give Workaholics a break please people...

[Aquagraph]

South Park is a good example of this uneducated vulgarity that rots the foundation of our cultural inheritance. It disrespects the ethics of the civilized Western culture. It's a mockery of the proud democratic society we have here today.

And I need all of this, you neo-puritan fuck.

It's never what you use, it's how you use it.

If things like that piss you off, I will be sure to use them in your presence. And you will tell yourself that I'm immature.
And I'll burn your white picket fence along with your golden retriever.

j/k

I am really nice and respectful although I swear sometimes. I can be civilized too n shit.

[Eliza Thomason]

I don't get it. Why would someone consider swearing offensive? I do it all the time (really, uncontrollably) and.. I... I just don't get it. They're words. Words, people....

Because words have meaning? I appreciate you mean no harm, however, the fact is others feel harm, a pressure, an annoyance, a disturbance of their peace. To me its a priority not to burden people with stressors they don't need, since people can be carrying huge, huge unseen burdens at any moment, and why be the straw that breaks the back?

...
I don't tell others off for swearing, I more just accept that that is how they are and I look at the reasons why they seem to be swearing.

I do however dislike being around a vulgar tongue for too long and I also expect my kids to just know that they should not swear around of me however my son seems to be incapable of this most of the time.
...

Me too, all this. My son knows to never swear in front of me. Though he might (probably) swear among friends, by not swearing in front of me its excellent training for the real world - as not everyone will tolerate it. Work place particularly.

...
I do think an EII might refrain from expressing their anger/frustration, thus leading to less cursing than a type who has less inhibitions. But that doesn't mean that the thoughts/etc aren't there...

I am IEE and similar on this. The easy part of not swearing is I grew up around not swearing. It was not a part of my family life. So I don't judge others who grew up differently through no choice of their own, and when I cannot take a bit of credit for my early-established habit. Well, then I chose to stay not-swearing. My choice, and I endeavor to not judge others for their choice, however don't choose to spend a great deal of time around that which I have to do work to purposely ignore. Its tiresome.

Like you said anndelise, when I feel anger/frustration I inhibit myself from expressing it. That is a life-long habit, part from upbringing maybe but also I think it might be part type-driven. I find it fruitful to hold my negative impressions, rather then cause pain or say something stupid that i regret later and have to make amends for. I prefer alone-time, quiet to think the feelings thorugh and identify why I have them (not always clear to me at first), and understand what I am feeling before I express it.

[Crispy]

There are no bad words, just bad reasons for getting offended by them.

[UDP]

EII 6s generally don't care

9s and 1s care a lot.



that's the trend I've seen.

[Beautiful sky]

I say idiot a lot. I like it.

[UDP]

*looks at the last few pages of this thread*



woahhh (barry burton voice)

[Cuddly McFluffles]

Sometimes I do readily want to offend others. I don't think being Fi base means you'll always be rainbows and sunshine, it just means you pay attention to and understand what you could say to offend or not offend others. That's sort of an upper-hand in communication, I think, in some ways. Anyway, sometimes I say shit for the sole purpose of pissing people off and I might do it because I don't like them, or I think the things they say are dumb.

I most definitely agree with this. I may choose my words carefully to avoid hurting someone's feelings, or I may choose to go for vitriol or shock value. is not all about catering to others' sentiments; it's about perceiving those sentiments and deciding where to go from there.

I can also relate to censoring oneself but really preferring company where I can let loose. I finally sucked it up and made a separate Facebook list so I can post more adult-ish content and let loose a few swear words without my mother or my more religious friends having a conniption. Some people would call that faking; I call it avoiding unnecessary conflict. At my previous job, a friend and I would sit around and have relatively NSFW conversations on the highly-unpopulated night shift. (And there goes my statement about not swearing in front of others...) It's a slight tangent, but we were something of our own little community there, with our own "rules" that didn't necessarily match the company's; even the supervisors were pretty laidback. That'd be a post for another thread, though.

[Eye of the Potato]

I once playfully called a half-palestinian ESI friend sand****** just because I knew she'd find it incomprehensibly horrible and I wanted to see the look on her face. She's such an emo, always talking about the non-existent racism she has to deal with and how some old lady from her house always looks at her in a bad way "clearly because she's different", even though she looks just as Finnish as everyone else here and no one would ever guess she has roots somewhere else if she just kept quiet about it. I found it amusing that she didn't talk to me for two weeks..

I find that quite hilarious.