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Thread: Is western civilization about to collapse?

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    OK #1, the right does not have the right to stop progress. If we achieve it in the legislature, that's the end of the road. The court cannot just strike down something its members disagree with. It must represent overreach by one branch of government against the other. In both cases now before the supreme court, the administration is correct: ACA does not exceed the power of the congress. It's a tax. No one's being forced to buy anything, you're just faced with paying a tax if you choose not to. It's just creating a new class of tax payers, one which is contingent on the individual's will.

    Regarding immigration, I looked over Article IV very carefully, and compared it with Article II. Only Congress can raise militia (police) and armies. States are given the ability to administrate the police. They may raise not troops -- meaning no police and no armies -- of their own. The structure of the police forces is dictated, that's why it is uniform. The police may behave only as the congress dictates: there is a U.S. code entry governing everything they do. The rights of the states are actually strikingly limited, which is to be expected because the constitution was a reconsideration of the articles of confederation, which gave enormous independence to the states.

    What is ICE? I'm not sure. It's either an army contingent, which are under direct control of the president, or police operating through Virginia/Maryland. (both Maryland and Virginia must share control of their police forces with the congress, because the capital is on their lands). Either way, the federal government has exclusive control over it, and has not given the police the powers to check immigration status. So it doesn't matter what those justices say: Arizona can do nothing but instruct its police to follow the federal law.

    Quote Originally Posted by somavision

    It is naive to see any deviation from an idealised state of continuing and linear social progression as apocalyptic.
    Actually THAT is naive. There is real danger of a general uprising when people feel 1) that the people in power are not listening, and 2) that there is a power above them which seems out of reach.

    The SCOTUS majority is one such power.

    The endurance of the conservative majority on the court, coupled with the idiotic voting patterns of Americans (things are going good with the Democrat... let's choose a Republican to keep it going! And oh look: TAX CUTS!! DDD) suggests that the chances of obtaining a new liberal majority on the court are slim.

    Liberals are sensitive to the use of pressure to shape emotions -- they're the smart guys after all -- and will not long abide it.

    The right tends to respect authority. The left respects it only when it serves its ends.
    Last edited by tcaudilllg; 04-26-2012 at 11:54 PM.

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