View Poll Results: Do you think subtype changes over a person's lifetime?

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  • Yes. And it can do so many times.

    2 11.11%
  • Yes. But rarely.

    5 27.78%
  • No. Subtype-- like sociotype-- is set in stone.

    10 55.56%
  • Undecided.

    1 5.56%
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Thread: Type doesn't change, but Subtype can

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  1. #1
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    Default Type doesn't change, but Subtype can

    Agree? Disagree? Somewhat? Discuss. And please vote

    When I was a youth, I think I fell more into the D/N (Rational) subtypes; as an adult, I've become more C/H (Irrational). Probably had to do with my ubringing.

    The environment I grew up in...My parents were both Gamma Rationals, emphasizing the Fi and Te in my psyche. I didn't have a whole lot of freedom to "explore" as a kid, to just wander around and be carefree. Well, I did all that still, but within limits, and I always had responsibilities, which I was expected to do on certain days at certain times.

    Now as an adult, I am free to run my life the way I want it. Chores are never regulated, and can always be put off or rearranged to fit my mood. My house is mine. I can make a mess working on a particular project, and leave it out without fear of someone yelling at me to clean it up (though I do have to be careful about what I leave out around my toddler).

    Even my clothing has changed. I used to have a much more subtle and modest wardrobe; I wore mostly prints that looked like my mom picked them out (oh wait, she did, kind of). When I started expressing my own style more, I found myself choosing brighter, more noticeable attire. Though, I still like to keep it practical.

    After much deliberation, I think I am finally convinced that I am C-subtype. But I never would have thought of myself as such ten years ago.
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    hmm.. maybe you were c subtype all along but because of your parents you repressed it a bit?

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    No, if we bother to define subtypes at all they are permanent. Other wise they wouldn't "exist".
    Socionics strictly deals with aspects of the personality that stay constant throughout life.
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    I believe that both type and subtype can change, although the former is more stable than the latter. After all, personality is far too fluid and malleable a concept to submit itself to strict confines. If you are put in an environment that rewards and encourages the use of a particular function, you will become more adept at using that function and will consequently regard it as more valuable. Most tests of psychological variation over time reveal that the younger an individual is, the more volatile his personality; as he ages, however, he becomes more set in his ways. However (if I remember correctly), since correlations of people's personalities over time rarely exceed 0.85, change is possible at all ages. Insofar as subtypes are concerned, this represents merely a small shift and can easily occur; insofar as types are concerned, this represents a more fundamental change, and it is not easy to effect.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Begoner View Post
    I believe that both type and subtype can change, although the former is more stable than the latter. After all, personality is far too fluid and malleable a concept to submit itself to strict confines. If you are put in an environment that rewards and encourages the use of a particular function, you will become more adept at using that function and will consequently regard it as more valuable. Most tests of psychological variation over time reveal that the younger an individual is, the more volatile his personality; as he ages, however, he becomes more set in his ways. However (if I remember correctly), since correlations of people's personalities over time rarely exceed 0.85, change is possible at all ages. Insofar as subtypes are concerned, this represents merely a small shift and can easily occur; insofar as types are concerned, this represents a more fundamental change, and it is not easy to effect.
    Uh think about this a little harder...

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    Quote Originally Posted by tcaudilllg View Post
    Uh think about this a little harder...
    After giving the matter some more thought, I have concluded that the Gospel of Apostle Augustinavičiūtė is completely correct. You have saved me from my errant ways of employing common sense and heeding empirical evidence, and I repent for these egregious sins. Hallelujah, praise Jung!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Begoner View Post
    Most tests of psychological variation over time reveal that the younger an individual is, the more volatile his personality; as he ages, however, he becomes more set in his ways.
    Perhaps. But I've also observed that younger people are often easier to type, having not yet had time to develop and "strengthen" their weaker valued functions. As people age, they actually become harder to type, IMO, not easier.

    The one exception being, perhaps, the teenage years. We're all so confused and confusing at that age. I have a hard time typing any of my high school friends for just this reason.
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    Quote Originally Posted by pianosinger View Post
    Perhaps. But I've also observed that younger people are often easier to type, having not yet had time to develop and "strengthen" their weaker valued functions. As people age, they actually become harder to type, IMO, not easier.

    The one exception being, perhaps, the teenage years. We're all so confused and confusing at that age. I have a hard time typing any of my high school friends for just this reason.
    Well, the two statements are not necessarily contradictory. I do think you're right in that older people tend to "mellow out", eschewing the extremes of personality and converging towards the average. However, this process need not be linear: the average 40-year-old might be 20% more mellow than the average 30-year-old while the average 50-year-old might only be 10% more mellow than the average 40-year-old. In other words, because there is more variability among younger people, there is more scope for change as they age; but once they get older, they begin to seem more alike, and the scope for change begins to diminish. The reason that younger people are easier to type is because many of them lie closer to the extremes, but that doesn't mean that they aren't capable of changing their attitudes substantially.

    Of course, this is just one theory that can explain how your observation can accord with the empirical evidence I cited. It isn't necessarily true, but it at least shows that the two can be simultaneously accurate.

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    The subconscious has a different subtype than the dominant... very possibly, each of the four archetypes (self, shadow, anima, and synnex) has a different subtype.

    A little bit of deliberation... it's not too difficult to figure out where they stand.

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