kristiina's type

[Joy]

vote

[Kristiina]

I agreed with at least 4/5 of the female ENTj description in Gamma. And that was even before I translated it. (I didn't just agree with my translation). It lists both my strengths and weaknesses. There are a couple of strengths I don't have, but it's all in the interpretation of the A-model.

I can't be ISFj, because I have weaknesses they don't have and I don't have the weaknesses they usually have. I agree with some of it, but it's mainly the gamma similarities.

I have considered ESTj and it seems to be the closest aside from ENTj. The Si is troublesome, so I can't really agree with the type. And I when I take into account my relationship with Erkki, it makes even less sense.

ESFp...no. Not really. I have read many descriptions and a few were pretty good, but it didn't have my flaws and didn't have my strengths. Not even the mindset.

ISTj was what I thought my type was... for about 2 weeks. But I'm too enthusiastic and compared to them a free spirit.

[Expat]

I thought that ENTj female description could actually apply to most XXTx women. It mostly has to do with lack of confidence in .

Honestly I get a Beta rather than Gamma impression from you, Kristiina. Taking into account your identification with that ENTj description, that would suggest ESTp or ISTj. Taking into account your perception of something like a PoLR, perhaps an extreme sensory subtype ISTj where would be a mostly off 8th function might make sense. That would also explain the impression of ISFj you make on many people. But then the relationship with Erkki indeed makes little sense if he's INTp.

Just some thoughts - -

[Kristiina]

I thought that ENTj female description could actually apply to most XXTx women. It mostly has to do with lack of confidence in .

Honestly I get a Beta rather than Gamma impression from you, Kristiina. Taking into account your identification with that ENTj description, that would suggest ESTp or ISTj. Taking into account your perception of something like a PoLR, perhaps an extreme sensory subtype ISTj where would be a mostly off 8th function might make sense. That would also explain the impression of ISFj you make on many people. But then the relationship with Erkki indeed makes little sense if he's INTp.

Just some thoughts - -

How about seeming beta, because I've spent my whole life with an ENFj. (she's rational, not INFp and Si-polr seems more logical than Te-polr). According to dichotomies, I'm beta NF. But if anything, I'm xxTx. And I might have Se, but it doesn't make me a Se-type. And I can't really agree with the Ne-polr. And my relationship with Erkki has to make sense (and he can't stand ISTjs) and my lack of comfort with ISTp and ISFp... There are so many things... And only ENTj makes sense. And ENTj makes perfect sense, if you consider that there is more than one version of .

Ok, consider this: I'm , but I have to have a real-life example for every theory, otherwise I won't care and won't believe. Is it still , if I only trust it when it has proof in the real world.

Taking into account your identification with that ENTj description, that would suggest ESTp or ISTj.

...I'm just guessing here, but couldn't it also mean that I could be ENTj? :wink:

[Joy]

Ok, consider this: I'm , but I have to have a real-life example for every theory, otherwise I won't care and won't believe. Is it still , if I only trust it when it has proof in the real world.

wow... that was a great description of an ISFj role, hidden agenda, AND dual seeking function, all in one very well put sentnece.

[Kristiina]

Ok, consider this: I'm , but I have to have a real-life example for every theory, otherwise I won't care and won't believe. Is it still , if I only trust it when it has proof in the real world.

wow... that was a great description of an ISFj role, hidden agenda, AND dual seeking function, all in one very well put sentnece.

Yeah, you're so right. You're a master at typing people. You just look at a sentence and see all of the hidden meaning. Wow!


PS! Isn't this a great example of -creative:

I have absolutely no sense of time at all. This is my least favorite thing about myself. In fact, if I could instantly change anything about myself, but only one thing, I would make myself an excellent time manager. I would always be on time to appointments, I would make good use of my time, I would not take 20 years to complete a 20 minute task, I would ave projects done with plenty of time to spare, and I would never miss a bill payment with the money sitting in my account!

oldforumlinkviewtopic.php?t=1024
:wink:

[Joy]

The only ENTj description I have ever seen that says that ENTjs are good at being on time is the one that YOU translated. You're taking the description of as the function of time way too literally. It's not the function of hours, minutes, and seconds, it's the function of the past and future. Good job trying to sound like you know what you're talking about though. *pats kristiina on the head*

[Joy]

nm... I'm sorry. I guess I'd feel that way too if someone started a thread in which more than 50% of the votes were for a type that I absolutely did NOT want to be

I worried that starting this thread would be mean because I knew how it would go... and that it's not how you like to think of yourself... but a few other people told me it wasn't mean, so I did it.

[Kristiina]

nm... I'm sorry. I guess I'd feel that way too if someone started a thread in which more than 50% of the votes were for a type that I absolutely did NOT want to be

I worried that starting this thread would be mean because I knew how it would go... and that it's not how you like to think of yourself... but a few other people told me it wasn't mean, so I did it.

I don't mind. I was curious what the votes would be and I knew this would happen, so I didn't make the thread myself. But it's fun.

People can vote for ISFj if they want. It doesn't make me ISFj. And it's not convincing, because I'm more likely to show emotions than feel them (Fe>Fi).

[Creepy-Diana]

.

[Joy]

People can vote for ISFj if they want. It doesn't make me ISFj.

lol that sounds just like something I'd say

[Kristiina]

Huh? So you fake emotions? Why?

Because I am not that good at really feeling them. When I see a friend, I don't get a feeling that it's a friend who I really like and I want to talk with and have a friendly conversation with.... I just get the though "yay! it's her" and I get an automatic smile. My reaction has more depth than my feelings.

When I get very angry, my head is empty and I shiver and It's all about reaction.

When I'm happy, I say "Yay!" a lot and have a large grin. I can't really verbalize my emotions. I can jump up and down and do things, but there isn't much going throught my head.

I think this is Fe>Fi.

[Kristiina]

People can vote for ISFj if they want. It doesn't make me ISFj.

lol that sounds just like something I'd say

I've tried all reactions to the ISFj thing. That's the one I'm having nowadays. Still not working.

[Joy]

yeah, I don't blame you. that's exactly what I would say in that situation, too. that's actually sorta my stance anytime someone accuses me of something. they can say whatever they want to say. why should that upset me?

[Kristiina]

I have considered that, because me and Erkki are pretty similar. But not that similar. We have the j vs p relationship, and I'm too talkative to be the same type.

How much do you think I have? Because you have it and you should be better at recongnizing it compared to ENTjs who just have a vague idea what it is. (to ENTjs reading this: no offence)

[FDG]

I voted ISFj.

[implied]

i could see ISTj or ISFj.

[Kristiina]

If anyone tells me I'm any type besides ENTj, please provide me the full explanation of how I could be that type.

Consider:
-harmony with INTp
-Lack of tact
-being bitchy about lack of comfort
-similarities with ENFj sister (Fe part is the difference)
-big goals
-narcissism (not sure if it's type-related)
-practical nature
-money-oriented
- ...

If you can't explain all of it (or at least how it's not type-related), don't bother me with pointless gossip about what type I "feel like" and don't tell me about being some other type because of some little thing I said. Those little things usually mean nothing and are later contradicted by someone else to prove to me that I'm some other type.

Stop the annoying doubting and believe the theory with the least contradictions. Because I'm so sick of it, I'm thinking of finding another hobby.
Provide the full explanation or just shut up!

[Joy]

lol

[implied]

Consider:
-harmony with INTp
-Lack of tact
-being bitchy about lack of comfort
-similarities with ENFj sister (Fe part is the difference)
-big goals
-narcissism (not sure if it's type-related)
-practical nature
-money-oriented

ISXj!

[FDG]

Because I'm so sick of it, I'm thinking of finding another hobby.
Provide the full explanation or just shut up!

Lol, is this some kind of stupid ultimatum? Please

[Expat]

Consider:
-harmony with INTp
-Lack of tact
-being bitchy about lack of comfort
-similarities with ENFj sister (Fe part is the difference)
-big goals
-narcissism (not sure if it's type-related)
-practical nature
-money-oriented
- ...

The problem is that I can't take for granted that you have typed Erkki and your sister correctly. I'm not saying this just because it's you - - that is always the problem when typing through relationships. If someone says, "I can't be INTp, I get along too well with ESFjs" my first thought is, "well, are those really ESFjs"?

In the case of your sister -- let us assume that she's ENFj. Fine. In that case, I'd say that this is at least as good evidence that you are ESTp or ISTj as ENTj. ENFjs aren't "ENTjs with " - - except perhaps at a very superficial impression. They are Beta, and different from ENTjs at a very deep level.

If you can't explain all of it (or at least how it's not type-related), don't bother me with pointless gossip about what type I "feel like" and don't tell me about being some other type because of some little thing I said. Those little things usually mean nothing and are later contradicted by someone else to prove to me that I'm some other type.

Stop the annoying doubting and believe the theory with the least contradictions. Because I'm so sick of it, I'm thinking of finding another hobby.
Provide the full explanation or just shut up!

You see, this whole paragraph is just a lot of bullshit attempting to achieve only one thing -- neutralizing counter-arguments through intimidation or manipulation. There is no real logic, just intimidation (or attempts at it). If you think that's , you're mistaken.

It is not about "some little thing" you said -- it's about how you come across constantly.

For the sake of argument, it is possible (though unlikely IMO) that, personally, IRL, you are very clearly ENTj and that just doesn't come across online. But we can only analyze what we see and perceive.

ENTj is not the "theory" with the "least contradictions" -- it has as many problems as ESTp, ISTj or ISFj.

[Kristiina]

Because I'm so sick of it, I'm thinking of finding another hobby.
Provide the full explanation or just shut up!

Lol, is this some kind of stupid ultimatum? Please

Actually yes. I'm really.... I mean REALLY sick of this. I feel like I'm fake. I don't like it, but I can't agree with any of the other types proposed. I'm so stuck here in one phase. I'm not getting anywhere. How long have I been stuck in this phase? I have no idea. I think it has been months already.

[Kristiina]

Consider:
-harmony with INTp
-Lack of tact
-being bitchy about lack of comfort
-similarities with ENFj sister (Fe part is the difference)
-big goals
-narcissism (not sure if it's type-related)
-practical nature
-money-oriented

ISXj!

That's a helluva good explanation! You're so and so smart. :wink:

[Kristiina]

The problem is that I can't take for granted that you have typed Erkki and your sister correctly. I'm not saying this just because it's you - - that is always the problem when typing through relationships. If someone says, "I can't be INTp, I get along too well with ESFjs" my first thought is, "well, are those really ESFjs"?

In the case of your sister -- let us assume that she's ENFj. Fine. In that case, I'd say that this is at least as good evidence that you are ESTp or ISTj as ENTj. ENFjs aren't "ENTjs with " - - except perhaps at a very superficial impression. They are Beta, and different from ENTjs at a very deep level.

Yes, and I've spent my entire life with my ENFj sister. We have gotten to the point where we don't bother to finish sentences anymore. We think very differently (we derive different opinions from the same facts), but when I compare functions and ask her stuff, she's very similar.

And I've provided some info about Erkki because people were saying that Erkki's type might be something else. People agreed with how I had typed him (proposed that he might be ENTj, and later agreed with INTp). If you want to re-type me, you can type Erkki too, but you better make it good!

If you can't explain all of it (or at least how it's not type-related), don't bother me with pointless gossip about what type I "feel like" and don't tell me about being some other type because of some little thing I said. Those little things usually mean nothing and are later contradicted by someone else to prove to me that I'm some other type.

Stop the annoying doubting and believe the theory with the least contradictions. Because I'm so sick of it, I'm thinking of finding another hobby.
Provide the full explanation or just shut up!

You see, this whole paragraph is just a lot of bullshit attempting to achieve only one thing -- neutralizing counter-arguments through intimidation or manipulation. There is no real logic, just intimidation (or attempts at it). If you think that's , you're mistaken.

It is not about "some little thing" you said -- it's about how you come across constantly.

For the sake of argument, it is possible (though unlikely IMO) that, personally, IRL, you are very clearly ENTj and that just doesn't come across online. But we can only analyze what we see and perceive.

ENTj is not the "theory" with the "least contradictions" -- it has as many problems as ESTp, ISTj or ISFj.

I don't care if it's or not. Not one approach has worked. People have have some twisted superiority complex which tells them that they know more about me than I do.

ISTj and any other type has twice as many contradictions as ENTj, so shut up. You would never in a million years type me ISTj if you saw both of us (me and an ISTj) in the same environment. I know 3 of them, two are girls and they are very different from me.

And I don't care how I come across. I have some twisted version of which gives the wrong impression. You can't trust this.

You can ask questions, but they'd better be decent ones, not some hearsay details how some type tends to do something in a certain way. They'd better be based on socionics, not this bullshit half-theory "socionics" people use in this forum! Where has socionics gone...

[Expat]

Yes, and I've spent my entire life with my ENFj sister. We have gotten to the point where we don't bother to finish sentences anymore. We think very differently (we derive different opinions from the same facts), but when I compare functions and ask her stuff, she's very similar.

And as I said, that yould be an indication that you're Beta, since ENTjs and ENFjs are similar only very superficially. You seem to think you were counter-arguing my point but you just confirmed it.

And I've provided some info about Erkki because people were saying that Erkki's type might be something else. People agreed with how I had typed him (proposed that he might be ENTj, and later agreed with INTp). If you want to re-type me, you can type Erkki too, but you better make it good!

*shrugs* I don't remember exactly but he did seem an INTp from the information you provided at the tim, in my recollection. In that case, ESTp and ISFj would also do fine in terms of relationships; ISTj not really, I agree.

I don't care if it's or not. Not one approach has worked. People have have some twisted superiority complex which tells them that they know more about me than I do.

Well, you should care if it's since understanding the functions - and your use of them - would be a step towards correct typing.

Personally I do not think I know more about you than you do; I do think I know more about the types than you do. I don't see that as "superiority complex", it's my opinion based on the evidence I see. *shrugs* is it possible that I'm wrong? Of course it is.

ISTj and any other type has twice as many contradictions as ENTj, so shut up. You would never in a million years type me ISTj if you saw both of us (me and an ISTj) in the same environment. I know 3 of them, two are girls and they are very different from me.

Not twice as many, I'd say about the same - - as for the rest of your argument, it's possible but it's not evidence available to me.

For instance, who else has ever used "shut up" as an argument?

[Kristiina]

For instance, who else has ever used "shut up" as an argument?

Any person of any type who wanted to say "fuck you", but was too polite. It's not meant as an argument. Not in the very least.

Well, you should care if it's since understanding the functions - and your use of them - would be a step towards correct typing.

That's why I wanna leave this place. I already feel like I'm constantly trying to prove I'm not this ethical friendly girl-next-door. Because I'm not. And I can't agree with people telling me that I'm a disturbed version of ISFj, because I don't think one bit like is said in any ISFj description. And to be honest, I certainly don't get a dual vibe from ENTjs. I don't have the "please use your , it turns me on"-feeling. To be honest, I'm somewhat annoyed by ENTjs never taking anything for granted. It's always necessary to argue and to prove wrong. I can say that I'm usually laid-back and not bossy, but anything I say will be distorted by others to prove something else. And to be honest, people just quote it and say "ISFj!", which I see as the ultimate stupidity, because it's just bashing with no proof.

And as I said, that yould be an indication that you're Beta, since ENTjs and ENFjs are similar only very superficially. You seem to think you were counter-arguing my point but you just confirmed it.

Tell me one type in beta who I could be with no controversies. Me spending my life (and room) with a beta would definitely change how I see the world. It won't make me beta, but it will make me similar to them. You can't just say stuff without considering everything about it. If you think I'm beta, prove it (completely explain it).

I do get too detail-oriented sometimes, trying to achieve the perfect result, but maybe it's just me trying to have some ISFj-ish influence in my life. I don't give a fuck why I use my but I know I don't use it all the time. My ESTj father has more than I do.

[Mariano Rajoy]

just delete the word probably from your quote. i have no problem with your Teness, and i see no reason to get another hobby. it would be nice to have your input on other issues/questions instead of always having this defend your type thread, which this has turned into.

[Creepy-Diana]

.

[Kristiina]

Diana, many things you find annoying about me can be summed up in one thing - lack of communication skills and tact. (in me, not you). I'm not an expert, but since I've always had that problem and it's a pretty big problem which I find somewhat bothering, I can't agree that I'm some type that does not have that issue. This is why I excluded ISFj after 10 min of thinking about it. Later I tried to see it as a possibility again, but there are so many things that just make no sense.

Excluding a type does not mean that I have Ne-polr. What would be your first reaction if I told you that you are ESTj? What would be the second reaction after you've thought about it for a while? What if even the relationships don't seem to make sense this way? How long would it take for you to agree with it? Better yet - would you ever agree knowing your own attitude, history, mindset, behavior, relations?

I'm just bothered that so few see ENTj as a possibility, but still feel free to tell me I'm xxxx.

[Joy]

kristiina,

1) there is no blood test for a person's type, no piss test, and no ph test. there is absolutely no way to PROVE anyone's type.

2) I gotta honestly tell you... Comments such as "That's a helluva good explanation! You're so and so smart. :wink:" do NOT help your case!!!

3) please answer this... would you think less of yourself if you ended up seeing that you're ISFj or some other type other than ENTj?

4) this is exactly what I didn't want this thread to turn into...

[felafel]

My reaction has more depth than my feelings.
When I get very angry, my head is empty and I shiver and It's all about reaction.

.

do other entjs identify with what kristiina says about reacting while angry? i'm trying to type this person (at what's my type, under VI-ville a strange adventure) and he has, perhaps, a similar way of getting angry. ie. i think he shivers (i don't touch to check, of course not. it seems like it becomes a physical thing almost....

also, a question about sense of humor in entjs. how would you describe it? dry, slightly dark and subtle, but also to some extend literal?

[Joy]

ISFjs have a "literal" sense of humor. they like to says sarcastic things with a straight face.

[1981slater]

fgfggf

[Kristiina]

3) please answer this... would you think less of yourself if you ended up seeing that you're ISFj or some other type other than ENTj?

I'll definitely think less about socionics! :wink:

[Creepy-Diana]

.

[Ms. Kensington]

diana-- nooooooooooooooo

kri-- lol still dont know why you say you have no se. in any case i think you're narrowing down the types.... yay!

also youre sure your bf is INTp and nothing else? (INFp to your ISTj, perhaps?)

[Kristiina]

diana-- nooooooooooooooo

kri-- lol still dont know why you say you have no se. in any case i think you're narrowing down the types.... yay!

also youre sure your bf is INTp and nothing else? (INFp to your ISTj, perhaps?)

I haven't really even seriously considered INFp. You can see why, if you read about him here: http://oldforumlinkviewtopic.php?t=3...er=asc&start=0 (scroll down until you see his pic and brief description)

Narrowing down types is easy. The problematic part is choosing when to stop. :wink:

[implied]

funny, miss k. i was debating whether or not i should suggest "what if erkki is indeed INFp"?

thank you for doing that for me!

[Joy]

kristiina, you actually look A LOT like my cousin who is ENFx. She's more accepting of people though.