my second video

[Trevor]

That's like me saying "ILEs in my experience can sometimes be over the top nauseating with Si. ESEs less so because they can control it better".

[Nico1e]

That's like me saying "ILEs in my experience can sometimes be over the top nauseating with Si. ESEs less so because they can control it better".

Or, like saying, the LII's supervisor, the SLE, can be over-the-top nauseating with Ni, and their activator, the EIE, less so, because they can control it better.

Just to be fair, I haven't seen LIIs doing a lot of Fe, but I don't spend much time with any LIIs.

[Suz]

all right all right guys

Point taken.

And I cant deny the fact that i need more experience.


The LII I have in mind was a female one i had to work closely with. I suspect she had a hidden motive though and that maybe have been why the nauseating Fe. Also, the rest of us are non-Fe valuing so maybe she was just very desperate for any shows of Fe from anybody. The weird thing though was that she scheduled her day so as to come in to work around 3-4pm and work until midnight. My other coworker later told me that it's because the LII likes to work in solitude. My hours were like 10am-7pm or so, and apparently it really irritated the LII that i was still hanging around at those hours (which came to my attention much later, when the LII was spreading false rumors about me cause i guess she couldn't get her work done since i was around and she was being fake nice to me the whole time). I also get the feeling she pokes around in everyone's stuff when everybody's gone. I'm sure not all LIIs are like this, so please nobody take this personally.

[Pa3s]

'Si/Ne' is more specific than 'T.' You actually know exactly which kind of S and N you prefer.

Therefore, Si/Ne is your base function. It is the most strongly recognized, the most visible, the most sure.

I agree that Si/Ne-valuing is most apparant to me. And your reasoning that one of those two IEs must be my leading function seem to be right. But it's not only important what I've wrote, but also how I came to this conclusion. For example, I'm sure that I'm Si-valuing, because I feel a strong dislike towards Se (which could easily hint to LII). I'm unsure about my relation to Fe. I like and admire Ne, that's why I prefer it to Ni. This could mean it's my dual-seeking function, hinting indeed to SLI or SEI. Or it means this is one of my strong, used functions like my creative function. (I actually perceive my Ne as rather strong, that's why I also doubted SLI as my type. I've read the dual-seeking function is valued, but one of the weakest.)

You are an introvert.

Yes.

If you really are a T, then you are a SLI.

Actually, I'm quite sure about that IxTx part, the Si/Ne notice was mainly to exclude ILI and LSI which seem rather unlikely.

An SEI is Te-PoLR. They say that a Te-PoLR person is not comfortable getting into logical arguments or trying to prove things. I suspect that this is the reason why some SEIs hesitate to choose what type they are. They don't want to make mistakes and have to argue about it later on.

I don't hesitate to prove others wrong by logical arguments. The problem is that it's very hard to prove anything if you're arguing about Socionics.

You also said that you didn't like math and science. Some people are going, 'Yeah, I know lots of LIIs who hate math and science.' I'm a little skeptical about that, but whatever.

Math was only fun if it made sense to me. Unfortunately, that wasn't always the case. Other than that, I'm interested in some scientific fields, mostly those which are popular anyway. If I'm interested, I do some research. I often remember those facts and many people regard as smartass.

I've seen some people who I think are LIIs, and someone who actually tested as an INTJ in the MBTI. He speaks with short, monotone, one-word sentences, like 'Yes.' 'No.'

I can be like that, it depends on my mood. However, it was a monologue in my video and of course, I wanted to say something. That's why this is hard to compare.

There are some things you said and did in the video that suggest you might possibly have Fe as your creative function, but I will get into that a little bit later.

I'd be interested to hear that because I think this is pretty unlikely.

I make tons of mistakes, and this entire thing could be completely wrong. It's my theory for now. I'll finish the rest of it later.

That's okay. Even if I don't agree with you, I'm curious to hear how you came to that theory.

[FDG]

Ewww noooo ISFp is a crazy typing c'mon guys don't make FDG weep.

[Absurd]

[Nico1e]

Actually, I need to come back to this in a couple of weeks when I'm no longer smoking crack. And no, I'm not literally smoking crack, but this theory is one of those crazy ideas in my head that ends up totally destroying all credibility that I will ever have at guessing people's types. Hopefully the crazy idea will just go away. It's very annoying when this happens to me.

[Reuben]

@n1cole

Hey, n1cole, Alphas generally enjoy people giving us differing opinions and substantiating it. I am as interested as MD to hear your body language analysis! Also, I'm very certain he wouldn't mind at all

Seriously, don't be swayed by what others say. We want to hear your reasoning.

That being said, I am very certain he is LII. Your reasoning for SEI will help us
1) Understand you better
2) Understand and learn from your approach to typing people
3) Correct your misunderstandings in socionics
4) Garner valuable pointers when we attempt to type as well
5) Set a precedent for open and fearless dialogue that is a) well-substantiated b) objective c) well-meaning

Thanks!

[Pa3s]

@Nico1e: As I said, take as much time as you want.

@Reuben: Good summary, I concur.

Sorry this isn't much help. I actually found the subtitles kinda distracting coz i had to concetrate on them and kept missing your gestures...

Thanks! No problem if you're not sure. I wanted to speak in my mother tongue in this one to make it more natural. Just try to ignore the subs if they distract you. I thought it might be better than nothing.

[Jonah Durham]

Nice Video-Blog Dude!!!

[pianosinger]

You're an ENFp.

I'm only half-joking.

[Pa3s]

You're an ENFp.

I'm only half-joking.

Which part of it is the half-joke? The EN or the Fp?

[pianosinger]

You're an ENFp.

I'm only half-joking.

Which part of it is the half-joke? The EN or the Fp?

Haha. Hadn't broken it down that far... I guess I just doubted anyone else would take me seriously, so I'm trying not to to take myself too seriously, either.

But, you seem quite comfortable/natural with the Fe expression, which makes me think you're a Feeling type. But a serious type, explaining why you think you're a Thinker.

Also, something you said near the end of your video...about how you're happy with your chosen career path, "for now." As if you're still partially open to other possibilities in the future, just not ready to totally commit to one life path. Seems more Ne-Base to me.

And you don't strike me as Ti-Ego, contrary to semi-popular opinion. But Ti-Creative is more likely than Ti-Base. Maybe ENTp is worth considering.

[Pa3s]

But, you seem quite comfortable/natural with the Fe expression, which makes me think you're a Feeling type. But a serious type, explaining why you think you're a Thinker.

I wouldn't say I'm especially "natural" with Fe, but if that's your impression it's okay.

Also, something you said near the end of your video...about how you're happy with your chosen career path, "for now." As if you're still partially open to other possibilities in the future, just not ready to totally commit to one life path. Seems more Ne-Base to me.

Well, I know that my opinion changes pretty often and even if I'll most likely stick with my choice, it's possible that the plans might change if something unforeseen happens. Also, I chose this career in a rather spontaneous manner, which is normally not how I make a decision.

And you don't strike me as Ti-Ego, contrary to semi-popular opinion. But Ti-Creative is more likely than Ti-Base. Maybe ENTp is worth considering.

Maybe I haven't fully grasped what Ti is all about, but in the matter of 'creating systems and abstractions from internal, subjective insights' I could see a how I might value it. Other than that, I'm pretty sure all extroverted types can be excluded. (But of course, you can still type my ENTp or any other type if you like.)

[Absurd]

Hey, n1cole, Alphas generally enjoy people giving us differing opinions and substantiating it.

They sure do...

[Beautiful sky]

ILI; do you really need me to list the reasons why?

First, your Fe-PoLR really gets in the way of you doing/looking/saying anything in the least bit excited looking; your calm and even tone of speaking suggests more serious than merry type, and may even suggest Si Role. You're speaking about doing things, work, drive to Objective dynamic relations of job...Te.

[Pa3s]

Seems like the video can be interpreted very differently in some aspects:

First, your Fe-PoLR really gets in the way of you doing/looking/saying anything in the least bit excited looking;

vs.

You seem open and receptive to Fe.

---

your calm and even tone of speaking suggests more serious than merry type, and may even suggest Si Role.

vs.

You seem Ti: calm but with some occasional smiling. The way you smile is natural: serious (Te/Fi) people have forced smiles.

---

@Maritsa: I fully accept your guess and your opinion. But you lost a part of your credibility when you said that you'd never change your mind about one's type once you made a decision (If I remember correctly, but I'm pretty sure you said this). Don't take this personally, but I think people should be open to change their opinion in such a subjective field like socionics. However, if the current discussion gives you no reason to change your mind it's okay as well.

[Reuben]

The solution is to only accept seriously the opinions that are backed by a holistic analysis of you as an individual, with this video as one example to confirm a trend, or at least someone who considers multiple elements in the video instead of merely your body language, or what you talk about, or your hairstyle etc.

Furthermore, it is very important to examine the kind of values you hold. Being open to change in stance if it is in fact truer than what ones stance was is very LII (searching for truth while open to change Ti+Ne).

@Absurd

I'm glad you concur

[Absurd]

@Absurd

I'm glad you concur

Well, expect nothing and you'll never be disappointed.

[Jarno]

I'm interested in your type suggestion if you have one.

wow, I have to apologize, I am for the LII party now...

I could see it clearly now by your facial/mouth movements, typical LII, that I've seen before.

So you're not ILI. It seems I cannot type that well from posts after all

[Pa3s]

wow, I have to apologize, I am for the LII party now...

No problem. If you have a justified reason to change your mind it's better to put it right here instead of keep quiet because you don't want people question your credibility.

[Jarno]

wow, I have to apologize, I am for the LII party now...

No problem. If you have a justified reason to change your mind it's better to put it right here instead of keep quiet because you don't want people question your credibility.

exactly. see you think alike me, it's confusing. but I'm very confident in LII now so won't be seeing any changes from me. The vid was very helpful.

[Reuben]

@Jarno

I don't usually question people's self-typing too much, but do you think you may be alpha NT after all Jarno? You identified with me, and now MD, and we're both alpha NT.

I'm also aware of some people in gamma who don't believe you belong to that quadra due to various reasons, but I'm sure they have some reason to say so. Would you like to reconsider your type in another thread?

[Jarno]

Would you like to reconsider your type in another thread?

nah, my intertype relationships are that of an ILI-Te.

I've lived with my conflictor for 4 years, even the curse words used between conflictors were correctly identified by socionics relationship descriptions (russian) . I think I've dated the whole socion, and all relationships seem to pretty accurately work out as expected. I can't be anything else than ILI.

The gamma's that think I'm not gamma, are just jealous because I'm much cooler than them.

I probably just shouldn't be so quickly too judge posts. I'm making to many mistakes with that stuff.

[Beautiful sky]

Seems like the video can be interpreted very differently in some aspects:

First, your Fe-PoLR really gets in the way of you doing/looking/saying anything in the least bit excited looking;

vs.



---



vs.

You seem Ti: calm but with some occasional smiling. The way you smile is natural: serious (Te/Fi) people have forced smiles.

---

@Maritsa: I fully accept your guess and your opinion. But you lost a part of your credibility when you said that you'd never change your mind about one's type once you made a decision (If I remember correctly, but I'm pretty sure you said this). Don't take this personally, but I think people should be open to change their opinion in such a subjective field like socionics. However, if the current discussion gives you no reason to change your mind it's okay as well.

You have Ti demonstrative and it's as useful in distinction as your Fe. However, in the way that you present the choices in not choosing the other schools from which you were reject is in the form of a criticism of these schools and the way in which they conducted their programs. This is why they call ILI "the Critic."

They, like you in your video, use Ni to give the expected development of your option/event. I presume you have a pretty good understanding of how things will turn out by the choices that you make; you could argue here that this is using Ni role or Ni demo, but if you were LII, you wouldn't care about the FACTS behind your choice, because they ignore Te, they are much more concerned about theory and development of these. You seem more "realistic" in your expectations resulting from your choices from what you finally end up choosing; your descriptions and your entire video is in the form of presenting your choice as a process, because you start off stating your topic, make your points, walk thought the decisions you're thinking of and make a conclusion; in opposition of this, a RESULT type, would say "I chose to become a doctor." That's it, that's their result.

Your lack of seeing the general picture of what I'm describing to you in the above and nit picking other people's posts to support an argument that you may have already decided for yourself, may be an ignoring of Ne.
http://www.wikisocion.org/en/index.php?title=Process

as an ignoring (7th) function (IEI and ILI)

The individual understands "external" connections made between different areas of knowledge and experience, but prefers to focus instead on "hidden" connections that have a special significance and help understand the mysterious, hidden nature of things. He is able to readily grasp the intrinsic potential of a given thing or situation, but prefers to restrict indulging such assessments in the face of understanding the latent processes underpinning said things. -Wiki

I believe that because of this last sentence this is why you're still "guessing" your type and probably why I'm an opposite because I do stick to my decisions(?).

[Nico1e]

Okay, I'm going to work on this again. This time I will suggest ESI.

If you were an LII, then you would have simply accepted LII as your type, after so many different people have told you that's what you are. There must be a reason why you still haven't accepted that one. You're being quite nice and tolerant about it, too, while so many people are insisting that's what you are. But still, you cannot say yes to that type.

The LIEs seem to be fond of you. ESI would make sense. However, what I don't like about suggesting you are an ESI is the fact that I have to ignore every single thing that you said about your own type so far (you've said you're a thinking type that values Si/Ne). I don't like to just dismiss all of that.

But I know about this from personal experience - I know that I used to test as an INTP, INTJ, INFP, ISFP, and ISTP, when I took the Myers-Briggs test. That's all four quadras! It's possible to think you might be a particular type for a long time, and totally change it later on.

Video:

"Drawing and designing was always fun, but I've never seen myself as an artist, mostly because the word 'artist' has a very negative connotation for me. I'd say, everyone can call themselves 'artist' basically but that's not the way it works for me. For me personally, art is necessarily linked with outstanding skill, and so many people who call themselves artists today can't actually exist, and that's why I'm pretty critical if people use this term." (2:43 sort of tight lipped smirk, contempt, disdain?)

You and I have this in common. A high respect for 'Skill' is associated with sensing. I've seen that written more often in the Keirsey and Myers-Briggs descriptions, more than I've seen it in socionics descriptions, but I believe it is true.

This might also be a disvaluing of unrestrained Fe. There are artists who like to throw splashes of paint randomly onto a canvas, and they say that it's 'Art' because they were 'expressing themselves,' but there is no skill in it. If that's the kind of art that you dislike, I would agree with you, I feel the same way about that. And if you were an ESI, it would be true that you don't respect art where people just express their feelings and call themselves artists, without any skill.

"While my teachers were very down-to-earth and gave me tasks which were reasonable... the tasks from the other schools appeared to be odd - the direct connection to reality was missing - one of the tasks was about walking through the forest and trying to find things, 'products from everyday life' as they said."

You didn't like tasks that were disconnected from reality. That is also associated with sensing.

This is the part where I wasn't sure if you would want me to post it, because I am pointing out how you show your hurt feelings on your face while you are telling this story.

"However, I chose the alternative and rebuilt an existing product as a model. It wasn't very different in the other school, we had to build objects from different materials, like rubber bands, cardboard and wires for example, but those weren't actually products but rather objects without any purpose. (mild scowl in eyebrows, doubtful, troubled, disapproving - again, this is a disapproval of impractical or useless things that are not connected to reality - sensing). I did it regardless of that, but later it seemed as both test results weren't good enough. (grin - slight laugh) since both schools rejected my application which surprised me a bit, because most of my works before were received well (a sound of crying or tears or trembling voice, hurt voice; looks off to the right side, frowning mouth). I wasn't shocked, but surprised nevertheless (brief scowl) (6:48). I could live with that result, I just thought I'll try again next year."

I noticed that you express your feelings naturally without strain, but you are not expressing them in a loud and obvious way. I could clearly understand how hurt you felt whenever they rejected your application, and how this was different from the other people who had liked your work in the past. This could possibly be Fi, introverted feeling. It's true that everyone will be expressing feelings on their faces while they are telling a story, but it seemed like you were reliving and re-enacting the feelings again, and that's something that not everyone does. I tend to make friends with people who express their feelings this way, in real life.

That doesn't necessarily prove that you are a Fi type. It is only a hint or suggestion that you might be.

There's a reason why I'm considering an SF type. I think that SF types have more difficulty deciding what types they are and arguing for it, especially introverts.

I have always seen you being 'nice' in the forum. Again, this is only a vague impression, but it is part of the reason why I am suggesting an SF type for you.

How do you feel about gamma and ESI? Is there anything about that type that seems totally impossible or unlikely for you? I realize that the descriptions might not sound good for that type, but I have known many ESIs in real life, and I like them and I think that a lot of the type descriptions don't do them justice - possibly the people who write the descriptions are a type who doesn't like ESIs. I found that it helps to read descriptions written by a variety of other people. The ISFJ is the same thing, and I know a lot of web pages with descriptions of them. Do your intertype relations with Gamma NTs work out well? As I said, the LIEs seem to like you, and the ILIs would too (that is, if they were actually ILIs!)

[Absurd]

As I said, the LIEs seem to like you, and the ILIs would too (that is, if they were actually ILIs!)

Hehe, they sure do. Anyhow, who are those mistyped ILIs Nicole ?

[Pa3s]

If you were an LII, then you would have simply accepted LII as your type, after so many different people have told you that's what you are. There must be a reason why you still haven't accepted that one. You're being quite nice and tolerant about it, too, while so many people are insisting that's what you are. But still, you cannot say yes to that type.

Oh, that's simply because I was pretty "sure" before that I was a certain type. I often made the experince that once I put the "label" on (writing my new self-typing below my avatar), I have doubts again and consider other possibilities. I don't want to give others the impression that I change my mind all the time, that's why I have now agreed with myself that I won't change my displayed type before a certain amount of time passes. It's also because I don't want to mislead others who think of me as the type I call myself, you know?

I'll answer the rest of your post later, when I've got more time to think about it.

[Nico1e]

As I said, the LIEs seem to like you, and the ILIs would too (that is, if they were actually ILIs!)

Hehe, they sure do. Anyhow, who are those mistyped ILIs Nicole ?

Well, a couple examples.

Myself. I would have been called an INTP in the past. So, assume MD actually is an ESI, and assume that I am actually a SLI. I'd be having a benefactor relation instead of an activator relation, and that's not a big deal, it would just be sort of confusing.

EyeSeeCold: I just recently read that someone else (TheHotelAmbush?) thinks that he is an LII instead of an ILI. I would have to look more closely at all of his posts to get my own opinion about it. I also haven't seen if he has a video anywhere.

I agree that Korpsey is probably an ILI. I've seen a video by him and I've read his posts, and once in a while, I get that feeling of confusion and disorientation that I sometimes get when somebody is using strong Ni, and I lose track of the train of thought, and I can't figure out how they jumped from point A to point B, or how some idea is connected to what we were saying. That does happen to me sometimes when I read Korpsey, so I get the impression that his ILI type is probably correct. It is difficult for me to follow people whenever they are using Ni strongly.

That also has happened once or twice with EyeSeeCold. He made a comment and I went 'Huh? Where did that come from?' So he might be using Ni too. I'd have to do more reading.

I thought I saw somewhere that Jarno was typed as an ILI by somebody, but I don't know where this was written. Jarno is on my list of suspected 'hidden SFs,' possibly ESI?

I can't recall other examples offhand. We don't seem to have a huge number of ILIs here, but then again, there aren't a lot of people at this forum in total. There might be people on the spreadsheet who are typed as ILIs, but they don't have the letters written under their name, so I didn't notice them yet.

[Jarno]

Jarno is on my list of suspected 'hidden SFs,' possibly ESI?

I've heard so many different types for me.

I've never changed my type since I found out about it 7 years ago. My relationships seem to work perfectly for ILI-Te. I guess it's hard to type someone over a forum, if you would meet me eye to eye, you would see me daydreaming about 90% of the time, something you don't notice here. Here I seem active and awake :-)

[Absurd]

Jarno is on my list of suspected 'hidden SFs,' possibly ESI?

That Jarno, he hid himself very well. I think you're going to have to flush him out.

There might be people on the spreadsheet who are typed as ILIs, but they don't have the letters written under their name, so I didn't notice them yet.

When you don't know if you're going to make it to the same place you started from before just take an observational point, highest building, tree, etc. In this case a member you know aligns with people's typings, and go from there.

Anyway, treating the spreadsheet as a reliable body of consensus is going to be tricky.

[Nico1e]

Jarno is on my list of suspected 'hidden SFs,' possibly ESI?

I've heard so many different types for me.

I've never changed my type since I found out about it 7 years ago. My relationships seem to work perfectly for ILI-Te. I guess it's hard to type someone over a forum, if you would meet me eye to eye, you would see me daydreaming about 90% of the time, something you don't notice here. Here I seem active and awake :-)

Yeah, this is 'Needs More Information.' I actually don't see you posting tons and tons of stuff, so I would have to go look at things you've written in the past, and if you say that the intertype relations are working as expected, I'll take your word for it. If you feel like your type is correct and you don't have any doubts about it, then I'll just accept it as it is.

[Nico1e]

Jarno is on my list of suspected 'hidden SFs,' possibly ESI?

That Jarno, he hid himself very well. I think you're going to have to flush him out.

There might be people on the spreadsheet who are typed as ILIs, but they don't have the letters written under their name, so I didn't notice them yet.

When you don't know if you're going to make it to the same place you started from before just take an observational point, highest building, tree, etc. In this case a member you know aligns with people's typings, and go from there. That sounds almost like or something

Anyway, treating the spreadsheet as a reliable body of consensus is going to be tricky.

Yes, and I just noticed that Jarno actually has the letters ILI written as his signature, so that's where I saw it. It could be one of those theories that fades away when the effects of the crack smoking wear off.

[Absurd]

That sounds almost like Ni or something,

I don't think so. Finding myself for first time in unfamiliar territory, like a city not known to me before, having no map, not knowing anything, that is, not being prepared, for I just have to get somewhere, and there is little or no time to prepare yourself, I usually treat large objects, like highest buildings or something else, as a compass pointing me the direction. Simply speaking, guiding me.

[Pa3s]

The LIEs seem to be fond of you. ESI would make sense. However, what I don't like about suggesting you are an ESI is the fact that I have to ignore every single thing that you said about your own type so far (you've said you're a thinking type that values Si/Ne). I don't like to just dismiss all of that.

Well, you dismiss almost all of it, besides the introversion. I also like some of the LIEs here, FDG, Ashton... I haven't interacted much with Azeroffs, but I think he's okay as well. But I don't know if that can used as an indicator simply because of the lack of data/examples. A little turnoff of this typing would definitely be the creative Se because I don't know where this should come from in my personality.

But I know about this from personal experience - I know that I used to test as an INTP, INTJ, INFP, ISFP, and ISTP, when I took the Myers-Briggs test. That's all four quadras! It's possible to think you might be a particular type for a long time, and totally change it later on.

FYI: When I first typed myself at all (in a MBTI-based typology) it was INTJ. In socionics at first ILI for a longer time, and then changing between LII, ILI and SLI. I haven't seriously considered anything outside of those types as far as I can remember.

You and I have this in common. A high respect for 'Skill' is associated with sensing. I've seen that written more often in the Keirsey and Myers-Briggs descriptions, more than I've seen it in socionics descriptions, but I believe it is true.

Yes, this sounds reasonable.

This might also be a disvaluing of unrestrained Fe. There are artists who like to throw splashes of paint randomly onto a canvas, and they say that it's 'Art' because they were 'expressing themselves,' but there is no skill in it. If that's the kind of art that you dislike, I would agree with you, I feel the same way about that.

At least I try to be as open minded as I can when it comes to art, but it still depends on my own perception. (There is even a seperated thread in which I talk about how I see it.) Art doesn't always have to depict real-life objects. I can appreciate paintings which are very surreal or made of colour splashes for example if I can identify an idea, a "scene" (atmosphere) or maybe a feeling behind it. I admit it's a little complicated. But when you see the famous constructivist painting "Black Square" by Kazimir Malevich (just google it) I just can't see it as art because it's nothing more than a black square on a white canvas. There can't be a deeper meaning in it, imho, so it's nothing special.

You didn't like tasks that were disconnected from reality. That is also associated with sensing.

It can be interpreted as that, yes. Others might see Te-valuing in this statement.

I noticed that you express your feelings naturally without strain, but you are not expressing them in a loud and obvious way. I could clearly understand how hurt you felt whenever they rejected your application, and how this was different from the other people who had liked your work in the past. This could possibly be Fi, introverted feeling. It's true that everyone will be expressing feelings on their faces while they are telling a story, but it seemed like you were reliving and re-enacting the feelings again, and that's something that not everyone does. I tend to make friends with people who express their feelings this way, in real life.

Hmm, maybe you are exceptionally attentive to those details, but several people have told me before that they never know what I'm actually thinking or feeling because they can't 'read' me. I'm not sure if I was emotionally hurt by the rejections. What really made me sick was the seemingly arbitrary way they threated the applicants. Well, there were many people who applied there, and they had very few places. They wanted to judge on our creativity by a 5-minute talk with the professors and those silly tasks. I found this was a very pointless procedure.

I have always seen you being 'nice' in the forum. Again, this is only a vague impression, but it is part of the reason why I am suggesting an SF type for you.

Well, I think every type can be nice. But yeah, I get what you mean.

How do you feel about gamma and ESI? Is there anything about that type that seems totally impossible or unlikely for you? I realize that the descriptions might not sound good for that type, but I have known many ESIs in real life, and I like them and I think that a lot of the type descriptions don't do them justice - possibly the people who write the descriptions are a type who doesn't like ESIs. I found that it helps to read descriptions written by a variety of other people. The ISFJ is the same thing, and I know a lot of web pages with descriptions of them. Do your intertype relations with Gamma NTs work out well? As I said, the LIEs seem to like you, and the ILIs would too (that is, if they were actually ILIs!)

Okay, as I said above, Se creative doesn't sound right somehow. When I think of ESI, I have mainly one prime example (in my opinion) of this type in mind: one of my former teachers. She did her best to teach us well, but the "fun" was really her weak point. Whenever the class became a little silly she almost immediately brought it back on track and made us listen again. There was no ill will intended, she just always kept an eye on the discipline. Altogether she was well-meaning and a good teacher after all. But to me, the atmosphere of the lessons was often a little too "tense" for my taste. Like you always have to watch what you do because it's school and you have to learn stuff, you know? I typed my mom ESI before, but later I recognized that this was unlikely and SEI matches way better her relaxed nature. Also, I we tend to get along really well and have an uncomplicated relation. Regarding Fi-leading, I'm not sure if my emotional life is of that great importance for me (this was also one of my arguments against EII). I actually don't know many people in real life, and there are not many Gammas among them as far as I know. And in the forum, I'm not entirely sure but I think I get along well with most Gammas. On a related note, Galen (who is IEE) said in this thread before that INTj seems unlikely because he doesn't feel supervised by me. However, he and Ashton (and others, see spreadsheet) type me SLI. But this would automatically mean I'd supervise Ashton and I think neither him nor I think this is the right intertype relation, either. You see, those relations are not always making sense. I know there are people who have mostly good experiences with them, but I take them with a grain of salt (without dismissing them of course).

[Jarno]

ESI vs LII:

Their biggest difference is club.

ESI is a social supporter.
LII is a researcher and deep thinker.

How much fucking more different do you want to have it. Please give me an example how you can make this even more different.

ahum, oke sorry frustration.

So, megadoomfuckingnuketheworld tell us, are you social supportive or a deep thinker.

[Pa3s]

So, megadoomfuckingnuketheworld tell us, are you social supportive or a deep thinker.

Well, of those two, I'd say I'm the deep thinker. Also because I'm kind of a hermit and exist apart from most societal influences.

[EyeSeeCold]

EyeSeeCold: I just recently read that someone else (TheHotelAmbush?) thinks that he is an LII instead of an ILI. I would have to look more closely at all of his posts to get my own opinion about it. I also haven't seen if he has a video anywhere.

Nope, no vid.

[Reuben]

@MD

I'm pretty sure by now that you're pretty sure by now. I'd like to know when's your ETA of release

@N1cole

You have very interesting perspectives, but as a form of feedback, I believe you can improve your typing by taking a more holistic view of the person. Attack every typing you support as harshly as possible.

E.g. ESI? He hardly demonstrates Se, his facial expressions are so soft, they are clearly Si/Ne. His Fi is very 'role' in a sense that he seems very polite, very proper in a sense, so much so that you cannot imagine him backbiting someone or reprimanding someone very harshly over an ethical issue. Hardly Fi-Lead paired with Se creative. LIE's go well with him? LIE's go well with anybody who talks reason with practical applications > subjective emotional imaginary bull. Reading his posts throughout this forum confirms that he is definitely of a thinker type. He is so open to suggestions, willing to change his mind (although it's already made up), and able to deflect arguments well without being personally insulted. ESIs will never be able to handle something like that without going off track or feeling personally attacked (feeling as if someone told them their thinking is weak or something). You notice that he keeps everything almost impersonal, but still gives off a very friendly, positive air. Clearly Fe>Fi; not allowing people to infringe on personal space past a certain point while valuing positive emotional relations. Almost everyone interacts with him on that level. Fi's on the other hand allow some people to get VERY close to them while keeping everyone else far away at different, but chosen, lengths. That's the diff between Fi role and ego; one can work according to each scenario, while another is based on general rules. You will generally see an Fi being EXPLICITLY closer to some people in the same thread than others, while almost everyone interacts with MD at a similar interpersonal distance regardless of familiarity.

^ This is what I'll do if I'm trying to type someone; (assuming setting up the argument/proposal is already done,) first attacking the argument before coming to a conclusion. I'm not trying to be harsh to you at all, but that's my tone when it comes to my own arguments If you practice ruthlessness on your own, chances are you produce sounder results.

However, I encourage your inquisitive attitude and your courage to speak out against popular opinion. This will serve you (and the community well) once your ability to type soundly is further developed.

[Pa3s]

Thanks for the praise, Reuben.

@MD
I'm pretty sure by now that you're pretty sure by now. I'd like to know when's your ETA of release

Honestly, I do lean towards INTj right now (also due to the large number of supporters of this typing). But as I said before in this thread, I'll let some time pass until I change from 'undecided' to a definite type. No matter how sure I am now, this could be a phase which may change again. If I'm still certain about this in say, two or three month, I'll accept it as a (hopefully) final decision.