kate winslet has always seemed hot to me , but i tend to take her for a delta nf . same with winona, i thought fi dominant.
kate winslet has always seemed hot to me , but i tend to take her for a delta nf . same with winona, i thought fi dominant.
^^ that happens to be my last movie. Never considered sle for Hanna as a character, i was going for LSI. But why not a fi polr , after all...classic LSI figure in a related situation would probably be Gerd Wiesler in The Lives of Others.
I actually think Michael's value interrogation after he finds out Hanna had been involved with the SS is more indicative of Fi than of Fe. A Fe type would be more likely to show solidarity with a person without questioning their acts or to be vindictive cause of resentment (Hanna had left him without warning). The whole problematic of coming to terms with the Nazi past, whether that should be understood or condemned and of individual or collective guilt sounds kind of Fi to me. Even when he doesn't know if he should tell the court about her secret illiteracy or not, he tries to find an answer through a debate on ethics, freedom and dignity with his father (prolly LII lol). Just as an example : "..my awkwardness was not the result of real feeling, but of thinking about the way one is supposed to feel after visiting a concentration camp". I've tried not to jump headfirst in the trap of thinking that a dude who ends up into legal history must be a thinking typeOriginally Posted by Ankh
.
SLE. wonder about her enneagram type, she doesn't seem like the typical EP-7 mix
updated: enneagram 9w1 so/sp
they are very differentreminds me a bit of Madonna in ways
Last edited by silke; 07-11-2018 at 08:27 PM.
SLE-Se ...she´s too chaotic for E 8 and E 3. I´d go with E7.
well, Madonna really has her shit together and is much more talented.
Lol Courtney Love is a fine example of my worst drunken drugged up moment ever...but ALL THE TIME
Now this is a story all about how, my type got changed, turned upside down. Just wait for a minute and watch chatbox right there, & I'll tell how Gem became the moderator with blue hair.
In typology central friended and praised, on the picture thread was where she spent most her days. Chilling out, selfies, relaxing all cool, And all typing some people and getting them schooled.
When a couple of girls who were up to no good, Started annoying her & her friends in the forumhood, She got in one little flame war & got pissed off & said 'I'm moving in with that exboyfriend in the forum with the socionics toffs.
So Gem pulls up to the forum for a year without being a hater, And yells to typocentral 'Yo creeps! Smell Ya later', Became a mod in her kingdom she was finally there, To sit on her throne as the mod with blue hair.
InvisibruJim
Yeah I could buy LSE for Madonna.
Now this is a story all about how, my type got changed, turned upside down. Just wait for a minute and watch chatbox right there, & I'll tell how Gem became the moderator with blue hair.
In typology central friended and praised, on the picture thread was where she spent most her days. Chilling out, selfies, relaxing all cool, And all typing some people and getting them schooled.
When a couple of girls who were up to no good, Started annoying her & her friends in the forumhood, She got in one little flame war & got pissed off & said 'I'm moving in with that exboyfriend in the forum with the socionics toffs.
So Gem pulls up to the forum for a year without being a hater, And yells to typocentral 'Yo creeps! Smell Ya later', Became a mod in her kingdom she was finally there, To sit on her throne as the mod with blue hair.
InvisibruJim
Madonna is clearly SLE. As for Courtney, I think she's an LSE-like SLE.
I thought she was LSE for long, because of the style of clothes she wears ("rock" rather than "hot" + attention to details in the outfit, like nails, lipstick and coloured shoes, being more colourful and "retro" than Betas (particularly SLEs) normally are), and because she can be so extremely direct (even rude) to people, in a way SLEs normally don't dare (Fe HA + Fi PoLR means most XLEs will not dare to say the things LSEs dare say). I now think she's SLE because of her dating history. From VI I still find her more LSE-looking (think Gillian Anderson, Mick Jagger) than SLE looking (most similar SLE would be Kate Winslet, maybe?)
I think they´re both SLEs, but Madonna is simply smarter as a woman (and not only) and she has better tools for success with her music and her voice. She´s been extremely creative and "shape-shifting", able to adapt to trends and so on. Courtney Love has never produced one single song as good as Madonna´s.
closest match to Courtney that I can think of would be Karla Homolka, who is rare enneagram variant for a SLE - 9w1 soc
Karla
Courtney
I see her as sle-se and enneagram 8w7 sx/so...
Me too, I'm just undecided between 8w7 and 7w8.
I hope Courtney is drunk or otherwise not sober in this vid?
her eyes look like a couple rocks to me...doesn't seem to be any tonal difference between them and the rest of her.
not even a slight friction jamming her antennae...no cracks of vulnerability coming through or getting in.
she's just there...instinctively moving around (gut > head)....
All I know is that 1) "Violet" is some kind of awesome hidden symbology skullfuckery; some days I even like her better than Kurt, I need to hear more of her albums 2) Courtney' statement "I have Catholic damage, too." makes me think she is hilarious and awesome and I totally want to chill with her 3) Madonna seems like a total stick in the ass and everything I have heard of her music sounds like the rest of the synth-soaked, unedgy garbage of my mother's generation.
So yeah maybe they aren't the same type.
Ti-SLE. energy is too open and scattered for me to think 7w8 doesn't work... not quite compressed enough for 8. and sx/so. Madonna is likely 3w4 sx/so, a bit more composed and controlled.
4w3-5w6-8w7
“ . . . Somebody kill me / Kill me [Tylenol] / No one cares, my friends . . . Watch me break and watch me burn / No one can hear me, my friends . . . Suck me under: maybe forever, my friends . . . ”
“He hit me, and it felt like a kiss / He hit me, but it didn't hurt me / He couldn't stand to hear me say that I had been with someone new / and when I told him I had been untrue.... / He hit me, and it felt like a kiss / He hit me, and I knew he loved me / ‘Cause if he didn't care for me, I could have never made him mad. / And he hit me, and I was glad / Baby, won't you stay? / Baby, won’t you stay? / Baby, won’t you stay? . . . // He hit me, and it felt like a kiss / He hit me, and I knew I loved him / ‘Cause when he took me in his arms with all the tenderness there is / He hit me, and he made me feel / Baby, won't you stay? / Baby, won’t you stay? / Baby, won’t you stay? . . .”
“ . . . I'm not that stupid; I just need a lot of help to understand how stupid you really are. / Down at the bottom of the ocean, I lay down / Nobody's coming / Just continue to drown / And no one here could ever stop my ruin . . . And I know I've got not to fear / He'll get me out / Oh, God, just get me out of here / Are you astounding us, surrounding us? / And asphyxiate all your pain away / Don't try to win: it will only end in disgrace . . . You don't understand how damaged we really are / You don't understand how evil we really are / And I will dig my own grave, yeah / I'm misbegotten / I am the last one you save here / Of course I'll sleep forever and forever / Anesthetize all your horrors away / We live inside this black web that you have spun / Greed and your bile is miles away / Don't tell me I have lost when clearly I've won / I want to see you stretched out on the floor / The world's broken doll, the world's shattered whore / And you, you can't walk / But you, can you crawl? / Come on, infect us all / Asphyxiate all your pain away / Don't try to win; it will only end in disgrace / Translucent as the cold light of day / It's glorious / It's terrible / God, I need it / It's beautiful / It's ravenous / I'll just feed it / Coil down to your dark black decay / And I will dig my own grave, yeah / I'm misbegotten / I am the last one you save here / It's all gone rotten”
http://guestofaguest.com/new-york/ev....kvqlwz7Y.dpuf
Courtney Love, “AND THIS IS WAR”
“Movie stars need to be alive. Artists need to be dead,” said Courtney Love, in one of her opening remarks at the Guggenheim’s “Last Word” conference. And I was struck by how, well, intelligent the observation was. The last time I had seen Ms. Love perform was with her band Hole at Washington D.C. 9:30 Club in 2010, where after a string of disasters, including tirades against critics and audience members, she removed her shirt and performed an encore topless.
That train wreck bore absolutely no resemblance to this poised, clothed (if slightly short-skirted) woman, who with glasses, podium, and prepared notes seemed more likely to lecture on Roland Barthes than flash her breasts. Her chosen epitaph, the appropriately antonymous and angrily cap-locked “AND THIS IS WAR,” directly challenged the tawdry image of herself splashed across the pages of public opinion.
Her revelations ranged in wisdom, but each added depth to a character society would insist was flat. Much of it addressed her formative years: “I had a trust fund…just a small one,” she said, winking at the audience, while alluding to the numerous boarding schools she had been expelled from. Class, or class perception, seemed to have mattered a great deal in her family. Her mother once slapped her for saying, “Yabba, dabba, doo!” an expression she considered too “middle-class” for her daughter to speak aloud.
As a child, Ms. Love yearned for fame: “I thought, all I want to do is feel famous…[I thought:] Fame will protect me from bad people.” She perceived celebrity at the time as a protective "white light" that would guide her through her troubles. Introspective and reflective, she discussed the shattering of this youthful misconception, and addressed both the highs and lows of her life in the spotlight.
Not short-skirting her way around her infamy, Ms. Love revealed that she once googled her name with the word “drunk,” and was surprised by the number of hits (around 2.5 million). “I’ve only been drunk 8 or 9 times in my life,” she swore, citing the drugs as the primary cause of her past erratic behavior. And how many hits came up when she googled "Courtney Love" and "sexy"? "Only one," she said, sadly.
In a tie-in with Mr. Cattalen, Ms. Love discussed her new occupation as a visual artist. She's been drawing sketches and marketing them to potential art buyers, one of whom raised a particular drawing's value because she may have drawn it "on the toilet," she laughed.
She also revealed that billionaire men tend to flock to her in order to share their own problems and addictions. One in particular, an unnamed prominent art dealer, discussed his conflicted emotions about wishing artist friends like David LaChapelle dead, so that their collections would increase in value. The secret troubled Ms. Love, who after discussing the problem with her psychiatrist, concluded that for successful businessmen, enough can never be enough. Be it the accumulation of art or its creation, businessmen or artists, "When we quit, we're dead," Ms. Love sagely concluded. It was nearly 2:00 a.m. before she strutted off the stage, svelte and sober, a woman clearly not ready to call it quits.
http://guestofaguest.com/new-york/ev....kvqlwz7Y.dpuf
Courtney Love, “AND THIS IS WAR”
“Movie stars need to be alive. Artists need to be dead,” said Courtney Love, in one of her opening remarks at the Guggenheim’s “Last Word” conference. And I was struck by how, well, intelligent the observation was. The last time I had seen Ms. Love perform was with her band Hole at Washington D.C. 9:30 Club in 2010, where after a string of disasters, including tirades against critics and audience members, she removed her shirt and performed an encore topless.
That train wreck bore absolutely no resemblance to this poised, clothed (if slightly short-skirted) woman, who with glasses, podium, and prepared notes seemed more likely to lecture on Roland Barthes than flash her breasts. Her chosen epitaph, the appropriately antonymous and angrily cap-locked “AND THIS IS WAR,” directly challenged the tawdry image of herself splashed across the pages of public opinion.
Her revelations ranged in wisdom, but each added depth to a character society would insist was flat. Much of it addressed her formative years: “I had a trust fund…just a small one,” she said, winking at the audience, while alluding to the numerous boarding schools she had been expelled from. Class, or class perception, seemed to have mattered a great deal in her family. Her mother once slapped her for saying, “Yabba, dabba, doo!” an expression she considered too “middle-class” for her daughter to speak aloud.
As a child, Ms. Love yearned for fame: “I thought, all I want to do is feel famous…[I thought:] Fame will protect me from bad people.” She perceived celebrity at the time as a protective "white light" that would guide her through her troubles. Introspective and reflective, she discussed the shattering of this youthful misconception, and addressed both the highs and lows of her life in the spotlight.
Not short-skirting her way around her infamy, Ms. Love revealed that she once googled her name with the word “drunk,” and was surprised by the number of hits (around 2.5 million). “I’ve only been drunk 8 or 9 times in my life,” she swore, citing the drugs as the primary cause of her past erratic behavior. And how many hits came up when she googled "Courtney Love" and "sexy"? "Only one," she said, sadly.
In a tie-in with Mr. Cattalen, Ms. Love discussed her new occupation as a visual artist. She's been drawing sketches and marketing them to potential art buyers, one of whom raised a particular drawing's value because she may have drawn it "on the toilet," she laughed.
She also revealed that billionaire men tend to flock to her in order to share their own problems and addictions. One in particular, an unnamed prominent art dealer, discussed his conflicted emotions about wishing artist friends like David LaChapelle dead, so that their collections would increase in value. The secret troubled Ms. Love, who after discussing the problem with her psychiatrist, concluded that for successful businessmen, enough can never be enough. Be it the accumulation of art or its creation, businessmen or artists, "When we quit, we're dead," Ms. Love sagely concluded. It was nearly 2:00 a.m. before she strutted off the stage, svelte and sober, a woman clearly not ready to call it quits.
Last edited by HERO; 07-14-2015 at 06:21 PM.
My guess would be Se-ego leaning towards SLE
Courtney Love: Se-ESTp (Creative subtype) [ESTp-ENFp]
Last edited by HERO; 07-10-2020 at 04:25 AM.
Easy ESTp.
Where's her Fi?
You can't compare Madonna and Courtney Love. Madonna is a pop singer who produces music for the masses. Courtney is a punk-rocker with wild image of a rock star. For people who like pop, there won't ever be anyone better than Madonna, but for people who don't listen to pop music and prefer rock, Courtney's the real deal. The way she plays her fearless, badass songs is worthy of a rock'n'roll queen.
What would you expect her to demonstrate in terms of logic to convince you she is SLE?
I find only the heavysubtype of SLE appears logical in the sense of making logically thorough arguments for the sake of it, the
subtypes and slight
In the case of Love, herpolr is obvious from her rash behavior. Or maybe that's at least partly due to the drugs, idk. In any case she doesn't have to invent a new math theorem to prove to me she's a
Love has also advocated for LGBT rights throughout her career: In 1997, she used her award speech at the MTV Fashion Awards to advocate for acceptance of the LGBT community. [...] Love has also supported the Sophie Lancaster Foundation[352] as well as LGBT youth charities, specifically with the Los Angeles Gay and Lesbian Center, where she has taken part in several of the center's "An Evening with Women" events.[353] The proceeds of the event help provide food and shelter for homeless youth; services for seniors; legal assistance; domestic violence services; health and mental health services, and cultural arts programs. Love participated with Linda Perry for the event in 2012, and performed alongside Aimee Mann and comedian Wanda Sykes. Speaking on her collaboration on the event, Love said: "Seven thousand kids in Los Angeles a year go out on the street, and forty percent of those kids are gay, lesbian, or transgendered. They come out to their parents, and become homeless... for whatever reason, I don't really know why, but gay men have a lot of foundations—I've played many of them—but the lesbian side of it doesn't have as much money and/or donors, so we're excited that this has grown to cover women and women's affairs."Feminism and LGBT rights are clearly a personal matter for her to the point she feels the need to enforce it in the social sphere, which is rather Gamma SF > Beta ST, or more broadly F > T. STs do not really care for such matters, or at least they wouldn't try to establish them in the social sphere, their strengths lie elsewhere. The only Beta that might do that is EIE, though they rarely focus on minority groups like LGBT, which is more of an Fi thing (personal values over the masses), and rather on bigger groups, like MLK Jr did with the black movement.“I am a feminist and I’ve always thought of myself as a feminist. What I don’t like about feminism and the far left in general is the in-fighting, the way that the far left in-fights too much to get anything done and I feel like in feminism it’s like, ‘well, she’s not really feminist enough’ and there can be this kind of less-than thing in feminism."
Anyhow, it is difficult to "prove" introverted IEs in that way. It is much easier to look at other clues, like club related ones. Again, she fits SF much better than ST. She lacks ST pragmatism. Her focus is on social matters and fashion (besides music; and I could argue that the music sphere is full of Ethicals especially Gamma SFs but that is for another day). There's nothing that indicates preoccupations that indicate stronger logic or an ST streak. The Se subtype certainly brings her closer to ST, and her Sx/So stacking seems to give her Beta values. Beyond that, I find F makes way more sense than T for her.
To freshen up the memory or understanding of Clubs:
ST, Pragmatists: "When a group consists of members of this club, but without either of the two quadras having greater weight, its interactions are likely to be based on sports activities or discussion of, or cooperation in, projects related to manual work and engineering. Very typical examples of groups formed mainly of members of this club are groups of car enthusiasts where actively repairing and refurbishing them with their own hands is a key component of their activities." Note: If an ST is not a car enthusiast he is often into some other mechanical device, typically motorcycles.
SF, Socials: "When a group consists of members of this club, but without either of the two quadras having greater weight, its interactions are likely to be based on enjoying conversations over their families and personal relationships, artistic and sensorial interests such as cooking, gossip, and group social activities such as parties, dancing, travels and sportive activities. It's the stereotypical "women's group", although obviously such clubs formed only of men also exist, with common activities and interests usually focused around sports or, depending on the age structure, partying, clubbing and the like."
Being a feminist, standing for LGBT rights, and helping the homeless is completely NTR. C'mon now.
It has something to do with Ethics, clearly.
Very rare to see someone with Fi PoLR standing up for personal moral values in that way.
Helping the homeless is not necessarily Fi, but feminism and LGBT commonly is related to Fi (if not valued then usually Demonstrative). You'd be hard-pressed to find a Logical type that is focused on endorsing feminism or LGBT. That's the preoccupation of Ethicals, not Logicals. The only Logicals I've seen doing that were mostly Fi HA. Maybe Role once in a blue moon. Definitely not PoLR.
Besides all that, her brain and thinking seem entirely unstructured logically. Another point for a lack of Ti. She doesn't put things into logical categories or boxes. She is very chaotic in that sense. That is more typical of Ti PoLR.
But it could be.
And she could be following a trend. Maybe she doesn't see it as personal moral values, but something that reflects the values of her entourage? It's hard to say, as the reasons one has for doing something are more important than what you actually do, in socionics. Also, I know an Fe-EIE who is very into gender issues and LGBT rights, she just processes the information related to those subjects differently than an
She has the same face features of an MBTI INFJ friend of mine, eheheheheh
anyway... why is none talking of the fact that she killed KC? >(
You mean the rumor?
there's plenty of telly signs
Yea.
But it's not proven though, so not really fact.
I had an LSI friend who was convinced she killed him, and he showed me a documentary about it, I mean there are some signs like you said but it's nothing conclusive so I got annoyed at my friend for his conviction she killed him. It seemed to me he liked to entertain the idea because 1) he didn't like her and 2) it's more colorful an explanation than him killing himself.
I'm kind of annoyed by people like my friend who believe in conspiracy theories, lol.
I was thinking the same as u when an ENTJ friend was so convinced about she killing him that I started doing my researches online and that idea became a pretty scary evidence... yes there's no evidence actually but a lot of hints. Like Michael Hastings* found dead with 2 head gunshots, and it's been passed as suicide. Nonsense, I agree.
oh I confused the guys it was Gary Webb*, well a lot of mysteries.
Michael Hastings? The journalist? Google and Wikipedia say he died in a car crash and wikipedia says conspiracies about his death were related to the FBI, not Courtney Love.
Unless you mean a different guy?
got confused kk
It's ok that's why I'm here.
btw my comment was sort of a joke coz I saw nobody pointing out how foul she looks....
but seriously O.o check out Gary Webb
btw it's sad but I know someone who tried to kill herself with a gunshot at her temple and she survived, so yeah, everything's possible and...never trust your guns guys.
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