Who do you think makes best leader among TJs?

[joseph2505]

Is it ESTJ ? I know this depends on situation also .

[UDP]

:wink:

It has nothing to do with type, it has to do with the ability to manage your presonality, and other people. The ability to be more than type, and to act outside of type.

If an INTj has balls, then he can do fine. I don't know a lot about ENTjs..... but they're said to be good leaders too. IT's relatively subjective

[FDG]

Depends on what you're looking for in a leader.

[Apollonian]

I'd follow an ENTJ. However, if all others cannot lead, an INTJ will tend to step forward to fill the ENTJ's roll (at a personal cost).

I've known some ENTJ leaders. They serve their members well, though everyone has their foibles. I've also known an ENTP leader, and I don't know if I like their style as much. There is something about the J function which seems to make a lot of sense in a leader - the ability to get things done; an emphasis on the goal rather than the process.

I was a boy scout once upon a time and tried my hand at leadership. It is not something to take lightly, and abstract analysis can be nearly impossible (at least meaningful analysis) without experiential data.

But then again, what do I know...

[UDP]

If I had to follow someone, I'd rather it be an ENTj, too..........
That's a huge, IF, though.


(What type is Picard, from Star Trek?)


Whatever the case, I'd want some input in the decision making process, if I am to be a part of this team or function. Subortinate roles (in general) do not fit well with me. I have too much pride (P) for that.

I wouldn't follow most INTjs, I don't think, unless they expanded their leadership competence. I have taken an interest in leadership and discipline lately, so I suppose I am more of an exception, perhaps. Maybe not. I do understand (greatly) the immense value that working alone has to an INTj, and generally deal as such in my doings.

The difference would be if I were on a "quest" I deemed worthy enough. The more something meant to me/seemed important to my universal goals, the more invovlement I would want.

[UDP]

Hey, Tcaulding--

You mentioned in the other thread that an "xNTj" (or it was xSFj, in the rinoa thread), was more confident than an ESFj or ISFj. I wonder if I am a candidate for such a cross type, because I have, at times scored very directly between I and E

(Perhaps not apploicable, but I managed a 50/50 split for MBTI I/E in my earlier days).

I'm just speculating, though. What do you think about that?

Or, what would an xNTj crosstype personality be like to you?

[emeye]

The best leader among Tj's?

Most likely, an Fp, with whip cracking

[Apollonian]

The best leader among Tj's?

Most likely, an Fp, with whip cracking

*raises an eyebrow*

*laugh* *sigh*

That would be really quite effective... only insomuch as the Tj's are willing to submit to such maneuvering. It makes for a good laugh though.

[UDP]

I don't think I've ever been truly personally justified in following an Fp.......................... and I know that was sort of a joke, but it is still....... ......

[Creepy-pokeball]

They can be leaders. Quit thinking in stereotypical mono.

INTp wouldnt be bad. ExTj would truely be annoying to me. I'd much rather have an ExTj companion than leader. Then again, I'd much rather not have a leader at all.

[UDP]

Look, I'm just speaking from experience. I'm not making claims to being more than subjective, especially here.

They can be leaders. Quit thinking in stereotypical mono.

Anyone can be a leader. It's whether or not I'd follow them, or whether I think they'd be effective. As a rule, I probably wouldn't follow anyone that I didn't really believe in, so the point is moot for me. It has nothing to do with types. but if we are merely talking about something that is already superfluous, then what's the big deal?

Maybe you should lighten up

( )

[tcaudilllg]

Hey, Tcaulding--

You mentioned in the other thread that an "xNTj" (or it was xSFj, in the rinoa thread), was more confident than an ESFj or ISFj. I wonder if I am a candidate for such a cross type, because I have, at times scored very directly between I and E

(Perhaps not apploicable, but I managed a 50/50 split for MBTI I/E in my earlier days).

I'm just speculating, though. What do you think about that?

Or, what would an xNTj crosstype personality be like to you?

Me? I'm solid INTJ.

The question is, why did you score that way? What are the answers to those questions that are true to you? Crosstypes score as they do because they find specific disagreements with the questions themselves. "They asked the wrong things" is what I hear from many crosstypes. Crosstypes are unaware that the things they believe are "wrong" to ask actually exist.

I'm definitely an INTJ. I don't have any determination to "belong" to anything in particular. Ego-block nonexistence infers a desire not just to fit in, but to be the fit. Besides, I'm a terrible judge of people's behavior, whereas E/I crosstypes are quite adept at it. (it's all they think about)

[UDP]

Hey, Tcaulding--

You mentioned in the other thread that an "xNTj" (or it was xSFj, in the rinoa thread), was more confident than an ESFj or ISFj. I wonder if I am a candidate for such a cross type, because I have, at times scored very directly between I and E

(Perhaps not apploicable, but I managed a 50/50 split for MBTI I/E in my earlier days).

I'm just speculating, though. What do you think about that?

Or, what would an xNTj crosstype personality be like to you?

Me? I'm solid INTJ.

The question is, why did you score that way? What are the answers to those questions that are true to you? Crosstypes score as they do because they find specific disagreements with the questions themselves. "They asked the wrong things" is what I hear from many crosstypes. Crosstypes are unaware that the things they believe are "wrong" to ask actually exist.

I'm definitely an INTJ. I don't have any determination to "belong" to anything in particular. Ego-block nonexistence infers a desire not just to fit in, but to be the fit. Besides, I'm a terrible judge of people's behavior, whereas E/I crosstypes are quite adept at it. (it's all they think about)

I don't like any of the tests, because they don't seem to really address the questions. Perhaps that is the limitation of a test, but... choosing between two alternatives, or a degree of how much of one alternative over the other is unappealing to me. things are generally relative for me, to some extent.

However, the INTj personality fits me MUCH more than ENTj, so perhaps I am not really a crosstype. I haven't taken a test in a while- perhaps I should. Any recommendations?

Ego-block nonexistence infers a desire not just to fit in, but to be the fit

I don't understand just what that means. could you explain it?

[Polly_G]

I agree its all relative to the person and the requirements they need to fill. Part of being a good leader is knowing your strengths and weaknesses. So a good leader would surround themselves with a team that filled those gaps when it came to their limitations.

It's when ego gets involved and people don't want to admit their limitations and seek a good team to help them out that they start failing.

I don't like micromanagement because it seems to demean the ability of the team to take care of the tasks assigned to them.

[Creepy-pokeball]

Look, I'm just speaking from experience. I'm not making claims to being more than subjective, especially here.

They can be leaders. Quit thinking in stereotypical mono.

Anyone can be a leader. It's whether or not I'd follow them, or whether I think they'd be effective. As a rule, I probably wouldn't follow anyone that I didn't really believe in, so the point is moot for me. It has nothing to do with types. but if we are merely talking about something that is already superfluous, then what's the big deal?

Maybe you should lighten up

( )

I dont want to lighten up. Nor do I need to. The point is moot because you woulndt follow anyways.

[Polly_G]

Been thinking more of this. On level playing field I think I'd pick the ENTj as the leader. Provided they didn't micromanagement the place to death. I would also trust their competance to do the job. The last one I worked with gave me a bit more space than some of the others because she saw I needed and didn't abuse it.

They would need someone around to challenge them though when they made a bad decision. ENTjs can come across as so capable and confident that people never question them. Sometimes decisions even an ENTj makes need to be questioned for the good of everyone.

[UDP]

Well, considering the Quadras, I guess I 'd be comfortable with an ENTj leader, as it is more or less "their job". I think they'd do well in such a position, or similar assistant position.

[FDG]

You have to pay attention to the steamrolling qualities of the ENTj leader, because there is the possibility that he/she is steamrolling along the wrong path. In this case, the only way to convince him that he's not going anywhere is shouting and/or logical argument.

[Polly_G]

Agreed and there are certain types who would instead try to gain favor with the ENTj by supporting them regardless. Its something to definately watch out for.

[UDP]

You have to pay attention to the steamrolling qualities of the ENTj leader, because there is the possibility that he/she is steamrolling along the wrong path. In this case, the only way to convince him that he's not going anywhere is shouting and/or logical argument.

Yeah, I've been there personally ............. ................

Maybe I am xNTj

[cracka]

I just signed up a few days ago and this is my first post here, just thought I may throw in my $.02 on the subject.

So, I'm a total ESTJ pretty much to a T. Am I a leader type, well yeah of course, after reading about my type all over the internet I guess I finally understand why...lol
I've pretty much stepped up for leadership in everything I've ever done whether it was in sports, boy scouts, work, or school just to make sure things get done, and for the most part they always have been.
Someone posted:

INTp wouldnt be bad. ExTj would truely be annoying to me. I'd much rather have an ExTj companion than leader. Then again, I'd much rather not have a leader at all.

I agree with this statement and think pretty much everyone I work with would agree. They all take direction from me in order to get work done, and, for the most part (not always), respect pretty much every decision I tend to make. But I could imagine if i was their actual supervisor I probably would micromanage the area waaaay too much because I wasn't there doing all the work I normally would be doing to get it done.
I absolutely hate micromanagement from those that are higher up than me and my group of 4 other people that I work with. There's never really been an instance where we have been micromanaged that has actually made any difference to what we were already getting done, at least from my point of view. (this could be my ESTJ personality speaking out though...lol)
Forgive me if anything here is irrelevant but like I said this is my first post here and seeing that there aren't many estj's here if any I don't know how any of my posts will be taken since I'm still not versed in all the different types, quadras, etc... but let's just say i'm working on it.

[Creepy-pokeball]

Well, considering the Quadras, I guess I 'd be comfortable with an ENTj leader, as it is more or less "their job". I think they'd do well in such a position, or similar assistant position.

I have to come back to this. Sorry UDP. But why is it their inherent job? Why not the person with the best ability to do *insert whatever leadership role here because there are a lot of ways to lead* well? I say this because I have known some ENTjs to be so god awful annoying when in this role that I refuse to even care. I dont waste my time to appease one's ego and love of heighted vocal chord volume. Quite franky, I find it annoying and disruptive in these negative examples I believe to be ENTj. But beyond that, why could an XXXx not lead if they were truly good at what they were doing? What if I was working at a patent think tank? Or what if I was the host to a calligraphy seminar? What if I was in charge of little children? What if I was ... .... .. I could go on and on about the zillion different roles I could think of that we may or may not partake.

[FDG]

I agree with Jade.