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    wants to be a writer. silverchris9's Avatar
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    Default Note on Fe

    This is something from the topic about whether or not the forum is going downhill, but I want to expand it into a larger conversation about the nature of Fe, and how it is different based on what IP element it is blocked with.

    Quote Originally Posted by Crispy View Post
    Nothing about this forum is Fe anymore. All you guys care about is staying on topic, being respectful of other's attitudes, and a myriad of other Fi trivialities. The seriousness of this place is palpable. I wouldn't be surprised if half of you realize you're Delta in the next few months as this place becomes more and more of a bore-fest. I would be fine with a boring atmosphere if the information pertaining to the theory was the least bit accurate, but this place is the worst of both worlds.

    Do you have any evidence that these new policies are Merry > Serious? You've witnessed a lot of the Merry people get banned.
    The intuition at play here is that Fe as blocked with Ni (and in Se-valuing individuals) looks different than Fe as blocked with Si (and in Ne-valuing people). Staying on topic or not isn't really related to any function, if anything it's related to both thinking functions. But Fe blocked with Ni is going to be more grandiose. It has more interest in making the passion as large as possible because Ni is interested in ideas that are as large and as abstract as possible. Fe blocked with Si is going to be gentler. It's going to poke rather than prod. It is concerned not with making the passion as grandiose as possible, but with making the atmosphere as pleasant as possible. It doesn't seek extreme emotional atmospheres as Beta Fe does. It seeks emotional atmospheres that complement a positive internal state.

    The fundamental problem here is an overidentification of Fe with "emotion." Certainly, Fe is about changing internal states (internal dynamics of objects), and a changing internal state is often identified as an emotion (as opposed to more habitual internal states, which Ne is concerned with, such as being a "grumpy" person, or a "happy" person). But changing internal states aren't always big noticeable emotions, because big noticeable emotions wreck Si equilibrium (you can't reach an equilibrium if you're always bouncing around from ANGER to SORROW to GRIEF to RAGE to JOY). Rather, changing internal states, when informed by a concern for external dynamics of fields, rather than the double internality of Fe and Ni, involves making the atmosphere more comfortable emotionally. Smoothing out extreme emotions, working in precisely the opposite direction.

    Of course, this is just in the abstract. In practical terms, the two "versions" of Fe are still quite similar, but hopefully this suggests some of the underlying difference.
    Not a rule, just a trend.

    IEI. Probably Fe subtype. Pretty sure I'm E4, sexual instinctual type, fairly confident that I'm a 3 wing now, so: IEI-Fe E4w3 sx/so. Considering 3w4 now, but pretty sure that 4 fits the best.

    Yes 'a ma'am that's pretty music...

    I am grateful for the mystery of the soul, because without it, there could be no contemplation, except of the mysteries of divinity, which are far more dangerous to get wrong.

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    Contrarian Traditionalist Krig the Viking's Avatar
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    Very well said, silverchris. I would say that +Fe (Beta Fe) seeks passionate emotions, while -Fe (Alpha Fe) seeks pleasant emotions. Beta prefers powerful, thrilling, earth-shattering "heavy" emotions, while Alpha prefers harmonious, soothing, happy, "light" emotions.
    Quaero Veritas.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Krig the Viking View Post
    Very well said, silverchris. I would say that +Fe (Beta Fe) seeks passionate emotions, while -Fe (Alpha Fe) seeks pleasant emotions. Beta prefers powerful, thrilling, earth-shattering "heavy" emotions, while Alpha prefers harmonious, soothing, happy, "light" emotions.
    What kind of emotions do Deltas seek?
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

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    Slippery when wet Simon Ssmall's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Parkster View Post
    What kind of emotions do Deltas seek?
    Looking for an Archnemesis. Willing applicants contact via PM.

    ENFp - Fi 7w6 sp/sx
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    Slippery when wet Simon Ssmall's Avatar
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    Looking for an Archnemesis. Willing applicants contact via PM.

    ENFp - Fi 7w6 sp/sx
    The Ineffable IEI
    The Einstein ENTp

    johari nohari
    http://www.mypersonality.info/ssmall/

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ssmall View Post
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

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    wants to be a writer. silverchris9's Avatar
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    Deltas presumably seek a stable relationship that is based entirely on the connection between two people, or even a larger social structure, that can't be disturbed by the emotions of the moment. Obviously Deltas love to laugh, and love to have a positive internal state, but the positive internal state is less important than what your insides tell you about each other, how you feel about eachother in the sense of how your internal motor is humming when you're around one another, which is itself an indicator of the quality of relationship. Deltas do Fe stuff of course, everyone's internal state changes. But Deltas see internal change as something necessary for the improvement of the relationship, as such, only those emotions which benefit the relationship---and only insofar as they benefit the relationship---are permissable or good. So whereas betas enjoy fighting to some degree (anything for something to feel), deltas see fighting as, at the very best, a necessary evil, a clensing that needs to happen to make a relationship progress. Negative emotions in general are to be avoided because they make the relationship worse.

    So Forum wise, deltas wouldnot be in favor, presumably, of intraforum conflict, because they'd ideally prefer an atmosphere of mutual agreement and unity so that we can move forward as a group, whereas betas prefer a more antithetical method, subscribing to Blake's theory that "opposition is true friendship."
    Not a rule, just a trend.

    IEI. Probably Fe subtype. Pretty sure I'm E4, sexual instinctual type, fairly confident that I'm a 3 wing now, so: IEI-Fe E4w3 sx/so. Considering 3w4 now, but pretty sure that 4 fits the best.

    Yes 'a ma'am that's pretty music...

    I am grateful for the mystery of the soul, because without it, there could be no contemplation, except of the mysteries of divinity, which are far more dangerous to get wrong.

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    Contrarian Traditionalist Krig the Viking's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Parkster View Post
    What kind of emotions do Deltas seek?
    Deltas seek relationships; emotions are secondary.

    Though if I understand it correctly, Model B proposes that both Alphas and Deltas value -Fe and +Fi. But I haven't read as much of Boukalov's work on the subject as I would like, so I don't have a full understanding of the theory. (If anyone has a link to a full description of how Model B works, I sure would appreciate it )
    Quaero Veritas.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Krig the Viking View Post
    Very well said, silverchris. I would say that +Fe (Beta Fe) seeks passionate emotions, while -Fe (Alpha Fe) seeks pleasant emotions. Beta prefers powerful, thrilling, earth-shattering "heavy" emotions, while Alpha prefers harmonious, soothing, happy, "light" emotions.
    Ok, though I don't know that I would call it "soothing," but that's just me.

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