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Thread: Alphas, do you disrespect weakness?

  1. #41
    Humanist Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Suzzy View Post
    Maritsa you misunderstand or misinterpret so much of what I write. You look for ways to attack and jump on me when you feel you have the chance. You make me hesitant to post as I never know when you will decide to act like a little Nazi ninja.
    I just observe information that is aligned with functions and I point them out. How you see me (Se), externally, is your choice. Why do you correlate people to things like
    Maritsa's action = action like little Nazi ninja...on

    That very sentence is a load of Se....you see me and that to be the same. wow.

    It's like saying "The door is black" "Maritsa acts like a nazi ninja"
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    Tritype 1-2-6 stacking sp/sx


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

  2. #42
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  3. #43
    Humanist Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pied Piper View Post
    That's like saying "the door is black" "Suzzy is Se".
    What type do you think she is? She has 224 posts; you can tell.
    Se is not a bad thing; I am not cursing or putting anyone down by letting them know that they are Se ego block holders. I may get concerned about information being accurate, but I don't fear Se. I fear people who are emotionally gone-bad, who chase me around and disrupt a warm atmosphere that I escape to.

    All people have feelings and are sensitive to violence in their own way. Just because I say she has Se that doesn't mean I've put her in a category (which I don't) of being a "bad" person (which is something I don't do to people).

    The fact is, most people poorly understand Se and what it means, so their natural inclination is to shy away from it for the very wrong concepts that have been associated with it. I have been trying hard to break people from those definition that have created negative images.

    The fact is most Se types are wonderful at a lot of things I am not and vice versa. We both contribute, everyone does.
    Last edited by Beautiful sky; 07-29-2010 at 04:29 AM.
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    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

  4. #44

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    Man you guys suck. It's not even that you're being judgemental and critical, it's your being inaccurate in your judgements and criticisms about people. You don't really have anything figured out, you naive little sheltered middle class nobodies. Fuck all of you. You won't even get to know people, you just know what they show you and you think that's the real thing. It's very faux-intellectualism.

  5. #45
    Humanist Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    I stand up for my beliefs very strongly; I don't see why INTj's don't; they are just not proactive when promoting their product, to make money.
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    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by BulletsAndDoves View Post
    Man you guys suck. It's not even that you're being judgemental and critical, it's your being inaccurate in your judgements and criticisms about people. You don't really have anything figured out, you naive little sheltered middle class nobodies. Fuck all of you. You won't even get to know people, you just know what they show you and you think that's the real thing. It's very faux-intellectualism.
    Who are you referring particularly to? Maritsa33? or all who have posted here?

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by BulletsAndDoves View Post
    Man you guys suck. It's not even that you're being judgemental and critical, it's your being inaccurate in your judgements and criticisms about people. You don't really have anything figured out, you naive little sheltered middle class nobodies. Fuck all of you. You won't even get to know people, you just know what they show you and you think that's the real thing. It's very faux-intellectualism.
    This guy is always complaining. I havent seen any real intellectualism from you either, just complaints that people "dont understand" yet do you understand anything?
    What good is a book that does not even transport us beyond all books?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr Who View Post
    Suzzy is like Sigourney Weaver mixed with Marilyn Monroe mixed with Scarlett Johansson mixed with Heather Graham in her videos.



    Whereas you seem hilariously like a Nazi Ninja.
    And all of those actresses are ESFp types.
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    Enneagram 2w1sw(1w9) helps others to live up to their own standards of what a good person is and is very behind the scenes in the process.
    Tritype 1-2-6 stacking sp/sx


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

  9. #49
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    Default Maritsa

    I just observe information that is aligned with functions and I point them out. How you see me (Se), externally, is your choice. Why do you correlate people to things like
    Maritsa's action = action like little Nazi ninja...on
    I'm afraid the very fact maritsa that you use this as an example of why Goldilocks is an ESFp and that you are INFj is wrong. Infj's naturally enjoy finding symbolism in statements and enjoy making metaphorical comparisons between things. It's in their very nature. The fact you question why Golidlocks is doing this and seem to not 'get' it makes me wonder how you can possibly believe you arew such an expert on personality. I'm sorry but you really need to become more open-minded and less concrete. You act exactly how an ESFj friend of mine acts...rewriting information or events to suit your own goal. Stop jumping on everything Goldilocks says as proof she is Se! Do you not have anything better to do? And honestly...if I tried using information the way you do...i could have you represented as any personality i wanted twisting information to suit my own purposes.

    Here is just one of many examples proving INFj's are known for their metaphorical comparisons!!

    Their thought processes tend to be highly integrative as they frequently become aware of the profound significance and interrelatedness of the many ideas, relationships, and events around them. When they allow themselves the space away from the hustle and bustle of day-to-day life, they often are conduits for profound symbols that speak to many. Symbols and metaphors come to them easily as ways to bridge differences and connect people with their potential.
    from INFJ Portait - Foreseer Developer - PersonalityCafe

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  11. #51
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  12. #52
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    thanks pied piper. sorry that site wasn't correct i just did a quick search because from what ive heard i know N's in general and IN's in particular are very good at using metaphors in general conversation and just wanted to point out the fact that Suzzy was doing this and Maritsa did not understand it one bit and was using it to justify her wrong conclusions.

  13. #53
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    Everyone has a weakness of some sort, and nobody is perfect. To balance that out, everyone has a strength as well. We can work in the areas that we thrive in, but also to overcome the weakness. People work at various paces to overcome their flaws. For some, its a lifelong struggle. It usually depends on the nature of the weakness, but I don't go as far as having a survival of the fittest type of mentality.

    If someone denies that they have a weakness themselves, that in and of itself is a flaw. There are certain people I'm more willing to be opened about my own weaknesses than others, and yes its going to be apparent to many.

    There are certain traits I'm more tolerant of than other traits, but that doesn't make them right, or wrong that people have them. There are times when I see some of my own weakness in another person and feel a little uneasy, but I don't condemn them for it.
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  14. #54
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    I guess so, if by weakness it can mean almost anything negative about someone or something. Sure, there are traits I don't like people to have, such as acting without thinking or being unwilling to consider that they might be misguided or wrong. Those are weaknesses that are hard to respect.

    And I believe it's important to have a strong military force that exercises periodic shows of force, especially with allies, as a defensive measure. Because if you can't defend yourself from outside aggressors, how could you expect them not to take advantage of you? It would be nice, if that wouldn't happen and their was some sense of decency and fairness to how the human race relates with each other, but humans like to disregard rules when they think it's to their advantage (or goes against an instinct for dominion and dominance) and enslave, kill, torture, and flat-out use people and land they can conquer. So even though I don't think I value Se or even Te for that matter, it's hard to respect people that ignore that kind of reality because it's a kind of suicide, like the Native Americans being wiped out or the slaves taken from Africa or the awfully violent wars of shoguns and Samurai and the abusive effect it had on the farmers and lower classes in Japan, the warring dynasties of China and its ruthless overly authoritarian rulers, and the religious wars fought throughout Europe and the Middle East that justify almost any atrocities in the name of a God. I mean there's always a group of assholes looking to justify mass murder, insurrection, sedition, and some kind of idea of manifest destiny just because they find some reason or logic or belief that supposedly justifies it. And it takes immense patience to truly deal with people like this because they don't care about or even believe in the value of getting along; they are looking to purely take control, for better or worse​. Adam is probably generally right here -

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    I've since broadened my definition of the divide to be between Authoritarians who can never live comfortably in a liberal democracy, and those who are more open minded. I think this is the basic divide, and all others are built on it.
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    we need a 'not really' option...

    it's something I notice in people but it's not important to me. If i do stumble across a 'weak' person, out of sheer curiosity, i'll poke and prod to see what makes them 'weak' but other than that it's not important to me...hence why i would've chosen 'not really'.


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    It might depend on the type of weakness.

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    I dislike weakness when it means I can't count on somebody

  18. #58
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    Weakness that is emphasized in terms of "look at me" mb.
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    I don't disrespect weakness in itself, I find it very refreshing when people are honest about what they are weak in and it helps me figure out how to either avoid it or strengthen it if I can. However, I do disrespect weakness when it is not acknowledged and/or used as a crutch when it eventually backfires on them when it could have been avoided.

    Everybody is weak in something and we can't always be strong in everything (as much as we wish we could). I admit, I can find myself feeling a bit shameful when I feel weak in something. However, accepting weakness is a strength. I think most people are willing to accommodate and help out if people are trying their best and that are willing to acknowledge that they are weak in something. It's when people get defensive and refuse to acknowledge their weakness when it can be accommodated for is when I don't have much respect or sympathy. I find that these people will be less accommodating for you and your weakness/needs.

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  21. #61
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    Everything that irritates us about others can lead us to an understanding of ourselves."

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  22. #62
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    I do wonder if this has anything to do with type/quadra but I can speak from the perspective of a metalhead. "Weakness" is a thing to be rightly despised and thoroughly disrespected. The "weak" have no place with our kind and deserve all they get and anyone who holds it up as some form of "virtue" is working for the great enemy. This is a grand irony for me as so many don't really seem to get what Christ meant when he said "the meek shall inherit the Earth". They equate "meek" with "weak". The "quiet ones" with "weak ones".

    Sadly, there is a distinction to be had there that many fail to make. You see, there is "vulnerability" and then there is "weakness" shall we say. We are all the former in one form or another, but only the truly broken will equate that with the later. After all, a random meteorite could pulp your brain the instant you walk out the front door. You weren't weak, you were merely "vulnerable" to what amounts to a dice roll you're so unlikely to "fail" that you rightly never even think of it.

    This has nothing to do with "physical" weakness BTW. It is, after all, an ideally temporary state. No body builder or Olympic "lifting" gold medalist just showed up at the tender age of 10 and set a world record. They had to work hard for that one in one form or another. Tons of "whimpy" metalheads out there who can and would show feats of mental and spiritual fortitude that'd put the beefiest strongmen to shame.

    This is sadly a fact the soyboys have corrupted to give them succor as well I must sadly say. They imagine themselves titans of the mental realm, but they are, sadly for them, but small souled bugmen. Insects, ticks attached to a great mammoth imagining themselves the operating force behind it. Tragic. Well, almost tragic, if it wasn't for them being in a position for them to take out their frustrations on their hosts!

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    Quote Originally Posted by End View Post
    I do wonder if this has anything to do with type/quadra but I can speak from the perspective of a metalhead. "Weakness" is a thing to be rightly despised and thoroughly disrespected. The "weak" have no place with our kind and deserve all they get and anyone who holds it up as some form of "virtue" is working for the great enemy. This is a grand irony for me as so many don't really seem to get what Christ meant when he said "the meek shall inherit the Earth". They equate "meek" with "weak". The "quiet ones" with "weak ones".

    Sadly, there is a distinction to be had there that many fail to make. You see, there is "vulnerability" and then there is "weakness" shall we say. We are all the former in one form or another, but only the truly broken will equate that with the later. After all, a random meteorite could pulp your brain the instant you walk out the front door. You weren't weak, you were merely "vulnerable" to what amounts to a dice roll you're so unlikely to "fail" that you rightly never even think of it.

    This has nothing to do with "physical" weakness BTW. It is, after all, an ideally temporary state. No body builder or Olympic "lifting" gold medalist just showed up at the tender age of 10 and set a world record. They had to work hard for that one in one form or another. Tons of "whimpy" metalheads out there who can and would show feats of mental and spiritual fortitude that'd put the beefiest strongmen to shame.

    This is sadly a fact the soyboys have corrupted to give them succor as well I must sadly say. They imagine themselves titans of the mental realm, but they are, sadly for them, but small souled bugmen. Insects, ticks attached to a great mammoth imagining themselves the operating force behind it.

    Do you have any weaknesses, or just “vulnerabilities”?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Poptart View Post
    Do you have any weaknesses, or just “vulnerabilities”?
    Only the later I pray. For if I have a "weakness" as I see it it means I have a sin I'm refusing to repent for and that means I am most assuredly bound for hell.

    You've prompted me to reflect upon that fact. Thank you for hopefully helping me upon my path towards heaven .

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    q_q alphas are too good for this world ༼ つ ͡ ͡° ͜ ʖ ͡ ͡° ༽つ

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    Quote Originally Posted by shotgunfingers View Post
    q_q alphas are too good for this world ༼ つ ͡ ͡° ͜ ʖ ͡ ͡° ༽つ
    I remember reading a comment a long time ago of a British explorer who wrote about the indigenous people he found living in the Caribbean in the 1700s:

    ‘These people spend all day sitting around smoking tobacco and playing games. They would be easy to enslave.’

    made me think of alpha for some reason.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alive View Post
    I remember reading a comment a long time ago of a British explorer who wrote about the indigenous people he found living in the Caribbean in the 1700s:

    ‘These people spend all day sitting around smoking tobacco and playing games. They would be easy to enslave.’

    made me think of alpha for some reason.
    Yet, this enslavement would be totally counterproductive. This is quite apparent in countries that have peripheral values. [Russia finally understood to leave Finland alone etc]. Passive or overt resistance is hard to overcome when the target is driven by intrinsic motivators and not by extrinsic ones.
    Last edited by BrightDemonSheep96; 04-15-2021 at 09:12 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alive View Post
    I remember reading a comment a long time ago of a British explorer who wrote about the indigenous people he found living in the Caribbean in the 1700s:

    ‘These people spend all day sitting around smoking tobacco and playing games. They would be easy to enslave.’

    made me think of alpha for some reason.
    shhh, they don't need to know.. only when its too late.

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    Quote Originally Posted by xerx View Post
    Partially inspired by a description that says ESFj disrespect weakness, but aren't inclined to think that INTjs are weak bz INTjs stand up for their beliefs.
    I think those people are EIE. This is why EIEs are pure moth-and-the-flame. There is all that charm and humor they have, but they are demanding and domineering in a way that
    just irks me. Quite simply, I think EIEs outnumber ESEs to a large degree, and they are therefore confused. I think this is where the problem of ESEs 'disliking weakness' in the theory comes from. I believe this because I have interacted with a number of people who I thought were 'ESE', but then this demanding, materialistic side would show itself, and you show even one sign of weakness to them, and you're 'toast.' And why is this? It's because they value Se. That is at least what I have personally noticed, anyway...

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    The only thing that I really disrespect and peeves me is when someone is being unkind to others.
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