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    ._. Aiss's Avatar
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    Default What am I?

    I've tested as ILI, but somehow expected LII as a result (because of "P/J switch rule", I suppose - I considered myself MBTI INTP, but functions descritpions seem much different). I don't see myself as LII though, and this led me to read more about functions in socionics vs MBTI. I realized I was ILI, but looking for more information about this type, I've started to doubt it again, and here I am.

    See, at first I've misread the diagram and thought Ti was ILI's ignoring function. I've noticed it wasn't so in ILI's profile, this made me take a look at LIE. Type dynamics (from wikisocion) describe me rather well, unfortunately - I've read a few things that others have told me before, but I was unwilling to accept.

    In retrospect, this might have been because of my knowing (and admiring) my ENTP (and probably ILE) sister. Try as I might, I can't recall an instance of my considering many multiple possibilities and generally dabbling with ideas outside of fantasy/science-fiction context, or some wittiness in discussion. I liked to think myself open to all ideas, just like my sister, and thought my mother didn't have a clue when she'd complained of me not being so in real life matters (especially if I thought something was pointless in long term - main point of contest, really). Also I've been often told I'm only criticizing and not contributing, which I've considered an unjustified attack, though thinking it over I can't completely deny this one, either. There's a lot of other accurate details, too.

    Looking at romance style, I seem to be a Victim (though I still have every intention of stabbing anyone who'd try to victimize me). In temperament, most like IP. Club - Researchers, I don't really fit in others. Quadras... this is where I'm not sure. See, I can act like almost any of them, when in their company (Deltas present something of a problem, since they're described as being nice). For example, depending on a person I speak to or a forum I write on, I sometimes consciously alter my expression - like removing all likelihood references (probably, possibly, likely, etc.) to make myself seem more confident. This is at least in part learned. FWIW, I try to be natural here. What rings surprisingly true is Gamma's perception of Alphas. I know a lot of Alphas, especially ILEs (or so I think), though some of the irritation might be with them being Infantile.

    I have some issues with being LIE. One of them is that they - ENTjs and MBTI ENTJ - are said to be charismatic and natural leaders. I don't feel like that - while I can see myself leading (not that I'd like the responsibility), I don't find it easy to get people to follow me. In fact, the only situation when it happens is when there's no one else to do the job. I'm not really sociable - I prefer it when others take initiative. I don't think I'm extroverted, in short. ILI, however, doesn't seem to fit as good - especially id block. This leads me to another question: how accurate do you find the profiles at wikisocion? Everyone deviates from the norm, but both of these types fit and yet don't fit me.

    Kind of ironic I've done a lot more self-reflection reading about socionics, when it's MBTI that's meant to help people in self-development. I guess differentiating between what I am and what I wanted to think of myself is the problem, though I'm not sure I could ever get it clear.

    Thoughts?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aiss View Post
    I've tested as ILI, but somehow expected LII as a result (because of "P/J switch rule", I suppose - I considered myself MBTI INTP, but functions descritpions seem much different). I don't see myself as LII though, and this led me to read more about functions in socionics vs MBTI. I realized I was ILI, but looking for more information about this type, I've started to doubt it again, and here I am.


    Thoughts?
    Oke let's get you up to date :-)

    j/p switch was invented as a solution to a problem that can't be solved. Needless to say, nobody uses j/p switch anymore, since it was a wrong idea.

    mbti functions are a mess and incomplete. Best to simply ignore them. Socionics functions are correct. (though mbti type descriptions and 4 dichotomies are fine)

    You say you are INTP so most likely ILI, which is correct since you clearly identify with most of the obvious traits (temperament, clubs, introversion/responder, critic etc)

    your main issue with not identifying with ILI seems to be with ID block and functions. functions and model A have caused much confusion with many people their selftypings, since it's harder to relate to functions and blocks, then to the other type traits.
    Last edited by Jarno; 12-19-2009 at 02:28 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    You say you are INTP so most likely ILI, which is correct since you clearly identify with most of the obvious traits (temperament, clubs, introversion/responder, critic etc)

    your main issue with not identifying with ILI seems to be with ID block and functions. functions and model A have caused much confusion with many people their selftypings, since it's harder to relate to functions and blocks, then to the other type traits.
    Thanks, I think I'll go with ILI for now. So functions are less important than traits in typing? I probably don't understand them well, but I think Ti is my ignoring function rather than Ne (unless the descriptions I've mentioned are inaccurate). I see you've got ILI-Te as your type - that's actually what the test gave me, but I couldn't find a source about subtypes. How do they influence functions? Just the ego or id as well?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aiss View Post
    Thanks, I think I'll go with ILI for now. So functions are less important than traits in typing? I probably don't understand them well, but I think Ti is my ignoring function rather than Ne (unless the descriptions I've mentioned are inaccurate). I see you've got ILI-Te as your type - that's actually what the test gave me, but I couldn't find a source about subtypes. How do they influence functions? Just the ego or id as well?
    IMO functions often add more confusion in typing than the other general traits that you've used. As you can also notice in yourself, you're most probably ILI according to several traits, but the only thing that doesn't seem right is Ne as ignoring function. This is probably due to vague definition of 'Ne' and 'ignoring' and the unreliability of introspection. In my experience, only in relationships you'll notice your ignoring function. Since for example it drains energy in Mirage relationship.

    I would also expect you to be Te subtype. Direct and summarized writing style. Ni subtypes like user Crazedrat are more linguistic evolved, as if he writes a poem in every post.

    How and why subtypes exist as they do is still a question. The influence of subtypes are on the ego block and probably the other blocks too... There are probably more than 2 subtypes but at least you can all catagorize them into 2 classes with these traits:
    Producing subtypes (ILI-Te) are always more directed at contact/persuasion with others, Accepting subtypes (ILI-Ni) seem to be more 'talking to themselves and allow others to listen along'.

    Here's the subtypes description:

    ILI subtypes - Wikisocion

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    IMO functions often add more confusion in typing than the other general traits that you've used. As you can also notice in yourself, you're most probably ILI according to several traits, but the only thing that doesn't seem right is Ne as ignoring function. This is probably due to vague definition of 'Ne' and 'ignoring' and the unreliability of introspection. In my experience, only in relationships you'll notice your ignoring function. Since for example it drains energy in Mirage relationship.

    I would also expect you to be Te subtype. Direct and summarized writing style. Ni subtypes like user Crazedrat are more linguistic evolved, as if he writes a poem in every post.
    You're right, I likely don't really understand Ne at this point. I have no idea what types my friends are, except perhaps for some alphas, so I'll probably only find out various relationships with time.

    I'd go with Te, except the subtype seems a bit active, so I'm unsure. ILI it is for now.

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    What are you? A human being
    What type your are is based on your characteristics. Independently, how do you feel about the 8 functions, which one would you not want to deal with, which one angers and annoys you about other individuals, which one are you not sure about? Base your decisions on the definitions I give you please.

    Extraverted intuition is also called Intuition of Possibilities, or Intuition of Potential.

    This function is “responsible” for considering the world in all its possibilities and alternatives, in generalization of what is going on and developing new concepts.

    Bearers of this function are usually curious, full of ideas; they gladly look for new ideas in books, or make new interesting acquaintances. Usually they are not aggressive, and even being talented, often have troubles with getting a “reward”, recognition of their ingenuity. They usually see a lot of positive possibilities in other people. However, when their ideas are offended, they can be very persistent.

    A negative trait: when they promise, it usually does not mean “I will certainly do”, often it means “I wish it would happen when somebody helps”.

    Introverted intuition is also called Time Intuition.

    This function, instead of lots of possibilities, considers people and the world as if flowing in a big and insuperable stream of time. What does people's potential mean when it cannot be realized? Fate rules the world. Their usual condition is something like meditation. However, in spite of such “Buddhist” vital philosophy, they are very smart in adaptation to different crises that happen in life, and stoically tolerate even somebody else's petty tyranny. They are intellectuals, but they do not often want to demonstrate their ideas, preferring that other people would pay attention to them, and for this reason often seem to be “passive”. In fact, they do not think they are “passive” – the “wait for the good moment”.

    Extraverted sensing is also called Volitional Sensing, or Space-capturing Sensing.

    This sensing function directs to occupation of space. People with this strong function are usually demanding people, which like when other people fulfill their wishes and demands. Sometimes they become managers, and sometimes – good sellers that can sell even unnecessary things. They often (but not always) have athletic, somewhat roundish figure, quick and demanding eyes. They are very persistent in the life: "If I want, then it should be achieved”, and they often gladly help other people – those who accept their leadership. Their outbursts of anger may fear some people, but in fact they are short-term – in several minutes they become calm again and restore their good mood.

    Introverted sensing is also called Comfort Sensing, or Space-settling Sensing.

    This kind of sensing is rather passive, it focuses on getting as more pleasant feelings as possible, on reduction of quantity of unnecessary motions, on the quality and functionality of work. People with this function as dominant do not like to argue (if they began – it means that something VERY serious happened). They are often efficient at work that requires attention to small details, monotonous chores etc. They like intellectuals, like new ideas, because these ideas make their life more diverse, but also ridicule intellectuals for their “impractical approach”.

    Extraverted logic is also called Processual or Practical Logic.
    It estimates everything in terms of efficiency: not abstract analysis, but "how to make it work?", and not systems, but methods. They are energetic, active, and mobile. As scientists, they are strong in improvement of methods, but often they choose a business career. However, people who work together with them, often blame these types of being "too dry, cold-hearted", even in spite of their high emotionality. In general, this type of thinking may be called “algorithmic”.

    Introverted logic is also called Systematic Logic, or Structural Logic.

    This type of logic is inertial. Instead of “making things work”, it rather focuses on elimination of contradictions, on systematization, or in more general meaning – on “justice” (if it only exists). The types for which this function is dominant are often not too energetic, they are rather stable-mooded, work without noticeable “falls” and “rises”, logical and reticent in their sayings and deeds. On the one hand, other people respect them for being “just”, for their cold and sober analysis of situations; on the other, they do not “feel people” well.

    Extraverted ethic is also called Emotional Ethic.
    This function reflects person's own emotions, his/her emotional, highly personal and passionate reaction to what is going on around. Types with this dominant functions are eloquent, often smiling, artistic, charming (but somewhat “fussy” and “too artistic”), can speak and persuade others, but they perceive situations too emotionally, too personally, and sometimes they “sink” in their own emotions, cannot calm down for long time.

    Introverted ethic is also called Ethic of Relations.

    This function is inertial; many emotions are inside such a person, but they do not go outwards, and rather stay “conserved”. Such people are very passionate in evaluating other people, but from outside they seem to be “emotionless”, smiling just as much as etiquette requires. They are good spectators of relations: in a small collective, they very quickly feel who has which relations with whom. They can work with people – as lawyers, pedagogues, etc. However, being so attentive to people's relations, they do not like, even more, they are afraid of “intellectual initiative”, do not like arguing, because it can “break” or just significantly change relations with other people.
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 2w1sw(1w9) helps others to live up to their own standards of what a good person is and is very behind the scenes in the process.
    Tritype 1-2-6 stacking sp/sx


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

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