Taylor Swift

[on a peaceful hiatus]

Are you serious? Steve Jobs is incredibly emotionally expressive throughout that whole interview? Are you dumb, stupid, or dumb? Huh?

Oh my god you are totally right. It's a sure sign that someone is extroverted when a person constantly looks at the floor while giving an interview

and this is Fe (EIE): https://youtu.be/i5f8bqYYwps

And of course it's a sign of high introversion when some looks at an interviewer with focused eyes and an expressive face.

[/URL]

You are a genius

[Rusal]

IEE but sure

Funny that you claim to recognize IEEs on the spot yet you refuse to listen to what Strati, Alive, Adam and everyone and their grandmother is telling you in Socionics about EIEs.


You linken Fe to 'emotional expressiveness' but deny that Fe+Ni combination even exists. When you read that Fe is about that and that EIEs warn about impending dangers, it's not that they'll tell you trouble is ahead while biting their nails and then making grand hand gestures.

[on a peaceful hiatus]

Fe has the strenght that it can look at the dirt on the floor to interpret facial expressions and respond to them. Didn't you know?

[ILoveChinchillas]

https://www.theguardian.com/technolo...ting%20startup.

Steve Jobs was known for being ruthless and controlling, driven by a desire for perfection with a clear image of how products, practices and Apple should be, which helped him turn the company around after rejoining it from NeXT in 1996 when Apple bought the computing startup. But that same drive had an effect on his relations with employees.

SteVE JoBs wAS IrrAtIonAl

[FreelancePoliceman]

@two, I don’t think that Taylor is a weirdo, because she’s a lot like the SEI-Fe whom I know and like.* But her fans….. Yes, they are weirdos.

@Alive is correct about me not feeling comfortable in that kind of environment.

The first Taylor Swift fan I knew was a man who posted on an unrelated/untypological forum I was on when I was 14. He was a brony. He tried to get me and others to listen to her music often. His avatar was often one of Taylor Swift, or of a My Little Pony. I thought Taylor Swift's music wasn't for me and that the singer herself seemed strange, but in retrospect he seems far stranger.

Edit: Also, for some reason I see I voted for her as an SLE a couple years ago. I'm not sure what I was thinking. For the record, my vibe of her is an EIE who acts like an ESE.

I feel music videos are often good for getting a sense of someone's type -- out-of-the-ordinary elements are added in ways that have to mesh with the singer's personality. This one gives me a powerful sense of the Fi void of ExE. A few people on this forum have described Fe base as "evil" and I've begun to kind of get it (not necessarily feel the same way, but understand where they're coming from). Everything in this video is extraverted ethics; no interiority; everything is "perfect." It is kind of creepy when you're face to face with this kind of thing.

[Rusal]

Edit: Also, for some reason I see I voted for her as an SLE a couple years ago. I'm not sure what I was thinking. For the record, my vibe of her is an EIE who acts like an ESE.

You know, now that we know that LSI was a serious option for Gulenko's students and that what she sings about in songs and gladly accepts to put in her videos might signal aggressor tendencies sugarcoated in 'female craziness', Beta ST is not that bad of an option. After all, have we ever seen her engaged long enough in that Fe+Ni attention-seeking speech pattern?

[FreelancePoliceman]

You know, now that we know that LSI was a serious option for Gulenko's students and that what she sings about in songs and gladly accepts to put in her videos might signal aggressor tendencies sugarcoated in 'female craziness', Beta ST is not that bad of an option. After all, have we ever seen her engaged long enough in that Fe+Ni attention-seeking speech pattern?

Did someone actually say "female craziness?"

[on a peaceful hiatus]

You know, now that we know that LSI was a serious option for Gulenko's students and that what she sings about in songs and gladly accepts to put in her videos might signal aggressor tendencies sugarcoated in 'female craziness', Beta ST is not that bad of an option.

Only till you watch videos of actual 1D Fe types and understand how fundamentally different they are at expressing themselves.

https://youtu.be/CuOvodbkPjA

[Bethanyclaire]

she understands me the only way a famous ESE pop star could. the lyrics in her songs sound like every romantic ESE woman I've known

maybe LSI..she's a perfectionist

her partner is probably her dual...he is known for being private/ maybe LII

[Renna]

Could be ESE, but seem lack of Si slow ass calmness. Sx first?

I somehow more tend toward Beta. It's really hard to type her.

Could even be SEE.

[Bethanyclaire]

she's a marvel! I feel like I get to live so many missed opportunities via listening to her music, whilst at the same time she cures all my pain and reminds me of the things I like about myself and good things I've experienced

ESE-fe........!!

[Metamorph]

Fe has the strenght that it can look at the dirt on the floor to interpret facial expressions and respond to them. Didn't you know?

When coupled with intuition, it does. (Even though socionics is fake, looking at people and thinking about their body language is a rather ST approach to socializing, literally, consciously sensing and thinking.)

But clearly, this thread is just an excuse to see how long we can "VI" Taylor Swift for. "Ooooh look at Taylor... look at the way she moves those hips and smiles, I think that's EIE... No I think that's IEE... Ahhh yeah those IEE curves... I want to see that delta outfit..."

[Metamorph]

Oh my god you are totally right. It's a sure sign that someone is extroverted when a person constantly looks at the floor while giving an interview

Yeah, it's a sign that they want to be polite and not make you feel like they're just staring intensely at you. Does someone have to burp in your face and shout "I BURPED!" before you type them as extraverted?

[Metamorph]

How about we type people that behave like this as Fe valuing

So SEI?

[Aster]

I have decided. She is Beta as hell.

And EIE.

[on a peaceful hiatus]

I have decided. She is Beta as hell.

And EIE.

Finally this thread can be closed

[Squirrel]

How about we type people that behave like this as Fe valuing

I fell in love with the song, thanks for introducing me to it

[Bethanyclaire]

A true aesthete..she is ESE

[Aster]

Finally this thread can be closed

Exactly!!!

[Aster]

The way I personally think of EIE aesthetic and ESE is, I hate to say this (but I’m being a crazy honest bitch tonight, sorry) is that I really cringe and think ‘garish’ when I see ESE aesthetic, but I don’t with EIE. And by aesthetic, I also mean the lyrics. Look at Led Zeppelin, Pink Floyd. Gorgeous, beautiful, symbolic lyrics. Both Se/Ni bands. Si PoLR. Si is something else to me. Ni/Se is a type of harmony. Idk. I don’t think her aesthetics are Si though. And I for one, think EIE aesthetics are incredible beautiful. I think that our own Quadra’s aesthetic language speaks to us at an unconscious level.

thoughts?

anyone wanna fight do ya do ya

[Aster]

I like all white, too. I don’t think it would last long in my world though. Ugh. I need to fill it with random junk I like. We prob need a separate thread if this is going to continue though. Yeah.

Ps (I could be wrong but I don’t want to be lol) *hugs*

she’s def an extrovert, though, me thinks

[Bethanyclaire]

I think S types do music slightly better/ a little more beautiful....N art can be a bit too dark to be beautiful in a pure way. I'm not a massive music nerd so I'm not basing this on a very wide range. Saying that it might depend on the medium...also other factors....what's going on in the world. Art probably goes in cycles and N types are probably inspired by S types/ S types inspired by N. My fave films are Beta....but music....I think it's Alpha. I like Beta techno...dark, beautiful techno but Taylor and Sufjan Stevens (SEI) fill my heart with hope.

I think the world needs an ESE right now, and the reason Taylor is Beta-like is because she grew up in a time that was tough for women (and young people in general).

I think the writer Madeline Miller is EIE- she is queen of writers atm! Very romantic, not too dark.

I'm sure there is a lot of very beautiful EIE music out there, maybe the bands @Aster mentions, not my taste but they are respected aren't they? But they're not as big as Taylor or Bob Dylan(ESI?)...and Taylor is getting a lot of respect these days.

Michael Jackson (greatest EIE musician?) is awesome but I wouldn't call his music 'beautiful' in the same way I'd call Dylan's or Taylor's? These geniuses (popular geniuses!) probably want to work hard on their polr..genius EIE wants you to dance

I'm just rambling and don't really know where I'm going with this, probably nowhere lol.

Taylor knows her culture...she even has a British boyfriend Her music seems influenced by Disney films...her music is Beta-ish because it's tasteful and romantic..

[Aster]

I think S types do music slightly better/ a little more beautiful....N art can be a bit too dark to be beautiful in a pure way. I'm not a massive music nerd so I'm not basing this on a very wide range. Saying that it might depend on the medium...also other factors....what's going on in the world. Art probably goes in cycles and N types are probably inspired by S types/ S types inspired by N. My fave films are Beta....but music....I think it's Alpha. I like Beta techno...dark, beautiful techno but Taylor and Sufjan Stevens (SEI) fill my heart with hope.

I think the world needs an ESE right now, and the reason Taylor is Beta-like is because she grew up in a time that was tough for women (and young people in general).

I think the writer Madeline Miller is EIE- she is queen of writers atm! Very romantic, not too dark.

I'm sure there is a lot of very beautiful EIE music out there, maybe the bands @Aster mentions, not my taste but they are respected aren't they? But they're not as big as Taylor or Bob Dylan(ESI?)...and Taylor is getting a lot of respect these days.

Michael Jackson (greatest EIE musician?) is awesome but I wouldn't call his music 'beautiful' in the same way I'd call Dylan's or Taylor's? These geniuses (popular geniuses!) probably want to work hard on their polr..genius EIE wants you to dance

I'm just rambling and don't really know where I'm going with this, probably nowhere lol.

Taylor knows her culture...she even has a British boyfriend Her music seems influenced by Disney films...her music is Beta-ish because it's tasteful and romantic..

I think a lot of the problem is people disagree on who is what type so things like their aesthetic get labeled such and such by people…get grouped in the kind as belonging to something…and that’s when disagreements arise…and that’s what keeps us all here arguing Like I think Dylan in IEI. Someone like Harry Styles is EIE…Paul Simon I think is IEI not SEI like so many people label him as. He is a pretty dark guy if you listen to his lyrics and are flowery, yes, but so are many Si PoLR lyrics. Robert Plant is one. I really think she is a harmonizing type, Si, so that is weird. :shifty;

[Bethanyclaire]

@Aster ohh Simon&Garfunkel.. yeah I mean Dylan seems like an IEI in some ways, but is he actually? He could be, I haven't thought about it too much, but I think he just seems like the stereotype of an IEI. Some artists will fit the stereotype of the type. And some will try to be like another type..Taylor is so goofy in a way I've only seen ESE act. I don't really follow her on social media/ watch her videos. But the music...it's clever...and the lyrics...'It's me, hi, I'm the problem, it's me?' That's not an EIE line..It's goofy...and the deepest insecurity of an ESE, they don't typically show that part of themselves.

[on a peaceful hiatus]

Harry Styles IEI>EIE

[HeInin]

I need an explanation, who is the extroverted here? Can LSIs be better stage performers?



How harmonius.

[nifl]

I was watching that interview and I had to chuckle at 8:20 because she pulled the same expression my ILE classmate in college used to in conversation – my classmate, Swift, Tea Leoni and whacky Ariel Burdett look like they could be an extension of the same woman in the faces they make (down to the same issue with their…upper central incisors? But I digress).

Tea Leoni is perhaps LIE/ILI

[Djangr]

SEI

[hellohellohello]

Ethical. Sensory. Introvert. ESI

[Finaplex]

Yeah but are tickets to her concerts worth $1000? lol.

I guess $1000 is the new $600

[youfloweryourfeast]

I think she does have some beta values how ever I can't see her being intuitive though for now I think she is LSI, and harmonizing.
I can also see arguments for ESE or SLE...IEE is crazy and though she may be the opposite of this imo.

[Bethanyclaire]

Now go stand in the corner and think about what you did..

[ILuv2Ho3]

Cannot stand her, as much as some of her songs make me want to unwillingly dance, all I feel somewhat confident in for her is extroversion, and Fe valuing

[Bethanyclaire]

greatest artist since Shakespeare and Van Gogh

[godslave]

I (a priori) don't like her for some reasons (NTR though, and that might change because I know only very peripheral stuff about her). I've listened to only one of her songs about 3 months ago. The song wasn't bad, it was a video in which she was robbing a bank or something like that. (I've just learned a few seconds ago, while checking if what I was about to say was proper English, the urban/slang meaning of the expression "robbing the bank"... I see the symbolism of that vide now ).

I think she's some sorts of EIE (I haven't tried to properly type her).

[on a peaceful hiatus]

I (a priori) don't like her for some reasons (NTR though, and that might change because I know only very peripheral stuff about her). I've listened to only one of her songs about 3 months ago. The song wasn't bad, it was a video in which she was robbing a bank or something like that. (I've just learned a few seconds ago, while checking if what I was about to say was proper English, the urban/slang meaning of the expression "robbing the bank"... I see the symbolism of that vide now ).

I think she's some sorts of EIE (I haven't tried to properly type her).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bUh7AkAeNgcv

I think her being a creative subtype makes her a bit more artistic due to Ni as she midly resembles IEI to me. I find her very expressive. she has lots of facial expressions and interacts with fans, socializes and identifies with them to the point that she pretty much has a cult following now. seems very scattered, excitable, skilled with people. all of this fits Fe and Ne quite well. her music itself is rather uninteresting to me. I think she had a couple of good songs like "style" but other than that her music escapes my attention. maybe because it's all so uncontroversial it helps people to identify strongly with her. I think almost all artists are IEI, but she seems like a genuine extrovert in the way that she creates attention. maybe it's because she is so different from all the people of the same sociotype around her.

[Adam Strange]

I don't like Taylor Swift on a personal level. I haven't listened to more than one of her songs, but I've seen her on stage with other performers, and she seems entirely self-interested to me.
I don't think she's healthy, because it seems to me that she needs to be loved by strangers, and keeps kicking her boyfriend de jure to the curb once she's gotten what she wants from him (which is attention from her adolescent fans). "Let me pretend to fall in love this week with a football player who is playing in the Superbowl, so I can kiss him on the biggest show of the year and be seen by more people than anyone in the world." A month from now, he'll be gone.

I think she's unhealthy, just as Trump is not a healthy SEE. In Trump's case, you can see the SEE under there, but you also see the overwhelming narcissism, which is not in the Socionics descriptions of any type. In Taylor's case, she needs attention from strangers, which is Fe carried to the nth degree. She also has an extremely high level of Si, which shows up in her control over her voice and her body motions, and in the costumes that she wears.

When a person is unhealthy, they become harder to type because the personality is obscured by insanity, but personally, I think that Taylor Swift is SEI, even though she looks 100% extroverted. She looks exactly like an SEI whom I worked with for twelve years, but the SEI with whom I worked was healthy and was actually nice to be around. An extroverted SEI is an ESE, but I don't think she is ESE. Swift's face is thinner and sharper than a typical ESE's face. Therefore, the extroversion she exhibits is an act, designed to win the adulation that she unhealthily craves.

On the other hand, I'm grateful for the fact that she's a liberal democrat (small "d" - Alpha Quadra), and her efforts to get her fans to register to vote are admirable.

[Bethanyclaire]

hmm I tried to re-think her type as ESE but I just kept coming back to ESE..and her boyfriend is so wholesome he has to be LII. (unless screeching madly on the football field lol), he reminds me of my LII neighbour.

ESE have mass appeal in the way IEI and EII can..in their likeability...so I think makes sense these types would become popular artists, or universally admired. @on a peaceful hiatus I re-thought my Shakespeare typing...

I think Shakespeare is IEI-ni, Swift is ESE-fe and Van Gogh is EII-fi...all base subtypes...I regard these artists as the most universally liked..I guess their art has a lot to say about 'the human soul' or condition..

And Swift, is here to stay..I really think she will bring a lot of change to the world, she is non-offensive and that means she can gradually influence people..like young, 'tortured' men..of course she has influenced women..she is such hero to people, I think she just notices trends and also grew up in a time (same age as me basically) when there was so much pressure on women (in the media) and the world was beginning to change, with the dawn of the internet..guess she is commenting on an interesting time.

It's so fun when you discover a new thing you like

[Bethanyclaire]

i mean she has a song about kanye called...this is why we can't have nice things....i love these metaphors she uses about....individuals being childish..it's so clever..turning narcissistic behaviour on it's head.

[misanthropex6]

ESE