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Thread: Deltas and the concept of "best friends"

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    Default Deltas and the concept of "best friends"

    Do you believe in the concept of having a best friend, or to treat all your friends the same way? I just found out today that the person I've considered my best friend for a long time doesn't feel the same way, and would rather treat all his friends the same, keep everyone at the same level. It's something I can understand to an extent, but I wanted to see if other deltas believe in having a sort of hierarchy when it comes to friends like I seem to naturally develop. I'm always aware that there is a friend who is my "best friend" during a certain period of time. It's a position that is "up for grabs" from me at all times, and I don't have reservations in assigning someone as my best friend if they did things to deserve the special treatment.

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    Yes, there is a sort of hierarchy in my relationship to people depending on the individual. Is this not what Fi is all about?

    Though personally, I am uncomfortable assigning one particular friend the 'best friend'. I tend to value all my close circle of friends in different ways; the circle which I speak of is a rather small one.

    Also, I don't think this is limited to just Delta or Gamma, but these two quadras are the most comfortable discussing this kind of thing and want it to be explicit. Where as Alpha and Beta rather have it expressed implicitly (via Fe, perhaps?).

    Is your friend a Ti type?
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Greeter View Post
    Yes, there is a sort of hierarchy in my relationship to people depending on the individual. Is this not what Fi is all about?

    Though personally, I am uncomfortable assigning one particular friend the 'best friend'. I tend to value all my close circle of friends in different ways; the circle which I speak of is a rather small one.

    Also, I don't think this is limited to just Delta or Gamma, but these two quadras are the most comfortable discussing this kind of thing and want it to be explicit. Where as Alpha and Beta rather have it expressed implicitly (via Fe, perhaps?).

    Is your friend a Ti type?
    No, he's SiTe, but I don't want this to be an "SLI sucks" thread, because that's not the issue. I respect that way of thinking, even though it's not in my nature.

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    I have to have some sort of differentiation. I know so many people that if everyone was on the same level,it would just be one big blur. And there are impacting factors of time known, history, and other things.

    That said, I'm really discovering (this summer, actually) that there are some very, very significant factors that relate to how close I am to people, and it has to do with their "ethics". I'm not sure what word to use, but, it has to do with my judgment of how much someone has things I want to be around. It has a prerequisite of being friends and knowing the person somewhat.

    But my really good friends have certain qualities, it seems. I might be getting more aristocratic and more mercenary now, but, it is something that I'm noticing in myself. It has to do with what I want influencing me. Ideally, it's a certain preference in terms of productivity and values, and in order for you to understand them you'd have to know me, so I won't try to explain them here. But when I sense them in others, I very actively want to pursue them and be with them. I notice how people impact others and impact the world around me, and as such, I notice how they impact me. Are they giving me things I can relate to and support? Are they annoying me? Are they wearing me down and not bringing any benefit to me? Am I contributing to them? Etc

    I do not suppose, honestly, that all people of my type or delta STs or even deltas feel that way. But it is where I am now. The big factors for me are compatibility of productivity and ethics, ease of communication (such as, are they easy to talk to in general; shared interests/views; do I see them every day/physically close by/we're involved in a lot of the same things), and also, simple history and experience. I have the most say in terms of my perceived compatibility and who I pursue and spend my time with. I have less say/choice in terms of who is actually around me physically (although I can 'move location', etc, yes). And I don't have much say about who I have a lot of history with as it has already happened.

    Still, in general (since always), I don't open up to people very much unless I feel relationally and ethically comfortable around them. The more questionable and variable the ethics the harder it is. Even if I don't totally agree with them, having consistent ethics makes it more likely that I'll open up.

    But what really affects me in terms of people I want to be around are how much our ethics align, and how much I think we're going in a similar direction in life. So in that sense, my best friends are somewhat rare but also very valuable. The selection process is a mixture of how much I 'want', which is generally entirely Te based in terms of how much I see that relationship bringing benefit, and how much I 'have/get', ... not everybody reciprocates my interests or desire to be closer.

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    I have a sort of not-well-defined hierarchy, I guess you could say. There are certainly levels of closeness, but they are often somewhat fluid and, eh... varying in color or quality. For example, the person I would consider my closest friend right now is an ESFj. But I'm also very close, if not closer, to my sister (ENFp). But the relationship I have with each of them is different, has different qualities, different dynamics, different focusses.

    The way I see it, every individual has their own connection with me (as well as all sorts of connections that in turn connect and intertwine), and each connection is unique even if there are many similarities between many of them.

    If there were a visual representation of one way of looking at it, it might be something like this (probably entirely unnecessary and useless, but I felt like making it so here you go, lol):




    Me being the purplish dot in the center and other people being the other dots. Each person has their own connection, but different people are different distances from me and come from different directions and interact with me in different ways. There are no real boxes or set-in-stone hierarchies. But some people are definitely closer to me than others, and that's most often based on how well I like them and how well we interact on closer levels and even how well I think they deserve it, and other variables. Nothing is ever the same for different people.

    Now, despite what I say about non-well-definedness and lack of structure, I don't like lots of changes in the distances and qualities of relationships, and I don't like unexpected changes, either. Once I find a balance, I tend to like to keep it.

    My natural inclination is to assume that most people are like that, having naturally and expected varying distances in their relationships, as well as showing those closeness-es in particular ways, but according to some of my experiences and conversations, apparently not?

    Anyway, I have no idea if or how much this is of any use to you, Sereno.
    Oh, to find you in dreams - mixing prior, analog, and never-beens... facts slip and turn and change with little lucidity. except the strong, permeating reality of emotion.

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    If only I had that many friends as to be able to separate them into groups.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Minde View Post
    I have a sort of not-well-defined hierarchy, I guess you could say. There are certainly levels of closeness, but they are often somewhat fluid and, eh... varying in color or quality. For example, the person I would consider my closest friend right now is an ESFj. But I'm also very close, if not closer, to my sister (ENFp). But the relationship I have with each of them is different, has different qualities, different dynamics, different focusses.

    The way I see it, every individual has their own connection with me (as well as all sorts of connections that in turn connect and intertwine), and each connection is unique even if there are many similarities between many of them.

    If there were a visual representation of one way of looking at it, it might be something like this (probably entirely unnecessary and useless, but I felt like making it so here you go, lol):




    Me being the purplish dot in the center and other people being the other dots. Each person has their own connection, but different people are different distances from me and come from different directions and interact with me in different ways. There are no real boxes or set-in-stone hierarchies. But some people are definitely closer to me than others, and that's most often based on how well I like them and how well we interact on closer levels and even how well I think they deserve it, and other variables. Nothing is ever the same for different people.

    Now, despite what I say about non-well-definedness and lack of structure, I don't like lots of changes in the distances and qualities of relationships, and I don't like unexpected changes, either. Once I find a balance, I tend to like to keep it.

    My natural inclination is to assume that most people are like that, having naturally and expected varying distances in their relationships, as well as showing those closeness-es in particular ways, but according to some of my experiences and conversations, apparently not?

    Anyway, I have no idea if or how much this is of any use to you, Sereno.
    This reminds me of a post I made about the "feeling" of

    http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...tml#post448096
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    I very much believe in the concept of a best friend(s). Don't exactly have one at the moment though.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ryu View Post
    I have to have some sort of differentiation. I know so many people that if everyone was on the same level,it would just be one big blur.
    Yeah.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sereno View Post
    No, he's SiTe, but I don't want this to be an "SLI sucks" thread, because that's not the issue. I respect that way of thinking, even though it's not in my nature.
    Sorry, I never intended it to be, especially since they don't suck.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sereno
    [...] However, if I see someone who has deserved to be in a "pedestal" because of what they've done for me or enjoy my accompany a lot, I wouldn't hesitate to assign said person as a best friend.
    I am the same. Am I allowed to have more than one best friend? If so, then I don't hesitate to do that either.
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    I don't really have the time or patience to deal with many layers of human interactions.

    I've basically got 1) I trust you 2) I don't trust you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Greeter View Post
    Also, I don't think this is limited to just Delta or Gamma, but these two quadras are the most comfortable discussing this kind of thing and want it to be explicit. Where as Alpha and Beta rather have it expressed implicitly (via Fe, perhaps?).
    Well, it is a socionics forum. That said, IRL, it would be strange to discuss how you order your friends.

    As I said in another thread, I have a fluid way of dealing with just about anyone + the special people who get to deal with me being a neurotic nutjob (lol) + anyone I feel I'm looking after + whoever I'm interested in (romantically). (Each + goes up a level. Summary version.)

    I'm going to revise the name for that to the "energy turnip".

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    Minde's blue/purple dots are a great example. And I second what she wrote.

    I guess I do assign a "closeness level" in my mind to everyone. But this unfortunately changes a lot. I think the last few years especially my "best" friends and I have grown apart a lot and I've moved, switched things around, etc. Depending on when you'd asked me, I would have been closer or farther from various people.

    I would prefer the closeness level to stay the same, but pretty often people who start out seeming genuine, caring, good, end up having a very shady cheating sorta side to them that really turns me off. And that's where I feel I kinda have to step back and change that Fi distance.

    And let me clarify that -- I'm not saying I'm some sort of perfect beam of white light or anything, but when girls are getting someone to pay their rent and living w/ him when they're constantly saying he's a loser, and can't make his own decisions (behind his back to all his friends), and don't even LIKE him, ICK. Or, guys who will pretend to be your friend to try to get some, even if they have a gf, etc. ICK. I actually knew a girl who proudly said she didn't listen to what anyone said if it didn't directly benefit her. She interrupted me once to say that someone across the room had a bracelet similar to hers. Or a "good" guy friend you go shopping w/ who, it turns out, has had his whole office cheering him on to try to sleep w/ you for several months, including his bosses and the client side (some of whom you've met), meanwhile you've never even held hands w/ the guy...until they get him so drunk and send him off to meet you one night that he spills the whole story in his drunkenness. And then he demands you sleep w/ him or it's "over" so you show him the door and sadly, have to de-friend your "best" shoe shopping buddy. And then you see his boss out cheating on his wife w/ some 20 year old chick, and tell him this, and he finds it "funny." etc., etc...

    where is the love people? where is the love.

    So because of that I'm really hestitant to announce a "best friend." I also don't want to make anyone feel bad and the non "best" friends are still really really important close friends.

    Sidenote...the two ESTjs I've known well did assign a "best friend" that they kept for a really long time. One of them was best friends w/ an ISTp. The other was likely cheating on his gf.
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    I was just talking about this with my best friend! Strange! I guess I would generally agree with Minde's "model" there. I definitely have a loose hierarchy, but it's extremely flexible and in flux. My current best friend and I have been close for about 11 years, though with varying degrees. There were many times where her importance in my life diminished and other people had more influence and precedence to my attention, but she kept her "value" so-to-speak. While I can easily assess where a person is in this hierarchy, I'm not constantly thinking of it or letting people know of it's existence. Observance of these zones of friendship are only useful to explain my behavior concerning comfort levels relating to information and spending time with, as well as doing certain activities.

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    I definitely have best friends, acquaintances, and several gradations in between - although they're not so much defined specifically as they are built up or degraded through each interaction.

    It's kinda weird, because I don't disagree with anything on this thread so far, and some of it really sounds contradictory. People have varying distances to me, a la Minde's drawing ... but the distances can change pretty easily from interaction to interaction. However, I just can't do "on-again-off-again" in the sense of fighting, breaking apart, coming back together, getting into another fight. So there are aspects of the friendship that must be fairly smooth.

    I can go for a long time not seeing someone and still feel very close emotionally. And if I hang out with someone and there's no "click" that makes things exciting or brings us noticeably closer and more trusting, that's OK as long as there are no strong negative developments. I am still learning the balance of how to treat people I have to deal with regularly that wouldn't otherwise be my friends, such as coworkers, but I haven't had a serious personality clash at work in a long time, so even though I know some people think I'm aloof, I feel like I still project enough trustworthiness to be easy to work alongside.

    When a person gains "best friend" status, I'm more likely to go through the awkward process of revealing the depth of my emotions for him/her, and I stand ready 24/7 to help. There are few things in my life that have been as rewarding as helping one of my BFs in need, and a few people who have abused my protectorship have gotten themselves booted out of that status.

    However, it's still unlikely that I'll initiate much socially even with my BFs. I am more likely to be found hanging out with people who initiate social interaction than with the people to whom I feel the closest connection, and it sounds strange to even admit that, but it's been that way for a long time now, and I just kinda go with it. Those people in the inner circle know they're there, and they understand this about me, too.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jewels View Post
    So because of that I'm really hestitant to announce a "best friend." I also don't want to make anyone feel bad and the non "best" friends are still really really important close friends.
    In my way of thinking, even if other friends are important close friends, I would still have the best friend position available. The problem with not doing things to make people feel bad when it comes to this is that if someone comes along who definitely deserves to be "up there" as in always being there for you, and definitely showing interested in being more involved in your life, makes time for you, takes you seriously, and then you become hesitant when it comes to deciding if you should or shouldn't assign said person as your best friend (or just don't) then it's true that everyone is "happy," except you'll be hurting and possibly pushing away the one that is more concerned about you. There are people who will care for you and be your close friends, but unintentionally will not be there for you at times, or won't actively make themselves a part of your life. Of course, everyone has their own life and concentrate on their priorities. However, if someone makes me a priority as I described before, I don't care if I'll end up hurting my other friends' feelings by assigning said person as one of my best friends (or best friend period), not because I don't care about their feelings in general, but I expect them to understand this. I do have friends who I consider close who don't consider me as their best friend, and I'm definitely ok with that because I'm not as involved in their life. This can be a sensitive subject that can make you affect the friendship in some cases, but when someone puts in the work and I let them, then I don't see it as fair to be wishy washy.

    I think that all of this is something that I've only just recently come to understand by being the person I'm mentioning who wants to actively be involved. From this standpoint a lot of things seem clearer to me... It's just not fair to treat all your friends the same way, even if they are close, especially the ones who put in the work. My friend is so concerned about keeping everyone at the same level, that he doesn't know the impact or consequence of this decision. It might be one of those things that will take a long time to realize when you look back, or maybe that won't be the case. Regardless, it's very unfortunate, but now I'm going to concentrate on other things.

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    I don't assign roles to friends, nor do I have some verticle hierarchy. I personally don't even think of people as friends or enemies, but rather that I have a specific relationship with each individual, and while I know that some may be more profitable (or the person more trustworthy, likely to do whatever, etc.), I still don't think of some people as better or worse friends.

    The point of Fi isn't to set up internal hierarchies among people and things. The point of Fi is to assume the good in each thing before it's even seen. "Bright lights band the hopeful" is how I like to put it, and I tend to think of Fi as a warm glow which emminates from all/between and including all objects, almost like the sun.

    People misrepresentin' mah Fi.
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    First of all, I have always had very few friends. It's a stretch if I have three at a time. And I certainly do not see them all the same way. I do believe in the concept of best friends, but I don't always have one.

    I may have several close friends and no best friends, but I am always on the lookout for a best friend. Even when I had only one close friend, I didn't necessarily see that person as a best friend, because best friend has special meaning for me.
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    This is an interesting thread because I have definitely noticed this before. I think the concept of having a best friend is very attractive to deltas. Most (if not all) of the deltas I have known will say they have a "best friend" or will categorize people as either acquaintances, good friends, very good friends, etc. I dated an ESTj who had several different categories for all the people in his life. Usually deltas will openly express these categories to their close friends so that their friends know how important they are. I definitely believe in the concept of having a best friend, although its not very easy to find such a person.

    ~an INFj

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    I do believe in best friends, and I have several people I would put in this spot. I have a lot of people in my circle who I'm friendly with, quite a few friends but very few close friends. Some people will never get to the top of the heap, because of lack of connection. It's partially my fault too because I'm awkward with that. Perhaps one or two people would be at "best friend" level and there are a few others who are right being them. I don't usually verbalize my friend order to others, I keep it in my head.

    I've had some people try to get from the level of stranger/acquaintance to best friend and that's not how it works with me. When people try too hard to soon, my instinct is to push them away, because best friendships often take time. Positivity is great but there is such a thing as being too friendly and lacking any sort of boundaries. Part of being my friend is accepting that I prefer relationships, even on the platonic level, to move at a slower pace.

    There are rare occasions when someone has a common interest, and we become quick friends by the level of closeness takes a lot of time.
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    Mb its related to instinctual stackings too. About OP this can be also related to SLI/EII relationship (like in Strat description).

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    I have a lot of acquaintances irl and have a few best friend irl.
    But for me best friend is a concept , if i feel chemistry between me and other
    I will share my personal things and try to trust & loyal with them

    Tbh , when i'm with acquaintances
    I'm pretty indifferent to care and rather emotionless to them
    Especially on chats , i won't make a move to chat to them until i feel close with them
    I will share my emotions and tell what i feel comfortably , if they're close to me

    I dunno , it sounds Delta or not

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