Okay, I'd buy that. The bolded makes sense if Palpatine is really an EIE.Originally Posted by Gilly
Okay, I'd buy that. The bolded makes sense if Palpatine is really an EIE.
„Man can do what he wants but he cannot want what he wants.“
– Arthur Schopenhauer
I think the old man obiwan is INFp. Han Solo seems ISTj. ISTp,... still think Vader is ISTp. Im not thinking of the new movies cuz they sucked,.
Well, his old age made him a little crazy, just like Yoda.Maybe this is the reason why he appears so different from movie to movie.
Yeah, first I didn't get that you mean the classic trilogy by the word "original" in the title. But the other movies add some more intertype relations.
„Man can do what he wants but he cannot want what he wants.“
– Arthur Schopenhauer
Being dead for a significant portion of the series may play a role in that.Well, his old age made him a little crazy, just like Yoda.
assuming yoda is INTj, could ISTj work for Obi-wan? he's more Se-heavy, investigatory, and decisive in his actions, whereas Yoda has much more of an analyzing intuitive focus.
No.
Yoda seems irrational to me. He is full of abstract advice and quirky sayings and whatnot, which I think pushes people towards Intuitive for him, especially as he is kind of a mystical character, but in reality I think he is just a wise old SLI, keeping to his own shit, seems to fill roles of leadership out of a sense of almost reluctant responsibility, making rational and informed decisions to keep drama and drastic events and chaotic meltdowns at bay. He is ridiculously powerful and yet rarely gets his hands dirty. I think he is a 9, which might make him seem kind of Se-PoLRish. Overall he just seems kind of detached from everything, not nearly as invested in order and the system as someone like Mace Windu, more likely to just see how things play out and act accordingly. He's kind of Buddha-like in an Si dominant way.
Obi-Wan, on the other hand, has the kind of priestly Se PoLRish feel to him, always using as little force as necessary to complete his objectives, able to deal with conflict because of extensive training but with no real thirst for them, always trying to fly beneath the radar. Whether he always obeys them or not, his actions and decisions seem more actively conscious of and related to the rules of the Jedi Order than someone like Yoda, who, despite embodying the principles of the Jedi better than anyone, is kind of lackadaisical about it, almost whimsical in his overall attitude, sometimes grave but not really a stickler for the rules. Kenobi believes in the rules, but realizes that they must be bent to a degree in practice; Yoda seems to view the rules of the Order in a more holistic fashion. Not that they ever lay any of this shit out, it's more my impression of their whole personalities based on how the characters are portrayed generally.
But, for a certainty, back then,
We loved so many, yet hated so much,
We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...
Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
Whilst our laughter echoed,
Under cerulean skies...
Ith the best IMO.
Luke = kamangir
Obi-Wan = krae
Yoda = tcaud
Darth Vader = DeAnte
Emperor = k0rpsey
Princess Leia = glamourama
Lando = smccosker (Or that JWC3 dude)
C3P0 = Subterranean (Galen as C3P0's naughty alterego)
R2D2 = woofwoofl (wanted it to be me but felt weird to plug myself)
Last edited by female; 09-06-2011 at 01:53 AM.
I personally don't grasp that Fe ego typing for Luke Skywalker: maybe it's just me but where do people get the Fe from? :/
The only ones that stick out to me are the characters who are real people.
Maybe like they're always fighting who they are even when they're putting on a show, that makes it difficult for me to put them in another quadra.
iow Luke and Leia seem obviously Delta, or at least Fi/Te
- People see him as an IF. For me some Fi ego works fine as long as it's not Fe. Leia seems ENFp, but I've seen ESTj somewhere... well whatever works best in this sense.
Hans Solo seems Alpha, etc.
- He comes across ENTp.
Even Mace Windu.
- He gets a 4 minute time slot. C'mon it's Samuel L. Effin Jackson!!!... ENFJ
Look how pissed he looks at u with his overly-dramatic purple light saber
Sure, I'm not saying this is always the case, but I also don't think relations always match up well in fiction shows. For instance in the newer Star Wars I can't draw the line with some of the characters, but with these characters they seem to be already how George Lucas wanted them to be--I think he picked them as naturals to their personality and not extending into anything majorly different just from how they can be. The first three movies have a fairly Delta tone to them IMO, based on the two main actors he chose who were in his quadra, Mark Hamill (ESTj) and Carrie Fisher (ENFp). I can't trace any of the other four functions from those two, and ime the director often colors his movies with the members of his quadra.
Last edited by 717495; 09-06-2011 at 02:41 AM.
No one on this forum is Han Solo status, but Hitta has to be chewbaccaIth the best IMO.
Luke = kamangir
Obi-Wan = krae
Yoda = tcaud
Darth Vader = DeAnte
Emperor = k0rpsey
Princess Leia = glamourama
Lando = smccosker (Or that JWC3 dude)
C3P0 = Subterranean (Galen as C3P0's naughty alterego)
R2D2 = woofwoofl (wanted it to be me but felt weird to plug myself)
okay, thanks.No.
Yoda seems irrational to me. He is full of abstract advice and quirky sayings and whatnot, which I think pushes people towards Intuitive for him, especially as he is kind of a mystical character, but in reality I think he is just a wise old SLI, keeping to his own shit, seems to fill roles of leadership out of a sense of almost reluctant responsibility, making rational and informed decisions to keep drama and drastic events and chaotic meltdowns at bay. He is ridiculously powerful and yet rarely gets his hands dirty. I think he is a 9, which might make him seem kind of Se-PoLRish. Overall he just seems kind of detached from everything, not nearly as invested in order and the system as someone like Mace Windu, more likely to just see how things play out and act accordingly. He's kind of Buddha-like in an Si dominant way.
Obi-Wan, on the other hand, has the kind of priestly Se PoLRish feel to him, always using as little force as necessary to complete his objectives, able to deal with conflict because of extensive training but with no real thirst for them, always trying to fly beneath the radar. Whether he always obeys them or not, his actions and decisions seem more actively conscious of and related to the rules of the Jedi Order than someone like Yoda, who, despite embodying the principles of the Jedi better than anyone, is kind of lackadaisical about it, almost whimsical in his overall attitude, sometimes grave but not really a stickler for the rules. Kenobi believes in the rules, but realizes that they must be bent to a degree in practice; Yoda seems to view the rules of the Order in a more holistic fashion. Not that they ever lay any of this shit out, it's more my impression of their whole personalities based on how the characters are portrayed generally.
im a little confused now though. do people type by quadra guidelines then? it seems like if we follow that logic, then model A becomes incompatible. but model A is more into the jungian roots. are there any books that go into the reasons for creating the quadras the way they did (or good articles/links)?
so why not ILI then for yoda? quadra stuff again?
edit - if yoda goes to delta, i wonder if EII would fit better then.
edit - i definitely agree with LII for Obi-won by the way due to cognitive styles. but just throwing an idea out there to make sure people knew what they were talking about. ;P. your answer seems really good to me. better than what i would say if asked.
Last edited by DividedsGhost; 09-06-2011 at 05:12 AM.
That rulesIth the best IMO.
Luke = kamangir
Obi-Wan = krae
Yoda = tcaud
Darth Vader = DeAnte
Emperor = k0rpsey
Princess Leia = glamourama
Lando = smccosker (Or that JWC3 dude)
C3P0 = Subterranean (Galen as C3P0's naughty alterego)
R2D2 = woofwoofl (wanted it to be me but felt weird to plug myself)and hell yeah I'd make an awesome R2D2!
p . . . a . . . n . . . d . . . o . . . r . . . a
trad metalz | (more coming)
Truth be told I really only ever identified with the Tusken Raiders.
C3PO = Uniden
Salacious Crumb = siuntal
Jarjar Binks = WA
Last edited by Korpsy Knievel; 09-06-2011 at 02:34 PM.
Howling, shooting, half-intelligent pack animals?
Well, my favourite characters are Jango/Boba Fett and Obi-Wan. The Fetts are interesting because they're intelligent individualists who always have a trick up their sleeves. Jango's people are a nation of mercenaries which is also pretty cool. Obi-Wan is not a flawless person, but he tries really hard to do the right thing. He is a Jedi VIP but is still humble enough not to be corrupted by his power. In the 2nd and 3rd episode you clearly see the huge differences between Anakin and Obi-Wan in which he proves the strength of his character in several situations. Anakin, on the other handside, is the character I disliked from the beginning because of his inflated ego.
„Man can do what he wants but he cannot want what he wants.“
– Arthur Schopenhauer
I thought they looked nice, plus they provided the only aspect of terror in the entire series. Let's call it an SeFi connection.Howling, shooting, half-intelligent pack animals?
I suppose I'll post my interpretations.
Luke - seems IEE in A New Hope, but I'm really not sure
Leia - LXE
Vader - XSI
Obi Wan - ...
Yoda - ...
Lando - EXE > SEE
Solo - Fi/Te
Emperor - XIE
Chewy - is upset a lot
Episodes I-III
Qui Gon - ...
Obi Wan - ...
Padme - Ne/Si valuing, possibly EII > LII
Anakin - possibly SLE (the George Lucas version)
Palpatine - XIE
Jar Jar - SEI
Personally, I thought that Anakin =/= Vader. I don't see them as the same person for the most part. Anakin (as in from episodes I-III went off to become a strange Disney-like Darth Vader who we never saw in episodes IV-VI... While the Vader in episodes IV-VI was actually a very different sort of Anakin person before the fall).
Or I could site what I feel are their enneagram type differences: Anakin being Eight-ish and Darth Vader being a One.
I suppose you could say that after becoming "more machine than man" Anakin went through a major personality change... but I just like not thinking of them as the same person as episodes I-III are simply unbearable and so are the characters therein.
I mean when Obi Wan told his tales of what happened to Anakin in Episode IV, episodes I-III were NOT what I had in mind. I felt cheated out of a good story. *weeps*
How is Darth Vader not an 8? The personality seems inconsistent because (a) different actors and (b) he was basically drone-ified by the emperor, but archetypally I think SEE works fine and I think looking at the overriding forces of the story as being Delta vs. Beta and the personal themes being Alpha vs. Gamma makes a lot of sense.
But, for a certainty, back then,
We loved so many, yet hated so much,
We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...
Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
Whilst our laughter echoed,
Under cerulean skies...
I saw Darth Vader as probably a more introverted, anal person. He wanted a perfect world and perfect order, and I thought that a lot of his "fall" came because as he tried to control everything and make it perfect, he lost sight of his ideal as to why he wanted that in the first place. I saw him as having an idealistic vision of how the world should be (fixing all of the things wrong with it) and trying to achieve that (and then seeing the Dark Side eventually as a means to an end). And he still hadn't seen where he'd went wrong even when he was talking to Luke, because it was still the same idea... he and Luke would rule over everything together and make it perfect (he had realized the Emperor's ways were not manifesting his vision). I think in the beginning there was a compassion and benevolence behind the vision (the benefit of a perfect world is that everyone is happy and free). But he lost it as he became more and more obsessed with order for the sake of order. There is also his intolerance of everyone: mistakes are not tolerated... you get three tries basically before he kills you for incompetence. If you don't perform perfectly and do everything "just right" you're screwed. In fact Vader's standards are nearly impossible to meet although I thought in episode IV on his own personal star destroyer that the killing of his crew didn't go on so much because he'd broken them all in (he'd already killed the incompetents and so those remaining were the survivors who had learned how Vader expects things to go and he'd relaxed a bit knowing that they get it). (but that was just my assumption) And I'd also add that Vader's frustration and temper are the scary things about him... it's a cycle of... did you do everything the perfect way Vader wants? Because if you didn't he'll get angry and frustrated and then it's off with your head.
Anakin says things along these lines in Episodes I-III, but I thought his vulnerability was more around his fear that he can't trust "his people" and that they'll betray him. The more he doesn't know if he can trust people, the more off kilter he becomes. So despite the fact that Anakin talks about order and mentions making everyone agree, etc. I think this is eclipsed by his fear of losing his people. I mean in the end he's created quite the saga for himself... the Jedi have all turned against him and betrayed him--in fact they were lying to him all along and so he must have his revenge... his closest friends, Obi-Wan and Padme have also turned against him... perhaps Padme never loved him and Obi-Wan was always trying to bring him down. He's the victim and vulnerable and everyone is against him trying to hurt him. Anyway I don't see it as particularly One-like. Unlike Vader who I felt was trying to create his ideal vision of the world, I thought Anakin just wants a world that's safe for him and his people, although he also loves being in power. Anakin is also inclined to fight for those who can't fight and defend the weak and vulnerable against those who would harm them.
Perfect!C3PO = Uniden
LOLJarjar Binks = WA
Gilly can be young Anakin cuz Hayden Christensen is gay.
x
What about this?
Anakyn Skywalker SLI
Darth Vader ESI (yes, he changed his mind, literally)
The Emperor LIE
Luke Skywalker IEI
Han Solo SLE
Princess Leia SEE
Chewbacca ESE
R2D2 LII
C3PO ILE
Lando Calrissian LSI
Master Yoda ILE
Qui Gon Jinn LSE
Obi Wan Kenobi IEE
Jar Jar Binks IEE
Padme IEE
ILE "Searcher"
Socionics: ENTp
DCNH: Dominant
--> perhaps Normalizing
Enneagram: 7w6 "Enthusiast"
MBTI: ENTJ "Field Marshall" or ENTP "Inventor"
Astrological sign: Aquarius
To learn, read. To know, write. To master, teach.
The other thing I love about Vader is that he sees himself as "forgiving." I got the impression that Vader perceives himself as a fairly tolerant person, not as the hyper-anal, critical tight ass that he actually is. I mean he gives everyone their fair chance (to perform perfectly, efficiently, diligently, without complaining or excuses or meaningless apologies for their incompetence) and he warns them ahead of time so they know what will happen to them if they don't perform well and get him what he wants when he wants it. So really he is more tolerant than the Emperor who is so evil he probably just loves killing people for the sake of it. But Vader is aware of their plight and he "sympathizes," which is why he gives them a little tiny bit of wiggle room (which I'm sure he thinks is generous of him). I think it was due to this sympathy that Vader spared Admiral Piett. hehe
I felt that Piett's silence and valiant, but quiet, efforts to do a good job (not for the sake of pleasing Vader but for the sake of the job itself), and growing anxiety about his performance really sparked Vader's softer side and so he chose not to hold Piett responsible for these things that he really wasn't responsible for anyway. He harbored no ill will towards Piett because Piett didn't irritate him by being disrespectful or obsequious or secretly arrogant, and so on. Piett reminded him of his generals of old back on his other star destroyer who treated his every order with respect and set off efficiently to get it done without any complaints or excuses. And so Vader would know if they hadn't succeeded it wasn't because they weren't doing the best that could be done.
I had seen Vader as a demented ESI in the past, but really I don't see why LSI isn't an option. I think that Vader is the embodiment of the "dark side" of Se IJ. I had thought a lot of his behavior could be equated to Te super-id and "evil" Fi, but I just don't know anymore.
Another thing I had noticed about Vader was that he seems to think that if a job isn't getting done "fast enough" that it's because those doing it aren't "motivated enough" because he seems to see a direct link between strength of will and end product (this is very Se of him, although I feel it's maybe a little bit more Se IJ since he's so singularly focused on things, squelching the irrationality out of everything). He seems to not understand that sometimes things just aren't going to unfold by a certain time just because someone wants them to. Although he does understand that motivation is a key ingredient and that sometimes others need it supplied externally, which he's willing to do (often in ineffective ways that turn people into frightened rabbits), I don't think he understands the complexities of it, assuming that everyone is able to to easily generate an objective and focus all their energies on it until they achieve it, like he is able to. This is why "excuses" are never tolerated because Vader (out of Ne PoLR) will not look at all the different angles to things--these angles don't exist and have little to do with his 'point and shoot' way of doing things (which is of course the right way to go about these things so as not to bog oneself down and create delays). I mean if that guy leading up Death Star completion were, say, lost in several considerations about processes involved, some of which he was experiencing indecision about because he viewed it as a terribly complex situation, this would only tell Vader that he's not motivated enough (the only way the situation can be viewed is the way that he views it).
Last edited by marooned; 09-07-2011 at 06:40 PM.
You don't like me any more...
But, for a certainty, back then,
We loved so many, yet hated so much,
We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...
Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
Whilst our laughter echoed,
Under cerulean skies...
New Star Wars movie coming out soon. Time to type the characters all over again:
Obi-Wan: EII
Luke: IEE
Anakin/Vader: SLE
Palpatine: LIE
Yoda: LII
Hans Solo: SLI
Leia: LSE
Mace Windu: LSI
I am not really sure about these typings tbh. I will probably change some of these later on.
“We cannot change the cards we are dealt, just how we play the hand.” Randy Pausch
Ne-IEE
6w7 sp/sx
6w7-9w1-4w5
Kylo Ren- ESI?
Some remarks about your typings.
I added my comments to your post.Obi-Wan: EII (Not EII, because not-vulnerable, extroverted judgement better than suggestive,
better than demonstrative)
Luke: IEE (Yes,-ego type)
Anakin/Vader: SLE (Are both really the same type? Anakin has Ep-temperament and Vader Ij-temperament)
Palpatine: LIE (ILI-Te might be an alternative)
Yoda: LII (I'll buy LII, but he has unusual strong
Hans Solo: SLI (He is an adventure seeker, not a comfort seeker, I suggest LSI-Se instead of SLI)
Leia: LSE (No dissent)
Mace Windu: LSI (no opinion on him)
Addition: I suggest SEI-Fe for C3PO.
Last edited by WinnieW; 11-25-2017 at 07:03 PM.
Fair enough on most points. Except, I see your point about Anakin and Darth, but I think it is odd for the same person to change personality type. LIIs have 4D demonstrative
“We cannot change the cards we are dealt, just how we play the hand.” Randy Pausch
Ne-IEE
6w7 sp/sx
6w7-9w1-4w5
the whole thing about "you told me Vader betrayed and murdered my father" "what I told you was true, from a certain point of view" is like the most Ne ego thing ever
Masters of half lies we are.
“We cannot change the cards we are dealt, just how we play the hand.” Randy Pausch
Ne-IEE
6w7 sp/sx
6w7-9w1-4w5
is the lie half full or half empty, a question for the ages
Because typology is made for real people, not for fictional people.
Otherwise he changed his type as a result of a total mental breakdown. The change of his personality type could be the result of an enforced healing process or a brain wash from the emperor.
True, but the demonstrative function is an unconscious function in socionics. He seems to be aware ofLIIs have 4D demonstrative
Yeah, usually fictional characters are based on real personalities, but Anakin/Vader is a unique case and an exception the rule.
“We cannot change the cards we are dealt, just how we play the hand.” Randy Pausch
Ne-IEE
6w7 sp/sx
6w7-9w1-4w5
Anakin: ILE (though he comes across more as LIE when Vader)
Palpatine: IEI
Luke: ESI
Han: LSI
Leia: LSE
Obi-Wan: ILI
Yoda: LII
C3PO: SEI
R2D2: ILE
It's Fi/Te types style. We don't like to lie as it's bad. Meanwhile we need to live somehow.
Anakin/Darth Vader is such an unstable character in the series. In the phantom menace, he seems a LIE-Ni, he then turns IEI for the next two installments, then turns Se ego when Vader.
Yup. I don't think he's typeable either without fragmenting it. Several movies, screenplays, actors ---> then socionics reaches its limit for one particular character.
do you know chocobojohn, @Chae?
Oui, why? About his typings, maybe Padme as
Okay, thanks. Just wanted to see something.Oui, why? About his typings, maybe Padme as
Carrie Fisher - ENFJ - Hamlet
Last edited by khcs; 12-31-2019 at 01:24 PM.
Harrison Ford - ISFP - Dumas
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